Western Culture and Its Discontents: A Conversation with Douglas Murray (Episode

[@adventurer3645]

Both of these men are the least biased, most honest, clear thinking, well spoken, courageous, beacons of integrity and cognitive ability I have had the pleasure to listen to. If I had to choose, I might give the edge ever so slightly to Douglass Murray, despite being a Sam Harris fan for longer. Nevertheless, they’re both quite underrated by most of our society. We all owe a debt of gratitude to the both of them, whether we realize it or not. Good day.

[@kgr003]

42:50 [Douglas] "Nobody on the left wants to touch the Hunter Biden laptop story. They'll say "But Trump." 44:15 [Sam] "But Trump."

[@siriusfun]

No one here thinks Sam's anything but disgusted by Trump. Are you new? lol

[@anthonyreed480]

The lack of introspection Sam has is truly incredible. Imagine if Don Jr had a job on the board of a Ukranian gas company and there were leaked emails about cash "for the big guy" lol. Sam would have to start a new podcast series of 12 eps to cover it.

[@coyohma8947]

@@siriusfun You can be disgusted and still at least try to not display wildly disparate standards

[@whatarewedoingouthere]

I wish Douglas would have more directly called Sam out on this.

[@phatpat63]

@@siriusfun The question is whether or not Sam is capable of anything like rational or honest thought on anything where Trump is even peripherally relevant. The answer being an obvious and resounding no.

[@hitech0202]

It's a tragedy to see Sam disgrace himself. Douglas is making such excellent points, calmly, rationally, etc. Sam has become the very person he claimed to fight against. One can absolutely despise Trump yet say that the silencing of the Ny Post was utterly reprehensible. Sam defending the decision or claiming not to know the right thing is about as lamentable an argument I've ever heard from him.

[@pathologicaldoubt]

LOL Trump refused to concede and republicans are more outraged at Twitter execs. Amazing.

[@hitech0202]

@@pathologicaldoubt I'm not a republican, lol. Again, your comment has nothing to do with what I said. The truth is the truth. Your analysis shows how tribal everything is. Why is it so hard to admit that what was done was draconian because you believe the ends justify the means? I'm concerned about the truth. One can agree that Trump is a maniac while still submitting that the canceling of the post was ludicrous. This is not the first time Sam has supported cancel culture when it fits his agenda. Yet, whenever Sam gets attacked, he becomes as righteous as any. He's become a smug liberal who hides under the cloak of seeking reason.

[@kelvincasing5265]

@@hitech0202 Sam's a Leftist first, principles second. I'll be in the car with Gad Saad.

[@bobf5360]

Douglas does make a few good points, but some of them are essentially whataboutism by himself. He argues that the left "started the distrust of elections", and that the intelligence community politicized their intelligence products, completely ignoring the fact that outside intelligence agencies from other countries also confirmed that Russia interfered with the 2016 election, to which 45 completely ignored and sided with Putin on, then, by all credible accounts revealed US-Israel secrets to Russian officials in the White House. For these and other examples too numerous to detail, 45 was an existential risk to our intelligence community, and so they acted in defense of our intelligence assets. Thats not politicization, that's defending the US interests.

[@occamsblunderbuss]

It's despicable. I'm a disenfranchised classical liberal who voted for Trump. The Left wing homogeneous blob of evil is a conglomeration of people like Sam Harris. I almost worshipped him during his "End of Faith" days. What a vile person he's become.

[@anthonyreed480]

Sam has had brushes with cancel culture, and has been bewildered every time because he says "What the?! I'm one of the good ones?!" When conservatives are blacklisted he shrugs "it's not the town square." Something tells me if he lost his twitter, patreon, Uber eats, and Chase accounts for something he said, he'd suddenly be a lot more concerned.

[@CuriousGeorgio59]

He’s for censoring people and removing them off social platforms, tells you everything you need to know about him

[@anthonyreed480]

@@CuriousGeorgio59 I have to reluctantly agree. Unfortunately, you just can't trust people whose instinct is to censor. Sam, like so many before him, imagines "the adults" like himself being in charge. The truth is you'd be better off trusting power to a random set of 100 people at a hardware store than the Davos set. His elitist instinct is so wrong in that way.

[@johnnycrenshaw9438]

Cancel culture isn’t a thing. If you’re famous & wealthy you can’t really be canceled. If you’re not famous & wealthy no one will want to cancel you.

[@anthonyreed480]

@@johnnycrenshaw9438 That's ridiculous lol. If you're wealthy enough pre-cancellation you may be able to continue living a comfortable life, relative to the general population, but that's a totally different question. It's also just flat-out wrong that nobodies aren't targeted. They're constantly targeted.

[@ridesharegold6659]

@Censored Opinions The exceptions prove the rule. I know people who have had their small businesses destroyed for 8 year old edge tweets about the homeless - made while still in high school. Yes, it's true, you can't cancel people who are rich enough but nobodies are very easily cancelled. You just don't hear about them because they're nobody.

[@brianmeen2158]

How is Sam still confused on what should have been done about Hunters lap top?!? This is shocking to me. I mean come on !

[@Jekyll_Island_Creatures]

TDS melted his brain. He wants to justify the censorship as long as it hurts Trump's chances at reelection. The ends justifies the means.

[@PeteMD]

Sam is a partisan liar

[@michaeltrivette1728]

@@PeteMD correct. Sam is worse than all the Religitards he usually rails against.

[@dandybufo9664]

@@PeteMD what was he lying about ?

[@LOSTTIMEBANDIT]

Sam is a cheerleader for his side so he kept in line with what his masters wanted.

[@dmtgallardo]

A note of positivity : at the beginning of the discussion Sam suggests they instead of going through the same topics they already know they agree on, let’s touch on the ones they disagree about in order to avoid a confirmation bias think tank and provide a more in depth and difficult conversation. That alone is worthy of praise, and something i wish I could see more and more in podcasts and general conversations.

[@adstanrashaw9279]

Murray has just written an important work outlining in detail how the left ( mostly) is trying to attack Western institutions, but Sam wants to say " what about"; bringing up his favorite topic--Trump. It reminds me of Biden saying that " white supremacy is the greatest threat to Democracy" in the face of China and a " disinformation board".

[@seanmatthewking]

100%

[@tcorourke2007]

Agreed. Sam has been pretty poor at this as of late, perhaps all my negative comments are having an effect.

[@jackward6726]

Well that's good considering all Douglas Murray ever talks about is how western civilization is under attack from the woke

[@seanmatthewking]

@@tcorourke2007 not just you bro. Sam has a lot of listeners all over the place on political spectrum, and I think all of us have been annoyed now and then when Sam hammers away at one of his favorite subjects of ridicule with nobody ever there to give the counterpoint.

[@dragonjohnson6352]

Sam Harris has really disappointed me. There was a time where Sam would confidently stand for western values like Free speech. And not just in the law, but he professed it as an important cultural norm. "Conversation is all we have," he would say. Watching him now deteriorate into a pro-censorship stance is really saddening to see. If you have never been to 4chan, I would recommend taking a look. It's not what you think. Everything against US law is already against the rules; this is a stance which expresses confidence in the American ethos. Across 4chan you can find the entire spectrum of the Human Psyche. Profoundly dark and nihilistic, and profoundly wholesome and uplifting. Religion, art, humanities, science, all of these can be found on 4chan. You can indeed find racists and Nazi's on 4chan, just as you can find communists, black nationalists, and every other type of human. As my father used to say "There's a seat for every ass." In this sense, 4chan is beautiful. That freedom to choose to be a troll, a saint, a villain, or a something inbetween IS the most fundamental human thing, and I'm sorry Sam can't see that.

[@lucasglowacki4683]

I’m disappointed as well…I used to love to watch his debates and took his side in many of them. For someone technically so brilliant to say some of the things he’s said…like here too “I don’t care if Hunter Biden had severed heads in his basement”…like seriously? TDS is truly a handicap. You don’t have to be a fan of Trump but you gotta be objective.

[@michaelhall7546]

Covid broke him

[@ridesharegold6659]

@@michaelhall7546 Yes! I was just saying above that's when I quit my premium sub. He really lost it.

[@phatpat63]

"There was a time where Sam would confidently stand for western values like Free speech." Not really. He's always had an authoritarian streak. This is the same guy who always advocated that the TSA's illegal searches should also include profiling and that Edward Snowden belongs in jail. There has never been a time when he wasn't 100% part of the problem on this front.

[@NotQuiteFirst]

@@michaelhall7546 Trump broke him. Covid rebuilt him as a tribal elitist

[@tylerhayes4493]

Douglas Murray 👑

[@aln5832]

Nope

[@jtrace24]

@@aln5832 L

[@ericadler9680]

One hour talking about Trump in a conversation that was supposed to be about the war on the West - the guy clearly has a fixation.

[@flyingmonkeyknat]

Sam's totally deranged at this point.

[@victortaylor9399]

I really enjoy listening to San Harris, but I disagree with his vitriol about Trump. Who did Trump dox? I'm willing to be set straight in the issue, but I've never heard of that happening.

[@mmc1086]

Didn’t hear them say that but Sam did say he incited his followers to dox recognisable people on twitter who had tweeted opposing views.

[@victortaylor9399]

@@mmc1086 Yes, and I'm saying I don't think that ever happened, but if someone can provide a specific example of it I'm willing to be set straight.

[@countdebleauchamp]

He doxxed election workers by proxy.

[@victortaylor9399]

@@countdebleauchamp By proxy? Oh, I see. So, somebody who supported Trump did it and people are blaming Trump for it without any evidence that he had anything to do with it. By that same standard Biden is responsible for doxxing the Supreme Court justices, right?

[@mkkrupp2462]

not too sure what you mean by ‘dox ’. Aside from T’s narcissistic personality, his supreme egotism and basic ignorance on so many things ( having confessed to reading only one book in his adult life), hardly anyone mentions the wind back and cancellation of SO MANY protective consumer, environmental and workplace regulations. Including things like reducing water and air pollution controls, safety standards on machinery, increasing stocking levels on livestock, reducing the size of national parks and eliminating restrictions on the hunting of endangered wildlife. Etc etc etc. These were not done for “efficiency” reasons but were all done at the request of the corporate sector - so much for dealing with the swamp! These wind backs against the interests of ordinary Americans and the health of the environment, are all on the public record - the US Federal Register in Washington. Then of course there were the HUGe tax cuts given to the elites and corporations soon after his inauguration and the subsequent cuts to social spending on education, welfare and infrastructure. This is the real tragedy of the Trump administration. Fortunately some of these protective regulations are now being restored, but a great deal of damage was done.

[@listener523]

"If moderation was going to be figured out it would have already been figured out....." They did figure it out. They decided what opinions they wanted and 'moderated' anyone who dissented.

[@listener523]

@@seanupton709 It does have the benefit of being true. I don't know how I could be more charitable.

[@aaronsmyth7943]

You waited 3 minutes until commenting, is that a record?

[@listener523]

@@aaronsmyth7943 Well it took Sam less than 3 minutes to make this obviously flawed statement. I listened to the whole interveiw of cours and at no point did he seem to correct it nor substantiate it.

[@anthonyreed480]

@@aaronsmyth7943 I didn't realise there was a rule about waiting until the end before commenting. Maybe you should write to KZbin and let them know.

[@roxee57]

That’s not what he’s saying. Twitter made some rules, albeit some of them were very vague, and then applied them inconsistently. The platform needs clear rules and consistent application and when the see political mobs taking advantage of a rule against the spirit of the rule, they should use that information to more clearly define the rule and take more care in kicking people off the platform who were the targets of such politically motivated attacks.

[@perkyy2709]

I bought into Sam’s defense of taking Donald Trump and Alex Jones off Twitter. Then I listened to Douglas. Sorry Sam

[@kdemetter]

I actually think it's a great thing that a US company (Twitter) is able to kick off a sitting US president. That's a pretty good indicator of freedom. One could easily imagine what might happen to the CEO of a company in a more authoritarian country that decided to ban the leader of said country If you own a site, you need the ability to moderate your content, and that may include kicking off certain people. That should ideally be based on a reasonable terms of service though, not whim. But the same rules that apply to the average user should apply to the President of the US as well. So that if your platform bans people for inciting violence, than if the president of the US incites violence on your platform, you do get to ban him.

[@perkyy2709]

@@kdemetter I agree with everything you said. However, in practice, it turns into silencing people for political views. Unless you had a hyper bi-partisan board deciding who should and shouldn’t be banned, I don’t think silencing one political side is very productive.

[@vincentrodriguez6376]

@@perkyy2709 Then you dont really believe it in practice. Nobody claimed to have the answers, but trying to inscribe the act of holding a belief infallible due to it being political ignores the ramifications You cant ignore consequences because what it may theoretically imply if implemented for nefarious means. People are already doing that and the endeavors have been successful. We need to minimize these avenues before there is nothing to protect.

[@MonkeyKing3333]

Nice 👍

[@LAZARUSL0NG]

36:16 It’s easy, Sam. Imagine it had been Trump Jr’s Laptop. What do you think should have been done? Well, that’s what should have happened with the Biden laptop.

[@seanthomas7327]

He's unable to do that simple thought expirement.

[@LAZARUSL0NG]

@@seanthomas7327 It’s a big old brain, but there’s a blind spot.

[@sachamm]

Ya, Imagine Biden put his family into positions of power at the White House, despite that family having no bona fides for the job AND that family being unable to acquire security clearances due to their ties to Russia. Oh ya, we don't have to imagine that, it actually happened under Trump. No one cares about Hunter Biden because his level of corruption is orders of magnitude less than we've already seen go unpunished under Trump.

[@viekent]

Nothing

[@brianmeen2158]

Anything that has to do with Trump causes Sam to lose all rationality

[@ikik3406]

Its scary to hear Sam on the Hunter biden story... Not knowing if the surpression of that story was good or bad...

[@benjaminz2523]

Something tells me Sam's not a /b/tard

[@ninjaskeleton6140]

That part actually made my jaw drop. Douglas Murray is crystal clear on this point, and absolutely right.

[@tier1solutions28]

Yep. Sam just wanted joe to win

[@charleswalker2484]

It's not that he doesn't know. It's that he knows that his fake AstroTurfed algorithm promoted content would fade into obscurity where it belongs if he doesn't shill. He's a hack.

[@MrColdchillin81]

Honestly - I agree. Trump was a nuke for American politics. Anything - literally anything is better

[@oscargoldman85]

I have an unlimited amount of patience with Sam, after so many decent Books, speeches and podcasts, Sam will have a very long leash with Me, in fact, I will always give his opinions a second thought if I disagree, but there is some fundamental point where he gets derailed, and loses all his intellectual neutrality, particularly on the subject of "you know who", but generally. It is up to public intellectuals like Sam to identify these points of bifurcation, and possibly put police tape around them, not to go sliding down one side with purpose

[@BrainSoap]

Lol

[@johnpreuss5796]

Well said. A frustratingly brilliant mind with a hell of a blindspot. If we could all be so lucky to only have one.

[@seanmatthewking]

Sam is a right about Trump. 100%. But I’ve also been listening to Sam forever despite disagreeing with him all the time. So I’m with you there.

[@sandiasurfers3174]

To say “our democracy survived by the skin of our teeth” speaking on the 3 hour delay January 6th caused…. Just such disingenuous BS. Agreed, great thinker with a bizarre blind spot

[@gdtimay]

Well said.

[@jenniferlawrence2701]

On a point of fact, Harris is simply wrong to claim 4chan is "un-moderated & filled with...illegal things." It is moderated, and anything against US law (specifically the kind of pornography Harris referred to) is deleted. That's not to say its a wonderful site, but let's be accurate.

[@drewthomasarnal5378]

They need a boogeyman.

[@alkalisunshine]

@@drewthomasarnal5378 and the hacker known as 4chan is the perfect one for them.

[@kdemetter]

That's because Sam just buys into the mainstream narrative about it, and that's exactly how the media portrayed 4chan.

[@drewthomasarnal5378]

@@alkalisunshine The hacker known as 4chan! Haha that's classic!

[@user-fu2lh7up2i]

Sam is an in the tank Leftist. Speaking about J6 without including a discussion of the Democrat party sponsored and enabled phony staged Black Lives Matter riots is intellectual dishonesty of the highest order & Sam is guilty of it!!!

[@coyohma8947]

I'll forever be indebted to Sam and astounded by his intellect-but politically when his values were pressure tested, he bought a conspiracy theory about a Manchurian candidate and lobbied Jack Dorsey himself to censor his opponents.

[@samdg1234]

I could not agree with you more. He has Trump derangement syndrome so bad that he cashes in any principle he had. Regarding the Hunter Biden laptop, all of the media (according to Sam) did the necessary thing in banning any discussion of it because it almost assuredly would have changed the outcome of the 2020 election. I think of the analogy of a notorious murderer on trial and the only damning evidence that will prove his guilt was obtained illegally. The judge says that you have to make your determination of guilt without considering the only incriminating evidence that *PROVES* the defendant guilty. On principle, you have to disregard the only proof you have of the defendant's guilt and find him not guilty of crimes you know he committed. *Sam shows himself to fall short of this level of principle.* What you hear from Sam is (44;15), but the notorious murderer is a *singular problem that needs to be solved* Looking back I can see other examples of his lack of principle. I'm very disappointed. It colors my opinion of him. I'll need to be wary of his opinions more in the future.

[@Ianmar1]

Help me with my ignorance; which Manchurian candidate?

[@coyohma8947]

@@Ianmar1 The rather orange one. I don't recall him ever debriefing, if you can forgive the wordplay, his audience following the Mueller report. And wherever you fall politically, if that result didn't alter your view of what was more/less likely, that's a serious problem.

[@LeatherCladVegan]

I would also like it if you could elaborate - a conspiracy theory about a Manchurian candidate? What does this mean?

[@godisbollocks]

Trump *threatened nuclear annihilation* of North Korea on Twitter. You don't think a circumstance like that deserves an exception to the rule??

[@justin_5631]

Just realized what's so annoying about this. I have all Sam's positions on Trump and republicans (though not about twitter) but this isn't a conversation. This is Sam interrogating Douglas Murray for ideological purity. It's just question after question like.. recite the creed point for point. It feels so unnatural and adversarial. Like I really believe Jan 6 was a deranged coup attempt. But rather than just discussing the event organically.. Sam wants an immediate confession. If someone pulled 20 questions on me like that I'd likely end up telling them to fuck off or saying I don't care. Because I don't want to recant my stances point for point on a firing line.

[@paulcurtis2642]

Bang on point

[@brianmeen2158]

Yeah I’m almost finished with this ‘discussion’ and I’m very disappointed with it. I expected much more from it

[@Xocixo]

Agreed! I was going to subscribe to listen to more inclusive contents but after this I've changed my mind.

[@wasdwasdedsf]

"Like I really believe Jan 6 was a deranged coup attempt" then 100s of thousands of uncertifiable ghost vots in just 1 state thats beeninvestigated has to hurt... almostseems like you guys were the insurr-ists alla long... so good job,thanksfor this illegitimat evegetable destroying the country at a neverbefore seen pace furthermore, try ONE argument. so far, the impeachment trials best argument was that he used the word "fight" in a sentance... as the people who touristedthe capitol was already there at the very moment he used that word... but who cares about reality, right?

[@haircutdeluxe]

The whole internet should be like 4chan. You’ll have to wade through a sewer, but there really is some great shit in there.

[@ASDeckard]

4chan is heavily censored, which is why 8chan needed to exist.... which is ironically now itself fairly heavily censored.

[@nsh1980]

@@ASDeckard wherever the “dangerous “ ideas and the people who want to hear them go the censors will be following right behind to shut it down and suppress its spread. We don’t live in a marketplace of ideas, we live on a battlefield of ideas that is disguised as a marketplace as long as you don’t stray too near the front.

[@samdg1234]

At 35;50, Sam seems to struggle to find some daylight between his own views and those of Douglas Murray. That daylight is dazzlingly bright when simple principles are the issue. Sam essential states that he and people that think like him should have the power to quash sharing of information that *might* cause a political situation that he and his 'intelligentsia ' and 'glitterati' don't approve of. At 37;23, he states, "There is *LITERALLY* nothing you could have told me, about Hunter Biden that *WOULD HAVE BEEN RELEVANT TO ME* when the goal was to keep Trump out of office at that point." So he (Sam) sees no scandal or dishonor in asserting that because he finds that Hunter's corruption is tied to Joe Biden's as irrelevant, he (Sam) should have the power to keep such information from those who might find such information relevant. In this Sam shows himself to be grossly unprincipled. I've seen glimmers of this in the past. It is thrown into stark relief here. Thank you Douglas for your crystal declaration in opposition to Sam's imperious dictatorial instincts at 39;46.

[@Jekyll_Island_Creatures]

Well said.

[@magicbuns4868]

Yeah exactly, two things can be true at once, and worth considering in. One of his most blinded tweets I've ever seen him make was "Democracy was saved" after Biden won the election - it highlighted how fixated he was on Trump. Western democratic systems and liberal values around the West don't feel more secure two years on.

[@edgaraf9411]

Sam's principles lead him to not wanting Rrump in office because he was objectively worse. You retards don't understand that.

[@anthonyreed480]

Exactly right. I was genuinely gobsmacked that Sam could say that with a straight face, but I shouldn't have been. He's proven so many times that he fancies himself one of "the adults" in the room who knows best.

[@samdg1234]

@@anthonyreed480 And for Sam declaring an issue into which he has, “limitless clarity“ kzbin.info/www/bejne/q3XXi4pmpNKph8k

[@MrSidney9]

Sam couldn’t decide whether is was wrong for the media to systematically repressed the Hunter Biden story? Gee! this was so disappointing! At least he brought Douglas over as a voice of true nuanced and balanced reasoning and commitment to intellectual honesty

[@TenTonNuke]

The Hunter laptop story is just Hillary's Emails: The Sequel. It was an unconfirmed claim being used to influence an election. The media was right to refuse to give it a spotlight until it was investigated, rather than hype a rumor.

[@MrSidney9]

@@TenTonNuke Dude, they new the story had merit. Like you said here it was just a matter of controlling information so as to steer voters in a certain direction rather than letting them be truly informed voters. This is plainly antidemocratic and serves to generate mistrust in the media, the very mistrust they claim is not warranted. I for one thinks the Biden would have still won even if the story was allowed to be published.

[@TenTonNuke]

@@MrSidney9 What do you mean they knew it had merit? Nothing has come from it even now.

[@MrSidney9]

@@TenTonNuke I mean they knew it wasn't some fabricated story like they claimed

[@edgaraf9411]

It was wrong but in the world of evils I'd rather choose the lesser one. You can't change the game unless you win it, and you can't do that unless you play it.

[@paulkEmon]

I listened to this in pieces, but I feel like it was basically an hour of trashing trump followed by a teaser for the reason I clicked in the first place

[@brianmeen2158]

Pretty much, as soon as Sam mentions Trump I just groan

[@cshipster11]

Trump is a disgrace to our country

[@Ashantia35]

Oh you want to only hear the LEFT bad all the time. Problem with some on the right is you've attached yourself soo much to Trump that any criticism of this flawed man is taken as a direct shot at yourself

[@chriscoffee9070]

@@Ashantia35 You don't understand, I feel the same as the OP, I can't bear Trump either, but to suggest that he's uniquely unsuitable for government is ridiculous, he's no worse than all the other corrupt lying sociopaths in government and nowhere near as bad as some; he just doesn't have an array of slick PR people smoothing his 'brand' out for him. Sam's myopic and ceaseless diatribes about DT border on obsessive. I bought every one of Sam's books and hung on his every utterance for many years until he decided to venture into politics a few years ago. I can't even use his meditation material any more, I keep expecting him to start going on about trump yet again. I've not listened to his output for a long time, only here because Murray is on..

[@Bryan-wf5mi]

When the criticism is so absurd as what Harris is saying here, I might as well go listen to Joy Reid and that of course would be painful. When you are this biased as Harris is towards trump it makes it a terrible listen.

[@anthonyreed480]

The lack of introspection Sam has is truly incredible. Imagine if Don Jr had a job on the board of a Ukranian gas company and there were leaked emails about cash "for the big guy" lol. Sam would have to start a new podcast series of 12 eps to cover it.

[@claudiaxander]

The Republican-led Senate investigation found no evidence of wrongdoing on Biden’s part with regard to Ukraine. It also pointedly noted the involvement of Giuliani, saying his “discredited conspiracy theories and alliance with figures connected to Russian intelligence have been widely reported.”

[@pathologicaldoubt]

Jared Kushner had a job inside the Trump admin, is his family, and literally pocketed billions from the Saudi Prince. And there’s nothing but crickets from Trumpists. LOL at your “Sam is incapable of introspection”

[@nsh1980]

Wonder what the other two replies are? Good thing we are being protected from each other’s true thoughts!

[@nsh1980]

@@djknox2 oh you think it’s him? I assumed the algorithm was doing it. Hmm

[@sachamm]

Trump got away with 1000X worse and no one gave one shit. How do you think run-of-the-mill corruption from Hunter is going to matter if we can't even keep fascist-wannabes out of the office of the prez?

[@chriscoffee9070]

"By lying, we deny others a view of the world as it is. Our dishonesty not only influences the choices they make, it often determines the choices they can make" - Sam Harris, 'Lying' 2011. Choices... yes, like the choice on a ballot paper for example.

[@jordanmasuccio]

It's sad that Sam disregards truths he's written about so clearly in the past to fuel his blind hate for Trump. Sam needs another podcast with Scott Adams to put the nail in the coffin for these dogmatic views he has on Trump. This is coming from someone who loves Sam Harris, he's one of my fav guys to this day, but he's so lost in the delusion of Trump being a literal Hitler, that he turns into a metaphorical blue haired SJW any time he mentions Trump. Come on Sam, we want you back to your old self, have a hard reset on your views and come back to us stronger with what you find without bias.

[@davidlenz9902]

@@jordanmasuccio I've realized this with Sam for a while, specifically with his views on Christianity. He use to make comments as if the US was one election away from becoming a theocratic fascist state, as if he's never read a history book and never realized that the vast majority of our politicians and population has been religious, and even more dogmatic and fundamental the further back you go. The logical conclusion would be that there's an even smaller chance of the US becoming a Christian Saudi Arabian today, but yet an ever growing threat of becoming a socialist secular society the less religious and more secular we become. I think the ultimate antidote to Sam is Nietzsche.. he at least recognized the religious instinct and the inevitable void created by secularism. He also criticized intellectual and academic culture for lacking any affirmation of values, and expecting people to live like infallible automatons, devoid of human nature or existential/religious needs. Sam's so called realization that he needed to study religion from a psych/neurological standpoint was the _assumption_ that the terrorists that flew into the twin towers did so because if you believe in 90 virgins in the afterlife, it then becomes rational to commit the terrorist act, thereby solidifying his own belief in rationalism, or the intellectual faculty being the fundamental cause of human behavior. Sadly, there are plenty of other causes, outside of intellect and material causes which can cause people to do such things, such as emotional/neurotic, social or reasons causes based on values, or a simple psychological negation of life. His general philosophy on life is so out of wack.. it's always been so hard for me to believe that such smart people can believe such specious and shallow ideas. I think that's the consequence of man living less instinctually. A plumber could probably know human nature better than 10 psych professors could.

[@australianpatriot]

@@jordanmasuccio his hate for trump isn’t blind, any rational person can clearly see the substantial issues with trump and his threat towards democracy

[@kylespence4869]

Sam made a living mocking God, so God sent an orange clown to torment him for eternity.

[@kylespence4869]

Sam made a living mocking God, so God sent an orange clown to torment him for eternity.

[@randygault4564]

No, Sam, there is not "some residual bigotry" left today. Rather, there is increasing and widely-accepted bigotry against exactly one group, who gets the blame for literally everything bad. And everything good wasn't good enough, soon enough. The culture is drenched in it.

[@vu4y3fo846y]

Without context, your comment is ambiguous. I have a guess, but what one group are you referring to?

[@LeatherCladVegan]

Which is that one group?

[@sidehustlez8946]

Awww. You're so oppressed.

[@ASDeckard]

"It's so sad to be a poor, white man. I know the road looks tough ahead. We used to have all the money and land.... and we still do, but it's not as fun now."

[@jackmikhail6807]

@@ASDeckard Amen to that!

[@gurpchirp]

douglas, making 100X more sense than sam here. trump really snapped sam's mind in half.

[@joekunis9986]

Yeah the current right in this country is not a blip on the radar screen compared to the left when assessing the cultural damage done to the country. Sam just won't admit it.

[@blueprince2330]

Agreed. I love Sam, but every time he gets on his soapbox about Trump, he loses a little bit of respect from me. I don't need him to support Trump, but he's definitely got a touch of Trump derangement syndrome.

[@Jomi91]

Very sad what has happened to Sam.

[@skronked]

Trump is an idiot. Sam Harris is a very sincere & brilliant intellect! Trump is a joke!

[@SS-uh6ht]

While I do recognize that TDS exists, and that it does often get in the way of having real discourse, I also believe the sophistry and buffoonery of Donald shouldn’t be ignored. - Donald Trump in a 2014 interview “I played first base, the best base. Second base, third base - that’s for losers. I have huge hands, so I could scoop up the ball. Sometimes I didn’t even use a glove. The ball was much more slippery then, not many people know that. The Yankees recruited me very strongly. They came to our house, they said to my dad, “You got to let him join our club. He’s the greatest natural talent.” My dad said, “Greater than DiMaggio? Greater than Babe Ruth?” “Yes,” they said, “greater than all of them put together.” I was 12 at the time.” What type of purchase on reality and truth do you think this dude has?

[@YouAreSoMadRN]

Okay Sam, it’s hard to listen to your takes nowadays and not cringe 😬

[@YouAreSoMadRN]

@@adamp108 Good riddance, if you can’t listen to Murray and wish to censor him, I can’t imagine anyone that’s not an extremist wanting to do anything with you.

[@nsh1980]

@@adamp108 ewww! You used platform as a verb and disagree with me? Pshhhaw!

[@Sal3600]

@@adamp108 there reason sam is good is because he hosts people like Murray.

[@PeteMD]

Yeah Sam is broken. He is the most delusional person in any political conversation

[@stephengehly2319]

@@adamp108 it is obviously idiotic to not want to listen to people more intelligent than yourself. I agree.

[@peterblanch2603]

I have listened to Sam for 10 years, loved his outlook on ideas. But I never thought I would hear him justify lieing and cheating to get the result he wanted.

[@holysquire8989]

@@djknox2 sam harris is an authoritarian neocon, a reactionary. it's not just liberals who are the enemy but the reactionary rinos too.

[@steve_m2473]

Yet he is fine calling out the right for looking the other way on such behavior from Trump. I think ultimately Sam still believes the institutions are the "center" point of America. And since they are assuredly not, this will severely warp your perspective on American society if you can't recognize them as "left" (or "establishment" is probably more accurate).

[@jyjjy7]

@@steve_m2473 Establishment" institutions are, basically by definition, conservative entities in that they represent things that have already been previously "established" within our culture and politics to the level of "institutionalization". They just *don't and cannot* represent change/progress, they *have to* represent the ideas of the past, specifically those enshrined and preserved in ways that they will remain relevant and in effect with regards to whatever the function of the institution in question happens to be. I'd like to at this point simply call attention to how difficult it is to even communicate with conservatives at this point because you people literally act like progressives rejecting ideas that don't actually make sense on a basic logical or semantic level is proof that they have lost their minds and are clueless. It is fine (logically valid) if you think American institutions have gone too far and you would like to see them regress to a previous state but that just means you are more than "conservative" in your political opinions and instead openly regressive, but of course no, NOT that ideas that have been institutionalized to the point of being "establishment" are possibly still "progressive" ones. You should be concerned, just like I am, perhaps more so even, that I have had to patiently spell this out for you and I encourage you as much as I can to not just do the painfully predictable thing and come up with and spit out some only vaguely coherent dismissive response that will allow you to ignore this *glaring* flaw in the way you think that in reality means it is *your* perception that is "warped" to the point that you consider those that aren't warped in the same way to be so instead. In short, please stop being willfully delusional in justification of a personal political selection bias that is otherwise without merit and incompatible with a sane and informed perspective.

[@Aaron-bx5ko]

He’s just a regular partisan shill at this point

[@stephencolbertcheese7354]

@@jyjjy7 haha...Perfect

[@AlexBerezovskyJr]

It was right about the end when sam felt the need to state his skin color to preface a conversation about race while also admitting its obscene to do so that i lost yet more respect for him

[@jumpinjohnnyruss]

He has a real obsession with "the [direction]". He needs to read some Phil Pettit or someone like that and educate himself on when group agents do and do not exist. Then again, maybe he understands his role as being to provide the bootstraps for sociopolitical bimodality.

[@matityaloran9157]

46:05, I agree with Douglas Murray on this one

[@samdg1234]

Only TDS (and near-total lack of principle) would render one a different opinion.

[@TheAlibabatree]

@@samdg1234 TDS only exists in the minds of deranged fanatics of the former president.

[@Sal3600]

The notion that trump was going to destroy democracy and that the Russians were involved is absolute bollocks.

[@TheAlibabatree]

@@Sal3600 Had he been successful in stealing the election (which is exactly what he was trying to do), then yes, that would have been akin to destroying our democracy.

[@lukecooper6971]

and then Sam spouts the Russia gate lie lol he's lost all credibility lol .

[@NikoBased]

Sam, Douglas is right about a lot of this stuff. The reason conservatives in the US feel like they can no longer trust many institutions, is because many institutions have proven themselves to be untrustworthy. What you're asking conservatives to do, is lose. You're simply asking them to tolerate being bullied around by the American left, who have marched through institutions, and have all manner of political power and influence, and oh by the way, they're going to teach your 5 year old about gender fluidity and sexual orientation, and censor media stories that detail corruption on one side of the isle. Are you mad? Are you absolutely insane? What do you expect them to do? Stop pushing these people around, or it's going to escalate to place you can't even imagine. If you think this is bad, keep looking the other way as the left behaves this way, with whatever justifiable excuse you can come up with. You're backing them into a corner which is going to cause a problem a hell of a lot bigger than Trump.

[@gkoogz9877]

Well said.

[@benhallo1553]

Perfectly said. Suppression of any stories is bad full stop. The whole allure of trump revolves largely around his criticisms of the corrupt media and institutions

[@wasdwasdedsf]

"You're backing them into a corner which is going to cause a problem a hell of a lot bigger than Trump." oh, the problem of peace deals in the middle east, a quiet north korea, china and russia, first real wage growth in half a century, with miraculous 6-8% wage growth at 2% inflation ratio, energy independence?

[@wasdwasdedsf]

@@benhallo1553 and his skills, results, and non-dementia

[@quartzparchmentshears8368]

The thing is, institutions tend to be overrun by liberal intellects, because that's where reality tends to live.

[@toby9999]

Douglas Murray on the U.S. elections, Trump, Biden etc... absolutely spot on. Sam was sadly a train wreck.

[@godisbollocks]

What do you mean?

[@bloodredcrown]

Murray makes point after point as Sam keeps dropping his clown nose.

[@PhysicsPolice]

Interview starts at 11:55

[@BurntF3aceMan]

thanks fam

[@vhyles]

champ 👌🏻👌🏻

[@sandorfintor]

Thank You. Hard to bear his opening statement.

[@anubislee36]

jesus it really took that long to get going. Some content creators are absolutely clueless about how to retain listeners

[@hitchslap8254]

2 minutes in I was desperately searching for this comment!

[@BurntF3aceMan]

it would have been easier in the first segment for Sam to have provided a whip for Douglas to flagellate himself with

[@sandorfintor]

Very very disappointed with the lack of Sam Harris's intellectual honesty here...

[@jumpinjohnnyruss]

You didn't tell us what there is to be disappointed about or even who it is that is, was, will be (etc.) very very disappointed. I'm disappointed be deliberately incomplete sentences. It's okay to use pronouns. Don't fear them.

[@jamesdunning8650]

​@@jumpinjohnnyruss Being ignorant of the fact that social media can be deemed the public square hence protected by the 1st amendment, is one example.

[@Thomas15]

@@jamesdunning8650 Social media platforms are private companies no matter how many people use them.

[@jamesdunning8650]

@@Thomas15 Not in the USA. That's why the use of the internet, which is owned by private servers, is protected by the 1st Amendment. Do some more research. I thought big corporations were evil and owned by billionaires who are money hungry? Do you really want these types of people dictating what people say on the internet?

[@openup8027]

@@jamesdunning8650 says who ? Sounds like you haven’t examined the line of Supreme Court cases and jump from A to Z , that the Supreme Court will deem it a “public” square.

[@craigb4913]

Sam doesn't mind media outlets banning certain stories as long as it helps his candidate win an election. Quite principled.

[@shamsam4]

I don't agree with Sam's characterization of Bret Weinstein at all.

[@simonheaney8721]

Gaad Saad .Dave Rubin. Shapiro..Jordan is oblivious

[@matthewrichmond4139]

When the Pandemic was full-steam.... Sam was Trump deranged, pro-mandate and vaccine and Brett wasn't. I would always listen to Brett before Sam. Even now he just said Trump's ban from Twitter was justified. And now saying Elon is addicted to Twitter. I rarely listen to Sam now. He's gone off the rails. He's finished.

[@PeteMD]

Sam is a joke

[@GeneTickles]

Forgets about Stacy Abrahams, forgets about the Supreme Court nomination insurrection, and forgets about the B L M riots before, during, and after. Sam has always been a millionaire and hasn’t had to deal with the real world.

[@ArthurDubinsky]

He lives a new york atheist typical Jewish life. And it is not a surprise trump has turned his brain into mush.

[@countdebleauchamp]

"Supreme Court nomination insurrection" effing pleeze. What nonsense.

[@ramongonzalez2112]

And the dossier. Harris says Trump’s the “most dangerous cult leader.”😂 I like Trump’s policies not his personality. And most conservatives never bought Putin’s embrace of democracy. But he certainly didn’t steal the election for Trump.😂

[@countdebleauchamp]

@@ramongonzalez2112 That the dossier may have been BS doesn't mean that the Russians didn't influence the election in Trump's favor.

[@GeneTickles]

@@countdebleauchamp you’re nonsense. You just don’t like it coming back at your side hypocrite.

[@anthonyreed480]

Sam: "Twitter *isn't* the town square." Fails to accept the premise, and so his arguments go haywire right from the jump. "It's a company, build your own if you don't like it!" *builds own/buys company* "NOOOOOOO reeeeeeeeee"

[@gavaniacono]

The problem for Sam is that he now has more than one singular problem that requires subverting democratic processes. He needs to substitute singular with multiple to remain honest. He just can't identify his own bias, it is very sad for a philosopher cum neuro-scientist to have come to this. He has become a political partisan just like the folk he now forsaken.

[@AlanDantes76]

What bias of his does he not recognize? You make a lot of assertions here but provide no evidence for them.

[@AlanDantes76]

@@Eviljubs He's not justifying anything, he admitted his fault on this matter, and just said frankly, that even though morally the right thing to do was to pursue the Biden laptop story, he doesn't see a reality where he wishes it would have happened, and neither do I. He doesn't have TDS- that's a lazy way of saying you get angry when he bags on Trump. He's pointed out numerous times how just because you may hate the dude, it doesn't mean every single thing he does, or did, is wrong, and he pointed out a number of decent things he did while in office, including being against Critical Race Theory. The atheism + thing is quite strange for you to bring up, as he's never been a part of that silly nonsense. It would seem you're confusing that tripe with the New atheists. Frankly, it just seems you have an axe to grind with Harris and aren't really familiar with his views on most topics.

[@AlanDantes76]

@@Eviljubs I seem to remember in your previous post that you were concerned about how long your comment was. I'm happy to see you've abandoned that concern lmao. I stand by my claim that saying Harris has TDS is lazy; it's a right wing "gotcha" term that has absolutely no meaning. Your attempts to justify it show this clearly. You act as if Sam is some huge fan of Biden, which he is absolutely not, and he wasn't a fan of Hillary either. He's said countless times that Hillary and Trump were the two most unlikeable candidates ever to run for the office of President. You seem like the type of person who seeks out "conversations" like this all day because you simply cannot get enough of this discussion, and I can assure you, I have better things to do, so I'll let you just run with whatever opinions and hills you wish to die on, I'd rather spend my time doing something fun than engaging in this tiresome, years-old banter. I merely thought it prudent to point out that nothing you said made much sense, which it doesn't. Russians certainly had an effect on the 2016 election; to what extent you don't know, and neither do I. I don't care what atheist movement you were ,or are, a part of, and your group identity should be the least interesting thing about you. "He is no longer a skeptic on many topics." Again, more vague conjecture. Sam gets pummeled from both the left and the right, so I fail to see how you can claim he isn't skeptical. He has been a voice of reason for a couple of decades now, and while I'm open to hear criticism and don't always agree with him, your claims, again, just don't ring true. You have an axe to grind with Sam, and you haven't presented any valid reasons why. "he's not skeptical about many issues" is not enough. Again, I have better things to do man, let's leave it at this and have a good day.

[@AlanDantes76]

@@Eviljubs You didn't make any points, that's why I didn't respond to them. Stop patting yourself on the back.

[@AlanDantes76]

@@Eviljubs Just because you typed something, doesn't mean you made a valid point. In your mind, which doesn't surprise me, you think you did. You grouped Sam into your convenient TDS category, and proceeded to rail on about someone you have an issue with, and you'll complain to anyone who will listen. Your "points" were laughable and I feel no need to address them. Anything else? No? Good. Go bitch to someone else.

[@xeftones]

Sam is SO PARTISAN on the Hunter Biden laptop issue.

[@PeteMD]

Yep Sam is a very very dishonest actor.

[@jumpinjohnnyruss]

@@PeteMD Most actors are.

[@buckchile614]

As is the other side. A politician's son gets a seat on a board for doing nothing. Unprecedented! The Republic is on fire!! Apparently, this kind of thing only matters whenever a Dem gets into office. Kind of like the deficit

[@fullwaverecked]

Like Maxine Waters? Has anyone on the left ever been canceled?

[@jamesmorrow1646]

Has anyone on the right ever been cancelled?

[@richardpowell1772]

Exactly. The rules are never evenly applied. There’s plenty of leftist (some with blue check marks) and Antifa accounts on Twitter that doxx, publish hacked materials, openly condone and/or organize violence on that platform, yet their accounts are still there. Meanwhile, The Babylon Bee is suspended for making a joke.

[@ubuu7]

Al Franken, Kathy Griffin

[@jamesmorrow1646]

@Pike Man They weren’t canceled, they broke the terms of usage and were removed. They were completely free to speak their insane ramblings on other platforms.

[@tcritt]

@Pike Man Sam agrees that Trump and Alex Jones clearly broke terms of service and the law. He talks about it in this video. Haha.

[@homewall744]

If you want to make tech that doesn't allow people to be free, then make it limited from the start. Don't ask people to provide a comment if you are worried that when the comment is negative, that you feel the submissive victim. You can certainly create a moderated communications platform, but then you become the publisher and are responsible for what you thought wise to allow, like a newspaper is liable for all it prints, including letters, opinions and advertising.

[@1984a-g9f]

This is so simple, I don’t believe Sam Harris is actually that dumb. He is lying to himself to justify is TDS after watch how bad he made average Americans by supporting Biden and those corrupt tech corporations that bought him into office.

[@AurorXZ]

Thanks for this rational and insightful discussion-great to hear.

[@cinikcynic3087]

Very good points. Except Dougie has to realise that one can be Christian Orthodox and Nazi at the same time. So if a muslim shoots him he didn’t do it because of anyone’s religion.

[@CuriousGeorgio59]

Oh Sam, I enjoy checking in occasionally just to see how much progressively worse your takes are, and you never fail to disappoint.

[@Alfa4]

What happened? (is happening) I was noticing this too, I don't know since when this is happening I noticed it with the Ukraine-Russia thing, for someone who sells some type of enlightening I couldn't help but think his stance was anything but. It's kind of the same thing I never liked about Hitchens but somehow feel with Sam is a little bit out of character and disingenuous/ biased in some perverse way. Anyway that is only what I feel and cannot substantiate it.

[@n.trushaev5132]

Dude keeps becoming more a more of a pro-censorship neoliberal centrist as the years go by. I'm guessing he's wants to appeal to popular sentiment and remain in the good graces of our woke corporate overlords, but in reality he's just destroying his own career. He was at his height back in the late 2000s/early 2010s with all the atheism stuff, and then he still had some interesting things to say back when ISIS exploded back in like 2014-2015, but he's basically irrelevant at this point. In another 2 years or so he'll literally be endorsing Pete Buttigieg or some other milquetoast neoliberal centrist, and probably broadcasting on CNN+ 2.0 to an audience of like 5 other establishment journalists.

[@axe-z8316]

@@n.trushaev5132 lol

[@motorhead48067]

@@n.trushaev5132 Harris is trying to “remain” in the good graces of the woke corporate overlords? Do you know anything about his views lmao? Half of what he does is shit on the far left and on wokeism. Most people think he makes too much of it.

[@ThatOneScienceGuy]

Ouch!

[@oraz.]

Good on Douglass for pushing back at the 45 minute mark.

[@craigtimmons6907]

Go on?

[@mfromaustralia1]

Declining education standards, a shift to measuring worth by the amount of inputs instead of whether any worthwhile outputs emerge at the end of the process, Sam nails it. When I was young we had a fantastic TV show hosted by Professor Julius Sumner Miller. He had a slogan or a credo wherein he used to say in a crazy American accent, "ask yourself why is it so." Ahh, those were the days !

[@chomo54andbabyaisha97]

☝️ Getready for the next plandemic.

[@rafaelalandrade]

Sam has become completely deranged. It's been a sad journey down this path, and I must say TDS truly broke him.

[@ramongonzalez2112]

No kidding. Harris spent an hour attacking Trump and the conservatives; and 5 minutes on the Leftists that are destroying the West. Murray’s great, but Harris used him as a prop.

[@rafaelalandrade]

@@ramongonzalez2112 Indeed. It ruined this podcast, as it has ruined most of Harris' other work. It's non-stop now, he seems unable to control himself in almost any conversation.

[@Judge_Meridian]

TDS was displayed on Jan6.

[@rafaelalandrade]

@@Judge_Meridian You can think Jan 6 was wrong and still be able to understand that Trump is not the devil.

[@JacquesduPlessis11]

@@rafaelalandrade Genuine question - if Trump had got his way and Pence didn't ratify a fair vote - and tried to hold onto power - do you think that is the moment reason would have prevailed when others would have stepped in, or do you think that things would have escalated and gotten very ugly? I am genuinely curious. My money is that people would have caved just like people caved to Mussolini. Jan 6 was a threat to the whole republic, and the fact that people downplay it is insane. And no I don't have TDS, I don't support Biden either - I just don't understand people's defence of Trump after his clearly bullshit behaviour after he lost the election. If that doesn't concern you - I am not sure what will.

[@chrisrayne3274]

I love Sam but his TDS is alive and well and ever-present in his thinking. I wish he'd spend more time wondering what the message behind Trump's election was rather than fetishizing about the man himself.

[@stirfrybry1]

I have to wonder if the guy understands that the far right hates Trump and consider him a zionist It's only midwits that haven't figured out Trump was put in there to flush out nationalists but he sucked so bad they had to fake an insurrection to keep selling their planned demonization of white people with "most dangerous threat" narrative

[@Raydensheraj]

And another triggered snowflake TJW that just can't handle that some Americans reject Diaper Don and his neo confederate Christian Nationalist QAnus Cult. TJW= Trump Justice Warrior

[@mormovies]

So tragic. A great mind like Sam's... turned to mush.

[@Sal3600]

I used to dislike trump in a similar manner. Until i looked at all the information available from both sides. It was clear that the left/democrats would vilify him in every action trump took.

[@PeteMD]

Ends up Sam never did have a great mind. Dishonest partisan self centered hack

[@atticusprime937]

Love Douglas! Thanks for this!

[@sameagletheregal8526]

This was more full on Sam TDS. Sam seems more concerned about what others may think of him if he associates with those of the wrong opinion.

[@MrCmon113]

Or he just hates Trump... like lots of people did even before he became president.

[@prioritystrength]

I've heard a few things from Douglas before that caused me to recoil a bit, but one thing I'm grateful to have learned from Sam is when somebody that you admire expresses an opinion that you disagree with (or in this case, entertains a guest that you disagree with), the proper response is curiosity. Not vitriol. So thanks for that, Sam. I'm glad that I listened in, and especially glad that I didn't agree with everything said. More thought provoking than the alternative.

[@erikshure360]

I wonder what board Sam is referring to when he mentions 4chan. Is he even aware of them?

[@simdal3088]

There is more illegal garbage on twitter and youtube.. He just parots act blue talking points. Free speech = antisemitism in his mind, he should be honest about it 😅

[@unknownsoldier9438]

He’s literally just making shit up. He’s never been to 4chan in his life and knows absolutely nothing about it, but he’s the kind of person who just makes shit up when he doesn’t actually know anything about a topic.

[@AngryBootneck]

After a decade as a fan I stopped following Sam about two years ago, because I went from being left wing at 21 to being Conservative at 41. For a man that likes to talk at length about logic and rationalism, I find it odd that he is immune to changing his mind.

[@lisad2701]

Then why TF are you here? Dishonest much?

[@tcritt]

I hope you recover from what must have been a very traumatic brain injury.

[@JW-bs7xp]

His views aren't solely rooted in his politics young man.. Please try not to be brainwashed by the overly simplistic smearing tropes of our time

[@siriusfun]

Sam is neither.

[@haircutdeluxe]

@@JW-bs7xp Yeah I’m sure he saw “censor everyone I don’t like, repressive tolerance is great” while he was on peyote or something

[@jimboo5802]

Of course not this and of course not that, I'm a man of such outstanding objective outlook on everything, but it's good that the man who was just the president of the US for 4 years is not on Twitter anymore because then he would be dangerous and I don't like him.. Your political thought, Mr. Harris, makes me want to become a Catholic again...

[@genzcurmudgeon8037]

Because apparently Trump being on Twitter means Nuclear war, according to Sam. He can be so melodramatic when it comes to Trump that I actually find it amusing. He reminds me of the 20 year old girls I overhear talking politics in bars and coffee shops. “Most dangerous cult leader in the entire world” - Sam Harris, and the 21 year old blue haired girl at the bar, on Trump.

[@edgaraf9411]

Of course the Trump fans don't understand. I'm sure a mob attack the capitol building and attacking law enforcement when they don't get their way to due to a con man's lie totally isn't dangerous. People who can make you believe in absurdities can make you commit atrocities. That is the danger Trump poses. History has shown this to be the case. Right-wing nationalism on the rise, the same ideology as Hitler. No wonder hate crimes went up directly to him

[@edgaraf9411]

@@genzcurmudgeon8037 Trump being mean on Twitter shows he has a lack of nuance, respect and dignity. Now transfer that over to how he handles policies and politicians. Use your brain. Nuclear war is an exaggeration but normal war? Certainly not. Iranian general killed? There's a reason why stuff like thay doesn't happen. "Punishing" someone isn't worth increased tensions between two adversary nations. Politics aren't black and white, the world isn't black and white

[@thiggs93]

I love Sam but I think his hatred of Trump has led him astray from intellectual honesty

[@PeteMD]

Aka Sam is dishonest. Sucks but it is true. He can’t be trusted

[@dandybufo9664]

@@PeteMD what dishonesty are you thinking of ?

[@RS-uh7rz]

Disagree. His view of Trump, like his views on everything else, is founded on dispassionate reason.

[@shadominium6290]

100% agree. You can sense his emotional frustrations when people don't agree with him.

[@GeneTickles]

That and he is terrified the left will come for him again, calling him a racist.

[@maxcharles6354]

Listening to this I am now a pure Conservative. Always thought sam harris was pretty fair,what a complete Liberal mess

[@gemkid85]

Lol phew.

[@therougesage7466]

Phew..

[@HypnoticSuggestion]

I've never understood the permanence of the decisions on Twitter. Why not soft bans, for example after a certain number of offenses in a given amount of time, the penalties rise linearly and then explode. Nobody ever needs to be permanently banned, but if they keep doing something outrageous, the bans stack up to weeks, or months. This has worked great on forums for 30 years.

[@thunderstruck1078]

Because they want to get rid of you permanently. If they could do it with impunity, they would do it in real life. The j-ruling class hate our guts.

[@stuboy261]

I have enormous respect for both of them, though this really felt like an attempt to manufacture a middle ground conversational space, a place for the disenfranchised centre and by that I mean it seems that much was kept intentionally vague so as to avoid upsetting either side by drilling down into specifics to say this is explicitly right or wrong, to cultivate a sense of your side has some things wrong, my side has some things wrong, we should keep that in mind and (continue to speak in very opaque terms) to avoid provoking peoples defences.

[@adstanrashaw9279]

well said. That is exactly what happened. Murray has alot to say in his book, but this did not seem to be discussed too much.

[@trentbeebe2052]

@@adstanrashaw9279 no sense in regurgitating his books information. Because it’s written down and available. But to create a middle ground in relative topics..

[@adstanrashaw9279]

@@trentbeebe2052 I think that is alright, but the discussion seemed a bit distracted and focused upon Trump when it is the left that are trying to destroy the West---that is the point of Murray's book.

[@AlanDantes76]

@@hikelfin then they have much in common with your youtube comments.

[@ramongonzalez2112]

Harris isn’t a centrist. He completely ignored the crap dossier or the fact that HRC said Trump was an illegitimate President.🤮

[@homewall744]

If you struggle with whether to shun someone (ban them, censor them), don't do it. It's really that easy. If you can say it in the town square, you can say it online, or you are really just the problem of spreading hate through your fear.

[@joedavis4150]

... Herman Melville wrote..." the miserable warping influence of towns and traditions"...... and Terence McKenna said that culture is not our friend.

[@johnowen1867]

Dude without towns and traditions we would live in trees playing with our wingwongs.

[@joedavis4150]

@@johnowen1867 ... But what if we could live under trees playing with our Wing Wong's? I would certainly choose this over punching the time clock.

[@benhallo1553]

I used to think of Sam as the epitome of rationality and unbiased thinking

[@johnwatts8346]

...but hes just another vapid lib hypocrite spouting b, s. i like how gad saad calls him the malabu meditator.

[@RS-uh7rz]

You used to be spot on.

[@Bryan-wf5mi]

You just listened to this podcast and came away that he is unbiased?

[@johnwatts8346]

@@johnj5221 well he couldve at least criticised trump within sane levels- claiming he was 'the most dangerous' and that 33-50% of americans were / are cult members is pathetic, the other pathetic thing is he does is- never critiques or holds obama hillary and biden to any standards at all. he even said hillary couldve been 'a good president', sam sucks, end of.

[@anthonyreed480]

Haha chance'd be a fine thing.

[@thomasalderson368]

It's basically the wild west and there's not much you can do about it. Thank you. Some rationality at last. It's like graffiti on a bathroom wall. It's up to you to get involved or not. People are adults. We don't need censorship Sam.

[@Sal3600]

Tesla is getting sued for bathroom graffiti. 15 million USD. For racism lmaooo

[@knossostellel-amarna8502]

Correct, just use the mute button Sam! Less moderation please

[@user-fu2lh7up2i]

"Sam Harris: Trump is the most dangerous cult leader on Earth" lol lol. Such silly statements! Without discussing the damage being inflicted today by Obama's third term. Runaway inflation destroying the working & middle class, a war on energy destroying the working & middle class (the rich still fly in their private jets), soaring food prices, Black lives Matter riots destroying $$$ billions in property, injuring thousands of innocents and resulting in the deaths of thousands as the defund war on the police causes the police to pull back and crime to soar. the endless race hustle... the sexual confusion of children all of these things are not as evil as Trump lolol give me a break. Intellectual dishonesty of the highest order

[@xrxs1020]

Sam is reportedly super smart and isn't to be challenged!

[@user-fu2lh7up2i]

@@xrxs1020 I'm unimpressed by Obamunistas like Sam & their narrow minded in the tank for Leftists intellect

[@christoferprestipino7433]

Anyone got eyes on the dislikes for this train wreck?? I’m interested to know what it takes for this dude to wake up at this point.

[@runreilly]

Where can we find the dislikes?

[@oasis71]

@@runreilly What you're looking for is Return KZbin dislike extension.

[@oscargoldman85]

I've been looking at the "I agree with Sam" Vs "Sam seems to have lost his mind over Orange Man".. My rough estimate is 1 in 20 agree with Sam. I'd call that ratioed. It would be great if Sam used his obvious intellectual power to do a ground up rebuild reconsider of the situation and his cognitive bias, rather than seemingly feeling bad when he gets a negative comment. Note: I have not seen any comments that seemed malicious, most simply stated what they felt, and were often just expressing disappointment with Sam's position rather than "hate".

[@Astarkiller]

@@runreilly there’s apps on PC’s to see the dislikes, the content creator can see it.

[@Astarkiller]

The call them programs

[@chester6514]

The idea to open source the algorithm was the most interesting. Also your point about 4chan seems to be something the media hasn’t picked up on. I don’t think Elon Musk has ever called for no moderation on the platform, despite what CNN keeps banging on about. I also agree that Twitter is not a town square. Twitter is already a cesspool of nonsense regardless of the left thinking it’s ‘safe’ for ‘vulnerable people’ and will become a free-for-all under Elon Musk (it isn’t, and it won’t). Elon Musk makes many claims that never seem to come to fruition. I hope he can turn Twitter into something more interesting but I’ll believe it when I see it. I can’t be bothered going on Twitter because it’s already a complete bunch of nonsense and people spouting boring and useless opinions that I’m not interested in wasting my time with. I’ve just got better things to do.

[@alextimer8055]

That’s a really long comment for someone who has better things to do. 🤣

[@chester6514]

@@alextimer8055 listening to Sam Harris and Douglas Murray is one of those better things 😏

[@tcritt]

So you came to the KZbin comments?

[@ThatOneScienceGuy]

“I can’t be bothered going on Twitter because it’s already a complete bunch of nonsense and people spouting boring and useless opinions that I’m not interested in wasting my time with.” Are you serious? Do you not know how to find people? Do you have no good intellectuals in mind who you can follow? Twitter is an incredibly rich and diverse platform. I love the people I follow. They’re thoughtful and intelligent.

[@LeatherCladVegan]

@@alextimer8055 It saddens me to see that this comment section has become a kind of stupid partisan comment section. No care for what is true, no concern for what was actually said. Nah, you would rather score cheap points and thumbs-up. Right? He didn't say he has better things to do than comment on the issue, he said that he has better things to do than join the raging Twitter mob. But you know that. I think that you are practicing deceiving people, misleading them. Well good luck, but don't turn around and cry that everybody else did you wrong.

[@ninjaskeleton6140]

Sam “I don’t know what to think about the Hunter Biden laptop story” Harris. His brain really is broken. What the hell happened to him over the last few years? He doesn’t seem like the epitome of reason I once believed him to be. How can he fail so badly on the question of free speech, over and over again?

[@benjaminz2523]

Very well said

[@noname19816]

He was never the epitome of reason. You've just outgrown him. Many of his claims are bogus and ahistorical.

[@ThatOneScienceGuy]

Yeah I’ve noticed lately he seems a little whack. His willingness to entertain aliens visiting earth (see Neil Tyson podcast) had my eyebrows raised. He didn’t express nearly enough skepticism. He just seemed to be going along with the stupid media hype about it.

[@makeshiftaltruist7530]

@@noname19816 That's well put. Most listeners have outgrown him. We loved Sam for his religious and philosophical discussions, not this constant political hogwash. Politics is a complete waste of time because NO ONE is on our side. Not one politician. It's all self enrichment for them and we have no power. It's boring and pointless to listen too.

[@archstanton3430]

In 2015, I thought Sam was a brave truth-teller and Glenn Greenwald was a bad-faith slimeball. Seven years later, it's the other way around. Strange days indeed.

[@toph8298]

Tell me you’re a Republican without saying you’re a Republican.

[@toph8298]

@@lookiehere5406 I was regretting to the poster. And Douglas Murray is left of centre? Please 😂

[@archstanton3430]

@@toph8298 Tell me you're a cliche-spouting simpleton without telling me.

[@toph8298]

@@archstanton3430 ✊🏻 💦

[@twntwrs]

I had a similar reaction with Harris and Ezra Klein.

[@lminterests5590]

Shutting something off is different than only allowing some people to use it. In the first case all are being treated equal.

[@chriscoffee9070]

First return to a Making Sense podcast for about a year, 2-decade fan and owner of all his books... but went completely went off him when he got into politics a few years ago and particularly on him contracting acute TDS. I'm here because DM is on... will see how far I get before SH starts going on endlessly about Trump and suggesting that I'm an idiot because I don't think he's the love child of Hitler and Satan.

[@TheYknuf]

I'm exactly like you. Read all Sam's books, watched literally every video on the internet featuring him. He was by far my favorite intellectual out there. But then, in 2016, he got TDS, and it seems to have only got worse over the years. Today he is but a shadow of his former astute self. I'm not even fond of Trump at all. But I appreciate that politics is sometimes complicated and requires one to see things from different perspectives. It's sad to see how Sam's TDS increasingly clouded his ability to think critically and rationally, which I used to so admire, and instead led to the utterly one-sided and biased partisanship he has displayed in previous years. Ever since I read 'The Strange Death of Europe', Douglas Murray has taken the place of my favorite intellectual. I can't wait to read his new book.

[@pocket83squared]

​@@TheYknuf The "TDS" thing would almost be laughable, if it weren't also so tragic. No, I'm not talking about Harris' inability to evaluate issues clearly: I'm talking about _yours._ At what point did it become considered a derangement to be fiercely critical over the actions of a person who's holding an elected office? As soon as somebody labels a particular criticism as being 'TDS,' my eyes tend to roll and then glaze over, because that meme only ever seems to come from a position of partisanship. Pick a specific point to find disagreement with, and then argue your case. Blowing raspberry with a blanket generalization is _not_ an argument, it's a dismissive scoff.

[@chriscoffee9070]

@@pocket83squared I am here to express why I no longer listen to Sam, I'm not interested in an extended argument in a text box, simply providing feedback, ideally to Sam himself, as to why he might find his long-established listeners are being put off by his recent content. I am also fiercely critical of Trump, he's a pretty appalling human being as are of a lot of politicians, but my point is that Sam is obsessed with this particular subject and in the last 6 or 7 years it has dominated his thinking and changed him from a balanced and thoughtful commentator into an obsessive myopic.

[@pocket83squared]

​@@chriscoffee9070 Let me get this straight then: so you're here to _talk,_ but not to _listen?_ Here's my feedback: it's not an "obsession" for one to continuously and clearly mark out bad ideas with repudiation. Though you'd prefer "balanced," the 45th President was a heavily one-sided, intuition-driven misfit who plowed through his tenure by forcing through enough bad ideas to justify the resultant tsunami of criticism. To fail to remain critical of such an aberration is to've been won over into complacence, and that's precisely the brute-force strategy of mindless persistence he used to gain power. We're talking about the highest elected office here; the occupant will, necessarily, "dominate" our thoughts. These issues are not things to scoff at for the sake of civility. Just as religious moderates permit ideological spread by their inaction, so too do weak-minded centrists as mob-backed Populist policy continues to work its way in. Note that in matters of public discourse, silence is a tacit endorsement; as listeners regarding the charismatic, we tend to fill in gaps of the unknown with our own values-which is how the most empty candidate becomes the most electable.

[@jakejohnson972]

Tiny hats getting worried about losing their strangle hold on free speech. I approve of this.

[@neglectfulsausage7689]

Tiny hats overwhelmingly represent banksters (vanguard and blackrock?), hollywood, and evne politicians ( feinstein, etc). Thats because they're highly educated and highly intelligent as a ethnic group. The problem is that peopel who become trendsetters for million+ pop societies start to think they're god. But antisemitism isnt the cure. The left is antisemitic too. White is a stand-in for jew. As soon as the "common white" is put ubnder the boot, all the jews will be alone to be sniped off by the anti-racists, precisely because they actually DO run so much.

[@benjaminz2523]

The Attack of the Small Hat Imposters

[@nsh1980]

@@benjaminz2523 I bet that second invisible comment is spicy!!

[@nsh1980]

Are you talking about the people who own the majority of printing presses, radio stations, tv stations, movie studios, and internet communication companies? No pattern here folks move along!

[@martinpospisil3747]

@@nsh1980 I mean Sam is early lifer himself.

[@vu4y3fo846y]

Leave the public square alone until someone breaks the law

[@matthewobrien5925]

35:00 - Correction: Trump didn't call Democrats "the Enemy". That term is reserved for the Media. The media still fails to properly analyze its own culpability for Trumpism.

[@nickyd922]

He called Democrats treasonous

[@jakeslist569]

@@nickyd922 Yeah that kind of bombast is certainly inappropriate. Have the Democrats said similar things about Trump? You know damn well they have! So our side isn't so innocent as Sam infers.

[@mike8595]

@@jakeslist569 Well hell, 'Ol Bernie called Republicans "evil" and "killers" and the next day a man went out to a baseball field with the intent of murdering as many Republicans as possible. Not a single article was written about Bernie being the catalyst for these events.

[@westonmeyer3110]

@@nickyd922 They are.

[@treeinside]

Sam is believing many lies that need to be pushed back on.

[@MexAm120902]

Both of these men can't understand why anyone would vote for Trump because they are unwilling to hear what he really said. I voted for him because he was the first presidential candidate in 20 years that spoke about immigration honestly. Prior to him, every president, both Democrat and Republican, was undermining our immigration laws. Some were more egregious, others less. But at the end of the day it was all about undermining our immigration laws. Yet, both of these intellectuals seem unable to understand this. Another point: flawed though he is, Trump expressed a real love of country. That meant a lot to many people who felt that so many of the previous leaders of our country had no problem putting the needs and interests of people from countries above those of American citizens. And it was especially galling since these leaders were supposed to be leading us and looking out for us--not everyone else in the world.

[@countdebleauchamp]

Anyone who has done what Trump has done has no real love of country.

[@yayalapham3269]

Douglas Murray literally wrote a book, “The Strange Death of Europe” about this very topic and Sam interviewed him at length about those very points.

[@brianmeen2158]

I know and I’m continually puzzled as to why he’s shocked that Certain groups vote for Trump. I didn’t vote for Trump but I completely understand why many of my peers did. Harris has a blind spot here but I think Murray knows exactly why Trump has a fan base .

[@Baron_Blue_Max]

Sam is still pro-censorship and deranged about Trump I see. 🙄 Love Douglas Murray though.

[@dancarter6044]

Your take is totally dishonest crap

[@Baron_Blue_Max]

@@dancarter6044 I'm a free-speech absolutist and obviously Trump was not an existential threat to the country. I like Sam's takes on a lot of issues but not these two. What makes you think I'm being dishonest and not just an idiot with a bad opinion?

[@dancarter6044]

@@Baron_Blue_Max When someone refuses to accept the election results and refuses to leave the office, he is a threat to the republic.

[@Baron_Blue_Max]

@@dancarter6044 but... he did leave office. 🤷🏼‍♂️ also, weirdly I can't see you comment in the thread, just your reply to me. YT is messing with you man. Been happening a lot lately. Maybe some of the keywords you used? Just a fyi.

[@dancarter6044]

@@Baron_Blue_Max For the record, I voted for Trump in 2016, but he just effed up royally

[@ellemjay]

"apes in the loop" is such a great expression.

[@idanthyrsus6887]

One of the more boring and pointless videos he's made in a while. Sam Harris has nothing but standard wokie talking points. He hasn't said anything interesting in years. Another person Donald Trumps mundane presidentancy literally broke.

[@dandimit8463]

Thanks for putting this together. I appreciate both your ideas.

[@echoplexmedia]

You appreciate great replacement theory? Okay Dan.

[@dandimit8463]

@@echoplexmedia I don’t even know what that even means, troll. Go somewhere else for your kicks. I’ll be disappointing.

[@masterofnone8400]

Sam has honestly lost it. Imagine feeling the need to point out an obvious and pedantic point like 'racism is bad' or 'slavery is wrong' when having a discussion on western civilisation as if its the only civilisation who engaged in these practices, honestly, every fucking conversation has me more and more worried about him.

[@JC-lu4se]

Your use of profanity leaves me thinking you're very young, unstable and it's a case of people should be more worried about you.

[@davidokinsky114]

He is losing the plot, which is a worry for me. I generally respect Sam's opinion on a great and many things, but he is starting to disappoint me.

[@masterofnone8400]

@@JC-lu4se I'm 40 years old and u believe society should be worried about me because I used the f-word? Yeeeeeok😂😂 I'd say you're fun at parties.

[@edgaraf9411]

It proclaims to be the best yet it still has flaws and is hypocritical. Americans ignore their history which is riddled with racism, slavery and their effects on race. This leads to division, resentment and calls for change. Nobody is saying "only the west did it" They are saying "the west did and still does it while doing little to fix the repurcussion, then wonder and bitch why people don't like it." I fixed it for you. Many Americans don't seem to think racism is bad "it's natural"(actual arguments I've heard). Some are just racially prejudiced and refuse to admit as such even though almost everybody is. I could go on but the point is there

[@ninjaskeleton6140]

He also derides identity politics while engaging in it at every opportunity.

[@barbuckle4207]

Sam Harris 2018 - We agree on the primacy of free speech. Sam Harris 2022 - Censoring speech is okay if I really really don't like what they are saying.

[@samdg1234]

I'd give you 10 thumbs up if I could for that.

[@hairetikos6402]

Sam (I am for free speech except for orange man) Harris. Free Speech is not a 'Hard Problem', the only hard problem is how those of us who actually value freedom counter act desengeous censors like you.

[@hartkopz86]

Those who foment sedition and treason don't get to cry about 1st Amendment rights.

[@countdebleauchamp]

"disingenuous"

[@hairetikos6402]

@@countdebleauchamp thankyou for proof reading my youtube comment. Your services are much appreciated.

[@daleullom9008]

Sam tries to put Douglas on the defense right from the start with accusations. Sam's hatred for Trump is deep seated with no logical foundation. You cannot get past blaming all the politics of the right on Trump. Trump indeed is rent-free in Sam's head!

[@mormovies]

Very troubling. I fear Sam will never come back to rationality.

[@adam1780]

Occupying an entire lobe and a half at this point.

[@nickyd922]

Trumpism has destroyed democracy. QAnon et al

[@billlyons7024]

There's a logical foundation. Trump acted like an unhinged lunatic throughout his term and tried to bully electors during the election. Every American should be concerned that someone like him got into the White House.

[@mizaklaw]

💯

[@Jekyll_Island_Creatures]

Sam: Trump nearly ended democracy! Working Class People: The Trump years were the best economic years of my life.

[@beephex1]

Still not much mention of the Steele dossier.

[@gkoogz9877]

Sam is factually dead wrong about 4chan. There is no cp or illegal content.

[@lancewalker2595]

Ya... he's been talking out of his ass lately. Clearly this is indeed a deranging time.

[@Nesendrea]

It’s changed then, because back when I used to browse, “Captain Picard” threads were quite popular. “The mods are asleep”, posters would say, and out came the bear.

[@Vorpal_Wit]

Yes, to Sam's discredit he often builds his opinions on his impression of something rather than his experience of something - we all do this, but Sam's venue and reach demand a higher standard in most of these cases.

[@PaulMathias1]

Just full of nut jobs?

[@aln5832]

There actually is.

[@langa77777]

Thank you Sam. Reason is fundamental.

[@corporalsanders9981]

I like how this cuts off just before they start to criticize the left.

[@adlc5288]

Sam declared that he was willing to look past the lies spread by media and government and censorship by social media of the laptop story, because Trump being re-elected was a high possibility if the story was allowed to run its course. I always believed Sam to be a person who seeks the truth above all else, especially personal political beliefs. This was discouraging and I'm likely no longer to be engaged with Sam's work.

[@hubrisnaut]

Sam is deeply interested in the science of morality... His angst means anything goes.

[@serofibrinous]

think before you write

[@adlc5288]

@@serofibrinous rudeness and laziness

[@andyh3970]

Sam spent the whole hour criticizing the right. Incredible cognitive dissonance or plain dishonesty ???

[@simdal3088]

Dishonesty

[@unendingitch4118]

Sam has spent countless hours criticizing the left.

[@toby9999]

@@unendingitch4118 While drifting closer and closer to them and sounding more and more like them.

[@unendingitch4118]

@@toby9999 when sam is out there promoting CRT, BLM, and whatever other insanity the far/mainstream left talks about, I’ll believe you.

[@NotQuiteFirst]

How about just good old tribal allegiance

[@Tuatara1989]

51:00 Where is think the question goes wrong, is saying the company is providing a megaphone to Alex Jones (or Trump). That seems like they would artificially increase their reach. But that's not what they did, quite the opposite, they artificially decreased their reach even before banning them. The reach these people have is not artificial (given the possibilities of technologies nowadays). They simply attract a sizable audience, like it or not.

[@holdenrobbins852]

The lack of self-awareness on Sam's part is astounding.

[@ramongonzalez2112]

Harris spent more time on Alex Jones than the garbage dossier. The Left never let Trump govern. They impeached him twice and Muller harassed him for three years. Meanwhile Biden’s got everything he wanted and a few tough questions from Peter Ducy.

[@1Deep43VA]

He’s pathetic.

[@sunnyla2835]

Especially for someone who touts a meditation (awareness) app.

[@leahcimolrac1477]

Go easy on him, he hasn’t had a vacation in almost a year

[@thunderstruck1078]

Pretending that someone would turn on you for screaming anti-semitism is preposterous. You'll be lavishly rewarded for enforcing the entrenched stance that the said group can never have group interest or that interest always aligns with their host nations. Whatever conclusion you decide to draw, public criticism of their behavior and influence on society is strictly forbidden, under penalty of complete unpersoning, doxxing and destruction.

[@nsh1980]

Look who you can say bad things about and who you can’t say anything about. Most people don’t seem to see it.

[@thunderstruck1078]

@@nsh1980 You know about the famous Voltaire's quote? There's one less famous by the same great author about this very "topic".

[@martinpospisil3747]

@@thunderstruck1078 You are very right. Seems like Anti semitism is a defence from any meaningful criticizms.

[@nsh1980]

@@thunderstruck1078 I’m sure I have heard it second hand. Have not read Voltaire but my favorite thinkers reference him a lot so I need to get with it.

[@thunderstruck1078]

@@nsh1980 This is the quote: "They dare to display an irreconcilable hatred toward all nations, and revolt against all masters; always superstitious, always greedy for the well-being enjoyed by others, always barbarous - cringing in misfortune and insolent in prosperity".

[@canadajoe1]

Poor Sam, still suffering cognitive damage from TDS. His obsessive hatred for Trump transforms him from gifted sceptic into generic true believer

[@lisad2701]

Actually, anyone who supports Trump is affected by TDS because they are truly deranged and delusional.

[@pedrosalgado8984]

TDS goes both ways

[@kenadams5504]

Accusing non -Trump supporters of being deranged , is why People like Trump are enabled to mis-use platforms like twitter to create hatred and its consequences .

[@EmperorsNewWardrobe]

26:24 “Culture is not this expendable thing. Culture really is the operating system for humanity at this point”

[@sunnyla2835]

Terence McKenna would def take issue with your culture comment. Wish he were still around

[@EmperorsNewWardrobe]

@@sunnyla2835 do elaborate?

[@EmperorsNewWardrobe]

@@PanelVulture can the values of the Enlightenment, namely reason, science and humanism not fill that apparent god-shaped hole?

[@shaneblackwood9052]

I’m a 46 year old man in Australia and never has anyone ever come up to me and mention Twitter ever.

[@samdg1234]

"I am a democrat because I believe in the Fall of Man. I think most people are democrats for the opposite reason. A great deal of democratic enthusiasm descends from the ideas of people like Rousseau, who believed in democracy because they thought mankind so wise and good that everyone deserved a share in the government. The danger of defending democracy on those grounds is that they’re not true. And whenever their weakness is exposed, the people who prefer tyranny make capital out of the exposure… The real reason for democracy is just the reverse. Mankind is so fallen that no man can be trusted with unchecked power over his fellows. Aristotle said that some people were only fit to be slaves. I do not contradict him. But I reject slavery because I see no men fit to be masters." _C.S. Lewis Although nothing of this quote is spoken of per se, I recalled the sentiment of the last sentence. Harris, beginning at about 35:50 seems to reject the cautionary sentiment and sees himself fit to be a master over about half the population. Thank you, Douglas, for your counter position. You are absolutely comfortable criticizing some of what Trump did, said, and maybe stood for. You were staunchly against the 'Tiananmen Square' autocratic, dictatorial, big brother knows best. Surely the founding fathers, although abhorring most things about Trump, would have been too wise to fall for the authoritarianism Sam contemplates imposing

[@samdg1234]

@@adamp108 *You're going to have to expand on this authoritarianism he wants to impose* 🙂 The authoritarianism that gets to -decide- claim what is real news. Sam, while decrying that 'fake news' is passed off as real, and vice versa, wishes himself to be able to make that exact call. When it suits *him,* when *he* deems the stakes sufficiently high, *he* wishes to be able to canonize what a modicum of investigation would have shown to be real as Russian disinformation. Here is a post I put at another location here. Does it answer your question? *WHO DO YOU THINK SAID THE FOLLOWING,* "There is a difference between truth and lies. There is a difference between real news and fake news. There's a difference between actual conspiracies and imagined ones. And we can not afford to have hundreds of millions of people in our own society on the wrong side of those epistemological chasms." kzbin.info/www/bejne/g5XHiICKbLBlnqs Now compare with 35:47 This is unbelievable. I can only hope that Sam wakes up (in the real sense) to his hypocrisy.

[@samdg1234]

@@adamp108 I responded to you. I’m suspicious that it’s been blocked. (isn’t that ironic) Do you see a response to you other than this one?

[@samdg1234]

@@adamp108 I'm pretty sure that the issue, for me at least, is that I'm censored for some reason when I put links in the comment. I'll try and repost it and somehow cloak the link.

[@samdg1234]

@@adamp108 *You're going to have to expand on this authoritarianism he wants to impose* 🙂 The authoritarianism that gets to -decide- claim what is real news. Sam, while decrying that 'fake news' is passed off as real, and vice versa, wishes himself to be able to make that exact call. When it suits *him,* when *he* deems the stakes sufficiently high, *he* wishes to be able to canonize what a modicum of investigation would have shown to be real as Russian disinformation. Here is a post I put at another location here. Does it answer your question? *WHO DO YOU THINK SAID THE FOLLOWING,* "There is a difference between truth and lies. There is a difference between real news and fake news. There's a difference between actual conspiracies and imagined ones. And we can not afford to have hundreds of millions of people in our own society on the wrong side of those epistemological chasms." Sam Harris - Echo Chamber Mentality & Online Media at 75-second point Now compare with 35;47 of this video This is unbelievable. I can only hope that Sam wakes up (in the real sense) to his hypocrisy.

[@samdg1234]

@@adamp108 It appears that my attempt to evade the censors has failed. I can see all 6 replies before I post this one. When I sign in anonymously, I don't see my posts that I sent you in response to your question. These censorious bastards. That is in part what I meant by authoritarians. There is not a word of hate or anything that could be construed so, but alas, this is what we get...

[@Zarrkell]

Did Trump break his brain?

[@tamarinds]

SHALOM TO YOU SAM!!!

[@jubjub2112]

I largely disagree with Harris on Twitter, Musk, and Twitter as the town square . . . and definitely disagree with him on banning the likes of Trump and Alex Jones. These are his ideological biases shining through. Deeply disappointed at this. I hope this will be a good conversation regardless.

[@hydrogia]

Making Sense=NPR without the passion

[@GrumpleSenior]

Sam’s take here is utterly asinine and genuinely frightening, it shows he’s an authoritarian at heart.

[@dieselphiend]

He's trapped in the belly of the whale.