What Does a Rear Swaybar Upgrade Do? And is it Worth it?

www.vdubwarehouse.com
If you have questions, or want a swaybar for a vehicle not listed below, let us know!
Links to 034 Motorsport Rear Swaybars
MK7 GTI: goo.gl/m2BAsr
MK7 Golf R: goo.gl/cB3Sk1
MK5/6 Golf/GTI/Jetta (FWD/IRS): goo.gl/8H2bQx
MK6 Golf R / Audi A3 (8P) Quattro: goo.gl/z2Dfve

[@gureno19]

Those are some real "Misterrrrrr Anderson" glasses you got there.

[@carnut84gti]

Lol!

[@denisssss]

Imagine Horatio from CSI Miami doing a review.

[@chrissteinmeyer1837]

Got a 034 rear seay bar in order for my Tiguan R-line. Can’t wait!! Thanks for this video!!

[@georgeb2590]

Great video of what a stiffer RSB does for a cars handling especially the MQB platform. Just added the 034 rear sway to my MK7 Golf R and wow what a difference! I put it in the stiffest setting and swapped the oem plastic end links with the steel Moog end end links since the oem plastic couldn't handle the increased loads. My experience is very similar to yours. On my favorite on/off ramps the car was mushy and didn't turn in with any conviction, but after the sway bar it was neutral to throttle lift oversteer. Very easily controlled with the throttle.Highly recommended. Thanks again for one of the best videos demonstrating the before and after of a RSB!

[@VdubWarehousecom]

Thank you for the comment! And if you need anything else for your R, please let us know!

[@patricknelson]

You are awesome man, thanks for this video! Great demo both before and after. Great to see a direct side-by-side comparison. It's actually a great demo of just understeer in general, not just the difference that a sway bar can make.

[@carnut84gti]

Thank you!

[@Jeeper1378]

EXACTLY what i was looking for THANKS.

[@carnut84gti]

Happy to help!

[@BirdShotIV]

Fun video, thanks for the demos

[@IBOO57]

Excellent explanation and difference made.

[@kuken166]

Great video! Keep up the good work

[@carnut84gti]

Thank you!

[@pissywilly]

GREAT video and demonstration 😁

[@carnut84gti]

Thank you!

[@devellwilson7099]

Thanks for the video boss..

[@YasssStitch]

I installed front and back Eibach anti-roll bars on my 2.0T Accord manual. Car went from soft mess to a almost S2000 like.

[@michaelcoles907]

Great video. I am a new MK7 2015 Autobahn owner. Love the car. The engineer who designed the Porsche GT3, I understand also did the chasis turning for the MQB platform GTI. I think he knows what he is doing. The handling dynamics are what they are for a FWD vehicle. The car is quite capable, stock, driven "within" its limits. But you are the first person who I have heard say it. ENGINEERED UNDERSTEER IS A SAFETY FEATURE!! We all want our cars to do things that maybe, they were not designed to do. If your car understeers, it means you are going to fast. The good news is with FWD, if you lift or brake, the car will not behave too badly unlike a rear drive car that may swap ends on you. Or an AWD car with to big of a rear sway bar and introduced snap oversteer (totaled a tuned, lowered, suspension upgraded subaru). Having said all of that, Ive never left a car alone that I could enhance in some perceived way. But with my MK7, I think I'll start with better tires/brakes first. Actually, because the chasis is that good, those are the things that want to give up first with spirited driving.

[@karmicforce01]

Yes engineers are beholden to lawyers and marketers. Understeer can be just as dangerous as oversteer. Invest in learning how to drive first and then learn the limits of your vehicle.

[@cosmicheretic8129]

Mk 7.5 GTI driver here. I have brand new PS4S tires and have front and rear chassis bracing along with a rear sway bar ready to go on the car. This should tighten up handling, reduce body roll and decrease understeer significantly.

[@nikcamaj6740]

Best demonstration on KZbin 🫡

[@Frisky_Panda]

Great video

[@joebrady9575]

Wow wonderful video. Thanks you sir

[@VdubWarehousecom]

Happy to help! Let me know if you have any questions or need any parts!

[@larphraulen]

Thanks for the great demonstration! Question: do you get any skittishness / odd undulations over corners with uneven pavement?

[@maninahat1417]

good content

[@carnut84gti]

Thank you!

[@billynguyen710]

Excellent video! Just for reference, about how fast were you going on the entrance ramp after the install of the new sway bar?

[@VdubWarehousecom]

If you look closely I had the digital speedometer running on the MFA. I wasn't focusing on my entry speed, more about the balance of the car through the corner, but on reviewing the video, it looks like I was typically around 54 when I started turning in

[@russellharris2689]

I see you use the Waze Ap. Awesome!

[@carnut84gti]

That I do, it's a fantastic app :)

[@daysofgrace2934]

It's a balance between stiffness of front vs. rear. The stiffer the rear, the more over-steery it will become. As tyre technology improves you can go stiffer on the rear arbs as the car won't under-steer or over-steer due to tyre grip. I find it better than fitting stiffer spring as they will increase ride harshness - better off using ARBs and progressive bump-stops to maintain flat-drive and road comfort. Audi house-style is traditionally understeery (watch the Group 1 Audi S1 Quattro), BMW is more oversteery...

[@DA9enthusiast]

He’s in Roseville California.

[@rodrigollamas8]

Madison Blvd!

[@chrischwaz7788]

Question I have a 1988 Pontiac Fiero and if I take the tight turn really fast the rear fish tails out do I have too big of a rear sway bar

[@VdubWarehousecom]

I know the Fiero had some unusual handling characteristics and could be a bit twitchy. Whie a smaller RSB might make it more stable, I have a feeling there is more to it than that. I'd try talking to a shop that specializes in the Fiero, they could probably give you much better advice than I can. Also if you have a chance, take it out on an auto-x and try to get someone to ride along with you, or better yet, drive your car to give you some feedback. I know i've run into a similar situation before, and after going out and driving the guys car, it was just an issue of experience and driving style. i showed him how to deal with the corners, he learned how to stabilize the car, and quickly reduced his lap times. We actually loosened the car up even further than he had it setup once he got used to the change in driving technique, lol. Beyond that, unfortunately your car is a bit outside my area of expertise to give you really detailed advice on that platform.

[@SloanZurnToto]

Looks like you are carrying more speed with the stiffer bar too.

[@VdubWarehousecom]

Absolutely am, that's one of the major reasons to run the bar. better balance means you can carry more speed through the corners! Transitions are significantly better too, though harder to document the improvement there

[@willie123811]

@@VdubWarehousecom do you recommend the stiff setting or the stiffer setting on a two setting rear sway bar?

[@VdubWarehousecom]

@@willie123811 Sorry about the delayed reply. That really depends on how comfortable you are with the car rotating, and how the rest of your car is setup. Personally, I knew I wanted to get my A3 rotating as much as possible, so I went straight to the stiffest setting. If anything, I wish it were even stiffer. But I have a lot of experience with a car that can rotate and am comfortable handling it. If you're not so comfortable with it, start on the softer setting, get a feel for it and how it reacts before you move it to the stiffer setting (if you indeed feel that you want more)

[@prasiddha1986]

do you notice any thing in comfort levels over potholes and uneven surfaces?

[@carnut84gti]

You'll notice barely any difference in comfort level. if you're talking about a situation where one rear tire hits a bump that doesn't hit the other side, yes, you may notice that slightly more, but it's minor, and the gains in performance are significant.

[@cakeofeat5149]

Difference between this and a rear lower control arm brace?

[@carnut84gti]

Rear lower stress bar stiffens the chassis and reduces flex. Tightening up the responsiveness of your suspension and giving better feedback, but won't have as dramatic an effect on the balance. The two work great together though!

[@reflexboxer2ndlt807]

Do you have the front sway bars on? Aftermarket

[@carnut84gti]

Front sway bar is stock, only upgraded the rear sway bar. Personally I prefer rear only, but it depends what you are looking to get out of your suspension. If you're looking for reduced body roll and high speed stability, then I would do both front and rear, if you're looking for better turn in and rotation which is what I wanted, then I would do rear only

[@longbowdt]

So how much thicker is the 034 bar than the OEM bar? Also, how much stiffer is this bar than the OEM unit?

[@VdubWarehousecom]

I'll have to take a caliper and measure the thickness of my stock bar for comparison. As to stiffness, I don't have the comparison to my stock bar (would have to put both on a dyno to get the spring rates, when I get a chance I'll try to do this), but, 362% or 423% Increased Sway Bar Rate vs. Stock TT RS Rear Sway Bar

[@sageaces1921]

@@VdubWarehousecom Knowing what the mil thickness of your upgrade sway bar is important, otherwise just sounds like your winging it.

[@VdubWarehousecom]

@@sageaces1921 Actually, the only way to know for 100% certainty the exact variance between the bars is to put both the stock bar and the upgraded bar on a dyno as I mentioned before. While the diameter is one way to get a good idea of the change in stiffness, there are other factors such as the placement of the bolt holes for the endlink attachment points that can also have a significant impact on the performance of the bar. The idea for this video was to give an explanation of the function and performance of an upgraded rear swaybar as it relates not just to the 034Motorsport bar I installed, but any rear swaybar (all of which will have some variance in how stiff they are). As to the exact change between the stock bar and this one, i still have not had the chance to put both on a dyno for testing.

[@JDDD33]

Did you ever go to the Stiff (Hard) setting, or just keep in on Soft ?

[@VdubWarehousecom]

Ran it on the stiffest setting from day one. Have never run it on it's softer setting

[@JDDD33]

@@VdubWarehousecom thankyou. I just installed a whiteline RSB in my Golf R and it does help the car handle better, but the ride quality has somewhat diminished on uneven bumpy roads

[@d1zguy864]

JDDD33 that’s the trade off. Honestly for street run on softest. Autox run stiffest. For better ride quality and handling it’s better to run higher spring rate springs with a soft rebound and harder at a good ratio relative to rebound compression setting and a stock or soft setting sway bar. VW and Audi’s mqb platform are not known for handling so no point to ruining ride quality. New stuff uses electromagnetic fluid that hardens the compression rate on the outside wheels instead of a big sway bar. I.e 2019 Audi rs5 and is a better solution than a big sway bar that ruins ride and lowers total axle grip.

[@limpei94]

Is it fine to stick with stock FSB and upgrade the RSB? What will be the fine setup for it If I were to ugprade my RSB for my mk5gti. I've seen a lot of aftermarket sway bars with different diameter. There are 23mm,24mm,25mm some even thicker. As far as I know the stock FSB for mk5gti is 23.5mm, so do I go for 23mm and put it the stiffest setting or you have any suggestions ?

[@VdubWarehousecom]

Personally, I wouldn't change the front swaybar, BUT, it all comes down to how you personally want to change the balance and handling of the car. If you do a front AND rear swaybar, you'll have less of an effect on the balance of the car, but you will have a great reduction in overall body roll. If you do a rear swaybar ONLY, and keep the stock front, you'll have less of an effect on body roll, but will have a much greater effect on the balance of the car. Since I'm trying to reduce how badly the car understeers, this is the route I went on my own car. As for size, are you talking about for the front or rear?

[@limpei94]

@@VdubWarehousecom Alright, I agree to what you say. If I were to change front and rear do I go for 24 front and 24 rear or the front needs to have a bigger size?

[@VdubWarehousecom]

@@limpei94 If I were to do both, i'd do the stiffest rear bar possible to help improve the balance as much as possible, and then do a moderate FSB. Neuspeed would probably be my top choice for that pairing depending on exacty what car you have

[@limpei94]

@@VdubWarehousecom to do stiffest rear bar, do I choose a bigger diameter or I could just get an adjustable and set to the stiffest setting? I'm planning to get a adjustable 23mm, which is a 2mm upgrade from stock and set it to the stiffest setting. and what do you think about the struts bar

[@guamboy46]

@@limpei94i

[@FranciscoPerez-dl8iw]

So you got significant improvement by only changing rear sway bar but not front one? Or why you did not change the don't one?

[@carnut84gti]

Sorry seems I missed your question. I tried to explain it in the video, but, personally, I would only want to do a rear swaybar. It does depend on what you're looking to get out of your suspension though. If you're looking for high speed stability, doing a front and rear swaybar is a good idea. If you're looking to have a more dramatic change on the BALANCE of the car, then doing just a rear is better. This is what I wanted, I wanted the car to rotate through the corners better because it understeers so badly. If I had done both a front and rear, there would have been less of balance change.

[@FranciscoPerez-dl8iw]

I see different diameters available, which one you got?

[@carnut84gti]

@@FranciscoPerez-dl8iw For my car, there is only one size available from 034. it's 22.25mm solid. Typically, i want to run the fattest RSB available for the vehicle, but keep in mind that tubular diameters do not equal solid diameters, so it gets a little more complicated on comparing the two.

[@ShutUpBubi]

I'd say Audi's Quattro system may also be why you're experiencing understeer ;)

[@carnut84gti]

This car uses a haldex based awd system vs the tortion based system of the larger Audi's. So the behavior off this car is much closer to that of a fwd, as the rear end only really engages when wheel slip is detected. That being said, I would actually argue that the awd system helps reduce understeer a little as it reduces how much work the front tires are having to do. A tortion based system will do an even better job.

[@patricknelson]

@@carnut84gti Ah, this is a huge help. I came to this video just looking for some info on rear sway bars, but I wasn't sure which Quattro system this was (without hunting it down, heh); most aren't the typical Haldex based AWD like mine is (TT RS, vs. the RS5 which already has more RWD bias, albeit I've driven both and both have understeer stock, but the 2013 RS5 was much better with the RWD bias). Since I went to a TT RS from the RS5, it's good to know that this should definitely help bring it back in closer to how the RS5 handled, if not better.

[@carnut84gti]

@@patricknelson It'll definitely help out! I don't know that we have one on the site for your car as our TTRS categories aren't that well populated, but I can certainly hook you up with one. I can either add it to the site for you or invoice you individually. Just let me know. Also, as for what cars have what system, basically, any of the transverse motor cars (A3/S3, TT/TTS/TTRS) have will use the haldex system, where the longitudinal cars (A4/S4, A5, A6, A7, A8 etc) will all use torsion style Quattro systems.

[@mikexcanxjerk]

Does the aftermarket bar improve ride quality

[@VdubWarehousecom]

Depends on your definition of "improving ride quality", but in general I would say no. The bar helps reduce body roll and improve handling, but has no real effect on ride quality (over uneven bumps there may be a very minor detriment to ride quality, but in general no real effect).

[@mikexcanxjerk]

VdubWarehouse.com well less body rolll + new sway bar links and bushing = better ride quality I would assume ////, plus I also have new struts installed KYB . So wouldn’t my chassis be on its best as possible ?

[@VdubWarehousecom]

@@mikexcanxjerk You are absolutely right that it will be more controlled. But "good ride quality" would often refer to "smoother over bumps" In general a swaybar will have no real effect on the ride quality over bumps, except when you get uneven bumps left/right, in which case they can add a little harshness. That's why I didn't want to say clear cut yes. But they will certainly reduce body roll and give a tighter more controlled feel. And let us know if you need any more parts for your car, we carry a wide selection of products!

[@tisoy909]

That new sway bar hangs much lower than the stock one. I guess they wanted to get that sticker visible for advertisement effect.

[@carnut84gti]

That's an interesting point, I'd have to measure the offset to see exactly how much lower it hangs. That being said, I don't thing it hangs low enough to cause any issues. My A3 is quite low, and while I've touched both the back edges of the plastic underbody panels (where they turn down) and the gas tank on things, I've never had the swaybar come in contact with anything. So I'd say however the bends are, they are by no means the low point of the vehicle. And unless you're laying on the ground, you're not going to see the sticker, lol.

[@9to5high]

Hey are those 8V seats? Are they a plug and play fit for the 8P’s?

[@carnut84gti]

Honestly not sure what they are out of. I bought them from someone who was planning on putting them in a Chevelle of all things. They aren't 8V seats as I've had them since before the 8V was around. I THINK they may be A5 (B8) Cabriolet S-Line seats, but have struggled to find the exact seat in any other car. They are definitely 2-door seats though as they have a release for access to the back seats. As for plug and play, definitely not, I still have to get them fully wired up and functional. It's been on the "to do" list, just too many things on that list, lol. They were a HUGE upgrade though, the stock seats in this car are just so flat and being full leather, you just slide around in them. These have decent bolstering and with the alcantara hold you in nicely. And, I feel really look at home in the car.

[@9to5high]

@@carnut84gti thats what im saying!! the base seats are awful. ive been on the search for new seats ones that work with the cars heating system. As I'm from Canada and having the heated seat function is a must here... Sad to hear you haven't been able to get the wiring done but I def think these are 8V seats. Remember in the EU they had the 8V since 2014 so possibly these from the EU from the guy you bought them off of.

[@9to5high]

@@carnut84gti just sent you a link;) they are def 8V a3 seats. beautiful nonetheless. Were a direct fit in terms of rails? like getting them to line up with the cars original rails?

[@brianmichaels7333]

@@9to5high Where did you send the link? As for fit, they just bolted in, no issues there.

[@jonah9165]

Is this audi AWD or FWD ? Also, what technique are you using when you're hitting that on ramp ?

[@carnut84gti]

It's Quattro, though due to the fact that it's a haldex system, it still drives for the most part like a FWD. As for technique, I actually wasn't using very good technique in this video as I was trying to jocky the car around a little to accentuate the differences in the handling with the different swaybars

[@user-lc5wd3zj7u]

Did you install a front bar?

[@VdubWarehousecom]

I did not. My primary focus with installing the bar was to reduce understeer. If I upgraded both the front and rear bar, it would have a greater effect on reducing body roll, but have a lesser effect on balance.

[@nikcamaj6740]

Understeer is not safe for everyone

[@kevinhibbard320]

haha Citrus heights. I know that onramp.

[@carnut84gti]

:D

[@anthonyogata3828]

I was watching this and said to myself that looks like it's Sunrise or Hazel! I WASN'T imagining it!

[@carnut84gti]

@@anthonyogata3828 it was a closed race track of course ;)