What Went Wrong With All-Star Brawl?

Well, no one said game development was easy or simple. Nickelodeon All-Star Brawl was met with surprise and excitement upon its reveal back in the summer. When it came out in early October, though, the enthusiasm vanished nearly as quickly as it'd appeared, with lukewarm receptions, disappointed reviewers, and an unexpectedly small (though still dedicated) base of players.
So...what went wrong?
Let's take a look at the game's content, mechanics, and creative decisions to see what missteps may have caused it to slip and fall out of the gate and why they may have happened. Some (constructive) criticism can only help, right?
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Follow on Twitter at: / delzethin
Support via Patreon at: / delzethin
Graphic design by Voyager: / fire_voyager
Post-production assistance by Yoshiller: / realyoshiller
Post-production assistance by Neoxon: / neoxon619
Additional Sources:
NASB - Barking Frog (Danny Phantom) vs. AxiomXL (Ren & Stimpy) (VGBootCamp): • SSC Fall Fest NASB Top...
NASB - Gameplay Showcase (GameSpot): • Nickelodeon All-Star B...
NASB - Kurama (Spongebob) vs. Elegant (Lincoln) (VGBootCamp): • SSC Fall Fest NASB Top...
NASB - Launch Trailer (Game Mill Official): • Nickelodeon All-Star B...
NASB - ThundeRzReiGN (Leonardo) vs RoseJ (Aang) (Beyond the Summit): • ThundeRzReiGN vs RoseJ...
NASB DLC Confirmed (My Nintendo News): mynintendonews.com/2021/09/16...
NASB Metacritic Page (PC ver.): www.metacritic.com/game/pc/ni...
NASB The Cutting Room Floor Page: tcrf.net/Nickelodeon_All-Star...
Rivals of Aether - Rivals Direct 2 (RoA Official): • Rivals Direct 2
Toph “Ah, Gottem, GGs” Meme: / 1444354420104474632

[@IcyDiamond]

I feel like Nickelodeon just didn’t want to put in the budget to make the game truly great, they just saw the game as a simple cash grab unlike the devs, or at least that’s how I feel about it

[@ObnoxiousArtist]

It's not only cash, but lack of departments as well. Rep said they don't have that department for glitch test-thingy.

[@IcyDiamond]

@@ObnoxiousArtist Oh yeah that would definitely be a problem for any game

[@Monafide3305]

Budget cuts were totally a huge factor in the game's biggest issues, but it's hard to deny that the game design is inherently flawed in quite a few ways. The game is really unfun from a casual perspective because of how, as the video describes, every thing is extremely fast to a fault. Even for the intended competitive scene, things like the options menu being as bare bones as physically possible or the crappy training mode show that they might not have had all the right priorities even within the given budget. I really don't want to dunk on the devs though, because they seem like really cool and talented people who were given impossible expectation by the Smash community.

[@pippo17173]

@@Monafide3305 THIS! I'm sorry but the fact that the game doesn't also try to cater casuals is why this game falters. Casuals needs to be your focus with a competitive scene second. Smash ultimate understands that.

[@mrshmuga9]

For fair reason. These Nick games don’t sell all too well, so why would they dump a ton of money into this one, just because it’s a different genre? I think they were right to assume a Nick fighting game (unfortunately) doesn’t have a lot of reach. If you didn’t watch Nick shows, it’s unlikely you’ll be that familiar or care that much about these characters. And I’m pretty sure people at a certain age stopped watching cartoon shows so even if you watched them as a kid, there’s going to be some you don’t know of or care about. And are kids today even going to recognize most of the characters besides Spongebob, Avatar, and Lincoln Loud? I’m pretty sure a lot of them left the air like a decade ago. Nearly every series in Smash (by comparison) has persisted.

[@Kirbman]

Apparently, Nick did not allow the devs to write their own dialogue for the arcade mode, for whatever reason.

[@IcyDiamond]

Because Nickelodeon has some weird obsession with canon for no reason

[@waffleman8053]

@Otneimica I think the amount of personality they cramped into every character makes up for the lack of voice acting. At least to me.

[@AlphaStoutland]

And it shows, it's just meme quotes and random crap sentences that makes no sense. 🤦‍♂️ I wish Nick had actually given them the chance to let the characters at least acknowledge each other with some witty banter and a snarky jab thrown in here and there, but NOPE, it's just "LEEDLE LEEDLE LEEDLE LEE" and "Licking doorknobs" for no other reason than "hehe funny" 🤪

[@PinkHairSasuke]

Kinda weird, if true, that they couldn’t write banter for the characters considering that all the Nicktoon crossover games from years ago, Unite, Globs, etc, all had the characters acknowledge each others’ existence in the Nick universe

[@tanimation7289]

@AT Productions That’s true. I remember a app game with Disney characters fighting in a RPG style setting and there was missions that had banter between characters.

[@smallsoul2374]

They ultimately focused so hard on the competitive audience that they alienated the much, MUCH larger casual one I feel. We'll see if it can pick back up.

[@Aego384]

This is exactly why Smash is successful.

[@freddiesimmons1394]

How did they alienate the larger audience?

[@Aego384]

@@freddiesimmons1394 Lack of items or other single player modes.

[@phlpcockrell]

@@freddiesimmons1394 it's strictly a competitive game. A casual player going online would get eaten alive, there is nothing to do in single player unless you just really like an arcade mode with no story or character interactions, no items or special modes to shake things up (like Melee had)

[@freddiesimmons1394]

@@Aego384 traditional fighters don't have items, and they aren't alienating anyone. No useful 1p mode is very strange I agree.

[@RenegadeJ.P.]

The animations come out too fast that I can’t even tell what the attacks are sometimes.

[@LucarioShirona]

too fast and looking incomplete too.

[@jmurray1110]

Yeah definitely not enough anticipation The voices do help but even they got sped up to match it

[@RabanoDoom]

12:06 - 12:33 God I feel that. As a zim main, after spending time learning all about good use of gir and gnome in terms of controlling movement, baiting jumps, owning platform space, learning how to juggle gir around, making perfect ledge traps, setting up strings, and figuring out the best opportunities to land your one and only good kill move (strong fair)... nothing is more disappointing than realizing literally all of it loses to a Leonardo or a Catdog pressing any button.

[@BigBossMan538]

I like zoners and defensive archetypes so I sympathize

[@waffleman8053]

I feel you man.

[@ordinarylittlebastard3248]

The balancement of the game is kind of trash,man. Zim is an awesome character to play. I love rushing to players with nice combos with him. His moves actually are really interesting to master and learn and you feel rewarded for doing so. Love being a Zim main. But, characters much less interesting to play as (Leonardo is the most boring and Powdered Toast Man the most frustrating for me) are simply better because of a single move or character trait.

[@waffleman8053]

@@ordinarylittlebastard3248 After fighting the top tiers of this game, no one in Ultimate really bothers me any more.

[@ordinarylittlebastard3248]

@@waffleman8053 yeah

[@littenfire3563]

Danny's thermos should've been a grab, like Link's hook shot, not an actual attack. That would've stuck better to the show tbh

[@megamaggotman7025]

This ninja spitting

[@m.o.s.4742]

Actually, the phantom thermos can grab only the ghosts

[@milesprower6110]

​@@m.o.s.4742 and Link's grappling hook only can be used on monsters or specific surfaces... It's how to be used in reference and not to be literal at its canon

[@thedapperdolphin1590]

Biggest thing for me was the animations. There isn’t enough attention given to anticipation or follow through frames, so attacks just kind of come out, and look janky and hard to follow as a result. Everything just looks and feels cheap.

[@bluefire9285]

But like, that's because it is cheap. This game barely had any sort of budget at all

[@xxProjectJxx]

@@bluefire9285 the only issue that was 100% down to budget was voice acting. Throwing more money at the game would not have solved the core issues with the animations because those issues were down to poor implementation, not a lack of resources.

[@nuibaba280]

@@xxProjectJxx It's called being rushed. Jenny is a prime example of what happens when the devs are given time.

[@SufferDYT]

@@xxProjectJxx Correct, it is entirely the consequence of having incompetent developers.

[@Kdkjdjewerdnxa]

This. The animations make the characters look and feel like robots and it also makes reading characters attacks a crapshoot.

[@thedapperdolphin1590]

Toph’s belt is a good example of the over reliance on references. Like, it’s something that appears briefly in one episode from what I remember. It’s not something that reflective overall of her character.

[@Y4manata]

that could have been a good taunt, but as a move it's really weird

[@flameheadshero]

@@hairmonster Weird because seismic sense is such an easy counter move. I feel like it’s not in there because counters aren’t well liked in the competitive Smash scene

[@diegoantoniorosariopalomin4977]

The scene where she raised her belt was used in ads for ages it might have stuck with one of the devs despite having no significance to the series

[@LucarioShirona]

Yeah. Sadly Garfield suffers the same problems in over relying on references.

[@nuibaba280]

@@LucarioShirona Garfield is a character that works well with them though? Garfield absolutely worked with them and fit his character. His entire moveset represented everything about Garfield. Way better than a generic "slice with claws" moveset. You're just looking for excuses to complain if you're pressed that a goofy cartoon char has a goofy cartoony moveset.

[@masterdhegamer6661]

I have the opinion that the biggest reason the game didn't stick the landing, even considering possible design issues, is undoubtebly was the price point. 50 bucks is way too much for it, and it reeks of a publisher decision, alongside the strict deadlines. Like, I bought the game at launch on Ps4, and I already have nothing to do on it because there's no one playing on the platform. If the game was cheaper, at least this issue wouldn't be that extreme.

[@Delzethin]

If I remember right, the game's director actually _did_ want it to have a cheaper selling price and got overruled.

[@Cashmoneez]

@@Delzethin Yeah I can't help but feel like it was a Nick decision.

[@keystone5750]

Yea to quote Rep “Frankly, I was *shocked* when I first learned the game was gonna be $50”

[@xJ4R3x]

Yeah I thought it was going to cost 20 dollars no 50, specially how smash cost 60 and the quality and content between games is insane

[@xxProjectJxx]

@@Cashmoneez Nick doesn't control the price. That decision was all GameMill. But what did we expect from the same publisher behind Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing

[@LucarioShirona]

Coming back to this, your criticism with the animation is more valid then ever. Sakurai made a video about the importance of Anticipation in a Gameplay Perspective. Lot of the characters in Nick move way too fast, it’s hard to understand what type of attack they’re displaying and their strength. I’m taking animation class and we just learned about timing. Seeing these choppy attacks is more painful to look at and I am 100% certain my professor will heavily criticize it to a pulp for how bad they are.

[@OhSayWhatIsTruth]

Have you shown your professor this game?

[@Perdix64]

Don’t show them Mortal Kombat, your professor would probably hate it.

[@SIMIFU]

I believe Maximillian dood said it best (probably not the right words but something along the lines of): "If you focus too much on the competitiveness instead of the overall spirit and game design or just straight up...FUN, it is setup for eventual failure."

[@LucarioShirona]

Which video did he said? I tried looking for it

[@MangaGamify]

A bit off topic.. this ties to my belief most publishers only care about investors, esport sponsors² and those

[@WC3fanatic997]

Sounds like what did Wildstar in. Had a ton of fascinating concepts and a lot of interesting, if not great, design choices . . . and then heavily focused on things that only made like 5% of the players satisfied in any way.

[@thedapperdolphin1590]

I definitely think it’s a mistake to make a game focused on trying to win over Melee fans, because Melee fans will only ever be devoted Melee, and the competitive Smash players in general are just a tiny portion of the player base. I think Multiversus could fall down the same trap, even though that’s at least more polished. Most of the people I’ve known who play Smash do so casually at gatherings or otherwise play at a pretty “low” level. It’s all about free for alls and items. You need to do something to appeal to that crowd in order to grow a player base, with some of those players potentially becoming more competitive. Like, I’m pretty sure we all started Smash as clueless kids just playing for fun.

[@revimfadli4666]

There's a reason Melee fans stick to Melee despite sequels

[@IronicHavoc]

I think some of it came from them legitimately wanting to make the game fun and competitive, in a way inspired by melee bit not necessarily just wanting to convert melee fans. Melee itself was able to appeal to both audiences at the time, I think that was the goal. The big issue is they couldn't do the competitive mechanics AND get all the other polish/quality of life/variety that smash bros can have. And honestly the bigger issue seems to be they just didn't have the time or resources, so neither aspect really felt totally finished anyway.

[@LUXSTERIA]

multiversus will die in 3 months. too gimmicky.

[@sadchild9478]

@@LUXSTERIA I’m already tired of it tbh, the gameplay just doesn’t look as fun as other platform fighters for some reason…

[@jmurray1110]

Well it’s certainly emulating brawls lack of hitstun, amazing air dodging (although not directional they are the most effective in the series) and air focus (technically ultimate air combat better but brawl basically requires jump approaches and air calling due to random tripping)

[@krubbington]

7:25 "These attacks feel like the devs were focused more on cramming in a reference rather than making them part of a coherent whole. It's a mistake I see in a lot of fan-made Smash movesets..." Completely agree with this. I've seen way too many Smash movesets that try to cram in references where they don't belong or in places where they don't fit, making the overall movesets kind of wonky and probably not all that fun to actually play.

[@grunkleg.3110]

I remember seeing one fanmade redesign of Mario which replaced his current Up Air with Mario Tornado I believe, so the down-air could be a Mario-style enemy stomp, when such a change would completely ruin how he currently plays. I feel like the best approach is to first come up with how the character plays, then slot in the references where they're most appropriate, especially if it helps enhance their gameplan. That being said, a lot of older Smash characters are in desperate need for a redesign, because at the end of the day, you don't want to feel disconnected from your current character. Who'd be opposed to giving Sonic more moves than just ball, or DK a barrel toss that helps him get grabs?

[@Dr.juiceboxtv]

@@grunkleg.3110 The funny thing about the Mario stomp down-air thing is that Dr. Mario already has a good stomp down-air you could just give to regular Mario

[@mushroomfusion245]

@@grunkleg.3110 are you referring to Brawlfan1’s video?

[@eem2wavy133]

@@grunkleg.3110 thank you lol people don’t understand that. That’s my problem with fan movesets

[@IcyDiamond]

*Cough Cough* BrawlFan1’s Steve Moveset video *Cough Cough*

[@beefusdoesstuff5194]

Personally, I felt a little disappointed by the lack of CatDog moves that revolve around synergy between the two. I think it would have been fun to have a move kinda like Luigi's Green Missile, except Cat can wind up and throw a ball, which Dog lunges for.

[@Mariobro4]

Heh, more synergy Catdog moves like that one would be nice to see.

[@ordinarylittlebastard3248]

That's an interesting idea, but instead, they got only like 3 moves that do that.

[@beefusdoesstuff5194]

​@@ordinarylittlebastard3248 The problem with their moveset is that Cat and Dog pretty much do the same things as each other, just with more speed or more strength. I'm sure if they had more time and money, they'd be able to implement a moveset that uses their strengths in synergy.

[@hydra4370]

That's so cartoony and hilarious! I literally smiled imagining that in game, sad that the game couldn't be more inspired rather than derivative.

[@GenoKnightXZ]

No CatDog wheel. Thats like the perfect side special or dash attack.

[@Wizard_Lizard_]

My biggest problem with this game is definitely the animations. Everything feels weightless and choppy at the same time. Very few moves sell their impact, or flow smoothly. Fast frame data isn't an excuse for sub-par animations. The SF franchise has extremely quick frame data on tons of moves across multiple entries, and very, very rarely does a fast move come off as choppy, weightless, or incomplete.

[@megamaggotman7025]

Yes

[@Neoxon619]

Yeah, the Battle for the Grid analogy is pretty accurate in terms of an example of a budget game for a big property improving a lot. The developers mentioned that the game would be a completely different beast a year from now, & I hope that happens. As you said, they really should’ve had more time to work on the game & not be rushed by the higher-ups to get NASB out the door.

[@s.p.d.magentaranger1822]

Battle for the Grid is awesome don't @ me

[@Neoxon619]

@@s.p.d.magentaranger1822 I don’t disagree, the game has come along way.

[@RyutheWeredragon]

@@s.p.d.magentaranger1822 I will @ you... So I can agree.

[@s.p.d.magentaranger1822]

@@RyutheWeredragon I can make an exception 😉

[@shapshapshapshap2829]

@@s.p.d.magentaranger1822 I will also @ you in order to agree

[@BknMoonStudios]

Everyone, including the devs, keeps comparing this game with Melee and Ultimate, but I think a much more helpful comparison would be with Brawlhalla. It's a game that came from an indie team, without an established IP, with a very small budget initially, the game balance was initially terrible and it lacked content at release. Fast forward 6 years and now it is THE MOST PLAYED FIGHTING GAME ON PC, surpassing Tekken 7, SF5, GG Strive, FighterZ, etc. Off the top of my head, I can think of a couple of things that Brawlhalla did better: 1. It was Free to Play. You can make money later on with skins and FX, but you need to put as few barriers to entry as possible. Multiverse from Warner and Project L from Riot are doing this, and I'm willing to bet it will pay off. 2. Casual appeal. I dunno how many people are aware of this, but look at the rank distribution in ANY competitive game, and you'll find that 90% of the playerbase resides in the BOTTOM THIRD of the ladder. In other words: CASUALS ARE WHAT YOUR AUDIENCE WILL BE PRIMARILY MADE OF. DON'T IGNORE THEM. 3. Easy to learn, hard to master. Most Smash entries, Brawlhalla and arguably even Tekken understand this. Guess what game doesn't? Melee and its clones. To be fair, Nick is much less intimidating than Melee, but it still demands tight execution and the tutorial it offers is extremely lacking. 4. Very little done to keep the attention of the worldwide audience (KZbin, Twitch, Twitter, Reddit, etc). Most games retain our attention through frequent updates, large tournaments, loyal content creators and advertising. Nick has NONE of that. There hasn't been a large non-balance-related update in months, there are no large tournaments going on, it has no content creators loyal to the brand and there is virtually no advertisements. I understand most of the fault lies with Nickelodeon, not Ludosity, but the fact remains that this game was basically released and left on its own to survive. There are a lot of lessons Ludosity could've learned from it, but they and everyone around them only focused on Smash.

[@ZoinksScoob2006]

It’s because the devs said that they’re biggest inspiration was melee. Thats why people are comparing the two.

[@thefreshvince879]

@@ZoinksScoob2006 actually project M

[@bob74h67]

Or the playstation smash bros that nobody talks about Smash bros got as popular as it did due to a build in audience and the higher ups at nintendo doing very great with marketing the game like just look the reveal trailer as a example. Crossover games are a niche generally just look at disney infinity and jump force. That's because they focus on the crossover aspect and not enough on it being an actual game so they blow their cash on licensing so the quality of the game fails as a result

[@e1iteyoshi998]

But didn't Jump Force fail as a crossover too.

[@odindarkll3706]

Perfect explanation. Not only does alienating casual audiences hurt reputation, it also makes the seats in tournaments empty. Of course, Nickelodeon continues to hinder creativity (even outside of gaming) at all times.

[@SourRobo8364]

The lack of voice acting was the biggest sign it was gonna be forgotten. You just can not have all these iconic characters without their voices. WB Games knew that and made sure to highlight having voices. So I am very much looking towards that game instead.

[@kyokennedy5334]

And it will be FREE

[@bluefire9285]

But thats because it's WB. They actually have the money to include Voice Actors, while the NASB devs barely had any money at all lmao

[@kyokennedy5334]

@@bluefire9285 man the Nick's crew could just add the voices of the characters from their own shows and editing.. is it that hard to make?

[@bluefire9285]

@@kyokennedy5334 there's no way you genuinely think it's that easy...

[@kyokennedy5334]

@@bluefire9285 Well, if they sold the game for $50, I'd say yes

[@waffulsyrup6320]

As much as I enjoy the game, Nick's handling of NASB really stunted things up for Ludosity. Ludo stretched a dime into a dollar and even then they're still cracking at it with the game. The gameplay landed with some but it also alienated many (including the casual audience) Here's hoping Ludo can do their best with future updates, but Nick really dealt them a bad hand.

[@TommyDeonauthsArchives]

It probably doesn't help that Game Mill was the publisher, which probably contributed to the very small budget. If I were Nick, I'd license the crossover games to THQ Nordic instead.

[@grunkleg.3110]

The animations in this game are bad across the board. Every attack that isn't so fast that you can't make out what's going on, look really unnatural, and not in a funny cartoon way, but much more uncanny valley. Leonardo is probably the biggest offender of this, with him swinging his swords like they're clubs. I watched some Leo gameplay for a bit, and I think the problem is that especially with the strong attacks, he puts way too much arm into swinging weapons as light as katanas. Ideally, the lag for these moves should've been put at the end rather than the beginning. His arms also look pretty stiff in general: the low endlag means that he doesn't really follow through (this honestly describes basically everyone everyone in this game, but its very obvious on weapon-wielders like Leo). Ren and Stimpy are quite guilty of incomplete animations too, especially their victory animation. And once again, the C-Stick in this game has weird quirks. It does heavy attacks on the ground, but light attacks in the air. I also agree with your take on functionality over reference in movesets. Off the top of my head, characters not playable in Smash Bros like Alucard or Dr. Eggman do enough things to warrent 95% of their potential movesets having some sort of reference, with all of the weaponry they have access to, but you don't need Crash Bandicoot with a back air referencing the one time in the comics where he sneezed on his dentist

[@castform7]

Yeah, there are some characters who warrant having a bunch of references within their moveset since there's a lot there that keeps the character's intended design in mind but not everything has to be a reference. You can have a few tilts, aerials and smashes be somewhat made up to fit with the character. I want a character to feel like themselves but that doesn't mean pointless fanservice that amounts to just being a "hey I know that" moment for fans rather than a cohesive moveset for a character.

[@dyll_pyckle]

But that was one of my favorite moments from the Crash comics though!!!

[@ordinarylittlebastard3248]

Whenever I play Leo, his swords feel so heavy and strong. They feel like clubs instead. Aren't swords supposed to be lighter?

[@peterfamilyguy2040]

Patrick also looks a little weird. Patrick's face without eyebrows looks incomplete and for some reason various animations in his move set make them disappear. Also the way he poses in his idle animation doesn't fits too much with his personality, at least in my opinion, and the way his arms move feels incomplete. It's a bit ironic that in a game with multiple characters that come from cartoons acclaimed for their visual quality (like Ren & Stimpy or Avatar), almost all the animations seem cheap and/or unfinished.

[@dyldragon1]

Ultimately, the animations and sound design are what made me not want to go get the game myself after playing it elsewhere. It just doesn't feel the greatest to handle because of this

[@BigBossMan538]

Glad I wasn't the only one who felt it was odd for Toph to use a champion's belt for an attack.

[@LucarioShirona]

Yes. It's even worse with Garfield and the use of a Thought Bubble as an attack.

[@nuibaba280]

@@LucarioShirona That is not worse. Garfield is a cartoony character and tapping into his source material like that, especially with the thoughts of what he loves (lasgna) and hates (mondays) was cool. Complaining that a random and cartoony character has a random and cartoony moveset is stupid. He is not grounded like Toph is. You're the same type of person who will praise Velma having thought bubble attacks and made up shit in Multiversus lmao.

[@dustymcwari4468]

@@LucarioShirona other games also use thought bubbles as attacks tho, even when used as taunts, they do damage to whoever’s nearby when they pop out of nowhere xd Though if there’s something in Garfield that makes no sense to be an attack, is Garfield casually eating lasagna, he’s sitting on the floor and chucking everything at his mouth with no stuff like food chunks flying off or anything that could make it a damaging move, at best it looks more like he should heal out of it xd

[@wootmasterzorsx]

I haven’t played the game, nor am I looking to pick it up at the current price point, but from what I can see, you make a lot of great arguments. One thing I feel is important you didn’t mention, however, was just the advertising side of things. After all, what made Ultimate, or heck, any Smash game from Brawl onward, survive in the public conscious is the hype train for character reveals. 4 and Ultimate in particular managed to retain momentum for ages because of the promises of DLC. And Ultimate sticks in my memory since we knew of two DLC characters before the game even DROPPED! Compare Nick All Stars Brawl, where it’s been promised we’ll get DLC, but we just have no clue what or when. Whereas with Smash, we knew it was reasonable to assume given Nintendo Directs had a good chance of revealing a Smash character. And I think the draw of who’s next to be revealed is really important to keeping the longevity of these kinds of mascot platform fighters for the casual audience, above all else. Not that they live or die off it, naturally, but it really feels like it hurt the game to have the momentum die so quickly.

[@slimballs9650]

This also comes with the fact that the devs' balance philosophy is to make everyone broken. That's not balance, that's just making the game more of a race to see who gets neutral first.

[@juanrodriguez9971]

That's a fun philosophy for a party game that last one minute, not for a fighting game that has to last at least 4 minutes.

[@randompoet9997]

The brawl minus mod is more balanced and that is literally their balance philosophy.

[@keystone5750]

Yeah absolutely agree. You need to be able to know when something needs nerfs. Obviously this doesn’t mean take away options from a character, but making them less problematic would result in a more fun game for the entire cast.

[@danielorlovaquinn]

What? Way to twist words that was NOT their philosophy

[@keystone5750]

@@danielorlovaquinn All of the following are from the discord “Everyone will be broken and it will be my intent” “At the end of the day I still want this game to be a fun & broken mess. Where I draw the line is when there's a single option that's consistently overbearing & unfun” “And to the people saying that Toph's kit looks busted and stupid; Welcome to NASB lmao” I think having a high power level isn’t inherently bad, but obviously the game’s balance is going to be pretty messy for the next few month with the lack of aerial defence options and the similarities between lights.

[@carlcarlington7317]

They targeted literally the most niche audience possible competitive melee players who are tired of melee. Even as someone who like smash and fighting game’s casually the controls are so different from smash that I could never get into a flow state with nick all star brawl. it’s like when you first start driving and you’re consciously thinking about everything sure it gets better with time but the game lost it’s appeal so quickly that I never got to that point.

[@GenoKnightXZ]

My biggest problem is that they relied to much on melee players to sell the game. See Hungrybox making clickbaity videos and calling it things like "better smash bros" or "smash killer" rubs me the wrong way. Smash works because its for everyone. But Melee player have their heads so far up their ass that they think everything should go their way when really they are at best 10% of the smash fan base. I'm looking forward to Multi verse because it's trying to be it own thing and not melee but with WB characters. A sick part of me wants NASB to fail just to show Melee players that the world doesn't revolve around them. Edit: Now a dev doesn't want it to be called a smash killer. Strange that they don't want that comparison AFTER the game came out and failed to catch on. Almost as if they admit that they were cocky about "giving fans that they want"

[@bigf0ot25]

Recognizing that melee is the gold standard of platform fighters=/=melee players thinking the world revolves around them. Like no indie platform fighter is trying to be like brawl, 4 or ult and thats for a reason: those games suck in comparison to melee, not just on a competitive level, but a casual one.

[@DoctorMario606]

@@bigf0ot25 If you think Melee is the best smash game casually it's safe to say you're a competitive Melee player LOL

[@Spyder-Marth]

@@DoctorMario606 exactly

[@bigf0ot25]

@@DoctorMario606 i have no reason to lie to you when i say that i am and have been a casual at *all* games for all 34 years of my existence. In fact, i speak the way i do wrt the smash franchise precisely because im a casual. I mean, if i was capable of playing competitively, surely i could adapt to the molasses of every smash title since melee, no?

[@itsalex-youtube]

@@bigf0ot25 Cap.

[@keksidy]

I hope you cover Fraymakers in the near future. I love SSF2 and I'm glad that the devs are finally making an original platform fighter

[@IcyDiamond]

Honestly I’m just excited to play as Octodad in a fighting game

[@omarpikm2101]

octodad

[@thekeyandthegate4093]

Fraymakers is gonna be the best shit ever, it's a wonder more people don't talk about it.

[@DoctorMario606]

@@thekeyandthegate4093 When a beta comes out I'm sure it'll be talked about WAY more. The kickstarter got funded extremely quickly, so people know about it for sure.

[@caryslan5890]

They fell into the same trap that has doomed countless Smash clones. Not only did they focus too much on the competitve audience, but they were too focused on trying to emulate Melee's gameplay. I knew this game was going to struggle the moment the developers kept bringing up wavedashing and seemed to focus too much on that mechainic. I understand Melee has a massive fanbase to this day, but the reality is that three Smash games(four if we count Smash 3DS and Wii U as separate games) have gone in their own direction in terms of the gameplay evolution of Smash, and wavedashing has not come back since Melee. A Smash player who started with Brawl or later is not gonna care about wavedashing. They may not even be used to Melee's brand of Smash gameplay. This focus also doomed the game, because it forgot the casual audience. Alot of Smash's player base are casual players who love to hop online and throw items at each other on the crazy stages. Other fighting games like Mortal Kombat, Injustice, Dragon Ball Fighter Z, and other games of that kind have things that appeal to casual players like a story mode, other gameplay modes, etc. While this game has clear presentation issues, I think the biggest issue is that they wanted to make another version of Melee, but with Nickelodeon characters. The problem is, they don't have the proper experience to create a proper balance between casuals and serious players or to cater to different gameplay styles.

[@zwillscoopchannel9689]

Not to mention those mechanics in melee are bugs and glitches. It’s hard to create something that was never intended. Even some melee players said that the game play felt off

[@shrimpchris6580]

@@zwillscoopchannel9689 They aren't bugs and glitches, they're slightly unintended but natural extensions of the games mechanics that people picked up on being very useful lol

[@yl3716]

@@shrimpchris6580 "They aren't bugs and glitches, they're slightly unintended but natural extensions of the games mechanics" Sakurai stated, when asked if it was a glitch, that they were aware of wavedashing during development, they just didn't think it would make a difference. So it is a glitch, just not one they thought important enough to fix, which isn't that uncommon in games. It's like saying Link being able to go faster when walking backwards in ocarina of time is intentional because being able to walk is a part of the game. Doesn't change thats its a bug, they just didnt bother getting rid of it.

[@shrimpchris6580]

@@yl3716 Unintended consequences of programming don't equate one to one with being bugs and glitches, I don't know what else to tell you lol

[@arthurkane5434]

@@shrimpchris6580 Thats exactly what it means. Bugs and glitches arent inherently bad, but regardless of whether it breaks the game or makes new gameplay opportunities, its still bugs and glitches.

[@waffleman8053]

Here's my take on the game. One of the biggest flaws of this game is the lack of variety in playstyles. As we all know, SpongeBob is the all rounder character. Super easy and straight forward. I generally like his design (even if his playstyle is mainly spamming aerials.) But here's the problem. This game was designed around Sponge Bob. Any character that dissents them selves from the Sponge is punished by the games mechanics. This is the reason so many moves feel the same, And why there are so many rushdowns. Now lets look at one of my mains. Toph. I love Toph's design. Its one of the most unique and different designs in the game. And everything in the game go's against her playstyle. A grounded, bait and punish character in and air based rushdown game. I know they wanted this game to be like Melee. They wanted this game to be a crazy aggressive mess. Which is fine. There's nothing wrong with making a aggressive platform fighter. Just don't neglect or destroy the other archetypes. A lot of melee spiritual successors do. (debatably even melee itself) The thing about melee that made it last to this day is the player expression. How people can play the same character differently. But in Nasb, all characters just latter combo you till you die. It get's old soon. Over all, even if this game is a mess. I still had a great time with it. It made me, and guy who didn't grow up on Nickelodeon, Excited when it was first reviled and had a ton of fun playing it with his friend. And brought that fun and excitement to thousands of people all over the internet. Even with all these problems, I still don't regret my purchase.

[@siobhannicolson5566]

tbh my biggest issue with all star brawl was just how... non casual friendly it was. smash isn't like a pick up and go game, but it has something for both casual and competitive fans (although there is a bit of a bias towards casual if you look at some circles). nasb just felt... taxing to play, especially if you weren't really experienced with the melee style of playing. its also IMHO not fun to watch -- the moves are jerky and it becomes a messy, hard to follow experience.

[@witherkichian4867]

They tried to cater the game to the competitive melee audience, instead of the casual scene. People love to watch competitive Melee, but only a tiny percentage of people actually want to play melee competitively. As such, the casuals felt alienated. Couple that with the budget cuts, lack of voice acting, and 50 dollar price tag, and it's very clear on how this game really failed.

[@richardhoule9302]

Did Helga just ask Toph "what are you looking at?"

[@harryvpn1462]

Unironically great

[@Xenowolf8]

The problem is that there’s a very small but loud portion of the Smash player base that is spoiled by Sakurai, and they take everything he does for granted. Just to complain to no end about a couple flaws while never giving credit where credit is due (especially in the case of a certain gluttonous crate fellow). And with this game they catered to the loud minority, the devs thought to themselves “no zoners because Smash players hate zoners, almost no single player because smash players don’t care about that, no items because no one uses them, good online because that’s all Smash players care about.” And look at what we got, a messy game that’s nowhere near as good as Smash because it doesn’t have the same soul that the loud competitive people took for granted. This game is proof that the loud minority that does nothing but complain, doesn’t know what they want, and shouldn’t be completely trusted.

[@nuibaba280]

No they didn't, you're completely generalizing them and that isn't fair. They did not think that way, items were planned but couldn't make it to launch. Also, you're completely wrong about zoners. Zim and Toph are zoners and even Oblina is kind of a zoner. They all depend on keeping their opponents out.

[@elkarlo1593]

I still remember it I always knew it would not come even CLOSE to smash bros, so I've been enjoying it a whole lot, and I'm excited for it to get updated

[@keystone5750]

Damn, I like this game, but yeah you kinda hit the nail on every one of my issues with it, except momentum cancelling, and a bit of stuff on blocking was inaccurate. I do still think the engine is fun enough to make the game still very enjoyable, but the game is definitely a long way from mass appeal, both as a casual game and as a competitive one.

[@musico4609]

Hey I know you

[@keystone5750]

@@musico4609 oh hi musico

[@walkernonya5887]

Another note about the lack content, Slap CIty (another platform fighter Ludosity made) has a comparable amount of content for $20. Less characters, but more content everywhere else.

[@Savvysnek]

Yeah the lack of variety in playstyles was what made me eventually lose interest. At first I thought it was so cool how fast the game was compared to Ultimate, but because it was so fast, it forced every character to play more or less in the same aggressive, in your face way. I miss the zoning techniques in Smash.

[@KyleEvra]

Lack of voice acting is what made me lose interest.

[@clairebun]

Gameplay is important, but bad presentation can be a killer. Doesn't matter how well polished and well-balanced your mechanics are if it doesn't have polished animation and sound design to match, or has strange thematic choices that break immersion

[@the_crusty_crusader]

Then why did Minecraft take off because that looked like shit

[@aIkaIi]

@@the_crusty_crusader See, but Minecraft has a style and them to it. It has a certain "look." Everything well balanced needs this. NASB just looks ugly. It's got no sauce.

[@the_crusty_crusader]

Just because it had a theme doesn't mean the graphics weren't garbage you play a game for the mechanics not the look. Looking better is always preferred but you don't just not play a game because of the style. The game is fun and different and it feels like allot of the complaints are kinda nit picky like weird move animation choice and reliance on spikes. They aren't Smash it's allowed to try new move styles and balancing techniques and shouldn't be held in comparison to a 20 year old polished franchise.

[@64bitmodels66]

holy shit its the srb2 guy

[@reactking7093]

@@aIkaIi it's bigger than that. Lack of advertising and Nick not willing to spend money is hurting it right now. In terms of gameplay I actually like it. We just need voice acting and more characters and more advertising and the game can take off.

[@lijemiriam7965]

I never quite understood why people thought putting all 4 Ninja Turtles wasn't nesccary. That being said: the roster just feels incomplete.

[@belnonaodh1520]

I feel the opposite - including April O'Neil and the upcoming shredder, giving all TMNT characters representation would give them 6 character reps while SpongeBob, and any other franchise, only gets 3 max. Giving Squidward or Mr Krabs representation would draw in more fans knowing the popularity of SpongeBob, AND give the game way more variety in gameplay and visuals than Donatello or Raphael imo.

[@bluefire9285]

Because it is incomplete

[@thischanneldoesntexist6132]

Platform fighter devs: “Alright so if we focus on *ONLY* the competitive players and not the casuals despite it being by franchises what casuals like and also make it so some characters with great moveset choices smash clones” Such a great business idea

[@thischanneldoesntexist6132]

Atleast fraymakers seem to be casual friendly

[@rotundmonibuv5103]

Absolutely true. So many platform fighters will prioritize tech and combos over substance, i.e. this game and Icons: Battle Arena, and pro players will eat it up and overhype it to no end. What's the point of good mechanics if there's no polish behind them? I might as well watch a bunch of shapes moving around.

[@burningfiregames6015]

I agree they should have put way more effort into the casual side, but it's kind of unfair to say it was a shitty business idea, it wasn't really a choice they had, due to low budget, they had to pick one really, and if they went casual, then smash would have completely overshadowed it.

[@thischanneldoesntexist6132]

@@burningfiregames6015 you bring a good point

[@duragdee2760]

@@rotundmonibuv5103 'bunch of shapes moving around.' I can't help but feel like that will happen eventually. 😂

[@TheStarBot]

I can't wait for this video for Multiversus

[@Neoxon619]

Same here

[@joskalnunez381]

Lol

[@lostcrusader8053]

At the moment, it seem to be better that they actually have voice acting and have more costume variations.

[@nuibaba280]

@@lostcrusader8053 Doesn't matter. It's a free to play game, you're gonna be paying for basic ass cosmetics.

[@phoenixdouchebag904]

Aaaand this aged like wine.

[@filippikusf.4001]

guys, don't worry, Multiversus is now out, free2play and really fricking fun to play; just forget about the Nickelodeon failure and come to play super sayan Shaggy

[@Peretoroto]

Or you can play as NBA Super Duper Star from the hit movie Space Jam 2, Lebrone Jahames.

[@LorzIX]

I went into this video thinking "what do you mean went wrong, the game is alright", but I think you hit the nail on the head particularly when it comes to balancing and playstyle variety, which has been my biggest issue when playing. Granted I'm the kind of player that doesn't mind getting a game like this to play nothing more than competitive 1v1, so I overlook many issues, but I feel like this video is coming from the right place, so I hope the devs hear this criticism and are able to apply it to the best of their ability.

[@thorjhonson1721]

The game ain't alright. The game actually sucks. If you like smash why would you waste your time with this crap? The IPS is the only thing that makes it interesting, not good

[@8bitmagic]

The game is so fun idk how you can say it sucks. It's lacking polish, and as the video points out made a few weird choices but it's definitely fun.

[@LorzIX]

@@thorjhonson1721 what, do you get paid for telling people to stop playing a game? I think there's plenty of valid criticism to be made but if you genuinely think there's no reason to play nick over smash, you wouldn't recognize a good game if it hit you over the head with a sledgehammer

[@andykishore]

@@LorzIX Yeah, I was also surprised by how well explained these criticisms are in this video.

[@shrimpchris6580]

@@thorjhonson1721 Smash ultimate's absurdly dogshit level of input delay and sticky controls make it one of the least one fighting games on the market to play offline, let alone online. I love smash and have been playing it since I was a kid, but as crusty as Nick is, it feels infinitely better to play than the latest smash game.

[@LucarioShirona]

The game has a sad misdirection, I know a fair amount wanted to play NASB as a celebration of Nick overall, like how Smash is to celebrate Nintendo that would later evolve to celebrating Gaming as a whole. Sadly this game completely lack that, and didn't even have a boss or any Arcade Ending to warrent a Lore/Reason to why the characters are crossing over. Instead, mostly focus on the Competitive Side (more on Melee) without realizing the flaws Melee had brought to the community, even tampered the quality of the roster.

[@nuibaba280]

It doesn't need a lore reason. Nick's characters are already tightknit, that's the most nitpicky pointless shit to complain about. "The silly Nick game doesn't have lore!!! Even tho tons of other licensed games had the chars cross over no issue".

[@LucarioShirona]

@@nuibaba280 They could have gone with something very simple. It was how it was back Smash 64 where it was believed to be a kid playing with his toys, simple yet effective. Part of the reason for adding a story is important at least gives a reason to actually play a bare bones Arcade Mode that has no Boss Battle. Most Fighting Games don't add a lot to their Arcade Modes, but are still remembered for the addition of a simple story added.

[@nuibaba280]

@@LucarioShirona They don't need to. Nobody cares about the reason, not even Smash fans care for that. There's lots of things NASB needs and a "lore reason" is at the bottom.

[@LucarioShirona]

@@nuibaba280 you completely missed the point why at least little story adds a lot. It helps gives something for players who wants something out of 1P content, and currently is still one of NASB’s biggest draw backs.

[@nuibaba280]

@@LucarioShirona It doesn't though, it's a nice detail but nobody gives a FUCK about that in terms of playtime and value. People liked Smash because of it being an IP game that looked pretty and was accessible. Punchtime Explosion was a game that did 1P experience above everything else and nobody cared lmao.

[@elkarlo1593]

A flaw that I've noticed myself is you can't use your Dash when you're on your tumbling animation, so you gotta attack first to stop the tumbling animation so you can dash I hope that wasn't intentional and gets fixed

[@fernandobanda5734]

I don't think it wasn't intentional, it just sucks.

[@WeldonSirloin]

It's amazing how we can't criticize the developers for not doing a good job. Sure, the suits behind this are at fault for obviously rushing this product but the game really isn't attractive to a bigger audience outside of the small portion of the competitive smash community. Hopefully the game can be revitalized with each new update but I honestly doubt it's going to grow outside of its own little niche.

[@grinbrothers]

Honestly, seeing all the trailers/videos focused entirely on it's mechanics and online gameplay with little mentioned about offline content and modes kind of clued me in to this game having a rough start. For a game focused on children appealing cartoon characters, it strangely lacks casual appeal with a lacklustre arcade mode and somehow around the same (or less if you don't count online) modes than even Smash 64. I didn't think too much about it's mechanical flaws but it was interesting to see them highlighted. The overly quick animations that you pointed out at 5:44 was something that I felt in watching trailers so it's nice to know that others noticed.

[@JustChadYT]

This video was really well made! While I’m a bit sad that the game turned out this way, I also have faith that the wonderful team behind this game will learn from these mistakes and keep getting better with time. Hopefully in the future, they’ll have more freedom, as just like you said, I do suspect that certain factors outside of their control restricted them and held them back.

[@castform7]

I'm gonna be honest, while I saw the potential with NASB, I thought there were many things holding it back from being a game I actually wanted to give a try. As more footage came out, I wasn't really feeling the game. The slapped on references, the samey movesets both within a characters kit and compared to others. The usage of characters to fill an archetype rather than actually play to their personalities, the presentation not really seeming that great. These and many other things turned me off from the game and didn't really get super hype for it even though I really like Nick shows. I don't want say the game is awful, it's obvious the team was working with what crumbs they got. It just felt very mediocre.

[@nuibaba280]

But the characters who fit an archetype DO play into their personalities. Spongebob being an all rounder fits him. Patrick being a grappler that crushes people in hugs is 100% something that would be associated with him.

[@Blitz_Spencer]

Smash fans saw “Nickelodeon Cross-Over platform fighter with good movement, tech, and rollback netcode” and immediately wanted to jump ship from Smash, making a shitton of memes and getting extremely hyped for the game. The game came out and was just lackluster at every corner. Why we play Smash and KEEP playing Smash is because how polished the experience is and the amount of content to keep people playing. Other platform fighters just struggle because they both want and don’t want to be Smash, and it’s really unfortunate because it is extremely difficult for them to make a name for themselves, the only one coming to mind being Rivals of Aether and Brawlhalla.

[@aagamer43]

I feel like the main problem was Nick.Here’s what I mean Nick thinks this will be a quick crash grab. Ludiosity wants this to be a actually good game.

[@UltimateInkling]

Yea if nick put more budget into the game then this wouldnt be a problem.

[@waffleman8053]

My thoughts exactly.

[@ricknaturalls2065]

For a lot of things, yes. However the issue of playstyle variety is on Ludiosity.

[@waffleman8053]

@@ricknaturalls2065 Sadly, I don't think they will ever fix that.

[@fernandobanda5734]

@@UltimateInkling That is some tremendous simplification of game development.

[@hououinkyouma5539]

Jigglypuff has more impact in her motions than the majority of these characters

[@IcyFir3902]

Nick All-Stars: The developers had limited creativity and had heavy time constraints. PlayStation All-Stars: First time?

[@GurrenPrime]

I’m so glad you brought up the weird movesets. More than anything else, those were what turned me off of the game. I was so excited to play as characters I loved growing up, but if a bunch of them don’t really feel like themselves, then I didn’t see much point.

[@nuibaba280]

"A bunch of them" is a massive exaggeration. 90% of the roster absolutely feels like themselves. Only like 3 characters have some off things about them.

[@GurrenPrime]

@@nuibaba280 a bunch of the characters “I loved growing up” that’s an important phrase you glossed over while reading my comment. Aang, Korra, and Danny all feel off just from looking at gameplay, and then SpongeBob, Patrick, and Toph all have really weird looking moves that feel out of place even if the rest of their movesets seem fine. That really only leaves Zim and Sandy as characters I’m really attached to who seem properly represented. I barely remember the 90s, didn’t live in the 80s at all, and stopped watching Nick before Loud House came on, so the rest of the roster is characters I don’t care about.

[@nuibaba280]

@@GurrenPrime Spongebob and Patrick are the most thought through and animated characters. What's wrong with them? They absolutely feel like themselves.

[@GurrenPrime]

@@nuibaba280 like I said, they’re mostly fine. But things like SpongeBob’s “imagination” and Patrick’s up light and up strong attacks all feel more like taunts than attacks. They do get into fights in their show and various video games, so it seems weird to have these non-attacking moves repurposed into attacks when other more accurate stuff could’ve been used instead.

[@nuibaba280]

​@@GurrenPrime ??? You're complaining that the silly game that doesn't take itself seriously has zany cartoony attacks? Literally Spongebob's imagination was the best received move reveal before launch. That's nonsense to say that a goofy cartoon game having goofy cartoon moves is bad. It's not about complete fighting "accuracy". This game isn't even trying to be serious nor have the fighting be intense. It's about having fun while still representing their characters. Which they absolutely do, they are iconic moments that tap into their personalities.

[@krooga_]

i agree with most of this but the point about blocking is just not true at all sure attacks are faster but also block has 0 startup, there is no lag from dropping block, and there is no jumpsquat so you can still realistically punish most things that you could in smash (especially since 90% of neutral in ultimate is mashing extremely safe landing aerials)

[@shrimpchris6580]

Block in this game is absurdly good and he sounded pretty uninformed about that for sure

[@grunkleg.3110]

The difference between this game and Multiversus is night and day. MV's got its own unique gimmick that helps separate it from Smash Bros rather than it using Smash as its crutch, full voice acting with a lot of the original / modern day actors, complete with banter between characters, coherent, logical movesets where you can actually tell what your character is doing, less of a chokehold from the folks over at Warner Bros, which means things like Ultra Instinct Shaggy, room for playstyles other than Rushdown / Fratboy Melee Nerd, cross progression, multiple options for controls and display that were oddly lacking in NASB last time I played, and the game is very much free. I dunno, I guess Multiversus is currently lacking in music, and the sound effects could be a bit better, not to mention all the sins that come with F2P, but one clearly blew the other out the water

[@Peretoroto]

I too thought the music was lacking.... that is until I heard the Rick and Morty remixes.

[@forhisneutralspecialhewiel2295]

The biggest disappointment for me is the game focusing way too much on the competitive community, to the point of not even adding items or an equivalent to Final Smashes. It's good if you also focus on the competitive side, but not to this point. This is a game with iconic cartoon characters, it's obvious that children and casual gamers are gonna get interested. If you want a competitive platform fighter, then go play Rivals of Aether or something. There's also the animations. They are very unpolished and fast, sometimes you can't even tell what is going on. Some moves don't feel right, too. Like, why is SpongeBob's down special a bite? Maybe it's a reference to the krabby patties he makes, but that's kind of a stretch. Movesets shouldn't be about cramming in as much references as possible, they should be focused on what you'd expect from that character. I know next to nothing about Avatar, but even I agree that Toph should have something else as her light up tilt instead of the belt. It just doesn't feel right as a move, it's like if you took Snake's box and made it into his forward tilt. Overall, I think they should improve the game with updates, maybe even a sequel in the future. I also hope that Multiversus doesn't suffer from the same fate, because Warner Bros' properties mean a lot more to me than Nick's ones (I grew up watching mostly Cartoon Network).

[@BigBossMan538]

Agreed. Although Jenny looks pretty great for this game. As an Avatar fan, I’m disappointed in its representation here. SpongeBob’s bite is a reference to I’m with Stupid. But you’re right, it’s not something I strongly associate with SpongeBob who only bit Patrick as a one-off gag

[@AlphaStoutland]

Just my two cents on the whole Nick All Star Brawl burning out at arrival: I feel like it was simply a mix of Nickelodeon giving the team a minuscule budget and Ludosity trying to make it this hypercompetitive game overall. The overall lack of content is likely a symptom of the former, but for casual Smash players and Nick fans like myself, it's pretty isolating when every character is CRAZEE STRONK and there's such a reliance on crazy fast paced gameplay. Plus there's A LOT of reused moves in everyone's movesets, like Smash Bros. Sonic level bad. 😐 The release day price was WAY too much too. Fifty bucks for a half-baked game like this with little to no content is asking a lot for what you're getting, but I got it on sale for twenty on Black Friday and that's more than fair. My hope is that Nick allows Ludosity to do more with the game beyond one alt costume and the two DLC fighters we know about, and that a year or two from now we'll be talking about what a glow-up NASB went through. 😊 And hopefully my girl Jenny Wakeman makes it in a fighter 😀🤖

[@SpiderManNintendoFan]

Oh. H-hie.

[@AlphaStoutland]

@@SpiderManNintendoFan hello sir 🙋‍♂️

[@affrything]

Here’s to a hearty glow-up for Nick Brawl!

[@OhSayWhatIsTruth]

Your wish has been granted. If only the rest of the game was good...

[@revolution4122]

Now that they know how badly Nick All-Stars Brawl bombed, I wonder if Multiversus can take the opportunity to learn from its failure and give us a better beat-em-up.

[@bluefire9285]

I wouldn't say the game was a failure. I mean, it sold over 100k copies on steam alone a few weeks ago

[@Teriiiyakiii]

The 3 people playing the game on Twitch are offended

[@bluefire9285]

@@Teriiiyakiii what?

[@nuibaba280]

@@Teriiiyakiii Oh shut up.

[@Teriiiyakiii]

@@nuibaba280 I’d like to see you try and make me 🤺

[@Drewsel]

I applaud your efforts to discuss the games issues without outright attacking it and providing some deserved constructive criticism. There's too much doom and gloom on youtube and it's nice seeing a positive spin.

[@chidaluokoro9104]

agreed

[@jphn938]

Thank you for bringing up the reference issue - Patrick's phone is particularly egregious and doesn't fit the character at all. It's a funny scene, but he does it one time in the entire show and he was even acting out of character by wanting an award in the episode anyway!

[@nuibaba280]

Now you're just nitpicky. That scene is iconic and Patrick *has* no continuity in the actual show. The devs can pick anything they want and it would work. Patrick using the phone is amusing and literally nobody complained pre launch, the vast majority even praised it. It fits his character if his character got involved with a scene like that at all. Lighten up!

[@elkarlo1593]

Hopefully they add Defensive options, or at least make dashes refresh when getting hit, that's my biggest problem that could solve a LOT of the core gameplay right now Also ledgehogging sucks

[@nuibaba280]

Ledgehogging is never getting taken out.

[@jedisquidward]

I wouldn't count it out just yet. I tried to get it on black friday at so many places and couldn't find it anywhere. A GameStop I called told me I was the fourth call that day specifically asking about that game.

[@AlphaStoutland]

Got it for sale BF too for $20, definitely worth it for that price 🙂👍

[@TheClassicnathan]

You know, it's kinda ironic how they ended up becoming like that old project M game called "ICONS" in terms of focusing on only the competitive scene. Makes me wish they would have gone with a CN punch time explosion route where the characters aren't perfect but how movesets that fit them while also having a story mode that focused on character interactions

[@AutumnWoodham]

Just a reminder, people were claiming this was gonna be the "Smash Killer".

[@bluefire9285]

Ah yes, an indie company made up of 10 people, vs a Multi-Billion dollar Company with over 100 devs

[@Flunkass]

@@bluefire9285 people were caught up in the moment

[@MrGameguyC]

That was a meme... No one unironically believed that...

[@MrGameguyC]

@AT Productions We don't talk to those people. lol

[@phoenixdouchebag904]

Yeah there were. I remember a Smashboard post that basically on went like that.

[@NicholasLionRider]

I think the two big things I think that caused brawl to "at best" be a quick fun game the fanbase enjoyed, then only weeks later barely saw any news is lack of content and future dlc leaks. Lack of content is obvious, once you played 10-15 hours of the online/casual matches in your fighting game, you basically have experienced all the game had to offer. With the limited characters/stages, flaws in those two categories become really apparent. Before you know it you are just on the Legend of Korra stage all the time playing your main and 1-2 other characters and get bored simply by it being the same thing over and over. Looking to the future isnt so bright either. The first dlc fighters Shredder and Garfield don't really resonate with "Nickelodeon nostalgia" or excitement. People want Jimmy Neutron, Rocko, Timmy Turner, Jenny, etc. and two non nick characters being the thing people have to look forward to short term isn't super ideal. The costume update we just got also kinda cemented, its a "step in the right direction" but still far from ideal.

[@savebigmoneyatmenards]

Simple. They forgot Raphael and Donatello.

[@tardissins7512]

Something I just noticed is how weirdly heavy all the knockback curves are. That’s something that makes the game a lot less approachable, and something that’s hard to change once you’re committed to it.

[@ivansotelo4622]

Good criticism men, i hope they take notes, we really need more games in the scene, since the improvent and innovation of one, can help the other to implement them as a standard

[@xaayer]

I feel like Danny got shafted. He should have been a zoner similar to Samus. His neutral B should have been able to charge on a hold instead of just shooting at best two ecto blasts. The Fenton thermos should have been a range grab (that maybe stores the opponent in the thermos for him to shoot back out). The Ice beam eyes are a good inclusion because even the show forgot he had those, but they don't do anything: they should have at least been similar to ice climbers where consecutive hits would end up freezing opponents. Also he can fly... why isn't his jump similar to Kirby with him flying a little before falling? Sure that would make his recovery really good, but on the other side: he is a teenager and is a light character. Most of his deaths would come from hard hits knocking him out rather than off ledge. The lack of dodging is really insane and the fact that they gave dodge to Nigel is crazy. Of all the characters, Danny can turn intangible - that means he can't be touched. Why not give him the dodge? Ghostly Wail is one of his best attacks but feels so small and should likewise be able to be charged where the longer you hold it, the larger the radius to a degree until you release the button and he does the attack. They recently did the costume update and while I like the costumes, each character only gets 1 costume and some are lazy, but keeping this about Danny: they put Danny in his pre-powers suit (negative colors) which is dope, but why are his eyes still green? They were blue!

[@nuibaba280]

Danny Phantom's abilities are the direct opposite of zoner. A lot of his action involves him directly throwing punches and kicks. NASB does not fit with his ice beams working like Ice Climbers, a freezing mechanic Danny can spam in a fast paced fighter would completely kill the competitive scene. There's a reason we have few characters in fighting games that fully freeze opponents as a full fledged mechanic.

[@xaayer]

@@nuibaba280 I said Danny SHOULD have been a zoner. Also his ice beam wouldn't be an instant freeze. It would be a buildup similar to April's camera but on the opponent and it fades without near consecutive hits. At max, they freeze for a few seconds. This mechanic is literally already in place with the whole "rps strong attacks".

[@nuibaba280]

@@xaayer Danny doesn't FIT as a zoner. He's literally a brawler with powers in the actual show. And people hate the RPS. Putting it on a whole ass character who can spam a freeze mechanic is shitty design

[@xaayer]

@@nuibaba280 everyone in the game is a brawler for the most part. Adding a zoner would be different. If you don't like the idea, neat. I don t care. I'm sharing my opinion and in my opinion, Danny could work as a zoner because his blasts can vary. Her can do quick blasts, sustained blasts charged blasts all from the show. I'm not saying riddle him with ranged attacks, but in saying his ranged attack as it is could have had more mechanic behind it other than reskinned bubble blowing. As for his ice beam, it wouldn't be spammable because there would be a mechanic behind it that would, like April's, sora's and ice climbers attacks, have to build up. But in this fast paced game, how would that be a spammable if the person can get out of it and it cools off/resets within a second or less of no consecutive hits? It wouldn't be spammable, just another tool.

[@nuibaba280]

@@xaayer Toph and Zim are zoners lol. Danny does not fit as a zoner. It goes against his entire character and fighting style, he throws hands with the ghosts in canon.

[@jupitervideos7702]

Also can we talk about how only 2 of the 4 ninja turtles are in the game.

[@ThatOneSawk]

why do we need 4 characters that look nearly identical

[@Zonefire15]

We don't need an overhaul on one type of character.

[@phoenixdouchebag904]

@@ThatOneSawk Because every TMNT game on earth has had all 4 turtles. Name me one TMNT game that doesn't have the turtles that ins't some obscure forgotten random game of the past.

[@jupitervideos7702]

@@ThatOneSawk Because they are all iconic in their own right, besides the spongebob characters, and almost guaranteed to come Garfield. All 4 are more iconic than most of this roster.

[@Zinksk8er]

No alt skins, no voice acting was a big bummer. I fixed that with PC mods. No dash dance in the beginning was weird. No official music was a bummer. I had mirror match mods that made you be able to tell the difference between you and your opponent with a tint over them. The first balance patch they did to adjust knock back was great.

[@hardondong3550]

It simply focused too hard on being a "smash killer"(Well in terms of competitive) that it just didn't give enough attention to the other aspects of what made smash so special and what we got was a pretty bare bones game. I wouldn't say it's dead but had definitely been on a heavy decline. I haven't seen much videos being made on it.

[@dabluepittoo-aqua4213]

All Star Brawl is decent...but flawed. I feel like many games that try to follow Melee's design (including Melee itself) kinda suffer from the same issue of lacking variety. It's why I'm not the biggest fan of Project M but love Ultimate; each character isn't forced to play as a rushdown fighter. Hope All Star Brawl manages to figure out how to increase it's diversity to match it's gameplay, as Rivals Of Aether proved it's possible. Maybe slowing things down just a little bit could help? Sounds dumb, but what good is high speed gameplay if it's the only option?

[@waffleman8053]

Hard agree. There's nothing wrong about making a more aggressive platform fighter. Just don't make rushdown the only viable option.

[@makito106]

Exactly one of biggest problem with the Smash community is how they want every character to be an aggressive rushdown fighter or they get the character gets called "lame"

[@Zonefire15]

It only came out 2 months ago of course it's flawed.

[@phoenixdouchebag904]

@@makito106 This game feels like it was made by salty Captain Falcon that got butthurt that he lost to a Belmont main, so he decided to remove zoners alltogether. It's really stupid to be honest. I get that some characters need tools to better combat zoners or zoners need limitations and weaknesses to balance characters but to remove an archetype just because you don't like them is monumentally dumb. Imagine if i made a fighting game and decided to remove all grapplers because i don't see them as "HyPE". Then again, Patrick gets so jobbed that he might as well not be in this game......

[@davidc.]

@@Zonefire15 a 50 dollar game shouldn't come out half baked. It should be worth its price at realise

[@davidtheriault1421]

One of the main places it went wrong was that there was focus on side characters and memes rather than actual Nickelodeon All-Stars. We have a game to celebrate Nick's history and characters, but they forgot to include Arnold, Rocko, Angry Beavers, Tommy Pickles, Otto Rocket, Jimmy Neutron, Eliza Thornberry, etc. It's sad

[@nuibaba280]

They only had a 20 character roster??? The game DOES have Nickelodeon All Stars. Every single one of them has a place in Nick history, that is undeniable.

[@battlememesbyomari1979]

They were too worried about FAST FAST FAST! HIGH SPEED HIGH SPEED HIGH SPEED!! Literally ignoring every other aspect of the game, even alternate outfits. Smh 🤦🏽‍♂️🤦🏽‍♂️🤦🏽‍♂️

[@Zonefire15]

Slow it down jeez! It's still being fixed up. What did you expect? Perfection right off the bat? This isn't the 2000s anymore where you get what you receive.

[@lsebastian9086]

@@Zonefire15 I cant expect perfection but i cant stand for incomplete things. I mean, if there isnt even a palette swap, wich woudl be easier to do, regardless off the reasons, that is no excuse.

[@nuibaba280]

@@lsebastian9086 There is an excuse. Thaddeus confirmed alt colors were ready at launch but Nick said "no. they must be canon". So the alt colors were trash (like Spongebob having colors that changed his yellow to reference Patrick, Squidward, and Krabs).

[@lsebastian9086]

@@nuibaba280 Well, then my scorn is at Nickelodeon for failing to consider how much that action genuinely damages a basic feature. I deeply apologize if i sound so harsh and stern, but after witnessing so many games cut corners and not forgetting the poor management, there are things i will call out, no matter wether it is a small or big company. I mean, the color change is somehting standart if only to make things easy and seeing the lack off it is genuinely upseting.

[@rhett8819]

Honestly, I felt it was the fans that went wrong. Everything I've seen and experienced in all star brawl, seems par the course. Bare Bones modes, no voice acting, janky gameplay, it's just like every other run-of-the-mill Nickelodeon cash in that's been released this past decade. And yet for some reason, fans caught on to the net code or whatever it's called, and they kept harping on that, like that alone was enough to push it over the top and into Smash Brothers territory. Maybe it started as a joke, but somewhere along the line it felt like the fans started to really believe it.

[@rotundmonibuv5103]

This is one of the best videos explaining this game's flaws, I really hope at least one dev saw this and is actually taking note. It's sad to see a a game that was so hyped be a disappointment in terms of both its graphical and technical polish. Hopefully Nickelodeon loosens their grip on this game's content.

[@Bylethsummoner3]

I also think another issue was they were betting on people like Hbox and all of them for the fan base. Rivals for example made a unique fanbase and didn't bet on people like Hbox and all of those people to promote the game. I also think the lack of voicing sucks and lack of casual play also sucks thats why I like ultimate I play competitive but people who like items can play items in All stars you got sports mode and thats it

[@j0hn78121]

That's interesting. What platform is this recorded on? I generally and unfortunately agree with all points listed in this video, but I've always had full control of ALL keybinding remappings on PC. Have you tried scrolling down at 2:27? It lists the rests of the keybindings.

[@THERE.IS.NO.DEATH.]

I was wondering why I only just found out about this game right now, seemed cool, but totally understand your criticism, great review!!!

[@absoul112]

What's really sad is that Ludosity also made Slap City. That game had less caracters but more content else where and I'd argue better use of it's mechanics (admittedly it's a lot closer to Melee but it has it's onw unique qualities).

[@jamnnjelly3102]

I'm absolutely baffled at how well Slap City plays compared to NASB

[@Joe_Vinky]

My main issue with the game is how fast paced it is. It doesn’t feel smooth or fluid half the time and most moves feel like they have no end glad it start up. On top of that the lack of voice acting or anything doesn’t make the characters feel alive. Yeah I’m playing as Ren and Stimpy but everything’s so lifeless

[@loganmadface5425]

Well Ludwig accidentally leaked the DLC is coming out on Thursday so giving it another shot, my biggest problem with this game is that it has no cross play, i can’t find a single person to match with anymore on PS5

[@aaron_aj_knight_95]

Probably because nobody can really find a PS5. I have yet to see one in stores.

[@PurposeDriven7_]

@@aaron_aj_knight_95 not much of an excuse, the numbers as a whole are really low on twitch. And I also own it on the Switch and it’s hard to find any matches online. On console NASB is dead.

[@aaron_aj_knight_95]

@@PurposeDriven7_ No kidding. I played it once and haven't bothered since.

[@centidyn1482]

This video got recommended to me so your videos are doing good. I've never seen you before but good job!

[@gor764]

I actually just picked up this game and am really loving the way it feels. When I get into a good flow it feels like playing Melee again. I hope it gains some steam and the devs continue to update it.

[@nuibaba280]

Thankfully Ludosity plans to continuously improve it.

[@B3N_Youtube]

Hence why you should never focus around if the game can be competitively viable, you need to make it fun

[@bryanvelazquez2836]

I knew from what I’ve been careful before looking forward to having that Smash inspired game turn people off for reasons it should’ve been worth while experience. Instead, it disappointing to see what Nickelodeon All-Star Brawl was trying to do its best and yet so close if needed more time to build up.

[@Zonefire15]

Why are you talking like it's dead? It only came out 2 months ago.

[@bryanvelazquez2836]

@@Zonefire15 I know. Sorry if I felt off a bit while getting to know NASB having future updates.

[@Athesies]

solid review. ive heard an update coming tomorrow for the game, hopefully its dope if it actually happens

[@einstein9177]

Now we have Multiversus, but the thing is, it’s actually fun.. and everyone’s constantly replaying 😳

[@KnuckleDude24]

If by chance this manages to continue with DLC, Zuko is honestly a safe bet among them.

[@ThereAreThoseWhoCallMeTim]

Is it just me, or does it seem like the Warner Bros. and First Player Games observed the trainwreck that was NASB and told themselves, “Ok so all we gotta do is the exact opposite of what they’re doing if we wanna be a competent Smash clone.”?

[@W3tPaint]

you made the phrase constructive criticism make sense, people just say that in like commentary videos about things all the time, and just talk out of their ass most of the time. But very good video, you explained every point very well with reasoning behind it

[@sincara345]

What went wrong with this game was the servers were fucked I literally remember I could never get a game competitive play or normal, I’d just be sat in a lobby on my own for 20-25 mins before another player would join, tried all the different servers an they were all dead so idk

[@samuelwilliams663]

So wait, you're telling me that despite the game having Roll-back Netcode (the one thing everyone and their mother has been asking for in a fighting game), the online experience is still poor? God, that's depressing.

[@GeneralGorillaSonicOC]

The Nintendo Switch port failed harder because it was on the same console as the game it was intending to compete with. The developers shit talked Smash like there was no tomorrow which of course Nintendo's core fanbase started shitting on Nickelodeon All-Star Brawl and then Sora got revealed for Smash which was the final nail in the Nintendo Switch port's coffin. Nickelodeon All-Star Brawl developers even tried to get Smash players to endorse the game. Even though it had one advantage over Smash by being multi-platform it still failed. Maybe Microsoft can try to make their own Smash clone and Sony could try again with PS All-Stars. Since the Xbox brand has its own dedicated fanbase and the PlayStation also has a dedicated fanbase.

[@finbois8115]

I love this game my friend just got it for Christmas and it’s a blast we played for several hours just having a good time, I feel like the game is much more fun played casually with friends. I couldn’t imagine playing this game competitively.

[@phoenixdouchebag904]

Yeah when played like fun platform fighter it can be fun. Its just a shame the developers focused so much on trying to make it like Melee competitively, that was a fool's errand.

[@romeb.1060]

So you're saying focusing solely on the competitive side of things was a *bad idea?* Shock of all shocks there.

[@nuibaba280]

@@phoenixdouchebag904 No it wasn't. NASB only got to people's attention because of the competitive hype lol.

[@insertobligatoryreferenceh489]

@@nuibaba280 Well, that and people clamoring for their childhood favorites to get in. (Kinda like a certain other fighting game…)

[@mateushenriquepinheiro3197]

Considering we are getting a sequel with improvements in every aspect of the game, I think the second time around will have much better results The second game seems to have remastered and update graphics which will hopefully include better animations, but it will have better alts for the characters and a story mode similar to the one in melee in scope since the devs won't have a triple a budget to work on the story mode. It was also confirmed that bosses and assist trophy like items will be added! (Not to mention rollback netcode and voice acting day 1) Expectations are high for the sequel but it will definitely be reviewed better than the first game and I hope it will be able to thrive for two years at the very least (PS: it would have been pretty cool if multiversus also made a comeback, but that will depend on WB)

[@TheJusticeLeague]

looks like multiversus is taking the spot light. I wish all-star brawl wasnt created and just put their characters in multiversus for a %

[@Bragglord]

1. The same pitfall that Fallout 76 and No Man's Sky fell into of releasing a half-finished game and, by the time it was updated and good years later, the vast majority of people didn't care anymore (Nick Brawl still ain't there). 2. KZbinrs and other idiots hyping it up to be a Smash rival or even (LOL) a Smash beater.

[@markcambrone8369]

Aside from Aang and Korra, I would redo Danny’s move set. Having seen the show, I think Danny would work better as an all arounder like Mario or Ryu. No thermos, ghostly wail saved for a final smash (I know it doesn’t have those but you get that it should be a big thing), no need to mention all of his powers. I also would redo the Turtles representatives. It’s not just that only 2 of them are Turtles, it’s that it’s ONLY the 87 series. I get their fans of the 87 cartoon, which is why they used them, but there are four Turtles and four cartoons. Instead of focusing on just one cartoon, the one that didn’t air on any networks after Nick’s purchase, they could’ve had one Turtle from each cartoon. 87 Mikey, 03 Leo, 12 Don and Rise Raph honestly comes off as more creative than just 2 Turtles and 2 non-Turtles from the same cartoon.

[@sparkleprizm199]

I played the game again and it’s much better now.