White Forest Real Talk: Can We Survive the Meta?

[@dillindbz]

the good decks vs well positioned deck discussion part was a big eye opener. good stuff.

[@Saaltoo_o]

Scourge plays around Evenly, same with Azamina stuff, same with Desirae if u play it U have so many ways to counter breakers but under shifter it's really way harder

[@Saaltoo_o]

I've been on WF Azamina Fiendsmith Breakers and been doing decent since 2 weeks (Top 40 Omega even tho it doesn't mean a lot i know) But i faced a lot of Droll/Shifter and often found a way to be able to survive them then come back. Of course sometimes u have to conceed the Game 1 cause some hands get really cooked by a singular Handtrap like those. But comes the Siding time and it's really important i feel in this format

[@carlosblanco3844]

thanks for making this video because I’ve been taking it to regionals and getting cooked. I guess I’ll just play something else for the time being

[@RayquaSr.]

From personal experience no, but ive seen worst decks top.

[@ApjOASF]

I doubled down and just got my QCSRs. It’s just too fun to give up on IMO and has decent potential. Thank you for your insight as always

[@ApjOASF]

Thoughts on a Post-ROTA and beyond Side Deck video on WF?

[@BimYGO]

want to make a video on siding regardless so might use that as a case study

[@babrad]

Dominus Impulse is incredible for the deck since it allows you to hit Tenpai etc really hard, while you don't lose to shifter because you wouldn't be playing WF with Impulse anyway. On a serious note, just like @Saaltoo_o said I find Scourge invaluable (especially in the runick variant) and the extra synergy reviving 1 Illusion can be soooooooo good especially during the grind game. I know hands with toys are way more explosive yet I went with the 1-1-3 ratio and swapped Droplet for actual breakers to complement DRNM even more. Still, I'm not a fan of the current WF non-runick builds for competitive play, they play fine as casual but I wouldn't even consider them tier 2 similarly to Centurion Bystial. Next set is where the deck will truly shine, very similarly to how Yubel became relevant 2 sets later with the release of Phantom and majorly boosted with the coming of Fiendsmiths (and both TCG exclusives, especially Aerial Eater, being CUSTOM YubelxFiendsmith support)

[@BimYGO]

I fear that SUDA format will still be shifter/fuwalos/droll dominated - and since azamina will be the way to go that set, we will also be blown out by retaliating c if azamina is still splashed in meta at that point who knows though - that will probably be under another ban list

[@babrad]

@@BimYGO I believe next banlist will untie Snakes from the Sinful lore by finally banning OSS in order to prepare the ground for White Forest to become the best Sinful deck. And while Yubel is already checked by the format I'm almost certain Phantom will go to 1 killing the deck That can lead to Shifter becoming bad, at least during turn 1 where Ryzeal and Maliss don't care about it at all, giving some edge to White Forest. Then post side it's simply "draw the out" whether we talk about Shifter or Fuwalos. I'm thinking of going back into Gamma, replacing the 2 missing ones with Delta since Azamina are here to stay

[@servine1212]

Hey, I love that you try to blend creativity and competitiveness. I feel like that is the core of what yugioh is about and the message I try to convey on my channel, though I am more on the rogue side of things, right now I am specializing in world chalice (I think it has a lot of potential this format as a compotent combo strategy) The boards are well insulated and it can prettt consistently play through 2+ handtraps, How do you feel about the lack of handtraps in the main? Do you feel your breaker line up is strong enough to push through fully built snake-eye/yubel boards? Honestly seeing some games or maybe an exhibition videonwhere you do test hands vs handtraps would be very nice to see.

[@BimYGO]

i have a ROTA video on wf azamina gameplay recently you can check. but basically id say yubel is unbeatable without two breakers while other meta decks are definitely beatable. fire king is probably the hardest matchup with breakers cuz their interruptions are layered and dont lose to one droplet/drnm etc. that said, the power level of wf is below those decks so youre still a tier below

[@voidlockdragon1406]

I think main deck like 3x Destructive Daruma Karma Cannon should be a card to consider in WF. It can really save you during a turn that you get shifter, drolled, mulcharmied or simply getting 2-3x hand trapped in the same turn. Essentially, a disruption that buys you a turn and weakens your opponent's board a bit. At that point, unless they have even more hand traps, it should give you enough of an opening to come back.

[@BimYGO]

great for winning the dice roll, horrendous for going 2nd

[@voidlockdragon1406]

@@BimYGO It's more so that if you go second, you just use it for WF cost effects. For going first, it's a pretty good defense for the hand traps that get played often at you and literally every meta hand trap in the game hurts WF plays at some point. It's just like an insurance plan if they do stop your first turn plays with hand traps, you fall back on the Karma cannon while they play with a smaller hand.

[@BimYGO]

@@voidlockdragon1406 nib works the same way, except its flex on the dice roll while karma is bad going 2nd

[@voidlockdragon1406]

Except that monster hand traps don't work so well in WF and that's why the board breaker spells are at least more consistent to that style. The Durama Cannon trap at least has the WF gameplay to work with. The only concern with the Cannon is that Deception makes an easy omni-negate that would stop at least this play. But with multiple copies, the Cannon would be effective since it's not a once per turn effect. But that's not an ideal situation going first opening to multiple copies of a trap card.

[@brandongreen8895]

If you could do some lines through the meta hand traps that would be amazing! Jus so we see how to compete somewhat.

[@No__Vanity]

the runick variant is really cracked rn. no azamina, just the new spell thats a targeting omni

[@ryionizer3622]

Imo just put the white forest deck core in the vault and get ready to bust it out after SUDA and take revenge

[@BimYGO]

100% gonna fiend in SUDA but still concerned we may be in a shifter/droll format at that point so we shall see

[@ryionizer3622]

@BimYGO Suda will be a shifter format cause of maliss

[@quietguyjosh4643]

The problem currently is the price of deception Its up to 45 usd Reprint hopefully soon

[@CamelHoarder101]

It's very upsetting that such a fun deck just gets blown out by every handtrap seeing play now. Really enjoyed the deck last format but can't bring myself to play it at the moment.

[@BimYGO]

if the blowout non engine mostly moves to side deck or if at least shifter/droll lose popularity in crossover breakers format, we might be in a much better position

[@Nick_Rodriguez444]

I’d say that it’s a turn skip for sure with the shifter than droll and Fuwalos. Also through d barrier you shouldn’t lose with build because you can set up an ip and Caesar or Caesar and woes play.

[@Charysma]

at my locals i been teching card destruction. its cheesy but they deck out before they know it

[@Tonio924]

I’m interested to know your thoughts on the recent ocg snake-eye white forest list. Probably too soon since by the time we get SUDA we will have a ban list but watching duel videos and seeing list of the deck it seems cool and interesting.

[@BimYGO]

that version will live or die by our ban list as you say, so i wont hold my breath in the meanwhile in case they nuke SE

[@RayquaSr.]

What's your opinion on draw spells like upstart in the deck?

[@BimYGO]

not necessary - issue is more about playing through interactions rather than drawing a playable hand

[@erk8520]

What he said, buuuut, if you do want to run a draw card, run 1 terraforming + chicken game. You can draw a card, then pitch it as a cost for your WF cards. Just side them out going 2nd

[@HinbunEZ]

White Forrest is the wood to the fire. You’re cooked bro

[@Leo98pm]

Idk i got cooked like in 3 locals in a row and I sold my 3 fuwalos lol. Might try again once SUDA drops. (Now time to watch the vid lol)

[@feuerweier]

Wey you cat the Millenium cards and black goat ?? You are not a fan of Droplett in the past in this deck. What change ?

[@BimYGO]

droplet only works if you reliably have many solid sends - combining a large toy engine with powerspells makes droplet more playable than before. no space for millennium in this particular version but its still good. black goat still good can main 1 for thrust

[@florianschmidt5869]

Even after suda too?😩😩😩

[@BimYGO]

@@florianschmidt5869 that’s after crossover breakers to very far future, can’t predict that format yet

[@jobro8293]

the gallant granite nib combo should not be in here. i have tried the deck with and without it and without it feels way better.

[@BimYGO]

the way that you build your deck to modify your end board to the format will always depend on your expected matchup spread. nib+veiler remains one of the strongest possible combinations of hand traps since azamina didnt change its effectiveness for example: vs SE you veiler ilia silvia first, then nib (almost every single SE profile makes desirae and not king). vs FK you veiler arvata so nib resolves and they wont have fires on field after. vs yubel you veiler phantom first. vs centurion with the new combo they now play into nib. WF is the only deck right now that can easily search both of those hand traps without hurting their own gameplan that said, play what you like - and there are arguments for other cards in those slots, like a larger FS package

[@assumingfrog7944]

If you're a Runick WF enjoyer, I'm unfortunately here to say that that deck isn't doing too hot either. You have a better ability to play through cards like Fuwa but you get punished super hard by Shifter and now Retaliating C which is in everyone's side deck. It's rough out here for WF fans, but hey, giving Snake-Eye Fire King a spin has been fun.

[@BimYGO]

yea cooked from all sides for now