whose the real baby daddy? 🥸 r/AITA

In this week's AITA we explore baby daddys, family thanksgiving drama, gym buddies, and baby vs cat (eep!) grab a cuppa let's go fishing x
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[@nergregga]

The woman who told the expecting mother to get rid of her cats, and then turned the entire office against her, is the asshole, and a major one at that.

[@milksheihk]

My cats can come & go, they'll go outside to do their business.

[@hexonyou]

And you can literally get a test from the doctor to see if you already have antibodies against toxoplasmosis; I did when I was pregnant and since I had the antibodies already (from growing up around a cat), I was a lot safer from that danger as a pregnant person at the time. Still wasn't going to go digging through the cat litter or anything, but it's just not the huge red flag this woman makes it even if we were trying to play devils advocate (not that anyone has been)

[@Lucifersfursona]

“Oh you have a second child coming? Well you should get rid of your first child! It’s for safety, what if they don’t get along? Put the first kid up for adoption” Actually terrible

[@mippa]

The woman clearly has a cat-hating agenda or is a "frenemy" who is raining on the pregnant OP's parade. Total asshole. I'm the daughter of a veterinarian and have a happy, healthy five-year-old girl and have had four cats for almost the entirety of my pregnancy/upbringing of her.

[@ChaquetaB]

I wondered what kind of crazy pills she took. Plenty of people have cats while pregnant and just have their partner change the litter. I have a dog, and we just made sure to watch him very closely when the baby first arrived. I've never heard of anyone getting rid of a pet just because they're pregnant (only occasionally after the baby came and there were issue with pet hurting/endangering baby - and those people were very upset to have to do that).

[@fifinoir]

Doing the gardening has more risk of toxoplasmosis than changing a cat litter tray that you know you’ll wash your hands straight after. Did they tell her she should get rid of all outdoor soil or she’s a bad mother? In actual fact, safely having pets around growing children can have positive health benefits like lower allergy risks so….

[@adrienstarfaer]

Also, sometimes the cats will be caring. I'm not saying this is a necessarily common thing, but when I was a newborn, my mom's cat would pace back and forth between me and my parents when I was crying, as if she was trying to hurry them along in taking care of my needs.

[@fifinoir]

@@adrienstarfaerwell that’s the sweetest thing ever. Love your mom’s cat.

[@thesaltycat9493]

The lower allergy risks are a serious benefit (at least in my case). I've had cats my entire life and so has my mother. A few years ago we went to the allergist to figure out what was causing me a certain allergic reaction. Long story short, the doctor got sidetracked when he saw that I reacted slightly to the cat and dog allergen pricks. They have NOTHING to do with my symptoms, and he admitted it, but he went on a whole tangent saying we should get rid of any pets we have. The nurse helping us even disagreed with him on this and once he was done ranting he and the other practitioners let us know that I'd built up an immunity to those allergies. Anyways, that's how we found out that I am technically allergic to cats and dogs, but I've built up an immunity to them because I've been around them my entire life. So I've never had symptoms, or at least severe symptoms, and I'm likely (hopefully) never going to. The human body is very interesting like that.

[@starparodier91]

@@adrienstarfaerI was born into a household of eight cats, and one of them was a kitten and around the same age as me and really bonded with my mom and I. There’s pics of my mom holding me in one arm and him in the other.

[@SlothDaan]

I came here to say the same thing about gardening. I have never heard people talk about the fact that pregnant women shouldn't be gardening!

[@samantharose7951]

With the gym one, I find it super weird he didn’t tell her. If it was me it would be the first thing out of my mouth when I got home, like “hey I saw your sibling at the gym today, we did a little workout together it was fun!” Or something like that

[@SlothDaan]

I find it even worse that when it came up, he wanted to avoid the whole situation and actually not tell. For me, that is the red flag.

[@s.a.4358]

⁠@@SlothDaanagree with you both. Fiancé’s reaction definitely indicates that the omission was not an oversight and OP not knowing was the idea. Why hide something like that unless there is something to hide? Even if it is a fairly innocent reason, such as the sister asking fiancé not to tell because she doesn’t want to be pressured to therefore see OP more often, it’s still weird to hide something like that from one’s partner. I would feel super awkward seeing my partner’s family member more than they see them, without it being a known thing or a logical reason.

[@caroline0001]

Just the fact she knows he has a workout buddy signalizes that they have talked about it. How weird it is that in the conversation he just mention his “workout buddy” like “ today me and my workout buddy did this exercise” but it is someone she knows, which for me it would be “today me and (name of the sister) did this exercise” or whatever. Super, super weird!!

[@hexonyou]

agreed, it doesn't feel like something that would just 'slip your mind' if you've been workout partners for months... at some point you would've talked about it UNLESS you are specifically trying to avoid it/hide it. Which in that case..... a long significant side eye your way. Not only that, but him telling the OP that she was 'overreacting' immedaitely- yeah, it's not really a positive when the person realizes they slipped up and then tries to make you out to be the one in the wrong. While I'd like to say "we can never know for sure", my mind immediately goes to "he's manipulating you sis, get out of there"

[@lazypanda6023]

I feel like fiancee was worried about her becoming jealous

[@tarasandlinmusic]

Second One: The fact that Sarah wants Dan around and cites all his help makes me want to know if OP is pulling his weight with household tasks and childcare. From the narrative we have, it seems like OP is NTA, but I’ve also observed many dynamics where the parent who doesn’t do their fair share of daily tasks (often but not exclusively the husband in hetero contexts) has a lot of expectations around fun and bonding while the other parent is drowning in the work of parenting and other domestic tasks. The partner not doing their fair share often doesn’t realize this dynamic (at best-in abusive contexts, they may well recognize and take advantage of it). If OP is pulling his weight and wants to bond with his baby through those daily tasks of living, that’s great. But given the one-sided story we have and the hints at Sarah’s dissent, we should consider the possibility that OP only wants to do the fun part of raising a child, Sarah is overwhelmed, and Dan has been her lifeline. It’s presented here as though he keeps barging in of his own accord, but if Sarah wants him there (which it seems she does), it’s possible he’s even letting OP think he’s barging in, taking the blame to protect Sarah. Again, I hope this is not the context here, but once you’ve lived this it’s hard not to ask these questions. Either way, OP and Sarah need to have a conversation about why Sarah needs so much help.

[@agent57]

Yeah, for both this story and the previous one, the thing that has made me hesitate is that very little is said about what the woman in the relationship wants. Shaaba's very much been like "leave the new happy family alone" and I agree that people shouldn't overstay their welcome, but that's assuming both people are happy in the relationship.

[@agent57]

Mostly its just seemed like there's not great communication within the couple in both cases.

[@rahnigene5769]

Thanks for summing this up so well! This is the vibe I got from it as well. Of course we don’t know the whole story but it’s important to remember there may be more to it than OP is letting on

[@SlothDaan]

​@@agent57that's almost always the case with these AITA.

[@gymnasticsgirlie0647]

Agree with everything, except the very last bit about "why Sarah needs so much help". Even if OP and Sarah are both pulling their weights, which it sounds like OP might not be, Sarah needs so much help because humans evolved to raise children in large groups. The West has convinced parents that they are failing if they are struggling in a two-parent household, but this directly contradicts how our brains are equipped to raise kids. Dan could very well just be Sarah's "village", and that's ok. In the West up until 1-2 centuries ago and presently in other countries, extended female family members being a large part of child-rearing (i.e with the child for more than 20 hours a week) is not uncommon. In fact, I wonder if OP would be as mad about Dan's stay in their house if Dan was a woman.

[@Minyassa]

Why wouldn't Workout Guy not come home from the gym and tell his wife immediately "How cool is it that your sister goes to the gym? We're gonna work out together." I mean just because of the coincidence and family ties it would be mentionable. So the silence is...odd.

[@gyara7329]

Right? Definitely makes me think that there's an affair going on.

[@soraia_4383]

it seems like they've been friends for years. op saying that they only knew her sister was in law school because fiancé knew before everyone else was weird

[@catsmom129]

My only thought is, what if OP is prone to read too much into things? Then the silence is more understandable, though still not ideal.

[@TiffanyAllen1784]

Someone I know from high school decided her cat was going to become an outdoor cat when she became pregnant. The poor cat-who had no experience being outside-ended up being hit by a car. If you view an animal as a temporary pet until you have children, you shouldn’t have animals.

[@EmpressOfCatsup]

Especially dumb because the cat can't be exposed to toxo unless it goes outside. Unless you have mice in your house or feed your cat raw food, it isn't getting toxo in your house, and they only shed for a few weeks after exposure. The #1 way people get toxo is by eating undercooked meat.

[@SpatialHeather]

for the thanksgiving one, i'd also be REAL curious to know how much help the husband/brothers are doing when they go over early, because i know in a lot of families they'd just be sat at the tv watching sportsball while their wives/girlfriends are actually the ones cooking. Which is shitty on its own, but doubly so when the wives are the ones "married in" and its not really their family tradition but their husbands'. if they go to "his mom's" EVERY year, when do they make time for HER family and her traditions, or even have the space to make their own?

[@irisbear9421]

I wondered the same thing!

[@dragonfliesnh4204]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who had that question. It wouldn't surprise me if it was only the women. As a woman, that certainly doesn't sound like a good time if my significant other is in the other room just relaxing while I had to work. The people who hosts the Thanksgiving dinners I've been too always do all the cooking. I will ask what I can do to help and what to bring. Also I go over early to help but they are stubborn and don't usually accept my help. All the men also offer to help in one way or another. At my mom's house, both she and my stepdad does all the cooking. He LOVES to cook! Edit to add: my siblings and I all bring at least one dish or dessert to contribute.

[@esther5636]

I wanted to add to the thanksgiving situation. Hearing you explain you can choose to not take part once as long as it is ‘not every year’ made my heart sink a bit. As someone with a chronic disability my big anxiety is that this is how people would feel about me not partaking. Yes you can tap out once but more than that and you’re an asshole. It makes the hole chronic bit of disability so hard. We often think about health and specifically illness as ‘getting better’ but in many cases it either goes down or just stays sort of constant. Just really wanted to add this bit of perspective to your thoughtful discussion on these AITA topics. Lots of love (Edit for spelling)

[@animeartist888]

There was no mention of mental or physical health issues besides "being tired," so Shaaba was assuming OP wasn't going to need to skip the prep stage every year unless the "tiredness" was just an excuse to try to wiggle out of the work. My mother is chronically ill, and she's frequently not up for the large amounts of work and prep that are involved in making a big meal. None of the family holds it against her. In fact, we come over ahead of time, sometimes by several days. We help clean and cook and even grocery shop for her before these big events. When you've honestly got a chronic issue, the people who care about you should take that into account before judging you for not being able to help for as long or as much or in the same way as others. As long as you're doing your best to help and thanking everyone for their contributions, I really don't see any reason your able-bodied family members should feel like you aren't pulling your weight.

[@ivory7182]

I do think you get too caught up in the idea of a single family unit with parents, kids, and pets. Such as in the Dan situation, maybe the kid just grows up with close family friend Uncle Dan and that's okay. Mind you, that is very much a conversion that needs to happen between the parents first and that doesn't preclude the idea of some alone time and privacy. But that could still end up being a very sweet and functional dynamic.

[@adymlv]

As someone who has been dealing with severe burnout for a couple of years, Thanksgiving-OP is NTA for wanting to not be at her husband's family's home ALL DAY to prepare food with everyone else on her only extra day off when she's exhausted from an intense period at work. Yes, family and traditions are important, but you need to take care of yourself and be mindful of stress, just because it's not a physical illness, like a cold, doesn't mean it's not important to rest if and when you are able to. She isn't saying "I never want to help again", she's saying that this year she feels like she needs to prioritise her mental health, but she still wants to see everyone. I have absolutely done things like this, not because I don't want to help, but because I just don't have the energy, and the people in my life understands this and are happy just to see me at all.

[@SerenityRoses12]

I love how well your vet handled education regarding the cats!! I'm a veterinary student and can confirm - the risk of toxo is something to be aware of, but it's not as simple as "cats = toxo = dead fetus." Once you've been infected, the risk is very very low - and you can get your antibodies tested! Also, cats are often infected very early in life, and only shed for 1 week when they're initially infected - then they don't shed anymore. Best advice is to not get a kitten when you are expecting, but adult cats are almost never shedding. The risks are highest when doing things like gardening (stray/feral cats may defecate in garden beds) or cooking pork. The best thing you can do is cook your food thoroughly, wear gloves when gardening, have your partner scoop the litterbox, and CLEAN YOUR COUNTERS before prepping food. People forget that their cats have fecal matter on their feet and in their fur. It is impossible to keep them off the countertops (even if you don't see them on those surfaces, assume they get up there), and they get fecal matter everywhere. It's also important to protect your baby from other zoonotic infections as they age. Vets are experts on zoonotic diseases and can help you figure out what risks your family is exposed to.

[@missnaomi613]

Thank you for the reminder to wipe the counters before handling food!

[@faemomofdragons]

I'm taking issue on the Dan thing. Family is more than partners and children. My best friend was over every Sunday through Tuesday every week for years. She was much more helpful with my baby and toddler than my ex was. Saturdays my ex had one of his best friends over. I have a male best friend who lived across the country at the time or I would've expected him over. (To contextualize this, when I was growing up, we went to my grandparents' house every Saturday and Sunday, all day, starting when I was a baby, so I grew up sharing my weekends with family.) I hate that the first assumption is there is a fling. Men and women can be friends. Even if they are both heterosexual. OP should have a conversation with his wife. Maybe he isn't pulling his weight. Maybe he's an introvert. Maybe there are toxic dynamics in this relationship. But as Shaaba says Communication.

[@camillaanderson7464]

For the last one, I was honestly really shocked that everyone was saying that op was the a-hole for wanting to “reap the rewards” without helping at all. It might be because of my own experience with fatigue, exhaustion, and burnout, but if op is really that exhausted, I don’t feel like it’s that unreasonable of an ask. The prep/cooking part of Thanksgiving is THE most stressful and frustrating part of, like, almost any holiday. If it’s just for this one time, I see no problem with that. Also, I feel like a lot of people on the forum misconstrued the situation a bit-the MIL might be the one hosting, but it’s not like if op doesn’t help, MIL will be left alone. With all of the other siblings and spouses, there should be more than enough people to help and one person missing wouldn’t make that much of a difference. As another point, prep is a big part of Thanksgiving, but the actual consumption of the meal as well as the togetherness that that brings is also a major point of the holiday. This might just be projecting my own experience with my own family, but I feel like if they’re reasonable people, the rest of the family would be glad that op was able to join them for at least that part of it. All of that said, it would be a really good idea for op to talk and work things out directly with MIL, and i think bringing a dish and/or coming to help with set up is a also a really good idea. It just really rubbed me the wrong way when ppl were saying that op was being lazy or entitled.

[@alex_blue5802]

The story with the bread that Shaaba mentioned is a metaphor. Acting like someone can't eat at the table unless they personally helped seems like a very stingy view of family togetherness and holiday meals. Everyone has different things going on and you'd hope people could be flexible with their loved ones and still want them to be present for the occasion. Do people really think that OP's mother-in-law would prefer her son didn't show up for Thanksgiving at all?

[@Serenity_yt]

As someone mentioned above I would also really want to know if the men help cook or if it's just MIL wifes and sisters because in that cause husband isnt the one that would have to do the work. He could just help out instead of his wife so she could rest while they still contributed the normal amount there's lots of nuance we aren't getting there.

[@aprildawnsunshine4326]

As someone with an invisible illness and dysfunctional family that "princess" comment cut me deep! Even when they decided to "believe" me and stopped demanding I help then berate me for a terrible job I still had to take all the "jokes" and comments about me being an entitled brat. It wouldn't surprise me if either his family or he himself, behind closed doors, behaved in a similar manner. She could very well have an undiagnosed illness and the reaction of the forum is not uncommon ime.

[@alex_blue5802]

@@aprildawnsunshine4326 for what it's worth I thought that person was way out of line. Family should want to do things for each other and help each other.

[@16poetisa]

For the last story, I suspect there's some gendered issues at play. Often, most Thanksgiving food prep is done by the women in the family, and the men only handle cooking the turkey. So OP's husband might not have to do as much work as OP, in which case he's likely to take his mom's side - especially if there's the general sense that the women are *supposed* to help out more than the men. Also, OP's in-laws' tradition seems a bit controlling about the food. In many families, like mine for instance, every household brings a couple of dishes to the event, either ready-made or mostly prepped and just needing to be tossed in the oven for a bit. Not allowing guests to bring contributions of their own, but requiring them to spend all day in the kitchen making the food from scratch, is... a bit excessive. That's why it comes across to me as controlling, unless there's some dietary considerations OP failed to mention (like allergies or celiac).

[@mirazenker1203]

Mmm... I see your point but I kind of disagree with you. In my family we don't celebrate thanksgiving but do a similar thing around Christmas where we all gather together to make the food at my parents house. It's a fun time, we share family stories, we listen to songs, we play games and we end it all with the meal. So the eating part is actually not the most important thing. The preparation is the thing. We don't know what the situation is in OPs case of course. She didn't really tell us much about the preparation process other than that she "has to" show up. We don't really know if OP just doesn't want to take part in a tradition or if it's like you said and OP is forced to work at her in-laws. However, even with all that I've said, I still don't think OP is the asshole. If you don't want to participate then you don't have to. That's how it is in my family as well. (But then I would find it slightly weird that she would still want to come to the dinner, at that point I would say just don't go this year and chill at home :))

[@HighAsHeckPriestess]

​@@mirazenker1203unfortunately, that is generally how Thanksgiving is done :( a leftover artifact of the original mass murder day is the misogyny in meal prep. My family was the same before my mom and her wife got married (where now the whole family is women, so there's no do-nothing men getting underfoot trying to taste stuff)

[@16poetisa]

@@mirazenker1203 I see your point too. For us the eating is the most important part, so no one cares if you bring some rolls or pie pre-made and skip the kitchen altogether, although the women do tend to do most of the table-setting, dish-cleaning, and breakdown work *sigh*

[@mirazenker1203]

@@16poetisa that sounds kinda bad, I sometimes forget I'm in a really privileged position where my family is just full of supporting and loving people. I hope OP was able to get things sorted out...

[@alistercat]

yeah in my family the women do all the cooking including the turkey and the men just sit on their ass watching football so I can see how that would be irritating if his family is similar

[@IAmContemporary]

Re: Dan the 3rd Wheel Man - With stories like this I always wonder what the spouse’s perspective is. It could just as well be that OP expects the fun & bonding time of being a new parents, but isn’t being a supportive partner in all the other aspects of family life (housework, assisting his wife through postpartum, etc.). Sara may have felt more supported by her friend than by OP, which is why she likes having him around. Not saying that her response to his concerns is productive in any way, but I can see why she’d defend someone that has helped more help than OP has.

[@incantrix1337]

For me, it's a huge red flag is when people are like "you're overreacting" before you've even had a chance to react.

[@Whateverhasbeenmynameforyears]

I get really frustrated with the idea that someone who is not a parent is not qualified to give advice. There are many people who have done plenty of parenting and not had children of their own.

[@maurinet2291]

If you're in charge of a child, you're parenting regardless of biology. But there is a LOT of parenting advice from people who last were around children when they were one. Maybe except for brief interactions at family gatherings.

[@dragonfliesnh4204]

I agree. I've been around many kids. I used to help my mom with her daycare, had babysat a LOT, volunteered at a youth center, etc. If it's something I don't know much about, I won't say anything. There are some things I have experience with, I may offer suggestions on tips to try, but only if it seems like it'll be well received by the person. It's NOT my place to insist they do things a certain way. If they decide not to try the tips, it's nothing personal as everyone is different, including the kids.

[@winterwolf0100]

My mom tells this story of how she was sick with the flu, and her mother-in-law forced her to get up with a fever and help cook Thanksgiving. In contrast, my dad got a headache and his mother told him to go lay down.

[@animeartist888]

Sounds about right. 'Murica, land of the mysogyny and home of the bigot. Household expectations were a little more balanced in my family, but it was always the women who did all the cooking for big holiday meals like Thanksgiving.

[@SarahBent]

With the Dan situation i would have to wonder how much the OP is actually doing around the house. So many men think they are 50/50 doing stuff and they just arent. Dan may be actually pulling your weight OP.

[@sassylittleprophet]

This is my thought as well. When I was with my ex-husband, he expected me to do most of the housework and cooking while I was working a 4 days a week, 8 hours a day job...and I was *heavily* depressed at the time and dealing with a shit ton of trauma from childhood abuse. I also got married when I was 19. I'm thankful I never got pregnant and was able to get out because I probably would've stayed. I already know he wouldn't have done shit to help because "that's woman's work." A lot of guys don't help out and their wives end up doing 85-100% of the housework because it's very much invisible work that they're accustomed to having done and not having to do themselves. ("Alexa, play 'Labour' by Paris Paloma.")

[@skypancake7]

there's a reason why there's the stereotype of Thankgiving being full of family drama lol

[@soundlessbee]

I would say that in the second story and in the previous similar one, Dan and the OP weren't really the problem, but more of a symptom. In both cases it seemed that one of the couple wanted the extra person there and the other one didn't. In my opinion, it should be between the couple to come to a solution together and then speak to the third person. I'm sure not many people would appreciate it, if their partner went to tell their friend or family member they weren't wanted around. Like if this was from Sarah's point of view, wouldn't the OP look like the AH: Me and my partner just had a baby and my best friend has been helping a lot, coming over on the weekends so we can rest. My husband said he doesn't want my friend over as much, because he wants to spend some "quality time" with me and the baby, but I really could use the extra help. Once as my friend came over, my husband got mad at him and told him to leave. I defended my friend and we got into an argument. My husband refused to see my side, so I left with my friend to cool down a bit. I think that the OP should have a serious conversation to get to the bottom of why she wants Dan there all the time and to figure out a compromise. Also maybe he should think, if he's not taking equal responsibility as his wife is. I would like to know what's the situation with the parents, like are one or both of them working and is the housework shared equally. Unfortunately dad doing anything with their child, is still often seen as great effort and mum is seen as the primary caregiver. If the OP is only wanting "quality time" with the baby and all the work is left for Sarah, I can see, why she wants Dan around. I might be naive, but it didn't even pop into my head that Dan might be the baby's father. Maybe he's just exited that his best friend has a baby and he gets to be an uncle.

[@MorgenPeschke]

​@theashwoodfaerie then, speaking as someone with 4 kids, he's doing a crap job at being a dad, and not being a particularly good husband either. There's literally no downside to this situation that isn't of OP's own making. Having someone willing to come over and help with the baby consistently enough that they know how things are done and can be trusted to actually do them is a godsend. We didn't have that, so it took like 6 months after each kid before things were back on track well enough to have time to ourselves, and OP is _wasting_ what could be a gift in their lives. They can go on dates, without having new parent anxiety because they know their kid is in good hands. That's beyond priceless. OP is being a jealous fool, and it's honestly really sad

[@soundlessbee]

@theashwoodfaerie I agree with the previous person, who replied to you that it's well known that being a new parent is difficult and help should be appreciated. If OP doesn't think they need help, but his wife does, then obviously he should be doing more. But whatever the issue is, he should be talking to his wife about it, as I already said, and they need to come up with the solution. I'm sure that the exhaustion of being new parents, isn't making things any easier, but declining help that your spouse wants, is hardly a solution. Maybe they should ask Dan to look after the baby, so they can take a nap and then discuss about the situation.

[@solsystem1342]

First off, I should be honest and just say having a Dan in my life (if I ever hypothetically raised kids) would be goals. I think it's great to have more parental figures around kids whether that's grandparents, other family, friends, or poly parents. I was extremely close with my grandparents as a kid and that was super valuable for me. I think it's sad that op didn't just talk to their partner about what was bothering them like "hey, this is how I'm feeling can we talk about xyz because it's bothering me and idk what you are thinking?" Would just have probably completly avoided the blow up fight😅

[@solsystem1342]

​@theashwoodfaerie He's there, sometimes, over the weekend. I hope that isn't the extent of when op wanted to help raise their kid (baring ya know a bonkers work schedule or something).

[@inuendo6365]

For Thanksgiving; family dynamics are at thier WORST during the prep/cooking. The "bossy" ones are the most unbearable because they become tyrants over the smallest pinch of salt, the loud annoying ones are even louder to be heard over the clanging and the lazy ones (usually the husbands) find ways to get out of any hard tasks by taking a long time with simple tasks or disappearing into the corner with a beer. In my experience it's the families who expect tradition to be upheld who are the biggest AHs... and usually the anti LGBT ones to boot. I agree with the suggestion that if OP really wants to go, at least offer to buy a dish and help with the simpler prep to avoid being the AH. Otherwise just don't go, it's not worth the guilting/shaming later on

[@mikaylaeager7942]

#2 Ok. I agree that dad was absolutely NOT out of line to ask for bonding time with his brand new family. It seems like he was communicating and being shot down by his wife which is not ok. HOWEVER… I don’t think it’s anyones business what the friend’s sexuality is!!! I think it’s super heteronormative to jump to conclusions about an opposite gender friend when we wouldn’t even consider it were this a close girlfriend! Reddit loves creating soap operas out of these AITA questions. It is far more likely that the wife considers this guy to be a part of her family and has for a long time. Just like you shouldn’t have to kick out your cats when you have a baby, you should not have to reject your found family just because you’ve created a blood family. Personally, Reddit is the absolute last place I’d go for sane relationship advice

[@violet7773]

Shaaba also immediately wondered if Dan and the wife had previously been involved, which is also so presumptuous :/

[@MorgenPeschke]

​@@violet7773and also doesn't really matter. If they dated in the past, that doesn't mean they are or were having an affair

[@mikaylaeager7942]

@@MorgenPeschke Exactly! There are people in my life that I consider family now that I was “involved with” in the past, even if briefly. I would absolutely not be getting rid of them were I to start dating someone else nor would I consider it a priority to inform the new partner of our entire relationship history. Just because your f**king someone doesn’t entitle you to every part of their past or present life.

[@Shamazya]

I'd go to Reddit for... Perspective. I don't really trust Reddit advice but it can be a really good place for getting points of view that aren't your own. Granted you have to do a bit of digging if it gets popular.

[@demial4]

My parents had their cat put down before I was born because my mother was afraid she would sleep on top of me. It wasn't until years later that it really sunk in what that meant and how awful a decision it was. Is it any surprise that my mother gave me childhood trauma, too?? Lol i have my own cats now and i dread the day they will inevitably pass away

[@Magic_Skeleton]

It really shows how awful they are to choose to kill the poor kitty rather than giving them to a shelter.

[@jennivamp5]

26:10 both can definitely be true. I am a big old introvert and I can find it difficult to spend a lot of time with my husband's rather large family. It's definitely something I have to gear myself up for and if I'm tired or have had a lot of other stressful stuff going on, I just don't have the spoons to spend a whole day with that many people, family or not. Add on top of it my hearing impairment that means I have to concentrate very hard to understand what any of them are saying and I'm exhausted after 5 minutes on a good day.

[@starparodier91]

I’m a big introvert and an only child and my family has always kept to ourselves for the most part, but my fiancé is from a huge family so it’s been difficult. We’re both autistic as well but he’s very extroverted. I’m still getting used to it and getting better but it’s still a lot. I also have extremely mild cerebral palsy so I take longer to get ready so that really drains me too.

[@AnnabethOwl]

For me it’s really stressful to hold a productive conversation with someone(I recently found out I’m neurodivergent) that I try to avoid big events and if I go to a big event I’ll admit im a jerk the day after because I’m so exhausted from trying to appear “normal” and hold a conversation.

[@buttaflueblu]

I made my daughter a Moses basket net to stop my three cats wanting to get in with her. It was strong enough to withstand two of them sleeping on top of the net. Ultimately, so long as you're sensible and don't leave cats and baby alone you'll probs be okay. Pets are family.

[@aeryngoodspeed]

i honestly can't fathom not thanking someone for cooking. yeah even if i buy the food or even if i read off the recipe for them, they're still helping me by cooking. that's still work they're putting in. even if i buy the chicken nuggets and all they do is stick it in the air fryer, they've made it so i don't have to get up so they deserve a thank you XD

[@zenleeparadise]

I'm a professional cook and I'll have you know that it's largely a thankless job. At least where I live. So it's nice to hear that some people have some respect for it

[@aeryngoodspeed]

@@zenleeparadise bruh you're literally providing the means for someone else's survival AND making it enjoyable while you're at it, that merits a lot more than just gratitude

[@zenleeparadise]

​@@aeryngoodspeedawe thanks ❤❤ I am pretty proud of my work even if I only hear an occasional thanks from a server I hooked up with dinner lol I wish I could interact with the people I'm feeding but also I get the sense it's not as pleasant as it sounds in my head, at least from the impression the servers give haha our customers are apparently a nightmare to deal with

[@jofawkes]

100%

[@irisbear9421]

Yes! Any help should at least be acknowledged. Cooking is hard work. Especially for a large amount of people

[@zZizify]

I have opinions on Dan being a third wheel in the new parents lifes. Possibly because I, myself is a Dan with my friends. First off, I find it weird that so many jumped to the conclusion that Dan might be the father. I feel like that wouldn't be an issue of concern if the mama's friend wasn't a dude. It is however weird that Dan gives unsolicited advice and it's something the dad should bring up. It's also not ok that Dan turned up unannounced. But that's basically it. I'm hanging out at least once a week with my friends, who have 2 toddlers. I happen to be friends with both parents and it's very clear that me coming over is on their terms. That might be the difference here. What we don't know here is if Dan has asked the baby mama to come over, each of those weekends, and it's actually a lack of communication between the parents that's the problem here. Maybe Dan and the dad needs to get to know each other better, for the dad to be more comfortable having him around. My friends are very much my chosen family and I love to help out with their lil squishes. Maybe it's something similar going on for Dan here.

[@soraia_4383]

the reason why it wouldn't be an issue of concern if mama's friend was a lady is because if both of them are cis ladies, they can't have a kid together unsless if they went through the medical options that I'm not going to dive into right now. They could have an affair though, but that wouldn't result in a baby that easily. That concern comes also because we don't know anything about their history and it's hard to understand from the post why sarah isn't respecting her husband's boundaries. After they had this discussion, she left with Dan instead of asking Dan to leave so they could talk about this privately. It's like she's acting more like Dan's partner than op's. And that doesn't prove anything, but the behaviour is not ok. Reddit being reddit, they will always jump to the worst conclusion possible. It could be that op is not helping out with the kid as much and dan is doing that. Even if Dan had asked Sarah if he could come, the post reads as if that decision is not being made by the two of them every weekend, only by Sarah. Which wouldn't be Dan's fault but would also make no difference deciding if op is TA. Plus, even if op got to know Dan better and felt more comfortable, op might not want to have him around anyway and that's fine too. I'm not sure every couple would want their best friend over every weekend for months in a moment when they're trying to figure out this new family dynamic even if some couples would love it. I think both Sarah and Dan are being a-holes. Sarah needs to act like a partner and either communicate that she's having a hard time with the work division or be more open to op's opinions on how to spend family time. If I were in Dan's place, I'd be checking with both my close friend and her partner if they are ok with this.

[@flibbertygibbette]

With the Thanksgiving one, I feel for the OP. When my parents were still alive, my partner and I would split our Thanksgiving between our two families, and since mine was closer than my partner's, we would do the early part of the day with my family and then head to my sister-in-law's house for the dinner portion. We would show up at her house an hour or so before dinner and then spend the rest of the evening there (everyone else would show up in the late morning to spend the whole day there). One year she told us that she wanted us to come only to her house for the whole day, or to not come at all. And this wasn't about food prep-she didn't let anyone help. This was just about having everyone there the whole day. Basically, all I'm saying is, sometimes people get a little crazy around holidays and big celebrations.

[@barrylangille3523]

As to testing for toxoplasmosis, yes. This includes the mother. If mom has had toxo she's immune and therefore there's no risk to an unborn child. If the cat(s) have had it they will be immune as well. There is also a limited window when toxo can do damage to a fetus, so that cuts down on the time when exposure is a risk. It's a risk to the unborn child, yeah, but not the death sentence the cat haters would have you believe.

[@zenleeparadise]

I appreciate the information, as a person who may have a kiddo one day ❤

[@SlothDaan]

People also forget to mention that gardening has the same risk. Maybe even higher because there's poo of all sorts of animals.

[@pencilpauli9442]

Is it that the daughter-in-law gets invited to do some meal prep, and the son also preps the food, or is it just the women folk? Because if the latter, MIL may be a stay at home wife, but DIL is working a job. And just because something is a tradition, it doesn't mean it is a good tradition. More info required.

[@Ayame0ki]

For the last one, I totally get the "thank you" part and agree with her. "Thank you" don't mean you did something outside of what was except of you, it just means the other appreciate the effort. My husband do the meal every day because it's part of our deal. None the less, I thanks him for it pretty often, just to show love appreciation and all my happiness that came from his action. In the same way, I thanks people for visiting me AND thanks them to receiving me.

[@Jupiter-ng1yi]

That lady in the first one would probably think my parents are terrible people then. My family adopted a cat when I was little, and we soon discovered my sister and I were allergic (me much more severely though) but we kept the cat anyway. I actually ended up growing out of my allergy because we had her for like 10 years. We had to put her down this summer since she was like 17 and had a UTI, kidney disease, and thyroid disease. She’ll forever be missed.

[@animeartist888]

Poor kitty is resting in peace now. She did her part in the family. Now she gets to chase mice and nap all day in kitty heaven.

[@petrastedman669]

For the 2nd story, I can't be the only person who at least momentarily thought maybe Dan is the bio dad... At the same time, one of my friends had her cousin (female) basically move in with them for the first 4 months of her child's life. She just wanted the help, and it was either the cousin or her MIL, but the cousin got a little over-attached until the husband stepped in to establish boundaries.

[@iarlondwen]

I have three cats. One of which found us when I was pregnant last year. All three still sleep with us on the bed. My partner cleaned the litter boxed during pregnancy. We put the co sleeper up early and bought one of the structured net covers for it. The cats were super interested at first but soon learned, with gentle removal, that it was not for them. Another friend used tin foil in the crib/cot, and another balloons. All of these have worked well. I also talked to my vet and made sure I could use a veterinary grade food that calms cats down. Point is, lots of options and prep that can be done to minimize risk to you and baby without getting rid of a family member.

[@Silentgrace11]

As someone who lives in a family where Thanksgiving is a living hell, and was even worse of a living hell when everyone was expected to cook at my grandmas rather than bringing their own contributions, I definitely empathize with the 4th poster. It takes a lot of physical and emotional energy to deal with a lot of people cooking in a kitchen all at once, especially when one or several of those people are controlling when it comes to the way things are done (and I also get how that can be from the other side - I’m relatively calm when cooking, but when I’m baking a cake or pie or something most people know to stay tf away because I will fight someone if they mess something up lolol. But likewise I don’t harbor the expectation for other people to help me bake - I even deliberately do my baking later in the evening so I’m not inconveniencing others. ) And that’s ofc even assuming the bossiness and struggle is the issue here - the OP may just generally be tired. The fact that she wasn’t outright against the idea of communicating with MIL suggests that MIL is at least somewhat amicable. I definitely think communicating with MIL and bringing a dish in return is a reasonable compromise - admittedly even when I realize I’m falling ill leading up to Thanksgiving I will often make sure there is at least a pie to send out as my contribution as I rest and recover at home that day lol. But at least that beats dealing with family while being ill.

[@foolishalie]

I have autism and if I was in the last person’s situation I also would not have the energy to be there the hole day, and so I can definitely understand that they don’t have the energy to be there the hole day, I would’ve have asked if I could make part of the meal at home were I can take brakes, but that’s just my opinion

[@Imjustkendall]

Sameeeee

[@dasha_ucko]

For the last one, I think it really depends on who's expected to cook on Thanksgiving. If it's literally everyone, then OP is most like the asshole. But if "everyone" really just means all of the women (as is very common for Thanksgiving), then I can see why OP would be frustrated with the family's tradition

[@purringlion]

For the last situation, it seems OP's partner would be arriving with the guests. Why isn't HE expected to help out? Is it because he's a man? If so, "family tradition" sounds like just a way to be misogynistic.

[@maxc.2411]

Op clarifies in the comments that everyone in the family joins in on the cooking

[@chronicAngel]

I didn't get that impression at all. It sounds like the entire family helps out, including husband, and OP wants unique privilege.

[@AnnabethOwl]

@@chronicAngelI agree with the whole family helps out part but not the fact she just wants special privilege…. If she is actually tired and burnt out(I’ve been there) then it makes sense to not spend the whole day there. I can’t spend the whole day doing something without maxing out my people time and snapping at people. In some of the comments she seemed willing to bring something later in the day(that’s how my family does it we all have special dishes we make at home and bring) so i don’t think it was just privilege

[@catT5236]

Story 3: I think I woukd find it pretty weird if I only saw my sibling once a month but my fiancé was seeing them on a weekly basis. So that on it's own is a bit weird but obviously the lying is the main issue. If it's innocent why lie? You have to actively work to not bring that up. Also find it pretty weird the sister didn't tell her family about getting into law school, which I note is the same school as OP's fiancé (seems a bit fishy in context with the rest). That's a huge thing to not tell your family about. If you really aren't close at all & LC then it's even more weird that sister & fiancé are hanging out for hours at a time every single week.

[@s.a.4358]

The fact that the fiancé and sister go to the same gym also implied that they live fairly close to each other (fiancé was at home before going to the gym, so it’s probably not a gym for example close to his work which may be far from the home), so why is OP seeing her sister so infrequently? Of course it could be that everyone has busy lives, but if I were the sister I would maybe pop over for a quick hello after the gym, or as the partner I would be like “hey I know you don’t see your sister often, but she goes to my gym so how about you meet us there one evening and we go for a quick drink or dinner?” There seems to be something strange about the sister not communicating, not seeing her family a lot, etc. And it is strange that the fiancé, knowing that, isn’t communicating the fact that he sees the sister regularly. It could be a completely innocent coincidence that they go to the same gym, but the fact that there is no communication is weird. I would be like, like hey I know your sister is hard to get hold of but guess what, she actually goes to my gym. How random!

[@sapphodyl]

The gym one is giving me some extra red flags over the fact that fiancé seems to have become the family’s source of news on the sister. OP stated that fiancé off-handedly mentioned that sister got into law school, which is how everyone else found out, and (I think?) OP assumed he heard because he’s also in law school. That makes me wonder if he learned about it during their shared workout sessions, or if maybe he & sister also (secretly?) study or go to school together. In either case, it strikes me as suspicious that sister is so private and/ or forgetful with everyone except the fiancé. Workout partner politics aside, something seems seriously fishy about the secrecy of their relationship.

[@roswell5065]

To me it read as if maybe sister and family were estranged and the guy just happened to be a friend of hers. OP says they don't know anything about sister's life and she doesn't talk about herself - gives me "The family doesn't approve of xyz" vibes. If he knew her in law school and he knows her in the gym maybe he's just not trying to get entangled in whatever argument led a woman to go such low contact with the rest of her family?

[@sapphodyl]

@@roswell5065 I didn’t really get that vibe, but maybe. Still doesn’t explain why the fiancé would choose to keep so many secrets from his own partner, despite staying with her. If he’s gonna so blatantly and heavily chose the sister over his own partner, and/ or hide entire relationships in his life from her because of disagreements, that’s also a big red flag. That’s not really what I would call healthy partnership.

[@smarie3874]

Just a note on toxoplasmosis, cats don’t tend to carry it if they don’t eat raw meet (hence indoor cats being lower risk). So, if you are looking into adopting a kitty and are planning a family (or have medical issues) adopt a cat that you can be reasonably sure of it’s history/diet. I worry about this not being common knowledge, especially with raw diets being a trend these days.

[@GraupeLie]

The first one already makes me so, so angry! I've had cats all my life, my family has always had cats - there's NEVER been an issue with pregnancy and cats! As the OP pointed out, one can be careful, the partner can clean the litter boxes and gloves exist! Also, I'm completely with you there, Shaaba, I'd love to rescue all the cats out there. Also agree with OP that animals are NOT disposable. They are family, and it's beyond me how some people just say they "have to get rid of them" just because they're expecting a child.

[@savannah4439]

Important clarification: yes, it’s perfectly fine to have cats while pregnant and there’s no need to get rid of them. However, it’s wrong (and potentially dangerous) to spread the misinformation that there’s “*never* been an issue with pregnancy and cats”. Toxoplasmosis is spread through cat feces and is a potentially serious condition for a fetus. The mom may be asymptomatic or have very mild infection, but in the fetus it can cause brain lesions, seizures, eye problems, and deafness. The risk of getting Toxo is pretty low, but bc the potential impact is very serious it’s still important to take precautions. That doesn’t mean getting rid of your cats, but it’s best to avoid changing the litter box, avoid gardening, and wash countertops before preparing food (bc cats spread microscopic fecal particles onto the counters). Second best is to wear gloves while changing litter/gardening with hand washing afterwards. Keep loving your fur babies! Just be safe about it

[@jintym2951]

I soft disagree on the last post that to be too tired from the job next year at Thanksgiving after being too tired this year would make OP a bit of an A-hole. This is basically because I'm approaching my 17th holiday season in retail, and can confirm that I am exhausted throughout this period every year. Not simply because it's more hours and labour, but it's mentally & emotionally draining also. I mean last year I wound up forced to take time off in the middle of it because I was literally crying over nothing and becoming dizzy all the time - ended up on medication for Labyrinthitis hence the need for time off. So if OP's job is similarly super constantly busy at that time of year, I can entirely appreciate the dread of having to get up early on the single guaranteed day off, to help and then socialise with additional people later on, and probably not leave until past midnight, probably having to be up for work again next day. I love my family so deeply and always turn out to help them, but this situation as an annual loop, where tradition tops someone's exhaustion, "fair's fair, no exceptions last bum" would be a true nightmare scenario for me 😅

[@coelacanthropology]

hiya shaaba! for thanksgiving, i think the most basic staples are turkey (of course), mashed potatoes, gravy, biscuits (what you call scones i think?), stuffing, cranberry sauce, and pie- usually pumpkin but pecan is also common! other popular foods, depending on region and personal preferences include things like green bean casserole, oysters or some kind of seafood (that's more of an east coast thing i think lol), any number of different ways to serve vegetables (in my experience there's usually at least one salad AND some roasted veggies, which could include carrots), and my personal favorite, sweet potato casserole! mmmm sweet potato casserole... it might sound weird if you've never had it but sweet potato casserole usually involves sweet potatoes, butter, brown sugar, and a layer of marshmallows on the top! they get all toasty and gooey in the oven and they taste so good with the sweet potatoes. any reason to have sweet potato casserole is a good reason. you should definitely try sweet potato casserole shaaba.

[@spectilia]

Apple is also a popular pick for the pie option! My family also has sugar pies, but I think that one is pretty niche. Was also curious if mac and cheese makes a regular appearance for folks, or if that is similarly specific to my lot. But oysters, really? How fascinating! It's fun to learn about other regional traditions.

[@savannah4439]

Chiming in to add baked Mac & Cheese!

[@coelacanthropology]

@@spectilia omg i can't believe i forgot apple pie lol! mac and cheese isnt something ive heard of as a thanksgiving dish, but i believe it! i love mac and cheese mmm. also yeah, my family has never had oysters or any kind of seafood for thanksgiving but we had a family friend from the east coast who apparently always had oysters at thanksgiving growing up, and i guess its somewhat common there? i dont really get the appeal but i know theres a lot of regional variation lol.

[@HighAsHeckPriestess]

Don't forget the baked mac and cheese!!! With 4 cheeses and topped with Cheeto crumbs🤤🤤🤤

[@HighAsHeckPriestess]

​@@coelacanthropologyi think baked mac and cheese is popular in the black community and among some southern folks. My family makes it every year as a competition where everyone spends a year perfecting the family recipe to see who does it better

[@ffs_]

I feel like the difference between Dan and the sister who lived with the couple in the previous story is 1. She's moved in and is a relative, so I see her equivalent to grandma moving in, not a friend of just one half of the couple. 2. The kids were older, so they should already have an established relationship and dynamic with both parents. In both stories it sounds like one half of the couple is really enjoying the support - but I feel like when it comes to a new baby they haven't had a chance to sort out how their relationship to each other has changed and what they need to do to support each other, whereas in the sister story it felt like maybe the couple just didn't have a solid relationship to start with and the sister's help and attentiveness showed how the husband lacked those things.

[@ilanarhian]

I grew up with a cat who was 2 years older than me, no way my parents would have got rid of her when I was born. The cat was very protective of my sister and me and would keep a beady eye on our babysitters. I think it is good for children to have animals from when they are little so they learn how to treat them.

[@henrysansone5501]

Your song was so lovely! I listened when it came out and had it stuck in my head all afternoon. ✨ I think it’s cool that you’re not only making music, but sharing it with all of us too! Looking forward to the rest of the album. 🎉

[@sarahnicol6855]

I added it to a play list after hearing it that's how good I thought it was. Thanks for sharing your art with us all ❤

[@killer_rabbit42]

For the first story, completely agree they're NTA. The soon to be mother is aware of the possible issue & is taking precautions. There's no reason to get rid of furry family members in that situation. I've had cats almost my entire life & I can't think of any situation in which I would just get rid of them. I would sooner stop talking to some of the people in my life than get rid of my cats. 2:25 Yes, I agree. If I could move to Aoshima (Cat Island) in Japan, I would😺 4:58 Because cats are curious & like to sit everywhere, there was an old wives' tale that cats steal a baby's soul or a baby's breath, which contributed to them being associated with witches. 20:16 Thanksgiving dinners can vary depending on where in the United States you are, but the usual menu items include: turkey, mashed potatoes, stuffing, gravy, vegetables, cranberry sauce, & pumpkin pie for dessert. And, contrary to popular belief, the tryptophan in turkey isn't enough to make you tired, the reason you usually get tired after eating Thanksgiving dinner is because of how much you eat. You're body needs to divert energy to digest all that food, leading to you want to sleep. (Thanks Mythbusters for testing this).

[@raspberryitalia3464]

Story 1. I have 5 rescue cats with my husband, and we're starting to think about kids, and the idea of getting rid of our pets has never once crossed my mind. It sounds like an old wives tale or like something Frenchie from Our Flag Means Death would say (cats are witches and they steal children's breath!) We'll need to make adjustments and stay on top of things, but babies and cats have existed together for thousands of years. It's gonna be OK lol Story 2. I want to hear the wife's side of the story immediately. Has the husband asked his wife if she feels her mental, emotional, social, and litetal needs are being met, or is he just upset because he's possessive? Is the husband doing fuck all so she feels she has to rely on Dan or she'll get no help? Is the husband only bent out of shape because the BFF is a man? Has he worried about this friendship in the past? If this was MIL or a female friend, would he care that they were over on the weekends? Tbh, weekend visits from friends are absolutely vital to new mothers so that they don't feel isolated or lose their sense of identity to motherhood. I also think sometimes people's family portraits can shift and change as life goes on. The individualistic idea of family is a lie of capitalism. We all need each other. Dan isn't over every day, he hasn't moved in. He's hanging out on the weekends, and he IS being invited by the new mother, who clearly feels she needs this support. Showing up unannounced is the only wrongdoing I can see. That's fucked up no matter who you are lol 3. My instinct is that fiancé has a crush on the sister, which is why he didn't say anything and felt guilty when he slipped up. Idk if any cheating has happened, but he deliberately hid who his work out partner was, and that's the red flag 4. The foundational pillars of a Thanksgiving meal are turkey, mashed potatoes, gravy, and stuffing. All these things can vary in flavors and styles, and there's usually some kind of other vegetable situation going on too - green beans, brussel sprouts, corn, carrots, etc. - as well as things like mac and cheese and salad. The pumpkin is in the pie usually lol other favorite pies are apple, pecan, or sweet potato. Also I agree that OP just needs to be honest with her MIL about how she's feeling this year if it's just an issue this year, but if it's a larger issue, she and her husband need to figure out what works for them as a couple. I host Thanksgiving for my family every year, and I like cooking with as many people as I can fit in my kitchen, but if someone is unavailable for any reason until mealtime, I don't care. Just be here when you can be here. The food is getting made regardless, and I value any time people can give to the holiday. That's just me though.

[@_0w3n]

For the Dan situation, here are my thoughts. Have you had the conversation that you want just family time, and did you have the conversation that you don’t want Dan to be apart of your family. I know from my experience that some people just considered it typical for close friends to just pop by and help out. Because if the answer to the second one is no then I think that you and your partner need to have that conversation.

[@elaexplorer]

The base Thanksgiving dinner is Turkey or Ham, mashed potatoes and gravy, dressing/stuffing, cranberry sauce, green bean casserole (green beans, canned mushroom soup, fried onions baked in the oven), pumpkin pie, and some type of dinner roll. There are a lot of regional dishes like collard greens, pecan pie, sweet potato casserole (sweet potatoes, brown sugar, marshmellows and sometimes walnuts baked in the oven), sweet potato pie, green Jell-O with fruit in it, all kinds of hot fruit pies, cornbread, corn on the cob, and many others. If the meal is being served as dinner there's usually appetizers during the day like deviled eggs, chips, veggies and dips and cheeses. If it's served earlier it's usually expected not to eat anything before hand to "save room".

[@kazh8639]

The first one was literally a question in my exam (I’m a vet student). Giving away your cats is unlikely to be beneficial. Your cat probably already has it and is immune, and you are likely to have it. The hygiene is enough.

[@tiffanyallen731]

Our cat actually saved my life when I was a baby. She noticed I was choking and alerted my parents. I may not be here today, over 40 years later, if my parents didn't have that cat and if she had not done this. I love all animals, always have, and currently work with dogs and cats full-time. I agree completely: pets are members of the family. You don’t just throw them out on the street as if they are disposable. (BTW, to be clear: my parents were there with me and I was in my bassinet, I don’t want them to come off as neglectful in any way. They were very loving, caring parents).

[@lisamichelle2837]

I have 6 cats. I got my first when i was in Peru. He was a 2 week old kitten and they were going to feed him to stray dogs. I brought him from Peru to the US and the process was a nightmare. Now that he's here though I couldnt be happier.

[@HighLordBaron]

I think OP in the Thanksgiving story is NTA. I very much understand not wanting to get up at 9am and spend hours cooking with people you're not close with after a stressful time at work. Also, since there are other guests who also don't help, I think it's fine for her to come in later.... If it was only the people that helped it would be bad to show up to eat, but since there are other guests it's fine.... Also, honestly, I hope OP listened to the first comments and not the rest....

[@MaggieValera]

Thanksgiving - OP may come from a family where Thanksgiving takes an emotional toll. And just because hubby's family doesn't do the same, that doesn't mean that OP doesn't have a hard time dealing with the holiday because of how they've viewed it. If OP is already feeling that she needs a break, this isn't the day to ask her to pitch in and take one for the team. That being said, OP didn't say how long they had been married and if they'd participated in years past. That "without being thanked" makes me think that they have participated once and didn't like the fact that they did not receive the verbal feedback that they felt they deserved. Is this the first Thanksgiving since getting married, and watched what the siblings and spouses went through and decided this is not for her?

[@maeshellewest-davies7904]

You are never the asshole for not getting rid of your cats

[@Nariasan]

Cats, especially strays, are being treated terribly in Japan, which makes me so sad. I've wanted to take so many strays... there are so many that are injured or sick and malnourished. And Japan is a country with a ridiculous amount of kill shelters. It breaks my heart. I was wanting to go to Morocco, but now I'm not sure 😢

[@roselover411]

Who would give their cats away because you're having a baby????? Absolutely not!! Your partner can take care of the litter boxes, it's totally fine???

[@thecolorjune]

I’ve been having a really bad Monday, (my beloved 7.5 year old Guinea pig passed away), thanks for bringing some comfort to the day with your weekly video.

[@silverghostcat1924]

So for the loss of your fur companion.💜

[@HighAsHeckPriestess]

I hope Shaaba comes to the US to experience Thanksgiving! Horrific history aside, being with the family/friends making cornbread and baked mac and cheese and turkey and baking pies is so comforting and fun!! Friendsgiving has been so helpful to my homesickness now that i dont live in the same state as my family

[@KristiChan1]

Agreed, the history of it is awful, but the food...so much glorious food.

[@lorrefl7072]

What heartless people is this woman working with that everyone in the office agreed that she should get rid of her cats.

[@edielungreen]

On the Thanksgiving one: is the communal cooking gendered? If it’s the women who are expected to help and the men who show up to eat, then I think that’s another conversation that people need to be having.

[@blackhyla]

I'm totally like you, Shaaba, in that I love cooking big meals with family and friends- as a host or a guest- hell I'd be the first to volunteer! But that's because we both seem to have happy, equitable, relationships with our people. But if I invited you to my thanksgiving party and said "Shaaba, you're INVITED to my party! and because you're FAMILY, I expect 6 hours of free labour from you before the REAL guests arrive! Also, you will not be thanked for any of your contributions." Would you consider that a fun bonding experience? Because that was the general vibe I was getting from the third story. Even if OP weren't exhausted, if this is the expectation for family as a CONDITION OF THE INVITATION, I hope OP nope's right out of this "tradition" going forward. (PS: I'm glad that you have the kind of beautiful group cooking experiences that I've had, and I hope yours are always full of joy!) EDIT: typo

[@koraliekora-leepalmer4024]

I'd also add that it seems like it's only the women cooking. Why can't op's husband take her place this year?

[@JokesInBase13]

Toxoplasmosis infections are typically only dangerous if you get a NEW infection during your pregnancy, which is unlikely from cats you've had for years if they're not exposed to other animals, the outdoors, or fed raw meat (which can also be infected). There's no reason to rehome them, just stay away from the litter box.

[@never_eat_soggy_waffles]

I’m nine months late, but “I don’t like me either” is a great song and my current favorite.

[@curiousdoodler5509]

On the second one, i suspect the op isn't carrying his weight and Dan is actually helping. I don't think it's Dan is the baby's daddy.

[@curiousdoodler5509]

@theashwoodfaerie the reason I have my suspicion is because he's complaining about having 'no time' with his family, but also Dan is there every weekend. There are 5 other days in the week. Even if op works, that still strikes me as sus. Honestly, if op was actually carrying his weight, someone showing up on the weekend isn't going to be able to outshine them.

[@hotchocbooks]

It literally didn't even occur to me that that last OP wouldn't be helping out at all - my family and i do this at xmas, i struggle so much with having other people around me to the point where the winter holidays are really overwhelming for me, so i just bake various desserts (usually on request, even if they're things i don't personally eat) and bring them along when i come for dinner - then i've still helped out but i haven't had to do the exhausting socialising bit also

[@emilyrybak1033]

I would love a version of this segment where we go through any updates posted for posts what were covered in past videos. Reflect on our / Shaaba’s conclusions and compare them to how things turned out.

[@rion2499]

The gym one is weird, because the husband saying “hey, give it to me I’ll give it to her when I’m at the gym” kind of implies he didn’t think it was a secret that the sister was his work out buddy? Like, it could be just a case of everyone assumed everyone knew kinda thing. Him trying to real it back is a little sus, though at the same time I could see myself automatically doing that if someone gave me that kind of reaction, cause I’d need a second to figure out if there was a reason no one knew? But then, to play devils advocate to myself, the HIL going to school with the sister and knowing her almost better that her sister is interesting. Either they are cheating or are just life long friends. I wonder who the HIL met first actually, the sister or his wife. 🤔 Again, not enough information. It is healthy to have a good mix of friends in different genders and for it not to get weird: heteronormative society is so stupid and isolating. I’m at a weird point where I’m like if you can’t trust your SO why are you with them? But also, still good not to be completely naive or walked over. OP just needs to be super direct with both parties and talk it out with Husband and Sister. PS: I’m not gonna touch it with a stick, but the problem the comments were having with the last AITA IS the heteronormative concept that there is inherently only ONE WAY to have a “Family Portrait.” And that we’ve become too nuclear and isolated with the “parents and children” clusters. I just keep thinking of the phrase “it takes a village to raise a child” and how unique family dynamics are good and shouldn’t have to conform to societal expectations if it works for them. Also, just, I think it’s very important that the Stay At Home and/or primary-caregiver parent doesn’t become too isolated and their partner too controlling: red flags.

[@s.a.4358]

I do agree with your take of why be with someone you feel you cannot trust, however trust also comes from open communication and feeling secure in the knowledge that one’s partner will share info, not keep too many secrets about their own life (we all have things we don’t like to talk about (trauma, past experiences, etc), and that is fine, but careful if it influences the current relationship) and generally having received positive clues that the person is trustworthy and not sneaky. I don’t think the issue is that fiancé and sister are gym buddies or even good friends, the issue is OP not knowing. How come it never came up? Do they not chat about their days like “how was work? How was the gym?” I find it not a great sign that OP did not know. It makes me think that either they do not communicate well enough as a couple - which is also an issue and can lead to bigger problems - or OP did not know on purpose. Maybe it’s not for a sneaky reason, maybe it’s that OP has been jealous of the friendship in the past, that the sister doesn’t want it to be used as a pressure to hang out with OP more often, or even something cute like they are planning a secret surprise for OP. But it’s a little suss in any case and in OP’s place I would also wonder what is going on. Even if there is nothing going on, lack of communication (not just about big topics but also just sharing about life, chit-chat, etc) can easily lead to misunderstanding or worry.

[@casstadman3662]

I grew up around cats at my grandparents house and we had a cat while I was pregnant with my son. Our cat, Jules, was very protective of belly and he and our dog Jodie followed me everywhere. Jules knew I was in labour and stayed with me against my back til mum took me to the hospital. He loved my son and loved sleeping on his feet❤

[@HeiwaTori]

story 1 makes me think of the kdrama where a woman is pregnant & she goes to a cafe & orders coffee, someone tells her you should drink decaf, so she orders decaf instead, next time she goes someone tells her she should drink tea instead of coffee, she orders tea, the next time someone tells her she should drink kiwi juice, so she orders kiwi juice, the social pressure on mothers is extreme man, her in a voiceover then says the facts about caffeine affecting the baby & then says "who do you think cares most about the baby? thats right me, the mother"

[@lucialma]

As an American, I care way more about teaching Shaaba about Thanksgiving food than about any of the stories 😂😂😂 Turkey, yes. With gravy and stuffing. Cranberry sauce, mashed potatoes, sweet potato casserole (there are various different versions but most of them are fairly sweet and it tastes way better than it sounds), and a green vegetable: traditionally this would be a green bean casserole made with cream of mushroom soup and crispy fried onions, but many families will do roasted Brussels sprouts or similar instead. Pumpkin usually shines at dessert, especially in pie form. Pecan pie is also popular. One absolutely can have carrots at Thanksgiving, but they aren’t part of the core foods. Of course every family has its own preferences, and most have several other dishes such as mac & cheese, salads, corn dishes, and various other potato or root vegetable dishes. Generally people make way more food than we can eat in a day and live off the leftovers for days afterwards. It’s great. We say it’s a holiday for celebrating everything we have to be thankful for, but it’s really a holiday for celebrating food.

[@corvuscorone7735]

The toxoplasmosis one makes me so mad! That is not how it works. a.) you can test if you have it b.) you can test your cats c.) If you have indoor cats and they haven't got it, or even if they had it and have antibodies now, they won't be infectious, because they are only infectious for a short while after they themselves catch it. Don't feed them a raw diet and you will be safe. Unless they are outdoor cats and have no antibodies against toxoplasma yet, but then you can still have your partner clean the cat toilet daily to be safe.

[@jennagermain3660]

The last one has no win possible, either you go and do all the work and have a terrible time and feel resentment or you both stay home and get blamed for them not being to have husband there, or he goes without you and your judged for "not supporting your husband/not interacting with the family" for "making him go alone" plus, I wonder if he has to help as well or if it's a "the spouses (or females specifically) have to show up super early and have to help while the children (or specifically the men) just hang out and bond" because screw that tradition right in the you know what

[@Shamazya]

I don't think it's a no-win situation necessarily. I feel like it should totally be possible to either ask if you can opt out this year either entirely or partially (Bringing a store-bought dish) or husband setting the tone and saying he and his wife would like to do something a little more quiet an intimate but say they'll be there for Christmas or be sure to call or something.

[@zaraandrews600]

My dad lives in Oman and there are a lot of stray cats there. I get so upset when I see all the starving kitties. Sometimes people will poison them to reduce numbers, which just breaks my heart.

[@SassyGirl822006]

I grew up with cats. I had two cats during my last pregnancy, and I cleaned the litter box. I wore gloves and washed my hands. Baby is now 10 weeks, and perfectly healthy.

[@bunji_beans]

Dangit.. for a second I thought the gym one might be wholesome since OP's partner seemed so nonchalant about working out with her sister like he just naively thought it wasn't a big deal. But his immediate backtracking made it super sus.

[@Rogue__Ghostie]

Traditional thanksgiving foods (at least for me): turkey, ham, mashed potatoes, baked sweet potatoes with marshmallows, stuffing, green beans, canned cranberry sauce, bread rolls, turkey gravy, pumpkin pie, apple pie

[@skypancake7]

ok that first story is so infuriating! my mother had 2 cats when me and my brother where born! i would actually carry one of them around as a toddler :) no problems at all also i watch mama doctor jones channel and when ever she talks about this she said that she recommends for the non pregnant partner to clean the litter box just in case. Theres not an extreme concern though

[@Rikrobat]

With the Dan situation, I don't like that Sarah isn't on OP's side about wanting some personal time with just them. Calling him ungrateful for the help isn't addressing the situation at all, almost like she prefers Dan's presence to that of her husband's. Granted, there could be a lot of factors we're not seeing about the "family time" through the week, but not getting a good vibe that the wife seems resistant to having her friend let them have some weekends alone.

[@glitterspray]

“He means well” isn’t really relevant. That’s cool, but not a reason to put up with an intrusive situation.

[@naonao9528]

I think there could be a reason that Sarah isn't siding with OP, so I do think OP might be a bit of an AH on the original post. Firstly, the way the post is written heavily implies he thinks they are having an affair. Second, it doesn't really seem like he's trying to see it from his wife's perspective at all. It could be that Sarah might still be on maternity leave, so she isn't getting much social interaction and OP isn't realizing that Dan coming over is some of the only social interaction she is getting "almost every" week. He wants to spend time alone with them after working with coworkers all week and she might want to spend time with someone who isn't the husband/baby for once. If that's the case I don't think his wants should take priority over hers. OP also contradicts themselves or at least exaggerates a bit they say Dan is a constant presence but then stating he's there "almost every weekend for hours". How much is almost? How many hours? How many days of the week? It just seems like something is missing from the story. The end bit where OP lost his cool, argued with his wife and then she left with Dan could be the classic reddit move of implying my SO is cheating and then downplaying my own actions to reinforce that belief. That is possible, but it also could just come from their clear communication issues. My first thought was what Shaaba mentioned about him not pulling his weight. In that case Sarah might just be glad to have some help with the baby/not happy with OP's parenting style and she doesn't feel comfortable confronting him. Like maybe she's using Dan to communicate her needs to her husband, because of their communication problems. Which isn't healthy for the relationship either. Either way all three of them need to communicate better with each other. I think Shaaba's advice to chat with Dan is good maybe he has more insight into the situation that the OP is missing. If Dan and Sarah are really good friends he should want to help OP and Sarah have a happy marriage/family. In that case he'll be understanding.

[@StoryBird2]

28:10 my family celebrates Thanksgiving but we all chip in some kind of meal, if someone doesn't that's fine since the others did something but when we have guests over they usually bring an item or two to help out, it's a communal thing and NOBODY should be forced to cook just for stupid turkey day. (I have a hatred of the Holiday but put it aside to eat a nice meal with my family)

[@SannaiSan]

I feel some kind of way about that last one. I'm an exhausted introvert and my extended family are all very family-oriented extroverts, so I feel OP when they say hanging out with people for the whole day on the only extra day they get off sounds exhausting. Surely compromises could be made here where they could just make some food at home and bring it later?

[@bellewells2099]

Toxoplasmosis is actually slightly more likely to come from unwashed root vegetables like potatoes and carrots but still always clean up the litter box with gloves on.

[@danielagodinho2044]

As long as the pregnant lady have someone to help take care of the litter box it wont cause any harm to the baby. When my sister was pregnant we rescue a 2nd cat and she would bite sometimes at first and we thought this would be a problem with the baby. Fast foward to when my niece was born. Our younger cat became one of those cats that is super loving and both of our cats became super protective of the baby. Even now (my niece is almost 3 years old) they are super protective of her and if my niece starts bothering them they just leave the room. They never once attacked her and they love to sleep near her foot. They were always allowed every where in the house and that went really okay.

[@YesTodaySatan69]

When my bonus sister was pregnant and needed to change the litter before her husband got home from work, I would help her with it. Just be a good friend and help out... Second story: Yeah... I feel like OP needs to get a DNA test because that's, uh, super suspicious. My family's Thanksgiving dinner usally consists of an oven turkey, a smoked turkey, mashed potatoes, green bean casserole, rolls, mac & cheese, apple pie, pumpkin pie, and sometimes pecan pie. Also might do a pumpkin swirl cheesecake this year. Lol. This stuff will last us a week or more though. But as far as the story is concerned, I think OP is NTA. After a long shift and you finally get a day off, you shouldn't be obligated to be somewhere that early.

[@animeartist888]

"Bonus sister" lmao I'm gonna use that to refer to my internet-adopted sister from now on

[@catsmom129]

Pumpkin cheesecake is yummy! I made it with my kiddo once. Great memory

[@whoahanant]

Toxoplasmosis can be gotten from lots more than just cats. Dirt and food both can carry it. It's used against cats all the time because animal haters sadly exist. Thats it. You just need to sanitize yourself just like you'd do with eating and gardening. If you don't have anyone to clean the litterbox besides yourself then you can also use long gloves to do this with washing your arms and hands afterwards.

[@laurenthomas7074]

It's just a little note but in the last story [Edit some of the comments] imply that feeling unwell is a good reason to stay home but feeling tired isn't. As someone with a fatigue disorder I can tell you that extreme tiredness is absolutely a form of being unwell, and for me it hits as a touch ableist to suggest that being exhausted is just an 'excuse'

[@jesskitty4704]

Toxoplasmosis is more common and usually found in Outdoor and Indoor-Outdoor cats. Since they can eat/hunt rodents, which is usually an immediate host. If U have strictly indoor only cats there is very little to no risks. It is good to not handle cat feeces and the liter box at all. (Note: Toxoplasmosis can also be present in farm animals) We have a 13, almost 14 month old son, 1 guinea pig (used to be 2) and 10 cats. (had 6, but took in a pregnant cat and she had her babies) Hubby cleaned the liter boxes and piggy cages throughout my pregnancy. He still does it 80-90% now and we make sure we keep Little One away from the boxes. Its all about keeping the house clean and safe. The person in the first story can eat a whole liter box for the getting rid of kitties suggestion and workplace alienation.

[@piaonomata9220]

I certainly hope the "you're a s__t parent if you don't get rid of your cats" person holds the same view with regard to, say, driving a car when pregnant or with a newborn. I mean, if we're setting a standard of ANY RISK IS UNACCEPTABLE RISK YOU MUST SUBJUGATE YOUR LIFE TO YOUR BABY'S AT ALL TIMES WITHOUT EXCEPTION...traveling in a car presents a much greater risk overall, I would think. But I'd bet Anti-cat Coworker would likely balk at that. Anti-cat Coworker can go clean a litterbox. With their tongue.

[@FreyaofCerberus]

My personal rule of thumb is that if a partner is trying to hide something there is a reason. As a very private person myself I could conceivably see the sister not mentioning working out with ops fiance although even that's a stretch. But the fact that the fiance hid it and only revealed it after a slip of the tongue is super sketchy. He didn't tell OP for a reason and the most obvious reason is probably correct. If it wasn't a big deal he'd have mentioned it.

[@xpaartan6916]

For the workout one, I can also understand a perspective not mentioned here. I have an anxiety disorder and it manifests a lot in relationships where I can get very insecure about people close to my girlfriend. There is one friend of hers I got particularly jealous about, and at one point my girlfriend would stop telling me when she saw her because she didn't want me to get uncomfortable. Of course, there is then the finding out and being like "WHY DID YOU HIDE IT?!" but sometimes the reason for the hiding is BECAUSE OF my anxiety. Maybe OP is a jealous/anxious type and fiancee just didn't want her to feel insecure when nothing weird was going on.

[@xpaartan6916]

Also congrats on your single Shaaba! It's lovely!

[@ravenclawfairy3648]

My mother was told the same crap about cats when she was pregnant with me. She told those people, "My daughter *WILL BE* raised with my cats. End of discussion." My father would change the liter box for her and those cats were my best friends growing up. They always stayed close to me when I learned to crawl and they would curl up next to me when I started to read. They passed away within a year of each other (one was 15, the other was 16).

[@LukaszSebastian]

My best friend has more cats than the OP from the first story and two children, who came way after the cats. Both children love those cats, have great relationships with them, and it goes both ways. Also, I have 2 cats, before them I had another one, and toxoplasmosis was one of the first things my vet checked right after each adoption.

[@emmaliefmann9984]

I got some similar comments about my cats when I was pregnant, I think in my case it was down to cultural differences - the friends who made the comments come from cultures where house pets are less common and generally less close with animals. I was checked monthly for toxoplasmosis, and now the love between my kitty and babies is mutual ❤

[@booknamebasis]

I have to say, just because something is a “tradition” doesn’t mean it’s necessary. In fact, I would say adhering to tradition is less important than considering other people and their well-being.

[@Whateverhasbeenmynameforyears]

I cant believe how common it is to get rid of pets because they had children.

[@silverghostcat1924]

Which is sad for the kids not getting to grow up with a furry companion 😿

[@sasha73991]

The cat one makes me so sad!! Hope mama didn’t give up her cat. I adopted my first cat from a pregnant woman who thought it was too risky to keep the cat with a baby on the way. She’d had the cat since he was a kitten; he was a senior when I took him in, and with how quickly his health declined, I’ll always suspect that he didn’t fully recover from being removed from his only home... Sweet, stubborn old man. Tried my best to give him a good life in the couple years we had 💜

[@kated2147]

My husband is allergic to cats, we have 2… he had a doctor’s appointment yesterday and they tried to talk him into getting rid of the cats… he said absolutely not. He loves them as much if not more than I do. 😅