Why 40k Triggers People

[@PilgrimsPass]

I'm leaving this hear to address common repeated comments: 1. I address the satire aspect of 40k in the video. I address what it FAILS at satirizing and what it SUCCEEDS in satirizing. The satirical aspect of the setting doesn't change the nature of the setting itself which is one where progress failed. Also, not every novel or contribution to the lore is satire. Especially since the Imperium of Man is getting increasingly more heroic in its portrayal. 2. Starship Troopers the movie is NOT satire. It's SLANDER because Paul Verhoven didn't get past the second chapter before deciding to portray the Federation as Fascist because dude got triggered at a different political perspective in the novel. 3. Yes people get triggered by the lore in 40k. That's why they complain and put pressure to retcon and change the lore. Which then triggers the lore purists who complain back and then the original triggered make fun of the purists for getting triggered and down the spiral of mutual triggering we go. People forget the pressure to add female space marines used to be more of a fringe thing before becoming more mainstream.

[@gothicpando]

interesting.

[@channingdeadnight]

I'm one of those long time Bay Area leftist libtards. But I don't need an inclusive message in every piece of media i consume to enjoy it. sometimes the whole point is to watch something completely contrary to my worldview. just because someone enjoys watching something doesn't mean that they want to emulate it or live in that kinda universe. only a total moron would want to live in the 40K universe. they even had to ruin the Tau because people couldn't handle a faction that wasn't a complete horror show. The 40K universe is incredibly massive. if you have a certain worldview somewhere in 40K there's someone or some group that represents and supports it, and something antagonistic to it. It openly advertises and celebrates the messed up universe it has created. that grimdark aspect of it's universe. so if it's something that you don't enjoy or understand ignore it. 40k isn't nearly pervasive enough that an average individual is going to be exposed to almost any of it without someone actively looking for it. there's nothing wrong with being a Cali libtard I'm one myself and its much better than most of the alternatives. but it doesn't have to rule every aspect of your life. And you really shouldn't try to force it upon anyone else no matter how incredibly wrong they area. the whole point in our worldview is that it isn't dogmatic or proscribed like religion is. it's a worldview that's supposed to be based on the facts and evidence that makes up the real world. which means that it's also not a static set of beliefs. it's changes and grows as your knowledge changes and grows. or at least that is the idea.

[@NorthernXY]

I would say the T'au are more of an amalgamation of China, Korea, and Japan. Japan had a pretty strict caste system, while whatever China was calling itself at the time actually had a pretty good system going that required government workers to pass exams to prove competency in the job they are choosing to pursue. EDIT: Also the T'au are like the Japanese people because once the US politely opened Japan up to world trade they modernized, and they did it FAST!!! So much so they won the Russo-Japanese war of 1904.

[@RyanEX2000]

Point 2. PREACH! Not gonna lie and say I didn't enjoy the movie for what it was, but the anime was far better and somewhat more accurate...once you got past the alien design.

[@neglectfulsausage7689]

I'd like to say something about phases, cycles, and the nature of humans. Sodom and gammorrah, tower of babylon. Thsoe were stories that said "excess from hubris/lust destroys your society". Everyone wants to be a rebel when they're young. Lots of young fall into the trap of hedonism to rebel against moderatism. Yes, not "oppression" but moderation, in behavior, action, intake, etc. Humans cannot EVER reproduce works of fiction that stretch beyond the knowledge and understanding of Man, and ultimately, of self. That is, Slaneesh is designed as such BECAUSE you could metaphorically say "its coded in our human DNA to understand this". The same way the Hero's Journey is somethign everyone understands on an intuitive level even if they don't have the words. In my opinion, the Left would rather see the world burn under Mass Hedonism where everyone pleasures themselves until the whole thing collapses and ends all of them, than suffer the "oppression" of hierarchical societies that FEEL, note, FEEL, oppressive. Even Marx wrote poerty to the effect of making the entire earth burn to walk among its ashes like a god. The work of 40K was decades of distillation of Ultimate truths, about nature, about humanity, etc, into a game format because where else can people draw inspiration from except reality? The collaborative work was invented by people who read and watched behavior at large and were correctly able to interpret what they saw. They didnt say "what my utopia would be" when making 40K, they said "what might be, given the nature of life"

[@The_Natalist]

Warhammer 40K is a positive vision of the future because humanity is alive in the year 40,000

[@AlexAlex-zt3hi]

Negative, "voketurds" are still messing with the rest of us.

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

more than that, humanity is the dominant galactic species in the year 40 000

[@LEFT4GABEN]

To be fair, behaviorally modern Humans have existed for 60000 years already...

[@ThreadBareHope1234]

😁😁Yeah.

[@varietywiarrior]

Boy, the bar has been lowered pretty far.

[@whyjnot420]

If more people simply realized that the 40k universe is a place you DO NOT want to be in, things would be a lot better.

[@CanadianPale]

Hate to tell you, bud, but we're already in that place, just 38,000 years earlier. 🙃

[@daishan1234]

well, people seem to be increasingly awakening to the fact that the present day universe is a place they also don't really care to be in...

[@slkjvlkfsvnlsdfhgdght5447]

@@CanadianPale how?

[@art-o-cart5166]

​@@CanadianPale yea just the other day my friend was lobotomized and turned into a living robot

[@ColorfulStarburst]

​​@@art-o-cart5166Being a necron in warhammer 40k would be the best out of any species.

[@Archon...]

It was not merely sex that caused The Fall, it was everything in excess... the drive to explore and intensify every possible sensation. When the Emperor's Children entered the Laer Temple we glimpsed a fragment of what it might have been like: there were new smells, dazzling colours and astonishing sounds that forever changed the Astartes present.

[@RageAgainstTheDyingOfTheLight7]

Yes its Excess wich is why she has so much overlap with the other 3

[@therasco400]

Not only that we even have a example in the elder of what excess will do when purpose is stripped.

[@Bandopede]

God forbid you imply that a healthy adult shouldn't constantly seek out an endless string of meaningless sexual encounters, that would be... like, nazi oppression evil-bad stuff

[@DylanJo123]

​@@Bandopede i think you might have missed op's point

[@Bandopede]

@@DylanJo123 No, I was mocking the very idea of somebody even needing OP's point to be made. I've seen plenty of 40k tourists imply that Slaanesh isn't bad at all, unironically using the very reasons that I sarcastically paraphrased in my last reply. It kind of scares me that so many people seem to not even believe in hedonism as a concept anymore.

[@orboakin8074]

30:57 As a Nigerian Star Wars fan since childhood, i agree with you. I am pretty much done with disney star wars and their garbage writing, toxic identity politics and antagonism towards fans. Thankfully, i am getting my fix from Lucas era shows and movies, EU novels and games like KOTOR and Fallen Order. That is enough for me.

[@psychodoxie6987]

I think you would love Space marine 2 or if you want a more chaotic game Helldivers 2

[@orboakin8074]

@psychodoxie6987 thanks for the recommendations, friend 👍 Will be getting these two on Steam for sure

[@psychodoxie6987]

@@orboakin8074 If you can buy the super citizen version of helldivers 2

[@psychodoxie6987]

@@orboakin8074 I just want to say as a fellow african the internet connection with these games can be a little crap but I live in South-Africa so it might be better for you

[@orboakin8074]

@psychodoxie6987 no, I agree with you. That is one of the many hurdles we still face in much of Africa 😞

[@Tehstampede]

The crazy thing about the Craftworld Eldar is that they're the descendants of the 40k equivalent of hardline Amish separatists. While their entire society went to hell in a handbasket, they were stockpiling water, food and ammo in remote shelters to survive the collapse and for better or worse, their plan worked lol

[@kingleech16]

And then there’s the exodites, who are like Amish who think that the other Amish are too into technology…

[@honkhonk8009]

I like the Tau cus they remind me of buddhists kinda. But then again

[@Culexus101]

I'd say they're more like rural conservatives who mostly live in the modern world but eschew things like alcohol, cigarettes, and any media rated higher than PG12. The Exodites are the Eldar space Amish, Harlies are 4chan shit posters who are just happy they survived the apocalypse they were probably too busy laughing at to do anything to try and stop. The Dark Eldar seem to be the descendants of the old liberal elites slaves rather than the liberal elites themselves. To a lot of people the Craftworlder lifestyle is superficially appealing because they look at it from a human perspective. From an Eldar perspective it's basically a life of extreme self denial, it's practically monastic for them. The Eldar are natural polymaths who can be warriors, and poets, and philosophers, and scientists all at once, but somewhere a long the way things went of the rails and they ended up birthing Slaanesh...

[@LM-xw7ii]

Oh my gosh, I love thinking about of the Eldar as space prepped.

[@talesofgore9424]

based Elven preppers

[@runningcommentary2125]

"RELIGION IS BAD" said the 10-foot tall gleaming golden god-man, "HUMANITY SHOULD BE FREE TO FOLLOW REASON, AND BY THAT I MEAN UNQUESTIONINGLY OBEY MY DECREES TO THE LETTER."

[@jonathanathor117]

Chad sigmar: Guess I'm god now.

[@war_designer8763]

*14 foot tall

[@zeehero7280]

BECAUSE I AM THE EMPEROR AND THEREFORE DESTINED TO LEAD HUMANITY INTO A NEW AGE OF GOLDYNESS AND ELDAR HOOK- I MEAN SAFE INTERSTELLAR TRAVEL

[@tau-5794]

HUMANITY MUST BE ABLE TO FOLLOW REASON. I AM REASON.

[@jonathanathor117]

@@tau-5794 The emperor's plan for humanity: a long winded over complicated plan that involves 21 demigods and straight up subjugation of the entire human race only to end up with 2 redacted and half going full retard and dooming everyone. Sigmar's plan: an actual warhammer

[@peaceribbon8322]

And with each passing day, I am continuously torn between Pilgrim convincing me to check out 40k in earnest and GW convincing me to not.

[@mikeparker7631]

jump in but limit your purchases to used stuff...which probably means no mini gaming...but the fiction, rpgs, etc are the best parts anyway.

[@mikesecondname]

@peaceribbon8332 mate, bite the bullet and get into 40K. You don’t have to get into the corpo side GW push. You can even get by with just 3d printed or second hand models off eBay/vinted/Facebook and read the rules on wahapedia. There’s plenty of us who don’t care if your models are GW ‘tournament accepted’ as long as it looks mostly like the model it’s supposed to be. Most of us just want to play the game and listen to the cool lore.

[@TheBayzent]

Jump in but pirate the books and find mini printers.

[@BrBetim]

Get into Warhammer Fantasy. The franchise is technically done, so GW can't do much to ruin it!

[@thewolfpoet]

If you want to enjoy 40k without getting involved with GW I highly suggest checking out A Vox in the Void; he's a very skilled voice actor who narrates professionally-written 40k fan fiction. I enjoy his channel immensely

[@Chris-iv8sb]

40k triggers people because people want to be triggered

[@nowhere474]

BASED

[@codyshmodie]

They are soffft

[@domagoj905]

This is so true. Some people just live for conflict. Its like they have too much time on their hands, glued to screens 24/7 and looking for problems..

[@jhinthevirtuoso4886]

It invalidates their unrealistic belief system. 40K is a mirror to our own universe.

[@GloomGaiGar]

summary of humanity

[@christophebedouret9813]

The elites do not resemble Slaaneshy cult... They are one...

[@Thalanox]

Complete with worrying philosophies and worshipping weird things.

[@DISTurbedwaffle918]

Some remind me more of Genestealers tbh. I sometimes fear that our government is a horrendous battleground for such cults.

[@level20eevee75]

@@DISTurbedwaffle918isn’t that just every western (and southern) nation?

[@zeehero7280]

you'd best start believing in Chaos cult stories, yer in one!

[@turkeysandwich1998]

True, but I really feel like they are chaos undivided

[@ShadowFox178]

For me I treat Warhammer especially Warhammer 40K as a lesson that collapse of a sophisticated society isn't inevitable, but possible. Unless everyone remains vigilant and aware of how delicate everything is. Especially technology. I like how interesting and how introspective this universe makes me.

[@majormajorasic]

It's like how it's an unknown public secret that entire USA power-grid can be near permanently shut-down nation wide by a small group of 5-10 dedicated men that would cause permanent and massive damage in materiel and in resulting panic riots, and the only way to defend against that possibility is to not defend it at all and hope nobody notices the weakness.

[@wolf2403]

I find myself aligning much with your statement. Thanks for expressing it cuz I can't write for shit and probably would've written 10 paragraphs for what should be said in 3 sentences. Progress is nice, but exercise caution. Stagnation is dependent on your ability to be cautious and careful. Basically, look where you want to step before taking the step.

[@PerkulatorBenny]

​@@wolf2403 So if it was in a fortune cookie, it would be something like "move forward when possible but be careful where you put your feet". ;)

[@intenzityd3181]

Remember that it is fiction, and much of 40K fiction (like the DAoT) is star-trek tier nonsense written by midwits who implicitly believe that science and experts are capable of guiding humanity to some sort of utopia, if we just did what they said.

[@ShadowFox178]

@@PerkulatorBenny that would be the best fortune cookie I've ever seen.

[@zephyrstrife4668]

Ultimately what it comes down to... is that 40k was supposed to be an over-the-top, evil dystopia version of every Utopia science fiction could think of. Because War Game! A Utopian society doesn't breed conflict because everyone thinks the same... but when utopian societies meet and aren't the same... they clash hard.

[@picollojr9009]

Utopias collapse

[@CanadianPale]

@@picollojr9009 *cough* Dark Age of Technology *cough*

[@CanadianPale]

_40k was supposed to be an over-the-top, evil dystopia_ A necessary evil by the logic of the setting, though.

[@CantusTropus]

Yeah, part of the reason why it's so bad is so that you can easily justify any matchup of armies, including mirror matches.

[@karlfranzemperorofmandefil5547]

Not a necessary evil. That’s something they shoehorned in. Early Warhammer 40k was explicitly supposed to be a parody of authoritarianism. The emperor isn’t some necessary golden path following autocrat, he’s directly to blame for the fall of humankind through his own lack of understanding and love to his children and sheer arrogance.

[@joea12]

To be clear...Historically speaking, homosexuality has been tolerated at certain times in certain places to the extent that people were not punished for engaging in homosexual acts. Homosexuality has not, historically, been tolerated to the extent of legitimizing same sex marriage, or using the power of the state to safeguard such unions or even acknowledge "homosexual" as a social category

[@ForOne814]

And where and when it was tolerated, it was tolerated because women were seen as so beneath men that having sex with men was more socially respectable.

[@AndrewRyan-zv7zb]

They were better human beings when they had to live in the closet.

[@vgamedude9811]

Exactly. I have seen some of the homosexuality in warhammer fiction and its VERY different (from the examples Ive seen) from historical examples of it.

[@TheDormantP]

​@@AndrewRyan-zv7zbYou can relax buddy

[@zklpr4661]

Ehhh that's kinda true but also kinda wrong. Same sex couples were actually pretty popular in ancient times before Christianity, especially in the Mediterranean. For example, the Sacred Band of Thebes was an elite fighting force purely composed of gay couples, and was sanctioned by the state. Quite a few Roman leaders also had homosexual lovers. The real social stigma for homosexual couples during those times came down to who was on the receiving end in bed, funny enough. Unfortunately, once Christianity took hold on most of Europe, homosexuality became a lot more stigmatized as a whole.

[@thomriley1036]

Don't you understand?! If a fictional wargame set in a hellish future space dystopia doesn't promote all current day societal values, then any casual enjoyer of it might actually have fun without constantly reflecting upon a prescribed corporate agenda. And, that's awful. No, it's far better to wreck the lore of the setting and divide the fanbase at a loss than to just let a beloved setting exist as is.

[@OutplanetStudios]

That's what they've done to Halo, Star Wars, and Star Trek. 40k is the last bastion

[@thomriley1036]

@@OutplanetStudios Don't get me started on D&D...

[@OutplanetStudios]

@@thomriley1036 oof yeah

[@alex434343]

Good, it's about time the damn normies got with the program! Corporate progressivism is the only path forward for humanity! DEUS CORPO VULT! /s

[@thomriley1036]

@@alex434343 Stocks for the Market Gods! Revenue for the Shareholders!

[@povilzem]

In ages past, men built wonders, laid claim to the stars and sought to better themselves for the good of all. But we are much wiser now.

[@fearlesspotato3429]

Nothing wiser than porn addiction. Edit: For those who don't get it... Yes... It is sarcasm Dim wits

[@burt2800]

Did you come up with that?

[@povilzem]

​@@burt2800Hell no lol That's a 40k quote from the Adeptus Mechanicus.

[@Sara3346]

@@fearlesspotato3429 ..are you alright?

[@fearlesspotato3429]

@@Sara3346 it was sarcasm. I'm not literally saying porn addiction is wise. In the context of the reply indicates quite the opposite. "We are much wiser now" Yes because being a modern porn addict is wise.

[@DTylerFultzVA]

Trying to be progressive in Warhammer 40K would be like... Imperium: That sounds like a bunch of HERESY! (shoots w/bolter) Eldar: ...Been there. Tried it. Didn't work. (leaves) Dark Eldar: Sounds fun! Try this, you'll love it! (Dark Eldar torture ensues) T'au: We accept you. (demons start appearing) SCREW THAT! You're on your own!!! Necrons: ...Neat. We don't care. Get off our lawn. (vaporizes) Ork: HAHAHAHAHA! Yer funny. (chops 'em up) Chaos: That's right. Hell is real, you helped create it, there are FOUR Satans, and it's all nothing like what VivziePop cracked it up to be. Have fun! (drags to Hell) Tyranids: NOMNOMNOMNOM!!! (eats them all)

[@erykoman50]

Tyranid Hive Mind: YES! We must grow to consume faster! And we must consume... to grow faster! (alas, the only victory it can achieve is dying last, from starvation, in a dead universe)

[@ChucktheSpicyChicken]

The chaos gods being aware of VivziePop is pretty funny to me, i like to think they do a CinemaSins style gathering where they watch Helluva and Hazbin.

[@aedwynn6474]

Genestealer Cult: That all sounds really interesting! Why don't you tell it to my friend here... (mind control ensues)

[@crocidile90]

Leagues of Votan: SILENCE WHENCH, WE MINE, FOR ROCK AND STONE! (Proceeds to dig a hole)

[@peterrj1973]

the eldar didnt end up like this because of trans people, if you think so you dont understand why they spawned slanesh

[@siquod]

This unspoken assumption that societal change, especially overthrowing tradition, is automatically "progress" towards a better state of affairs, it has always struck me as insufferably presumptuous and stupid.

[@magusd123]

tradition should only be overthrown, when it is understood why the tradition exists in the first place, and then understanding why they aren’t needed in the end.

[@geeljire9247]

It is stupid, but unfortunately people judge values by the wealth of the nations that have them (even though in most cases, they only developed these values *after* acquiring wealth)

[@keng6663]

@@siquod of course change is not necessarily always for the better, but neither is wilful stagnation.. both can lead to collapse.

[@bumponalog5001]

Traditions are just experiments that worked.

[@yourdad6902]

So you just wanna keep slavery around troglodyte you just wanna be a racist troglodyte you just want to insert things that were backwards as hell and there's a reason we changed

[@cichy45]

That reminds me of an oldschool space opera anime called "Legend of the Galactic Heroes" that also seem to embrace this idea of history being a cycle. Without spoilers the series tells the story of a war between two galactic states - one being liberal democracy and the other being monarchy. What I found interesting about it is how the series shows political corruption in both of those systems being different and yet having some common points.

[@duncanharrell5009]

Definitely sounds like something I should look into.

[@dudeboydudeboy-zj8kd]

that anime is also an adaptation of the 10 part novel by yoshiki tanaka ;)

[@KnjazNazrath]

The only decent anime series out there IMO.

[@Brutaful]

Just finished watching it again about a month ago, and it's fantastic. I'd say if you want a better understanding of modern right-wing ideas and why some advocate for monarchy, this anime is a good place to start. It's also just got a great story, with well written characters.

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

@@duncanharrell5009 just a warning, there is a lot of exposition. I normally like subs, but its super hard to follow LotGH alot of the time because there is a massive word dump that the subs can be hard to keep up with. I couldn't find a dub, so incase you can't the sub is not an easy watch at times. the character and battle segments are great, just the narator bits that can be abit much

[@Tax_Collector01]

The issue with progressivists is they think progression is inherently good and without flaw, that anything new should be embraced without caution or scrutiny regardless of the consequences that may arise from such developments. On the other hand, maintaining the position of pure conservatism is also incorrect…as we are all aware, not all of human history is worth any reconsideration for modern implementation or preservation.

[@The_Natalist]

True except your bottom quote describes all conservatives today, that is modern conservatism

[@fuckyounoonecaresaboutyouyoun-]

@@The_Natalist so does the top one mordern liberalism thats why i say embrace moderatism both in moderation

[@_d--]

​@@The_Natalistno you are wrong. No you are wrong. No you are wrong... And on and on and on.... Maybe just maybe mediate a little

[@fuckyounoonecaresaboutyouyoun-]

@ThatGuy-bh9qh what i am trying to state is that both sides have gone into the fucking extreme to deradicalise is what i seek

[@jonathanathor117]

Honestly I think progress is positive change and regress is negative change. Change can be good but change can be bad. If anything change is neutral due to his duality. I don't think progressives understand this and just rely on hindsight every time but vey little foresight. Even science requires individuals to be precautions and document any flaws or sources of error so that other don't repeat the same mistakes.

[@wearenumberone1111]

those priests blessing weapons holy crap youre right thats literally 40k

[@universalflamethrower6342]

The Cathedral WW2 memorial just outside Moscow has molten Nazi tanks as it's floor

[@rahadityap2375]

Tbh, Entire Russia military itself is Literally Warhammer 40k in real life, The Russia Defense Minister are literally released many video of Weapon and Tanks Production and after they get assembled, Orthodox Priest bless and purify the finished weapon and tanks, they also have lot many video from the trench battlefield where There is literally exist a type of 40k Commissar but its Battlepriest, Its like Russia current aesthetism combine Soviet system to Orthodox Nationalist is what made 40k vibe

[@knighttemplaroftentacult7123]

They still do. We, Russians, have our own patron saint of nuclear triad, the Seraphim of Sarov. He was a kind man, very calm and wise. Which is why he was chosen, because we want to be sure, that if we push that button - it will be WELL WORTH IT, and not just because we felt like it.

[@0816M3RC]

​@@knighttemplaroftentacult7123 Even though your politicians and propagandists constantly threaten the West with nukes. 😂

[@imperiumoccidentis7351]

@@rahadityap2375 To be fair, the Imperium is a combination of many different types of human empires throughout history, including Soviet Union, Russian Empire, Nazi Germany, Roman Empire, Holy Roman Empire, Byzantine Empire, Spanish Empire, British Empire, Mongol Empire, Germany Empire and the crusader states, among probably many others. Likewise, the Emperor is a combination of Napoleon, Hitler, Julius Caesar, Washington, Alexander the Great, Genghis Khan and every other great conqueror throughout history. 40k is highly archetypical. When people say that modern 40k is just a satire of fascism, it's oversimplifying it a lot.

[@csimmeri]

Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. -Gustav Mahler

[@Baloo555]

If they added Slaanesh to the lore today instead 36 years ago everyone would say it's too on the nose.

[@keng6663]

@@Baloo555 I never cease to be amazed about how many misunderstand Slaanesh and indeed miss the whole duality of all the chaos gods. I mean Slaanesh has already been toned down and sanitised from the original version these days.

[@jaypeadieL611]

Chaos god of excess being toned down to feed the demand in excessive policing of bad content and in turn increase the desire and demand for that very "bad content".

[@valance10]

We live in a slaaneshi society.

[@thescott123]

Could you imagine if the Emperor had a text to speech? If only there had been a youtube channel to show is what that would be like…

[@gaymanezhden1702]

he actually does, custodies can hear his voice. though he was silent for 10k years

[@snarkymoosesshack8793]

That shitty series died a death. It's time to let it go

[@DeeWagoner-zx9my]

"Oh look, your double standards doubled over and died." - Totally not the big E with TTS

[@ballsinspector42069]

"I am sorry, I'm just *_ABSOLUTELY LIVID_* at the moment."

[@AndrewRyan-zv7zb]

I will never forgive GW for taking that from us. And leaving us with a crappy stand in taking place in the WOD setting.

[@Stop_Gooning]

Why does "El Salvadorian Empire" sound so excessively badass?

[@evilemperorsperg]

Empire of the Savior

[@phoenixdouchebag904]

Bukele decides to clean crime from the galaxy.

[@ReformedSooner24]

We can dream. However in a recent interview with Tucker he said “democracy works.” So I unfortunately don’t think he will be willing to receive a crown of civil government anytime soon.

[@rokva5771]

@@ReformedSooner24 It's unfortunate that those most deserving to rule, often choose not to.

[@Dowlphin]

@@ReformedSooner24 Ponder the idea that everything is inevitably democratic, because there is no other sovereign but everybody, and that sovereign steers its fate through decisions of action and inaction.

[@Stellarheim]

Warhammer shows one of the possible futures for humanity that does not repent, but instead rushes forward in the blind strive for the progress in the name of progress.

[@benoliver5593]

Mankind knows nothing of Trust. Mankind is about competition. There is no room for anything else and it results in corruption. Faith and religious fever arise when the broken and aware become willing to escape the Great Mandate over Reality. It's a Machine greater then the stars that grinds all to concepts and kept in equilibrium. It cares not of individual lives or souls. It cares not for the existence of one race over another. Thats why they try to escape. Besides how should we exist without profiting off the suffering and misery of others? We can not simply make a living nor housing due to "laws" and greed. There is only so much room on this rocky boat. Very soon Humanity will do a death march to relax the tension and maybe more slots.

[@endlesswaffles6504]

The Imperium seems like a theocratic, feudal empire. Most planets are given relative autonomy as long as they pay their tithe of resources and manpower while keeping the faith. I don't like calling things "fascist" as I believe the word is now meaningless. The current definition of Fascism describes 90% of civilizations before the 1900s.

[@directrulefromgamerchair3947]

It's a term that at this point is so broad in meaning it basically has no meaning at all. It's like the video said, people have a very small political vocabulary, most have two words. One is Fascist or Communist, and the other is whatever they call their own belief system (Liberal, Conservative, Progressive, Fascist, Communist, basically anything). Everyone they encounter gets put in one of the two groups and that's the end of that.

[@Viper_Vic]

The Imperium is all over the place politically/economically. It's theocratic and feudal but also incorporates mercantilism (Rogue Traders), technocracy (Mechanicus), and war socialism. But it's objectively not fascist. Fascism is when society is organized into state-sanctioned interest groups (fasci). The Imperium is just militaristic and xenophobic.

[@neglectfulsausage7689]

How about this? If we repeal gay marriage, and "trans rights", and close the border and tightly control migration, are we now a fascist country? Because we'd just have gone back to be 1990s USA. Apparently 1990 USA was fascist.

[@Zeke2001]

Tired of hearing people saying "the Imperium are space Nazis/Fascists".

[@johngellare3507]

Whenever I hear someone cry "Fascist!", I immediately just ignore them because, 99% of the time, they just want something bad to call you.

[@goosechucker2154]

If we were actually progressing forward as a society you would see more evidence of and respect for virtues in public society such as truthfulness, trust, discernment, knowledge and worldly sophistication, but that doesn't seem to be the case. Pop culture gradually becomes more shallow and fake while an everybody-for-themselves (or everybody for the flavour of the day oppressed demographic) message is pushed instead, which funnily enough results in everything gradually becoming worse for everyone in a negative feedback loop as the loss of trust in society accelerates itself.

[@andrewgreeb916]

Progressives are more interested in power than progress, is what I usually see, they don't care for the cause only what it can do for them. If progressives truly cared about progress racism would have died long ago, the issue is it's politically useful...

[@themysteriousnavi6850]

Which is why the modern west is a dystopia in of itself!

[@NonyaB-zp6lz]

Preach

[@ssjwes572]

You said it better than I could.

[@TF2CrunchyFrog]

Well said.

[@frankenbou]

The amount of people unable to keep a fictual sci-fi universe and real life separated, hence calling for the fictual universe to change according to their demands, is astounding. Always gatekeep your hobbies from tourists.

[@Galdenberry_Lamphuck]

So you aren't a bigot, you just larp as one.

[@frankenbou]

@@Galdenberry_Lamphuck cool, you played the b-card and won the argument *yawn* Here is your cookie.

[@Galdenberry_Lamphuck]

@@frankenbou You want any LGBT or BIPOC representation in your hobby wiped out. I hate to tell you this but that's not normal.

[@fgkuv5232]

​@@Galdenberry_Lamphuck you aren't welcome here, be gone

[@Galdenberry_Lamphuck]

@@fgkuv5232 nah yall are whiners

[@MrBenMcLean]

Ender's Game was never intended as a children's story and Orson Scott Card always wrote from a perspective fully aware of how grimdark its setting is.

[@almalone3282]

Is it really grimdark if the humans "win"?

[@johns.1854]

How is it possible that the most balanced and nuanced take on both politics and culture that KZbin has to offer comes from a channel that is basically dedicated to anime and 40K?

[@Sorain1]

Because those are the areas of free expression, which have come under assault last.

[@casbienbarr]

because its an illusion created by you hearing what you want to

[@ChaseDaOrk3767]

​@@casbienbarrHow so?

[@casbienbarr]

@@ChaseDaOrk3767 because its comeplety unbalanced and not even slightly nuanced. its 1000% a whiney bias held by the most BETA of dudes (by their own definitions). all I see is children whining about lore in a setting without true cannon from the very beginning. fuckin pedantic losers too used to getting their way, with boomer levels of resistance to change.

[@stevestarcke]

Western society has been under assault for a long time. 40K is one of the few voices that dare to depict the cycle of history. We are at a pinnacle of history. 40K warns us of the fall.

[@TheKnizzine]

Counterpoint: The Primarchs are returning, the warp has grown to contain half the galaxy, newer powerful Warp entitys are awakening to challenge the 4, Bile has created a new human evolutionary line, the Necrons are waking, the Eldar are summoning their god of death, and Big E is awake. Things are changing, the setting is no longer stagnate. It is the era of Tzeentch.

[@karlfranzemperorofmandefil5547]

And the setting wasn’t about that stagnation being good. It was about the empire slowly decaying to its death.

[@1knurlagn]

Era of Tzeench. So same shit different day

[@Emperor_Of_Mankind]

That gave me goosebumps.

[@Chewable396]

This all sounds very dumb and soulless. Primarchs returning is just fucking dumb. Expanding upon and explaining the Horus heresy was one of the worst mistakes in storytelling ever made.

[@Hypogean7]

@@Chewable396 Why? A lot of people love Guilliman's character, and so far only him an Lion are in the Matteriumm.

[@adrenjones9301]

20 years ago i was wondering how a progressive society could ever regress. Then Social Justice happened.

[@vit968]

No its things like Alt-Right and white nationalists and religious fundamentalists trying to regress society. Fcking look at Project 2025 "Then Social Justice happened" give me a break.

[@leonbarry5403]

Bro I used to wonder how stuff like the holocaust could ever happen. I don't wonder any more.

[@arcdecibel9986]

I guess nobody told you that "progressive" just means "Communist", huh?

[@reverendnon5959]

Only a west problem and westerners like to think they are the whole world

[@chriswest7873]

Didn’t watch the video, didja bud?

[@bigmanteddyhimself1913]

Belive me when I say this is one of the most well rounded, educated and funny warhammer commentaries I've ever seen. You should genuinely be a teacher for how good your work is on this, keep up this magnificent quality and I'll watch everything you post the second I see it.

[@CdrChaos]

"It's not realistic that humanity in 40k has lost so much technological knowledge and can't simply reverse engineer it!" NASA cannot rebuild the Saturn V rocket. The same one that almost took Tom Hanks, Bill Paxton, and Kevin Bacon to the moon. They have an unused engine from one that they found in storage, they 3D scanned it, and even 3D printed a replica of one, but they no longer possess the mechanical knowledge necessary to build one that is actually functional. This is because the Saturn V was built by hand, not mass produced by machines, and every part had to be built to exact specifications. Teams of expert craftsmen had to make each part by hand, and said craftsmen are either now dead or have been retired for so long that they would need to relearn their old craft, and with the advent of mass production by machines, a lot of the crafting skills used on the Saturn V were not taught to the next generation. And then there's the struggle they have maintaining communication with the Voyager satellites, which are very basic computer systems but run on an OS that might as well be ancient Greek to anyone taught modern OS programming. And considering the average Imperial citizen doesn't even have what we would call a middle school education, it makes sense that science and reason have been lost and replaced with superstition and fear.

[@WanderingConsequences]

Funny isnt it? Tragic even Tragic isnt it? Funny even

[@berilsevvalbekret772]

Thats not 'not being able to built' that 'we don't want to put time and resources to built it' there is a tremendous amoung of difference between NOT having the knowledge and loosing said knowledge completely.

[@WanderingConsequences]

@@berilsevvalbekret772 can you muster enough professionals through the course of years in order to craft a specifc piece of engineering? We say its lost because of how unlikely it is for necessary factors build up again in order to rebuild something like saturn V.

[@ixian_technocrat]

That may be the case. Or maybe it just is not economically viable to rebuild the Saturn V ? What good have those Moon expeditions brought anyone ? It was just a dick measuring contest with the Soviets, and I believe people now have realized the futility of it. If humans are to go to space, they will do so long-term on self-sustaining space vessels and mine asteroids and such. Landing on a barren moon is just pointless.

[@Gravedigger.]

@@berilsevvalbekret772 To be fair the same could be said of the imperium. The mechanicus and the higher echelons of the imperium have advanced super-tech, but it's so expensive to make and maintain that the imperial guard has to make do with lasguns and flak jackets.

[@snakething87]

“The rewards of tolerance are treachery and betrayal.”

[@alexanderleonardi3625]

all the Emperor asks is that you hate.

[@ronwatford7331]

And now we're being hated on because we want to have stable families and kids and hated because of our (lack of) skin color. 🤷

[@underarmbowlingincidentof1981]

@@ronwatford7331 mate nobody is hating on you for wanting a stable family governments are literal incentivising it through subsidies stop trying to play the victim and be a man

[@ChauncyFatsack]

@@alexanderleonardi3625 Hate gives you strength when you have no Hope!

[@charlieflight6124]

Well aren't those words so true today... We tolerated a certain set of people, and now we can't go half an hour without being called all sorts of ists and phobes and all such things. We're even paying for people from other lands to live on our own while we can't even afford housing. Whoever wrote that knew more than anyone else would know about the importance of exclusivity.

[@FreshD0T]

Pilgrims Pass talking about 40k again truly this is a banger!

[@rreeves3428]

No no it is not

[@WolfJarl]

Not really. I clicked on this out of boredom: Just came off as if this guy seems to think stuff like Chaos is real and that 40K is predicting our actual society collapsing with fucking blue aliens that evolved from bovines and manifestations of raw emotions.

[@zmakesense3781]

@@WolfJarlI mean he ain’t wrong our „elites“ are basically slaanesh cultists in everything but the name

[@Fridaey13txhOktober]

@@WolfJarl Found the tourist.

[@TENGUartesmarciales]

Remember, THERE ARE NO FEMALE CUSTODES.

[@thundergaming155]

There are no wolves on fenris.

[@NoobieTheNoobzigma]

It makes sense though

[@MrPlainsflyer]

No.​@@NoobieTheNoobzigma

[@NoobieTheNoobzigma]

@@MrPlainsflyer Wdm no? Men have more muscle which can make them stronger

[@MrPlainsflyer]

@@NoobieTheNoobzigma oh my bad bro, I thought you meant female custodes make sense

[@igodreamer7096]

"I was a Star Wards refugee" - I felt that. :(

[@DontCallMeFlash]

I feel similarly, and considered 40k as an alternative, but I don't think I have it in me to invest in it to the same degree

[@wolfoffenris9951]

​@@DontCallMeFlash don't, 40k has already fallen, hold the gate at the next uninfected hobby, mechwarrior for example

[@Galdenberry_Lamphuck]

No it wasn't that Disney thought they could shit out bad projects year after year and keep making money. It was that there was a fem with more than 12 lines of dialogue

[@Galdenberry_Lamphuck]

​@@wolfoffenris9951 My clanner squad is comprised entirely of a polycule of transgender furries.

[@wolfoffenris9951]

@alack3879 are you pushing for games or shows or books need to include sexuality, lgbtq representation or modern politics breaking the world? No? I don't care, have fun Yes? Get out you god damned parasite

[@TheAutistWhisperer]

Because they can't discern between reality and fiction.

[@cottermcg123]

When you live in a fiction, you can’t tell the difference between fiction and reality

[@talscorner3696]

The lack of capacity to tell fact from narrative is one of the big issues of the current western world order, in fact.

[@sqwalnoc]

Also, nothing is allowed to be not related to current day political issues. They want all things to be political all the time

[@WolfJarl]

Yea it really did come off as if this guy was implying we're really going to be invaded by Slaaneshi Daemons because some people are gay or bi or trans or whatever. I literally don't care what someone is if they're not causing harm. But apparently we just can't help being assholes to one another and just let normal people enjoy a silly work of fiction.

[@Dragonheroadimus]

⁠​⁠@@WolfJarl I think the whole decadence before the fall was being pushed more than any supposed demonic incursion. Like he said in the video, it doesn’t really fit with the imperium of man, mainly because of Slaanesh being a thing. There’s are queer characters in the setting but going so far as to transition would have gotten the attention of the Dark Prince(or the Inquisition). This is the setting where prejudice, injustice and xenophobia run rampant …a galaxy at war.

[@Crown-of-Solomon]

The simplest way of describing fascism (IMO) is “everything for the state, nothing outside the state, & nothing against the state.”

[@KnjazNazrath]

Letter and verse is a safe bet tbh.

[@robsilvester6213]

That's the historic definition, by the Bad Italian Leader himself. The current definition is "Anything I don't like".

[@KissatenYoba]

No, fascism is a natural conclusion to a liberal democracy. Basically, eventually the politicians get sooo stuck and unable to pass any legislation at all that all they can do, at most, is uncontroversial stuff like installing big chessboards in parks and calling it a great investment into the future of chess in a country. This cannot continue forever, there would need be someone to break the deadlock and to simply choose one side to win while repressing the other side, to finally get at least something done. Of course, the people who will be doing the choosing will get rewarded handsomely by the interested parties, lmao

[@rolandrush5172]

Fascist “State” Communists “People” Nazi “Soul“

[@Crown-of-Solomon]

@@robsilvester6213 I think the modern interpretation could more accurately would be, if diluted utterly into one word (again, IMO) would be “Bully.”

[@seanhouser4510]

What most people fail to realize is the reason that the Emperor tried to push the fact that " religion is bad" is that he is trying to crush the belief in the Chaos Gods to weaken said gods.

[@AModernRogue]

Any belief in any god fuels the warp

[@RandomDropUp]

Reddit gonna attack this dude for years.

[@YhhMooseShyCen]

Reddit is an idiot magnet

[@KingRusso1990]

Reddit is for P****

[@Fridaey13txhOktober]

" *HERESY!* " Reddit.

[@notnurfcreanga]

reddit is a far liberal left echo chamber that hates Christianity (but afraid to criticize others) and anyone who doesn't agree that there aren't 4000000 billion genders, i go on reddit sometimes and its like going to the zoo because of the amount of utterly delusional people that act like animals when they see anything slightly conservative or reactionary, like they don't even argue about it, they either perma ban you or try to dox and yell death threats

[@internetzenmaster8952]

28:40 "Obviously Chinese-coded" More like an amalgamation of SE-Asia with pre-dominantly Japanese influences (there's a REASON everyone half-jokingly called them communist weeabos back in the day), but yeah, I can see where you'd get the Chinese-coded idea from.

[@Fridaey13txhOktober]

Things works in China nowadays, contrary to what some youtube-promoted channels claims. While Japan and S Korea are getting infected.

[@zachsmith1676]

To be fair the planets that hunted psykers and unalived them tended to still be around by the time of the great crusade, those that didn’t quickly fell when said psykers lost control of their powers when the long night started

[@tarektechmarine8209]

Again, humanity is bad, but what would you do? that is the question, and the correct answer is, you would do what the imperium done, unless you knew the future and every move in between( that would mean you would have to be god, which you are not, nor ever will be)

[@entropybear5847]

@@tarektechmarine8209 this is what makes the infantilism of critics of the setting stand out so much. They act as if the Imperium is awful purely out of choice. Nobody in a million years actually wants to live in the Imperium, because it's a compromise with a bad situation. It's a world of literal insane gods, demons, mad aliens all hell bent on humanity's extinction. Uh, yeah, I'm gonna support the genetically engineered super-soldiers and praise this Emperor guy. Progressinists are ALWAYS identifying with the bugs in fictionalsettings to the point of insanity, it's wild.

[@Dramn_]

@@tarektechmarine8209 You're saying you would immediately become genocidal because you found some people different to you?

[@guyincognito1406]

@Dramn_ Yes they use the warp as a tool, which was why big E said no bueno. Refer to the sundering. It’s 40k not your modern sensibilities ffs go away tourist.

[@Kevin-fj5oe]

​@@Dramn_Basically think of the warp as being dark. Human souls are flickers of light. Psyker souls are huge glowing beacons. Each of these are a potential way to breach from the warp into realspace. The demons can try to trick the psyker into letting them in, or they can try to brute force their way through. Either of these will end in possession or death, and can open a "door" into the warp for other demons

[@neromastic4512]

I am personally new to the Franchise thanks to SM2 It pretty much made me awe to see the universe with this level of detailed lore The Fantasy aspect is astounding to lore in comparison to real life But as much as Socialist as I am myself,I did learn one thing from 40K what is very important. Never Bring real life into 40k or 40k into real life. They should stay apart and can be compared. I enjoy the lore of 40K and the community that is dedicated to defend the lore,game and more for its existence to this world. Could say SM2 caused a chain reaction into gaming history that made others open they eyes of what a game should or should not be. The video is amazing even tho my many new friends explained me a lot about the 40k. I felt like a kid with sparkling eyes knowing what true gaming and rich lore was like. Hope that this Franchise never changes within the hearts of fans and people. For the Emperor Brothers!!

[@ericatkinson5433]

You should check out Arch's 40k lore channel. I suspect, being a self-declared socialist, you would disagree with his politics, but you wouldn't be listening for the politics, you'd be there for the lore and that I think you would appreciate.

[@neromastic4512]

@ericatkinson5433 Indeed,it's the lore that drew me to not just the game but even the animated movies. In the end, it's a game with dedicated people that has rich history and astounding lore.

[@KitMikit]

Progressivism wasn't a complete joke to me before the war in my country started. But when there's an entity bent on your destruction for the things that you are, it denies you your language, history/identity, and leaves you without electricity, running water, and food - the problems of "equality" become rather distant in comparison. The West is very privileged, and I can only imagine the number of people who would be running for their lives, as they are not prepared in the slightest for the idea of an enemy that really wants to kill them and all the things they represent, take their homes and all of their possessions. You can play any games you want, while the walls of proverbial garden that keeps you safe are intact. I hope it stays that way. Despite the tarnish of the weird girlish cultural currents of "everyone is awesome and equal no matter what" I like the Western worldview very much. But is it prepared for any resemblance of real attack on its fundamental ideas? Not sure.

[@bonbondurjdr6553]

I can assure you that I am not. Good luck in the war. 😞

[@alexfrost2799]

An interesting thing to note about Western progressivism is, as you note, how it only seems to be that way as a result of comfort or privilege, the way the Eldar Empire was before their fall. The Eldar weren't prepared for a existential pressure that wound up nearly wiping out their species. I dread to think that the progressives of the West, especially here in the Unites States, will face a similar outcome because of their own self-superiority, hubris, and mistake of believing decadence is a form of progress. If another World War were to come into being, one that could result in the destruction of the United States if we lose, I don't have faith that the common citizen will have the gall or will stand up and fight, thus destroying all of their ideals they have protested so hard for.

[@AmericanImperium1776]

@@alexfrost2799 I don’t think it’s just the United States, but the West as a whole. Post-Modernity has done a number on us that I don’t how most people will react to a draft. Personally for me, I just won’t show up. If they want me, they’re going to have to drag me.

[@alexfrost2799]

@@AmericanImperium1776 would you say the same if you saw an existential threat that wanted to destroy your way of life i.e. modern China or extremist Islam? Personally, I will stand up and fight against that. I'm not convinced most people will, which tells me they lack willpower or 'the ability to put their money where their mouths are'. To me post-modern progressivism is all a bunch of people being prissy peacocks because they don't face hardship the way less fortunate parts of the world do. And it'll all come crashing down on them.

[@AmericanImperium1776]

@@alexfrost2799 If there was fighting in my own country yes I would sign up, but I really don’t feel like going too some foreign land most Americans probably can’t find on a map when the children of politicians are excused from fighting. Also, I agree with Heinlein on the draft.

[@LordEmperorBoss]

The problem wasn’t the lack of DEI. The Slaneshi Cult had that covered in spades. The problem is they wanted DEI portrayed in a way that would be considered respectable and not headonistic. So they made a female Custode and tried to gaslight the lore.

[@derek96720]

These people only care about DEI when it comes to the top 1% of positions of power and influence. They don't care about representation in areas of blue-collar positions or represented in the enemy forces (in fiction, I mean). They wanted women in the custodes because they are considered a core faction in the lore, one of the prime faces of the WH universe, like the Ultramarines.

[@zero.9831]

@@derek96720Yeah they just have some sort of inferiority complex in not accepting that men can be and are ideally fit for militaristic machines. That, and apparently being cooperative and capable isn’t enough nowadays :/

[@Fridaey13txhOktober]

@@derek96720 A purely political decision motivated by greed and/or duress. If anything, the Adeptus Custodes shouldn't even have gender. Unless The Emperor intends for them to breed at some point.

[@notnurfcreanga]

@@zero.9831 they are already pushing an agenda in middle schools in liberal states like California that sex isn't real and that there are 0 biological differences between men and women, its literal insanity that political activists who pray on the younger generation to fall into this ideology as a coping mechanism for their issues, instead of for example a trans activists fixing their problems at a therapist they try to gaslight people into thinking there are infinite genders so they don't have to feel bad about themselves and instead be celebrated, its why they care so much to infest media with dei, "woke" games are made by devs who want to fulfil their fantasy rather than make a game that people want to play

[@Peaches-i2i]

The remarks on Russia and China also applies to the west, we just don't see it because we're on this side of the glass. I remember when I served, especially in Afghanistan it was not odd to have guys pray to God for success or have chaplains bless them en masse before action, guys holding crosses and prayer beads to their rifles, even some who thought of themselves as crusaders in the modern day. Many units also went into deployments underequipped, even in the mid 2010s. You just didn't see it happen on the news. Happened plenty in all of our past wars too. Seems to be a tragic norm for humanity in general.

[@thrwwccnt5845]

the military is always more right wing than the general population, and universities more left wing

[@MrSmith-zy2bp]

The west is a Slaanesh Cult.

[@Aliaksandr-hc1rt]

​@@thrwwccnt5845 it depends on your definition of right and left. Was St Francis right or left winger?)))

[@anon2427]

@@thrwwccnt5845university campuses are just as religious, if not more. Their religion centers around domestic materialist scientism instead of metaphysics however

[@Allex_0.9]

Warhammer triggers me only if it is ASMR. There's nothing more relaxing than hear how commissar prepares his gun or sounds of mechanics praising shining toaster.

[@BlueStarr86]

The Imperium of Man doesn't worship the government. They worship Humanity, as embodied by the Emperor.

[@pizzakiep4157]

who is the head of the government

[@Galdenberry_Lamphuck]

​@@pizzakiep4157 Currently Guilleman, Cawl, and the Lords of Terra. The Emperor is about as cognizant as a night light

[@RageAgainstTheDyingOfTheLight7]

​@@pizzakiep4157theoretically the Emperor and Cawl practically its Cawl and Robot Gorillaman

[@RageAgainstTheDyingOfTheLight7]

​@@pizzakiep4157oh yeah and the lords of terra and technically the navigators throw around some governmental weight usually they get what they want

[@BlueStarr86]

@@pizzakiep4157 He's still not the government. The Adeptus are the Government.

[@AmericanImperium1776]

And before Russia’s progressive atheist empire they were an Orthodox Christian Empire that unlike popular notions was actually industrializing and building itself up in the early 20th century. So much so that Germany feared if Russia fully industrialized, they’d be unstoppable. (This was Mustache man’s fear of the Soviets as well) P.S. Can you do a video on Mass Effect?

[@duncanharrell5009]

I'd love a video on Mass Effect!

[@leonbarry5403]

Yes, that's why Russia is still the enemy. There simply can't be a different example people can follow.

[@JMObyx]

So if Communism was aborted in Russia, they WOULD'VE been unstoppable.

[@Afrologist]

It isn't a coincidence that Russia's had a religious resurgence while other former USSR states have remained atheist. Most Russians, both those in power & regular citizens, are fully aware of the role the Church played in Russian societal progress.

[@Poppadop1]

Yes, Crusader, that is true to some degree. However, Orthodox Christian Russia was also using its industry to improve standards of living. That's why the tsars ended serfdom in Russia and supported the North in the American Civil War to end slavery when the British oligarchs supported the South. After this, both Russia and the US suffered major political assassinations (Tsars Alexander II, Alexander III, and Nicholas II - Presidents Lincoln, Garfield, and McKinley) which led to both countries allying with the Brits and the international clique. That's what the Austrian Painter was afraid of.

[@mazdrpan4099]

Im just going to point out how childishly naive is to think our own actual human history is a constant march to better future, constant progress to greater and better things. When we barely have a glimpse into history a couple thousand years ago, with sources heavily biased to suit the victors and knowledge destroyed or rewritten several times over. In reality human society and civilization is much closer to the grim darkness of 40k than it is to utopian federation of Star Trek.

[@Galdenberry_Lamphuck]

In the last 100 years humanity has progressed far beyond any previous period in terms of both acceptance and industrial output. If you don't believe bigotry can be eradicated, then simply put you are probably a bigot and need to work your way out of that.

[@therandomcommenter6629]

Humans are Masters at the art of making bulshit up in order to make ourselves feel better that applies to everything

[@GloomGaiGar]

I contest that history is written by the victors. It's written by the survivors from all sides.

[@Hakar17]

​@@GloomGaiGarEspecially before the mass proliferation of gun powder. The victors were very often illiterate horse nomads who flat out couldn't record the events.

[@LowestofheDead]

To be fair, Star Trek was written as a goal and positive vision of the future to aim for, not a prediction.

[@wheelchazeal8089]

This is an incredible piece of work you’ve put together. Incredibly well informed and written.

[@gundamzeta3447]

Slaanesh would get along well with the Magistracy of Canopus from Battletech. It’s a nation who made cat girls and centaurs and mermaids just to fuck em.

[@docthefaust4519]

So weebs unchecked 😂

[@nunyastockson5901]

excuse me but sauce on battletech catgirls. for science.

[@ericatkinson5433]

Apparently, there actually are catgirls in the Imperium. I forget where they come from but they're a recognized strain of abhuman. I don't know much about them, just that they exist and serve in the Guard.

[@AJadedLizard]

The thing I'll always admire about the Progs is their unfailing ability to decide, without any evidence, that they're really the originators of everything, and the final arbiters of its ownership. It's like Afrocentrism, except instead of just human history it's _everything_ they claim to have invented.

[@underarmbowlingincidentof1981]

I mean progressivism is by name the thing that has progressed and invented... Capitalism was once a progressive idea, so was democracy, communism, fascism, language, and agriculture. Like thats the whole thing about progress vs conservation. one brings in the new the other wants to conserve the old.

[@AJadedLizard]

@@underarmbowlingincidentof1981 No, no, no, we're not talking about _progress_ we're talking about _Progressives._ Those are two _very_ different things.

[@user-df4kf6fg7h]

@@AJadedLizard I mean, if you see yourself as the next in line torchbearer of those, who favored such instances of progress in the past...

[@hainleysimpson1507]

No different from white supremacy either. Afrocentrism is just the Afrocentrism version of race theory purported by Europeans with themselves at the top.

[@AJadedLizard]

@@hainleysimpson1507 The only people I hear insisting Europeans are at the top are Progs, so I'm not really sure what your point is.

[@CantusTropus]

As an Irishman, I'd like to formally apologise for whatever the heck our Eurovision candidate was doing. Our elites are a lot more "progressive" than the rest of us.

[@logangodofcandy]

That's what your voters said lol

[@till851]

Bro, yalls canditate was fire (from hell, lol) ngl

[@neglectfulsausage7689]

In the USA we have our own problems with people using satanic imagery. That rapper who put real blood in his line of nike shoes who made a thing about him having sodomy with the devil in his music video. The whole church of satan acting progressive and inclusive when the entire point of it is to be offensive and degrading to other cultures, putting its statues in the government buildings. Dont forget the Lucifer Trust society that has a Meditation/prayer Room in the basement of the U.N.

[@NoPeace4theEvil]

Progresive now a days just means destruction of anything related to moral and ethic

[@woodlands_]

That performance was actually good. If anything you should apologize for your cringe opinion.

[@Opus_Fluke]

You have to set Warhammer 40K alongside its contemporary of UK world building: Judge Dredd of 2000 A.D. comics (first featured in Prog 2 in 1977). Both are grim, dark, grimdark "satire" of totalitarianism, dehumanisation and bleak futures with our trademark British black humour. "The System sucks but it's better than the alternatives." Maybe Judge Death was right?

[@dawall3732]

22:35 He's absolutely right about the United Federation of Planets. Section 31 created a computer system called Control. Control created universal translators. Everyone's speech in the federation is controlled by the universal translators. Most of the population of the federation have no Clue, what each other are saying to each other.

[@neglectfulsausage7689]

Doesnt matter though. If a person says something in one language and its heard as different by someone else, then the other person will respond nonsensically. So the idea you could capsulate people in their own little imaginary worlds through UT manipulation to work together is bunk. Its like the idea "does red really exist as a color". Philosophically, no, scientifically, yes.

[@TF2CrunchyFrog]

There are enough people, esp scientists and ambassadors, who learn other cultures' languages, as long as those can be pronounced by one's larynx and mouth parts. Many people in today's Europe, India etc grow up multilingual. Why have universal translators in everyday life, when those were created to communicate with completely new species at first contact situations? The whole Section 31 stuff was created during a time in the 1990s when everything had to be "darker and edgier" and more cynical and fans had demanded the Federation should have a corrupt underbelly, because after the end of the Cold War, the new generation of fans no longer wanted to see a hopeful Federation as a contrast to the grim reality of the 1960s Cold War, but were indoctrinated by 1990s postmodernism to see every "authority/government" as corrupt and thus longed to see the Federation "exposed" and "deconstructed" as the usual stereotype of "if it's the government it must be evil". In contrast, Deep Space Nine was darker in a realistic way, showing that war can make it neccessary to put survival above lofty ideals, while also showing that even in the midst of war you can still hope and strive for eventual peace understanding across cultural divides, overcome xenophobia (of the Founders) and grant mercy (not eradicating the Founders despite the Founders being fully intend on genociding and/or enslaving the Federation, Cardassians, Klingons, Romulans etc as they had done with "solids" in their galactic quadrant out of paranoid fear. But some authors of (often non-canon) Star Trek novels and the script writers of ST: Discovery went over the top with Section 31, into full dystopian nonsense.

[@LilypadLandings]

@@TF2CrunchyFrog Back during DS9, it was left ambiguous on whether or not Section 31 was a legitimate branch of Starfleet, or a fringe group.

[@ericatkinson5433]

I think that comes from Discovery, which as I understand it is what Star Trek would be in another timeline if they didn't have Star Trek and gave criminals who disobeyed orders and started wars with other empires their own ships instead of life imprisonment or the death penalty. I think it belongs to the same not-Star-Trek timeline as the reboot movies. I vaguely remember that episode, and how it was a blatant rip off of another show but for the life of me can't quite remember which one it was and don't want to subject myself to having to watch it again to remember. It was something akin to how StarGate Universe ripped off Battlestar Galactica. Point is, that didn't happen in the same timeline as TOS , TNG , DS9 and Voyager. And as much as I cringe to say it, Enterprise. At least, if you're talking about what I think you're talking about.

[@Skritz-mt9zb]

This one is a massive wall of text, I apologize in advance. The thing with Warhammer 40k and it supposedly being this masterful anti-fascist satire is that, if you look at the setting as presented and how GW wrote it and marketed it since day one, it fall completely flat on its face and sucks at being the supposed genius anti-Thatcherite satire people claim it is. Was Rogue Trader heavily rooted in late '80s British Punk culture and anti-Thatcherite sentiment that permeated the culture at the time (2000 AD come to mind) and were most of its creators leftists? The answer is yes, but the problem is that if you take a moment to analyze the setting as it has been presented, written, sold and marketed since day one. 40k's SUPPOSED premise is that the Imperium is a horrible bigoted, corrupt hyper imperialistic if not fascistic hegemonic empire of ultimate evil. The problem is that, while the setting maybe was intended to be written like that, this is not what we got for a simple reason: wether deliberately or accidentally, we have a setting where THE IMPERIUM'S DOCTRINE IS ENTIRELY MORALLY CORRECT BECAUSE THE UNIVERSE IS JUST THAT AWFUL! Take the Imperium's fear of aliens, mutant, heretics and witches. On the face value, this is an exagerated stereotype of what religious fundamentalist and right wing/reactionary politics are strawmanned as. Except, if we look at the setting as presented, this fear is entirely justified. Most aliens beside maybe Tau are insanely evil and hostile toward humanity and anything else not their own species. Heresy and chaos corruption spread the powers of literal space hell into the real world. Psykers are genuinely dangerous if left unchecked and without controlling their powers as they can warp reality and tear open a rift in time and space where daemons can come out. If 40k was this brillaint anti fascist piece, then the Imperium would be wrong. Its fear of alien, mutants, heretics and the likes would be WRONG. Aliens would be an oppressed minority or a benevolent outside forces that either want to help humanity escape the grip of the Imperium or poor innocent aliens colonized and displaced/destroy by the Imperium and while this does happen in the lore, it is relegated to some background and the Imperium is almost always shown as the one being attacked by the aliens as opposed to attackimng the aliens to conquer new worlds. If the Imperium was in the wrong, heresy would actually be benevolent new age and progressive thinking trying to free the Imperium from the shackles of space fascism, full of oppressed minorities who are stunning and brave. Brave freedom fighters and punks fighting space fascism. Yet time and time again, rebellions against the Imperium tend to be portrayed as negatively. Now take the Genestealers, the ONLY Aliens we know of that can be crossbreed with humans If the setting was this satire on right wing strawmen, then crossbreeding with aliens would be a positive thing because diversity and all that and the Imperium would, again, be in the wrong. And yet? Genestealers are canonically the creation of a malign alien intelligence specifically designed to corrupt a population to breed useful idiot mutant hybrids whose sole purpose is to be consumed by the Hive mind once they have weakened the planet. Hell, Genestealer Cults are very steeped in Communist and Antifa-like imagery, yet GW clearly write them as useful idiots and loonies. They are literally the WORKERS RISE UP faction down to their models being miners and yet the lore clearly show them as corruption resulting from outside forces. If 40k was truly this masterful anti fascist satire, then the Imperium should have been the main human antagonist faction. Still a major player in the setting, still playable, but clearly portrayed as Star Wars galactic empire.

[@PilgrimsPass]

Yeah I agree. They created a setting that justified a lot of that behaviour. Its hillarious but intriguing at the same time. Though I would never want to live there.

[@Skritz-mt9zb]

Addendum: if the setting was clearly this masterful satire, then most of the Imperium's problems would be self created and the other xenos races would all have a legitimate beef with the Imperial war machine. They would also all have members (maybe not their leadership) who are willing to actively seek peace or make things better. Yet this is, once again, not really the case outside of the Tau. Eldars are themselves bigoted dickheads who consider human lives less important. Dark Eldars are, well, Dark Eldars and basically seek only to continue on living by being dickheads and live to be dickheads. Orks are genetically programmed for FOIGHTIN' and Tyranids are an all consuming hive mind. You'd think if the setting was this truly amazing piece of left wing satire that all these races would, at worst, only be evil because the Imperium made them that way and then it backfired on the Imperium. Still, this isn't what we got. This was NEVER what we got since day one. Everyone is kind of a dick in Rogue Trader, even if the species do slightly get along better in theory in 1st edition if only barely. Modern lore from 2nd edition onward very clearly state that there is very little to no room for cooperation and even modern lore showcase such situations as being an extremely dire 'enemy of my enemy' situation. Now obviously this is GREAT to justify a war game where every faction can in theory fight almost anybody, don't get me wrong that part is great. But the implications and worldbuilding that emerge from said implications really paint a portrait of a setting where peaceful coexistence is a goddamn pipedream of a true lunatic. I mean, even the Tau gave up on trying to be nice to some alien races like Orks and Dark Eldars because they are iredeemable.

[@LoboGuara5bruxaria]

TL;DR: Trying to make a message about the evils of xenophobia doesn't work if the main setting you create is a Cosmic Horror Story where most other species *really ARE* out there trying to get you!

[@Skritz-mt9zb]

@@LoboGuara5bruxaria Yeah pretty much.

[@In_Purple_Clad]

I'd say that everything you've said is correct. Objectivly, you are correct about 40k. Since it's inception it has tended to glorify the imperium and it's 'noble' space marines for monetary gain. Any satire got completely compromised the moment little 10 year old timmy saw the cool blue dudes in power armour and wanted an army of them, but also wanted to always play as 'the good guy' / 'the goodies'. Particularly while playing against his friend who used the spikey evil dudes in black power armour who are clearly obviously baddies. You're absolutely correct for 40k... ... ... 30k however... ... ... I think that's where the writers get to play around with and show the original intentions of the Rogue Trader era. The main reason the aliens In the 41st milenium are so viciously evil and hostile, is the emperor and his legions spent 100+ years ruthlessly slaughtering every other 'minor' alien civilisation from the galaxy, including many that would have been wonderful allies and possible bastions of the kind of utopias most Scifi universes portray. We 'could' have had a Star Trek/ Star Wars/ Mass Effect style universe where aliens and humans work together in relative harmony. We 'could' have had the 'interex' style civilisation as seen I the Horus rising books. But nooo. The emperor just had to go on a massive fascistic genocidal Crusade across the stars and ruined everything. The only aliens left alive are the ones too big and evil to be killed. That's why the Tau Empire I such a fascinating anomaly. They're exactly the kind of civilisation that would have been wiped out if the imperium met them in 30k. The only reason they're alive at all is 'cos the imperium can't get it's shit together 😋

[@Dogofwarno7]

I mean don't quote me on this, but a point I've heard from a couple other people make about 40k is that the number of humans becoming psykers is slowly increasing. don't know which books, but there's this idea that if humanity holds out for long enough, it will become a race of master psykers like what the emperor was. which makes the atheism kinda interesting, because a. no worship means chaos gods are fed less, and b. despite being born of sacrificed shamans and psychic energies, the emperor of man genuinely wasn't divine. it would take time and hardship, but his existence is a state that is ultimately achievable for mankind.

[@andrewgreeb916]

Sounds oddly similar to how the eldar are, where all are psychers just some are incredibly powerful.

[@nickmorris521]

They bring that idea up in Faith and Fire

[@James_Philip915]

Since the beginning of the dark imperium the warp got stronger. One of the effects is more psykers being born.

[@m.a.j.i.c]

Pilgrim, whoever you are - thank you. This channel is the most valuable and educational channel I've found in years. You're really good at putting those vague concepts that rattle around my head into words. That's why I've recently subscribed after listening to just one video of yours.

[@asacarpenter1162]

I dont think I've ever seen another video that draws parallels between a fictional world and our own so clearly. The quality of this video reflects how effectively and extensively you researched every topic. This one is going in my "Watch again" playlist. Edit: I wish I had discovered your channel a lot sooner. You create the exact kind of content that I've wanted to see for a long time.

[@Galdenberry_Lamphuck]

Yeah I remember when I kissed another guy once and grew another penis AND four vaginas.

[@Galdenberry_Lamphuck]

I also became a psychic elf

[@Galdenberry_Lamphuck]

From space

[@CatholicDragoon]

When it comes solely to technology the Whig view of history is... right enough, but the progressives took this and tried applying it to things like politics, the humanities, civilization in general. It's actually a very insidious argument in how it willfully misinterprets the information. "Look at this graph at the technical improvements across the centuries, this OBVIOUSLY means that my utopian ideology is inevitable thus you should blindly follow it without question." That's how many of these progressive types are.

[@Galvvy]

Yes the entire point is to stand upon your ancestors corpses as "god's gift to man" they can't possibly face the ego deflation that would accompany realizing people and most aspects of living haven't changed much at all.

[@entropybear5847]

Well said.

[@siamihari8717]

11:25 the fall of the eldar also reflects the philosophic concept of a culture and decadance within civilization. it was the roman culture we venurated and their decadance that lead to the flal

[@neglectfulsausage7689]

Oh yes, allowing trans and furry people to exist is totally decadence /s

[@dansmith1661]

Not Christian enough.

[@Admiralkirk95]

I went into this video expecting just bashing of modern politics but this was genuinely very well thought out. Deconstructing the universe and showing that it's relying on the 'cycle of humanity' and that modern ideals are very antithetical of what 40k is in alot of cases. Because so many people can't look more than around a 100 hundred or so years back and understand society is constantly reaching beyond its grip and destroying itself and forcing it to regress to save itself and eventually build back again. It's concepts so deep even the modern 40k writers don't understand it and have trouble keeping away from modern ideals(As you showed with a writer trying to sneak in transgenderism. I feel one of the other large issues just in general people have lost the ability to say "It doesn't appeal to me, so I will stop caring about it and I will trust others will have this mature outlook" because alot of times it's either the person personally resents 40k, or is fighting on behlf of others who will theoretically be harmed for the franchise. Even though any normal person knows that this horrible universe is purposely pushed to the extreme and that the darkness of the future is the appeal of the franchise. A safe way to experience a horrible terrible universe without actually living in it, or creating a society like that. Hitting off the transgender thing again, if we see Slaanesh as an evil enity in 40k, then somehow that will brain wash you into hating trans people. Only people who already disliked or hated trans people will go that way(Or very mentally weak/unstable people) you probably already feltthat way to begin with. It may also be because 40k does sort of point the finger at modern views and shows why they can be harmful and it threatens them. God forbid you don't enjoy a franchise you don't like(And feel left out for some reason), am I right? My brother once said something that hit hard to me "If you go into a franchise saying "I love the franchise for what it could be" and not "I love the franchise for what it is" then you're not going in for the right reasons" (This ideology works for a franchise that just started, but a long time 30 year old franchise, no) Just seems like insanity to force yourself into something you don't like just to 'improve it' when you could just enjoy something you do like and just build upon what you like. But I am also becoming a star wars refugees. I always had 40k in my heada little for a long time. I owned Space marine 1 for over a decade. But only recently have i finally been pushed to far by Disney that I can't justify caring anymore. So I have moved on and am hoping the 40k fandom is stronger in its attempts to keep the franchise the way its suppose to be. It'snot a nice universe..... it's appealing for being the opposite and glorifying courage for little return. To win a war just to move onto the next hell hole, night mare inducing war. And it becoming a more and mroe mainstream is scaring me that will be pressured to degrade into modern bland drivel like all the rest.

[@ZgermanGuy.]

Its to bad that those people who need to see this video the most will simply ignore it and return to their Twitter Bubble

[@gregorygreenwood-nimmo4954]

If you want to be really dark about it, you could argue that all you need to do to get a 40K style scenario in a broad sense is take the Star Trek continuity and add deep time unmediated by political and social plot armour. Star Trek assumes a sort of Fukuyama-style 'End of History - that the inevitable end point of history is the creation of an eternally stable and perfect techno-utopian society that will endure essentially until the stars go out. 40k, as Pilgrim Pass observes, rejects the idea that there is such an optimistic and idealised end of history. In that setting, social and technological advancement and collapse exist in cycles that are pretty much inescapable until some manifestation of universal entropy - whether the Ruinous Powers or the killer space bug Tyranids or something else - finally destroys civilisation once and for all. It is hinted that some transcendence into some higher state of psychic being might allow humanity to escape that fate, but that road is long, fraught with danger, and the outcome is far from certain. Even if a culture achieves a level of technology that is utterly mindboggling, like the old pre-Imperial human stellar civilisation did during the Dark Age of Technology, in the long run such achievements are only ever temporary and sooner or later, in the long view of history, such cultures, for all their achievements, ultimately collapse back into ignorance and barbarism - the fall of Rome over and over again, except with more ray guns and interstellar travel. In 40K's world view, the Federation could even have existed for a while in the past of the setting, with all its tech and utopian aspirations, but sooner or later the inevitable happened, and the heavy hand of entropy ground down the Federation leading to collapse and the continuance of the cycle the Federation erroneously assumed it had escaped until the 40K continuity emerged tens of millennia later.

[@zeehero7280]

Star Trek assumes no such thing lol.

[@gregorygreenwood-nimmo4954]

​@@zeehero7280 Do you care to expand on your argument? Techno-utopianism seems to be a pretty strong theme of Star Trek, and nothing in any of the series seems to me to consistently imply that the Federation is viewed as a society with a sell by date that is living on borrowed time. Everything seems to indicate that the Federation is a progressive vision for an ideal future, and even if it stumbles from time to time it is never really in any danger of being supplanted by a differing social and political system in the long term. Former adversaries are absorbed into the system or converted into allies on several occasions, usually with little in the way of negative consequences. A post scarcity culture that can solve almost any problem with the application of more and more technology and appears (from several time travel episodes from various Star Treks series) to depict cultures many centuries into the future that still maintain Federation style values - that really does sound like an 'End of History' scenario to me, so what would your alternate interpretation be?

[@sharojak9401]

Also the various Human Super-Civilizations in the Xeeleeverse. Natural Totalitarianism is an extremely stable system as long as there is an enemy, but as soon as the threat is gone the system dies. Every system has some sort of crutch that it relies on.

[@Klongu_Da_Bongu]

@@gregorygreenwood-nimmo4954 I love both Star Trek's optimistic version of the future and something like Dune, where it is this same cycle. However I believe in the latter.

[@gregorygreenwood-nimmo4954]

@@Klongu_Da_Bongu I love Star Trek too - Deep Space Nine is my favourite of the Trek series - and we can only hope that such a bright and enlightened future awaits our species, though with that said prior historical experience suggests that the road ahead will probably be rather rockier no matter how good our intentions might be. Dune is a legendary, seminal work of sci fi, and it is of course possible to enjoy more than one fictional vision of the future, and indeed enjoy different fictional futures that have conflicting or even antithetical perspectives on the nature of society and our species at large. For myself, Star Trek, the original and Prequel Star Wars trilogies (I would rather not get into a discussion about the more modern stuff), Dune, The Foundation series, The Expanse, Babylon 5, Warhammer 40K - that is just a quick selection of the IPs I enjoy, and I see no contradiction in such an eclectic spectrum of taste.

[@Neropol14]

I always feel stupid when watching your videos. I mean, I learn a lot, but it's insane how many new things you can talk about that I never even thought of.

[@Specoups]

Learning is natural, do not think so little of you. Being willing to learn already puts you leagues beyond the average person in terms of intellectual integrity and legitimacy.

[@thehale_]

Hey, it’s good that you’re seeking knowledge. Many people go their whole life without getting this far.

[@anotherbacklog]

This video aged perfectly. Watching this again after an Adam Something video calling Space Marine 2 problematic.

[@Jojonogogo]

0:36 and that is my problem with modern 40K, that is no longer true, ever since 2017, we have had technological progress and for lack of a better word ‘liberalization’ of the setting.

[@andryuu_2000]

Where's the problem?

[@Jojonogogo]

@@andryuu_2000 that the progress of technology is no longer inhibited thus making the setting move forward towards a “lighter” tone and making it less interesting.

[@0816M3RC]

​@@Jojonogogo You like being depressed all the time?

[@Jojonogogo]

@@0816M3RC depressed, no. Enjoying a story with stakes and actual suspense rather than dragon ball super, yes.

[@TheTigerz]

@@Jojonogogowell I don’t know anything about warhammer but in the end it’ll happen eventually? That’s how time works. In war you are going to build up no matter what. Sure maybe it is going towards a happier time and maybe they shouldn’t happen but building up tech over years of fighting is going to happen no matter what

[@Returnofthecrown]

I played a game called space hulk for sega saturn. And the marines would argue with each other all the time. Was very funny. "Azreal !! MOVE!! Get out of my way!"

[@dr3dg352]

Oh I'd love to play this! 😆

[@jonanlsh]

Ive never clicked on a "new video" notification so quickly

[@nullgravity2583]

I'm dying without your video essay videos bro 😫😫😫😫

[@WhiteLeviathan]

40k ultimately triggers them because unlike many other properties, it is utterly bathed in everything they hate, and subtle changes to properties, which is what they're decent at, is nearly impossible because they'd have to entirely rewrite everything to make it work in the universes own lore. And the lore now is what makes it popular to begin with.

[@rogue8507]

Warhammer 40k 🤝 Berserk Pissing off people

[@flatheadgg2443]

Can't really compare them tho, the japanese are just built different

[@chrisAN3681]

🤣!

[@toastle8005]

@@flatheadgg2443 40k is the ultimate sci-fi creative sandbox, Beserk is the greatest dark fantasy ever written, and some of the greatest art to ever have been drawn by human hands. Both great to have, but for different purposes

[@kyodarkness9243]

Pissing off twitter/reddit*

[@AliceBowie]

Berserk has only pissed people off in 3 ways. The Twitter people who got triggered by grape, the fans triggered by the awful 3D anime adaptation, and the manga fans angry about Miura's sporadic updates. 40K pisses people off in a few ways. Hobbyists who hate price-gouging and planned scarcity of models, fans of neglected factions that want updated codexes and models, fans of the fluff who hate when they change stuff, like primaris marines, and communists who want female space marines and gay stuff, and imaginary moms who might be triggered by daemonettes with one teat out.

[@chadnine3432]

Section 31 was a late entry into Trek lore, invented during the run of Deep Space Nine, and wildly misinterpreted by Discovery.

[@zeehero7280]

They aren't villains. they are a necessary evil, getting their hands dirty in secret so nobody else has to.

[@xelan8549]

12:15 LOL Yes El Salvadore under it's new glorious patriarch has the potential to become the next great empire... But for the love of God don't say it out loud it's meant to be a surprise XD

[@frogmastiff8198]

this is the best take put forward on how putting progressive ideas into 40K is nonsensical because of its inherent setting, liked and subbed sir thank you

[@ExGen8]

Ok, now do a video on the orcs of LOTR; Specifically the theme of evil that is inherent. We'll see how much more lefties would get pissed off

[@AmericanImperium1776]

Actually Tolkien went back and forth all throughout is life on whether the orcs were truly evil or not.

[@chillyavian7718]

@@AmericanImperium1776I think the best way to see it is that they have the same ability to choose between good and evil, but since Sauron, and originally Morgoth, would notice that and make, ‘corrections’, not many make the choice for good

[@AmericanImperium1776]

@@chillyavian7718 Yeah, very true. It’s really kind of like Eugenics. Morgoth and Sauron genetically enhanced a group of living beings to be subservient and loyal.

[@underarmbowlingincidentof1981]

tbh if Tolkien wrote LotR today you'd get right wing grifters on youtube raging about how the feminized male "elves" are being depicted as pure and how typical it is that a few trees destroy the person trying to industrialize the world.

[@zeehero7280]

but leftist evil is not inherent. it's much worse. it's not the orcs fault in LOTR that they are evil. but it IS the leftists fault that they chose to be evil.

[@laststand6420]

It's hilariously ironic that the 40k universe will probably be destroyed by a demonic cult in reality. GW is the real chaos demon?

[@zeehero7280]

Leftism is a Chaos cult.

[@Quark214]

The Chaos god of Greed, James Workshop.

[@underarmbowlingincidentof1981]

"le people I don't like are the bad guys in my favorite franchise :O" fking redditor mindset polluting the hobby man... wtf

[@dr3dg352]

There *are no* demonic cults in reality. At least none big enough to actually do anything.

[@underarmbowlingincidentof1981]

@@dr3dg352 the vatican literally exists??? they were compromised by mithraic cults long ago

[@derek96720]

The best thing about morality in WH is that, when it comes to survival of the species, there is no good or evil. Righteousness is whatever ensures your species isn't wiped out by psychotic cultish elves or devoured by swarms of insectoids.

[@jimluebke3869]

I'm not entirely convinced that _A Connecticut Yankee_ satirizes tradition any more than it satirizes the outlook of said Yankee. As a side note, you could see Tolkien's _The Scouring of the Shire_ as the English answer to Twain's novel.

[@unmitigateddisaster3793]

What makes this debate so amazing is that, even by the extremely low standards of a twitter war, it's stupid. It's a group of people who don't know what Warhammer 40k is in a screaming match with a group of people who don't know what progressivism is.

[@andryuu_2000]

Also, most of those that see Warhammer 40k as a sanctification of conservative Christian values are, and how the heretics symbolize the minorities or whatever they don't like, apparently are posers that don't really know shit about lore, given that in a few books homosexuality is barely addressed and looked over as something not even worth of attention: it's not common but it's normalized to the point no one cares. As long as you're not xeno, mutant or witch, you're good to go, and live just as badly as everyone else.

[@walmartian422]

@@andryuu_2000 If you can't tell it's pretty obviously coded in a certain way. Things do not have to be overt and explicit you also don't have to have a feeling of moral pain when you identify with something that is coded that way. I liked watching the imperials in the old star wars movies and it's been discussed to death that George Lucas obviously based them on Fascism. I unironically like the imperials anyway and it doesn't matter to me whatsoever that they were based on an actual controversial group. 40k is very much overtly leaning heavily into theocratic and nationalist iconography.

[@walmartian422]

@@andryuu_2000 "given that in a few books homosexuality is barely addressed and looked over as something not even worth of attention: it's not common but it's normalized to the point no one cares. As long as you're not xeno, mutant or witch, you're good to go, and live just as badly as everyone else." yea except for the entire cult of Slaanesh which is pretty obviously an allegory for extreme homosexuality/sadomasochism/and other forms of gratuitous sexual expression. Within warhammer in one way you are correct because moral judgements are not made or forced upon the audience the reality just is as it is every faction is valid but to say that these factions are clearly not coded in one way or another would be to just obfuscate the obvious artistic licenses. There are no real protagonists but at the end of the day the imperium is the most widely expanded on faction and is the most fleshed out so they are in a way the de facto "protagonists" however just because someone is a protagonist that doesn't mean they are automatically morally correct and moral judgements are pretty much meaningless in the universe of 40k to begin with.

[@yowutupimbilbo]

​@@walmartian422 I really have to disagree with your take on what Slaaneshi cults represent, although I accept that interpretations like this come down to personal perspective. In all three Warhammer settings (WFB/The Old World, Age of Sigmar, and 40k), Slaanesh is regarded as the god of excess. This to me indicates that they are about more than just sex and sexuality. I'm not super familiar with the fantasy or AOS lore, but I know that there exist Slaaneshi characters in one whose method of "excess" are wealth and/or food. I also know that there are characters like Ciaphas Cain in 40k who have plenty of sex without being Slaanesh worshippers. Slaanesh isn't about the sex, Slaanesh is about going overboard. Sex and drugs are just the simplest ways to get that point across, and Black Library writers have never been great at metaphors or doing things that are difficult. I say this as someone who is generally very pro-sex and supports non-traditional sexual lifestyles. I have met people who have taken their lifestyle WAY too far. Because of that, I think Slaanesh serves as a bit of a warning against becoming one of those people, rather than as an allegory for non-traditional lifestyles. It's also worth pointing out that one of my favorite books in 40k (The Lion, Son of the Forest by Mike Brooks) contains all but confirmed gay space marines, despite my disagreement with the idea that space marines are sexual beings.

[@yuridominick4227]

Wow a new pilgrim's pass video just released right after my college graduation. Today was a good day

[@AmericanImperium1776]

Congratulations! 🎉👍

[@Poppadop1]

And good luck! ;^_^

[@yuridominick4227]

@@AmericanImperium1776 THANK YOU!

[@yuridominick4227]

@@Poppadop1 yes i will, got lots of plans in the future

[@gonkdroid8279]

Congratulations!

[@mikepalmieri4989]

10:05 Omg i cant stop laughing at the IRONY

[@dean_l33]

I was wondering when is your next upload. Right on schedule

[@YTDariuS-my6dg]

A comment I saw about progressivism and traditionalism puts it well, why we view progress as positive - when progress and tradition clash to determine the outcome, there are logically two results - either progress wins and we adopt new ways, or tradition wins and everything stays the same. And therein lies the problem - if the progress is BAD it loses, but if everything stays the same people don't really perceive it as anything having happened to begin with, but if progress is GOOD then it wins and people naturally notice it. In other words, though I'm explaining it badly, progress is only observed when it happens, and it typically only happens when it's good (or largely perceived as good). People don't usually notice something not happening, so when progress is a bad thing and therefore doesn't happen, people don't notice it - ergo, the perception of progress being an exclusively good thing is a matter of *bias.* EDIT: please excuse me pitting tradition against progress, my English isn't working today as it isn't my mother tongue, so I figured it would be a decent enough substitute for the word I WANTED to use but forgot

[@toastle8005]

You wrote it out very well, don’t stress

[@Krasser_Crusader]

That was a very very good description you gave there and I just want to add something that could be nice to think about: „Tradition is the answer to a problem we forgot about. If you remove the tradition the problem returns“

[@cabnbeeschurgr]

I think the issue we're running into is that the people in power are trying to force their bad "virtuous" progress into a society that doesn't want it.

[@YTDariuS-my6dg]

@@cabnbeeschurgr hm... Well. I'm not experienced enough to comment. It seems like an American thing, and while that does necessarily make it a GLOBAL thing considering the USA's influence, I'm just not at all familiar with what's _actually_ happening beyond what I see on the internet. How much is propaganda? How much of it is informed and how much is people repeating what they're told? I just don't know. It always seems like America pushes the extreme in all things, good and bad, and the reactions are just as strong. Things I'd find a minor nuisance are reacted to as if they were on par with war crimes (though being a Balkaner I don't exactly get to say that) while big matters are swept under the rug by those responsible. I don't know, even "callouts" seem weirdly uninspired. It all looks like a practiced dance performed by their politicians that's meant to keep the people squabbling while the big shots rake in all the cash - mind you, all politicians do it since all politicians are rats, it just feels way worse in America. I kind of feel blessed that my country only had to deal with shady business deals and money laundering. At least it's something everyone understands. On the other hand, nobody seems to have a fucking clue what's happening in the USA, including the citizens thereof. All this to say, basically, I literally have no clue on the matter whatsoever.

[@majormajorasic]

IE: The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Or nobody thinks about electricity until a blackout occurs.

[@guyincognito959]

It is satire that gets very dark, into the cynical-tragical spectrum. Many people have a wrong concept of good and evil it seems. We can have good intentions, but in the end we need to make sure that those are not corrupted, and used against this very spirit. Or the outcome will be catastrophic and we will be to blame, no matter the intention we originally sought...

[@logangodofcandy]

The left has no sense of morality. Might makes right to them, and they demand to be the ones with power

[@pledgebigmike2977]

Which is exactly what Horus represents. He really did originally want to break free from the tyranny of the Imperium and have humanity be free of the "Imperial Truth" that was forced upon everyone by Big E. However, as the road to Hell is paved with good intentions, this viewpoint became corrupted, and we all see now in 40k what the consequences of that whole little Heresy are...

[@lordcommissar7813]

People get triggered by 40k becuase they realize they will never live long enough to see the emperor reveal himself in 28k years and that upsets them.

[@soffren]

I haven't been this early in a while, so I'll leave a proper comment after I finish Edit: this all reminds me of the Drukari Succubus who was trans (Da Big Dakka by Mike Brooks). That character made perfect sense and didn't break immersion at all since A) Succubus as a role/rank has an obvious feminine overtone and B) the Drukari are master "flesh crafters" who would absolutely be able and willing to do this. The issue arises when GW tries to pretend that everyday imperial citizens can be trans (news flash, all you actually get to be is corpse starch)

[@helekarsargarian6831]

But being masters of flesh the concept of trans is redundant, they can make the complete perfect change, from male to female, there's no trans there. They don't need to make something look like X or Y, they can put a brain on a new body or implant organs directly without any kind of rejection. Also let's remember that, to eldar, gender is just another trait, like being blonde or tall. So i believe, to Drukkhari, changing gender would be similar to us going to a hairdresser because we feel like wanting a perm. It's not something to write about EDIT: Also let's be real, anybody whose name is not Asdrubael Vect won't ever go voluntarily to an Homunculus, much less for something so banal as to change a trait, when there's better things to do, like eating antimatter or fighting a chaos spawn with a spoon.

[@internetzenmaster8952]

On paper, the sex-changed Succubus made sense. Mike Brooks writing it so that an arm basically jumps out of the book and stabs you in the eye was what threw me off and had me actually pause for a second. I was like "fucking really Brooks? Can you not come off sounding like a snob when doing this?" The whole 'awkward romance/courting dance' of the two Dark Eldar archons in the book was an entertaining read when I wasn't enjoying the spiky gitz getting krumped by me favorite Ork boys though.

[@soffren]

@@internetzenmaster8952 I agree with the sentiment, but snobby is kind of the only trait he has up his sleeve when it comes to writing space elves so I give him a pass.

[@blank4227]

@@internetzenmaster8952 mike brooks is writing it because he has an agenda, and would like to staple his agenda into the setting as best he can. it makes no sense to defend it whatsoever unless you agree with his agenda.

[@blank4227]

yeah man it's just an inch, just give them an inch bro it won't be a mile I swear

[@orionstark]

I am still waiting for a video where Pilgrim's Pass draws the two lines on transhumanism. Thought of the day: Kal'El of Krypton is basically the perfect embodiment of the hyperhuman, which is why his story is so endearing.

[@tau-5794]

Didn't he already do that in relation to 40k? Space marines are basically not transhumans because they are not replacing humanity, but enhancing it. The Mechanicus are more transhumanist because they view their natural flesh as a weakness and want to replace it with metal they view as sacred.

[@gonkdroid8279]

I'd love to see Pilgrim do even more on transhumanism

[@KnightofRome01]

Great video as always my friend. I really felt it when you talked about being a Star Wars refugee because of politics and lamenting about 40k and it's troubles, and your analysis of the narrative of 40k was spot on and similar to a paper I wrote for a literature class in college, post bachelor degree. If you are interested can I recommend Battletech to you? I have been a fan of the setting for over two decades and it is very grounded and space opera like.

[@nmorgan7170]

This is a great video. Deserves all the up votes. I would be interested to hear what the take is on Iain Banks' Culture stuff. It presupposes humanity is incapable of galactic sustainability so needs to invent godlike quantum AIs benevolent enough to keep humans around as a side project to pass the time. Dystopic, sure, but still creates an amazing free living space for humans who can be any level of awesome they choose to be, or as depraved for as long as they want. But IMHO any adversary in 40K would be decimated by the AIs in the Culture, except the Chaos faction at first - the AIs would figure out how to deal with the Chaos interdimensionality eventually. Also, ripping on university students is not looking at the truth we have been arrogant towards tradition since the scientific era began. In the Culture universe being humble or arrogant is irrelevant and simply part of being human. One of the reason the AIs keep us around in Banks' work, to study our inherent conflictual nature without judgement to learn more about surviving in an incredibly dangerous universe.

[@MrCmon113]

The "Prime Directive" in Star Trek is grimdark as fuck, precisely because social progress and technolog are so important. The UFP is condemning countless quadrillions if not quintillions of beings to pointless suffering and death.

[@Culexus101]

They really messed up the PD in TNG. In TOS there were several eps where Kirk and co were visiting pre warp planets on Starfleets orders. The PD was intended to stop Sf crews playing god, they're basically naval personnel, it's above their pay grade to engage in all but the most basic of diplomacy with new species. Warp capable was an arbitrary rule but I think it was chosen to let captains talk to other ships they met while exploring the cosmos. It's the civilian govts job to determine if a species merits first contact, TNG forgot that.

[@anonymousperson1771]

​@@Culexus101 I'd suggest in that context TNG was a "have cake and eat it" evolution of progressive values like anti-imperialism. Exploiting the protagonist role to simultaneously frame the moral and philosophical superiority of the Federation in solving problems - the problematic society of the week, or avoidable tragedy if it wasn't for their beliefs or tradition - while pretending they are impartial that don't judge or intervene in others civilisations. The episode Wesley fell on a bush which the planetary law punishes by death is one example.

[@freespace771]

You need to make a short of around 11:10 with the scenes of degen happens on earth followed by the Hersey Alert! I laughed so hard.

[@zerk813]

As a older gentlemen who has spent many years studying classical liberalism and the effects of the enlightenment. This is a extremely well done piece. I think most people wont understand the depth of thought you put into this fantasy setting. They will scoff at it as bigotry or radicalness, but to me this was phenomenal and a treat.

[@Galdenberry_Lamphuck]

The video says lgbt people are destroying America and the liberal is like "yeah that seems about right" Fuckin liberal

[@Channel-io4xu]

It's for no other reason than the fact that it appeals to men.

[@Naturessoulcelt]

Which is great. Woman and men can have different things. Women are very much represented in 40k as well. However while I agree that people shouldnt just come in and force their ideals and agendas on the lore or community, it shouldnt be gate kept and as the lore is, it should be enjoyed by everyone.

[@nighthawk_2k827]

A question for your channel in general, I think you’ve read ASOIAF and already pointed out the less favorable aspects especially prominent in the tv show. Would you be able to do a video about the better aspects of the books, like pointed out in Quinn’s Ideas videos about ASOIAF or the more philosophical aspects and also more classical fantasy tropes like knight errantry, knighthood and magic in especially “A Feast for Crows”. Considering the series isn’t done that could be somewhat difficult and because sometimes the good aspects are all over the place, but maybe it could be a video about chivalric culture and its appearance in fantasy, considering you’re a crusading catholic. The hedge knight stories and older book art like that of Ted Nasmith and some water colorings which I don’t know the author of inspired me to think of that aspect of the books. I know that you make videos which also touch on current topics, but I was really enchanted by knightly culture, in fiction and reality, though both is actually the same which I found out studying the Middle Ages more extensively like in Froissarts chronicles

[@AmericanImperium1776]

I second this. I too would like him to talk more about ASOIAF.

[@PilgrimsPass]

I have considered it.

[@nighthawk_2k827]

Thanks (excuse my English by the way, I’m German and I don’t know what the hell was wrong with me that day)

[@crownedcrow0091]

Very well done video my man its been a while since I've seen a video where I find myself agreeing with it over and over and over again.

[@roycehuepers4325]

8:27 Ironically, at least from what i can see, the only way they could introduce liberal ideology into their lore is to literally introduce something akin to the Bible and Hebrew like culture, or the Knights Templar and other similar types of warriors. (Note it'd be closer to classical liberalism, such as Locke. ) as the Bible definetly doesn't advocate pacifist ideology but it does state not to hate even your enemies. A King David type of figure for example would have the power to defeat his enemies, but also maintain that kingdom and a Jesus type figure God would encourage forgiveness. Basically, "the Praus shall inherit the earth" not meek, but someone of great power and great mercy.

[@TF2CrunchyFrog]

If you think the Old Testament is in any way shape or form "liberal" or promotes the ideals of the Enlightenment or even modern 21st century urban Western ultraliberal values, you have clearly never read the Bible or Torah. quote: "but it does state not to hate even your enemies" Not true. Those bits in the Ten Commandments about "loving thy neighbor" and not killing? If you look at the original Aramaic and Hebrew Torah version, this is _specifically_ about ancient Israelites being told to not kill or steal from other Israelites! All other tribes were fair game to enslave or murder... In fact, there are multiple instances where cult leader Moses claims that the tribal god of the Israelites _demands_ they should genocide other tribes for being "unbelievers", kill the men and boys, enslave their women, take their girls "who have not yet lain with a man" for themselves to rape, and steal their lifestock. Which Moses and his son Aaron later escalated to "kill everyone and their lifestock too and raze their cities because they're unclean and their culture must not pollute our culture, and then we take their land as ours because Jahwe gave it to us". All religious movement that promotes total pacifism have either cheated and let others do the fighting while their monks prayed (Buddhism), or stayed a fringe cult of ascetics (Jainism), or were brutally eradicated by a more powerful state religion as a threat to its authority (the pacifistic Christian splinter sect of the Cathars in France, after the medieval Catholic Church declared a crusade against them for daring to say the Pope was corrupt).

[@dansmith1661]

Matthew 10:34-36 34 “Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35 For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law. 36 And a person's enemies will be those of his own household.