Why Your Tracks Sound Cheesy

[@eyvindjr]

Don't stop at octaves! You should find the key signature where your synths sound the best too.

[@Pyroific]

very true, a lot of electronic music is around D-F because the sub bass hits hardest at those frequencies!

[@Pyroific]

of course!@@tuulymusic3856

[@darz_k.]

Can you elaborate on that point please? Or link to some info on it?

[@Pyroific]

the root note of your song, try pitching everything but the drums up or down a few semitones and see what feels best@@darz_k.

[@eyvindjr]

@@darz_k. This is especially important for the low end. Make sure to pick a key where the lowest note of your bass line is in a sweet spot between to muddy and deep enough by changing the pitch by half steps. You can do this with all other instruments too. For acoustic instruments, the way they are played also matters.

[@rymbre]

I couldn't stop listening to the track previews, the way it switched to version 2 was so good. Awesome tips!

[@ac34116]

id say the higher octave sounds more cheesy but thats maybe just me, but i agree with you that the change in octave is actually a sweet development if used together

[@danny.phanmusic]

yup its too good to be in this video

[@allseven5177]

@@ac34116 I agree. The higher octave sounds more cheesy. It all sounds cheesy.

[@MosheBenChaim]

@@allseven5177 The music itself is cheesy.. 😂

[@hertzcules]

I like cheese

[@notyourmother73]

Okay

[@py_a_thon]

Everything is about context. If you mean the meme of "cheesy music", then the context is what you do with that perception. Do you make a meta joke about your cheesy bass line? Do you lean into the concept fully and make an absurdly loud 4 bar loop that hits really loud? Do you invert the concept, and use it as a way to shock the audience before the "real music" kicks in? Or do you just avoid the perception entirely, and then you know what it is that you do not want to create as music?

[@unknownmusicman]

Me too

[@inline4forlife]

@@py_a_thon 💯 even the transition here between the two versions added some interest to the track

[@VOIDSTRANGER2099]

The cheesier the better

[@francisguyo]

Music creation has so many secrets just like in this video. You need a lot of learning and deep understanding to create amazing music. Great content!

[@ceasarsalad2055]

But the thing is these aren't even kept as "secrets". These things are really just naturally adapted through years of experience and one wouldn't even think about explaining this to a beginner because they wouldn't even notice themselves that this is their thought process. It's amazing really how he can teach us small things that makes a huge difference

[@Nako3]

At the same time you can have 0 music knowledge and still create something great

[@ileryon4019]

Bruh just learn music theory

[@alexmasak]

This isn't a secret at all. This is beginner level stuff that you should just intuitively know without anyone telling you

[@schqrr]

exacttly bro

[@GuRuGeorge03]

Great advice. I don't make music anymore but i remember learning lessons like this the hard way through 1000s of hours of experimenting, listening to my tracks in actual clubs and stuff. Some great advice that i can give is to try to copy your favourite music, you will hit roadblocks quite quickly and it will show you what you don't know yet, so you can then search for the information more directly

[@TheR6R6R]

+1 This is what I do all the time. The only negative I can think of is that we have to be able to rub away the sound of the artists' we were 'studying' when the time finally comes for us to create something original. Otherwise, that's just copying.

[@kantstress]

ya this is the method

[@volderhamer]

@@TheR6R6R Although if you copy from enough people, it becomes original again.

[@andyto629]

Yep. Go for the sound you love. It’s pretentious to think that your track will even be compared to the Artist you’re channeling

[@kantstress]

@@andyto629 fr

[@ihaetschool3361]

another tip for aspiring prodeucers who don't want cheesiness: start out making songs in minor keys... major is arguably the hardest key to work with, after locrian. it's not easy to make something non-cheesy with it. it's also very easy to make something really happy with minor, contrary to how minor is usually described. try making a VI-VII-v-i progression, for example. in A minor, that would be F-G-Em-Am. seriously, it's a great, happy-sounding progression. try throwing in a #VII (G#CD# here)in there, too, it can add some spice to the progression, the sky's the limit here

[@andyto629]

It’s cool to see someone actually talking classical theory on here, especially Roman numerals

[@Beyond_The_Fade555]

I love how generous you are with the knowledge u give away, thank u ive been gollowing u for 5 years, and learned the most i know from this channel.

[@timmeeow]

I love simple tricks that you never think of despite seeming obvious. I'm on board too, sometimes when I say "finishing touches" on a project, that means I'm sitting in my editor incrementing a value in the default window then running it from the top. I know I like what I created, it just doesn't sound good yet lol Great video! The overlay information you add like "|----| subbass would sit here" is so helpful and entertaining to boot.

[@yamamushi]

I love these short to the point videos covering the problem and the solution in a few minutes, rather than the 30 minute videos one comes across from other KZbinrs where they have to try to sell you something at least 3 times in the video and you feel like they could have covered the same thing in a third of the time.

[@aaronbazil]

Those two versions could just be one section, then leading up to the next version to uplift the mood. One section alone the whole time, as far as arrangement goes, would become stale. So there's movement between sections: you start at the bottom and rise up.

[@athmaid]

Yeah that's a common problem with EDM imho, people copy paste too much without thinking about common methods like sequences to make a track more interesting and have it build and progress naturally

[@aaronbazil]

@gordonbeckgb I mean, yeah, there's a place in the world for microwave ready edm tracks, as much as there is the opposite where there are elements of actual songwriting and musicianship. I love both. If I can, I wanna marry both together, if I can, in my own world.

[@Wendel_Kos]

this is MASSIVE advice and a trap i used to fall for! Nexus and a lot of general stuff have no beef at lower octaves. Its much better to program lower octaves yourself and give those sounds a little space. Thanks for this video :)

[@LLAWREN]

not only do you give great advice, your music also sounds awesome! 🔥👏😊

[@nrXic]

I make Happy Hardcore so this actually helps me make cheesier stuff. Thanks for all your tutorials, all great stuff!

[@JoeStuffzAlt]

I kind-of liked the cheese, but this tutorial can be used to create cheese. Also, I like some of the EQ tricks.

[@uffevonlauterbach]

I don't really make EDM anymore, but the topic of production is still important, so I feel like I learned something.

[@etfoltz]

5:45 I love the way the lines dance to the music. They look like they're alive and enjoying it :)

[@Bluth96]

I like your style of teaching and sound of your music! Can you do a long form video of you just making a song so beginners can get a feel of the process?

[@LogicKidroy]

Big Z sharing really useful knowledge.

[@SunIsLost]

Yep

[@mattmavromusic]

Such a simple but effective tip! Thank you!!

[@djicebreaker80]

That was pretty cool, thanks for sharing your knowledge about how changing just the octaves makes it’s a sweet and very uplifting feeling, more brighter

[@leonhard3944]

2:27 I have definitely made this mistake before! Thanks for setting me straight

[@xxzman]

Such a sick track. Great tips and sounds!

[@ericlemontu9099]

Great Stuff Z, as usual ! Thanks for your time and sharing your knowledge!

[@FrankHarding-g6c]

Love it, this stuff is so important but so few people take the time to talk about it. Biggups!

[@Maltino_Music]

Great Tutorial! Can u do a Video on using Stereo vs. Mono? Where do pan certain elements and what instruments should be centered.

[@hithere4289]

theres no rule, but to get to that point where you need no rules you first need to make your song sound strong. that means all important elements are center and additive elements are free to roam the stereo spectrum like say a shaker thats at the bottom of your mix? well you can make it go L R in a soft way to give it movement

[@Maltino_Music]

@@hithere4289Thanks. I Usually make Pads a bit more stereo and atmoshpere drones. I try to keep vocals, leads and bass centered and try to use the stereo for the drums (like shakers and stuff stereo). Would u agree with me when i say, that u can put ur core elements in mono, because if u do it well, every element has its own space and does not crowd the center too much? Best of greetings

[@willyp249]

not many times i like the music in instruction videos but this is pretty good

[@PATRICKoxoEthafulm]

Man that ‘just eq it to make room for the bass ‘was something I needed to hear to get me out of the box

[@CombatCatYT]

Of course remember. It depends on the song. If you are trying to make a cheesy sounding song. Do that. Creative pursuit triumphs.

[@ketz_165]

Happy deadmau5 vibes that was fire

[@youngkizzi9944]

Just sooo insane ❤❤❤

[@elijahlucian]

Your videos are the bomb. And your music is dope too

[@DisRespectoids]

Right away you can tell version 2 is better because it’s a better version of the same idea, one of the big mistakes I and probably apt of people make with our music is being too into one moment and not into how to maximize what that moment represents in the best way possible, what can you add and subtract change variate etc it’s so important

[@hubertprieger1766]

Super great tip! Your advice is very helpful. Thanks so much and thanks for your great music! I like this track

[@JulesKennedvitch]

This is what I was thinking of lately ! It's amazing how this video was suggested to me at the right moment ! Great content, thank you ! And your music sounds so good !

[@phillynn79]

Wow, nice and unforgettable advice, thanks! And great track!

[@hannesjilmstad]

Haven't even watched the video or listened to the demos for the new pack but I just bought it anyway because vol. 1 was the best purchase of my life

[@bestlifeever1211]

broooo.....value bomb, great track idea too. You should do a remix contest with it

[@thisguystrats]

I was waiting for a super subtle change... Then the melody jumps a whole octave 😂

[@kjellbeats]

fantastic advice!

[@cooloneshellchew1986]

Bro is the hero of my production !!!!!!

[@devohnhenry5828]

hey big z! if its worth your time can you make tut on how you create your chords for songs. genres of piano house like MK?

[@mvricks90]

When the bass notes changes you may have alterations in volume thats emphasized due to the low cut. Wouldn't it be a good solution to apply a dynamic eq like soothe instead? edit: damn that background synth is really cool!

[@JimijaymesProductions]

If you want extra cheesy just copy and do all 3 of those octaves for that lead synth.

[@saras1150]

great advice!

[@djruslanmazaev]

beautiful track bro

[@deatheternal720]

I did a track a cpl nights ago(for my wife as a valentines gift- it will premier on valentines on my channel rofl) where I took an 808, made one pattern, then copied it and all the mixing plugins(compressor for sidechain, util for stereo widening, and a cpl other things) and the pattern, but i pitched it down an octave for the sub, aand i put an eq 8 on the main where i made room for the sub. I also made the sub super wide comparatively.

[@TodaysThinks]

I think you shoulda started this video with your definition of cheesy. That concept seems subjective. I absolutely love both, for what it's worth. I think having it at the lower octave sounds... More solemn, nervous, or mournful. In shock. Processing. Lots of uncertainty. But version two sounds only triumphant, with no possibility that anything has gone poorly. It's almost a shame to waste the version that is that line on that octave. Is this full track anywhere online? I would love to scribble on it for funsies. Anyway I'll finish watching the video. Only halfway through... 😃

[@PhazeOfficial]

This track is a banger, release 🔥

[@apersononurphone920]

"powerful instead of cheesy" okay this guy gets it

[@Walid.OnTheTrack6725]

i'm gonna watch your whole channel

[@sandersonstunes]

I love seeing tip on arrangements. It's too easy to get trapped in the gear or techniques of music production but at the end of the day a well written song with poor production is better than a bad written song with the best production.

[@keithrutherford8785]

If you liked this video, research the overtone series. This is the theory behind why this octave adjustment is so critical and changes everything!

[@allans1212]

Each video is a masterclass 🔥

[@ericgoldin4600]

Thanks Big Z you da man!

[@matt.mastery]

Damn that song was good. And the sounds really nice. Will download

[@tehRealPRM420]

Thanks for the tip :)

[@JulianMaea]

great tips for everyone!

[@hdslave]

both sound cheesy. everything sounds cheesy to me today, maybe need to take a break from it all

[@johnsignoretti4002]

Great tutorial!! Any future tutorials on EDM melody composition?? Thank you very much

[@musicbycarlo]

You're an OG, Big Z.

[@Fiveash-Art]

That song reminds me of the scene when Natalie Portman's character is communicating with that weird A.I alien god thing at the end of Annihilation.

[@joewolf38]

I think that's the first thing you realise when you start making music. How to place instruments in "space" and "time". Like in classical music:-). (chord breakdown, layering)

[@Stochholm]

Are you going to publish this track soon?.. It´s amazing

[@julianmoncada6764]

Great video!!

[@Paraay]

Basic but extraordinarily and remarkably important 🔥

[@ViN-EzL]

Damn son you make dem synth sound fine.

[@Nedvio]

Awesome video as always

[@nickbatt399]

Thank you I love you

[@proxzi]

useful stuff

[@alexanderperisteris8163]

nice track!

[@SoundPeaks]

dope tune

[@beantreats]

really great explanation style

[@partlysimpson5154]

Coz they sound like modern pop music

[@weakw1ll]

0:55 WOAH

[@metalyeezy]

this is craazy

[@kipchickensout]

Version 1 and 2 - from "meh not my type" to "yeeeeeeeahh"

[@Beatsbasteln]

i totally forgot that this was something i learned at some point

[@mou_aissa]

Nice job mate !!

[@quinnobi42]

I could definitely tell there was something more going on in the high end in the one-two comparison at the beginning. I didn't realise that moving whole parts up or down an octave could sound so similar. I guess with the synths there's a lot of overtones so it wouldn't be as noticeable as on an acoustic instrument.

[@Beos_Valrah]

Acoustic instruments usually have many overtones too

[@quinnobi42]

@@Beos_Valrah certainly, but obviously in a different way since they sound different.

[@Beos_Valrah]

@@quinnobi42 This is not in your initial comment, you can edit it

[@BVSISofficial]

Great channel thank you

[@ypy6337]

Is This rule for bass for EVERY LAYER? Or it's just for SUBBASS?

[@AdrianMakBC]

you are a genius

[@schqrr]

big help thanks bro

[@AudioAssassin]

Absolutely right, my friend. I get the feeling that you have been producing for around as long as I have. This is my 24th year of production :)

[@BrandNewUsername]

That's why trumpets are cooler than trombones 😎

[@goldenmushrooms48]

i feel like the cheesy part just got cheesier in my opinion 😂 love ur videos and advice regardless

[@KableTdi]

also you could sidechain the sub to the bass

[@mystikrebel1089]

really good tips !

[@matt_freund]

Sweet tips man!

[@prodbymutio]

This is so good

[@AlexGeek]

The synths alone remind me of Jarre

[@bonkerzmusic6506]

Your slope is very sharp with 36dB be careful, also switch to natural phase your mix will sound better.

[@Astral-Sine-Techno]

Thank you sir. : )

[@johnviera3884]

this is The Business guy!

[@deejaysoulution]

amazing

[@gothicwvlff]

2:14 daniel give me coffee

[@wjdgjs369]

💯💯💯

[@threepe0]

Neither sounds cheesy. If version one wasn't there, two wouldn't have an impact. Neither would that hesitation to deliver on that note in version two. But I suspect you know that ;-)

[@justinthiele5967]

So my two cents…bass needs to be at the sweet spot consistently. However, the synth sounded great going from the lower octave to the higher octave in the track. In fact, leaving it at the lower octave before going to the higher octave added to the excitement of the track.

[@jnfe]

I want to hear this song in full. Where is it?