Will Kevin Durant Kill the Worst Argument in Sports?

[@TheRiggedBA]

Interesting. I didn't expect the use of ring logic to die overnight. It will be a gradual process. They've been moving away from ring logic on Fox Sports for awhile, and you could already start to see it happen on ESPN leading up to the 2017 Finals. But after not watching much, if any, ESPN for awhile I was surprised at how drastic the difference is now already. ESPN hosts are now ironically mocking ring logic that they used to propagate. Michael Jordan recently doubled down on his stance that Kobe is better than LeBron because Kobe has more rings. And pretty much every show I saw not only rejected Jordan's logic, but basically made fun of him for using it: Shannon Sharpe - kzbin.info/www/bejne/jXbcfYCYi9R7mMU PTI/Pardon the Interruption - kzbin.info/www/bejne/mXiohYikmN6ZrcU First Take - kzbin.info/www/bejne/ioSwYnmYr6-Kbs0 It being Jordan makes it especially funny since ring logic is a fake standard intended to be used specifically for him. It's not a real argument to be applied to other players as though it's a legit rationale. It's fake. So it's funny to see Jordan walking around using it himself as though he doesn't know it's not real, then getting called out on it.

[@TheRiggedBA]

Jalen Rose and Jacoby chime in saying ring logic is old, tired and meaningless and that Jordan is just using it as a ploy to protect his legacy. - kzbin.info/www/bejne/Y4KWgIWcZsaBg7c

[@TheRiggedBA]

+NBA Myths It's amazing to see it on _First Take_ in general. That was the main outlet for propagating ring logic in the first place.

[@al-muwaffaq341]

TheRiggedBA I thought I was the only one who noticed that people stopped using rings to determine if your the goat

[@swayjacob7778]

Saying the NBA is rigged in the end throws out your entire argument about anything basketball. By that logic I can say LeBron isn't really that great because the NBA is rigged and helped him win. The NBA rigged every finals ever for money so what's the point of watching or calling anybody great. It's like watching the WWE but I know for a fact you still watch it otherwise you wouldn't even post this video. You say the Warriors are gonna dominant as long as the NBA wants them too but at the same time KDs choice to go to the Warriors just changed the ring argument? By your logic it wasn't even KDs choice. You should be thanking the NBA itself for destroying the ring argument....

[@swayjacob7778]

Also you have to argue who exactly is rigging the NBA. The NBA is owned by the 30 majority team owners. They're like the government but for the NBA. Finals appearances equals money. Being at the bottom of the NBA means less ticket sales, less people watch, less air time. Which all means less money for that individual team. Sometimes you can make a case that teams lose money. The point is no one wants lose. Imagine if the owners, coach's, players found out they lost because the game was rigged. It would be chaos. You can't dictate a whole series with fouls. Especially with replay being used often in todays game.

[@classingamer]

Listen people this man knows what the fuck he's talking about.

[@jaydenevans8003]

I really wish you would make more videos. You are honest to God one of the most knowledgeable NBA youtubers out there. I love your content. keep making these videos.

[@TheRiggedBA]

+Jay Evans Appreciated, thanks

[@NewEarthSon]

TheRiggedBA just curious whats your top 10 basketball players of alltime?

[@NewEarthSon]

TheRiggedBA Good Video. I was never a fan of Ring logic. Did Tmac need a Ring for us to to know he was a geeat player? Blaming 1 player because Management and Ownership want to be cheap and not buuld a team. but shhhh Nba is rigged.lol

[@spencerqual93]

TheRiggedBA 2 questions. Do you think all major market sports are somewhat rigged? And who you got to win it all this year? I'm taking the Warriors in 7 despite KDs injury, feel like he'll be back in time with avengence. P.S. TMac in my top 5 no doubt. Peace.

[@williamogden1413]

+Specer Qual I know the NFL is definitely rigged. Wacky stuff takes place in the Super Bowl all the time. There's even a video from a few years ago where Doug Baldwin is shown making a thumbs up and the Broncos defender goes over his head.

[@123recon456]

This is nice. People confuse "best player" with "best career". More rings will often mean a better career (when comparing stars) but not necessarily a better player

[@NewEarthSon]

123recon456 YUP. YOU ARE 100 PERCENT CORRECT

[@heikiu96z]

Yeah true, I say Horry have the best career in modern era, better than MJ, Lebron, Magic, Bird. But Horry is no better player than any of the above. And Horry also deserve that title cause he was a key player to like half of those rings he won.

[@NewEarthSon]

heikiu96z you are correct but Horry contributed to ALL the rings.But like Tmac said to tmz, "Atleast he will be in the hall of fame" and to me, thats what matters. Yoy tell them Tmac!!! lol. Horry even in his wet dreams could not carry those trash lottery magic teams to the playoffs.

[@williamogden1413]

It doesn't even mean a "better career". The NBA is rigged. Championships mean nothing.

[@ch.illmatic]

Wilt Chamberlain is the greatest player of all time stat wise(best player) and Bill Russell is the greatest contributor of all time(best career)

[@ninjaguy123]

The other horrible argument is that mj is 6 for 6, as if he only played 6 seasons lol

[@BornToBeRollingStone]

ninjaguy123 I read this stupid argument every day because it's MJ. They act like losing in the finals is worse than losing in the first round. They act like you get a try to win a ring only when you go the finals. Fuck it, you get a try every season you play. MJ is not 6 for 6, he is 6 for 15.

[@TheRiggedBA]

I'm always amazed when ESPN hosts say with a straight face that anyone who's ever been on a losing Finals team is automatically disqualified from being as good a player as Jordan, even if they get more championships than Jordan. I'm not amazed that they say it, as ridiculous as it is. I'm just amazed that this actually gets accepted as valid logic and repeated.

[@petervanbuskirk500]

Yeah before Pippen and Grant he could hardly get out of the 2nd round in the playoffs.

[@fuckso2342]

Simon Dumbest argument in sports that was pushed by marketing, business and NBA.

[@chrissaintjames3006]

Simon no but it's better than melting down in the finals like 2011

[@Spvcely]

Agree, the same ones praising WB for staying now are going to be talking about him when he retires like " he was great but never won anything "

[@NewEarthSon]

Spvcely AT THE END OF THE DAY. IN 25 YEARS, a New Generation of BBall Fans will come who never saw Wersbrook or Durant play and the Only thing they will care about is if they won. a ring. Thats it. Also In real life When is it ever smart to be loyal to a business? NBA fans, no scratch that. Sport Fans are big Hypocrites.

[@Welcome2HDiiTV]

NewEarth Son yes I agree they are the biggest hypocrites like how you hate LeBron now you love him again

[@wickedbabayaga]

Look at it already now that Durant won the ring. Before he wasn't really in the conversation for "best player," in 2016 it was Curry and Lebron being argued as the best player and Curry had won 2 MVPs. Now Durant goes to the GSW and Curry is no longer the best player even on his own team let alone the best in the whole league, and Durant now is the consensus "best player in the league" because of his skill set at his height and wingspan, only compared to Lebron. Westbrook is talked down upon as a selfish player and Durant had to leave because they weren't moving the ball around at OKC. People, not just basketball or all sports fans but people in general, have gold fish memories and are impressionable idiots that agree with the last thing they heard the talking head on the TV say.

[@know1squarter307]

Felt so bad for T-Mac when he was legitimately one free throw away from a ring with the Spurs; he was actually smiling. Great player to never get a ring.

[@12SAINTSFANCOLSTON]

I'll let you in on a little secret....... Shhhhhh...... The NBA is rigged! ROTF LMAO! The funniest, most honest, and the best statement I've seen in a while. Once again, great video!

[@HighMyNameIsTy]

Great overall point. I didn't think of the Durant move like that. Def. gives me a different perspective on it. I absolutely HATE that ring argument w/ a passion.

[@CocoXLarge]

Even without the ring argument, KD doesn't owe anybody shit, he can do what he wants.

[@lilprincekilla]

Tell that to this corrupt bandwagon hypocritical generation world we live in today.

[@ReoBandss]

LeBron didn't form the first super team. The first real super team formed was Boston's Big 3. But if we're being honest, Magic only came out of college because the Lakers had the #1 pick and he wanted to play Kareem. That's kinda forming a super team. Or how about Rodman joining the Bulls to give them the best scorer in the league, the best SF in the league, and the best rebounder/defender in the league. Super team, right? The league has been super teams since it's existence. I have no problem with them. I just have a problem when a top 3 player goes to the team that beat him and prevented him from getting his championship.

[@FAlynn92]

but the boston "big 3" was all past their prime. Lebron, Wade & Bosh were just hitting their prime. its different.

[@TheRiggedBA]

+TheCream12 Right.

[@whydouneedakno]

PP was 31, KG was 32, and Allen was 33... I wouldnt call that all past their prime... LBJ is 31 right now and about to be 32, are you saying he is well past his prime? lol

[@FAlynn92]

***** compare 33,32 & 31 to 25, 28 & 26. & by that point in ray allen's career, he was just a spot up shooter. wade, james & bosh all were versatile. also, comparing Lebron's prime years to another players isn't really helping. everyone doesn't hit their prime at the same age.

[@combatenthusiast6297]

The Bulls with Pippen, Jordan & Rodman was?

[@TheAndyk123]

You were pretty much spot on with this. I noticed that after Lebron won his 4th ring that the debate has greatly shifted with certain championships "meaning more" and certain championships "being fake". No one gives Lebron any credit for the 2020 championship, as if all the other teams in the bubble just weren't trying or something. They're scared that he might actually get rings 5 and 6 before he retires. People say none of KD's rings "actually count" because of the superteam and the fact that the Warriors were playing injured opponents (this standard is never applied to Jordan obviously, like when Gary Payton was hurt for the entire '96 Finals). Even people on ESPN were saying that Giannis's '21 championship "doesn't count" because Kyrie got hurt. They're so worried that someone is going to dethrone Jordan. This style of arguing essentially makes it impossible for anyone to ever approach Jordan because the goalposts can always move. If Zion or Wembanyama or some other future superstar goes 7-0 in the Finals and wins 7 FMVPs, the standard will move yet again where you have to score 60+ in at least one game during your championship run or something.

[@TheRiggedBA]

Yeah, it's pretty shameless how the standards are never applied to Jordan. Jordan's first ring came against a Lakers with an injured James Worthy, a Byron Scott who was injured during the series, a retired Kareem, and a sick Magic Johnson who was citing fatigue during the series and retired that offseason. But they never discount that or any of Jordan's rings. That's why I feel bad for the players who don't realize the ring narrative is fake and nothing but Jordan marketing. Because they actually believe they can reach the goal post. They don't know it will just move.

[@nonamewillbegiven2826]

Lebron won no 4th ring

[@nonamewillbegiven2826]

And you are a snowflake

[@panamcail]

I love the way you ended the video, by disclosing that the NBA is rigged, which of course it 100% is. Most people have NO CLUE and worse, do not want to know. It isn't just sports. It's everything that we've come to known. Controllers manage humanity in ways the population cannot even imagine. And NO ONE is willing to put in the work - NO ONE. It's all about SHOW ME, give me proof, etc. There are so many entitled people not willing to sacrifice and put in the work but willing to DISMISS the truth. Great work as always, brother. Thank you.

[@MistahUnknown]

And it's like a lose-lose situation for superstars of this era and the upcoming era's. If they all leave legally in free agency or get traded to a better team (ie: the Warriors) and ends up winning a bunch of rings, the media will push that pathetic "Jordan never went ring chasing and was loyal to the Bulls organization!". Blah Blah Blah.

[@nonamewillbegiven2826]

Troll

[@dynamic6645]

@@nonamewillbegiven2826 Get a life dude, you really replied to a 2 year old comment, pathetic. 😵

[@SickoRed72]

Good to see you back making the videos. Keep em coming

[@FallacyUnknown]

Durant shooting a very high percentage this year and yes the NBA is rigged

[@theprodigy7002]

L

[@oakinw8361]

@@theprodigy7002 L Lefraud not in playoffs

[@smandin1]

@@oakinw8361 I love how people just dismiss LeBron as if he sucks. You are a prime example of a Stan, who has no brain.

[@stann.3408]

my boi TheRiggedBa back again cracking down on the NBA. great content man

[@moneymekai]

Finally I can see a potential positive light on Durant's move

[@lilprincekilla]

Durant's move was common sense. What was there not to see????

[@Irichan08]

with how these "pundits" argue about who is the best, you would think they were talking about tennis or maybe 1 on 1 basketball.

[@TheRiggedBA]

+Donald Barham Indeed.

[@ElGranSanto]

I need to check the channels im subscribed to more often. This video is GOLD.

[@TheRiggedBA]

Thanks!

[@gridirongod4207]

I’ve said this back in 2021 and it’s aging like wine. “All the things we dislike about the modern NBA such as load management, super teams, boring All-Star games, and a general growing apathy towards the regular season are all negative byproducts of rings culture and they will continue to persist until that cancer dies out if it ever does.”

[@ninjaguy123]

I have some requests for you my man about rigging : - NBA didn't let the Warriors win the 73rd game last year until the last game. They could have won more, but they needed to make more money - The last season the LAL made the playoffs as an 8th seed, the NBA rigged most of their last few games, especially that last Kobe foul on a 3pter that didn't get called. - Dallas only championship didn't happen until Mark Cuban stopped criticizing refs and David Stern. - The number of fouls called for Dwade to win his first chip.

[@whydouneedakno]

Wrong, they should of won way less, the amount of ref help they got to win 73 games was insane... They also had losses where they laid down but they had at least 10 wins where the refs bailed them out...

[@monalisa-bs4zs]

Nah their shooting got them those wins. Their team put up ridiculous Shooting % all season.

[@asfclayton698]

Dark milicic has more rings than Melo, CP3, Damian L, Kevin D, Russ, Allen I,

[@OneTrueAce]

Ring counting will never die, unfortunately.

[@TheRiggedBA]

+OneTrueAce If KD's team wins, I really think it could. LeBron and the internet have already started to depopularize it. Durant can just speed up the process and finish it off. It seems inevitable to me that it will die either way because it's just too stupid to last, I hope.

[@theastralshepherd4335]

if I could like, I would've liked, great vid as always

[@dumisatonyjohnson8145]

Duncan has five But no one calls him the best basketball player to ever play

[@vicshephard9231]

They do call him the 🐐 power forward. It would be different for him if he opened up more. Dude rarely advertised. Had he been the type guy to celebrate taking cats to school, he'd be talked about more.

[@KingEDZKY]

Rings should never be used to judge on who's a better player between two or more individuals, there's just too many factors to consider, the amount of teams that participated in the era that they played in, the competition, who really produced (if the said player was really the reason why they won the ring), the supporting cast, the staffs, etc., etc. As for the example to the first two things that said, we all know that before 2000, there were a lot of expansion teams, yes this is a less physical league but you can't takeaway the fact that the competition before 2000s wasn't as solid as it is now, there are many teams that are favorable to win the championship now compared to how it was 20+ years ago.

[@nonamewillbegiven2826]

Competition now is not more solid than back then

[@nonamewillbegiven2826]

Is that why everybody just thought it was only gonna be the Nets and Lakers last yr? You silly troll

[@nonamewillbegiven2826]

And criticized the league back then for expanding and yet wanna say the competition is better today. Oh the contradictions

[@rrski05]

have you seen Nike's new "debate this" ad for KD? it seems like Nike is already acknowledging the demise of ring logic/argument

[@1990POE]

This aged like wine

[@lilprincekilla]

No video articulates the truth about the NBA and the people who watch it better than this video here. Just straight and cold hard facts thrown out.

[@ddp5406]

Kevin Durant did not break this logic Now they are turning to the 6-0 Which just means they never had any intention of crowing any player over jordan

[@jamalliwalug6639]

Jordanatics think losing in finals is more embarrassing than losing in 1st round playoffs not making in finals they always say Jordan is 6-0 as if he only played 6 season in the NBA.

[@TheRiggedBA]

@@jamalliwalug6639 That's Stephen A. Smith's phony logic. It's nonsense and Stephen A knows it's nonsense. But he's promoted it in the media so often that people actually accept and use it now. Which is amazing to me.

[@Stunt877]

@@jamalliwalug6639 Which is funny because I guarantee those are the same people that talk down on westbrook for losing in the first round for 3 years when westbrook legit had a worse team in those 2 years. Im not even going to get into the whole westbrook and okc situation. The point is oldhead nba fans are high on nostalgia and hypocritical.

[@Stunt877]

@@TheRiggedBA And Stephen A Smith was the same guy that most likely got Westbrook ring chasing because of him not having a ring and losing in the first round.

[@TheRiggedBA]

@@Stunt877 I hadn't made that connection. But now that you mention it, it is interesting timing that Westbrook would join the Lakers after the recent stir over Stephen A saying Westbrook's numbers "mean absolutely nothing" because he's never been on a championship team.

[@dumisatonyjohnson8145]

Doesn’t Bill Russell have 11 championship rings?! Last time I checked Bill has the most championship rings for a player in the history of the NBA 11 beats 6 11 beats 5 11 Beats 1 11 beats 3

[@sookiezboly4502]

Yeah, but since it's MJ and he's god and shit... maths doesnt work, so 6 beats 11 Isnt life so easy when you're an MJ fanatic ?

[@amandapowell3124]

Most well put together videos on the subject of rigging. Please make more videos. You are amazing. Lol

[@TheRiggedBA]

Thanks

[@HdTr1cKZzZ]

TheRiggedBA what do you think about this years playoffs and finals you knew what would happen last year and I won a lot of bets cause of that lol love your insight on bball tho so what do you think will happen

[@TheRiggedBA]

Well I'm not certain like I was last year, but I don't think they want LeBron to win again and I don't think they want Curry to lose again this year, especially with Durant since it would make both of them look bad. So I'm assuming the Warriors will win. I also wouldn't be terribly surprised if they have the Cavs get knocked off before the Finals.

[@HdTr1cKZzZ]

TheRiggedBA ok Bro thanks appreciate the quick reply you should try and make more vids even tho I know you don't like watching it lol

[@TheRiggedBA]

Yeah, I might try to force myself to sit through a few games again.

[@ImmaMyReaction]

GREAT video, lot of good points here that doesn't get through people's thick skulls

[@TheRiggedBA]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/iX-QfaumYtFpb6M Sports media host Mike Greenberg admits that the media created ring counting as the standard for rating players specifically for Michael Jordan. His framing of it as something Jordan did is annoying, but he's exactly right. No one judged players by rings before. This is something that the media started only after Jordan retired. Jordan was never required to match the ring counts of players before him in order to be considered better like players today are.

[@nonamewillbegiven2826]

Yawn. I dont care for your lies

[@josegamino5677]

Keep making videos your one of my favorite channels

[@cansergenvaran2948]

Boy you are good. I love your channel

[@TheRiggedBA]

Thanks!

[@sellsword335]

Lebron is greatest player of all time and gsw is greatest team of all time...

I AGREE 100 PERCENT WITH THIS VIDEO ! IF YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE GOAT , WHICH I ACTUALLY DON'T THINK ANY SUCH THING EXISTS AS THE GOAT BECAUSE IT'S TOO SUBJECTIVE AND BASED ON PERSONAL PREFERENCE . THESE DISCUSSIONS ARE ALWAYS BASED ON RINGS , CHAMPIONSHIPS , BUT NEVER ON THE ACTUAL SKILL SET OF THE INDIVIDUALS IN QUESTION AND HOW WELL THEY PLAY THE GAME !

[@NewEarthSon]

emmy lite Yup. Ring Talk is overrated. The same way its srupid in Baseball its stupid in basketball

[@Welcome2HDiiTV]

emmy lite yup that's why I love j kidd and ai

[@leblonk2537]

I swear i have never watched a video which contains that much truth

[@TheRiggedBA]

Heheh

[@emmanuelmoses7249]

Another great video.

[@heikiu96z]

Holy shit you still make new videos? I found your older video some time ago and thought you were one of those people who made videos and then disappeared. Subscribed.

[@luissyquia]

ring counting really is the worst argument when comparing players... gotta take a look at the player's body of work and skill set and situation... you know.. the whole picture?? everything so simplified in the media nowadays...

[@Stunt877]

Now cousins did the same😂😂

[@TheRiggedBA]

The more commonplace it becomes, the better. Death to ring logic.

[@Jason09_]

The ring logic of how many you win is the dumbest thing in sports. It matters on how you win and what teams did you have to go through in order to get those rings. Kd could win the next 4 rings but the fact that he joined a team that went 73-9 puts him out the discussion with a jordan,kobe,magic. Same goes for lebron. But I understand the players logic on winning as many rings as possible regardless of what the media says.

[@PatriotsPride12]

Jason Espinal lebron is better than magic kobe jordan. Its not really too close. Durant is closer to lebron than the others.

[@NewEarthSon]

Jason Espinal SO ITS PLAYERS FAULT WHEN OWNERSHIP AND GMs DONT WANT TO BUILD A CHAMPIONSHIP TEAM AND INSTEAD SAVE MONEY? google Gilbert Areanas instagram post on durant. Google Mark Cuban and why he couldnt keep his 2011 team together

[@Jason09_]

NewEarth Son No but i think that's a big problem in nba today . The owners and gms are not doing a good enough job. Just think if Okc would have signed james harden.

[@NewEarthSon]

Jason Espinal Ultimately the Gms and Owners dont care about chips. The Fans do and to be honest some of the players dont care either. Just look at some of thier moves. Carmelo staying in New York, if you research a bit Karl Malone had a chance to play with Ewing in New York but declined both IN THEIR PRIMES, on and on. Thats why Rings dont mean much but COME TO THINK OFF IT, THEY MOST LIKELY DONT CARE BECAUSE SHHH. THE NBA IS RIGGED ANY WAY.LOL ITS GET MONEY

[@Jason09_]

NewEarth Son Some franchises do like the celtics lakers and spurs . Some players want to win on their own instead of joining another team, looking back at their careers they probably regret it but everybody can't win especially with jordan in the league.

[@amarvalousstarttheconversation]

You sir make great videos! If you can find the time and resources to make more frequently they would definitely be binge watch worthy. Keep up the great work!

[@hunter12182]

Not everyone can be a leader though one thing they all have in common they're great leaders.

[@fraddi]

I hate it when your videos are so short! With that being said, I dont think Warriors will win this year because of what Steph's wife said last finals.

[@chefcurry3044]

lol

[@airplayrule]

Hugh i seen u before, and not just on simpsons

[@Unitas19]

They won in dominant fashion, but ok.

[@Welcome2HDiiTV]

thank you someone who is truthful

[@airplayrule]

Wilt Chamberlin is the GOAT. I plan to make a vid on this 1 day. MJ was an arrogant punk.

[@dumisatonyjohnson8145]

11 beats 6 #billrussell

[@dumisatonyjohnson8145]

11>6 tho

[@rubberglovesandwich9889]

@Drink Me The Finals Mvp was invented during his last season I believe. So the argument doesn't make any sense because Bill Russel only had the chance to win one and that was when his career was ending.

[@rubberglovesandwich9889]

@Drink Me True but he would probably have at least 5.Not that we'll ever know. Just wondering how many finals mvps would Bill Russel need to be better than MJ? more than 6 or would he need to be the best player every time he went to the finals?

[@rubberglovesandwich9889]

@Drink Me I never said he was. All I said was finals mvps weren't even a thing in his time. So that isn't fair because when you said 6>0 you make it seem like he just wasn't good enough to get them when they actually didn't exist.

[@lukedro]

Durant still getting shit on for his move but I think ppl will start to quiet down if the Warriors three peat n he gets another finals MVP

[@AnHebrewChild]

Laughed at "as confirmed by Steve Kerr's four rings". Ha ha. And doesn't Robert Horry have seven rings? Horry > Bird, Magic, Mike. These dudes are all in _the entertainment business._ They are entertainers. Period. I consider Jordan **BEST EVER** (I hate the term "GOAT") because I consider him most entertaining to watch. MJ was REALLY GOOD at what bball players do... that's why the NBA promoted him, not the other way around. Scripting or not, Mike did run and jump with cat-like grace & fluidity. That's what drew viewers then. That's what drew more viewers to the "Last Dance" than this year's NBA finals. This is also why, despite the league's scripting, I'll still click on an MJ highlight video.

[@TheRiggedBA]

I wouldn't disagree. Michael Jordan was probably the greatest showman the league has seen. Dr.J is the only real challenger I can think of. MAYBE Vince Carter just on superior dunks alone. In terms of pure excitement and artistry, Jordan was definitely special.

[@MONEYMASTERSUS]

keep the videos coming sir

[@silversunnybunny]

Very interesting video! And it actually is true for sports, not just the NBA. I'm thinking of football, the comparison of Messi and Ronaldo. In the past months many people claim that Ronaldo has the edge over Messi because Ronaldo helped his national team win the european championship, even though he got injured very early on and didn't actively influenced the rest of the final. So Ronaldo has won one of two major finals with his national side, compared to that Messi has reached four finals, yet lost every single one.

[@donaldyoung9901]

Let's say the league is rigged..the ball still has to go into the basket..and that's not always automatic and while we are at it..Robert O....has seven rings and because of his big shots with the teams he played .. these teams had some of the legendary player's ever..no one player has won more championships off his shot more than " big shot bob" now...let the greatest discussion began.

[@heroinvrxther5826]

So the Celtics ultimately ended up sweeping. Any thoughts on that? And I wanted to know who you think is better between Kevin Durant and Steph. NBA Twitter is trying to go back and retroactively put him over KD due to his performance this year, and say that his all-time great runs in the playoffs were merely a product of Steph’s “gravity” or whatever. Which is just crazy to me. I still think KD’s better.

[@TheRiggedBA]

Well I assumed the Nets would lose, but I think the Nets falling into disfavor, especially Kyrie, had something to do with why it became a sweep to add the extra insult to injury. But yeah, I've seen the KD slander around KZbin. I think KD is better. But even if someone thought Steph was, this idea that all the attention was on Steph and KD was just riding along is some BS revisionist history. I haven't checked out Twitter in a while. I think I might go see what they're talking about.

[@heroinvrxther5826]

@@TheRiggedBA NBA Twitter definitely calls for more users like yourself. The Jordan propaganda is much worse on there, than anywhere else.

[@TheBronzeBomber38]

@@heroinvrxther5826 KD is better than Steph. He’s just not better than MJ lol. Very close as a scorer but not there as an all around player.

[@heroinvrxther5826]

@@TheBronzeBomber38 I asked was he better than Steph, no one said MJ.

[@TheBronzeBomber38]

@@heroinvrxther5826 Honestly it’s close between him and Steph. If Steph gets a ring and finals mvp this year, you could have a very reasonable argument for him over KD.

[@conannister]

everything you said became invalid once the GOAT Brian scalabrine spoke

[@TheRiggedBA]

+Atanas Stoyanov That's just Michael Rappaport disguised as Brian Scalabrine.

[@thomasmihai3693]

Atanas Stoyanov that's exactly what i was going to say

[@FrenchPaul1988]

06:27 ironically, Durant DID get that ring in his first year at Golden State. Up yours, haters and asshats. Concerning the "unbeatable team" thing, I thought you'd have reminded people of past unbeatable teams with tons of talent like Bulls of the 90s, Lakers of the 2000s or mid-to-late 2000s Heat - and a lot of outside help too (draws against anyone in Jordan's way, the Lakers/Kings WCF in 02 or the Miami/Dallas Finals where one Miami player shot more free throws than all the Mavericks combined).

[@gridirongod4207]

Excellent video. I consider rings culture to be the absolute cancer of team sports and I try to be the cure LOL. I could talk about my disdain about rings culture for days. What most infuriates me is when Jordan fans (and to a lesser degree Kobe fans) act like winning 5/6 rings is the greatest achievement in human history when in reality those 2 don’t even have close to the most rings ever. It’s actually kinda funny watching them go through all kinds of mental gymnastics anytime you counter them with players who have more rings. They make a trillion excuses and move a trillion goalposts to explain how Bill Russell is not the undisputed unquestioned GOAT or how John Havlicek is not better than both using their famous logic.

[@TheRiggedBA]

Yeah, they have no other option but to move the goal posts. Because ring logic is fake. It's not a real argument, so it can't be applied with any kind of coherence. Coincidently, one of the upcoming videos in the Jordan vs Jordan series is about ring culture and will be kind of like a prequel to this video.

[@juju-vl7oj]

I agree with most of this but I don't think ring counting is totally illegitimate, but it should definitely not be the main deciding factor and circumstances should be thoroughly examined. Bill Russell won 11 but it should be considered the league only had 8 teams and for many of those years Celtics only had to win 2 rounds. Kareem won 6 but he was arguably not the mvp of the team for half of them and not even à top 10 player in the league rings 5 and 6. I think as far as who has the best résumé there's something to be said about the fact that Jordan arguably the best player every round for 6 different seasons resulting in a title. 6times is à pretty good sample size to predict at least any of his 90s contemporaries would win as many in his shoes. But also I think LeBron having to play in finals vs a 73 win team that added KD twice, or with his 2 costars injured, or with the 07 Cavs vs the prime dynasty Spurs, it's totally reasonable to think if Jordan had the misfortune of being in those situations 4/6 finals he'd be 2-4 and replace all 4 of those circumstances for LeBron with 4 of Jordan's finals opponents, he'd at least win 3/4 for a total of 7rings. I think we all agree a Chauncey Billups finals mvp isn't equal to a Shaq finals mvp, and Robert Horry 7 rings as a role player doesn't make him better than Malone and Barkley with zero. This is a long ass way of simply saying it's a very subjective and nuanced debate ranking all time players but I think there's enough information to be fair and put them into tiers relative to their own era.

[@nonamewillbegiven2826]

Yawn. You are a i/mbecile

[@nonamewillbegiven2826]

And contradictal and typical excuses for Lebron's finals shortcomings

[@nonamewillbegiven2826]

Yeah Lebron leading his teams out the east is very misforunate for him. Oh the excuses and thinking Lebron could lead the Bulls to a ring is silly. Delusional troll

[@nonamewillbegiven2826]

'Any of his 90s contemporaries would win as many in his shoes". Thats a dumb thing to say

[@NewEarthSon]

lol at 2:36

[@kennethpetrovic5535]

ROBERT HORRY HAS 7 RINGS. 7>6. 🤔🤔🤔🤔

[@rrski05]

the ring logic may have died but the haters are now using the finals record argument really sad, but on another topic what are your thiughts on Cousins joining the Warriors

[@TheRiggedBA]

+RRSKI Pogiski Yeah, the Finals record talking point is the mutated offspring of ring logic. Created in a lab as a bogus argument specifically against LeBron in favor of Jordan. The fact that Robert Horry has a perfect Finals record of 7-0 is always fun to bring up when discussing the logical validity of judging players this way. As for Cousins, I don't think it's as a big a deal as it sounds on paper. If Cousins blew his achilles, he's likely not going to be the same player any time soon, if ever. But now he has time to rehab on a team that doesn't need him and get a ring to boost his injured stock some in the process. So it's a great move personally for Cousins, but I don't think it really means much for the league and the issue of superteams.

[@rrski05]

lol Robert Horry seems to be the antidote on both the ring logic and this new one but thanks for replying, is there any more videos to come?

[@TheRiggedBA]

I have a few I want to get around to doing. Hopefully I'll get some time soon.

[@mateoreed3716]

Thank you for your enlightening work... Best vids i've seen thus far on this topic! Would really be grateful if you might answer several questions i have -- all of which are in regards to the *Cavs/Warriors rivary* in recent years... 1)Did the fixers actually want Cleveland to win the first championship in 2015 with GState, but failed due to kyrie & kevins injuries and/or other factors? And if so, was the rematch in 2016 only arranged due to it not going as planned the first time? 2)On that topic -- the recent Christmas day 2016 rematch between the same two teams seemed to be the most brazen, sloppy, *obvious* rig job i've ever seen, and a lot more people than usual appear to be wondering or doubting the integrity of the game since then. Do you see the same thing, and if so, does it suggest the manipulators may not be able to get away with it as much anymore with people paying closer attention? 3)Will they 3-peat rematch once again this year, and if so, which team is being fixed to win this time and for what greater purpose or plan? 4)What are the fates of KD, Steph, Klay and Draymond individually in the future NBA? Do they stay together in GState for more years, or does the team get broken up after 1-2 seasons and they get scattered elsewhere? If so, where? Please feel free to elaborate as much as you like... and i'm sure I'm not the only person who would love to see your complete breakdown and analysis of this growing rivalry in another one of your videos if you're ever so inspired to make one soon. Thanks again! Please keep up the excellent work!

[@TheRiggedBA]

+Mateo Reed 1) No. I've felt since before LeBron's first game back with Cleveland that the plan was for him to lose the first year then win the second year. 2) I only watched the highlights of the game, but a couple people have told me they felt the referees were controlling the score. 3) Probably. I don't think they want LeBron on the winning side anymore this year though. 4) I don't know, but I doubt they stay together long after this year. That situation doesn't strike me as long-term.

[@mateoreed3716]

TheRiggedBA ...thanks for responding to me! Please keep up your amazing work - hope you have more soon!

[@analyticalinsight]

excellent video

[@TheRiggedBA]

Thanks

[@thenotoriousdig610]

by Shaq's logic, James Johnson is better than Chris Paul, John Stockton, Derrick Rose, Gary Payton, Hakeem Olaijowan, Elgin Baylor, Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, Patrick Ewing etc etc.

[@UncleT4life]

hope we see kd back in okc, it would be good for the league and I think they'd win the championship

[@TheRiggedBA]

I was thinking the same thing when I was watching OKC last year. Not the championship part, but, with the way OKC has built itself back up it would be kinda cool to see KD return to the new generation of Thunder stars. That could be a pretty good mix at this stage of Durant's career. Don't know if there's any chance of it, though.

[@dumisatonyjohnson8145]

Michael Jordan’s the greatest shooting guard in the history of the game of basketball 🏀 Even Jordan never surpassed Bill Russell’s 11 championship rings

[@Heatlifer77]

How scary is the Dion-less Miami Heat? You may have heard that 4th seeded Miami Heat starting shooting guard Dion Waiters will miss the remainder of the season to undergo surgery on his ankle. Does this loss mean the Heat’s season is over? No. Being a proud Heat fan I am used to hearing this Heat player is out with an injury all the time, next man up which would be Tyler Johnson who is averaging 16ppg on .517% shooting. Another Heat player who has stepped up is Wayne Ellington who is currently 6th in most points by a bench player and second in 4th q points by a bench player. Yes Miami is streaky on offense, 12x Miami scored 100 points but failed to score at least 100 the next game. However, they're defensive game is strong. During their 6 game winning streak they have allowed the 8th least amount of points off tovs, 8th least amount of 2nd chance points. Also during the streak Miami has held their opponent to the 7th lowest 3pt % at 32.6%. Miami allowed the 5th least amount of points at 102.5ppg and 3rd least amount of rebounds per game at 39.5 all without defensive specialist Winslow. The Heat have beaten notable teams such as the Boston Celtics 2x once in BOS, Timberwolves, Wizards and the Raptors who only lost 2 home games with 1 of those home losses was to Miami. Total so far, Miami has scored the second most points in the 4th Q game within 5 with 5 mins left. Within that time frame the Heat is 18-7, first in 3pt% at 42.9%, and first in the +/- with 64. So far can this Heat team go? Well depending on matchups and the officials, I believe they can go as far as the Conference Finals.

[@TheGodfather441]

Why should we give Durant the credit? Lebron had to build a superteam, look at the Celtics, meanwhile the Thunder were on the verge of eliminating the Warriors

[@TheRiggedBA]

Hopefully you won't give him credit. That's the desired outcome. Devalue the rings. Make an excuse to not credit Durant, thereby acknowledging that rings don't really mean much of anything and that they are valued and devalued based on a subjective whim.

[@fuckso2342]

All players on the team deserve credit for a ring but the way people use it to defend Jordan is very contrived. That said if you look at KD finals stats he most definetely was a key part in winning it for Warriors he stole game 3 from the Cavs. He had one of the most efficient finals in NBA history.

[@kentaviouscaldwell-goat5880]

Big fan of the channel man, but I'm curious on your CURRENT thoughts on rigged games. I've always thought watching the playoffs that the NBA refs are some of the worst in any sport ever, 2016 was so awfully rigged in those 3-1 series it made me want to puke. This last year though, I felt was one of the most fairly called playoffs I've seen, well, ever. We all knew who was going to end up in the finals, and the two super teams (for the most part) swept their way there, as they should, no randomly created drama stood in their way. And also as expected, 4 NBA all stars on one team won the championship in 5 games. There was no extra storylines or drama, primarily being a Westbrook v Durant series. I thought FOR SURE this would happen, and even come down to maybe 6 games, just to create extra buzz despite GS clearly being better in every facet of the game. It all seemed like a legitimate playoffs for the first time in awhile. In my opinion, I feel like things will start to get better under Adam Silver. He seems to display his anger in lack of parity often, and I think he realizes he has only himself to blame... Had OKC won that series against GS like they should have, they likely would have went on to beat the Cavs, and Durant would have then probably stayed. If anything, I think this means other teams will start to win more. GS will stop getting a ton of questionable calls in their favor, paving the way for the rest of the stacked western conference to make a move on the playoffs. I may be blinded by false hope, but I believe this is about to be one of the purest NBA seasons ever played out...

[@TheRiggedBA]

+Kentavious Caldwell-GOAT I think last year's playoffs were largely a matter of circumstance and that the NBA had it's hands sort of tied. Because if the Warriors struggled too much the first year amid all the scrutiny, it would make the 1st or 2nd most popular player(Steph Curry) and Kevin Durant both look bad and lose some viability if they couldn't dominate while combined. So I wasn't surprised that there was no Warriors/OKC match-up since that would be too lopsided to be worth it. I think David Stern would have made that happen, but Adam Silver seems like a mad genius who'd wait until later to get the most out of that storyline. I expected for the Warriors to cruise for the most part except against the Spurs, who I assumed they were going to have take Golden State 6 games. But Kawhi getting hurt changed the options there. But now since the Durant Warriors have won, the perception of them is more secure. So now the NBA has more freedom to rig games against them. I don't expect for them to be as dominant this year. I won't be surprised if they start dropping (relatively)easy games while the media just creates narratives about in-fighting to explain away the questionable losses.

[@docamaro868]

Steve Kerr has 5 rings not 4

[@TheRiggedBA]

Yeah, that's actually corrected in the annotations...which KZbin no longer shows.

[@jaydenevans8003]

also, if you wanna talk some basketball with some folks, share a short blog or debate over a question or something of the like, head over to "Hoops Amino" on the appstore or playstore. We would love to have someone like you be on there.

[@tkellz8141]

Who is getting 11 rings though? NOBODY every talks about the ring count of Robert Horry or Bill Russell.

[@ansarisarmadh9823]

considering all the rigging and all

[@murphystv8120]

bill russell have 11 rings so he is the goat

[@nonamewillbegiven2826]

Nope

[@Amjbmcg]

This is a great idea and that would be amazing if ring BS ended.

[@thenomad6532]

Well it didn’t happen: what did happen however was people pick and choose which rings count more. So now it’s not even about winning rings: it’s about winning in the way they want to see it which is narcissistic imo.

[@nonamewillbegiven6847]

No one cares m/oron

[@mategradac199]

You can rigged one game not entire league... super teams always exsisted... maybe- jordan-pippen, rodman-kukoc- they are not super team?

[@TELEthruVOXx]

I don't do hold my fav players to the ring standard ( Even tho I'm happy dirk got his) there are just to many really damn good players over the years to do that to. I've always thought if you want to say Karl Malone is the best PF your more that welcome to & he has the stats to back it up. Be just couldn't beat Jordan. That shouldn't tarnish a decade of perfecting the pick & roll and giveing jazz fans joy. Rings are the icing on the cake. But there's more to it, a lot more to it. Especially when the league is rigged!!! Haha

[@LegendKiller1fan]

I would have to say that Charles Barkley was a better PF. He too has stats to back it up, just no rings.

[@stevencoardvenice]

time for some new videos

[@UncleT4life]

Sadly ring logic still exists in sports though it's seemed to move over to the nfl mainly to gas up mahomes now which is even dumber than the nba debates over the years

[@ansarisarmadh9823]

ay. who wins the NBA finals this year?

[@TheRiggedBA]

The Warriors I assume.

[@IGLESIANIMANALO1914]

beside of kobe Durant is one of my favorite nba player.. durant deserved win the rings.. based on jordan ring logic horry is better than jordan..

[@Jason09_]

I was just watching first take and Stephen a smith just admitted how the nba is rigged, how the nba will not allow another team in the east to reach finals except for the cavs.

[@TheRiggedBA]

Do you have a link?

[@TheRiggedBA]

Found it. kzbin.info/www/bejne/aGO5qHabpLmHj5Y (at 15 minutes 50 seconds) That's interesting because he didn't just say it on First Take, he's been saying it on other shows too today. I've seen Stephen A. allude to the NBA being rigged before, but usually just in passing. I remember on his old show, "Quite Frankly", he kind of chastised Michael Jordan for downplaying Kobe's 81-point game by Jordan saying there's no way he would have let Kobe get 81 without fouling out trying to stop him. So Stephen A basically asked Jordan who he thought he was kidding because Jordan knows damn well the referees would never foul him out of a game.

[@Jason09_]

This is as blatant as I've ever seen Stephen a smith talk about how important LeBron is to the ratings for nba finals. I wonder if the nba just let the refs call every game normally and unbiased, how would the nba look.

[@TheRiggedBA]

I think it would look very different. To say the least, the most popular players would have a lot less championships and there would be more parity. These guys are all professionals, even a 2nd tier player could kick a superstar's ass on any given night if allowed to. And match-ups matter a lot more than people realize. A lesser team could beat a superior team if they happened to match up well against them. But factors like that don't really get to show in the NBA anymore. If a player posed a match-up problem for the chosen team these days, they'd just get fouled out or something.

[@Morlich209]

While I agree that the refs influence games, the nba cannot simply rig games like you propose they do...for example, what if Kyrie misses the 3 at the end of game 7 and Curry makes, do the refs also decide if an important jump shot goes in??

[@vicshephard9231]

Making it to game 7 was enough for them.

[@ariannabolton8508]

Durant out played LeBron 2017... Kyrie out played Steph 2016...2015 Steph out played LeBron...when Paul Pierce out played Kobe the big 3 won but after LAKERS got Ron Artest LAKERS WON...just like Dr.J didn't win in Philly till the great Moses Malone left HOUSTON...PIPPEN HAD BARKLEY AND MALONE BUT DIDNT WIN A RING, I GUARANTEE MJ WOULD OF WON ATLEAST 2 WITH THOSE HOF...MAGIC HAD KAREEM...KAREEM HAD MAGIC...BIRD HAD HOF'S IN THE 80'S PUT BIRD ON THE WASHINGTON BULLETS, HE'LL STILL BE GREAT BUT WITH LESS RINGS...Put Bill RUSSELL on the Bucks and he won't HAVE half the rings...IT TOOK Pippen 3 yrs to become great just like Kawhi and Kobe...HAD JORDAN played with LA or Boston from the jump he starts winning rings sooner ...JORDAN DOMINATED FROM 1988-1998 THEN SHAQ AND DUNCAN...THEN KOBE AND PAUL PIERCE DOMINATED TILL LEBRON TO OVER...NOW THE PAST 7 YRS LEBRONS DOMINATED WITH DURANT CENIMETERS AWAY...YOUR SUPERSTAR HAS TO OUTPLAY MY SUPERSTAR AND NOT ALL SUPERSTARS ARE LEADERS...DIRK IN 2011, D.WADE IN 06, ...SOMEBODY HAS TO PUT THE BALL IN THE HOLE...MJ GOAT MAGIC JORDAN BIRD DUNCAN SHAQ

[@TheAndyk123]

Durant and Steph outplaying Lebron is stupid revisionist history. Lebron was BY FAR the best player on the court in all 3 of those series.

[@LegendKiller1fan]

When the fuck did Lebron ever play Center or Power Foward? SMF

[@KniroSly]

he plays power foward when kevin love dosent play, its been happening since last year

[@fraddi]

really? wow

[@vikrantgrewal4565]

LegendKiller1fan He played PF a lot in Miami

[@AlexGarcia-xu9bm]

Vikrant Grewal yea but playing power forward now isn't like it used to be. Hes basically still playing against SFs because a lot of teams are also doing the same. If everyone's playing small ball then Lebron isn't really guarding 1-5. Maybe 1-4.

[@TheRiggedBA]

LeBron has also been used to guard centers like Dwight Howard.

[@thenotoriousdig610]

IS BILL RUSSELL BETTER THAN JORDAN? I don't think you can compare them, but according to this stupid logic, he is. Even though they played in vastly different times, positions, with different rules etc

[@hunter12182]

Kerr has five rings not four

[@TheRiggedBA]

Yeah. There's an annotation correcting that.

[@Aingelives44]

copy that.

[@boo6495]

I want to believe its not rigged because that makes me sad if it is

[@alysiano]

Durant won... But it didn't change the ring weaponizing

[@TheRiggedBA]

He didn't kill it, but I think he lessened it. I see a lot more push back against ring logic now. And I see more players stepping up and saying rings aren't the standard by which they measure themselves.

[@mikehammer1777]

RiggedNBA you're sooooo wrong on this. MJ used to get killed by the media, they used to say "scorers don't win championships" "Air Jordan can score but he can't win and that's what separates MJ from Magic and Bird" "Clyde and Barkley are superstars but they can't elevate their teams to championships like Magic and Bird" it wasn't until MJ won his second ring did the media start talking about him in rarified form...... It's always been about rings.....always. Even Wilt, the knock was Russell has multiple rings, Wilt has none....it's always been about rings this is nothing new.

[@TheRiggedBA]

+Mike Hammer "Killed" is a gross overstatement. Jordan was being advertized as the best player in existence almost as soon as he entered the league. He didn't get a championship until 1991, but he was being called the GOAT by announcers already in the 80s. But as the video said, ring logic has always existed on some level. What the video said is that ring logic in it's current, WEAPONIZED form didn't exist. In other words, it wasn't used as an end-all, be-all tool to degrade and disqualify players from discussion like it is today. Yeah, Jordan got the occasional "scorers don't win championships" comment on the side, but it didn't stop him from being considered the best player and he was aggressively promoted as such. The general argument was never that Jordan had to win 5 championships to better than Magic or that he wasn't as good as Bird until he won 3. That just didn't happen back then like it does now. And the fact that Jordan is declared the GOAT today when Bill Russell has almost twice as many rings as Jordan brightly exposes that ring logic is just a ploy. It's only used to prop up Jordan and disqualify potentially threatening players from being compared to him. When players have more rings than Jordan, it gets immediately ignored as the sham argument that it is.

[@mikehammer1777]

I get your point but it is overstated. MJ was herslded as the best player people had seen to that point. No one had seen a 6'6 guy with that level of elegance, speed etc. He was never called the goat then because he had not won. After he won his post retirement 3 peat something NO other NBA player has done was he then referred to as the goat. He retired, returned and threepeared again, tbat is why hes considered the goat, no other player has done that. So do attempt to downplay that is an irrarional argument. Russell had more rings than MJ, but did not abdicate his position in his prime, only to retuen adter his prime and win 3 more. Seems you are conveniently deleting the reason why MJ is considered the goat. 3peat, retired, returned, 3peat.

[@TheRiggedBA]

+Mike Hammer That's not true. Again, Jordan's team didn't get a championship until 1991, but he was being called the GOAT by announcers already in the 80s.

[@mikehammer1777]

Air brushing history to suit your argument...you got it bro.....

[@TheRiggedBA]

So I "airbrushed" these telecasts? They didn't happen? kzbin.info/www/bejne/d3fGiWOAjrSUfq8 Ring logic is a fake standard. It wasn't used like this before and Jordan himself was never judged by it. I didn't airbrush it that way, that's just the way it is.

[@mikehammer1777]

RingeNBA 2 three-peats, one of which was after an impromptu retirement is somehow......"NBA branding"......??? Yeah okay.

[@atomicwedgie8176]

So, by that logic, Bill Russel is the goat! All pro sports is rigged.

[@sageantone7291]

Ring logic may or may not be the best... but Kobe is still better than Lebron.

[@Norien]

Nice facts you got here to back up your statement. Impeccable logic.

[@lilprincekilla]

It's debatable. Lebron's the better team player, Kobe's the better individual player.

[@lilprincekilla]

***** the fact that you're saying I'm wrong tells me you probably know little to nothing about Kobe......

[@theprodigy7002]

L

[@lilprincekilla]

***** The more versatile player is not always the better player, dumb fuck.

[@wakeupnigga1112]

Make more videos bro. I know you have thoughts on the finals

[@TheRiggedBA]

I do. But it will probably be a while before I have time to sit down and make something on it.