Wokeism's Postmodern Roots | Glenn Loury & James Lindsay

[@5dollarshake263]

This episode was very interesting. James Lindsay knocked it out of the park as Glenn steered the ship as the interviewer.

[@bcazz5202]

Thought he was squirming like a toad, actually.

[@TerryStewart32]

James Lindsay could do with a shave and he'd look more respectable.

[@cecilcharlesofficial]

@@ElmerGLue Yep. We live in a world where aesthetics outweigh substance. And what comes from an emphasis on aesthetic over substance? Leftist dismissive snark.

[@ledaswan5990]

@@TerryStewart32 How old are you?

[@beemo9]

I like how Glenn sometimes takes the other side's position to question him. Not enough people can see both sides of arguments.

[@cecilcharlesofficial]

He's so good at steel-manning it - makes you trust him even more, to be honest.

[@5th-Season]

Same here. Is is the master of giving the devil his due.

[@cmcull987]

I think that's just good curiosity and argumentation. A large part of why I like the show.

[@crescendo5594]

The steel man argument is functionally huge to not only understanding the opposition’s argument, but introspectively criticizing your own, in order to remove the weak points, update, and strengthen it in the end.

[@jakelee7639]

Their are no both sides,....woke is guilt ridden racism to virtue signal., not interested in how or why crazy, destructive people think

[@npickard4218]

I watch every one of Dr. Loury's podcasts and I think this was the BEST. I will watch it about 3 more times. He hit upon every hot button issue. LOL

[@Leadeshipcoach]

Same... or at least I try! And I too will be listening to this again!

[@vvggg12]

These two together are interesting blend

[@troymcg]

Glen Loury is a very skilled interviewer.

[@Drewsicology]

He's an excellent interviewer and I love whenever he steel man's an opposing argument. I just wish there was more back-and-forth in this conversation. I agree with others that adding John would add a very interesting dimension to the conversation

[@welovecheshirecats4557]

Glen Loury is very skilled in many fields.

[@stevecaldwell8740]

His standards of intellectual honesty and rigour mean that he will draw out the critical style of a debate to examine both sides of an issue, even on topics he agrees with. Good to see, given that we hardly see debates these days, due to the intellectual dishonesty of many figures in this culture war space.

[@NagorbMan]

I can't tell if he's taking devils advocate positions, or if he genuinely believes the premises of the questions. Either way, James answered the questions well and Glen did a good job letting him talk and if he had biases it didn't particularly ruin the interview if it was there.

[@JadeoftheGlade]

Absolutely.

[@Ferdinand314]

Great convo! Two of America's most fearlessly brilliant men, talking things over. If only the people who really need to hear this would listen.

[@notificationsareblocked.yo53]

Most aren't intelligent enough to follow. And if they are, often they are already so balls deep in their ideology that they're stuck in a constant state of delusion. Instead people just want to scream and fight for their tribe aka the cult of Wokeism with no rational thought in sight.

[@Ferdinand314]

@@notificationsareblocked.yo53 I fear you're right, but a lot of them graduate from top colleges. Keri Smith over at Unsafe Space went to Duke. They certainly don't lack the raw brain power; they're being scandalously miseducated. We have to keep pushing back, even if it's futile.

[@billsimms2511]

@@notificationsareblocked.yo53 it’s very shocking at how people just blindly follow the woke ideology. There is no critical thinking with these folks at all, they just buy into it and start preaching . Wtf

[@billsimms2511]

@@Ferdinand314 yes and they are now starting to indoctrinate kids in grade schools. This is beyond disturbing. The future of our country will be ...?

[@ondolite3789]

@@billsimms2511 No such thing as woke ideology.

[@samhand8270]

When these types of conversations, with such clear thinking and honest assessment, are considered “heterodox” or taboo, it really begs the question: what kind of world are we heading into?

[@crazierthan-u7571]

I agree that the media spun Trump's utterances. I caught them a couple of times myself and even asked them, "Why are you twisting that which is already twisted? It's so unnecessary and hurts your credibility." What brought me to thinking the unthinkable was when the White House Office of Budget and Management issued a smackdown on the D'Angeloian, taxpayer-funded diversity training and identified it for what it was. In the end, though, I couldn't vote for Trump. He's an empty, self-serving greed machine who embodies all the frailties of mankind and none of its virtues. But I couldn't vote for Biden either because he at least appears to be leading us down the Road to Wokeville. But I think James goes too far in his support for Trump. He's forgetting what a fucking insensitive dunce he is; the shitty way he has treated veterans and their families -- John McCain for one. His inability to accept any criticism whatsoever, like when he incorrectly included Alabama as one of the states in the path of a hurricane. Instead of simply saying, "Oh, my bad," and carrying on, he took a Sharpie and altered a national weather map trying to mold reality to conform with his error. I thought I'd die of embarrassment when Trump congratulated Poland on the 80th anniversary of its invasion by the Nazis. I read that "congratulations" is a verbal tic he sputters out when he doesn't know what else to say. But then, when Vladimir Putin "won" the election in Russia, Trump, with a card in his hand that said "do not congratulate," congratulated him anyway! Yeah, Mr. Putin. You poisoned or jailed your political opponents in a fair election -- well done! On a Joe Rogan podcast, Magician Penn Gillette told of the two years he spent on "The Apprentice," when he had the chance to observe Trump long and closely. His statement about Trump's lack of a sense of humor, at least with regard to himself, and his apparent absence of any understanding or enjoyment of music chilled me to the core. James almost seems to think Trump was actually a good presidentia, maybe, and the guy isn't even a decent human being. In the words of Dr. Seuss, Trump is "a bad banana with a greasy black peel." Maybe he did get a couple of things right, but even a busted watch is right twice a day. The damage he has left in his wake is undeniable. My fear remains, however, that Biden & Co. are going to finish slavering a gooey salve of still worse damage over it. And the rest of the free world will sing along in perfect harmony, just like in the old Coke commercial. I feel so doomed.

[@jameshallahan769]

I know! WTF

[@samhand8270]

@@crazierthan-u7571 You’re right about Trump’s character, and in an election that is a referendum on Trump’s personality rather than his policy, he loses every time. I agree that Trump is far from ideal but, for half the country, he was better than the alternative in 2016 and 2020, and that says a lot more about his opposition than it does about Trump. If Trump did nothing else though, he exposed, probably inadvertently, the rot and corruption in our political and media institutions (or rather they exposed themselves because of their hatred for the man). If that corruption doesn’t get addressed than we should expect more of the same: less than qualified candidates winning elections because of their unwillingness to concede to the left’s and the establishment’s orthodoxies (which will probably be characterized by more careless rhetoric and “unpresidential” behavior). No reasonable person would want to endure the inevitable political attacks and brutal media coverage that combatting the woke cult and their powerful allies invites, which is why you get unreasonable, often reckless candidates like Trump.

[@crazierthan-u7571]

@@samhand8270 Thing is, we've never had a candidate like Trump. Ever. During the 2016 race, he must have said a hundred things that would have instantly ended the political aspirations of literally ANYONE else who said them. Which makes me suspect the hand of Satan in all this. We've had presidents with abrasive personalities before; presidents with some particular moral failing or flaw. Overall character is another thing to me, and nothing reveals a person's rancid character more than power or adversity. I'm just putting a finer point on my own comment, because I basically agree with everything you said.

[@crazierthan-u7571]

We're heading into a CRAPPY world that I hope I will not live to see reach full flower.

[@nickforte]

Glenn looks amused and engaged by Lindsay's grasp of the subject matter. They should engage more often.

[@cecilcharlesofficial]

I've never seen Loury just sit and listen for such lengthy spells. James is a force to be reckoned with, and Loury can tell. This convo is so good. More please.

[@markt4281]

I agreee

[@kiwigrunt330]

This is the clearest explanation I have heard from James as to why he voted for Trump. Makes more sense now. Great conversation.

[@ondolite3789]

😸

[@poltergeistfm]

Could have gone on for another 90 minutes as far as I'm concerned.

[@Leadeshipcoach]

agreed!!

[@RM-tr7bk]

I just listened to the podcast a second time. Lindsay is to be highly regarded. He is insightful and courageous. The perfect guest for a show of the caliber of the Glenn Show. How about you (Prof Loury), John McWhorter, and James Lindsay in a discussion together, as McWhorter is, I understand, writing a book on critical race theory?

[@outofbluepills]

That would be GREAT. John's writing a book on Wokism as a religion. James knows their entire theology, and in his previous life, he was an author on atheism. It would be a great discussion.

[@vintage910]

@@outofbluepills honestly that’s a subject that they should get Peter in on too. Peter and James have had a few good interviews on that subject.

[@Higoodmorning-t5o]

@@vintage910 Peter who?

[@honeybadger5933]

@@Higoodmorning-t5o Peter Boghossian

[@undefinedfreedom8580]

This is first podcast that I listen to twice.

[@Mooxieclang]

It takes some stones to stand up and say what these guys are saying in the face of an entire culture against them. Much love from a libertarian anarchist 💛🤘

[@tteot1wph]

James & co. are doing very valuable work. Glad to see them get more attention

[@RedRose-fr8ze]

Thanks for letting James speak freely, Glenn. I agree with James.

[@AerysBat]

An epic crossover

[@swordpoint9]

Perfect honest conversation!

[@marionhoe1367]

Fantastic conversation! I sensed Glenn was a little skeptical about James Lindsay's take on things. James stepped up and was stellar. Glenn seemed to really appreciate the coherency and consistency of the arguments set out by James. Thrilled at the supreme quality of the communication! Glenn seemed pleased too.

[@VIEWITIS]

It's rare to find someone willing to read all the postmodernist/Marxist garbage outside the circle of woke believers. Hell, even they don't read much of it. Lindsay and Pluckrose are doing society a service. Too bad Pluckrose isn't as active on podcasts and such, though, since Lindsay can grate on people with his flippant humor and overtalking.

[@michaelhiggins2562]

Glenn, thanks for introducing James to your audience.

[@drwhatson]

James Lindsay, thank you for your unceasing research. We desperately need people like you to expose the lunacy of endless pseuds with loud voices.

[@larsanderson2150]

Let’s not forget the progressive arrogance that compels them to “help” the black community which manifests a co-dependency that likely assuages some form of guilt perhaps.

[@regi8838]

GLENN, THIS WAS AWESOME! An a MUCH needed example of MUCH needed conversations too many aren’t willing (or brave) enough to have/allow!

[@SpookyApparition]

Conversations like this keep me sane right now. It's reassuring to know that level-headed public figures still exist.

[@roderickmorrison]

Glenn's steel-manning of the position of Derek Bell (sp?) by Glenn - brilliant. A fantastic demonstration of how to think, how to understand the argument and the positions!

[@1pointt21gW]

EXCELLENT job summarizing the malignant mutations of postmodernism! Being a physicist I have tracked this unholy mess since 1987 and this is among the best summaries I have heard. It's been crazy how the academic fads kept rebranding from postmodernism to deconstructionism to moral relativism to social constructivism to wokeness. The real victims were the social or so called soft sciences. Interesting how we refer to the most difficult early stage sciecnce as being soft...instead of scoffing at economics or cognitive science we should remind ourselves that physics was once a nascent science and may yet be revolutionized!

[@omglol9825]

There's no shame in being a soft science, sometimes when studying a soft subject you have to adapt to understand it. What's terrible is when they pretend they're hard sciences, or the other way around

[@1pointt21gW]

@@omglol9825 I completely agree.

[@boilermaker1337]

Great conversation, Glenn and James. It's so refreshing seeing people discussing issues trying to be objective while admitting the limits of their knowledge.

[@mayormccheese6171]

Americans got such blue-balls with Trump not going to war with anyone, they had to go to war with themselves to get relief.

[@alexs6250]

Deep!

[@steveb9713]

It’s amazing how woke the mainstream society is and conversations like this are largely ignored in media

[@dwindeyer]

One could argue that conversations like this are largely ignored in media precisely because of how woke mainstream society is

[@janso7979]

@Rosen Bar I would say that we are at least several years past the golden age of KZbin, although we haven't yet hit the dark age. There's a lot of interesting material still available but one needs to diligently seek it out these days. The algorithm has become more and more intent on pushing MSM and sanitized, non-controversial material, regardless of one's viewing history.

[@josephsorrentino9530]

Please consider an episode where you discuss a particular problem and have a discussion to work towards some proposed solutions. How do we improve education and close the gap with performance? Do we stop measuring performance, or do we understand what makes it flourish and strive to implement that in our schools

[@RM-tr7bk]

Excellent idea.

[@billsimms2511]

I’d like to hear that as well. We talk about the problems of wokeness and other education issues but rarely do we talk about possible solutions

[@CrustyJug]

Both of you at your best, thank you gentlemen

[@bobd251]

I'm going to have to listen to this about 5 more times to absorb it all... maybe. Very good.

[@Grkgroup2]

It’s always great to hear two excellent scholars discuss. Please interview James Lindsey more.

[@jamieleerahimian8037]

One of your best conversations I’ve ever heard!

[@JoeLeasure]

Excellent discussion as always from Glen & co. But to address one revealing point Glen expressed: he wondered if white people primarily watch his show for the anti-narrative views he expresses that they don't feel the 'authority' to express. Personally, I wouldn't call it 'authority'. It's just that, I as a white man can convey those sentiments all day (and often do), but they're simply dismissed out of hand because it's viewed as serving my interests. When Glen or John say these things it's against their assumed interests so it has more weight. Or it's at least less easily dismissed as self-serving.

[@billsimms2511]

Great point! We are in a place where whites simply are unable to talk about certain things. If they do they are labeled alt right .

[@somedandy7694]

Damn, these guys were ON POINT! I'd get torn apart against either of them. But Loury steel-manned the opposition and pressed HARD on James, and James was prepared and defended his points brilliantly!

[@plaidpaisley5918]

I loved this so much!!

[@philippedesaulniers]

Glenn and James are both heroes! I absolutely loved this conversation

[@russellmm]

Great conversation, I enjoyed it and hope you have more of these.

[@sarahleahcanada]

This was a fantastic discussion. Thank you.

[@nikmills]

This is going to be good.

[@random_person6041]

Love this interview💚

[@HerbSparks]

I've been really looking forward to this interview. I really respect both you guys.

[@julian65886]

Great show Glenn! This guy is as good as John. Make more videos with him.

[@joshjones9878]

James Lyndsey and Prof Stephen Hicks have done the most to help the world.understsnd the deep philosophical roots of the madness we are seeing these days

[@samuelyeates2326]

Great conversation, I have been following these subjects for a long time and this puts so much on the table in a succinct and accessible way.

[@matthewmaccaughey5016]

This should have been twice as long. Excellent Conversation.

[@Leadeshipcoach]

Excellent discussion!! I have been seeing James book for sometime now appearing in my Amazon “suggested reads”. I will be buying it now!

[@caracre]

Can’t wait for this!

[@georgeharvey3062]

Glenn this was a great conversation! I thoroughly enjoyed it start to finish. Thank you for having such intellectually stimulating podcasts. 🙏🙏🙏

[@kathastrand4110]

Loury is an excellent interviewer. Love heterodox thinking honoring nuanced reality.

[@playnejayne5550]

Cosby's albums of the 1960's were everywhere. The family laughed to them together. He was the first black to enter most homes, if only on vinyl.

[@nathanngumi8467]

Sam Cooke also, they say he was even more dangerous than Malcolm X or Muhammad Ali because he was already in White living rooms by the time he turned towards radical politics.

[@partygrove5321]

And look what a POS he turned out to be!

[@playnejayne5550]

@@partygrove5321 Sad but true.

[@partygrove5321]

@@playnejayne5550 Hey I used to like Cos too.

[@hegemonycricket2182]

That was excellent. We need more of this and we need it to mainstream rapidly.

[@BenWeeks]

Key Section 20:30 Glenn's Steelman of Derek Bell Setup (Bell is CRT's founder-Glenn knew him.) 21:20 Derek Bell Steelman Begins 25:00 Bell feels PoMo is helpful. "What's wrong with that?" 26:44 "Not much!" James explains Foucault's History of Sexuality. (Pessimism ignores cultural change, negates distinctions.) (Bell's 1992 book 'Faces at the bottom of the well' seems locked in 1970's) 34:00 Black comedians already taught us to laugh at ourselves. 38:00 Conservatives reckon with accusations of racism. Black comedy excellence.

[@AstroSquid]

I've been watching Glenn and John, and I've been watching James for about almost a year now trying to understand what's going on. It's great to seem them mix thoughts. Epic.

[@sherrydionisio4306]

Fascinating! Thank you gentlemen.

[@stopchasingoblivion6175]

Just came across this episode and I'm glad I found it. A great conversation!

[@chasedanforth4037]

Glen is an amazing listener. I envy these skills.

[@travelinpack]

You guys need to talk again. Definitely.

[@Dwadedragon]

I was hoping that one day these two would converse! Cheers!

[@bb-od9ku]

Loved this

[@monarado2118]

Love both these guys.

[@sigsfast]

Man! What a wonderful conversation.

[@danielpeirson3071]

Great interview Glenn.

[@stevenrichardson1843]

James is the closest i have to a guru. He has made sense of more to me than anyone else, more even than Thomas Soweĺl and Richard Dawkins. And they were a big deal for me.

[@ondolite3789]

Why do you need this in your life. What is missing?

[@follow-jade]

Glenn, it is a good thing that the ultra right listens to you and likes you because that is showing you are talking sense into people who before could not be convinced.

[@christopherd6399]

There are a lot of verbal acknowledgements when the other person talks. That translates to drowning each other out. I miss things here and there. I only bring this up because I am raptly attentive, just short of taking notes. Best thing going on KZbin! Recommend sticking to head nods when the other person speaks, and agree to that before you start. Thank you! So nice to see sanity somewhere among the intelligent.

[@yordanojimenez5291]

Fantastic discussion. Thank you!

[@Heart_filled_bot]

Great interview!!

[@josephgoodrich]

These guys are SO GREAT.

[@merrick8000]

Subscribed. Glens a gem

[@danettebear-ett7616]

Y E S, James i love you now. Ive watched your awakening on Trump over time and i love it!!💕

[@deenzmartin6695]

something tells me that you're missing the point.

[@mariazibell8229]

What an amazing discussion!

[@ondolite3789]

☺

[@frankiegumdrops8532]

LETS DO THIS!!!

[@ksquare81]

This was a great conversation. Thank you both!

[@danstube411]

Thanks Glenn, great show.

[@orihoola]

Glenn asking great questions

[@playnejayne5550]

I began teaching public school history in Virginia in the 80's. The books were at least 10 years old. We had to follow state standards of learning. The old narratives about race were considered a joke by the late 80's.

[@explrr22]

I attended HS in SE Wisconsin, early 1970s, it was then and remains a pretty solid Republican. The books I presume were rather traditional narrative, I don't remember them, but 60s had happened and my american history and social studies teachers made sure we were aware of blinkered views of past and information available in literature about plights and repression of black folks, native americans, labor, etcetera. Teachers were mostly hard nosed athletic coaches and far from leftists. Now I was on the "honors" track, so maybe others got a different version. Point is, for those students willing and able to look and think critically at history we already had most of the corrections people now insist we need to "start" learning about in front of us. We knew about Tulsa massacre and the crimes of Reconstruction, we read Dee Brown. I thought maybe there was some big retrenchment in 1980s education. But I'm beginning to suspect the trope about what people have been taught in school up until recently is false or exaggerated. It's certainly missing a lot of reality. Perhaps it was true in much of south or rural hinterlands?

[@playnejayne5550]

@@explrr22 Most of what we are taught is required by state standards, at least today. I cannot imagine state social studies standards for any version of White History. I graduated from HS in northern NJ in 1971. We knew about the Civil Rights Movement from covering current events in elementary school. Beyond that, I cannot really remember. I'm sure we were taught love of our country. Now I'm retired and in Virginia. I recently learned that the new social studies book for 9th grade begins with discussion of White Privilege. Now what is a 14-year-old to do with that? Hey kid, you're black and the deck's stacked against you. You kid, are white and a member of the Oppressor Race. Very upsetting in a depressing way.

[@explrr22]

On reflection I think even where education was updated in the past, in the same time periods a lot of culture and the cultural products changed much less... And it's those elements that are actually more responsible for a lot of social attitudes and actions. It does create a tragic dilemma when fairness, ethics and decency requires change. My current concern is I find much of now popular diagnoses and remedies significantly flawed. If diagnoses are in error and result in prescriptions that are socially toxic, that IS BAD! We should at least be responsibly and openly evaluating the possibility of such unintended effects (not driving the evaluation out). Which doesn't mean you give up on driving towards some type of progress. It just means you need more rigorous processes.

[@playnejayne5550]

@@explrr22 If it ain't broke, don't change itI. If it is broke, be careful with the diagnosis. If it is broke, change it only as much as needed, being careful of unintended effects.

[@annbrucepineda8093]

@@playnejayne5550 True. There was an older movie called "The Prime of Miss Jean Brodie (?)". She was a teacher whose passion for what she didn't really understand led to the death of one of her students who had gone off to fight in the Spanish Civil War, "inspired" by her teacher.

[@ClawsNGloves]

Great podcast.

[@aprilscales4683]

Very interesting conversation. I found your channel because I am in an MSW program that is teaching the "woke" rhetoric and I found that much of it didn't seem grounded in reality or grassroots effort. I hope to one day create a community nonprofit for children suffering through adversity and poverty that uses scientific research on how to build resilience. I think that you and John balance the current discussion and bring helpful information and possibilities that I could implement. So, thank you for being open and sharing your thoughts! About this video specifically: I find myself more in the camp that Trump was part of the swamp and took advantage of some of the turmoil we are experiencing for himself, but I enjoyed this discussion and appreciated listening to another perspective. I very much agree that we should be allowed to openly discuss these issues and I am unhappy with the current climate of silencing/policing what others say.

[@billsimms2511]

That’s what I can’t wrap my head around when it comes to the “woke” rhetoric. Much of it is not grounded in reality yet it’s being pushed at high levels . Our countries intellectuals are pushing this and I don’t get it 🤔

[@pomyao]

Fantastic. Thank you both.

[@libertywilly7519]

48 minutes in. That is the thing Professor. Simple but that's why I consider you must listen.

[@richardkut3976]

Excellent show, thanks again.

[@npickard4218]

I wish this had been a 3 hour discussion !!

[@roggr679]

“I said something true which is always the most dangerous thing in the world to do”. An amusing (but correct) observation that stands out in a fine discussion.

[@swordpoint9]

Just subbed Glenn. Thank you!

[@kelseystrate2035]

Poll workers and other election officials are among the most honest public officials in the country.

[@lance1097]

Wow. The truth

[@jabbrewoki]

Good stuff.

[@asmrasmr6229]

beautiful conversation

[@Mark-hc8ek]

I really like New Discourses. I recommend checking it out.

[@Mbsfpvchannel]

To Dr. Loury: I've always thought that Candace Owens says all the right things that white people want to hear, yet things that are not the result of rigorous thought. It's almost pandering. That's not what you are doing. There's nothing pandering or traitorous about being critical of your culture when it's the result of careful thought, and when your heart is in the right place. You are not saying these things to scold, as does Candace. I see her pleasing whites by tearing down blacks, and it's shameful. I saw her referring to blacks as cockroaches, and was appalled. Coleman Hughes said something that really hit me and got me away from feeling any guilt about being critical of inner city culture. He said, it isn't victim shaming when your heart is not coming from a place of hate. There's nothing wrong with white people recognizing that inner city culture is hurting people, and calling it out if their heart is coming from a place of wanting them to live better, and not from a place of hate or condemnation, and there's nothing wrong with you saying it. That's the difference between black intellectuals like you, and pandering, non-intellectuals like Candace.

[@johnneville403]

It's not pandering to tell people they're not automatically racist because their skin colour happens to be white. It's calling out racist bigotry for what it is.

[@Mbsfpvchannel]

@@johnneville403 she says nothing original, is mean spirited and panders, that doesn't mean that some things that she says are untrue

[@tman040496tb]

Well is it hate or is she just angry at the state of the situation. I'm from the rule south and if I had to talk about meth head in my community I'd sound the same way she does. Dont confuse passion for hate.

[@Mbsfpvchannel]

@@tman040496tb she doesn't say anything that thoughtful, it's just venom

[@m.chumakov1033]

@@Mbsfpvchannel Calling a alcoholic an alcoholic, a thug a thug, a crybaby a crybaby, a hypocrite a hypocrite is not venom, it's the bare truth that most in your community refuse to face. Of course Candace is not as sophisticated as Glenn and John, her background is too different. But what you hear from her and Tatum is not pandering to whites, it's just a more blatant version of what you hear from Glenn. And unlike Glenn and John they didn't come out from BMC, they are from the hood so when they say "Stop whining about your victimhood, take control of your life!" it's because they care about their community and see what's going on from close distance. Do you think it's fun for them to do that, knowing that more than half of blacks would hate them? Well, as James Lindsay put in this podcast, telling the truth is the most dangerous thing these days.

[@paweex3655]

YES! YES! YES!

[@christyrae8800]

Great conversation! Working at a public school in NYC I have heard the opinion to get rid of the current Constitution and write a new one. “Start from scratch” was the phrase someone used.

[@bobterrana6554]

Your out of your mind. based on the Constitution this is the greatest most powerful country in the world. And you want to change because of your white guilt.foolish.

[@christyrae8800]

Bob Terrana Hello sir. I think you misunderstood my comment. I hear people calling for that at my school, but I disagree with them. Like you, I love our country and our Constitution.

[@bobterrana6554]

Thats ok i understand. I would inform them that if we lose the Constitution we lose all our rights as American citizens. And if the government writes a new constitution. it's not gonna be for the people. It's gonna be for the government. A lot of people have given their lives For the freedom we have today. It seems a lot of young people don't understand that freedom is not free.

[@josiahclarke3535]

@@christyrae8800 People can't or won't read before they react

[@christyrae8800]

@@josiahclarke3535 :)

[@Guillhez]

29:25 I for one think the religious understanding of homosexuality, on the long run, is far preferable than the medical one.. The religious understanding saw it as "something people do", which meant that one could be persuaded to quit it, to regret it and ultimately to be forgiven for it. The medical/psychological understanding saw it as "something people are" or "something people are afflicted with" which meant one needed to be purged from it and 'cured' from it. That's not to say that there wasn't an overlap between these two perspectives or that either one of them is entirely false or correct, but rather that the medical/scientific establishments of the 18th, 19th and early to mid 20th centuries get too much of pass for the pains they've inflicted on gay people and that religions are too harshly judged for things they aren't entirely responsible for. That is, even though historically religious doctrines have been the fuel of many homophobic sentiments, a lot of the discrimination and violence gay people suffered in recent centuries came from faulty medical and psychological perspectives whose basis were entirely rooted in enlightenment views of humanity rather than in traditional religions.

[@josephsorrentino9530]

Excellent discussion looking forward to round 2

[@hieronymuslarsson1388]

Wonderful conversation. Lindsay is worth his weight in gold for being honest and sharp and having the patience and stamina to dig for and parse the roots of the bisarre nonsense we encounter today. It seems postmodernism sort of lays claim to, and draws appeal due to, what i'd call social epistemology - the philosophy of establishing knowledge through purely social processes and relations. And screws up. Yet it's an interesting and potentially fruitful field. Because a lot if not most of our knowledge is obtained socially. We usually don't trust anyone blindly on anything of importance, there's a ton of common sense, intuitive assumptions as well as conscious principles that determine how successful we are in obtaining truth by social processes; e.g. whether we trust experts over laymen, what traits and acts we think lowers and raises credibility, when and how aggregates of people become more trustworthy than individuals. There's a lot in there that should interest us just as much as deductive priciples or design and interpretation of experiments. Not just for philosophical but for practical, everyday purposes. "Socially epistemological" power bears a lot of resemblance to political power because it's a hierarchical social structure of people and aggregates of people that determine what we bring on board as dependable truths. It's also true that political (i.e. physical, actual) power, by influencing parts of that hierarchy can distort the socially held truth away from objective truth to some degree. But it cuts both ways - individuals in the social epistemological hierachy are vested with a kind of indirect power and can by either unearthing politically sensitive truths or hiding such truths make or break kings (literally and figuratively). What is socially held to be true determines what societies do. This social epistemology is an important epistemological branch that should'nt be left to bunglers, political activists and charlatans.

[@leonpope861]

Individuals are personally responsible, and accountable for their growth in Wisdom, Truth, Transparency, and Transcendental Love. ❤💓💗

[@drwhatson]

That wasn't an real *insurrection* or a *coup*, that's why. One person died, shot point blank in the face by a security guard who has got off scott free. There were almost a million people present. Had they wanted to, they could have torn the Capitol building apart brick-by-brick or burned it to the ground, not scattered a few papers.

[@h.boylen6334]

They sure as hell didn’t scatter a few papers. And more than one woman died. The only reason it wasn’t a coup was because Pence did the right thing. I’m conservative but this is a bullshit “narrative” if you don’t think something bad happened at the Capitol. So much for the cops that were there and saw it quite differently than you in your armchair .

[@mikem4984]

Would love to see John added to their next conversation. And let it go three hours! : )

[@cecilcharlesofficial]

yes please

[@brettneely9019]

Bravo!

[@megg.6651]

I wish that Glenn was my dad

[@petermathieson5692]

Glenn, courts did not pronounce on the evidence. Court after court after court refused to hear the evidence on the basis of "standing". Courts used "standing" to avoid becoming involved.

[@bettinabarr9107]

Why did the Supreme Court, on which three Trump appointed judges sit and which has a conservative majority, refuse to hear any cases about election fraud?

[@bettinabarr9107]

A decent number of the courts that dismissed the lawsuits had Trump appointed judges. They were dismissed due to lack of evidence. Even wikipedia gets that right.

[@jato72]

40:21. Glenn, I enjoy your podcasts because you are authentic, not because you are a certain skin tone.