PUSHDOWNS vs OVERHEAD EXTENSIONS: Which is Better?

[@Raj-zt6hf]

ive done ovh ext because of you, and I love it

[@WolfCoaching]

Glad you’ve been finding them helpful king

[@Pain53924]

Forearm hypertrophy please. Yes this is the 69th time i'm commenting this on ur video

[@WolfCoaching]

COMING SOON - STAY TUNED

[@Pain53924]

@@WolfCoaching thnax a ton

[@lorcan8484]

just buy arm wrestling tools, kid not that hard🙄🙄

[@logomarkz]

Weighted pullups and heavy carries.

[@googlymooglyman]

​@@WolfCoaching Abs would be great too! those are basically all the muscle groups you got left unless you wanna throw neck hypertrophy in there lol

[@Not-Lunar]

imho do both, push downs to warm up the elbows then extentions

[@Chr.Saint-Michael]

I think warming up is better just doing a few light sets with low reps on the overhead extension or on a press before

[@MangoTheRetriever]

Dope audio and video quality also dope content as always!

[@hyperarts4087]

watching this as I'm doing myoreps Pushdown after my overhead extensions set.

[@stevenzak199]

You mention that pushdowns tend to be easier on people's elbows 0:46, which is undoubtedly true. But there's more to that idea. The late, great John Meadows used to coach that pushdowns should always be done first, before overhead extensions, because pushdowns warm up your elbows so that overhead extensions can be done with a smaller chance of causing elbow problems. To protect your elbows, he'd say, never do overhead extensions (or anything like that, like skull crushers) first. Do them only after warming up with pushdowns.

[@omegaman_]

Always look forward to your content..👊🏻

[@WolfCoaching]

Thank you sir!

[@mihailopopovic4759]

Love this kind of content! Keep dping good work!

[@FitFatFit]

Sound and video are top notch bro ! Pak said that you’ve invested a lot in it and it feels ! Keep up the good work

[@huckinator]

If you ever do any specialized arm training in your normal split I would definitely love to see your journey, exercise selection, and so on. Maybe even some vlog style? Maybe an idea for a mini video series

[@SavageResolve]

As usual quality information.

[@gxymxr]

I’d love to see stiff leg DL vs Good mornings

[@Shine603]

Thank you for the video ! I do both pushdowns and OH extensions, but for me personnally, pushdowns are easier to overload than OHE. Single arm overhead extensions are way harder to progressively overload for me.

[@ryanwk1]

What u talkin bout man just go to failure with it

[@Dougie.A.M]

You definitely won't be using the same weight for overhead, but that's not a problem unless all you want to do is swing weights around at the gym and directly compare one tricep movement to another. Slow eccentric, huge intentional stretch, controlled concentric to failure or 1 in reserve. It'll blast them and you'll feel it in the morning.

[@pldl200]

awesome video. A video on differences in muscle worked between high bar and low bar squats would be great.

[@salvarunatortuga5396]

I would love to hear more of your content, subscribe, etc. but you gotta do chapters on your videos.

[@I_Might_B_Wrong]

Interesting clarification on muscle length vs stretch-mediated hypertrophy toward the end of the video. Do you believe there's a spectrum in which the amount of benefit from different levels of muscle length can be witnessed? As in, is something between a fully stretched position and 90 degrees likely going to have benefits on hypertrophy that land between the two?

[@miamidolphinsfan]

Doc, you made a great investment, your sound is improved

[@_MrTV]

Appreciate the new audio! ❤

[@chayoto]

Maeo is my hero. Upped sample size by more than 2x, equated ROM, managed to get access to a multi-planar imaging technique. Damn, dude went to town on his research, didn't he?

[@gerym341]

Very informative! Thank you, Doctor!

[@troels7]

Did both today.

[@le_rayon_vert]

I'm wondering where the cross cable tricep extension fits into this picture since Jeff Nippard has mentioned that he thinks kick-backs (which i think these sorta resemble) are still decent for the long head.

[@1TieDye1]

Cross cable tricep extensions aren’t significantly different from push downs

[@honeybrew5063]

I do both. Pushdowns have a very good SFR in comparison to other triceps exercises.

[@rockyevans1584]

Lmao, bro cmon. Unless you're arm dominant and are talking about bench variations, how the hell are triceps movements causing notable fatigue? That sounds like a cardiovascular issue for sure

[@slee2695]

Lol..maybe he means joint stress?

[@rockyevans1584]

@slee2695 that would make way more sense haha, pushdowns feel great. Nothing seems to grow my tris like the oh cable ext tho, sometimes you gotta say fuck your feelings

[@DJcs187]

​@@rockyevans1584if I do 3 sets to absolutele failure, there's a huge difference between how sore I get from extensions vs. pushdowns and subsequently how soon I can train triceps again

[@rockyevans1584]

@DJcs187 sure. I feel the same about rdls and ham curls. We were talking about sfr, not the doms incurred. Your arm isos arent causing systemic fatigue that will notably affect your workouts. Of course you need to structure your program so that arm isos aren't affecting your chest or back work, but that's due to acute disruption, not related to systemic fatigue

[@CrispyCircuits]

I've have a couple of problems that due to some luck, I think I now might know why. First, years ago I had severe convulsive seizures. I was pretty muscular at the time and I tore up my shoulder pretty badly. It required surgery to stop getting both forward and backward dislocations. The surgery was a success. I am not sure if scarring is the reason or not, but I quickly get shoulder pain doing certain exercises like the overhead extensions. I will need to see a physical therapist/Doctor to determine this. However, I also get forearm pain and elbow pain. I'm not sure what is causing the elbow pain. I also have had problems with pain at my wrists when I bend them (like the push up position or getting up from the floor or bed). I temporarily switched to straight arm into a fist to do this. After seeing a video by Leonidas using gymnastic rings for forearm strengthening, I watched a gymnastics video that talked about stretching the forearm tendons, I realized that I was severely needing to stretch my forearms. I'm going to try to get an appointment with physical therapy to get some help with all of this. However medical staffing shortages are really bad where I live. Do you have or know any videos that deal with this meanwhile? Thanks. Nice videos you put up, too.

[@oogabooga72]

hey can you make a video of whats in your gym bag? or what should be in it? love your channel

[@darrenjamrock2677]

Always look forward to your vids you put in a lot of work in bro would love to know your thoughts on if these exercises are safe long term like overheads, skull crushers, dips, etc

[@Johnsonthe3rd]

I watched paul carter talk about a study where it supports the idea that when it comes to triceps, the medial/lateral head gets more hyperthrophy from a partials rom(shortened) in the skullcrusher. What is your take on that study

[@EvanZamir]

I do both. Problem solved.

[@2jmajjic]

🧠

[@Dougie.A.M]

Modern problems, modern solutions.

[@DJcs187]

Same but..what if doing only overhead extensions was better?

[@murmor6890]

@@DJcs187 Pushdowns are a lot easier on the elbows for many people. I mean there are surely some people somewhere that take better to overhead extensions, but in general it is the other way around. I don't think for example 6 weekly sets triceps extensions are a lot better than 3 sets of triceps extensions and 3 sets of push downs (but those are surely better than 6 sets of push downs) but for most people far better manageable for joint stress. Also exercise science is not the best in general and the triceps tends to vary a lot genetically in particular, so would take it with a grain of salt.

[@newsean6771]

Neck hypertrophy video please

[@ryanwk1]

Overhead DB extensions get me sore easy probly from the stretch. Cable pushdowns dont, i try to stick to exercise that get me that soreness

[@gerym341]

Oh, and the audio! The audio!

[@MONKEYDKEVIN]

Should do Upright rows vs OHP for overall shoulder hypertrophy.

[@naijaman6639]

Your channel is quality...top quality. Kudos. I 've subscribed, by the way.

[@neon8270]

YES THE AUDIO!!!!

[@coppersuraniumden1985]

What is your personal opinion on Dr. Mike Israetel's form on the overhead extension for the long head? His form seems very different compared to other's (including yours) form on the overhead extension. Great video as always

[@Ultimatefitness360]

As muscle stretch passive tension increases which tend to more growth than active tension

[@davidii28]

audio is much better 🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@Coachahmadreza]

🌸 Plz talk about straps. Upsides and downsides (would it reduce grip strength gains at the expense of better targeting certain muscles)

[@j.cbarajas8988]

I would say if you care about grip strength only use straps when your grip is the limiting factor. Straps will not train your grip

[@C0d0ps]

I enjoy the new audio ❤

[@sinusoid703]

How do we train abs in a lengthed position. Mostly all of them never even put them in a lengthed position let alone emphasizing it.

[@SeleniumBalls]

I put a block behing my back when doing regular crunches on the ground, and my gym has a cable crunch machine with a back pad where I also put the pad there to get a full stretch. I put the block where I feel the greatest stretch. I'm not sure how much better this is than regular cable crunches but it feels so much better for me

[@omegaman_]

Yoga ball crunches are great for stretching the abs while getting a good burn in the contraction , slow high reps of 20..😊

[@ippanpedrozo1162]

use a decline bench w ankle bars to lock in legs

[@michaelshultz8973]

Totally agree with the other responders. Specifically for the lower abs, I'll do leg lifts on a flat or even decline bench and exaggerate the eccentric. At the bottom, let the pelvis tilt forward and the legs descend past parallel until you feel a nice stretch in the lower abs. I probably go about 30° past parallel. You could also do lengthened partials with these if you wanted. Just my two cents 👍🏻

[@broccoliliverwort4932]

I think you can get a pretty good stretch using cables crunches. It's just you have to be mindful of technique and cable angle. I use an exercise ball with someone holding down my knees to bend way back for a stretch.

[@charles7799]

Your videos reviewing studies are such an amazing asset!! Thank you for sharing your knowledge!! Your channel is going to be huge soon!!!

[@Panagiotis1709]

NO exercise has given me the tricep pump that the overhead extension has. None.

[@ratsubhan4968]

pump don’t mean growth

[@joojotin]

I only get good pump with dual rope but not with any other variation, but you cant load rope oh extensions or with bar heavy long term because it pulls you back, so cant do them.

[@lorcan8484]

nah I didn't even train and it's massive

[@BlackiJ11]

@@ratsubhan4968 it can be a good indicator tho

[@rockyevans1584]

​@@joojotinsure you can. Stand or kneel facing away from a low cable. Easy peasy

[@yangl123]

Great info

[@user-xb4ig7un4e]

Great video, I enjoy doing skullcrushers and one arm overhead extensions with a dumbell. What are your thoughts about somatotypes, It's completely bs or something to consider?

[@ChrisHedges-sp9mx]

How would you compare Seated Overhead Extensions w/ an EZ bar to a Seated Overhead Extensions w/ a cable machine? Wouldn't the cable version of the exercise be comparatively inferior to the version that uses the EZ bar, due to the flat resistance curve of the cable machine? Thanks.

[@lucaslouzada44]

You could do a video on the no rep counting mindset, people like Jay Cutler, who prefers paying attention to proximity to failure and compensating by adding sets, instead of the typical double progression bro…

[@adamlimbach6756]

I think better is a combination of exercises. Probably want to do 6-9 sets of tricep work a week above & beyond compounds…Pushdowns & overhead extensions both good, JM press, Skullcrushers, close grip bench, dips all excellent as well. Pick 3-4 and pound away at them. Don’t overcomplicate this stuff.

[@eddiepugmire447]

Which grip? Neutral, pronated, supinated?

[@jeremynowak2800]

How beneficial is it to start with push downs and then move to overhead for the average lifters elbows to feel good with these movements?

[@lednevnik]

My right triceps gets more stretch from overhead extensions than the left one for some reason. Like the left one doesn't go as far as the right one. And I swear I see faster progression on the right arm. Also when I go to failure I sometimes feel that If I go any further with reps I will tear something.

[@Kinta02]

Just yesterday I had doms SO BAD from bent over cable overhead extensions I actually had some tingling sensations in my pinky and ring fingers like something was putting pressure on some nerves. Was a crazy experience :D

[@khe8969]

doms dont mean growth and doms actually slow down growth. plus u get doms in the long lead of the triceps from calcium related fatigue rather from the lengthen position.

[@Dougie.A.M]

I've gotten excellent gains from over head tricep work. Whether that's because of the stretch or the new stimulus however is a question i can't answer.

[@mozawahreh8778]

i get shoulder pain from overhead press ..how to solve it?

[@JorgeGonzalez-sx7fk]

wrong channel to be asking this question on (improve your shoulder mobility and actually treat that as a priority, not a warm up)

[@WadeGarrett02]

Dont do anything thats causing you pain. Either go really light to avoid pain or choose another exercise. Use a range of motion that doesn't hurt unnecessarily, as in touching your chest during seated shoulder press with a barbell.

[@WadeGarrett02]

Dont do anything thats causing you pain. Either go really light to avoid pain or choose another exercise. Use a range of motion that doesn't hurt unnecessarily, as in touching your chest during seated shoulder press with a barbell.

[@_MrTV]

I’m wondering if I do a tricep push down but instead of my elbows, stopping at a certain point on the way up making sure that they come above 90°. Would that benefit the long?

[@user-ii7xc1ry3x]

But what about when compared to dumbbell kickbacks on a bosu ball?

[@nadiamartinez3244]

Overhead extensions are nice, they don't make my elbows feel like crap afterwards

[@mushfiqurrahman1359]

doing pushdown and overhead extensions for 3sets of both vs 6sets of overhead extension..Which one do you think is better

[@francescobergonzi3002]

I would love to see someone break down scientifically ring work, like the stretch you feel on rings push-ups and ring dips is unmatched for me and ye there is less stability wich in that case i've heard promote even more hypertrophy

[@Piery83_]

Dr Milo if i need to prioritize the lateral head, which movement is the best?

[@Antonio_Serdar]

The medial and lateral head have the exact same function, any tricep excercise will target it equally well.

[@johnmorrison7205]

What are some other lengthened biased triceps isolation movements for the long head besides overhead extensions?

[@lissadawes4243]

When you say overhead extensions does that include the rope extension?

[@Ultimatefitness360]

Long head got most stretch when hand goes behind the back so dumbbell or cable kick back should be best for long head ???

[@josephmoore977]

Is there a specific type of training that seems more beneficial for radial hypertrophy?

[@MrKakemann1]

So having both in your exercise routine is a win-win then. Right?

[@asprinklingofclouds]

I welcome the more cautious approach to the evidence in this video, I'm still not convinced enough to change my core exercises to include an overhead variation, although that is mainly due to the elbow problems it causes me. I am fine with the overhead press, I realise it's a a compound exercise and it doesn't stretch the triceps as much but given that they are an overhead movement do you think they would provide any useful long head activation?

[@Dougie.A.M]

We may just be different biomechanically, but the overheard press does very little for me tricep wise, unless on a machine of some sort. I'd say if you're aiming to improve long head, anything that starts above your head is optimal. I don't get any elbow pain anymore and I've been doing overhead tricep work for about half a year now. Start light and slow, you might find it helps strengthen the muscle around the joint at this angle like it did me. However, I did say we may be different, since everyone is.

[@asprinklingofclouds]

@@Dougie.A.M Thanks for your reply, my elbow pains are largely due to age (61) it's only started in the last 5 years and I used to be able do any tricep exercise pain free. The web seems contradictory on the overhead press as far as triceps are concerned, one source says it doesn't train the long head and another source says it hits the triceps more effectively than the bench press.

[@Dougie.A.M]

@@asprinklingofclouds yeah tricep activation on this seems to be a little mixed. Go for what feels best for you, push it hard and you're already doing more than most. Mix in some tricep work at several angles and forget the rest. If you haven't already check out Mr. Mikes videos (Renaissance periodisation) on tricep training. He has some great advice on his channel. 👍

[@murmor6890]

@@asprinklingofclouds Depends, if you do OHP with DB next to your head your shoulder is in the same position as in a triceps extensions. If you do them in the smith machine or so and it is closer to a strong incline bench it might not hit the long head very much (but not not at all)

[@seban-jackedweeb5513]

FOR THEE ALGORITHM!!!

[@muhammadhasnainkhalil7437]

Please react to the latest video on lengthen partials by Athlean-X. He talks about it in context of facepulls not being lengthened partials.

[@simonjoseph1447]

first study was biased because it was more of a lengthened partial vs shortened partial biased. why not do lengthened partials of both exercises(extension vs overhead extension)? or even shortened partial. that was the varying factor in this study.

[@josephmartel2222]

what about the fact you cant use heavy weights on overhead triceps vs pushdowns

[@matthewcronshaw9331]

The weight you are lifting is only one factor in whether an exercise is optimal. Some exercises put a muscle through a more mechanically difficult motion, meaning you have to use lower weight, but the increased tension at different positions in the movement can make it better overall. This is the case with overhead extensions. Even though you are likely using lower weight, the tension is higher in the fully stretched position compared to the partially-stretched position of a pushown.

[@denimyadav3826]

Need abs and forearms videos please 🙏

[@joegaming2583]

I get elbow pain whenever I do overhead extensions😭🙏

[@peetos-chan2835]

How does variation and staleness apply to picking and choosing exercises, in your view? Is it ven necessary (outside of joint pain, or straight boredom?)

[@kinginthenorth1437]

As someone with elbow pain that specifically would like to develop their longhead for aesthetic balance reasons; this is just all kinds of depressing.

[@vicvin64]

The answer is JM press

[@mikeburke2540]

Dont feel like watching the whole thing someone give me the answer

[@cory2023]

Neither are really needed. Just ohp and bench press. Maybe some weighted dips

[@TheHybrid350]

Great

[@travis.thefloyd]

Even better: do both

[@Theone.fitness]

Can't beat French Press + Pushdowns.

[@user-he4ef9br7z]

Pushdowns are not used as a main movement. They are supposed to be a warmup for skullcrushers/close grip bench. Intermediate to advanced lifters have no scope of progressive overload from pushdowns anyway because more of them can pushdown the stack. Cable kickbacks pushdown style, one arm at a time are done specifically because they don't lengthen the long head, because someone might want to bias and grow the shorthead more.

[@AaronTrainerFit]

Is no one wondering what's up with that logo on the shirt? lol I'm dying to know what that is

[@WolfCoaching]

It’s Sisyphus!

[@phsc7]

Based

[@paulshortall6734]

still trying to work out your accent

[@nikolasdeclercq3348]

Push downs are 100x more alpha😂😂

[@CyLvCompetetiv]

why focus on hyperthrophy? When you can focus on chadtrophy. I would always just maximize the pushdown stack and do 1 rep max screams. That way everyone in the gym knows you are a chad. MIght have the sideeffect that you dont grow at all. But I mean atleast you showed the guy in the corner that you are the pushdown 1 rep max chad

[@justinjones9194]

neither is better,do it all

[@matusjurcik6974]

Over heads cuz of better stretch dont need to see the videi😅

[@strongchad8130]

absolutely pissening

[@beerdemus2812]

feel cold fans

[@WolfCoaching]

It is sickening

[@lukeharris2622]

✝️💪

[@joojotin]

Pushdowns very easily imo

[@rockyevans1584]

They feel better to me. Triceps getting crazy with oh cable ext though.

[@Delta3angle]

Nope lol

[@rockyevans1584]

@Delta3angle you can't say no to his opinion, ya putz lol. Pushdowns feel great, I love the rope ones so you can drive behind your torso, but oh cable exts made a huge difference in my triceps pretty quickly

[@ratsubhan4968]

single arm push downs w shoulder extension r tuff

[@joojotin]

@@rockyevans1584 Yeah thats why I said "in my opinion" but I also think they are generally better. Do you really think oh extensions made big difference for you? If so which variation do you use? I find only one arm oh extension is stable and natural enough that it doesnt cause pain or feel off. I might give it another shot, tho I have never really seen any benefits for me personally thus far.

[@karimalladin8181]

Though you are very knowledgable your presentation is very boring. You seem to mug up a script and blurt it out before the camera. Slow down your speech pause between sentences and repeat important lines and be more dramatic