2020 Land Rover Defender First Impressions; CR's Annual Auto Reliability Survey | Talking Cars

Every year, Consumer Reports releases the results of its auto reliability survey, collecting data from hundreds of thousands of our members. We share the process of collecting this data, as well as some highlights from this year's results. The 2020 Land Rover Defender is a recent addition to our test program, and we share our first impressions on this resurrected and rugged luxury off-roader SUV. We also answer questions about NVH (noise, vibration, and harshness) shields on cars, possible solutions to end a burdensome car lease, and at what point a child can safely ride in a vehicle without a booster seat.
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SHOW NOTES
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00:00 - Introduction
00:37 - Consumer Reports Auto Reliability Survey Results
09:25 - 2020 Land Rover Defender First Impressions
19:13 - Question #1: Do NVH (Noise, Vibration, and Harshness) shield help with preventing rust and corrosion on a vehicle?
21:27 - Question #2: Which vehicle would be a competent replacement for a 2003 Toyota Highlander?
25:25 - Question #3: Is there a possible solution to ending a burdensome car lease?
27:09 - Question #4: At what point a child can safely ride in a vehicle without a booster seat?
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CR Auto Reliability
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[@garthhowe297]

From what I have seen, if you buy a Landrover, make sure you buy two identical ones. That way your neighbours won't notice that one of them is always in the shop for repair.

[@Ascend777]

At some point, they'll notice the two. Could be a hassle just to hide that.

[@aidanwilson6035]

Yeh , i should of done that with my FCA vehicles , complete junk !.

[@hagenherrmann8204]

you need one that is a land cruiser disguised as a land rover because with your idea, at some point, they will both be in the shop ;-)

[@badshodi]

Do you have a Land Rover or Range Rover?

[@rjzapper100]

I love you all...I watch ever show, but I have to say this group is the “A” team of Talking Cars. I could watch you all day long!,,,

[@rightlanehog3151]

Gosh, I wonder how the other "Talking Cars" hosts will feel about a CR heart beside this comment.

[@pedrofernandez8729]

In the past 15 yrs, I've owned a Corolla, an XB, an FRS a Challenger and now a Tesla 3. The latter has been at the dealer for warranty work more times than all the other cars put together.

[@Sanpedranoazul]

I believe you, older cars are more reliable

[@rightlanehog3151]

A ten year review that tracks brand reliability over a decade would be much more helpful than a one year snapshot. Does anyone else remember when the VW Passat was the CR top pick for mid-size sedans? ;-)

[@mrsj1417]

Their Annual Auto Issue does exactly that.

[@rightlanehog3151]

@@mrsj1417 So what is the point of the annual listing released today?

[@kurthunter5206]

@@rightlanehog3151 It is the update for all cars new & used. Consequently some lose CR's recommendation based on updated data.

[@mrsj1417]

@@rightlanehog3151 Sigh. 1:12 : "before we get into the results, Jen can you tell us how the survey data is obtained". At which point she explains how it's obtained, which cars are included, how many years worth is used, how far back they go for remodeled cars, how future model reliability can be predicted...you have to actually watch and listen to the videos if you don't understand. So what is the point of watching a video and not paying attention to anything you've just seen? What is the point of reading reliability on a 10 year old car that has been updated, improved, and remodeled?

[@jeffk464]

VW has moved to above average reliability I believe. They are ahead of GM, Ford, Chrysler and I'm guessing Land Rover. ;)

[@Ulvaeus]

They failed to mention that Defender is available with rear view camera that resolves the visibility issue. I guess they didn’t order that option.

[@skywalker2852]

I was going to make the identical comment. The optional ISRVM is shown at 15:29. I think this is footage taken using their vehicle, so not sure why they didn't mention it.

[@Noah_E]

That right there is why they shouldn't recommend the Defender. If LR knows the visibility is that poor 1) redesign it to alleviate the problem, or 2) make the rear view camera standard. Basic safety, like being able to see what is behind you, should NEVER be optional equipment.

[@ninetwenty]

Great show thanks

[@jshgrnr]

I absolutely loved this episode simply because all three of my favorite host collaborated together!! Love all the episodes but this one was special. 👍

[@sanatandharma4435]

It is possible to see beyond the spare tyre mounted on the rear by flicking the interior mirror switch so as to activate the rear vision roof mounted camera.

[@jamesallie8152]

Everyone mentions lack of visibility out the rear, but no one mentioned the ClearSight interior rear view mirror that is standard on the SE model. Are you aware of this feature? The view with the camera is fantastic!

[@JoeE.]

Hi Consumer Reports. Living in the area where winter comes once a year, I became one of the buyers of cars to include an Electronic Rust Protection Module (ERPM). I bought a new 2014 Nissan Pathfinder with the said module and 5 years later, my air-conditioning (a/c) system broke and it costed me thousands to fix it (my warranty was only for 3 years). The dealership said that the rusting under my car was the reason they have to replace the said a/c system. They said that the ERPM wasn't to be blamed. My question is: what does this module exactly protect under my car? Should it cover to protect all metal parts under my car including my a/c system (as far as I know and the reason why I paid for the module)? I have a 2009 Nissan Altima and upto now, I never had problems underneath it. It has no module but I make sure that an undercoating for rust protection is applied via the Walmart auto service here once a year before winter hits our area. Does this mean that undercoating is 100% better than the said module?

[@Ascend777]

How could Nissan be middle of the pack in your survey? Their CVT fails as early as 80k or 4 years. I an surprised there are brands that are worse than Nissan.

[@edweagle]

Fyi the link to subscribe to cr from the description doesn't work. Just signing up to a subscription on the site and wanted to give you guys / gals credit ;)

[@consumerreports]

Thanks for the heads up!

[@LlyleHunter]

I’d like to know reliability data for up to eight years.

[@richh7608]

If you're a member, CR provides up to 10 years of vehicle reliability data. Of course most vehicles get a major redesign within 6 years so older reliability data may not be relevant to the current model.

[@donttrustgoogle5963]

Subject: under vehicle shields: my 2020 ES350 came with these. One had to be removed to change the oil filter. (Stupid design). Both later ripped off in our first major 15mm snow storm. What’s the point??

[@millefune]

Cars with controls that make you look away from where you're going are a plague. My friend was hit by someone who (claimed) that she was trying to use the touch screen radio, and my girlfriend got in an accident while adjusting her Acura's climate control.

[@richh7608]

Please name some vehicles where you don't have to "look away" to adjust controls?!

[@millefune]

Every car before this flush "touch the label" or "touch the screen with our proprietary layouts" fad became a thing. Before, we could reach over and find the knobs/levers to change the temperature and fan speed of the HVAC. Now, some cars force you to use the touchscreen or just have labels painted/placed onto smooth touch sensitive surfaces. Anyway, you asked for names, so fine. Any Honda Accord before 2012 (I haven't driven one from after that year.), Jeep Cherokee, and 2015 Camry. There are obviously more, but I'm not listing over 99% of the cars that have ever existed.

[@yiyangcheng]

I feel like TFLs defender wasn’t so lucky. Not sure if it’s just the 4 cylinder is bad or what as Dougs Defender doesn’t have any issues yet

[@andresgonzalezmadriz7342]

I have one with 4000km, climbed a mountain, cross rivers, drove it in the city and the beach. Not a single problem. Guess the TFL guy had bad luck, like with any brand you can be unlucky

[@ronnieharford3326]

You can’t judge a vehicles reliability over just one unlucky KZbinr, got to bare in mind there are already thousands out there all over the world and that’s just one KZbinrs experience

[@hereigoagain5050]

I wonder if CR members who recently experienced auto problems are more likely to respond to the reliability survey?

[@kurthunter5206]

I would say no. From my own experience, I have been reporting to CR for 40+ years good or bad experiences.

[@keving7940]

One thing you forgot to mention is that a Subaru outback model has the ability to tow a utility trailer which unfortunately is an added expense including the car, but would check of the box of the tractor equipment

[@nlpnt]

LPT: When driving alone or two-up, take out the rear headrests and stash them wedged in the foot area below the backs of the front seats. Anyone riding back there who's tall enough to benefit from the headrest will want the legroom freed up by taking them from there and reinstalling them anyway.

[@markrigby9588]

There is a bracket you buy from jlr sort out spare/ bike rack issue. But of course this is more money.

[@davidm5707]

The LR looks great, but apparently is not made to drive. First, the huge blind spot. Then, they made sure you won't put the spare in the cargo area, by adding a little hump on the bottom half of the rear door to maintain the lack of visibility. Why?

[@aidanwilson6035]

They failed to mention the amazing rear view mirror camera and 360 degree multi angle images from the infotainment screen that eliminates any issues with rear visibility and most reviewers have been impressed with it's abilities on tarmac compared with direct rivals like the Jeep Wrangler that cannot be used as a daily driver !.

[@jstephens2758]

What happened to Consumer Reports? Years ago, when I first subscribed, your recommendation was to buy the least expensive and most reliable product that met my needs. The idea was that premium models often had features that were not only unnecessary, but that decreased reliability. That always worked for me even if I was disappointed that I did not always have the latest and greatest. Now, you have abandoned that by testing mostly upscale products that violate both principles. Land Rovers are expensive and have always been unreliable and now they are extremely unreliable. Some consumers have reported problems under warranty that dealers said were NOT REPAIRABLE. Why would you even want to test one? In another product domain: Recently, my countertop microwave oven failed and I consulted CR for a replacement. The top rated models were mostly in the $300 range and most had features I did not need. But even the ones CR recommended were reported by CR readers to have serious problems that do not show up in reliability ratings. I bought one on sale for less than $100 of a brand that CR rated as intermediate in reliability, although this specific model was not tested. It works well so far and meets my needs. It is somewhat of a gamble, but I feel that following CR's recommendations would not be any more reliable. I am beginning to believe that CR is irrelevant. Even if it fails, I can buy two more and spend less than the price of CR recommendations.

[@garrettw99]

I think you need to get with the times and realize that while added features do increase the chance that things break, these features can be life-saving. If you want a barebones car, get a barebones car like a reliable 1999 Corolla. They will last to 300k miles and you can find them around 150k miles. You don’t need to buy only products that CR recommends, too. They noted that the Defender is probably not going to be reliable.

[@nathanielmoran8537]

What is with all the changes? How did dodge drop in reliability’s

[@uru-freemind7711]

Hello, I wanted to say that they are currently manufacturing vehicles with the exhaust manifold integrated into the lid, that generates that in the city at low speeds the fan turns on more often since it must remove more heat from the cylinder head, consequently, the electricity consumption increases therefore fuel consumption as well. In addition, the cover suffers more thermal shocks, reducing its useful life and increasing the cost of maintenance. Direct injection engines need better quality oil so as not to form carbon deposits in the intake since there is no fuel to clean when entering that increases maintenance and costs since the injectors and their fuel pumps are more delicate, and in Many cases end up polluting more since chemical products are needed to clean the coal, it would be good to inform consumers about this because not everything new is better.

[@michaelsprinzeles4022]

A hybrid for someone that wants to DIY repairs?

[@toronado455]

17:30 now tell us what you really think LOL

[@carolynharmon7074]

Why don't they make cars for the United States where the rear door opens on the right. I think I've only had one car that did and it was a Jeep Liberty, so easy to load from the curb.

[@jdenmark1287]

Land Rovers are designed for right hand drive, so their swing doors open to the curb. They just can’t be bothered to switch over the feature to left hand drivers .

[@LionRunner]

@22:44 Talking about Honda Ridgeline, I've heard the Honda Ridgeline has same powertrain as the Honda Pilot. Do they suffer from the same common issue as the Honda Pilot premature injector failure? From the Honda Pilot owners FB group I see some owners had this failure at very short millage and some had better luck. My friend had the issue at 33K miles and was lucky to have it fixed under warranty. Just curious if Honda Ridgeline suffer the same problem? Thanks.

[@IamGroot786]

I bought my 2017 Ridgeline with 27K miles on it and now has 41K. Haven't had any injector issues, it's been pretty rock solid so far actually. But I do throw some fuel injector cleaning stuff in the gas tank maybe once every 3 months.

[@midwestfarm757]

I've talked to my Honda part's guy about this. Honda Alabama can build 3 different cars and more with different power trains. My Odyssey 14-17 model was being built at the same time as the 16- Pilot and the 17- Ridgeline yet the Odyssey didn't have the same exact engine, and the Ridgeline apparently doesn't have the same issue as the pilot. The 2018-Odyssey has the issue though.

[@IamGroot786]

Regarding the Defender, I gotta say while I understand the argument against "Double function" controls, they are helpful in decluttering the center stack. Look at how few buttons/controls you have there as opposed to some vehicles that have basically a hundred buttons! Having said that, for a huge warning when it comes to the Defender's reliability and issues, look at the guys on @TFL, they're having a horrendous time with the one they just bought!!!

[@treads2595]

Yep! They are waiting for their third car and are only getting this attention from JLR because of who they are. The average buyer would have had to do a Lemon Law claim.

[@nvamember]

What I would like to see is the sample size for each car. This is what be thing that deters me from taking your conclusions. I have owned cars that had the worst rating by CR but I had zero issues with mine.

[@mrsj1417]

So your sample size of 1 is a better indicator than CR? Got it.

[@nvamember]

@@mrsj1417 nope I do my due diligence before buying and that includes talking to people who own the same car.

[@Leo-bz8kg]

Next on CR... Talking appliances.

[@mikechan231]

Some of this commentary is silly: harping on its use with a bike rack, side-open tailgate and spare tire location... these are just Defender and LR holdovers. They shouldn’t be a surprise. Talking about its handling- it’s an SUV; it’s not going to handle like a sedan.

[@gtiguy9629]

If these are the complaints that causes bad scores no wonder people don’t trust y’all scores.

[@mohammadfarajzadehtehrani88]

You know

[@djw5415]

You be surprised how often people off road.

[@kippaseo8027]

It's $70000! 4 years from now when it's no longer under warranty the sucker I mean owner who bought it would be lucky to get $10000 for it. In contrast a $50000 Toyota 4 runner limited will still be worth North of $35000 And still have another good 10 years of life left. I work in auto finance and I see it all the time . I've literally had to hang up on frustrated and indignant owners They don't understand why they're $85000 BMWs Are only worth 1/5 what they were 4 years earlier when you.

[@roguedogx]

8:31 my biggest surprise was seeing how much progress FCA has made. Remember when all of their cars were at the bottom of the recommend list? I'm so happy for them making so much progress. The "company which must not be named" losing its reliability ranking was less of a shock to me. Given how many issues keep getting reported to me. I get why it keeps happening (company culture) and if they don't find a way to address it, while still keeping what makes them great, it's going to be a problem. Think about all the company's that have left the USA or gone under alfa romeo, citron, Renault, and so on. The one thing they all have in common is bad reliability and poor quality. While this company that has this new low rank has a customer base that's will to put up with more bugs than the average customer. This company is really making it hard to really break into the mainstream.

[@Buc_Stops_Here]

Be careful with that data, particularly on the new cars that they try to predict. Great example last year they initially recommended the Subaru Ascent with an above average rating based on Subaru's brand reliability. Too bad when the survey results of the first year came back it scored the lowest in their survey - 19 out of 100 or much worse than average. It was because the model was all new for the brand - new transmission, new engine, new electronics, new platform - new everything. I go by how old the platform, engine, etc. are. My 2006 Saab 9-3 (which they put as worse than average) went into its third year of production with a lot of fixes. So it lasted me 12 years, 191,000 miles with no problems when I sold it. Know the platform and take the new car analysis they provide carefully. Now I own a 2018 Buick Envision, which at the time they gave average reliability. The car was built in China for two years before it was sold in the USA, so I bought the fourth year of production with an engine made 5 years and a transmission made 8 years. Surprise, no problems so far and their survey says now that the car is tops in its segment with 100% better than everyone else, including Lexus.

[@logtothebase2]

One thing that ruined the Range Rover/ LRx / Discovery was small sniping by Jorno's of the handling /ride and packaging, getting these things "right" they lost much of the Original and uniqueness and personality (that and trying to follow post sales custom market).

[@Natethegreat200c]

I’ve found your reliability for Chrysler vehicles flawed. You don’t have enough people that have a fca car that subscribe to report on reliability for fca vs a Toyota. For example, how much feedback did you get from a Chrysler 200 vs say a Toyota Camry?

[@hippiebits2071]

I'm going to make an assumption that they need to meet a minimum number of respondents on any given model before they will summarize a report. Once that it met then then break the data down (example- problems reported per 100 vehicles). This allows them to come up with expected averages for each model regardless of the number of respondents who reported on any given vehicle. Keep in mind as far as reliability goes this all just functions as a guide to give people a general idea of what they can expect with a given model. No doubt their are individual vehicles that will experience either fewer or more problems than the averages reflect.

[@DctorSkillz1]

Is that Daddy Doug's Defender?

[@isaac198428]

The new Defender is crap. Another channel had issues from day one with the vehicle. Avoid like the plague.

[@normt430]

They got a new one out of it too.

[@normt430]

Don't watch TFL Car review of this car as thr engine blew up and they gave them a new car....the 3rd one was a charm!

[@gregburville3368]

Patrick? 🤣🤣😷😷😷😷😷😷🤣🤣

[@Luciferisking512]

If you are truly looking for a Discovery don’t buy one. Watch the TFL off road videos on them buying one. TERRIBLE engineering and reliability

[@djcoronel]

why the hell is patrick wearing a mask ostensibly all by himself when filming his video question? if it's to maintain anonymity then don't submit a video question in the first place.

[@mrsj1417]

Well Donald, first of all you have absolutely no way of knowing if he is "ostensibly" all by himself (perhaps that's a church hall he's in and just took a break - duh), and second, it's really none of your business if he wants to wear a bunny costume. In other words, get the stick out of your butt and stop being so delicate.