2020 VS 2021 Supra: Which Makes More Power TUNED?

[@faraz.f22]

The fact that they fit all this info into 6 minutes without going too fast or skipping anything is actually very under appreciated. Thank u lol.

[@NationalSpeedInc]

We appreciate the words! Glad you enjoyed the video! More to come like this.

[@CRVB7]

Just like the good old days when a 10 min YT video was considered long. Concise and straight to the point.

[@brokenhalo.728]

Non of that “before we get started. This video is provided by…..don’t forget to subscribe”. Help me.

[@aisu8481]

Sounds to me like the 21 may only be more valuable for heat soak prevention. Which for a track guy could be significant

[@Benjammin43]

I got my car tuned here back in like 2017. still by far my favorite tuner i’ve ever dealt with in the country. if the supras come with a 6 speed like they say they’re gonna I might pick one up and I know exactly where i’ll take it to tune.

[@NationalSpeedInc]

For everyone asking if the post-June 2020 ECUs have been unlocked yet, the answer is no, BUT there is a solution: cloning. In short, your ECU must be sent to FemtoEVO in Russia, where it is cloned into a tuneable pre-June 2020 ECU. From there, the ECU plugs in, and is tunable just like any pre-June 2020 ECU. The service isn't cheap, but in terms of horsepower-to-dollar ratio, it's still a great deal!

[@akpowerlifting]

Thank you for this information

[@bman1668]

I feel like 2021 will make more power after 800-900whp , down low hp 2020 2021 same but highly modified I think 2021 will be better choice .

[@omranmkv]

I think so, but I'm pretty sure it won't be noticeable difference that the driver can feel even if we say 850hp and 800hp. Anything in these modern cars after the 600whp is crazy and stupidly scary for streets pulls, most people just speak they didn't experience this

[@angrycar]

Thanks for this video. I picked up my 2020 Supra 3.0 premium for 8K less than a 2021. Kept telling my friends, who thought I should've got the 2021, that once it was tuned with the typical bolt on parts the two aren't going to be much different. This video proves it. And since, IMHO, the 2020 is more playful and tail happy, with a more usable power band, my choice is still the 2020 if you're just doing the typical bolt on's. If you want a high hp supra then the 2021+ is probably the better option.

[@hectorarcaya2424]

How much you pay for it ? Im looking for a 3.0 premium and i wanna knw how much will be a good deal

[@angrycar]

@@hectorarcaya2424 I bought my 2020 3.0 premium brand new in July of 2020. It sat on the lot for 9 months before I bought it. It was listed for $56,285. The dealer marked it down $4,285 and Toyota had a special $3,500 instant rebate deal going, so I got it for $48,500.

[@dirkdiggler2379]

@@angrycar nice freaking deal. Right now those are about 55k

[@steinway325]

@@angrycar that's exactly what i did in August! i was a bit pissed off though, when Toyota bumped it up to $4500 rebate in September >:(

[@angrycar]

@@steinway325 Nice! I didn't know they bumped up the rebate, but that's ok, we still got great deals. Enjoy!

[@keilder8543]

Great video, apples to apples comparison, and concise. Even the best videos lose points when they run too long - this one was perfect 👌.

[@65sohc]

I was glad to hear you mention flex fuel toward the end. I am running e50 which opens up another level of tuning and 50+ hp.

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Yep! We just did a fuel comparison video on this exact 2020. Check out the results! kzbin.info/www/bejne/rarQooZpec91pNk

[@maxfuerst1980]

This is the best video I've seen regarding modifying the a90 vs a91. Quikc and simple. Thank you for this content!

[@BabaYagaRacing]

Yupp

[@bmwm333e92]

best video showing the differences of A90 and A91 on KZbin, lots of info in such a short video, great work❤

[@Powaup]

I don’t think I’ve ever seen a more apples to apples dyno comparison. Very well done here

[@jameskelsey3759]

Glad I found this video. I went and drove a 2020 this morning and am excited to know that if I get it, I can do what I want and make up for not spending an extra 10 grand or so to get a slightly "better" one. Because daammmmnnn that was fun.

[@joepoyda1812]

It's really interesting to see the US has such differences in the power output of the model years, I have a 2019 A90 Supra in the UK and stock that put down 372.1bhp on dyno. From what I've seen on forums it seems that's pretty much the norm for us in the UK.

[@agurung03]

probably because uk and eu spec supras are fitted with an extra OPF filter for emissions on top of the catalytic converter in the downpipe. But stage one tune sorts that out you can get 410-420 whp (450-475bhp) from just a tune ..

[@thedeadpoet000]

Curious as to what octane fuel is recommended for UK Supras? I ask bc in general I think EU fuel is higher octane than US fuel.

[@HAPPYFUNTIMEx2]

@@thedeadpoet000 Octane ratings in EU and US are different. 93 octane or Super in US is equivalent to 98 in EU, which is also Super in EU. So the fuels are the same. Now some states in the US, mostly in the west coast(california etc) only have 91 available.

[@Foiiiii1]

I live in Japan and most 2020 Supras are easily putting down 370-380hp at the crank. I think it's to do with the octane rate where premium fuel is above 98 here whereas in the US it's lower. I remember Jason Cammisa mentioning something about the US having lower quality fuel so that might play a role in the hp difference.

[@TheIcybus]

Thank you! I’ve been considering the mk5 but it’s been so hard to find a thorough comparison. Excellent video and to the point ✨

[@e_skie2685]

I would call the power a wash, but the 21 also included some suspension changes. Because of that I give the win to 21.

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Yeah, as others mentioned in this thread, Stages are a subjectively term. Our Stage-3 is probably another shop's Stage-1, haha. But, we like to give our customers the ability to layer on over time, rather than committing to more than they might want or need.

[@kookiethebear]

@NationalSpeedInc - Fantastic job with this video - thorough, succinct, and unbiased. You have a new subscriber.

[@bikotheanimator6169]

Excellent presentation. This is precisely what I was searching for. Not that I know much about cars. I have been learning since 2020 during quarantine days. ^___^

[@CullyColantino]

This video solved all of my problems

[@DresRacingChannel]

love the info im happy i went with the 2020 model as far as tunability

[@VictorPitstop]

LOVE that hard data! Thank you for this!!

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Glad you liked it, Victor! More videos like this to come.

[@TheGnarTube]

There's a large amount of differences in the engines between 2020 and 2021. Specifically: Fuel system upgraded to 350bar injection pressure, cylinder head with integrated exhaust manifold, changes to the turbo, split cooling, coolant pump with integrated pressure release, new heat management module with split cooling valve, and changes to the chain drive.

[@MikeJitz]

Have ya'll dynoed the 2.0T version of this yet? Curious to see what that 4banger would put down.

[@NationalSpeedInc]

The B48 cars typically break the 300whp mark with the same modifications. Not bad, all considered!

[@kent4786]

How much does this type of tune cost .. ?? I’m thinking of getting the 2.0T

[@TronB58]

@@NationalSpeedInc unless you get the F44 M235i with the B48. It actually dynos 280-290 whp stock and my development car was pushing over 370 whp with a downpipe and e30 tune only. The revised B48 in the mini GP and M235 has all the forged internals from the B58. It even has S58 injectors. Now if you're referring to the 2.0 supra or the lower trim bmws, then yes you are correct..

[@wezkerlim]

doesn't matter. the 2020 can make good numbers with mods. i actually wish they ditch the 2021 motor & go 2020. no oil burn issues & ecu lock.

[@AntFragale]

I can appreciate this video. Doesn’t drag out the info, is very informative, and targets a relatable question that’s interesting. And I don’t even own or care about the Supra haha. Good job guys.

[@doorkicker8507]

Some make even more. My 2020 with same stuff yours had. Plus a high flow AWE exhaust made 493 to the wheels. Also on a hot 🥵 muggy day in July.

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Not bad! That's super strong for 93 octane.

[@lsjionredlinesupercharged2049]

I worked at carvona and drove lots of cars but the bmw supra was nice I would say if your 6 foot or above don't buy if you have a bad back don't buy but that exhaust note is as good as a srt4 or evo but the quality it very good though.

[@NationalSpeedInc]

You certainly aren't wrong, haha. The 2020 in this video belongs to Jordan (hosting the video). He's 6'6" and can attest to the challenges of getting in and out of an A90 Supra. That said, given his personal affinity for Japanese cars, he's used to make it work.

[@sicitydonmo3016]

superb video, packed to the best

[@NastyGenV]

would love to see a 2020 vs 2021+ with a similar turbo/mod setup around 600-700hp to see if the 6port actually does anything on the top end at that power level.

[@2yoked70]

It definitely does

[@NastyGenV]

@@2yoked70 ok have proof?

[@Ali_Mansour_Editor]

Great video! I don’t even own one of these cars, but I feel like I learned a lot!

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Glad you liked it, Ali!

[@bikotheanimator6169]

Indeed. I don't own any expensive cars haha

[@Bad_1nfluence]

Information was presented perfectly. Well done, thank you.

[@tmbmvp]

Any guess on how flex fuel would change the results? I would love to be able to save the couple of thousand and go with the 2020 if the hp is that close!

[@marcdelong2230]

Been waiting for a video like this, thanks guys!!

[@andrewnguyen4382]

this made me realize that I didn’t need to buy a 21+ model. yes it comes with more power out of the factory but they can achieve the same output (essentially)

[@thelastsignature]

Wonderful track selection

[@MilanrdVspec]

Best comparison video 😊

[@ctr-cyclone1408]

That matches what I feel in the car for the 2020 as soon as you get to 5k rpm feels line it falls on it’s face

[@ActNasty5]

Haha yeah it does

[@Wonderlaust]

Are you tuned?

[@ActNasty5]

@@Wonderlaust not yet

[@ctr-cyclone1408]

@@Wonderlaust No, it’s on the todo list.

[@jaimatic23]

From the races iv seen from 20’ and 21’ it does seem like the 2 -port design is more torquer than the 6-port . And the 11:1 compression is better for turbo !

[@carlosdeleon9593]

When you go for high boost, the lower compression ratio would be more beneficial, especially in terms of reliability and longevity

[@BabaYagaRacing]

It is

[@highboost1454]

What an awesome vid. Turbo upgrade seems to be a must for 2021 and up.

[@jadej6348]

Love that front wing on the 2021 supra. Can I get the name of the company that makes them?

[@NationalSpeedInc]

We believe that's the Seibon MB Style front lip.

[@MikeJitz]

Awesome video!

[@EastCoastMafia_NY]

Thank you for this video! I’m looking to getting a 2020 Supra in the near future :D

[@ΓεωργιοπουλοςΠαναγιώτης]

It's quite simple actually higher compression offers bigger gains per pound of boost but knocking becomes a limiting factor after a while so yes better overall numbers Maybe even mpgs without major changes but there is a greater room for improvement and big turbo applications in 2021 engine

[@ZeerXX]

This is basically the same story with the GTR from an engine potential perspective. All years can produce the same power levels with similar bolt ons.

[@T.R.A.N.C.E]

I can't decide which color to buy.

[@401nate2]

Hey guys, great comparison video! Would have been great to see the psi graph overlayed before and after for each model year as well. The higher CR leads me to believe that with a higher target, it could likely achieve it quicker resulting in the slight bump in low end response seen. What was the target PSI for both cars post tune?

[@purpskurp8737]

21 want my power at the tippy top

[@emalior5000]

Exactly. The 2020 falls flat on its face at 5k rpm. I've driven it and was left underwhelmed with how much it lacks top end power. A ton of bottom to mid then it signs off and leaves you unsatisfied especially when I own a mk4 supra with a ton of top end. It's not just about horsepower numbers it's about how it delivers it. A nice linear power curve all the way to 6 - 7k rpm is what I want and the 2021 and all the bmw cars with this engine have that power curve.

[@omranmkv]

Perfect video, the big question is why Toyota/BMW changed from 2 ports to 6

[@NationalSpeedInc]

That's a great question! We haven't done the research to answer objectively, but our hunch is to simplify manufacturing.

[@magnetman3t725]

Whoa where did you get hat Engine star brace from??? Looks like one solid brace ...Who makes it and how can I order it

[@prskyviews]

My lord the ENGINE BRACE is FIREeeee I want it too!!

[@justinfreeman8908]

I’m waiting for someone to stick 2020 pistons in to a 2021 to get the best of both worlds lol ports & pistons on stock turbo 😂 I bet that would break 500WHP & get better MPG

[@BabaYagaRacing]

Maybe

[@Mkv_jaahze]

Bruh exactly what I was thinking with mines 🤣🤣

[@mresab1997]

OR just save on the labor and put the '21 ports on the '20 engine, no?

[@HSTL_Team]

This was a super informative video. Got my like, subscribe and share. Id like to see what happens after more upgrades

[@johnmichaelazize6425]

Where did you purchased the strut bar, Front Bumper Lip Spoiler with the red accent and the Rear Diffuser with the Red accent? Excellent video!! I'm a disabled veteran interested in these parts. Thank you for your time.

[@rafiulrasheen4738]

Cool Vid! How do yall think it would perform with some bolt ons like catless downpipes,intake, and e85? These cars are also lightweight with great gearboxes so it must feel like a rocket.

[@imperatormouse2735]

Good comparison. The cylinder head integrated manifold design leads to an overall better thermal efficiency resulting in a slightly better fuel efficiency for the 2-port version (24 mpg) vs 6-port version (23 mpg). This is probably the reason why the B58 is only available as the C version in Europe because fuel efficiency is much more important to the OEMs there. Not sure what role the GPF plays in this category but towards higher power outputs it becomes more and more the bottle neck. Would you agree that the 6-port version is more robust than 2-port in terms of durability under same conditions?

[@user-xb3nk6dx3g]

Wait so the 2021 is now available to tune ? Details please. I have a 2021 just sitting in the garage waiting on some real data to follow.

[@BabaYagaRacing]

If your ecu date is after 6-20 you have to send your ecu to Russia to get unlocked

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Hey J! Feel free to fill out our form on our website, a Performance Consultant will reach out to you with those details. www.nationalspeedinc.com/contact

[@polywoggins]

Nice video, well done...

[@elvis_chen]

Thanks for the info, but the real question is when can we MY21 owner get real ECU tuning :(

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Hopefully EcuTek is not far off from releasing a solution!

[@marqueseason6360]

@@NationalSpeedInc What's your opinion on the JB4 piggy back? I have a 2021 and That's what im considering.

[@BabaYagaRacing]

@@marqueseason6360 piggyback is trash

[@patthonsirilim5739]

Not to mention a91 comes with locked ecu so you gotta pay an extra 2k for tuners for basically half the gains of the A90 so yeah his right if you plan on keeping it stock get the A91 if you plan on tuning it at least to sub 500whp levels get the a90.

[@jakethesnake1503]

I had a great time

[@darkskull5790]

Very nice video thanks

[@Kvs1920]

Great video

[@ricardoronin5170]

With the Wu playing!

[@MizzouRah78]

We need a roll race video for a street comparison. 😎

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Ha, we'd love to see that comparison!

[@just.a.simplejoe]

@NationalSpeedInc, appreciate the insight to the A91 Supra and considering getting this tune down the road but 2 questions.... 1. If my 21 supra got that type of safe bump in power what could be the recommended upping of tire sizes to help put that power down in autocross? 2. Is it fine if the customer already has their own intake (such as an ams/injen closed box) when doing the tunable packages? Thanks for the input and seriously great video!

[@angrycar]

I'd say absolutely yes get bigger tires. If they aren't daily tires get a set of Cup 2's, the biggest you can afford and fit. I'm sure they'll accommodate you if you have your own intake. This spring I'm going to drive down to VA with all my own parts and have them install the parts and tune the car.

[@just.a.simplejoe]

@@angrycar Hey thanks for chimming in. Yea that sounds like a great plan and I'd do something similar when the time comes! What size tires would you think for a Supra at about 430-450hp?

[@angrycar]

@@just.a.simplejoe On the stock rims, I believe the front max would be 275/35ZR19 and the rear would be 295 or 305/35ZR19. Hard to find a 305 but they do have Cup-2's in that size, otherwise if you stayed with the OEM tire, it's a really good tire, you'll probably only find 295. Cup-2's can be sketchy in the rain, so for daily might not be good, but for track they are sticky tires. If you get aftermarket rims it depends on rim size and width and offset.

[@just.a.simplejoe]

@@angrycar Thanks for the feedback, seriously needed the help. Don't want to waste money where I don't need too lol. Good luck with your build and would watch your videos if you do any!

[@andrewwhite9698]

Perfect video. 10/10

[@cskudda]

Thanks for this video. I thought the 2021 could not be tuned? Or did I hear wrong?

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Thanks for watching, Chris! And the early 2021 models can be unlocked and tuned.

[@BabaYagaRacing]

6-20 or earlier ecu date can be tuned

[@kuraryuX]

I'm coming to yall shop tomorrow with my bmw. Heard great things, and.....I need yalls help lol

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Glad you've heard great things! We're happy to help however we can!

[@crackedbrainOG]

So you can tune a 2021 Supra? I really can’t find a straight answer. Most things I’ve read is that you can only tune a 2020.

[@Deighvid.]

Cool video! Super interesting and loved seeing my same color 2021 haha

[@amincherfoune1402]

that was great!

[@呵呵拉]

Actually charge pipe does affect the maximum horse power.FTP motorsport does the test and prove about that.

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Interesting! We did a similar test and saw no notable difference.

[@andrewfranco4826]

Perfect video

[@chayenyang]

I have a 2020 and I plan on replacing my 2 port for the 6 port. If you want big power, 6 port is the way to go for 2 port owners

[@BabaYagaRacing]

That's if you are going crazy power

[@chayenyang]

@@BabaYagaRacing go big or go home

[@jaimatic23]

Iv yet to see anyone accomplish this , it would be ideal to have a 6-port with the 11:1 compression ratio

[@chayenyang]

@@jaimatic23 the world record Supra is a 6 port. I’m pretty sure that the 2 ports are having a hard time hitting mid to low 8s

[@jaimatic23]

@@chayenyang i don’t believe that to be true as in this years TX2k , the top 2 supras were 2-port and they both were low 8s

[@MikeFico998]

Are you guys dyno ing in 6th gear? 🤔 Put them both on Ethanol!

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Correct! 6th gear for each. We did a pretty cool fuel comparison with the 2020 in this video that's worth checking out: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rarQooZpec91pNk

[@MMPGAMMING]

Isn’t 2021 Supra ecu locked?

[@prskyviews]

Are these tunes available for Bootmod3 ??????

[@straightsideways4834]

Maybe the 2020 because of that charge pipe which may let in more boost is putting down more numbers

[@NationalSpeedInc]

We've seen no difference in output or boost pressure with the upgraded charge pipe. At this level, it's solely a reliability upgrade.

[@doorkicker8507]

A charge pipe will add absolutely Nothing. As a matter fact. Most that change it have problems of them popping off.

[@wernermeyer6635]

Does somebody know how to set the toyota Hilux into dyno mode?

[@H111-y8f]

There is any difference between 2020 and 2021 short block internal parts handling the power

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Not that we have seen so far. The only bottom end difference is in the pistons.

[@BroVCam]

WOW!!! I'm a Nissan guy but Yota's running laps around us and making sandwiches while doing it these days! Don't be surprised when I get the new Supra over the upcoming Z!!✌🏾❤✊🏾

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Right on!

[@emilianorodriguez6361]

How much does the 2.0 Supra push out with full bolt ons and jb4 map 3

[@BabaYagaRacing]

Not many have modded the 2.0

[@helmernachbaur5880]

What do they mean by tunable 2021? I've got a July 2020 and it cannot be tune in France atm...

[@ryanbrown918]

Pre June 20 can be tuned. Yours is just out...

[@BabaYagaRacing]

6-20 ecu can be tuned

[@kevin-jm3qb]

what oil do you guys run?

[@olson5252]

Soooooo can you tell me how much your stage 3 and tune costs?

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Yep! Parts, install, and tune starts at around $3K out-the-door!

[@briansimpson5664]

2020 was the way to go... Period

[@gtrekt33]

If the dynos reading higher than stock rated, the dynos wrong lol. Dyno jet things

[@To-Ro1]

I love the wutang beats.

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Good ear!

[@brianrockefeller3552]

I hear that BMW instaled a Anti-Tunig DME for B58 produced in 06/2020+, How did you tuned it?? its posible to Brake the Anti-tuning?? I hear that its imposible now, and I was Looking to Buy a BMW M340i, now I'm confused, can You explane me??

[@BabaYagaRacing]

Ecu before 6-20 can be tuned easily After that ecu has to be sent to Russia

[@brianrockefeller3552]

@@BabaYagaRacing but the Russian can really unlock the Ecu??? I heard that they don’t deliver your Ecu, like many people are getting scammed with Russian

[@NationalSpeedInc]

@@brianrockefeller3552 for this service, we recommend FemtoEVO only. What they do isn't technically an unlock, it's an ECU clone, which essentially achieves the same end state: a tunable ECU. It's not cheap, but it's well worth it!

[@tomaslekis3262]

I think the ‘21 ECU was locked and could only be tuned by like a single shop based out of russia?

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Hey, Tomas, here's a copy-and-paste reply of ours to another similar comment: For everyone asking if the post-June 2020 ECUs have been unlocked yet, the answer is no, BUT there is a solution: cloning. In short, your ECU must be sent to FemtoEVO in Russia, where it is cloned into a tuneable pre-June 2020 ECU. From there, the ECU plugs in, and is tunable just like any pre-June 2020 ECU. The service isn't cheap, but in terms of horsepower-to-dollar ratio, it's still a great deal!

[@Skimaskchu]

@@NationalSpeedInc due to what’s going on between Russia and Ukraine, is this option available and is there any videos of anyone doing this option?

[@johnathensimmons1045]

How much would this list of tunes and mods cost, putting it on a 2020 model

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Hey Johnathen! It ranges depending on a list of variables. I recommend reaching out to one of our Performance Consultants here: nationalspeedinc.com/contact/ They will be able to answer all of your questions.

[@Spork40k]

Watches video...goes and buys a Supra...

[@madisondang1324]

Hi guy how y’all doing I got one question since you guys from national speed I made. An appointment for my 2006 Mitsubishi evolution 9 at national speed in glen allen va,last minute the manager call me and canceled my appointment and refund my deposit,Taylor said they can’t tune my car,than why they didn’t say it at first ? Please I need answer

[@madisondang1324]

Hello I just need to know why sir

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Hello, I do not see a Work Order in our system under your name. Feel free to email [e-mail] with additional information, we'd love to chat.

[@Pokenostalgiastore]

Is this 469 Hp to the Crank of 469 Whp?

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Our dyno measures at the wheels.

[@prskyviews]

Is there a way to get these tu es in bootmod 3?

[@prskyviews]

@@NationalSpeedInc is there a way to get this tune for a 2020 in bootmod 3?

[@BjornFSE]

love it

[@zero_to_1000]

which one is more reliable

[@prskyviews]

The 2020 model

[@brettgaldieri3873]

Wu Tang is forever!

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Good catch, sir! Protect ya neck.

[@Famous_Flavours]

Stage 3 is normally a turbo upgrade 🧐

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Thanks for the comment. We saw the need for a more granular upgrade path.

[@jamesvanderstraaten3852]

lol that’s not stage 3 then everyone knows stage 3 is bigger turbo

[@omarali6651]

What's the difference between them in the stage 1 tune?

[@TML34]

I’m not sure what the point of this test is? If you gave both cars the exact same tuning logic then you would expect the same results. There is no mention of the different tune characteristics.

[@NationalSpeedInc]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/d6KxoISvnrSrgpI There are mechanical differences between the two model years. See the timestamp linked above for a breakdown.

[@goforbroke2]

Rats nest under that plastic engine cover.

[@Mind_Expansion_Network]

this will never be a supra to me period BMW all day

[@NationalSpeedInc]

Toyota had a lot of input in many aspects of the car, actually!