Ancient City Restoration Ep. 4.5

[@Jesthers]

A lot of people seem to be missing the point in this episode. The point wasn't to disprove Pillagers being there or to say that the wood is from some other unknown group. I'm seeing a lot of comments posting a rebuttal with "while not proven, all the evidence points towards it being Pillagers" essentially, and that was the entire point of the Story interludes. That yes, mots if not all the evidence points towards it being Pillagers, but because we cannot know 100% we should not assume so. To assume is to potentially be painting what happened here in an incorrect light, something we want to avoid as much as possible. The point was never to say that it couldn't have been Pillagers, but simply that - evidence aside - that is still only a possibility and should be treated as such.

[@daskalosBCE]

Thank you for pointing this out!

[@Jesthers]

@@daskalosBCE of course! Been loving the series, I hope you're having fun with it too :)

[@lazarusblack9995]

Also, it's called an "Ancient City". For all anyone knows, this was from an extinct culture that may or may not have evolved into either Villagers or Pillagers. Maybe even split into both. Or neither.

[@NixityNullt]

Thank you lesbian blaze the cat

[@nixsonhenderson]

Pin of enlightenment!! 🗣️🗣️🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

[@EntryGreats]

Fun fact: in some ancient citys there are piles of wool that are the same as the one you found in the mansion at 6:17

[@alexandreparot5846]

And the carpets around the dark oak towers are of the same colour

[@subject14]

these piles of wool your talking about are campsites in the ancient city so clearly people explored the remains before us

[@Wyattporter]

I love that you stuck to the pillager theory being inconclusive, because you’re 100% correct that there’s no definitive proof. It’s good enough for fan theories but not good enough for professional archaeology. Thanks for this great video

[@DewNotDisturb]

i dont think they found this, but there are ancient city structures with identical blue, cyan, and light blue wool piles with a campfire

[@Lorenzo_G_C]

01:00 NGL an exploration of the ancient nord and dwemer ruins in Skyrim would be an amazing video.

[@UhOphelia]

It would! I wanna see a Daskalos report on the dwemer society, especially since there's so many examples across so many games.

[@MC_Oda]

What a great idea to mix in the real-world educational bits as interludes. I also love how you tied them in at the end. Great episode!

[@daskalosBCE]

Thanks, man! Ill be including our restoration work in the next video

[@holly7999]

I love this series! But something did come to mind. Regarding the possible dark oak village: any and all ruined structures the player can excavate are pretty devoid of wood if not for campfires (explained by charring, like you've said) - so these dark oak planks and logs in the ancient city would have to be a more recent addition, right? And if they ARE from a village population, wouldn't it have to be recent enough for dark oak villages to still be found? Maybe not intact, mind you, but there doesn't seem any evidence pointing to their existence The reason the pillager theory is SO popular is because the admittedly scarce evidence we have all points to them - the only organized group (that we know of) to consistently use and stockpile those materials, which tends to favor dome-like wooden structures to serve as roofs for their towers. Another reason it seems so compelling is because those wooden parts in the ancient city seem to be the subject of patchwork repairs, rather than having been wooden from the start. My reasoning? Whoever it was that built the city itself seems to favor solid walls, those replacement parts are built with fences. Some parts of the structure are still in solid deepslate, and we have no evidence to suggest pillagers know how to work with that material - not to mention, they would most likely prefer to use cobblestone, which, like dark oak, seems more akin to their M.O. Not to mention what you said yourself, the shuffled, incoherent sorting in the chests seems to point to a looting, which would definitely seem to be appealing to a pillager race (though to be honest, that might just be how minecraft generates loot tables, your choice whether to read into it from an archeological perspective or stick to purely technical) I do want to say, I'm not bashing your conclusions at all, i just felt the need to act as a "devil's devil's advocate" of sorts. I agree that all of this is pretty inconclusive and admittedly disorganised on my part, I just felt there were some points to the pillager theory that weren't explored in the video. That being said, I can't wait to see what the next episode brings us :)

[@subject14]

what if instead of looting as he said, it might be them leaving and taking as much as possible before they die to the warden since then maybe you could say that the two cultures (the pillagers and the builders of the ancient city) might have interacted. they used the resources given to them by passing pillagers to repair and they might have lived in those tents that can be found in many other cities as a more safer place then in their homes that had been destroyed by the wardens.

[@vincentholdax1876]

One thing to keep in mind is that the ancient city sits underneath a cherry grove biome. If the people who built these towers were migratory they would likely use whatever building materials ready to hand when constructing their buildings. This could indicate that they were scouts or colonists who anticipated remaining in place for an extended period of time. Also, the fact that they used wood from a completely different area suggests that dark oak might have had some significance to them. It also implies a somewhat sophisticated supply lines or logistics network, perhaps some sort of commerce.

[@sannywhite2243]

A similarity between the towers in the ancient city and the pillager buildings that you missed was the fact that both pillager buildings used cobblestone as edge supports (cobblestone blocks or cobblestone fences) while the villagers all used wood (logs or wooden fences).

[@sagehinkle5942]

I don't know if someone's commented this already, but in regards to the Pillager tower vs the ancient city towers, the roofs look fairly similar. I just wanted to call attention to both having this rounded shape to them, with torches on the corners. And the Pillager tower's corners are supported on this stands, akin to the structure in the ancient city. Those factors - alongside the fact that both are made of dark oak and readily available stone - support Oda's hypothesis as well! And perhaps (I'm not all the way through the video yet, so this may be brought up later) we're not necessarily seeing this kind of patchwork from modern Pillagers, but maybe some kind of relatively recent ancestor? I know that the wood has to be pretty recent because of how moist the skulk blocks sounded and moisture does terrible things to wood in a confined, dark environment like the ancient city; but the world of Minecraft also has peculiar time scaling. Shipwrecks whose wood is still perfectly usable despite being submerged in seawater for instance, or the fact that we know normal lanterns and torches burn for a long time in this reality. Just my own 2 cents on the investigation field trip! P.S. I absolutely //love// this series!! It's so much fun to watch and hypothesize along with you guys, even if I have none of the background information

[@sagehinkle5942]

Yeah, reaching the end, I totally get that it's ultimately inconclusive and will forever be a mystery. But that's such a wonderful part of any world, including our own! The unknown always gets us thinking and dreaming

[@TuftyTaltan]

There is a little more credit to the tower being a Pillager construction besides just the materials (dark oak wood/logs, wool) it's also the design (domed wooden roof supported by some form of stone) and also a specific feature (the torches placed atop the dome above each post) This *still* doesn't prove it obviously, but it does give more credit to the theory that I felt went unmentioned in the video.

[@Valatyalie]

How fortunate. I stumbled across the Trail Ruins excavation earlier tonight before work started, and now have good incentive to finish binge-watching the first few episodes of the Ancient City restoration so I can enjoy this one right as I get home.

[@Tiki_Doll868]

Similar story on my end. Stumbled across it yesterday and binge watched while working on an art project.

[@josephrowlee]

It's so cool to see!

[@danniobrien1831]

me too. i found his videos and now im hooked!

[@dontaskquestions8721]

I'd like to also point out a few things as a counter argument. A: Why would they bring their banners to the Ancient City? Who're they gonna show it to? The Warden? Good luck with that. B: While their two other structures had only Dark Oak and no Birch, all of their stockpiles and such also only had Dark Oak and no Birch. C: Illagers are obsessed with the color blue, hence the blue carpet. There's a Lapis Block in their giant wool Illager Statue, and they keep stockpiles of specifically blue wool when they've shown that they use different kinds all over. D: Pillagers would absolutely pillage ancient cities, since they're full of good loot. That may be how they have Exp bottles. E: The other theories are unfortunately highly unlikely to impossible. The only Ancient City thing I know villagers can sell are *maps* to ancient cities, and I doubt they'd sell a map to a place they looted, but also, they don't sell anything *from* the city either.

[@daskalosBCE]

If i could give a response to your points: A. The captains have banners on them when they wander, it can be assumed it is something they have on them. These banners are found on the dark oak outpost towers, so its established that they post banners on structures. B. Unfortunately that is assuming the pillager=Ancient city connection, and you cant really do that otherwise it becomes a circular argument C. they also have red, white, and (what appears to be) grey. So its a shaky argument to raise based on their preference. D. True they would, but it doesn't mean they did. I have a drivers license which means I can drive a McLaren, but I never have. E. Following that logic, the pillagers don't have anything from the ancient city as well. Bottle o' enchantment is something pillagers AND Villagers have. Plus the fact that villagers DO have a map, means that they know its there, suggesting they have been there. Isnt archaeology frustrating? haha!

[@dontaskquestions8721]

@@daskalosBCE Thx for responding! Rereading my comment I feel I might've come across as hostile, and that was not my intention. Though I agree with you, I specifically said they had *stockpiles* of blue wool. As well as Dark Oak. And even before Woodland Mansions existed there were never any Dark Oak villages either. The only possible option is still Pillagers in my opinion. Ruling out all other options usually isn't something one could do in normal Archeology, but it absolutely could be in Minecraft. I thank you for taking the time to consider my comment and show me why so many of my points are unfortunately now debunked.

[@daskalosBCE]

No prob! I didn't read it as hostile. I thought it was a good comment to focus on since you bring up points I had heard from others and I noticed the same pitfalls.

[@minamagdy4126]

May I ask you to elaborate on how B is circular reasoning when it references structures that have no significant relation to ancient cities? Also, banners could've rotted off, but that assumes that the devs took the progression of time into account.

[@josephrowlee]

Very fun field trip! :D I agree more with the theory that the pillagers explored the Ancient City at some point. Those dark oak towers, the light blue wool used in the city matching what you found in the mansion (you can find light blue wool tents in some Ancient Cities), and pillagers often have small tents (but they're white) with their outposts. But the idea of villagers or even the wandering trader making those towers are also interesting theories!

[@snibo1024]

What a good demonstration of the scientific method; someone gives a hypothesis and the others try as hard as they can to disapprove it, if they are able to do that the hypothesis is false if they don't it is the leading theory. But I do believe that oda's theory should be considered as the main theory for who built those structures until proven wrong of course. Because of a lack of an alternative theory to complete with and the fact that the structure seems to be recent because of the fact that it was made of wood and it should have rotten over time, so it must be left by a people that still exist and pillagers are the perfect candidate since the structure keeps the consistent building style that pillagers always keep

[@casualsleepingdragon8501]

I would also like to add that illagers have shown (possibly) shown interest in other old structures wiþ magical significance as we can sometimes find rooms in woodland mansions that have constructions that look like end portals (green wool representing the end portal frames and orange wool representing the lava underneaþ And the structure at the center of the ancient city is þeorized to be a portal dew to it following the conventions of portals in minecraft (very hard blocks and heat, nether portal is made of obsidian and activated by fire, end portal uses indestructible end portal frames and has lava under it, and the inner edge of the ancient city structure is made of indestructible reinforced deepslate and has soul fire lit under it)

[@arsenelutin1734]

We can also find maps (made of wool carpets), and we can find potted flowers that don't generate in dark forests (notably there can be found blue orchids and lily pads, otherwise exclusive to swamps, and alliums in quite the quantity, there is even a dedicated room that looks like an allium nursery? they seems to like it!) Point is, I think that they are explorers! Sure, they are bellicose, they attack players and raid villages, but still, they seems to travel around quite a lot They definitely show interest in stuff: be that the end portal, (likely) the ancient cities, basic redstone, magic, animals (chicken and cats, if those wool statues means anything?), flowers... there are libraries in the mansions, too, so yeah, definitely interested in stuff and knowledge in general. What I wonder about their fake end portal is whether it's a reproduction of what they saw while exploring, meaning they explored a stronghold (not that unlikely, if they also explored the ancient cities), or if it was built from oral knowledge of the old times? Do they know what it is for? I guess at least they know about the ender pearls being a key

[@sammiannnz8341]

A wild theory that kind of combines all the evidence: Ancient city was populated by the predessors of the villagers. Worshipping a deity/creature called the ‘Warden’. Well turns out the Warden is real, and for whatever reason, comes by and forces/scares the villagers out of their wonderful strong city. Survivors flee to the surface, and surface in a dark oak forest (which could, by the time of the excavation, have changed biomes over time). Villagers are scared, and want to return home. They send down scouting parties, wth the resources they have to hand (the dark oak) and manage to make some makeshift repairs (fences are simpler than walls to build for example, faster and fairly effective and keeping most things out, or stopping you falling off a ledge). Maybe these scouts were scared back to the surface, maybe they were killed. Regardless, the villagers never manage to reclaim their home. Ultimately the survivors fracture into different parties wanting different things. Some want to just go about their lives, and leave for other biomes, either out of hope for the future or desire to forget what they have lost. These groups become the villagers as we know them today. The other group decides they will not be so easily defeated. They keep scouring the city, building up arms, and watch towers, seeking to grow stronger and one day return home. They build with dark oak as a reminder of this mission, and it becomes their reminder of what once was home. Over time this mission shifts from returning home, to making a home, to ultimately just wanting power. Since they are not focused on living, they end up raiding, or (one might say) ‘pillaging’ their once good friends. This would happen over several generations of course. They are also fairly grey skinned, almost pale compared to the villagers. This could be a result of exposure to the sculk in the early days, which provided a subtle mutation, or could just be war paint. Either way, they have become differentiated visually from their cousins the Villagers. A wild, and somewhat unsubstantiated theory, but timelines must be considered. For the oak to have been used but decayed, some time has to have passed between the building of the towers in the city, and the discovery and excavation. Which means several generations (or more). It would also explain the ‘jump’ or dissonance between the towers in the city and the present day structures you can find. The lack of records or archaeological evidence between the two time periods would support a sort of ‘dark ages’ time period (thinking of the Greek dark ages, but most dark ages have similar traits). It would be a period of rebuilding, setting up, where survival comes before literature and art, and they are forced to work more with the materials at hand (wood mostly) instead of the stone they were used to. It means a whole different way of building in many cases, different construction methods, different styles, and until they had those methods under their belt, arts and record keeping probably wasn’t high on the list. They could be keeping oral traditions as far as we know, but we can’t speak their language with any fluency so we can’t know that for certain. Please feel free to attempt to blow holes in my theory, I’d love to try and defend it using the evidence in game, to see if it’s even capable of holding water (it certainly ain’t watertight under any circumstances).

[@GayOttergal]

Pillagers exploring the ancient city after it was originally occupied could possibly explain why the wood and wool haven't degraded; pillagers repaired/renovated a limited set of structures, using their usual materials to fill in the gaps left by degraded materials from the original structures

[@dilo19000]

There is a key similarity between the tower in the Ancient City and the Pilliger Outpost, which is the usage of stone 'pillars' (wall blocks ingame) for support of a domed roof. Granted in this case the pillars of the Ancient City towers use what looks to be surrounding deepslate which seems to go against the general idea of Pilligers using imported materials. But it could be that they either not have as much reverence to the stone they use during construction or avoid stone import for weight reasons.

[@crazytiger6]

I just want to say, there is a difference between pillagers and illagers. Illagers is a term used to describe pillagers, vindicators and evokers (and the unused illusioner, as well as maybe witches and ravagers?) meanwhile pillagers are exclusively the variant with the crossbow, and are not found in the woodland mansion, much like the evokers and vindicators are not found in pillager outposts. They look similar and group up to do raids together so I think they’re one civilization but different jobs or something? It’s not a super important distinction most of the time, but I figure it should be made

[@PrestonMidgley]

RetroGamingNow did a wonderful breakdown of ancient cities, skulk, etc. as well as an intriguing take on the pillagers. Basically, he concluded that some unknown society created ancient cities, but they held some sort of power that the pillagers wanted. They repaired the buildings with the wood you're seeing as well as the blue wool (which can also be found in the same color in the wool room in woodland mansions). The video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/o2LQdJ6JiMasZqs

[@nightman1008]

Great vid! Any chance the Skyrim reference is a hint on analyzing the architecture/culture of the ancient Nords or Dwemer thru the eyes of an archaeologist? I'm sure it'd be a while if that's the case with your schooling and all, but I think that'd be cool as hell if you found the time to do it! I feel there would be a lot you could contextualize with the real world, despite the elder scrolls being a fantasy franchise. Like comparing and contrasting viking burials to Nord burials, or reusing and remaking ancient cities like markarth, etc.

[@daskalosBCE]

No hint, just a joke. But maybe! who knows

[@KyleMaxwell]

On the RL piece: I think recent DNA evidence supports the idea that Thor Heyerdahl had it backwards: humans came to what we now call South America from Polynesia (not from a Bering Straight land bridge as my generation was taught in school). I love seeing these fits and starts of humans figuring things out, and future generations will hopefully have even more solid answers about our shared story!

[@WatcherObsi]

I personally had loved the idea that pillagers could have built those towers, but also i have a personal little theory-and it's not really based on anything outside of how the tower is built so specifically. Pillagers, I've noticed, rarely if EVER use ladders in their builds. Maybe they prefer stairs because it's easier to defend against enemies, since they require both hands to hold a crossbow. Villagers use primarily what's around them, and DO use ladders-but only a very small few buildings actually have a use for ladders. My theory? I like to imagine they were ancient 'Players' like us. They use mainly planks, using unstripped logs as details... a single-block ladder using a nether-specific material... I feel like these two are very much like how we humans tend to build things in Minecraft. Of course, this is purely coincidental evidence and there's no TRUE proof of who, or what, put the wood and wool down. I suppose if this was real life, you could possibly use how the wool/wood looks and how far it's deteriorated to determine how long ago it was placed? But since there's no deteriorated wood or wool in Minecraft, we can only make guesses. It's possible the gray wool is older than the colored wool, perhaps having been colored at one point but lost that color? Who knows. Too many possibilities! I love the video, too, going through these different possibilities and even teaching about a real life archaeologist with a well-supported theory, but ended up being incorrect in that theory. Can't wait to see how else you restore the ancient city!

[@nils3939]

The storyteller in me says what if: Pillagers attempted to conquer the ancient city and were able to construct the tower before being either scared off or taken out by the Warden.

[@subject14]

maybe you might be seeing the difference between past and present Pillager civilizations something like different cultural layers. i think that there are 3 cultural layers in the ancient city pre-sculk, post-sculk and pillager involvement edit: take my idea with a grain of salt as I'm a kid who just likes to read about history

[@nixsonhenderson]

My man is honestly one of the greatest Minecraft creators in current times This is the kind of thing I would LOVE to watch as a kid and could actually see this being played in a classroom as an educational activity in the classroom!!

[@Tiki_Doll868]

What an entertaining, educational and relaxing series. I enjoyed letting my mind wonder while you both explored ideas.

[@dustinwheeler3833]

i love theory crafting. your videos have become a new delight for me, thank you!

[@PotSmokingSpiders]

My favorite part of this whole video is at @6:40 when they see the giant chicken and MC_Oda's chuckle sounds just like a chicken clucking to me!

[@cstockman3461]

I have to disagree with the statement that there's no similarities between the pillager towers and the dark oak structures in the ancient city. The dark oak constructions in the AC use exclusively materials characteristic of the pillagers, and in the case of dark oak no other known minecraft entity, with the exception of cobbled deepslate, which I think is most likely material scavenged from the surroundings. They both have roofs that are shaped like a sail vault, which is not to my knowledge seen anywhere else. The buildings do differ in the pitch of the vault, though that may be a result of size. The corners of the vault are supported by pillars made from cobble walls with a cobble block at the bottom. Both have a wood plank floor with unstripped logs at the edge. On both, the cobble block at the bottom is inset from the logs by 1 block. On both, there are fences starting beside the cobble walls and extending out, with a 1 block gap in the middle. Now that all the similarities are out of the way, the differences: The AC dark oak builders use dark oak flooring, whereas pillagers use birch. This does not rule out pillagers, as it would likely be less burdensome to bring only one kind of wood to what appears to be a temporary or hastily-built site, especially from the carpeting over dark oak repair work. The AC builders also use ladders rather than stairs. An explanation is given in the video, but I also offer another one: In the center of the tower, there is a basalt pillar, which is like what is seen in the other ancient city towers, which in those had a ladder. Given the overall makeshift appearance of the construction, it is likely that the builders sought to use that already-existing material in their structure, as well as the ladder keeping it more compact. Overall, the evidence is strong that the Illagers, or some group closely related to them, built the dark oak structures in the ancient city. It is not necessarily true, but I think the evidence is strong.

[@clausluger4570]

Both pillager outpost and little tower in the ancient city have four torches placed on top of their roof (regular torches)

[@nicolashansen2546]

12:52 i laughed outloud hearing about the boat thing.

[@widdershinnz]

I cant wait for the next episode! This one was sooo good with the history you provided

[@formalpainter6598]

This was a fun aside for an episode. I really think the real life example adds a lot to the story and method as well. It doesn’t need to be in every episode but I certainly would love to see it in other situations as well!

[@baldhumor5]

I actually rly liked the story of a real archeologist in this video, it rly tied the trip together

[@jcKobeh]

Personally i watch this channel as a loght learning source for archeology concepts, not really because i care about a sandbox game's lore or lack thereof, AND SO, having those interludes going deeper into the history and way of thinking of archeology was great. It's been my favourite episode from the ancient cities and trail ruins series. Also, what a smart move to preemptively tell the fanboys in the audience to shut up about other people's interpretation if the data (especially when they forget that iconic line "but remember, IT'S JUST A THEORY"). Anyway, just wanted to comment in praise of the masterful way in which you weaved in a bigger lesson through a brief history class in an already educational series.

[@allycat5609]

I cannot tell you just how hard i laughed at the skyrim bit XD

[@Dragons_Clutch]

Loved this a lot! The interludes were a great touch, and fit into the overall nessage of the episode so well!

[@giovannibrunelli5128]

very very interesting and well made, thank you

[@StaminaOverlook]

I completely agree that whatever we can assume about the ancient city can be nothing more than a compelling theory. But gosh if it isn't fun theorizing! 🤩🤩🤩

[@frank-yp9br]

Nice, keep it coming!

[@Smallsilk]

Besides the construction evidence, they do seem to have alot alot of wool, while besides beds i haven't seen any wool be used by villagers, also while villagers hardly are ever violent, pillagers raid, loot, and conquest, so if they couldn't make or bring their banners, maybe they used the mini tower things as different way to indicate their presence, overall of the peoples that exist in the overworld, due to pillagers and their affinity for raiding places, it they would be the most reasonable and likely people group to have been the raiders of the ancient city, not to mention they do have an affinity for studying or trying to follow the footsteps of the ancient builders, so them raiding/exploring their ancient cities would make sense

[@th3craftymin3r32]

I like how you've broken down why the common theory of pillagers could also not be true.

[@chdreturns]

Viewer ever since the trail ruins but the Bronze Age Minecraft series got me hooked, question, is there ever going to be a season 3?

[@daskalosBCE]

Of course but I gotta have a season 2 first!

[@kereminde]

@@daskalosBCE Oh good, for a second I was wondering if I missed a season existing!

[@chdreturns]

​​@@daskalosBCEI mistook Ancient Greek Skyblock for S2, my bad.

[@daskalosBCE]

Ah yeah, its definitely a standalone. The mitrou project is kind of a season 1.5

[@kierianiis]

Like the new(?) vest/tie combo!

[@daskalosBCE]

Fun fact: That is based on an actual outfit I occasionally wear in the real world

[@kai_the-_-eye]

this series is genuinely one of the things that have made me consider becoming an archaeologist lol. Can't wait to see how the rest goes! :)

[@zedbot954]

Yay field trip!

[@LBPskydra94]

It seems like the previous inhabitants resided in the Ancient City (the ones that built and lived in the underground city) were first and after it was abandoned, the Pillagers (or some other people) came to loot the remains of the city, but also weren't entirely successful due to the sculk and Warden. Some looters may have survived or perished, but all this is a speculative theory I just thought of. Still very interesting to ponder and theorize.

[@cawareyoudoin7379]

I love the real world educational bits, would love to see more of them!

[@plasticupkake]

incredible birthday present

[@LuvaniDarkwings]

I loved the mini history lesson that went along with this episode! There is some very compelling evidence that the pillagers set up temporary camps to loot the ancient city. It definitely seems that someone did, even if it wasn't the pillagers. Unfortunately, from a historical/archeological standpoint there just isn't enough evidence to say for sure one way or the other what happened in the city, where did the sculk come from, what is the Warden and where did it come from? For all we know the villagers could have looted the city, using dark oak towers so others would think it was pillagers. Without clear pictographic or written documentation we'll never be able to say for sure, and jumping to conclusions can lead to years of having to convince people that what they knew to be true was, in fact, wrong. A good example of this is in paleontology. Dinos were thought for years to be slow cold-blooded "lizards", but it turns out they are more closely related to birds, a lot of them had feathers, and many of them may have been warm-blooded, though the idea of cold-blooded dinos is so prevalent that scientists are having a hard time convincing people.

[@fuchsiabomb]

something i don't know if anyone else has pointed out are the noticeable architectural similarities between the structure in the ancient city and the pillager outpost that i feel go beyond the materials used. their rooves are both supported by four pillars of cobble wall (in the case of the ancient city structure, cobbled deepslate, likely locally sourced). as for the rooves themselves, not only are they both made of dark oak, but they have a very similar arch to them which spans between each pillar, all of which supports a raised, almost domelike center. additionally, both feature dark oak fencing which forms a sort of railing around their respective platforms. all of this is to say that to *my* eye, the ancient city structures *seem* to resemble pillager outposts rendered in miniature. as jesthers's comment points out, correlation does not equal causation. however, i still felt it was compelling and potentially worth pointing out.

[@Adam-xf6sq]

We got rim rolled

[@A11V1R15]

Now I'm thinking about mineshaft, most of them are made from regular oak, but in badlands they're exclusively dark oak! Also, between villagers an pillagers, maybe it was both, the pillagers could be the "dark oak villagers" at some point, that's why there's no dark oak village today. I wonder now if this has something to do with they grey colour, like Ancient cities, Mineshafts in badlands (were you probably don't want to be out in the sun) and dark forests could make a villager population develop some sensitive skin or something?

[@mr_irrelevant]

Recently enrolled in an archaeology class. I'm sure these series will help me understand the material better!

[@castel6773]

Quick note I'm saying everything at once, so be prepared Villagers don't live in dark oak forests because of illagers. Illagers hunt and kill villagers for unknown reasons except baby villagers they don't hurt babies. Pillager outposts like you mentioned carry dark oak with them but not birch no other species thwt can place blocks goes near the dark oak forests. The roof for the outposts looks like a giant version of the thing in the ancient city it even has the torches. The center monument is shaped like the warden's head. The spot underneath the monument requires sculk to work, implying that sculk was around with people. Since sculk can easily be removed with a hoe, they have a lot of Dimond hoe's another common way to find Dimond hoe's, is in woodland mansions. I think the illagers were prepared to go in ancient cities. Sometimes in outpost chests, you can find goat horns, and the most common place to find an ancient city is underneath a mountain. Most mountains are tall enough to have goats. Also, the sound for a village raid is a goat horn. That's all I'm willing to write right now

[@tia7520]

When I saw the room full of blue and cyan wool in the illager mansion I knew for certain illagers must've been at the very least inside my ancient cities. There's multiple buildings that are just piles of blue and cyan wool.

[@pumkin610]

Notfication on 🔔 👍

[@milleniumsword1558]

Just something that Sprung to mind. Both the City tower and the outpost use cobbeld fences/walls as supports for the roof. As opposed to the rest of the wall being mostly brick.

[@Neriedar]

I loved the discussion on theory and evidence. I had hoped you could have used the presence of non decayed organics in the wood and wool in what is likely a highly active decompositional environment ( skulk seems to be something of a fungal organism) as a segway into detecting different occupations of a space by multiple temporally distinct populations, even bringing in discussion of looting and site disturbance.

[@daskalosBCE]

I’ve discussed that before

[@usplezi]

вдохновляющие видео

[@cawareyoudoin7379]

I think it could still be interesting to see the two tower structures side by side, and compare them directly.

[@baldhumor5]

5:00 ngl i almost skipped thinking this was an ad

[@NoisyBones]

perhaps the pillagers are the looters that pillaged (haha) the cities afterwards? it would explain how there is new looking wool that matches the colors they have in their bases?

[@CoolBenjammin-hx4sh]

Literally just checked this and said it was upcoming and now it is here

[@nin_tan]

I would rather they keep this stuff inconclusive to be honest. Part of the beauty of Minecraft is "anything is possible" and that extends to how players are able to interpret their worlds. Personally I like the pillager theory and think the dome suffices as a unique architectural style in the context of the game. I think if we want to believe that organics are at play here though, we also need to consider how well kept the support beams in abandoned mineshafts typically are. Are they about the same age as each other? How new are mineshafts? I did really liked the idea you guys floated around about a potential ancestor to modern pillagers that did have dark oak villages that just stopped for whatever reason and either started making mansions or outposts though!

[@crimsonhawk52]

Just want to point out for your conversation at the very end, there are a lot more woods that are unused and very dark, in the nether!

[@crimsoncapricorn188]

Im 100% on the dark oak towers in the ancient city being pillagers, the top of the ones in the city is literally just a smaller version of the top of the outposts

[@KTNH617]

I have a theory that maybe the Illagers came down to the ancient city, built small outposts to scout the area, saw it was infested with sculk, found out about the danger of the warden, and used their blue wool, found in the mansions, to try and escape their outpost towers and escape the city

[@Xellerator101]

You guys are on the right track but there is one other from of structure that can help with the pillagers structures... deep within the oceans

[@Ninjaananas]

14:33 Villager jump scare

[@friggles8121]

I love the idea that pillagers are using blankets and pillows while exploring this structure. I've always thought a extra layer of dirt was missing around the city. A lot of structures have one block layers right above ground level which look like a base to the buildings. However, buildings usually sink into the ground rather than float. The primary path to the center building also has clear structured divots on the sides which goes against the one block up theory. I would like to hear your opinion about these ground level problems. Could the city originally have been filled with sand and it was washed away? Was it always underground meaning there was little wind? How old could this structure be based on the materials and depth?

[@ElClandelCangrejo]

14:32 yo wussup 🗣️

[@bentri7964]

There is archeological evidence of pillager and endersent (ancient ender race) presence in the ancient city. By reconstructing disc 5, recordings can be heard of players, endersent, pillagers, and the warden all within the city

[@rais7681]

You'd noted that there were voids left in some structures that suggests some sort of degradable support. They also had access to basalt for that tower and soul sand for their lanterns. I'm gonna guess that, if the ancients who built the city had used wood of any kind, they would have used the hyphae/huge fungus from the nether.

[@chirpdotbat]

Maybe the dark oak villagers became pillagers?

[@rockinggamerdude]

The dork oak was brought in afterwards

[@chosendovahkiin5781]

At 6:27 some of the Ancient Cities i have come across have broken buildings made out of wool blocks in those colors so that might be some evidence

[@ostepolsegudensprofet]

Since the wood would have rotted, I would rather assume that the pillagers made a temporary settlement there while raiding the ancient city.

[@NixityNullt]

14:33 Squidward Jumpscare

[@DrybBones]

what about the possibility of the pillagers once being a part of a dark oak village? after all there are theories suggesting that pillagers were once villagers that were banished for doing forbidden or taboo practices. Bonus note, it is also interesting you mention endermen having possibly been something else before, there is a theory on that as well, suggesting that they were people very much like the players but at some point left to the end and stayed there and were somehow mutated or something

[@AceMcCrank]

I wonder - there is another structure set that hasn't been explored here - the ocean ruins where the Drowned spawn. Also being a set of "ancient" structures, maybe worth exploring for connections? (I'm also making this suggestion blind)

[@wallobster1344]

I don’t know if you’d be interested but it may be beneficial to check out Game Theory’s Minecraft lore videos. There’s lots of interesting ideas and how the storytelling is pieced together. Absolutely love the videos keep up the great work!

[@daskalosBCE]

Thank you for your suggestion, however, the whole point of this series is to go in blind and treat like I would an actual archaeological site. I wont be looking up any theories by anyone else in order to not tint my interpretation. Also, unless Mojang says it, it should not be taken as canon.

[@wallobster1344]

@@daskalosBCE Completely understandable, love the videos!

[@havenbastion]

Which is more likely to degrade more quickly, packed bitch plank floors ( from being stepped on, dependent on the softness of it ) or dark oak used as structure?

[@kalenstone]

Look at the Pillager Outpost when compared to the Tall Ruins you've recently restored in the Ancient City. Are the Pillagers descendants of the Ancient City civilization?

[@Sly-Moose]

The dome roofs and stony sides are obviously similar too! Plus the blue wool is also abundant in the woodland mansions. And pillage is literally a synonym for looting The villagers don't pillage! They are a canonically peaceful mob and keep to themselves. They don't even like fighting themselves for defence so they use golems instead. Them stealing would be completely out of character for them, much less exploring deep underground It being the pillagers is clearly what the devs intended. That's one thing the Polynesia story doesn't have. Minecraft is written like a environmental storytelling book. History is not a book filled with intentions created from any singular group/person. History is messy and filled with plot-holes, unresolved endings, and missing facts. If a book were filled with those things, it'd make for a pretty unsatisfying book. Sorry, I didn't think I'd be this passionate about this- 😅

[@daskalosBCE]

There’s one idea that your whole theory hinges on. You are assuming that the towers were built by people looting the city. There’s no evidence to suggest that the towers = looting.

[@Sly-Moose]

@@daskalosBCE The other thing is that I'm looking at it from a writer's perspective, whereas you're looking at it from a real world perspective. MC far closer aligns with storytelling than it does anything else, since it's a fictional game. If we were talking about ruins irl, than ya, all bets are off with anything being conclusion. Irl, it could be anything, and that's where I'd leave it to the experts.

[@fellowdiman]

Villagers don't use dark oak because because pillagers live and getting resources from there, so there's a high chance to be killed

[@KaliTakumi]

14:32 villager jumpscare

[@mask_vids9834]

I'm ignoring the pinned comment to say that the deep dark can be found in any biome and so can pillager outposts as far from dark oak and acaia as possible and you still find that in the deep dark. And since the ancient city is made of deepslate it was made underground so they wouldn't have had access to those things unless they brought it there with them alongside their livestock to settle there. So the pillagers, pillaging as usual discover ancient cities all around the world guarded by sound sensitive blind monsters known as the wardens. It would be incredibly odd for piglins who use blackstone and endermen who place blocks at random to make those towers... also piglins zombify in the overworld which could be interesting to see a video like this for them and their bastions.

[@shavranotheferanox7809]

keep in mind that some woodland mansions have a secret room where they reconstructed the end portal lroom out of wool, might be connected to the "portal" in the ancient city?

[@perseverance6197]

So i was exploring an ancient city in creative last week and i saw piles of wool there in the exact same color as the ones u found in the manshion. I was like woah. Are we cool to do debates, theories, and counter thoeries in the comments? Also i remember watching an archology video a couples years ago where someone said they knew how a specific place had been used because they had found evidence in another place from a close time period. Would u guys be willing to do another field trip where u jist check out other ancients cities to expand your theories. I really liked this one. Is fun

[@JohnBread69]

inb4 DNA testing reveals the structures were built by Popbob the infamous 2b2t griefer

[@KinneKitsune]

I feel like you missed another very likely explanation. They weren't built by explorers, they were repaired by them, evidenced by the pillars being deepslate instead of cobble.

[@ShionWinkler]

The mansions are Illagers not Pillagers. There is a huge difference. But the Ilagers do worship they ancient builders (the makers of the city), so it makes sense they would go to the ancient cities.

[@D3ST1]

i dont think it could have been the piglins or endermen. This is because piglins turn into zombie piglins when exposed to the overworld. and endermen only pick up select blocks they like. :)

[@squittlequeen2282]

I learned more from Minecraft than I ever did in school

[@simonfraser3332]

SKYRIM PLAYTHROUGH WHEN!!?? :O

[@thiccchungo1041]

I don’t think the pillagers are the ones that built those ancient city structures, mostly because when it comes to Minecraft civilizations that we know of none of them are as full of themselves as the Illagers, their officers carry banners with their faces plastered on them everywhere they go, their outposts are covered top to bottom in their banners, and their mansions have giant murals of their faces and giant wool statues of their likeness taking up giant halls, the idea that they would show up somewhere and not leave SOMETHING that would indicate that it was theirs at one point feels very out of character, especially considering how territorial and aggressive they can be. Vindicators with steel axes aggressively charge down anyone who enters their mansions or even walks too close to it, crossbow wielding pillagers aggressively defend their outposts and chase down attackers that try and run away, and killing an Illager Captain used to entail having a bad omen placed upon you which would cause illagers to launch a massive assault on your village in retaliation using their giant Ravagers and magicians like Witches and Evokers. I feel like they would have left something that would be concrete evidence of their presence there other than dark oak structures

[@rafadelneg6080]

Do real archeologists break in inhabited building for their research?

[@daskalosBCE]

No, but they often trespass, lol!

[@cubus5451]

14:32 HMMMM….