ATC RADAR [NCT] (GROVE) | Busy Controller REPRIMANDED BY UPSET PILOT

[@VASAviation]

This is the raw unedited version of this ORIGINAL VIDEO -- kzbin.info/www/bejne/mn23f2SpZpyfpZY

[@jvvader]

PC-12 pilot getting butt hurt flying with the big boys and girls LOL!

[@Habu12]

He did a good job, dunno what the fuss was about.

[@VASAviation]

He did a great job considering how busy he was with all those flight followings.

[@CAPFlyer]

@@VASAviation Which is kinda the problem. VFR inside Class B is voluntary. ATC doesn't have to let them in or keep them in. He was overloading himself instead of offloading the VFR traffic outside the Class B if he was working above his capability.

[@flyingguyy]

@@CAPFlyer This looks like it was all below the Bravo. Airliners are Oakland (Class C) arrivals.

[@CAPFlyer]

@@flyingguyy Unless I misread the chart, the Class B floor in that area is 4000. He was at 5500 for most of the issue. Remember, the Class C "underlays" the Class B. It's a really complex airspace through there because the SFO Class B sits above the Class C and so the Class C is very "shallow" compared to normal.

[@BonanzaPilot]

@@CAPFlyerit was under the class B shelf and outside the class C. Never recieved a B clearance

[@rachelt2482]

Thanks!

[@VASAviation]

Thanks for watching

[@StealthParrot]

It is clear just how busy this controller is and yet some jerk doesn't like something and moans about it during all that intense communication. Controller was amazing!

[@in4merATP]

I've been spun VFR in this area quite a bit of late. I think it comes down to workload and being able to effectively communicate what's possible and what's wanted from both sides. Why is the sector lining up oak arrivals on the north plan while also coordinating ksql tower handoffs? There just isn't enough available mic time during a southwest crunch. The facts are that VFR traffic flows between the peninsula and Livermore past SUNOL. And the OAK arrivals cross that path. Sometimes the controllers act like there's a grade crossing, and want to stop all the vfr traffic to let the train go by. I think this is a developing problem, and there should be some outreach and collaboration to figure out how to keep these two flows away from each other without forcing someone out to Gilroy to get underneath a shelf of IFR arrivals just to go back to PAO. What's going to be the outcome of letting this pattern go unaddressed? This is not an isolated incident. I'm not faulting either party here; obviously everyone's just trying to do their jobs. But if this keeps happening, and make no mistake it's quite regular, the outcome will be fewer VFR aircraft participating in flight following, and that is an L for everyone.

[@dominicnguyen4802]

All of this is just poor planning, communication, and lack of understanding from VFR pilots. Use all the tools available to you before the flight. Use the FLY chart and resources like these to better navigate through that area. The controllers won’t have a conversation with you on freq. They have enough info to know where you go, a few minutes out of the way for you doesn’t supersede the need to move a whole sequence of jets out of the way and delay them.

[@BonanzaPilot]

I'm going to give some commentary as the pilot to this plane. This video better shows how busy that frequency was but it doesn't show the context or the airspaces involved and that is blaringly clear in the comments. This event happened almost 8 months and hundreds of flight hours ago but since it got posted to vas it has been replayed through my mind a bunch of times now. These videos show the work the controller is doing but the pilot has a job to keep pax safe and get to the destination safely and that doesn't always align with what ATC is legally allowed to do. The flight originated from Truckee, I had a handful of pax including at least one "infant in arms". I was vfr on flight following and descending with waypoints setup in the FMS to descend beneath the Bravo shelves as I'm not expecting a bravo clearance. My typical routing is the DECOT waypoint, it keeps me away from both the Oakland and the San Jose C airspaces. Generally, once I hit the Sunol area, ATC will give me a vector if needed fit between, and under Oakland arrivals. To this flight now, open reaching this frequency, I am immediately given a heading and altitude to maintain. I turn and continue my descent at this point I am outside of Bravo surface area somewhere around Mt. Diablo. I was probably wondering where I'm going but I'm along for the ride at that point. I still have to keep my awareness out for where the Bravo and terrain is but besides that, from the pilot point of view, the controller has said "to heck with your routing, I'm the captain now" Couple minutes go by on this heading and I'm level at 6,500. I'm still outside Bravo but I'm anticipating a right turn to go under the bravo at any second so I start slowing down. Keep in mind I can see the other planes on my map. 3 minutes into this vector I now have Oakland arrivals above AND below me. I'm recognizing there is an issue because I shouldn't be above those guys. Above Livermore airport I'm thinking I've been forgotten about so I called 4:23 to remind him I'm there. He starts to issue me a lower altitude and turn? He changes his mind and sends me left. I looked where he was sending me and I see the descending SWA jet and his call to me was anything but confidence inducing. It was pretty obvious to me the controller was more worried about getting airliner RA's than he was my flight path. I went into defense mode. I wanted control of my airplane "I'll end flight following". He steps on that transmission. I'm not sure he heard me. The next minute there isn't a single break in the radio, and the whole time I had a serious issue with this heading and altitude. I'm stuck and approaching what I'm visually trying to calculate the wake off that airliner. At 6:00 I decided I needed to turn to avoid the wake turbulence. There happened to be a break in the radio and I told him that. I realize I am deviating from my assigned heading and altitude. That is rare, and a big deal, I didn't like it. Why am I even in this situation, I reiterated I wanted to cancel, I don't think he heard me the first time anyways because he stepped on me. I would have turned a minute ago. He responds with 5,500. Ok, he heard me that time, he still wants control. I'm under the 7000ft Bravo shelf and rapidly approaching the 4000ft shelf and again no radio space to speak. He finally says descent approved. I respond with descent approved and that I was going to call them later. He might have been doing a fine job lining up the conga line but a pilot feeling stuck and helpless is not the business. I needed to talk to them about it. I really should have stopped right there because nothing else I said had any value. "that was unacceptable" was implied and my "no he's not" in response to the conga line of airliners, who are totally oblivious to the scenario that took place, just wasn't needed. I was frustrated. When I landed, I called nor-cal and a supervisor had already reviewed the tape. I explained my issue I had, he said the controller didn't do anything wrong from a separation standpoint. I asked about my routing and what I could have done different, and he said the routing was fine there just wasn't anywhere to put me at that particular time. That was the end of that. I was on the ground and my pax didn't even know there was an issue. I moved on I departed and got flight following as usual and went on with my day. I debriefed the scenario with another pilot later on and moved on. Done that flight dozens of times since and haven't had any other issues.

[@TheEdwardFrye]

I cut through this area between TCY and HAF all the time, and this particular guy is one of my favorites, and I will miss him in 2 months when he moves to KSAC, but (this is more for others) after hearing the back and forth, I think rather than a "ack instructions, but.." kind of response, and better response and something that would have gotten attention on your situation would have been a "unable" response. He's hauling butt all over that screen keeping the line moving, gave you and instruction and you said "ok", then he steps on you because you said "ok", had you responded "unable" that would have stopped right there and he would have what you need or why not? instead you kept saying "ok, but..", fastest way out would likely be "unable, turbulence/whatever"

[@Tommmmas]

File IFR, problem solved

[@NOELTM]

@@TheEdwardFrye Well said.

[@williamcarr8484]

@@TheEdwardFryeThank you!!

[@williamcarr8484]

@@Tommmmas❤

[@JSFGuy]

Touchdown, check it out.

[@thefallenrift1705]

125th 3rd comment