Battlestar Galactica | What Am I?

[@480JD]

She's no longer Starbuck the Grey, she is now known as Starbuck the White.

[@imhotepjasonduncanson6068]

You are too Funny.

[@friedrichsinofzik5969]

@Mäkirannantörmä Or she is an older version of cylon.. From the first earth and before the colonies.

[@eliseives345]

One of the nerdiest statements ever made. Nice.

[@havigeneral1]

That's why you slow cook on a bbq.

[@thehantavirus]

@@friedrichsinofzik5969 you mean before the first earth, since they had ressurection before the 13th tribe landed on the first earth. i always thought she was like the angels "gaius and Caprica 6"

[@jacobdarling1524]

That moment when Leoben sees the dog tag and backs up. Doesn’t matter how many times I watch this show that moment ALWAYS gives me chills.

[@damenwhelan3236]

Brilliant acting. This scene is emotionally charged.

[@paulc1665]

Even when he was facing death himself, or abandoned in space, or being tortured, he was utterly insouciant. To see him totally terrified after all was just SOMETHING ELSE.

[@nerva-]

@@paulc1665 Exactly - when even Leoben has no idea what's going on, you know nothing is certain from then on.

[@tuxedotservo]

You know you've accomplished something when you''re Kara and manage to creep out a Leoben

[@kanghahnlee1385]

"She told you that?" Whole world collapsing for Leoben.

[@dpoultski2499]

Great scene! When Leoben backs up and is speechless you know its a WTF moment!!

[@moofymoo]

just social distancing thing.

[@leopolddienstknecht7931]

That shits too weird for me, I'm not high enough to comprehend this. - Leoben, propable inner monologue

[@monyclair5357]

@@leopolddienstknecht7931 From all the Cylons, he's the most mystical ... he usually always finds something to say about a situation. But at this moment he cant believe someone dead can be still alive in front of him, 'cause Leoben is maybe a mystical, but at first he's a sceptical who want to know and find god in his life, now he have a proof. And from then to the end of the serie, you wont see him many times.

[@jkdbuck7670]

Oh I did the same thing to my wife when she finally fixed the Bluetooth stuttering on my phone. I was like "what kind of sorceresses ARE you?"

[@paulmichaelfreedman8334]

@@leopolddienstknecht7931 This is above my paygrade.

[@alibryant749]

"If that's me lying there, then what am I? What am I???" *Leoben.exe has stopped responding*

[@tmage23]

Starbuck: "What am I?" Writers: "We have no idea. Just go with it"

[@yugurtz]

the theories I've read still doesn't explain it. cylon would've just been an easier answer

[@nerva-]

So true. There were so many brilliant things about the show because RDM believed in just letting it evolve organically in the writers' room, but that was also the downfall of the show at other times, so you ended up with incomplete plotlines like "fat Apollo" and characters like Baltar starting off amazingly and then just wandering around aimlessly. RDM scoffed at the idea of rigid "five year show arcs" like JMS did with Babylon 5 - and B5 often felt forced and "on rails" going from chapter to chapter and character milestone to character milestone, but it didn't suffer from the mid-series-slump that BSG did.

[@shireboundscribbles]

The original series answers that question.....

[@mowtow90]

@@yugurtz They changed a lot of writters over the years for this show. The last season was defenatly the weakest. This scene in particular when they tried to re-create it from the original BSG and failed spectaculary. To this day nobody from the show can explain it. What happend to Kira , who the current Kira is ext. They just put that outthere and never finished it. They never explained how the 2 Hybrids (the renigate and the rebel) knew about her and they ment by "harbinger of death".

[@DiegoSouto-fy9su]

Yup. During parts of, but specially after New Caprica, things just got wonky as heck and the convenient plot device of the magical beings started being overused left and right. And at the ending, they pulled all possible heartstrings to make people go "oh that was beautiful" and forget about all the "just go with it" that had been going for a while and led to that point.

[@MrAlkylation]

it's incredible how many people did not understand the end of battlestar. After her death Starbuck became a messenger (seraph in battlestar original serie), like head baltar and head 6 but she did not realize at this moment, only at the end. Messenger are a old alien specie living beyond our dimension (so they are like god for us), they help human/cylon to fulfill their 'destiny" of eternal restart (it's already happened and will happen again). They appear sometimes to human and make them believe they are send by god.

[@TheNoybusiness]

Exactly. It's not really that complicated when you get down to it, nor should it be.

[@mowtow90]

@@TheNoybusiness Yes , the problem was that the writing of the last season of the new show was terrible. They never explained it. In the original series you could understand that but here , it was just dumped out there and left.

[@DiegoSouto-fy9su]

That was the intent. But the writing did not earn that payoff. It's not that people didn't understand this idea, it's pretty obvious what they went for. It's that it was shoved down their throats with contrived plot devices, so they didn't respond well to it. To me, New Caprica was peak BSG and after that the overall story and writing just got progressively worse. Sure there were still moments of brilliance in there, but through mostly self contained plots like the mutiny. When you make excellent seasons that require a certain level of suspension of disbelief and only sprinkle the devices and then you dial up the required level to 11, you lose a lot of people in the way.

[@ckeefe9868]

"What am I?" An excellent actor is what you are - because every time I see this scene, I still get goosebumps.

[@SeArCh4DrEaMz]

me too, that tv series is pure fuckin genius, im so affraid that the new BSG reboot wont even compare to the 2008 one

[@Colin-Fenix]

Her, an excellent actor? She’s a loudmouth who overacts. She is one of the weakest actors in the series!

[@hyjinki4886]

Personal theory: Starbuck was the same species as the hallucination Baltar and Six, the same species that the 12 tribes worshiped as gods. My theory is that hallucination Baltar was Ares and Six was Aphrodite, and Starbuck was Athena, the one who killed herself in mourning over the exodus of the 12 Tribes from Kobol. I think instead of simply dying, Athena was born again among the tribes she loved so well

[@hyjinki4886]

@@thehantavirus I agree that they're angels. But I also think that they are the Lords of Kobol

[@battlestar1788]

In the end of last series she vanish too

[@TheNoybusiness]

Word of the showrunners pretty much confirms this, other than the Lords of Kobol part. Given that they tell people not to believe in the Lords of Kobol, I would doubt that.

[@kbhalacy]

Starbuck is Hades

[@ricoender8020]

With no memories of her past life.

[@opticalraven1935]

Legend has it that Leoben is still running after that shocking discovery.

[@kylenewberry9792]

He ran until he hit water, and then turned around and did it again, Forrest Gump style.

[@LN997-i8x]

No one knows, not even the writers.

[@JcBravo8]

Only God knows and He - Hang on. No, no he says he doesn’t know either.

[@hardcoretam]

@The Dead Roach Society Indeed. Cosmic magician is much beter.

[@greggoat6570]

I always interpreted it as it does not like to be called “He”.

[@christiansoldier1968]

Pretty sure that the writers knew full well, because they actually watched the original show and were familiar with the seraphs on the ship of lights. There were many throwbacks to the original series, starting with character names, the basic plot, and then individual episodes. When Kara flew the raider back and “waggled” the raider wings, that was a throwback. The series is full of them

[@331Grabber]

You, are Ron Moore writing himself into a corner.

[@Zedul]

No, they just didn't have the budget to shoot the ship of lights material from the original series... and really, I think it's best that they left it this way. Actually SEEING the ship of lights would ruin the conjecture. Best to leave some things off screen -- especially rewarding for fans of the original series to watch the Battlestar newbies flop around on the deck like fish out of water. This series isn't just a "reimagination" it's actually a modern remake. They followed the original, note by note, even Starbuck's death and resurrection. It's a beautiful thing.

[@331Grabber]

@@Zedul Starbuck didn't die and be resurrected in the original. That was Apollo. It was just horrible writing. Moore was hellbent on the audience not knowing the plot. He and David changed the plot multiple times because fans figured it out too quickly.

[@Zedul]

@@331Grabber You have no idea what you are talking about, so just stop. Please, JUST STOP. Looking up youtube clips when there are so few available will just leave you with no context. Apollos "resurrection" if you could even call it that, was a barter and happened in the context of one plot, one episode. Starbuck's came later as part of a multi episode arc, when his viper was stranded and he was left on a planet. In the end, whether or not you like Moore's style, all comes down to whether you are an audience member who can fill in gaps with your own imagination, or if you are one of those people who needs to be spoon fed. It is your preference. Someone's writing isn't "good or bad" based on their preferred style of storytelling.

[@vgernyc]

He was also attempting to minimize the Mormons In Space aspect of the original show.

[@BladeZero238]

The most annoying part about this to me is that this Leoben apparently drops off the face of the series after this. I would've liked to have known what he did after running away like that. Did he off himself? Did he isolate himself on the Baseship pretending to have never cared about Starbuck's destiny? I mean, come on...

[@annoyed707]

A lot of Cylons got killed during the civil war.

[@tammymartinez7488]

On the finale, a Leoben copy is there with the six’s, and eights. One of them says that they choose to live out their days on the “new” earth.

[@BladeZero238]

@@tammymartinez7488 Yes I know, but it was never specified whether that was the infamous Two we all know and love-hate, or whether he was even still alive. I just wish this specific character got a bit more closure.

[@usul573]

We do hear a tiny bit from him in the finale and mutiny arc, but still.

[@TheEDFLegacy]

Could be because of the writers strike of 2007-2008; this was the very last script before the strike, and it was written in a way to act as a psuedo-finale, in the event the series never made it back to air. That could be a contributing factor as to why he never returned.

[@amawesome3190]

What is interesting is that ever since Leoben came into contact with Starbuck, he has gone on and on about how special she is and how she has a destiny. Now, confronted with evidence that what he has been saying all along could be true, he takes to the hills.

[@fakeemail9098]

You're a wizard Starbuck!

[@atticstattic]

whatever she used on her hair should have been used to preserve the Galactica...

[@Armann_]

The writers admitted they had no idea what they were going with, they wrote it off as quick as possible. It's left up to anyone's imagination if Kara was actually there or everyone was seeing something diabolic or schizophrenic. Edit: [SPOILER WARNING:] Just to be clear, Kara "Starbuck" did die. It's never explained how remarkably "she's" just "there" as some sort of Angel. _of death._ She doesn't remember how she died, her purpose after death was ...unfinished business. Then vanished.

[@dylanwight5764]

@@Armann_ I like to think she was a manifestation of Galactica herself. Sure, she has all of Kara's memories and personality, but her return had always seemed to make her a bit more like she was part of the ship itself. She was a bit more detached and focused on the fleet than she was before. She was still Kara, but she was also Galactica. Or at least, she had somehow adopted a lot of the characteristics that defined the ship and her crew throughout the exodus.

[@Ty-yt3lj]

That's just rooted in real human biology. Hair generally stays long after flesh decomposes, and would've probably stayed in place considering Starbuck died in a helmet. As for what Starbuck actually is... we have no idea. I subscribe to the idea that she's an unknowing angel personally.

[@bostongalden1171]

Ha!

[@atticstattic]

@@Ty-yt3lj It wouldn't look like a freshly minted wig, though....

[@MGTOWRising]

Puts a new spin on "staring death in the face."

[@aztalyido]

The most "What the frak?!!" Scene in this entrie series..

[@aztalyido]

@ some thinks she was the 13th cylon model.. but this doesn't explained that she vanished... Well.. hope the new reboot will fix this😂

[@chrisb9960]

@ I agree. They messed up with Starbuck with her death, coming back and then disappearing. But it is Science Fiction and fiction is made up.So it doesn't always make sense.

[@chrisb9960]

@ I agree that they messed up the Starbuck storyline. The disappearance was beyond silly. I get why they got rid of the technology. I would not have.

[@chrisb9960]

@ I did say that I would not have. It eliminated their knowledge of history. Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it. I think the writers wanted to tie into the history of Homo neanderthalensis vs. Homo sapiens and one dying off. Who knows if it will tie into the reboot. Doubtful but we will see.

[@JohnsDough1918]

The main problem was they didn't intend to stop the show so soon, and after network interference throughout season 3, the writers' hands were kinda tied. It's similar to GOT where most plot points could've worked if they took their time to develop them and didn't drop them midway through the last season. But the GOT creators choose to end the series, BSG could've been cancelled if they tried going beyond the 4th season. However, I would've preferred if Ronald D Moore went ahead with his other idea for the finale: everybody needlessly dies before reaching an hypothetical Earth, because intelligent beings too often lose track of the necessities of survival and kill each other instead. It would be almost cliche nowadays as an ending, but would've been daring back in the day.

[@MrSlive86]

This scene was incredible. Kudos to both actors. Kara with her usual fury, Leoben now not so sure of what path he's walking anymore

[@SapphireZeev36]

This is an homage to the original series. There was an idea that Starbuck would become one of the Seraphs and angel for self sacrifice

[@sinanuluc5143]

oh the music, the drama, the acting... gives me goosebumps every time.

[@BossyGuyMike]

It's amazing that this was basically Leoben's last scene of significance other than something like thirty seconds in the episode with Roslin on the Cylon ship and his less than ten seconds of screen time in the finale. I wonder whether that was due to availability or the writers simply not having any other use for him.

[@looneyburgmusic]

By this point the writers had no idea what to do with most of the cast, the unresolved Kara/Leoben relationship being just one of many glaring examples. There was so much potential for the emotional dynamic between the two to have a major part in the end of the series, but instead it's just sort of forgotten

[@jayfox3628]

A resurrection hub nearby would have helped answer what starbuck was. Maybe the same hub the final five pylons used 2000 years previously. Ellen could have saved the seventh model Daniel, and he could have been the piano player-father of Kara. That would hell explain why there are 2 bodies for Kara, and why Leoben was always attracted to Kara but couldn't recognize her.

[@tlotpwist3417]

When a youtube comment of a few lines makes more sense than what series writers came up with when they have hours to think about it

[@TheNoybusiness]

Being a hybrid would not explain that at all. Only pure Cylons have spare bodies, plus why would Cavil have let her off the Hub? Ron Moore explicitly said that Daniel wasn't Starbuck's dad and the writers never thought that anyone would even think that. If Ellen had been able to save a Daniel, it would mean the Five had the foreknowledge to prevent Cavil boxing them in the first place. She's just supernaturally back from the dead, that's it. .

[@TheNoybusiness]

@@tlotpwist3417 No, it doesn't.

[@inthecouchproductions8103]

I saw this scene on TV when it aired and had no idea what I was watching, but the scene was so intriguing I went back and watched the whole show. Now I've watched it all the way through 6 or 7 times.

[@Oakshield2]

"What am I?" A silly plot device.

[@Endeva09]

My interpretation was that Kara had actually died, but due to her connection to the humans and the Cylons she was the perfect "vessel" for the gods to use. She genuinely does die and is merely a vision in the eyes/minds of everyone else after this point. Her purpose is to ensure that the cycle of time is not broken, which until her many interventions it would have been as Cavil (Number One) intended on "punishing" the Cylons for creating him in human form, which would of resulted in the failure to find Earth, and as such potentially stopped or at least heavily delayed the next cycle.

[@deathstrike]

There may be an alternative explanation. In the original BSG, Apollo had encountered a being referred to as Count Iblis. He was never clear as to who or what he was, but it was quickly apparent he had tremendous powers. To make this short, Iblis was a rogue part of a race known as the Celestials. They were in a hyper advanced vehicle that appeared to be a pure white, almost crystalline appearance. The beings of this vessel claimed they were once like humans . And that humans with great age and maturity would become them. They may be the basis of the legends of angels and demons as finally, Apollo recognized Iblis as the evil Mephistopheles. Or as we call Lucifer. So Kara may very well have been "rescued" by the Celestials and used as a means to save the last remnant of the Colonial Humans. Once her "journey" was completed, she was simply held until they seemed her ready to "return" to her people in time of need.

[@calebwest3797]

*God the series pretty much confirmed that there was only one God.

[@rvaughan74]

I think Starbuck died and whatever "God" is 3D printed a new body and used a Download of Starbuck to give the new body a mind. We know from Caprica Human can Download/Ressurect as well so it's not a stretch that "God" (since he doesn't like that name according to Head Baltar) would do that to give the fleet their harbinger.

[@SoFGR]

I remember when she went to burn her own body after this and sat next to it, very emotional performance !

[@CesarDaSalad]

Starbuck: "WHAT AM I?!?" RDM: "Yes." I personally don't mind the ambiguity of what she ends up being, I simply assumed she was some sort of angel incarnate sent by the Lords of Kobol, which were proven (to me at least) to exist by that oracle lady's powers in that one New Caprica episode. :)

[@rikosaikawa9024]

RDM was a master

[@usul573]

It's a little frustrating, but I think I've come more around to seeing it from his perspective.

[@Kelmire1]

Yeah, but aren't the Lords of Kobol just sentient A.I that ascended to a new realm of existence?

[@usul573]

@@Kelmire1 Where was that said?

[@Becka_Harper]

I always assumed that she’s literally a Lord of Kobol.

[@paulcollins4932]

Brings back the goosebumps I first felt ten years ago , best series on Earth

[@theguythatmakesyoumad3834]

Which earth?

[@44excalibur]

The Seraphs came for you, Starbuck. “Yours is a promising spirit."

[@SilentReflection101]

Bear is a God with this soundtrack

[@QuicksilverSG]

The Resurrection of Kara Thrace In Battlestar Galactica Season 3 episode "Maelstrom", Kara Thrace vanishes mysteriously along with her Viper within a violent maelstrom around a gas giant planet. In the final scene before Kara disappears into the maelstrom, it's clear that even if she were to somehow survive, her Viper is starting to break up and will not make it back to Galactica intact. When Kara miraculously returns to Galactica several months later, she is piloting an undamaged Viper and claims she has been to Earth, but has no recollection of the months during which she had been missing. In the cockpit of her Viper a homing beacon flashes, presumably indicating the location of Earth. Galactica tracks the signal to a dead planet that had been nuked 2000 years earlier, where Kara finds a wrecked Viper containing her own corpse. Galactica subsequently discovers a verdant planet identified as a prehistoric version of our own Earth, where Kara once again vanishes without a trace. Whether Kara was a human, a Cylon, a ghost, or an angel is one of numerous puzzles left unexplained in the series finale. Here is a theory that explains Kara Thrace's resurrection without resorting to supernatural intervention. It relies on relativistic time travel via wormhole, a not unreasonable conjecture in a universe where instantaneous Faster Than Light physics are employed for routine space travel. 1. After Kara vanishes into the maelstrom, she encounters a spacetime wormhole and blacks out as it transports her to a decaying orbit around nuked Earth. After recovering conciousness, she visually identifies the planet while her ship records its coordinates, activating its homing beacon. She then flies back through the wormhole, not realizing that months of time have relativistically elapsed during her return flight. 2. Galactica tracks down the nuked planet via the homing beacon, and there Kara discovers a wrecked Viper. In the Viper's cockpit she discovers a corpse and removes a charred copy of her own dogtags from around its neck. This is the corpse of her future self, who is destined to fly once more into the maelstrom. The wormhole will then hurl her back in time to crash on the nuked planet, a few months before it is tracked down by Galactica. 3. Kara gives her corpse's charred dogtags to Baltar on Galactica. Months later, Galactica discovers verdant Earth, and the colonists set about decomissioning their spacecraft. Kara realises that it is time for her to return to the maelstrom in her Viper and fulfill her destiny. 4. Kara uses the wormhole to travel back in time to rendevous with her past self in a decaying orbit around nuked Earth. At that point in time, her past self has blacked out, her Viper has suffered irreparable damage, and it is doomed to eventually crash into the planet. To prevent that fate from happening to past-Kara, future-Kara docks with the disabled Viper, drags unconscious past-Kara out of that ship and exchanges Vipers with her, leaving past-Kara to regain consciousness later in the undamaged Viper and discover nuked Earth. After past-Kara returns to Galactica through the wormhole, future-Kara rides the disabled Viper down to crash into the planet. It is only later that past-Kara will reconstruct what happened and recognize that she is destined to become her own guardian angel.

[@missymoonwillow6545]

Best Character story in the entire series. Love the historical dot connections to our own past as well. The Thracian people are thought to be the survivors of Atlantis, a history rich in culture, dance, art, and magic!

[@Negativvv]

The long grass is exactly that when Starbuck walks to the wreckage, when Leobin walks back the grass is all flattened...

[@shaftoe195]

Starbuck: What Am I!? Me, an intellectual: You're a self-destructive alcoholic! Starback: ... (but she knows it's the truth, we all do)

[@OpenGL4ever]

Me: Search your feelings; you know it to be true! Starbuck you can find Earth. I have foreseen this. It is your destiny. Join me, and together, we can find Earth as audience and angel! Come with me. It is the only way.

[@johnecoapollo7]

When my teen self saw this for the first time I inexplicably started sobbing. No joke. I wasn't sad as in depressed or anything like that but the segments around this version of Earth are deeply disheartening. You've seen this people survive so many things only for their prize being nothing AND Kara which was one of my favourites gets a reveal like that? Watching BSG when it originally came out was the definition of a trip

[@SPACECRUISER96]

What happened to Leoben-Kara relationship after this? Seeing Leoben moving away like that, after all that happened with them (interogation scene, new caprica house scenes, prophet/mother scene, demetrius scene etc etc) They had a "special" bond. And feels like all that disapears in a moment.

[@_Rinalya]

I feel like he went into shock. This could have gone entirely different after but they didn't detail it because the actor wasn't available to shoot.

[@Hunpecked]

"OMG, I fell in love with a demon! Unclean! Unclean!"

[@Biggarou]

Yeah I agree, I mean after this scene it looked liek the whole story and polt got soved under a coffee table and left there. I think at this point the writers were looking to end it and the actors were there for 4 years, so some of them were ready to move on too.

[@ered203]

All of this has happened before, and will happen again. When Kara was waterboarding Leoben for information, he said the two of them had been doing this to each other for many cycles of time. He said that last time, he felt he was the one torturing her. Was it still water, or did the Leoben character use fire that time and burn her, or maybe he was taking the air out of the room and suffocating her? Was the Leoben figure the "Harbinger of Death" the last time? Did he crash his ship and die, only to be reborn and lead the Cylons to Earth (the original Earth), and then disappear? That would mean that in the last cycle (or at least the Kobol cycle), Kara was the figure trying to convince the Cylons there was one God, and that they should try and discover him together instead of fighting. Magnificent story plot.

[@Fidi987]

I understood that completely differently. I was thinking that somewhere in the original series there was a scene where Starbuck was being captured and interrogated or tortured by a cylon and this statement referred back to that scene. (No idea if such a scene actually existed in TOS.)

[@donpowlen]

I didn’t know then, and at the series conclusion I still don’t know. This show was great with ambiguities. The greatness of the show was the grittiness, the toughness, the dark side of life and death.

[@johnmcternan4157]

It's sorta of like any great work of art. Blade Runner for example people relate it themselves years later....

[@stephenbeagle2239]

I always took the religious aspects of the show as a nod to the fact Glen A. Larson was a mormon and had put some mormon imagery in the original. Angels in the Mormon faith(at least from what i googled ;) ) come in two forms...the ones that exist in spirit (Messenger Six and Messenger Baltar) and ones that are flesh and bone who are resurrected dead..

[@davidhenderson3400]

Starbuck: "WHAT AM I?!?" A ghost maybe. She sure does disappear like one at the end.

[@johnnygnoneeded]

She was what could be called an angel, a messenger, an agent for the Lords of Kobold. Like Micheal or Gabriel, fighting the force of death and darkness.

[@kevinpittman2517]

@@johnnygnoneeded thats what i surmised as well... kinda like the Original Starbuck.

[@underground868]

To me this scene gives me the vibes of the 'Dark Tower' series by Stephen King. "Ka was like a wheel, its one purpose to turn, and in the end it always came back to the place where it had started". This quote is eerily similar to Six's famous quote, "All of this happened before. All of this will happen again." I think that in both cases each time the cycle starts over the humans and the cylons keep making the same decisions, thus locking them in an endless loop. The point of both the series is that by the end everything will start over again, but the next time it will be different.

[@stevensrhester8594]

You are an originator Cylon. One of the "Gods" of Kobal!

[@ttebroc235]

I always took it that the "humans" from Caprica were Cylons, just lost. Remember that one old school Cylon on patrol in the middle of nowhere? He's like a bread crumb.

[@johnnygnoneeded]

The "Caprica" miniseries showed that the original Cylons were working military robots that a super rich but neglectful scientist tried to put an virtual AI into, based on the virtual avatar persona of his teenage daughter, who was killed in a terrorist attack...without knowing that his daughter was actually involved with the terrorist's cult and who was a cult membr. So...pissed off psychotic religious fanatic robo bi***! Just the kind of AI you want in your war machines, like a Terminator on a Jihadist Crusade!

[@airtexaco]

I love this show. Those that didn’t, I’m sorry. It gave me hours of entertainment in a deployed location. Maybe it was situational, but I really enjoyed it.

[@RisingTidesAC]

Situational or not, what does it matter? All that matters is that you enjoyed it. Thank you for your service!

[@Colin-Fenix]

It is entertaining and yes, enjoyable,but it isn’t as the greatest sci-fi series ever many sheep in the comments bleat by repeating “so say we all”. It’s better than some, worse than some. To many weak plot points and poor acting, like Baltar and Starbuck.

[@JohnMHammer]

What was she? The core of a really cool idea that, like most of the cool ideas Ron Moore introduced on this show, he couldn’t bring himself to take to a satisfying and reasonable conclusion so he said, “Screw it,” and either made them fade away or an act of some supernatural agency.

[@usul573]

Ron kept thinking about defining it, and it never felt right. It always felt less interesting and limited to spell it out. So he left it open. That's kinda ok to me. She's basically an angel or whatever word fits closely to that. Happens in lots of myths. The scenes themselves are done well though, it's not like I require Ron to spoon feed me.

[@Onigirli]

Funnily enough even the first time I saw this scene my only take-away was "It's cool to see Leoben look so disturbed." I didn't really care about the myth after they came back from New Caprica even though I still enjoyed the storytelling

[@bcn1gh7h4wk]

when you win a death saving throw, but you're actually haggling the Raven Queen and you come back as a Revenant.

[@bcmm1880]

If only they knew where they were going with this, and where tf was this guy the rest of the series?

[@KunraVong]

What?

[@bcmm1880]

@@KunraVong like with what/who Kara really was, and that cylon model just doesnt show up until the finale after this scene

[@TheNoybusiness]

@@bcmm1880 And one of the deckhands mentioned the Leobens when the ship was falling apart.

[@DylansPen]

What a great series this was.

[@zombieshoot4318]

I wish we had gotten something to know what was up with Starbuck at the end of the show. Just exactly what or who was she really.

[@13g0man]

(Necro post) She was a Messenger. She led everyone to the end (New Earth) through the Cylon Song, and when her mission was completed she disappeared like Baltar and Six.

[@FriendlyMarmot]

This is such a heartbreaking scene. I imagine being Kara and how badly it would mess you up to find your own badly-decomposed body, to be confronted with uncontestable proof that you did indeed die the way you thought you did. To me, it makes the scene even more powerful that the writers did NOT explain how this was possible (although we could always refer to the old series lore if we really wanted some idea). That way, we are able to feel the personal devastation that Kara feels, as she sees her own corpse and is left without even an explanation. Doesn't mean there isn't one, but she doesn't get a quick and easy answer, and neither do we. Kara is stranded in a desolate place emotionally, and the audience is stranded there with her. That's how it should be.

[@deathstrike]

This is more a fan theory, but in the original BSG, Galactica had encountered a "super race" of beings known as the Celestials. They were in a hyper advanced, crystal ship that had the ability to "revive" humans. They may be either the gods of their old beliefs, or an offshoot of humanity that evolved to an amazing level. This version of Starbuck may have been rescued by them, or even cloned. Either way, Starbuck was returned to the fleet as a sort of "shepherd" to bring the fleet safely to the second Earth. That or Starbuck was somehow pulled from a parallel dimension to temporarily replace the Kara Thrace of the one the show is in.

[@rockman8by7cut]

What a finding. This is a great example of foreshadowing our existence as humans. What am I .

[@mechtime]

The show didn't really have a coherent story toward the end, but it sure had some amazing scenes. This is one of them.

[@ReaverLordTonus]

First time I saw this I thought perhaps she was the missing last Cylon, that when she died she was resurrected like all the others were but wherever and whoever was doing it was making sure she didn't know and had her memories altered.

[@ndperson1]

Pretty sure she was the daughter of the corrupted one, the missing one, as he was creative and her dad was a piano player

[@phrophetsamgames]

@@ndperson1 I thought this too but RDM decided to speak on this and say her father was not a Cylon.

[@TheNoybusiness]

Cavil had no reason to release her if she had been resurrected on a Resurrection Ship.

[@Ensign_Cthulhu]

Given what we see happen to her Viper when she dives to her death in the clouds in that earlier episode, the cockpit section is - shall we say - very neatly and conveniently preserved. (Is this even the same planet?) It - and her corpse - ought not to have survived the fall.

[@davidkendrick4453]

The subtle clue was when Starbuck, a lifelong polytheist, said “God dammit” instead of “Gods dammit.”

[@AustinYoshino]

One season wantin to play house, the next season running for the tall weeds.

[@fernandochavez4312]

What are you? One of the most attractive actors in sci-fi. Respectfully.

[@CourtTV.]

@Mike Gee I remember when kara said that she wanted to capt marvel.

[@cengizbudak6594]

We don't know who you are for 11 years.

[@charlesfaure1189]

Maybe my favorite scene from the entire series. Katie was marvelous.

[@schadenfreude000]

It's been outright said by the showrunners that this Starbuck was one of the "messengers", i.e. the same "angelic" beings that head Six and head Baltar are. What those beings are is more ambiguous. One of the head writers said her personal idea was that they're an advanced race with an interest in humanity who are perceived as angels by humans and cylons. It's implied that the Lords of Kobol were also messenger beings, but they decided to abandon their direct intervention in humanity after the fall of Kobol. The beings are quick to say that the Lords of Kobol weren't actual gods, because they weren't. But again, it's all quite ambiguous. The two conflicting theologies (that the Cylon god was one just one of 13 gods/messengers vs. there really is one god and separate messenger beings/aliens) are both plausible given the series, and the writers deliberately left viewers to make their own conclusons.

[@martinpoole1451]

"What am I?": Hot.

[@ericscottstevens]

"Deus Ex Machina"

[@trochantermainsign8874]

There are a few times BSG brought me to tears. This was one. Lt Dualla comiittng suicide after earth was discovered to be a radioactive wasteland was another. Baltar praying that God would take his life rather than letting a little boy die of viral encephalitis was another. Lastly: when President Rosalin realizes in a FTL vision that it was wrong to let Baltar bleed out and die because of her wanting revenge

[@351cleavland]

Starbuck died a venti and came back a grande.

[@yuutsu4232]

Does anybody know the soundtrack?

[@patrickradcliffe3837]

One of Gods footsteps.

[@dakkuri1]

They never really did explain what Starbuck was after this scene.

[@ComradeOgilvy1984]

The writers dropped the ball on this one. She could be (1) Artemis of the twelve gods of Kobol, (2) an angel of the Cylon god, or (3) a Cylon similar in kind to those we know. Unfortunately, none of these explanations is properly developed, and the writers leave apparent contradictions, e.g. Why should she be mind 'effd about her own identity here?

[@dakkuri1]

@@ComradeOgilvy1984 she could've been saved by an alien species. Just a thought

[@ComradeOgilvy1984]

dakkuri1 Sure. From a pure science-y POV that is as logical as any other. However, from the perspective of dramatic logic, some other alien species that does not get mentioned anywhere else in the several seasons is even less satisfying. Or rather, for purposes of the show, a powerful hidden alien species is indistinguishable from 1 or 2.

[@dakkuri1]

@@ComradeOgilvy1984 it's a possibility

[@ComradeOgilvy1984]

@@dakkuri1 I agree.

[@uwemajewski4531]

Wenn das ich bin der da liegt ,wer bin dann ich? Gottes Wege sind unergründlich. Eine der ganz heftigen mystischen Szenen. Ich liebe BG, auch dafür.

[@bingbongabinga2954]

Kara brings change. The Humans and Cylons will merge. Death in this case means an end to the Human and Cylon races. Two become one. All of this happened before and will happen again. Converge and diverge.

[@PaulGuy]

So this is the green ending?

[@TehAntares]

This is one of the things even the deus ex machina cannot explain.

[@bingbongabinga2954]

This is the dying leader.

[@fingerboxes]

"All this has happened before"--the Lords of Kobol were not the first to have their Cylons rise against them. They may have even BEEN Cylons. Maybe she's an older model: older than Earth, older than the final five, older than the Lords of Kobol. Maybe the idea of using specific music to summon cylons and using supernovae to guide travelers goes back to the time of her model. Maybe her model doesn't need resurrection arks, they just recreate a body when theirs is too badly damaged.

[@wakuyanow]

Kara was resurrected by the "angels" in the Ship of Lights from the War of the Gods episodes of Battlestar Galactica 1978. Kara got a shiny new body and a shiny white ship, reminiscent of how the 1978 Apollo and Starbuck's uniforms turned white. Just my guess.

[@SLagonia]

For those complaining that not finding the answer to this question was somehow a terrible writing move; The fact that we never got an answer WAS the answer. That's not bad writing, that's amazing writing.

[@larrymarso4492]

great callback to Count Iblis

[@RisingTidesAC]

Kara was a Cylon. She crashed, was resurrected and then Cavil let her go in a duplicate Viper of her own, created by the Cylons. Before he let her go he erased her memory of being resurrected because he knew it was her destiny to lead everyone to Earth. She didn't disappear in the finale, she just slipped away unnoticed and boarded a ship to the Centurions ship and left with them because that was her destiny, which was to lead the Centurions to theirs.

[@DanielLewycky]

As much as it goes against so much evidence in the show, this is what I choose to believe because otherwise it was a fantasy show, not sci-fi.

[@burntblonde2925]

I love Katee Sackhoff! She was so good as Starbuck!

[@NaturalEnquirer]

Leoben has quite an arc

[@rikosaikawa9024]

You’re an angel who disappears suddenly

[@dougwebb704]

Starbuck is the resurrection.

[@audience2]

What are you? You are the plot of BSG taking another late season turn for the worse.

[@technologic21]

She's an extraterrestrial, the only one, the one, a 'guardian angel,' so-to-speak.

[@annoyedbysignups]

I never bought the angel explanation and frankly it feels wrong for Starbuck. The writers got out into the weeds (literally in this scene) because they were so married to some of their ideas and their desire to be deep and philosophical that they never stepped outside the box and thought "okay, how can we explain this and make it interesting and have it develop the world that the show is in?". If Cylons are compatible biologically with humans enough to make a baby, then who's to say someone didn't manage to reverse engineer resurrection to work for existing humans so that Starbuck can die in the plane but her consciousness can transfer to a copy of her body. It would've been more interesting if they'd introduced the idea that humans can BECOME Cylon even if they were born as a regular old human. That would suit Starbuck's past and her personality more. In the show she's always the one willing to take that 1% chance, to do something reckless and dangerous to get the job done where others would've accepted defeat. Plus, the ground work was laid. Starbuck was back on Caprica for a while, Anders was a Cylon, and we know she was in the clutches of the Cylons when she wasn't conscious to know what they were doing to her, so why not? Why not have Starbuck be both the ultimate traitor and the ultimate hero? It would've explained the otherwise nauseating Anders/Starbuck/Apollo love triangle a LOT better. Edit: Also, it would fit with the Cylon's agenda of exterminating humanity. If they can't fully kill off all humans, then why not convert them?

[@GuillaumeG-oz3hz]

That might have been really cool indeed. But then what about the plot holes that angel starbuck solves ? Sadly they were in a hurry and the strike didn't help, so they resorted more and more to her as an angel to make things happen. Not sure either that the cylons are exactly like humans, suggesting that humans could download too. The show contradicts itself, sometimes saying you can't spot the difference, sometimes showing us a working cylon detector, and I still remember 6's spine glowing red. I guess we can count that one as a pilot episode mistake ^^ But then why are they so strong if they're made like humans. I doubt Tricia Helfer could lift a water pack with those arms. Although i suppose it's an argument in your favor ^^ So many inconsistencies, why not say that human brains are exactly the same and memories can be wirelessly downloaded from insane distances. It's no more weird than the cylons being able to do it.

[@evilborg]

This episode really freaked me out.....

[@dragoonseye76]

This was such a good series

[@mbogucki1]

It's one of those points where you realize the writers/creators just ended up throwing shit at the wall and this stupid plot point stuck.

[@bladerunner3314]

I think it's both a bummer many questions never got an answer and on the other hand very appropriate

[@caramason56]

Love this episode

[@jeffburnham6611]

Well, she did lead them to their end, to a planet where they could start over, the death of cycle where they are constantly being chased by Cylons, the death of those Cylons who wanted the eradication of the human race.

[@tred6292]

This is getting out of hand. Now there are three of them. The Kara that died in the storm. The Kara that died, crash landed on, and rotted for what appears to be years on Earth. And the Kara that found the fleet in the nebula and later found her corpse in this episode.

[@mrmike1884]

It makes sense to me now. That is not Leoben. It's Lucy from Supernatural.

[@TheKingOfRuckus]

Never quite understood this. Clearly dead but her "ghost" is solid and breathes. If there was any explanation for this at all, I must have blinked each and every time it was in an episode throughout this entire series.

[@TheNoybusiness]

She's a messenger in human form. It's really that simple.

[@nicolasinvernizzi6140]

@@TheNoybusiness not only that but the Baltar and Six "Visions" are also solid to the ones that see them. she is the same kind of being now. but her mission required she was in "physical form" for far longer.

[@jdee8407]

Starbuck was a part of Universal consciousness personified. The goal of Divinity or Universal consciousness is to guide and or evolve humanity and human consciousness going forward throughout time. In special times or circumstances such as this, the Universe will send special guides or angels help steer humanity in the right direction, it won't simply be left to go out of existence and become extinct permanently. In the case of Starbuck she was something so profound that she manifested in the physical realm to guide humanity to that crucial leg of the journey because that's what it would take. And when her work was done that energy that personified her physical existence dissipated and left since since what was holding her there was no longer needed.

[@DiegoSouto-fy9su]

"You're now a... convtrived plot device!"

[@snapverse]

The whole show was in a simulated environment. She was a glitch. Caprica introduced us to simulation technology.

[@chriss9836]

Star Buck: WHAT AM I? The viewers: Bad writing.

[@xProGenitoRx]

True dat!

[@michaelkenny7314]

The result of a drug fueled writing session and drunken approval process.