Ben Shapiro and the Politics of Imagination | Big Joel

[@BigJoel]

Hope you liked my video!!! If you REALLY liked it, consider giving me some money on patreon: www.patreon.com/bigjoel. I'd appreciate it! Anyhow, here's the footnote. There is no doubt that regardless of what you think of private property, property law is an innovation that happened in many societies (though clearly not the modern idea of private property as a right that the government has no grounds to violate, as Ben seems to suggest occurred at the very beginning of civilization). And if Shapiro had simply said that, there would be no problem. *Neither what I said in this footnote nor what I said in the video amounts to an argument for or against Lennon’s perspective on possessions.* But it’s safe to say that civilization did not wait for the “discovery” of property to get started, and it certainly did not occur only in the West. After all, it seems far more likely that property law would be created as a response to the surpluses of emerging civilizations, not the other way around. And to say “property law is something that emerged across many civilizations because it’s one reasonable result of societies having surplus resources” is a radically different, less ridiculous, and less persuasive claim than “we would all be nomads if some dude thousands of years ago hadn’t thought about property” is.

[@HoJoXo]

Hey, I want to help you with that lawsuit. I'm not a lawyer and I don't really have any money, but I can make funny quips on twitter and stuff and at the end of the day that's all any of us can really hope for. Also, additionally, Shapiro either in this argument or if he ever defends this point is essentially trying to usurp the default as his point. He's going to say "You need land to grow food and that is property rights." Of course it's not though. That, again, is silly. Like expecting stoneage hunters to get a permit to hunt mammoths silly. It's just what happened. Shapiro makes it sound like the Founding Fathers were there too, going "You need a deed for this land!" when the reality is "This is close to water and no one else is living on it, so I'm going to make a house and I'm only going to stop if someone who can actually kill me tells me to."

[@laffy7204]

Of course Ben Shapiro is against imagination, he doesn't have one and doesn't want one. He's scared of it because his guardians were scared of it, his sponsors are against it, his target audience is against it. All because having an abundance of imagination brings them an almost physical discomfort, for having an abundance of imagination doesn't bring certainty, easy to buy growth, and easy to mantain but abusive connections and love, it doesn't delude itself in its self-importance. However, minimal imagination could

[@raulgarcia8627]

😂 did you get an email or a call telling you that you had to be more enthusiastic in the ad for skillshare and that's your revenge or what?

[@PenguinSGM]

just an fyi hunter gatherers had more free time than people living in early agricultural societies, gathering doesn’t require as much labor. i’d say the main thing with agriculture and civilization was being able to support a larger, more dense population that would stay in one place. it caused an explosion of complex social organization, but it’s also good to note that there are still hunter-gatherer societies today and they also developed complicated cultures so agriculture can’t take all the credit for culture. i know it’s not important for the point but thought you might like to know just cause

[@JC-jd1us]

How are people so for war but against property damage. Property gets damaged in war, peoples private property. How can someone be for private property with seeing this. Never mind the lives lost and destroyed.

[@kevinroth1049]

"Hello darkness my old friend, I've come to talk with you again." Ben Shapiro: "Okay, first off, darkness isn't sentient. By definition, darkness is the absence of light. He is literally saying that he wants to have a conversation with nothing here. You know who else talks to nothing? Crazy people."

[@bonesandhearts5683]

Woah I could literally hear him saying this in my head as I read it.

[@MisterAppleEsq]

You really nailed the way he talks.

[@AdrianCelsiusTepes]

All "facts" and no feelings makes Ben a dull boy.

[@hyperludicrous9143]

thats tripy

[@VictoriaClerici]

yeah, I had this kind of realisation through the video. Shapiro simply doesn't understand poetry or any of its figurative language, like metaphores or hyperboles, which happen a lot in "Imagine". It's really frustrating, he's reading the lyrics and taking them by their literal meaning and trying to DEBUNK THEM. For someone claiming to be so smart, he doesn't seem quite knowledgeable about literature (or anything else for that matter) lol

[@finnianday]

Ben Shapiro's the type of kid who said "No we can't" to the Bob the Builder theme song

[@miserabelle]

you just unearthed the memory of me doing that when I was like 6 and thinking I was hilarious

[@penelopeandpriscillaaregay1712]

@@miserabelle sameee 😭

[@timurthejerk9270]

miserabelle well when I did that I thought I was rebellious and cool

[@TV-Girl-Enjoyer]

"Well first off, Bob the Builder is absolutely ridiculous as he aims to teach kids about the fantasy world of building for no incentive. Hypothetically let's say, there was a show teaching your kids a giant lie and false idea of reality? Would you really be okay with that? Would this benefit the western society? Does Bob the Builder have judeo Christian values that actively help and progress the west? I think not."

[@miserabelle]

​@@TV-Girl-Enjoyer ASASIAWJEIOAWJELFKSDJLF

[@frankharvey88]

Only Ben Shapiro could listen to a song called “Imagine” and go “None of these things exist!”

[@SorowFame]

“Let’s say, hypothetically, that’s there’s a brotherhood of man” “No, that’d never happen”

[@VeenSauce]

I'm convinced Shapiro is autistic, but I don't want to imagine that, because then we're just making fun of a small handicapped man.

[@SorowFame]

@@VeenSauce autistic people can be horrible too. That said I’m hoping he’s not because we don’t want him

[@deanmoriarty6015]

“no greed or hunger” ben shapiro: *scoffs*

[@Mothromance]

The Ben Shapiro video reminded me of when I (autistic) answer people’s rhetorical or joke questions literally, and it takes me way too long to realize I’m rambling and they weren’t even serious…… and that’s not a good thing, it makes me cringe so hard. Basically, I’m insulting Ben Shapiro for acting autistic and I’m very autistic lol. (Idr think he’s actually autistic, just a disingenuous propaganda artist lol)

[@alaiterg]

“It is literally impossible for everybody to be king fu fighting”

[@Maksie0]

To say that the kicks were as fast as lightning just shows how liberals will just completely throw the entirety of science of the window and say things that completely go against physics and fulminology just to fit their agenda.

[@riyak.7393]

💀💀💀

[@ILikedGooglePlus]

Peak

[@boabuin1151]

Even if that were true, we would also somehow have to believe that those kicks were INDEED fast as lightning, which is just absurd

[@balls-lover-34]

@@boabuin1151 left wing media wants us to believe that it was a little bit frightening and that they fought with expert timing, which beyond any reasonable doubt is logistically impossible

[@heathermasonfan]

Ironic that John Lennon said "imagine no possessions", yet he then proceeded to own Ben Shapiro

[@mchu5580]

this is the best thing

[@thinkfirst1989]

aaayoooo

[@TheArtis4n]

He got that EDITH treatment

[@bhocolatebhipbookie3967]

Bam!😂

[@addmin5487]

ZING

[@da_pikmin_coder8367]

John Lennon: "Let's *pretend* for a moment that everything we do that causes our own suffering is gone instantly." Ben Shapiro: "That's unrealistic."

[@catpoke9557]

I remember one time I was having a hypothetical discussion with my dad about black holes, I don't remember what the hypothetical scenario was, but it was an impossible one. I was asking "what if," and my dad basically kept saying "that's impossible." I repeatedly said that's not the point, and what if it COULD happen, and he just.. wouldn't go along with it. God I hate conversations like that.

[@unslaadkrosis3489]

Conservatism is a mind prison.

[@katelynelms3062]

@cats zo yup

[@SceptileDude254]

@@catpoke9557 people that cannot entertain the -idea- of a hypothetical situation are braindead and have peaked in their own intelligence.

[@anuel3780]

I love hypothetical situation just because it's so fun and honestly really fun brainfood but it fucking crushes me when someone replies with "that's impossible" like congrats hypothetical situation is impossoble i am so proud of you

[@Lil_Albino]

Ben Shapiro is the kid to say “gun beats everything” in rock paper sizers.

[@Silverwind87]

He's the kid who was told to sit in the hallway because he kept correcting the teacher on minute details.

[@JustSkram]

He's the kid who had a force field when you play fought in elementary.

[@MoogMoog]

*sizzlers

[@MoogMoog]

RodianDude good one

[@MoogMoog]

@RodianDude i agree his dishonesty is really damaging to public discourse, it's pretty serious

[@lynnclaywood4043]

That part where Ben Shapiro keeps musically interjecting his objections to the lyrics while they play... That's gold. It sounds like it could be it's own song in a musical, with the antagonist desperately trying to undermine the protagonist.

[@albums8825]

lmao xD

[@parthdeshpande2966]

It sounds like harry potter owning voldemort at the end of order of phoenix

[@Furiac.]

It's like he's been hired as the ad lib guy but disagrees with the message and voices it throughout.

[@MimiksYou]

real the lorax let it die moment

[@grilledpook]

sick remix ben

[@ThreeArrows]

Ben Shapiro trashing "Imagine" by taking every line literally sounds like something someone would do as a parody

[@utubepunk]

Three Arrows! Now it's a party!

[@cosmojenkins3020]

Three Arrows Yeah, but did you know his wife is a doctor? Checkmate, atheists. 😎👌🤙✌️

[@bernardeugenio]

@@cosmojenkins3020 true LUL

[@duckofdeathv1595]

Someone should parody Shapiro's video by responding to Old MacDonald had a farm, or even better There Was an Old Lady that swallowed a fly. ha.

[@normaaliihminen722]

Thats because That song pictures a fucking communistic utopian which would never happen

[@witchflowers6942]

“Man in his room yells at anti-war song by dead man for ten straight minutes”

[@Hazel-xl8in]

Witch Flowers i love the picture of him under the covers with candles lit next to a picture of AOC

[@grav4706]

*in his mother's basement

[@umbilicalcreature1529]

This is the best comment here yet.

[@TheGudStuffs]

Not “yells”, instead he “debates” it. And loses.

[@FauxGemini]

Lord Saurgoth Lord knows if I was his mom I sure would've, LOL

[@w3stipher]

"God, that is so childish" "You may say i'm a dreamer" These two lines feel like they're part of a conversation, somehow. and the fact that the song itself is so calm and not asking anything of the audience, and Shapiro is so brash and angry, makes it seem as though Lennon is "winning" the argument.

[@joannamyers1268]

I was thinking that too. Upon hearing that clip of him, he inadvertently made the song sound like a duet.

[@99jean88]

What do you expect, Shapiro wrote a novel, a place that he controls the narrative, and still made his heroes come out as horrible human beings.

[@ExcludedLayman]

His whole grift is aggravating critics by smug affectation, then belittling anyone who responds with hostility. Arguing with a contemplative, peaceful song (with lyrics full of imperatives and encouragement to think, no less) makes his Gish-galloping moral outrage into the very thing he tries to manipulate opponents into doing. He's ducking into his own punch.

[@thesmiler1579]

Ben Shapiro Realpolitiks

[@AstraIVagabond]

John Lennon CALMLY DESTROYS Boomer Ben Shapiro with DREAMS and FEELINGS

[@killerbug05]

incredibly ironic, ben shapiro is widely known as the guy that says "hypothetically" before going on wild rants, yet he is unable to understand imagine's hypotheticals.

[@kolinkomita2975]

His wife is a doctor!

[@pastadeadman4594]

@@kolinkomita2975 okay...?

[@kolinkomita2975]

@pastadeadman4594 he says that a lot, like it offers him some sort of credibility. It's a joke

[@pastadeadman4594]

@@kolinkomita2975 ohhhh my dumbass thought you were trying it as a genuine arguement lmao

[@kolinkomita2975]

@pastadeadman4594 no, it's just like the real ben shapiro, no actual argument. Just pretend he's saying it fast and loud.

[@CharizardousRex]

Shapiro was asked to "imagine if you will" for the sake of argument by John Lennon and goes into a snowflake tantrum lol

[@xp7575]

Ironic that Ben "hypothetically speaking" Shapiro has a hard time imagining hypothetical situations

[@sankalp2520]

Ironic that this is the same Ben Shapiro who calls trans people and Gen Zs snowflakes after self-proclaiming that he completely destroyed transgenderism and owned every single college student

[@winnd44]

Lmfao this comment 💯

[@DNorbs7]

Shapiro: "This is so childish. Why can't he write an adult song about free market economics, private property rights, and the influence of Judeo Christian thought on the development of Western Civilization?"

[@justynawisniewska1213]

Doubt that'd be a bop

[@cosmojenkins3020]

Daniel Norbut Almost like he’s mad at artists and musicians usually leaning left because they aren’t heartless, boring, and unable to imagine a world that places human beings first. 🤔

[@Dante3214]

**cue evil nazi marching song**

[@anarchomando7707]

@@Dante3214 so The Imperial March

[@someonrelse3734]

Lemon was the father of these later rap about finances. It ends in zombies. Both of genres. Hint hint.

[@crowprincess656]

It feels like watching that scene of the Lorax where everyone is singing “Let it grow” and out of the nowhere Ben Shapiro starts singing “Let it die let it die”

[@peterprime2140]

Big Joel: *YOU GREEDY DIRTBAG*

[@LOLquendoTV]

Let it shrivel up and Come on, whos with me?

[@quorryraphael9980]

I was just thinking this!

[@casual_ice_consumer4148]

Ben Shapiro: You know, most saplings die anyways. That sapling is probably going to die, so there's no point in trying to keep it alive.

[@By_MichaelMcDevitt]

He is the right height.

[@jeffreycarman2185]

The juxtaposition of Shapiro and Lennon couldn’t be more stark. Shapiro came from a very wealthy Hollywood elite family and originally wanted to follow in his parent’s footsteps in Hollywood, but after his career in Hollywood never materialized, he has been relegated to doing niche social commentary in the right-wing media bubble. Contrast this with Lennon, who came from a working class family and on 100% his own merits rose to fame and has made an impact on music has endured for half a century after his death and who’s influence will, no doubt, be felt until the end of human civilization.

[@sarafontanini7051]

Ben Shapiro wishes he could be as remembered and influential as Lennon. In a few decades I bet you more people will rememebr lennon than Shapiro's scrawny ass

[@miltown3920]

my god jeff

[@sathira_anuk5179]

John Lennon is not the greatest human being, but you're right

[@justanothermortal1373]

Idk about the last sentence lol

[@TheLetterH111]

I think that Lennon will be remembered far longer than Shapiro but saying he will be remembered for the rest of human history is overstating it a bit. I'm sure youd agree that Lennon is to rock music what Bach or Vivaldi are to Baroque music. Whos to say if Bach will be remembered in another 400 years- the history of popular music is quite short and some artforms vanish and are disregarded very easily

[@jd_kreeper]

The fact that Ben Shapiro got owned by an audio recording of a dead man is honestly impressive.

[@mauropappaterra]

You meant a dead legend

[@thedudewhostalkedbjork121]

the power of ignorance ngl

[@brialapoint2608]

Ben needa therapy. Lots of it

[@noahvance6160]

Dead Musician Destroys Lawyer's Argument with Facts and Logic

[@OttoOctavius77]

Imagine what his reaction would be if he heard kurt cobain or Chris Cornell or Bob Dylans opinions lol he would explode kurt was a far left anarchist chris was a liberal who was in a band with mostly socialists (I'm talking about Audioslave not soundgarden Audioslave was a chris cornell and ratm supergroup that was basically just soundgarden2.0 with the ratm members and chris) and I actually don't know what Bob Dylan aligned with but he was also pretty left leaning

[@waffpng]

“Welcome to Olive Garden, would you like to try our Unlimited Breadsticks?” That is absolutely impossible. Let’s say you had 50 breadsticks. Sure, that would be a lot, but no where near unlimited. The supply of breadsticks couldn’t possibly be infinite, as this store is not. I’m utterly disappointed, and I hope you don’t come near me ever again.

[@DavidRSAT]

I can’t help but read this in Shapiro’s annoying voice

[@a.morphous66]

2/10, didn't waffle nearly enough about how unlimited breadsticks are communist and out to destroy the West before getting to the point.

[@heradsinn]

Offering what you call Unlimited breadsticks is the most immoral thing possible.

[@jseden]

Don't even get him started on Applebee's bottomless fries.. On a side note, I worked at an Applebee's. about 15 years ago and the kitchen manager was super stingey with the fries. He was totally the kind of guy who'd get his info from ben Shapiro. Conservative dude bro douche nozzle.

[@fey0217]

bro the fact i read this in ben's voice...UGHHHH

[@MissMillsonxx]

Ben Shapiro is the living embodiment of the phrase "Sir, this is a Wendys."

[@Zaccheus4]

Fake news, the phrase an only be “sir, this is an Arby’s”

[@HellecticMojo]

@@Zaccheus4 no one goes to Arby's

[@Somethingwithoutatrace]

HellecticMojo E X A C T LY

[@Silverwind87]

"Welcome to Arby's, we have the meat." "Let's say, hypothetically, that you DO have the meat." "Please don't do this again, sir."

[@Silverwind87]

@Humphrey Hogan Are you sure OP is the snowflake here? You seem pretty upset over the phrase "Sir, this is a Wendy's."

[@the_travelingbreeze]

Ben: “The people shouting ‘shame’ are the bad guys.” Me: they are the poor people she neglected…

[@Dos_Caffeine]

Hmm, it's almost like Kings Landing has a hierarchical society that Ben is just forgetting what country it's parodying

[@Bean-hz8jo]

That part is insane to me too lol. Like, are they? Is Cersei the 'good guy' to Ben Shabeebo? The RELIGIOUS FANATICS that manipulate the Martells, the Lannisters, and the public are the bad guys. But what he's obviously talking about is the mob of poor, indoctranated, opressed civillians chanting along, who he completely fails to consider as anything but a mindless hivemind, cancelling Cersei Lannister lol. Literally one of the most insane takes ever.

[@katieowlpower]

Also, just the childish belligerence of insisting simplicity here. “Shame” is a concept, that I’d argue is subjective. Should you have shame about exploiting others under capitalism? Yep! If you argued a LGBTQAI+ person should have shame for existing, you can bet Ben here would snap that “shame” up and hold it as a glorious banner to what is right in an instant, with zero acknowledgement of any double standard.

[@ssilnah1842]

Not to mention Cersei is clearly one of the most evil characters on the show lol

[@davidtaylor142]

Yeah 3very time I watch this video the wildest part is when he thinks Cersei is the protagonist of GoT

[@CafeConLentes]

Even outside of the context of the song who hears “imagine [] nothing to kill or die for” and immediately think “so if someone hurts a child I’m not supposed to care.” Like, no sir, we are asking you to imagine a world where no one hurts them in the first place. Thanks for playing.

[@TheSefirosu200x]

Also, there's a big fucking difference between "caring about the children being hurt" and "I'm gonna fucking be a psychopath and go MURDER the person who hurt the kid". You CAN care about the kid and NOT murder someone, you don't have to be a violent barbarian to prove that you give a shit.

[@hayk3000]

@@TheSefirosu200x nah it can't be, that'd mean life isn't childishly clear and all the options only extremely right or extremely wrong

[@SirEriol]

John Lennon.- Imagine no posesions, I wonder if you can. Ben Shapiro.- But possesions are what made us strive in the far distant past. How the hell are we suppossed to be better if we all just have to need something and people will help us with it, huh? What incentive does humanity have to become better if we all have the moral duty to be better for each other? We can't. Western civilization. Big Joel.- Huh. I guess you really can't.

[@MrCmon113]

@@TheSefirosu200x What? No, it's about killing the person, before they can do something.

[@MrCmon113]

@@SirEriol Not even quite extreme communists advocate against all possessions. That's a completely bonkers idea. It's like mandatory orgies in which everyone has to participate.

[@GarretsShadow]

"... and this is the stupidest line of the whole song. Walking a whole five hundred miles after already having walked five hundred is ludicrous. It would take years of training to be able to do this. Have you thought about how long it would take to walk 1000 miles? You wouldn't... " - Ben Shapiro, at some point, probably

[@trezapoioiuy]

ahahahahahahahahah

[@tarielkaroldan4106]

"yeah, we already know you have your little pony, you have repeated it several times. You don't need to say it anymore..."

[@liahamilton8931]

He just doesn’t understand what it’s like to walk a thousand miles and fall down at your door, doo doo doo (doo doo doo)

[@Pyriander]

Love this

[@davidking4838]

"....thanks to WESTERN CIVILIZATION, we have cars and trains and airplanes and you don't have to walk 500 miles. That's right, and this is because of PRIVATE OWNERSHIP OF PROPERTY".

[@absolutless]

Lennon isn't saying, "Don't kill someone who kills 1 million people." He's saying "In an ideal world, 1 million people wouldn't have been killed in the first place, so you wouldn't need to kill them back." It's willful ignorance, which is the guiding ethos of the modern right.

[@TheSefirosu200x]

But, also, you still shouldn't kill that person. You definitely don't "need" to.

[@zinjanthropus322]

We don't live in an ideal world, we never will.

[@absolutless]

@@zinjanthropus322 it's a song, sunshine. Cynicism doesn't equal intelligence.

[@zinjanthropus322]

@@absolutless over 130 million deaths in the pursuit of utopia in a century. But of course, it's just a song.

[@absolutless]

@@zinjanthropus322 what? oh you're regurgitating some anti-social blather you were told to think by a corporation that wants to keep you docile and depressed. Cool cool, good luck with that. Throwing giant numbers out there arbitrarily is a great argument technique, now everyone thinks you know what you're talking about. (slowly backs away)

[@theafterparty2264]

i genuinely come back to this video once every six months to hear ben shapiro snark "god this is so childish" right before lennon sings "you may say im a dreamer but im not the only one". poetic and healing.

[@theafterparty2264]

oh good I’m right on time

[@DanzelGlovington]

@@theafterparty2264 good to see you again

[@ryleighs9575]

​@@DanzelGlovingtonI love you both

[@visible.summer]

@@ryleighs9575 aw that’s nice

[@ayooobro]

@@theafterparty2264what’s a month too early for a good video

[@Fedrowreview]

10 minutes of Ben Shapiro not understanding the word imagine

[@Alexis-wg5nx]

I choose to live in an alternate reality where Ben Shapiro is completely capping and is just doing all of this for money. This man graduated from Harvard at 18 and Harvard Law at 21 (I may be wrong on these but it was when he was very young). He’s a top-tier academic for his field and I’d expect for someone like him to be debating with the likes of those in his level of intelligence. Meanwhile, his typical debaters are 19 year old college students or pop stars who were high school drop-outs. Does he honestly feel a high when he’s “winning” arguments with these people? No shame on either of them but with his skill sets that’d be like arguing with a toddler. Something just isn’t clicking. However, it clicks if you think he’s cap.

[@RC-hv1yx]

@@Alexis-wg5nx From a purely business perspective, he made a great call. He gets to be far more intellectually lazy in his messaging to the complete Neanderthals that unironically consume his content as news. Why stay in academia when he can make millions selling conservative propaganda, which requires a slim fraction of the amount of effort, compared to actual peer-reviewed intellectual discourse? Sometimes it is difficult to discern whether he seriously believes in what he’s saying when you take his educational background into account. Then you remember he makes a buttload of money - don’t look too deep into it.

[@arthurrosa9403]

@@Alexis-wg5nx He can't even stand up to Joe Rogan in a conversation.

[@darrenmacqueen9884]

@@Alexis-wg5nx This is how I feel about a lot of conservative figures. Especially those that are highly educated like Jordan Peterson as well. Most of them don't believe what they are saying they just notice that there is a lack of educated people speaking for the right and know that they will make big money just by seeming intelligent. They just need to lack morals and dignity and they can become rich.

[@atan7260]

shapiro really said there was no human development before western civilizations. that's a mind bending statement right there.

[@tarielkaroldan4106]

History-bending, more like

[@pablojn4826]

Another example that BSpiro doesn't know shit about basic Ancient history...What an unlearned boy.

[@neilpemberton5523]

Begs the question as to what Ben imagines western civiization to be like.

[@meoueo]

does he think western civilisations came from nothing?

[@pissapocalypse]

I can't believe I used to think he was smart. He's just good at talking fast and confusing people. Nothing he says actually has substance

[@e.s.r5809]

"Ben Shapiro heckling an absent John Lennon while Imagine continues in the background" is genuinely the kind of premise I'd expect from a shitpost. This is amazing.

[@kingcole5977]

How does one shitpost themselves? How did Ben Shapiro unironically achieve such a thing? And achieve it to such quality to his own detriment?

[@En.GergerRacc]

@@kingcole5977 Truly, Ben Shapiro's lack of self reflection causes shitpost interactions I would not have thought possible. The extent of his ability must be studied further, that we might unlock the true nature of the shitpost.

[@sebastiangorka200]

@@kingcole5977 people do t all the time? you seem to be confused

[@Vanilla.coke1234]

It's very telling that Ben instantlyconflates "living for today" with hedonism and then goes to say that that would lead to screwing everything in sight and killing all your enemies. Like, it feels like he just shared his own personal desires

[@gigiquinn5468]

so true. if the entire world was told it would end tomorrow, i imagine a lot of people would make a nice big family dinner or listen to their favorite song one last time. maybe they would take a nice walk on their favorite trail or play a fun video game. he jumped straight to the darkest possible reality.

[@ouch4523]

@@gigiquinn5468 I would literally just play some volleyball with my dad and then go hang out at the beach with my friends

[@thegroovyboi9598]

Every accusation is a confession

[@mammoneymelon]

literally, i think the majority of people would choose to spend more time with family, visit their friends, eat their favorite meals, etc. most people don't regularly think about committing murder or assault

[@lord_ozymandias]

@@gigiquinn5468ben jumped to that “worst possible reality” because the belief that humans are inherently evil and are only held back from committing sin and crime by religion and law is the core belief of conservatism. if the world were to end tomorrow, or if everyone were to live as though it would, conservatives believe this would immediately cause religion and law to become worthless and thusly would “expose” this inherent evil in all people. the problem is none of that is true, which causes their whole ideology to collapse around them and make ben look like a complete dingleberry

[@jacobdinman7600]

“Sweet Caroline, good times never seemed so good!” Ben Shapiro: “Firstly, I have no idea who Caroline is. Next, saying that a good time seems good implies that it truly isn’t and that it is actually really bad now. Creating this false sense of happiness is immoral. Let say, hypothetically, I was eating a hamburger and I said ‘this hamburger seems so good’ you would be confused since that implies that it isn’t. This song is a monstrosity that should not be played.”

[@mayuhmetal]

SOMETHING ABOUT THE PHRASE “Let’s say, hypothetically, I was eating a burger” IN BEN SHAPIROS VOICE HAS ME ON THE FLOOR-

[@alwayswatching5545]

This

[@Tyrantlizardking105]

To be fair to imaginary Ben here, Sweet Caroline does make my ears hurt.

[@philiphockenbury6563]

Boston Faithfuls are with you! Fenway will never die!

[@Obscuredinsight]

BUH BUH BUH.......Ok that is the most immoral thing ever

[@Sydney-Casket-Base]

the part when ben shapiro said, "its the anniversary of his *_death_* , so we're gonna make fun of the worst song ever!" REALLY made him sound like a cartoon villain

[@joysomepossum]

Also he clearly doesn't like the Beatles and makes fun of their musical abilities but STILL has to talk shit on Yoko. I wonder why, Ben. Could it be racist misogyny?

[@narwhal3638]

ben shapiro and billy mitchell are my top cartoonish villains that somehow exist in real life

[@michimatsch5862]

Nice Epithet.

[@BubbyBold]

@@joysomepossum to be fair, Yoko Ono is a garbage human being who deserves scorn

[@kimkardashianjong-un6299]

Ben always acts and sounds like a cartoon villain

[@elfin2865]

I am now picturing a child singing I’m a Little Teapot, only for Ben Shapiro to burst into their house, slap them, and scream “NO, YOU’RE NOT!”

[@ThingsStuffington]

Let's say, for the sake of argument, that I'm a little tea pot. Let's say that I'm short and stout. Let's say that this, here, is my handle and this, here, is my spout. Now, given all of that, when I get all steamed up, you would hear me shout right? Would you not, then, tip me over and pour me out?

[@Jelloitsme]

Him saying this monotonously with his hands folded while a child performs this for the family in the living room would also be a hilarious sight... I need to get to sleep

[@AdumbDriver]

I need sleep! Not more paralysis demons😭😭😭😩😩😩

[@mr_sanchez]

"Imagine people don't care about their kids future. What a world would that be?" *proceeds to deny climate change and to discriminate Muslims and Trans Kids* Yeah Ben, IMAGINE.

[@Yoma_all]

Ben dosent have the ability to imagine , thats why he cant put him self in the place of trans people !

[@meowcat280]

Yea as long as only his kids are ok. Not tHeM daMn tRaNS kIDs

[@angelelelelalalalalelae]

@@meowcat280 his kids start drowning because he told them to just move if the rising sea levels destroy their house but they cant buy a new house at these rates 🥺🥺

[@forbiddenedits]

Trans kids shouldn’t be a thing, but I agree with the rest

[@angelelelelalalalalelae]

@@forbiddenedits u really just HAD to get your two cents in like what do u want a cookie no clue how u found this channel in the first place, if you want to spew anti trans stuff go somewhere else cause this isnt it

[@apocolototh1948]

When debating children is too hard, debate songtexts

[@alexanderwasley5105]

@brmbly He never loses to college students though. He also never loses when debates actual political commentators i.e. Cenk Uygur.

[@rosco3516]

@@alexanderwasley5105 Ben Shapiro is sharp and snappy in a real debate. He's human like the rest of us.

[@alexanderwasley5105]

​@@rosco3516 are you agreeing with me?

[@rosco3516]

@@alexanderwasley5105 50/50. I'm acknowledging that Ben doesn't always pick the best thing to argue against because he is a very literal person. You could talk over Ben Shapiro's head if you speak Jive or Hippie.

[@Silverwind87]

@@alexanderwasley5105 Andrew Neil

[@TheVivaciousNerd]

Usually Ben is pretty good at employing the rhetoric and aesthetics of someone winning an argument, but this clip just makes you realize how crucial a timid college student is to that little song and dance. When there's no actual "SJW" for him to humiliate, no one to interrupt triumphantly, no way to trip Lennon up and strike when he fumbles... When it's just Ben vs a concept, it really illuminates how terrible Ben is at constructing a real intellectual argument.

[@ThineBreadKing]

*YES*

[@whosaidthat84]

So true. He loves picking on inexperienced college students. He knows what kinds of questions they'll ask and prepares very well for them. That's like any grown adult debating a high school student on how best to manage money.

[@TheArtis4n]

Its funny cuz he's feeling superior over a dead musician.... A dead.... Musician. He literally has nothing against John, like.... At all, compared to him.

[@nate-bc9zw]

So the trick to debating him would be to pose these big conceptual questions. Like for Medicare for all you could say “Should your life depend on how much money you make?” You can’t really argue with morality.

[@commbir5148]

This KZbin comment could be the most thorough explanation of Ben Shapiro that I’ve heard.

[@eastull]

I can't stop imagining a shot of John Lennon playing Imagine in that big beautiful house, then the camera shifting focus to reveal Ben Shapiro just standing outside the window pacing back and forth making his snide comments on the song, and the image is making me lose my shit

[@lasagna312]

I think the image is even funnier if you imagine Ben Shapiro tapping on the window trying to get John Lennon's attention

[@educprof2160]

"you are destroying the word, you hear me? you fucking commi, YOU ARE DESTROYING THE WEST"

[@anfearaerach]

John would have a field day with him haha he'd love using his sarcasm against Ben

[@goingfargettingnowhere]

Just imagining John and the rest of the Beatles being as sarcastic with Benny boy as they were in their interviews brings a smile on my face.

[@MahaHMA]

"let me in let me innnnnnn"

[@oxymoron02]

"The idea of owning what you produce..." - Ben Shapiro, literally describing a facet of Communism while also trying to debunk the ideology of Communism.

[@fibbintiggins2858]

Yeah I did a double take, definitely caught me of guard haha

[@Roozyj]

Hm, kind of. I feel like liberalism was a reaction to feudalism, when people wanted to own what they produced. Then some people employed other people to produce things and Marxism was like 'yeah, the way that plays out isn't fair' and communism built on that. So owning what you produce is a liberalist idea I think, but it didn't work that way

[@mattblack118]

Communism doesn't need debunking. It's been debunked at the cost of tens of millions of lives everywhere it's been tried. The slaves in Soviet Russia or Moaist China didn't get to own what they produced.

[@jbragg33]

@@Roozyj Liberalism is the basis of the enlightenment (Rousseau), causing the feodalist system to end in the Revolution by the bourgeoisie of the time. After that, the bourgeoisie becomes the dominant class in society, and the oppressor of the lower classes via a capitalist system. Marxism is developed in the 1840s, and is a form of liberalism. It is against the idea of being exploited by hierarchy in the mode of production, even if it doesn't really go against hierarchy (anarchism does go against it, Marxism does not). It is owning the product of your labor, and avoiding that product being stolen by capitalistic exploitation. It is a form of liberalism in the philosophical sense, that just means emancipation of the individual. In capitalism the bourgeoisie that occupies the managing positions in private companies STEAL from the worker what is produced in his work, that is called the "plus-value". This is how the boss gets richer.

[@Strogman25]

Is it? It's an aspect of socialism, for sure. But of course if communism has no possessions, then you wouldn't own what you produce. Maybe it's just an aspect of some forms of communism? Idk

[@fionatastic0.070]

Ben Sharpie: Imagine is dumb Also Ben Snickeroo in every argument: Let’s say, let’s imagine for a moment, hypothetically

[@plasmaballin]

That was actually what I thought this video was going to be about originally.

[@missmorbid1439]

Joseph Noonan Same, honestly.

[@grendelum]

Nice one mate 😉

[@michaelmitchell6089]

at least he actually tackles those kinds of arguments when he's presented like them.

[@spindoctor358]

@@michaelmitchell6089 he's usually tackling absurd absolute worst scenarios that he just assumes the opposing side is advocating for.

[@brooke-qk7fg]

john lennon: imagin- ben shapiro: is this a personal attack?

[@callahanhanson5890]

brooke Shapiro never mentioned personal attack in this well-devised debunking of a poisonous ideology

[@brooke-qk7fg]

@@callahanhanson5890 “well-devised debunking of a poisonous ideology” lmao ok boomer

[@callahanhanson5890]

brooke strong counter argument.🧐

[@enyafeckenham5730]

@@callahanhanson5890 ...okay boomer!

[@regalrayquaza7609]

I like that Shapiro interrupts him before Lennon could pronounce the silent e.

[@BrokenCurtain]

Ben Shapiro: how to argue with a dead man and still lose.

[@justynawisniewska1213]

And a dead man being a hippie singer

[@djhowell5273]

@@justynawisniewska1213 he really can't set the bar much lower for his own failures and short comings 😂😂

[@djhowell5273]

@@justynawisniewska1213 esp after his Wap take 😂😂

[@kurisu7885]

Shapiro definitely is the type to pick fights with the dearly departed.

[@emilynelson1969]

EZ CLAP

[@wriggleby]

I just can't get over the petty little "that's so childish", immediately followed by a much louder "you may say I'm a dreamer". Genuine comedic gold.

[@miranda0298]

for someone whose whole persona is based around the quote “facts don’t care about your feelings”, Ben sure creates arguments based around his thoughts and feelings...

[@thebrutusmars]

“What? What about torturing a kid? What about killing a hundred million people? Huh? Huh? What about that?”

[@miranda0298]

Brutus Mars i read that in his voice and now i’m irritated, thanks a lot for that haha

[@alexanderwasley5105]

When he debates politics; he provides factual evidence to back his feelings.

[@alicerussell310]

@@alexanderwasley5105No he literally doesn't. Take for example the clip where he writes "morons" on the blackboard. His argument against their chant of "shame" is that the bad guys in a popular TV show would also do this. While this is, in the loosest sense, a fact, it is clearly employed in the logically fallacious argument claiming that because one group of (fictional, mind you) people perform an action in one context and it can be arguably considered wrong that said action is then wrong in a completely different context. Now, one may make excuses for why it doesn't matter about something like this, but Ben's arguments are riddled with abuses of logical fallacy to make facts agree with his feelings rather than to extrapolate the most logical position from a set of facts. It should be clear to anyone with a course in elementary logic that this man is a political grifter abusing a niche in the market rather than a substantive commentator.

[@alexanderwasley5105]

@@alicerussell310 Do you watch his debates? Picking one example from thousands of his statements does not make them all false. The statement you've made, that somehow every debate, every statement Ben has ever made is invalid is so easy to disprove. In his debate against Cenk Uygur, don't you think Cenk would've stopped Ben and addressed the fallacies if they were presented? Yes, yes he would've but he didn't because they simply didn't exist.

[@Dank_Engine]

“This is the most selfish morality possible...” He came so close to self-awareness.

[@dinosaysrawr]

If you're living for today, it has to be for the purpose of hoarding money and property, or else you're a dirty, immoral hippie.

[@midnite1112]

@@dinosaysrawr It's funny because I took that line more as " think of all the people who are trapped, living hand to mouth, living for today" I guess music is weird like that.

[@tiagodarkpeasant]

@@midnite1112 even before i could speak english i understood that as, live a good life, because thats is the only life you have, also some religious people dont care about the poor, because if the poor people are "good" they go to the heaven and their current surfering is meaningless

[@punman5392]

T ZB Lennon means living for your life, not living for some afterlife

[@akorn9943]

Okay but like how much does it say about Ben as a person that he interprets “living for today” as child neglect, murder, and sexual assault?

[@neilpemberton5523]

It's just reactionary conservative paranoia. People like Ben epitomise anal retentive behaviour traits. You can hear it in his rapid fire whiny voice and his need to dominate the discourse.

[@randibgood]

It says a fuckton.

[@skootties]

fr imagine the first guy to come up with religion trying to explain it to people "you know how you want to constantly rape and murder all day? what if there was a man in the sky that burns you for eternity if you did that stuff? that would make you think twice huh?"

[@ND-nr6mx]

When all you know is consequences from an invisible authority, it's hard to imagine people just *wanting* to not be hateful a**holes for goodness' sake

[@johnpatterson4816]

Oh Good Lord!!First of all John Lennnon wrote and recorded "Imagine" 14 years before Shapiro was even thought of!! Secondly,Lennon wasn't promoting Communism or SOCIALISM. He was dreaming of a nice pie in the sky Kinda world. Ironically Lennon was very wealthy when he was murdered!! Now the problem with pie in the sky is that while it sounds good on paper. On paper sure we'll share and share alike and at the end of the day we'll all hold hands;form a circle and sing "Bang Bang Lulu" or "Mary Had a Steamboat".! Problem is that people want stuff even in a classless society!! Ironically. Benny was born in 1984 during the Reagan presidency which pretty much opened up the floodgates for corporate greed.

[@lilypaigeham]

Ben Shapiro is the only man to lose a debate to a literal dead man

[@sathira_anuk5179]

Lamo 😂

[@wft15]

You should watch Michael Knowles “debunks” Hitchens. Another daily wire goon that lost to a dead man. 😂

[@Jekyllstein_Gray]

The idea that humans were just farting around until Aristotle invented the west is... something.

[@ThingsStuffington]

I mean, humans are still just farting around, really.

[@dianas6800]

I’m farting right now!

[@TheArtis4n]

We all fart around

[@artistfloor9]

I fart, therefore I am.

[@l.pietrobon3925]

i be poobing and fartin

[@alexanderstanfield5845]

Imagine there's no Shapiro. It's easy if you try.

[@doddermodd]

I see the appeal.

[@lorianabanana6066]

I feel like he is my idea of Hell, so I can get rid of both in one swoop!!

[@zayatamburelli5322]

Sounds like heaven

[@CollinMcLean]

I do it all the time... most of the time I even forget there is a Ben Shapiro...

[@calvin2913]

Hearing Ben call the whole thing so childish right before the line "You may say I'm a dreamer" feels pretty damn poetic lol.

[@resm-oe9ji]

There are few things sadder than being owned by a dead man.

[@alexpetrie2327]

I've been a bitter musician. Someone you think is terrible gets popular while your talent is ignored, and it hurts. Ben can play the classical violin pretty well and he hates the fact an untrained musician is celebrated, but it's something you have to grow out of. The idea that someone like Jimi Hendrix was a terrible musician because he couldn't read the little dots on the lines is just idiotic.

[@thadjarvis9514]

This is pretty funny how true it actually is. I'd say even being able to play isn't even the mark of a musician but the ability to create. Playing other people's songs on an instrument is just monkey see monkey do.

[@mammoneymelon]

ben when he finds out music is one of the oldest forms of human expression and literally anyone can make it

[@albums8825]

Exactly. Besides, John Lennon (according to his own words) was not a celebrated guitarist or pianist, but a celebrated COMPOSER. He was great at COMING UP with ideas. Talents in music vary in that way. So it's not even worth it to be jealous about it if you don't even attempt to compose.

[@sathira_anuk5179]

​@@albums8825 Specially John's Lyrics, I Just listen to" In my life" , that's maybe my favorite song by the Beatles or any artist

[@kravvall4869]

"If you live today, you are going to kill your opponents immediately" - That says way more about Shapiros' fragile state of mind, than it says about Lennon. If the prospect of a future for yourself is the only thing keeping you from killing your opponents, you have a lack of basic human decency and empathy.

[@inconvenientfacts58]

What did we expect though from a pseudo intellectual hypocrite who preaches Christianity while threatening gun violence on those who advocates scientific education?

[@theoneonyoutube4925]

True.

[@alexanderwasley5105]

@@inconvenientfacts58 Pseudo-Intellectuals don't graduate Harvard Law with honors. And he's Jewish by the way.

[@alexanderwasley5105]

@@inconvenientfacts58 When did he threaten gun violence?

[@noahkarpinski1824]

@@alexanderwasley5105 "Psuedo intellectuals don't graduate from Harvard" Counterpoint: The person you're actually talking about. Ben Shipero is living proof that you can be really good in school and still be a a complete moron.

[@Jekyllstein_Gray]

"the idea of labor, the idea of owning what you produce." Are you saying the workers should own the fruits of their labor as opposed to giving it to the lazy capitalists, Comrade Shapiro?

[@TheArtis4n]

A capitalist making communist statements.... Wait doesn't he hate communism?

[@smirglepapier531]

Lol,, I was thinking the exact thing. If only he knew Marxist view of labour and possession of said labour🤭

[@rickrolld1367]

Plot Twist: Ben Shapiro is secretly a communist, but he keeps appealing to his stupid fanbase because he needs money.

[@HistoricLife]

Well the owners own the laborers in his mind

[@RC-hv1yx]

That’s hilarious. Ben sounds like he’s advocating for democratization of the means of production... a general socialist tenet. Ben, great idea! Amazon employees should be shareholders in the corporation that they work for!

[@ssstentacled]

Fun Fact: Stevie Wonder isn’t a great musician because he can’t read sheet music

[@nukiradio]

Yiiiiiiikes

[@H_J_Lux]

Neither was Ray Charles

[@ltraina3353]

Brilliant! Ben Shapiro is so full of himself he thinks he is the ultimate judge of what makes a great musician. Yeah, ok. I can read piano music, so with ben’s logic, Stevie wonder is less of a musician than I am. Which is the furthest thing from the truth! Great logic there, Ben

[@basedbattledroid3507]

That's odd, I can read sheet music but I'm a sheetty musician.

[@Rosebud0801]

Paul McCartney can’t either! So by his whacky logic, I’m a better musician because I can read music?

[@rjai5003]

Ben Shapiro: “I find it quite unrealistic that every person in the club was looking at her simply because she was wearing apple bottom jeans and boots with fur”

[@mikeworth62]

"And we have pretentious piano chords" was my favorite Shapiro criticism of Imagine

[@HoJoXo]

I've actually heard the phrase "pretentious liberal chords" a few times now and every single time I'm just blown away. Like, what could the actual possible definition for that combination of words actually be?

[@joannamyers1268]

I loved the response to that by Some More News. "It's C and F, Ben! The chords are C and F! As a musician, you know this!" Seriously, they are the most generic chords of any song. Pretty, but not pretentious.

[@andrewboyko8304]

Joanna Myers dammit you beat me to it

[@joannamyers1268]

@@andrewboyko8304 I'm glad you've seen it too, though. It's the best.

[@rdblk9710]

Yeah I dunno. Western "high" music has been wall to wall pretentious chords for at least two centuries. And Ben can't handle John's little B jazzing up the transitions.

[@entertain7us148]

every line of his argument is debunked by the fact that the song is called 'imagine'. Lennon isn't saying this is how the world is, he's saying 'IMAGINE if the world were this peaceful and utopian. that'd be pretty sweet.'

[@commbir5148]

>every line of his argument is debunked Nah, Ben's argument is doody but not for this reason. His argument with the song was essentially "All of these things you're proposing that we imagine are terrible, they would be terrible if they existed, and you are terrible for saying they should exist." There is no reason for you to point out that they don't exist in the world right now, that wasn't anyone's premise.

[@xp7575]

Ironic that Ben "hypothetically speaking" Shapiro has a hard time imagining hypothetical situations

[@NIHIL_EGO]

@@commbir5148 If that's the case, then he's pretty bad at explaining his ideas.

[@koolevro]

Ben is so weird. He'll mock a song for imagining stuff, yet he loves to start his arguments with "Let's say, hypothetically..."

[@joaopedroauriemo]

Ben Shapiro: “Let’s say, hypothetically... “ John Lennon: “Imagine... “

[@waspoppin4784]

Kool Evro Mashups lets say hypothetically my wife’s a doctor...

[@TheLifeOfMartin]

cos a lot of people he argues with, don't really think things out

[@EXTENDEDWARRANT]

Let’s say, hypothetically, you’ve been a bad girl

[@deanwrubel5730]

@@EXTENDEDWARRANT oh no

[@Laura-vt7jr]

listening to ben being drowned out by the music was so strangely comforting. you’re right, ben, he’s not the only one and im so glad we are your problem.

[@josciety5579]

So according to Shapiro, human history goes “nothing, nothing, nothing, W E S T E R N C I V I L I Z A T I O N “

[@wendyromero78]

Josciety as if the ancient Egyptians weren’t a thing

[@LimeyLassen]

In the beginning, the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. Then England, or something.

[@aegonthedragon7303]

Mesopotamia also wasn’t a thing.

[@Cosmic_God_Particals]

Wow he really knows how to undermind his own god lmfao ya Jesus I believe in!! You didn't do shit!!

[@nukiradio]

Who does he think built the Taj mahal? Monkies?

[@Ivytheherbert]

Ben Shapiro is the type of person that thinks CinemaSins is legitimate and intellectual criticism, rather than a series of nit-picks and one-liners for the purpose of comedy alone.

[@marxist-leninist-protagonist]

@Nobody You Know That's your opinion. Don't state it as if it was a fact. Remember, there are people that think Shapiro is funny. Absolutely subjective. Btw, I hate it too. But that's us.

[@tarielkaroldan4106]

@Nobody You Know sounds like CinemaSins talked shit about one of your fav films so now you're mad at them

[@littlemonztergaming8665]

@@tarielkaroldan4106 Check out one of Shaun's videos about CinemaSins, maybe you'll see where they're coming from.

[@EternalDensity]

Ben Shapiro basically is Cinema Sins. In the worst ways only.

[@a.c.slater7989]

@@littlemonztergaming8665 or Th3 Birdman.

[@grannydearest9129]

Imagine being in an argument with a dead man and losing

[@fredjohnston1701]

Imagine going into an interview with a person who’s on your side and still losing.

[@shadenox8164]

Well if anyone can do it it's Ben. My expectations for him are so low seeing this is exactly what I expect from him.

[@jonathanschweiss316]

It's easy if you try.

[@karlmags4022]

You know, the only thing good about Ben is that he's kinda hot. Still an asshole, still a moron and still a big whiny baby, but compared to other reactionaries he won at least a small prize in the genetic lottery. Good God this is evil 😤😖😖

[@grannydearest9129]

@@jonathanschweiss316 haha my faveorite so far

[@georgewilliamson5667]

its almost as if Ben Shapiro cannot wrap his mind around the fact that the song is not a manifesto on how to get a better world, but is instead a dream of what that better world will look like. In fact, its almost as if, hypothetically, Ben Shapiro is unable to imagine things.

[@TownDarling]

When you played that longer clip near the end of the video, it felt like a scene in a movie where the heroes finally gain the advantage and the villain is desperately attempting to rationalize themself.

[@mlorpf]

Haha, I can definitely picture that in a kids' movie. Only thing missing is him getting covered in slime or some other (relatively non-violent) comeuppance

[@b.parker1740]

Also, how in the world can you convince yourself that you're in the moral right when you go in on the note of "celebrating the anniversary of a prolific musician's/activist's death?" Like, not even Disney villains would be that over-the-top, hand-ringingly despicable.

[@ich3730]

@@mlorpf i was so short of expecting naruto and the ninja of konoha to burst in and tell him about cameradery and friendship before he transformes into a big snake or smth.

[@resm-oe9ji]

@Bruce Parker Well, what can you expect from a guy who manages to somehow make his heroes look like villains in his own novel.

[@blipboigilgamesh7865]

The long awaited sequel to Yellow Submarine

[@GlobusTheGreat]

Ben Shapiro IMAGINES destroying John Lennon while feebly whimpering at the majesty of music.

[@Barbarian.Streisand]

you know hes a world class violinist and his sister is an opera singer, right?

[@kylestyyle987]

Matt Vickner How good of a player he is is kind of irrelevant. The vast majority of musicians would laugh at someone making the claims Ben does about music (genres without melody aren’t real music, etc)

[@Szriko]

@@Barbarian.Streisand I have to doubt he's anything more than a hobbyist when he spends all day getting triggered by facts and throwing emotional shitfits no time to practice when you're busy being a simpering fucking loser

[@Barbarian.Streisand]

@@kylestyyle987 youre entitled to your opinion. as is he.

[@JeremiahContent]

Matt Vickner “you know hes a world class violinist” I guess that’s why he’s known for his music then

[@butterspread]

“It is literally impossible for Olive Garden to serve bottomless breadsticks” - Ben Shabebo

[@midnightmadness6344]

Olive Garden asked me to leave after consuming 10 baskets of bread, literally 1894.

[@midnightmadness6344]

@@gabbls_ it totally did. After being asked to leave I told them the pass phrase “All of your gardens are belong to me”, then everybody clapped and I was given the restaurant where I’m still eating the bottomless breadsticks.

[@FREAKOFNATURE-mb8oo]

No, but I'm sure he's a bottomless man -me

[@marquaad]

How can you think this is false lol, and on top of that it's a harmless statement.

[@chimp4225]

@@gabbls_ you are soooooo ignorant omg. This happened so much, I was there at the Olive Garden and I saw it. I clapped the hardest

[@acenutella1196]

As someone who is deeply invested in music theory, the elitist arguments about music theory almost always come from people who don't make music. Music theory is an ATEMPT for people to map and explain why music works. Music theory is incredibly incomplete. Its a great tool don't get me wrong but no one needs to understand music to write it. Music is created and ALWAYS the theory of why it works follows. The existence of jazz defied what we previously understood about music. So then music theory had to update it's understanding and definition so jazz could be music. Ben Shapiro doesn't understand anything about music.

[@originoflogos]

I think Shapiro forgot the song is called “Imagine”. In that, the song is about imagining the peaceful world. In that, Lennon KNOWS it’s unattainable. So, Shapiro totally doesn’t understand metaphor. Okay.

[@sjs9698]

it's possibly unattainable now... but... the change of perspectives we need can be triggered, as a last snowflake can trigger an avalanche, by something as small as a few people imagining a better world. we can make this world into pretty much whatever we want. physics & whatever our nature really is (i suggest it's primariliy adapability) define limits, but afaik we are quite unclear on what those really are. my question is: what do we dare to want?

[@dante_02]

@@sjs9698 we have reached a point in which most of the world is a established society, which means that we are in the perfect period to experiment. Hell, the Nordic countries mix classic economical liberalism with a quite big state, and they are doing great

[@en5788]

But that is the problem with liberals. Its all about an unattainable utopia. There is no basis in reality. Then they try to apply it to reality and are surprised by the unintended consequences. The end result is worse than just dealing with reality in the first place.

[@mayaprice669]

@@en5788 you're close, but not quite.

[@oxfordcommaisthegreatest]

@@en5788 Hold up I saw your reply on another comment Hmmm 🧐🧐

[@ramywiles]

"You need to be able to read music to be a great musician" *the entirety of the Irish trad music scene has entered the chat*

[@MahaHMA]

+elvis presely Michael jackson Eric clapton many great musicians couldn't read music. he only applies that to the beatles because a dead man pissed him off

[@tomski120]

@@MahaHMA those epic failures the Bee Gees couldnt was music either

[@T1CHE14]

Jimmi hendrix also

[@ClannCholmain]

Good catch. Greetings from Kerry!

[@torrent8446]

@@T1CHE14 Jimi Hendrix, of course

[@mootmuse]

“John Lennon post-humously owning Ben Shapiro” Is a great quote

[@angrym0nkeysh0w]

John Lennon: "Let's say, hypothetically, for the sake of the argument, that there are no countries or religion" Ben Shapiro: "you lost me there, buddy"

[@punman5392]

Ben Shapiro: “Call me an elitist” Me: “You’re an elitist”

[@Elvalley]

I don't know what he would expect for making such a broad, shallow statement. "Call me an elitist"? Why wait? Call yourself an elitist and be done with the charade.

[@temtempo13]

@@Elvalley "Call me an elitist" = "I'm about to create an arbitrary reason for entirely discrediting someone else's experience, reasoning and skill and I need to pre-emptively label any pushback against that as unimportant."

[@rhiannonlove6887]

Matt Bowen DESTROYS Ben Shapiro

[@dumbdoodoohead3911]

Dude. You just SLAUGHTERED the right wing.

[@andrewmcnamara6978]

Gottem

[@dissonanceparadiddle]

If you're nitpicking an old song like it's an argument to be won it's like yelling at a painting

[@aralornwolf3140]

Um... yelling "Dry Faster! Damn it!" doesn't make the painting dry faster? ... My life is crushed.

[@datachu]

It's obviously just made to be KZbin clickbait and 10 minutes long so he can put ads on it. Not really a big deal. Hey wait a minute, that's what this video is too! Crap I've been bamboozled.

[@Taumpy]

you mean I shouldn't have screamed back at the scream that one time?

[@mytmouse57]

I enjoy screaming at the Mona Lisa.

[@blixer8384]

I can imagine Ben Shapiro yelling at a painting of Lenin for 40 minutes

[@skringli]

Using "the idea of owning what you produce" to argue FOR capitalism is truly ridiculous

[@Eltiburonmma]

Ben Shapiro is a closeted commie! lol

[@lordcoltrane5630]

I had to do an enormous double take when he said that

[@commbir5148]

It was a breathtaking choice of wording for our friend Ben to use.

[@originalhgc]

Makes sense if the people who sell you their labor are mechanical and not human.

[@ralphhugogarcia6133]

@@commbir5148 For our "Comrade". Checked that spelling for you.

[@cindywells9119]

Love this quote, and it’s quite pertinent: “The modern conservative is engaged in one of man’s oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” John Kenneth Galbraith

[@mythical_dreams613]

👏👏👏

[@birdiejett3163]

Using a critique of John Lenon’s “Imagine” to try and dismantle Communism is like using a Veggie Tales song as a platform to debunk Christianity.

[@nukiradio]

😐🤔😑🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@52flyingbicycles]

Veggietales is lit 🔥 some of my fav songs

[@NimhLabs]

... isn't that AmazingAtheist or MundaneMatt's shtick?

[@plaguedoctorjamespainshe6009]

Wait, veggie tales isn't the origin of christianity !?

[@thegreatBarbossa]

@@plaguedoctorjamespainshe6009 yes it is

[@noellethomas2589]

I love how Ben chooses to hate Lennon because he was mildly leftist instead of hating him for the fights he got into, drug use, domestic abuse, etc (I’m not saying drug use is bad, but according to Shabeebo it is)

[@Mongo42089]

Right? There's plenty to hate on John for but instead he chooses one of the more wholesome moments of his career and decides to partisan up the place.

[@commbir5148]

Lennon was more than 'mildly' leftist, he was a radical. As well as all the shitty things you listed. But let's at least be honest about what's being criticized here. Lennon didn't put forward the vision of a society with modest public spending on a social safety net, he asked us to imagine a utopian communist society. Edit: Just want to be clear, I am all for this utopian communist society, and against Ben. Only commenting because I thought characterizing Lennon as mildly leftist smacked of revisionism.

[@no0412]

wasn't lennon an anti-communist as well?

[@neilpemberton5523]

@@commbir5148 I profoundly disagree. Sure, he went through a radical phase, but I would argue that he was very unhappy throughout, because the insane level of fame he achieved as a Beatle was not what he signed up for. His relationship with Yoko was key. She had a certain level of control over him for a long time. But he abused her in those years as well. It took their 18 month 'lost weekend' separation in the early 70s to get to the stage where their marriage became mutually beneficial. His radicalism was linked to guilt issues. He only became 'radical' after meeting Yoko. I'm not Yoko bashing. Eventually they made each other happy and were great parents to Sean. He was undoubtedly most happy as an adult after he realised he had the freedom to step back from the spotlight. There is no social or political commentary in songs on Double Fantasy. He was past all that.

[@drdeadbeat1604]

Because it's a political discussion not a personal one

[@Isaiah99002]

Ben was the kid in school who reminded the teacher that there was homework

[@edienandy]

Ily Void he would totally do like that 😒

[@inconvenientfacts58]

Ben was the kid in school who never did his homework, and then blamed the teacher for being an elitist liberal for failing him.

[@JOfnT]

I know it’s a dead meme, but Ben Shapiro is the real life version of that Yellow Shirt Kid from the Polar Express.

[@DanTarrant1]

Or you could say that Ben is a guy who has been told how smart he is his entire life, to the point where he has come to believe that any thought that comes to his mind must be a really smart one. Because otherwise, he wouldn't have thought it.

[@imakedamoney420smokeweed]

@@inconvenientfacts58 "I didn't fail to learn, you failed to educate *SNIVEL*"

[@alostlonewolf]

"IMAGINE there's nothing to kill or die for." Ben, "oh so you think there's nothing worth dying for?"

[@illhaveawtrplz]

Ben Shapiro: The Weird Little King of Red Herrings and Strawmen

[@CheapResistance]

"and the incentive that you own what you produce" So.. owning the means of production? Like in communism? I think Ben might've just made a pro communist argument.

[@hektivity6410]

r/accidentallycommunist

[@chickenfox6272]

ben shapiro is a commie cancel him

[@waspoppin4784]

InhumanBeings Ben is now cancelled and his wife isn’t a doctor anymore

[@yea4253]

As you may realise if you engage a lot with people about communism and socialism, is that the vast majority would be commies if they simply understood the core principles of it and weren't horrible misguided by bourgeois propaganda

[@_drnova1064]

@@yea4253 Well, 'commies' in the average american's eyes. The point John is arguing in Imagine is still way off from what a hardcore marxist would define communism to be.

[@TindraSan]

John Lennon: "We should improve society somewhat." Benny Sharpie: "And yet you participate in society. Curious! I am very intelligent."

[@somedudeok1451]

To be fair, Lennon is not talking about improving it _somewhat._ He's talking about a revolution in how we organize our economy and frame our identity. A thing that we have to do or slide yet again into fascism btw.

[@jubisisters]

@@somedudeok1451 No, Lennon is talking about IMAGINING if it was different. He's provoking thought here, not action. Not that I disagree about the validity of the conclusion. Just that that's putting words in Lennon's mouth.

[@somedudeok1451]

@@jubisisters When Mlk said he had a dream, he was also calling to action.

[@dominickperez2952]

John Lennon: This says alot about our society Ben Shapiro: And yet we live in one

[@biggsydaboss3410]

Is that truly your take on John Lennon's Imagine? It's an appeal to a utopian vision. The problem is when we seek to plenty Utopia we have always come out with the exact opposite. This is true irrespective of which side of the political isle you stand on. An An-Caps view of Utopia is something I find quite fear inducing. Same with a Socialist/Communist take on it.

[@malinm1615]

"We'd be hunters and gatherers or nomads, with no history" My inner archaeologist: AAAAAAAAAAAAAH

[@jeyyran]

also didn't agriculturists emigrating from mesopotamia play a role in the spreading agriculture in europe (the great western civilization), too?

[@malinm1615]

Yes. But interestingly, farming cultures developed independently on Papua New Guinea as well (about my first answer, I thought this was another, more sarcastic thread, so sorry about that ^^)

[@andrewg3196]

Also the idea of private property rights as it's known now didn't come into being until like, the 1600s. And then when you think about the Enclosure movement, what he says is even stupider. Before those private property ideas, many people in the west owned what they produced, even though they produced on shared land. i.e. the means of production was shared (the land). gooood loooorrrddd

[@graysonnobles7472]

me as fuck

[@isabelakopp78]

you know plato was right, writing was a mistake because writing created ben shapiro.

[@heybatterbatter]

Lmao the fact that Shapiro somehow pushed me into liking this song and finding it inspirational in a way I haven’t

[@kcapkcans]

my favourite part is where Ben Shapiro admits that his kids are an investment rather than enjoying their existence

[@hans-gerhardt-uwe-jochenhe3324]

Everything is an investment if you think that all should revolve around economic growth

[@gonnacry442]

@@hans-gerhardt-uwe-jochenhe3324 faccs

[@lucamp1]

@@hans-gerhardt-uwe-jochenhe3324 *sigma mindset music plays*

[@ProgressOnly]

My parents thought the same thing. Turns out I was a bad investment

[@georgelaboogar3106]

They can both be true simultaneously.

[@ChrisTian-rm7zm]

I have always considered "Imagine" incredibly cheesy. But Ben Shapiro finally makes me love this song.

[@cheshtasagar8498]

Was looking for this exact comment.

[@pizzahuthonoka]

Ben's like that one kid in class who thought he was special for being conservative, but he's never outgrown it.

[@jmiquelmb]

He’s the epitome of people who think conservative is a personality, and use it to define themselves. Like teens who think being from a fan base is a personality, but even cringier

[@zunlise2341]

@@jmiquelmb"I am a Herman Hoppe stan"

[@_Fuu_]

can i order pizza from pizza honk

[@gracelewis4016]

I was that person at one point. I like to think I've outgrown it. I often cringe at my younger self.

[@embop1266]

as a commie with a conservative mom, they think that they’re special and that they’re in the minority. THEY’RE the ones being oppressed and censored. he’s not the only one lol

[@longingmeow]

that clip of his video is genuinely some of the most moving art. it accomplishes the exact opposite of what he wants, and it’s incredible

[@amagicallaura]

yessss it's like a perfect encapsulation of what i love about art. the way ben plays it in complete sincerity & never realises what he's doing. just beautiful

[@shascircus]

"-Imagine no possession- -he says while sitting in his giant house" Ben really pulled a "-Hey society has problems, we'd have to fix that -Yet you partake in society! Haha, I am very intelligent"

[@dr.vanilla9017]

To be fair, the house is empty, excluding the piano.

[@ludwigwinter6795]

Singing about "sharing all the wealth" while owning literally hundreds of millions of dollars seems somewhat hypocritical to me

[@wconniff878]

@@ludwigwinter6795 I must have missed the verse where he sings that

[@ludwigwinter6795]

@@wconniff878 Ok, he sang "sharing all the world" so I misremembered the lyrics. Still the same meaning though, more or less.

[@naomiea.naomie6665]

​@@ludwigwinter6795 to be fair John Lennon is an extremely flawed man, there is so much irony in hearing him spread messages of peace when he has a history of emotional and physical abuse + has taken very little actual political action in his life. Though the song imagine is good and has interesting points, a lot of people could argue he only made it to become successful with "hippies", to be accepted and included in the movement.. to be one of its leaders. Lennon was a perfect example of "do as I say, not as I do"

[@jonnym4236]

John Lennon: "Imagine if we did better as a society" Ben Shapiro: "NO! Do NOT use your imagination! STOP THINKING YOU ARE GOING TO DISRUPT ALL OF WESTERN CIVILIZATION!!!!"

[@vinceknox4425]

Curious Soul That’s not how arguments work, walnut.

[@elan825]

@@curioussoul6059 It's not a misquote, it's summing up what he's saying in a humorous fictional dialogue. And to show direct speech, you use quotation marks. Are you new to the internet? Or writing? Or speech?

[@juliusc.8]

@@curioussoul6059 Conservatives have no sense of humor because they have no imagination funnily enough.

[@Chopstewie]

"green is not a creative color!"

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

There is not caring much for a song... And then there is doing what shitiro is doing which is letting the world know how much of a stupid asshole you are and how you think about killing yourself all of the time because you clearly hate what you have become lol. Feel kind of bad for the guy honestly... Must suck to be that angry all of the time. Even if a lot of it is fake anger... You know damn well it's become who he is... Pure hate. And massive stupidity of course lol. Let's not forget about the stupidity lololol.

[@radlad6435]

"the idea of owning what *you* produce" That sounds great, I wonder what it's called?

[@launebar5262]

Haha, good one!

[@needthistool]

I was thinking this the whole time. ... Whatever it's called, it's definitely not Capitalism.

[@adamcortright3445]

"The wealth of those societies in which the capitalist mode of production prevails, presents itself as 'an immense accumulation of commodities,' its unit being a single commodity."

[@DragoonBoom]

Don't you get it, if you own your workers, then what your workers produce is your property. That's why socialism and human rights are bad, it directly impacts your ability to own people. /s

[@biggsydaboss3410]

@@DragoonBoom What a terrible take. You pay your workers for their work. You don't own them. They are free to leave the job at any time & many do. I know someone who intensely hates their job. They are looking for another one, but still works at the one they hate to pay the bills. I support her as best I can emotionally to get passed this point in her life.

[@veenou6047]

My high school chorus teacher sung Imagine at one of our concerts a couple years ago, and then got in trouble because some parents complained and said that the song was "against Christianity" and therefore it was discrimination to sing it Nothing ever really came of it, but it was just very frustrating and dumb

[@grey_f98]

Lennon said "imagine a world with no possession", not "throw away all your possession in the current capitalist world where you will die if you don't have any"

[@airplanes_aren.t_real]

My blood boils whenever someone like that says something in the lines of "Well if you hate capitalism so much why don't you stop participating on it?" Or "well then why don't you just go to ?"

[@franchipalavecino1765]

@@airplanes_aren.t_real Ha ha, tipical socialist, blaming the capitalism for his mistakes.

[@airplanes_aren.t_real]

@@franchipalavecino1765 is that your entire argument or...?

[@mfsevin]

It's hilarious, Ben Shapiro comments on that followed by Lennon saying "I wonder if you can" almost acknowledging that exact line of criticism.

[@ronakbhadra6400]

And you know who asked to give away all possessions? Ironically it's Jesus whom these people believe to be God...the truth is if Jesus were present today, these people would abuse him calling him a "commie"...🤣

[@evanhagerth4501]

The fact that he's basically arguing the concept of imagination kinda says everything you need to know about Boing Shpoingo

[@trashmammal9203]

That's the most immoral thing you could possibly say

[@yellobanana6456]

I think you got his name wrong, it’s actually Bong Sharpies

[@nbewarwe]

"Let's say, hypothetically, that the ocean levels rise, what, five feet? You don't think that people will just sell their houses and move?" -Ben Shapiro, real quote.

[@creativepseudonym9872]

"Just one small problem! Sell their houses to who, Ben? Fucking Aquaman?!" -Harris Bomberguy. I'm sorry.

[@unlimited8410]

I doubt he'd think it'd be significant since the sea levels will only rise up about his height, (which isn't very much)

[@peterdafox]

Fucking Aquaman

[@creativepseudonym9872]

@edgar allan hoe I couldn't resist saying it.

[@prageruwu69]

SELL THEIR HOUSES TO WHO BEN *FUCKING A Q U A M A N*

[@elihilbert1258]

Bestie really said “I’m pro greed and pro hunger” with his whole chest

[@giantpinkcat]

"Imagine Dragons is stupid! You can't just imagine a mythical creature!" - Ben Shapiro (Probably)

[@mni2421]

"Imagine Dragons is stupid! You can't just imagine a mythical creature!" - Ben Shapiro (Probably): while also believing in a mythical sky daddy.

[@Yes_this_is_my_cat]

@@mni2421 a sky daddy💀 I guess they all are

[@charlieandhisantics9954]

Imagine what would happen if he met a fantasy author.

[@albums8825]

@@charlieandhisantics9954 I wonder if I can.

[@erichendel559]

"John Lennon destroys Ben Shapiro with notes, and chord progression."

[@Ayoayoayoayoayoayoa]

Ben admitting if he could do whatever he wanted with a day he would screw everything and kill all his enemies. Id probably smoke some weed and play videogames but each to their own i guess

[@DrCooch]

So is that something you do on a regular day off or not ?

[@nIhIl34]

@@DrCooch lmao probably

[@jmiquelmb]

Wrong. What he would do is let AOC step on his face

[@catross3713]

Exactly right! He's implying that he sucks and wants to kill and be debased really.

[@stephfromearth]

I liked your comment because I liked your comment .. and also to get the likes to 420

[@danmarshall5895]

Here's the thing about the "living for today" bit, it tells you that the only thing standing between little Ben and mass murder is the existence of consequences.

[@francesco4055]

Well yeah that's literally the basisi of judeo christian "morality" if you would call it that

[@michellebrowne9100]

I can't remember who said that Ben Shapiro sounds like everything he's commenting on is coming out of the locker he's been jammed in, but I can't unhear it, and it makes me giggle compulsively.

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

you sound like a bully when you say that, then again you are laughing at the imagined pain of someone else who may possibly have different political opinions then you, so perhaps you are just sadistic...

[@michellebrowne9100]

@@matthiuskoenig3378 I mean given that Shapiro makes more money than both of us do in ten years, I'm sure that if he ever reads my comment, he can afford therapy. I have sympathy for people with different political opinions, but not white supremacist climate deniers who hate the poor.

[@katekursive1370]

HI DUNGEON MOM

[@corthofler6749]

Lord Solar Matthius ...??? WHAAA ??? There's NO CRYING in political discourse ! There's NO CRYING in political discourse !

[@snowghost9800]

This video made me wanna ask: Who hurt Ben? Why wasn't he taught Agriculture?

[@marcingolab6227]

This video made me wanna ask: Why tf is Ben Shapiro? But I already know the answer to that one.

[@tobbleboii5988]

as far as i'm aware his father was intensly deoressed or scizophrenic, so that explains alot actually

[@uselessDM]

Well, he isn't completely wrong in saying this because agriculture and the idea of owning land instead of living a nomadic lifestyle go hand in hand, but he puts the cart before the horse I suppose and really distorts his own argument.

[@Gherkinspiel]

and does he realize communism and socialism are part of western civilization? like that's where it started....

[@Gherkinspiel]

@@tobbleboii5988 lol what? i've scoured the internet and there's nothing on his father besides that he's a composer

[@boopityboopboop]

Ben Shapiro: doesn't know what imagination is because he lacks it

[@boopityboopboop]

also boi can't differentiate between figurative and literal, he really is THAT stupid

[@AnnabellaCarter]

Idk about that. He’s very good at coming up with made up scenarios that fit his stupid arguments.

[@_Somsnosa_]

He believes in an imaginary sky daddy though

[@FrancisR420]

Why use precious cognitive dissonance to expand his Horizons when he's already using so much of it to just maintain his tired arguments.