Biggest "CHEATING" SCANDAL In Chess History

[@GothamChess]

Hi! I'm Levy, welcome to the chess world. If you haven't played, you should - it's quite a fun game. Highly recommend my beginner videos :) This video was recorded the first day the 'drama' happened, so it wasn't as detailed as I wanted. I made an updated, more detailed video of the scandal here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/j5zXiISoo8-Drbc

[@BlueGoat3175]

Yeah Yeah! Chess challenge! If I win I get your soul, if you win I get your soul!

[@mbm.64]

But....                                                                                             

[@Haoyu-xd2om]

Hey 3rd reply pog

[@jonnorth1147]

He needs to be banned for 3 years.

[@Justs99171]

You should stop calling this the biggest cheating scandal in chess history. It's not even top 5.

[@user-td1jj8ll8y]

Fun fact. In a norwegian podcast Magnus talked about cheating (this was a few years ago, so not about this situation). He had a very good point. He said to cheat, you wouldn't even need to be told what move to play. Imagine you simply had a buzzer, e.g. in your shoe, that simply gave a vibration if there was a significant change in the computer evaluation after a move. This way you would immediately know that your opponent made a mistake, and that it would be worth spending time to look for it. It was implied that this very simple piece of information would be significant to turn one of his closest competitors into his superior, i.e. a 50-100 point jump.

[@thedeadbaby]

Why the shoe and not safe inside the butt where no one would look for it except someone like Bobby Fischer who slept with prostitutes?

[@akuseru85]

I had the same thought. Just have buzzers in your shoes. Someone plays the game and sends signals. They could be small like you said, or more in detal, like right shoe buzzer for letters, left shoe for numbers. Then to signal C4 position piece, you do 3X on right, then 4X on left. Then repeat for the move.

[@shoyupacket5572]

that's literally what i was just thinking of, if you and the person communicating had prior language established then yeah it really would be pretty simple. the interesting thing however is who is giving him information and is it based on some engine being run because if not why would they simply not be the one competing in their place.

[@Corteum]

@M That's a nice theory. But it doesnt' work in reality because the scanners they use at these tournaments can detect electronics and radio signals. The buzzer idea would probably work at a club level tournament though.

[@ZzColdzDeathzZ]

@@Corteum but any simple signal of change in status during the match would be critical. That might not be the device but if it was it was bar related forsure.

[@GukGukNinja]

Clearly the engine is inside the pieces, because chess speaks for itself.

[@fromant65]

LMAO GOD COMMENT

[@megagigachad69]

Hilarious

[@timg2655]

BOOM 👏👏👏

[@joshdarius5995]

Yeah cause you didn't play the moves, just moved the pieces. So you could not even explain 1 move LMAO....total Cheater. Would never play in a tournament with this lying, cheating, pos

[@georgeforeman8876]

Where is this “chess speaks for itself” meme from ?

[@davidrobertson2826]

Here’s my take - I’m betting Magnus and his inner circle have had suspicions since the FTX Crypto Cup (possibly before), specifically his game against Hans. The cheating would’ve involved the leak of prep, not computer assistance, which would be nearly impossible to get away with. He decided to test this theory this time by preparing an obscure line he had never played before, and his suspicions were confirmed. He subsequently withdrew from the tournament, not out of saltiness from losing to Hans, but because he now knew with near certainty that there was a leak within this camp (and who’s to say that the leaker hadn’t leaked to others as well?). Everyone is focusing on Hans in all of this, but to me, the drastic reaction by Magnus is more indicative of an ongoing betrayal by someone he trusted rather than just being enraged at having been cheated by Hans. As others have pointed out, if Magnus suspected that Hans had computer assistance then there is no upside to withdrawing as he’d never be able to prove it. The only reason to do so is because he believes there is a continuing possibility of losing to others that have received his prep. Then there is the issue of the post-game interviews. There are a lot of people that I think are dismissing them as having no evidentiary value, but I think there are just too many red flags (of course, none of them rising to the level of “proof”). The attention that has been given to him miscalculating lines when challenged by Alejandro Ramirez I think is misplaced - I think that is much more likely due to him being rattled by feeling the heat of suspicion rather than him being a ~2400 player playing at a 2800 level because of computer assistance. Ironically, the scenario that I think is most likely is that Hans has actually made huge strides in his chess game lately, but was overcome by the temptation of the opportunity to look at Magnus’s prep. The truly damning thing that I think he said (again, not proof, but as close to a smoking gun as you’ll get) was his comment that “by some miracle” he had looked at that exact line before the game by chance. This is something you often see in guilty people - they know that they’re guilty, and because they know that, they think they need to address every possible avenue of questioning as soon as possible to establish their alibi/narrative, when in reality they never needed to even broach the topic as it only looks more suspicious. All the other weird behaviors are probably due to him crumbling under the heat - the accent, the rambling, oversupplying information/providing unprompted justifications, miscalculating lines, etc. But, I think the big takeaway is that from Magnus’s perspective this is not a Hans issue but an issue with his team. Only scenario that I think fits the facts. Hans’ nervous behavior, in combination with the actions that Magnus has taken certainly amounts to a preponderance of evidence for me. The idea that Magnus is just salty about losing to Hans doesn’t have any credibility with me, sure he has an ego, but it doesn’t fit the larger established pattern of his behavior.

[@seedex6730]

By far the best theory I have seen so far.👏

[@TheLastSyphen]

This is a theory I support the most

[@jorgevasseur9084]

Up up up.

[@tesseract2144]

You make sense bro

[@markocantdunk]

Most sensible theory thus far. It's either this or he didn't cheat.

[@Sinrix]

I bet someone cheated by stream sniping to see the other guy’s side of the board, truly a day that will live in infamy

[@DanZhukovin]

Wait, I'm not allowed to look at the other side of the board!?? Oh crap

[@bobzombie2710]

@Tom ikr and kasparov isnt even great.

[@festerbutt]

Magnus should have streamed his game with a 5 minute lag!

[@berryreading4809]

People keep sinking by submarine in 3 GUESSES! Forget about the battleship that always gets hit within the first Salvo... I hate board peeking in chess games!, Original divider was never really large enough, and high profile online games are spammed with opponent's grid coordinates! Chess is no longer fun for me 😔 🚀🚢

[@kittybossatron]

That’s why I play chess on this table with a mirror to see my opponents pieces

[@carlostrujillo4107]

"Beating someone once isn't revenge" has been there for a long time already, i know this coz i follow him

[@pedrommm4742]

Yep.

[@jsteja7127]

Yep. Levy screwed up on that one.

[@Chiny_w_Pigulce]

Pin Levy?

[@Stannoe]

same. i looked at magnus' page a week ago and it was there

[@GothamChess]

Oops. I listened to a KZbin commenter who wrote that. I'll never make that mistake again.

[@nobodynowhere8061]

Magnus is arguably one of if not the best chess player in history. Still he has lost many games. But he’s never made any accusations like this, even when he just got crushed or outplayed. This leads me to believe even if he is wrong he has very reasonable justification to act the way he is

[@thanostopgtv]

Facts

[@KaossTrojan]

Hans has been caught out cheating MANY times. This is probably why.

[@gagogoga]

@@KaossTrojan over the board?

[@gottimw]

@@KaossTrojan Its not just that, for me the biggest tell is all about the post game interview. It felt like someone explaining project they just copied. Thats where lie has shortest legs. Right after the game he could barely elaborate on his choices. He spent hours over the board and can barley recall lines he was evaluating? Claimed a -3 lines to be winning for white. It was bad. Plus massive elo gains, and as you mentioned caught cheating in online events.

[@Epindary]

@@gottimw ur a legit parrot,, shhhh

[@Memphis_ritz]

He may have said this, but my take on this as a non chess player is that the scariest thing about this is the potential that he cheated and nobody knows how. If nobody knows how, how can they prevent it in the future?

[@gottimw]

Life ban is somewhat a deterrent, but the truth is, if magnus were cheating. Say few hints every game - plus he was careful about picking non-engine crazy moves, he would hit 2900 in no time. And nobody would be able to proof anything without outright catching him redhanded.

[@MatichekYoutube]

rumor is that he had a vibrating communicator in his butt ..

[@scoutbane1651]

@@gottimw Nah, bs. You could do a move here or there every once so often, but otherwise they would definitely be able to catch you. There's statistical models you can use for this shit. But they'd need to upload every single game they had, try the engines of that time, compare models etc. etc., with enough statisticians you could definitely catch repeated cheating.

[@gorgeouszan]

Think you're jumping the gun as currently there is no proof he cheated at all. Only thing we know right now is Magnus is implying it may be the case though hasn't said so and people don't like how he handled his interview. Frankly none of that is compelling let alone damning. Until Magnus speaks out about what he thinks happened so that can be investigated this whole thing has as much legitimacy as a witch hunt.

[@MatichekYoutube]

@@gorgeouszan ya. they have to prove it, or say "i am sorry" :)

[@simonplatt5421]

Props to Levi for calling José Mourinho a football manager

[@whypree_tho]

I concur… from London 😃

[@edwardburroughs1489]

Isn't that what he is?

[@hanahomemadepizza1424]

@@edwardburroughs1489 Americans call the sport soccer instead of football

[@davidcopson5800]

@@hanahomemadepizza1424 And the country that invented it should have priority in naming rights.

[@lukesanders7194]

@MassT football ⚽️, american football 🏈

[@robbiebay8868]

I believe that Magnus' prep may have gotten leaked or somehow bugged. Magnus probably left because he could not completely trust the team.

[@ChocolateMilk..]

Agree

[@poppyharlow4448]

It sounds a lot more reasonable than cheating, considering how well scrutinized player screening is these days.

[@jacobcarrizales427]

He’s literally never played that line. It doesn’t make sense to prep against something he’s never played. Hans claimed it was from a game against So in London in 2018. But no one can find the alleged game. His analysis of his game with alireza is a complete joke. Literally painful to watch. A 1500 could do better analysis.

[@SkegAudio]

Continue coping or creating speculation lol

[@danishasif1001]

@@jacobcarrizales427 I read a bit about this and from what I've heard it's very likely that the game does exist but Hans quoted the wrong year

[@abraham7140]

this is a good, levelheaded response from Levy. nearly every twitch streamer i saw today was crucifying Hans and dissecting every little thing he's ever done -- it's an unfortunate situation and it may very well turn out be true, but it's refreshing to see someone just give the facts of the matter and not jump to any attacks or further drama-baiting.

[@patrickalpha1315]

"The facts" would have been the game against Carlsen, not against Firouzja.

[@stephenhalkovic6664]

True, thank you Levy.

[@sqerxfan7828]

wtf GothamChess ist so schlecht geworden, das ist viel besser kzbin.info/www/bejne/eKWlZXmbl7mGpLc

[@KG-or2yb]

@@patrickalpha1315 he covered that game yesterday, why do it again? Also people are dissecting the game against firouzja due to hans' poor post game analysis

[@SirEmperus]

Levy would give a good journalist.

[@sahargenish7058]

Magnus lost before, yet he never made such a commotion. As the greatest chess player of all time, he can recognize patterns that no one else can see. Some of these patters might not add up

[@bryantimothy8616]

I agree. There are a couple times a youngster managed to beat him and he didnt do anything like this. Something mustve happened. Might not be cheating tho.

[@Wesz808]

@@bryantimothy8616 exactly. Maybe there is something wrong with Magnus or in his environment (on which he can not comment). I read this was a 500.000 dollar tournament. If there is so much money to be made I wouldn't be surprised if there were some shitty politics.

[@opkarlsen]

OR Magnus & Hans just did this because they just want more publicity for Chess. :P Magnus pay Hans 1M and he make 3M. We dont know. But Magnus knows how to make money ;)

[@pkmgamer6162]

@@Wesz808 true money= politics shit

[@whyitmatters6906]

So what? We jump in the wagon without evidence? Is something we do now?

[@hardikconilingus6569]

"Beating someone once isn't Revenge" has been his bio for last 2 years.

[@jenskruk7985]

and Hans beat him twice, no? In Miami?

[@soumyaranjan14343]

@@jenskruk7985 He then lost back to back 3 game.Btw it was rapid

[@hardikconilingus6569]

@@jenskruk7985 once in Miami and one now

[@cc2706]

Ok

[@prachimayekar8712]

True

[@howdyman5961]

This is insane. I cant believe I have the privilege to witness this juicy drama live. This is the exact type of content I needed. The chess world is fascinating

[@elbarto4069]

Itsa me hans nieman

[@DT.186]

@@ChildOfGorb how does sending that link help you out ?

[@RadishAcceptable]

@@DT.186 it's spam. Report it.

[@robdubent]

Imagine spending less time on the drama and more time actually trying to play good chess?

[@harunosmanovic]

I got into chess like 10 days ago !!! I lucked the fuck out!!! Hyped!!!

[@sid3645]

Magnus always had beating someone once isnt revenge in his bio

[@Lyrics4y0u]

He obviously wasnt thinking of a duel.

[@khaelkugler]

Yeah Levy responded to another comment about that he made a mistake-- I still think he should cut it out of the video cuz it'll cause more drama

[@fosterdawson7339]

@@khaelkugler nah nah nah, if more people comment on it it'll generate more views and content for the algorithm, which would help his channel ;)

[@kronicjp1122]

“I look at this in a black and white way No pawn intended” -levy

[@DVNJ1]

Just as a side note, the chess courses link in the description leads to a 404 error. I hope you can fix it soon because I'm somewhat interested in buying some and I think others might be as well.

[@zaksmith1035]

Let's get this comment a lot of likes so Gotham will see it.

[@Lego_RL]

Earlier today, Gotham announced in his discord that they're in the middle of switching over to the new courses site! I'm not sure what the improvements are but he said they limited it to just people who previously purchased the caro-kann course so that the site wouldn't crash immediately. I'm sure it'll be up in the near future

[@friyazDO]

From his website’s main page: Purchases are no longer available. We are working on a new website for GothamChess courses! Check back soon for updates.

[@vansh8173]

please check the home page, purchases are no longer available as they are apparently shifting to a new website.

[@AlexKunstar]

Chess courses are a form af cheating and have been banned 🤣

[@AlexDings]

Cheating by getting prep leaked seems much more plausible - and Magnus withdrawing would make more sense too. Because if there was someone in Magnus' team leaking prep, Magnus can't know the other players don't have that, too, so it makes sense not to play them for now. If he thinks Hans was cheating, why would he withdraw from the entire tournament?

[@renato.albuquerque]

Prep leaked is not characterized as cheating. As much as it is immoral, doesn’t translate into a cheating case.

[@randyking9489]

@@renato.albuquerque so true

[@dimasfazlur5926]

lmao, who tf want to leak magnus prep to our white boy hans 🤣🤣🤣

[@mika274]

@@dimasfazlur5926 probably pulled it out of one of his cloud servers

[@iKaiii]

@@renato.albuquerque at the highest level of any sport I’d say it would be considered cheating cuz ur giving them what they would use against u if someone gave the other team in nfl there playcall it would be cheating

[@finnj6]

I think that Magnus may have withdrawn due to a prep leak. As said in the video, I don’t think that Magnus would simply withdraw because he lost the game. In the post game interview, Hans said, “I was so lucky to have prepped this line today.” Not saying this is definitive proof, just a theory.

[@anon8410]

Yup concidence. Out of all the lines he just prepares for this

[@FS4SS]

This - people are jumping on the cheating bandwagon really quickly. It looks to me like the issue is with his prep. An analogy for people who may not understand -- they're playing the card game Go Fish! and Magnus secretly has a Magic: The Gathering card in his hand, and Hans says "Got any MTG cards?" It's so unlikely as to seem impossible, like in that analogy. Magnus is likely thinking that someone on his team leaked prep to Hans - because that's just exactly what it looks like. This coming after the decision not to defend his WC title makes me think it's a disgruntled team member or something...

[@jacobcarrizales427]

He prepped a line in an opening that Magnus had never played, and references a game that doesn’t exist.

[@ChrisChoi123]

why is prep leak an offense? whats legitiamtely wrong with that. both players will be ready for the same line, and then after prep they will have to use their innate chess skills and knowledge to win.

[@lucaschinder3875]

@@ChrisChoi123 this line of thought of yours is so wrong on so many levels it's not even worth it to try explaining it to you 💀 how on earth do you say with a straight face that Hans is better than Magnus at any level of chess 💀

[@victorakinbode1]

This drama speaks for its self!

[@ChildOfGorb]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/pXnKZoaAjrd7d5I

[@elbarto4069]

The cheating speaks for it self

[@davidcopson5800]

But other commentators should help it along.

[@iainfulton3781]

Itself is one word

[@Biditchoun]

The drama can speak for itself, cause it knows what it is

[@adriantarngriffin]

Can the tournament scanners pick up a microreceiver hidden beneath the skin behind one ear? This is not a joke. That is technology now available.

[@pagnedaman3777]

I need some evidence, until then, Hans is innocent imo. As far as cheating, the only thing that sounds plausible to me is if Magnus' prep was leaked. Curious to hear more about this because it seems pretty out of character for Magnus to act this way after a loss.

[@manuelbonelli3690]

That's exactly the point. It's the first time ever Magnus did something like this so there must be something (for example if he found out something himself, or he has been told something) because a simple loss wouldn't make him quit the tournament...even if he was the most pissed off he has ever been

[@version1865]

@@manuelbonelli3690 yeah, but he is not accusing hans of anything anywhere tho. Its all the community thats creating the drama.

[@Soeeasy]

@@version1865 snowflake

[@manuelbonelli3690]

@@version1865 yeah exactly. At the end it's just speculation that can be what Magnus is referring to, but as long as something is said we don't know

[@codisfer]

@@version1865 Because he can't jeopardize being wrong and then being sued for defamation of character. Even though there is a defense Magnus could say Hans is a public figure and defamation doesn't apply it would still be a tough legal battle for both sides.

[@froofycat]

Poker player here. We had the same with Mike Postle. In interviews he couldn't defend his choices. Just had feelings. Was unbeatable. Ultimately a HUGE scandal and a proven cheater. And say what you want about the Botez sisters but I wouldn't even know who Hikaru or Magnus were without them.

[@Crunch630]

yeah, Mike Postle is a perfect analogy.

[@chrisk1180]

Thought of Mike Postle for sure though I'm sure this dude was no where near as blatant if he actually cheated

[@TristanOnGoogle]

There is a difference between poker and chess though. Knowing the hands of other player is a huge advantage, whoever the other players are. But getting a suggestion of a move from a chess engine where Magnus can beat most chess engine, not so big advantage.

[@matthewwilson4972]

@@TristanOnGoogle that’s simply not true. Any decent chess engine would easily beat him 100/100 times. It’s been more than 20 years since this was the case and the gap between human players and engines only widens as time progresses. Currently there is about a 1000 elo difference between Magnus and the strongest chess engines

[@bethanalpha]

> I wouldn't even know who Hikaru or Magnus were without botez well thanks for proving you are a pleb

[@James-dq8us]

Hey Levy. I usually lurk here, but I was absolutely stunned by the antisemitism in your pin of shame today and so wanted to speak up. You do an amazing job, and you've made a positive difference to loads of people. Sorry you have to deal with such cretins. Keep doing what you're doing. Thanks for everything.

[@MermaidTyrone]

I feel like at this point people just say stuff to get the pin of shame

[@lucretious7]

Yeah, Levy. What he said.

[@josephbilling3886]

simp

[@clintoruss153]

James whats worse than that idiots comment is that he has 3 thousand likes. Levy has only been professional and funny

[@Triggerboy78]

​@@ashtonal And this is a perfect example what happens when people speak with a lower IQ than the room temperature in °C

[@TheHumanSkidmark]

Levy is a fantastic presence in the community. Levy if you read this I hope your anxiety isn’t keeping you locked up, you’re a huge inspiration to me and the main man when it comes to who I think of that pushes through it. Thanks for all you do!

[@bethanalpha]

cool blog, champ

[@LordMayonnaise]

Levy, I have confirmed Hans was using a Bluetooth prostate massager to have moves relayed to him in Morse code. Please do not ask how I have done it, but just know I have now acquired the very device Hans was using. I can confirm it is very strong and after 1 hour of use, I am very tired myself. This fatigue might explain Hans’ inability to analyze the games in the post game interviews.

[@vogel2499]

That's a very crazy way to cheat, not even Chinese who bet their entire future on GaoKao exams would do it.

[@abdulrahmanalmawali2468]

Lmao this is a great shit comment

[@comentaristametaforico9287]

The things you do for science

[@Zawnpuia1640]

Bro u good? How are you, it sounds painful 😣

[@donkle9568]

Bro I actually taught of this in my head 😭😭 great minds think a like I guess?

[@porcu12345]

It's the biggest cheating scandal with absolutely no evidence of cheating lmao

[@bethanalpha]

tells you a lot about the chess community and the fanboys/girls of individuals

[@randomdudeontheinternet5901]

​@@bethanalpha its not even the chess fanboys its mostly the non chess player saying he cheated because its more interesting that he used a buzzer for cheating than knowing the situation

[@Garage.Philosophy]

The truth is Magnus played an obscure line that people don’t have knowledge on, on purpose to prove his theory that Hans was cheating and hans took the bait perfectly and played the line like a bot because he “miraculously “ practiced the exact line the night before without being able to explain the theory behind it

[@jaideepshekhar4621]

@@MidwestFarmToys Then PROVE it. Show me WHERE it is described to the t. I'll wait, for eternity. Because you have NONE!

[@lastimeye569]

@@jaideepshekhar4621 I'm having a hard time with these discussions. Why does someone need to prove anything here.

[@isakmaaan0326]

Either that or someone is leaking Magnus’ prep

[@hanshansen1990]

@@jaideepshekhar4621 if only it was that simple

[@jaideepshekhar4621]

@@MidwestFarmToys Then admit you're lying. Simple as that. Either walk the talk or stfu.

[@TgPepper]

I’m glad I’m not the only one that hates Queen and pawn endgames

[@avadakedavra6706]

I think hans made a blunder by giving interview, he should have just said "chess speaks for itself" and moved on

[@driedpancake]

stockfish speaks for itself and hans speaks in a fake russian accent

[@fredrik8500]

This guy: I'm all about the facts here Also this guy: Would Magus make such allagations if there were no grounds? I'm certainly gonna speculate that he wouldn't...

[@GothamChess]

Cool moustache Freddy

[@fredrik8500]

@@GothamChess now that's a fact!

[@menziboy2072]

@@fredrik8500 You should get some dogs

[@fredrik8500]

@@menziboy2072 ok I'll bite, why?

[@jakehamilton6735]

as a fan of Anna Rudolf, and how those allegations affected her. I'm gonna hold reservations

[@mananpatel3266]

what happened with her?

[@quikee9195]

@@mananpatel3266 She was playing really well in a tournament, beating higher elo players left and right and even a GM, and then some jealous player (not the GM) accused her she is cheating with a lipstick. She was searched and nothing was found, but the damage was done and her winning streak became a losing streak.

[@aniketpathak5679]

@@quikee9195 it magnus itself not any other gm, so there is something

[@knightf8648]

@@aniketpathak5679 magnus hasn't said anything, it's people who are enjoying drama too much and drawing conclusions.

[@sergioperez1131]

@@aniketpathak5679 well, there is a difference between Anna Rudolf and Hans Niemann too

[@valik7907]

if hans did cheat, his career in chess is over however if he didnt cheat i really REALLY feel bad for him. 1.his biggest moment ever got over shadowed by drama 2.his image got way worse forever (until proven otherwise) 3.and now there is a chance he wont get first place in the tournament just because his win against magnus does not count.

[@donsurlylyte]

3rd option, he did cheat, but got away with it, career is fine.

[@elcharro3548]

@@donsurlylyte i honestly doubt he would get away with it. In situations like this someone always spills the beans. But who knows.

[@jfamo3552]

I would feel bad for the idiots who pointed their Salem's Lot finger and burnt innocent people. It's Not Unusual. Pride is my favorite sin by far

[@Reb0rnLP]

@@elcharro3548 I mean in other sports there are usually even more people involved with doping and yet it often takes years for it to come to light. So yeah, maybe you're right, but who knows how long it would take?

[@newpgaston6891]

If Hans cheated and is exposed, his career is over... All games and sports have had cheaters. They cheat because they think they're not gonna get caught. Hans may have cheated and will never be exposed. Then his career took a minor hit. Or he may be legit, and then sadly, his career takes that same minor hit.

[@franciscobrandao4832]

Magnus has the "beating someone once isn't revenge" for a long time actually, he didn't change it just now

[@Dawn95284]

And yet no apology was given to Hans

[@chrisnorris7527]

Wow I honestly just assumed this was going to be "Someone refused to shake hands. It's not really a rule but people are really sour about it" but this is actually a chess scandal.

[@jovanvranes8038]

shaking hands is a rule though, you can get penalized

[@TheBiffsterLife]

Simplest explanation is that when Magnus heard Hans prepped for a line he had never played, Magnus smelled strong BS.

[@davidquinn9676]

If that's all it is, even if it's true, Magnus had BETTER come out REAL SOON and say that's all he suspected. Otherwise Magnus is turning his own reputation to scum.

[@OtherDAS]

EXCEPT Magnus had played it twice before.

[@boldimor84]

Honestly, all that comments about the interview after the match with Alireza seem to forget about the fact, that this day was strange for all players, let alone Hans. Imagine if he maybe is really innocent and you are still supposed to continue the tournament and give interviews and analysis. Ofc you might be nervous, even if you're innocent. Not saying he IS innocent, but still people should maybe consider this. And don't say why should he be nervous, if he doesn't have anything to hide: that line is and was always bullshit...

[@rubikvoncube3583]

exactly - the evidence does seem somewhat damning, but until the truth comes to light there's no reason to assume his guilt and ruin his reputation. Like you said, when people say things like "the innocent never run", or "if he's not guilty he has no reason to be nervous", it's incredibly dumb to assume that only a guilty party feels fear when shoved into the spotlight

[@boblikes]

@@rubikvoncube3583 What evidence exactly exists that "seems somewhat damning?" Did they find him with a cheating device? Someone communicating with him covertly and it was caught on camera? I'm curious how you can make a claim to evidence existing here. Please provide.

[@rubikvoncube3583]

@@boblikes correction: I should have said "the situation" instead of evidence. Posted my reply in a rush and accidentally used the wrong word, sorry about that. I'm simply referring to these two facts: 1) Hans played moves that represented perfect prep for the position (according to a comment that I saw, 20 moves of prep, although I can't verify the exact number personally) 2) After the game, Hans seemed unable to explain the position he played so perfectly, indicating that that he likely (not positively) did not understand the moves, but was rather reciting them from memory This *situation* (not necessarily evidence, as you rightfully stated), combined with the way Hans spoke trivially of the position, all just seems a bit fishy, that's all. I'm not making an accusation, but I am saying that based on the situation, a reasonable accusation could be made. And by "could", I mean that it's possible, I'm not implying anything that it should be made, or that such an accusation is a strongly supported one, only that it is not completely baseless. However, that aside, my reply was not really intended to focus on those details, the main point was that I was trying to echo OP's sentiment that people assume nervousness implies guilt. I was more focused on that idea rather than the details of the situation, hence why I misspoke

[@RazorStrap]

@@rubikvoncube3583 His reputation, by his own admission, is a cheater.

[@opioneer33]

@@boblikes You probably know this but his rating went up in a way that hadn't happened in the game's documented history. I think it's unusual to make drastic improvement to your game at that level so the obvious possibility is he found a way to cheat.

[@darylgraham4313]

I think it's actually most likely he got Magnus's prep. Like there's no way Magnus is treating his prep like some kind of national secret intellectual property with two factor authentication

[@sergejmaher144]

U know jack

[@kalodawg8297]

You're such a stupid absolute f**k. Magnus has only played this line A SINGLE TIME in history. How would he even get magnus's prep? Just shut up already if you don't know what you're speaking of Hans's whole interview post game is super sus, and he's been caught cheating several times in the past. Once a cheater, very likely forever a cheater

[@kevin12522]

What does prep mean

[@CorruptControl]

Magnus reaches an opening position that he’s never played before yet Hans apparently prepped it 20 moves deep…

[@stianaandal1488]

The same day they played

[@tchem]

Let's not forget that he couldn't justify his lines during the port game interview 😂

[@ApostleMan222]

He played it in a blitz game against Wesley So in 2019

[@shaundiltz5821]

Coulda been someone in his inner circle

[@tchem]

@@ApostleMan222 GM don't prepare classical games studying opponents blitz game, they require different game styles

[@justinherbert9146]

Magnus suspected that there was a mole - a leaker - in his inner circle, someone very close to him. So he prepped an obscure line he had never played before, and his suspicions were confirmed when Hans fell for the trap - Hans admitted in the post game interview that it was "a miracle" that he prepped for that opening in the morning prior to the game - yeah sure. Magnus did not bolt the tournament because he lost a game - he stormed out due to his feelings of a supreme betrayal. In time - we will find out who his Judas was - Judas betrayed Jesus for 30 silver coins.

[@ammonquitalig9077]

This sounds more likely

[@brooooooooooom4765]

It could be someone named Jess. Jess speaks for it self.

[@ErnestLebedev]

Oh, wow. Good thought, sounds very reasonable 👍

[@ashtonal]

Durov will become an easy likely suspect...

[@rrrrre2905]

out of all the reasons this seems the most plausable

[@dk-ih3mr]

"In an interview after the game, Niemann mentioned that he prepared based on Carlsen's use of the g3 Nimzo-Indian against GM Wesley So in London 2018. However, this game does not exist, and online database has not been able to locate any other modern game by Carlsen in this line." Not sure about the accuracy of this claim, but it would be a shame if the cheating accusations are true.

[@jamesmichaelmcdermot]

Nigel Short tweeted the relevant game, it might not been identical or in London but it supports Hans here.

[@BlindBishop]

You're absolutely right

[@NeaEmrys]

@@jamesmichaelmcdermot No Wesley So said there was no such game. Short is speaking out of his butt again.

[@pborofski]

@@NeaEmrys No, the only thing Wesley said was that he wasn't in London in 2018. And the game Short mentioned is in the databases and you could easily verify that info instead of spreading misinformation. I just checked. Magnus Carlsen vs Wesley So GCT Kolkata Rapid & Blitz (2019) (blitz), Kolkata IND, rd 9, Nov-25 Nimzo-Indian Defense: Romanishin Variation. English Hybrid (E20) · 1/2-1/2

[@knighterrant5772]

@@pborofski Yeah it's a transposition -- that's why Hikaru didn't find it in ChessBase.

If he didn't cheat then Magnus deprived him of a genuine victory and the accolades he deserved for it.

[@sofarsogod]

But he cheated once, thats enough evidence. Whats stopping him from doing it again? what? morals? kid has no morals.

[@daltonburnett7181]

@Alex F i love it when people speak out their ass, amazing😋.

[@derekma6482]

@Alex F so theyre not allowed to get up and move around for possibly 4-5 hours? that's probably just as bad to be honest

[@OwenNovakChildofGod]

@Alex F this has got to be the dumbest, most stupid fucking thing I’ve read this entire week. The most retarded solution possible

[@AGMatzen]

@Alex F lmao

[@mohammadsaifshahid2160]

Thank you for not jumping on the bandwagon like other chess streamers who have spent hours dissecting and mocking a 19 year old for using accents (probably inspired by subconsciously copying his idol chess players) for not following social cues and hyperfixating on random aspects of the interview when all of these things are common for people on the spectrum. The fact that most chess streamers are acknowledging that the game itself against magnus does not seem especially dubious in terms of unreal moves (infact most agree magnus played poorly) yet are convinced he cheated and are broadcasting it to impressionable viewers who know very little about chess is just terrible. Thank you for being mature, this is why youre the best

[@instagramsnapchat]

Very well said.

[@damkmankm3755]

Is Niemann on the spektrum?

[@iDC-Javi]

Lol the title of the video is an absolute joke though. He already frames it as “CHEATING SCANDAL” meaning there was cheating happening. It’s funny how he said he doesn’t wanna jump on the bandwagon but then puts out this video title.

[@mohammadsaifshahid2160]

It is a cheating scandal though even if it turns out to be false. Something beingg a scandal does not imply automatically that there is truth to it

[@2DarkHorizon]

@@mohammadsaifshahid2160 I agree the title is hopeless. Yet the content is good. I guess he needed the views.

[@chesscrush]

My take on it is that Hans did cheat but not with a phone or something. I think someone from Magnus' team either sent Hans Magnus' prep or he got it through some other way (hackers or whatelse etc). It just felt so weird that Hans said he literally prepared a 20+ line the same morning he played Magnus. I know these guys put hell a lot of prep if they play a serious tournament but you just can't "randomly" predict a line Magnus has never played. And that's the next thing Hans said Magnus payed this g3 system once already and he looked at that game but that's just wrong. Magnus never played this in any classical tournament, and definitely not in the London chess classic 2018. I'm gonna say there are no evidences yet and as I've stated before it's just MY PERSONAL TAKE. Levy already said that success can be addictive and I 100% agree if you went from 2500 to almost 2700 in like no time you need this feeling of being successful and recognized by the public. Hans is a little arrogant which is good for a top level player in any sport but sometimes I feel like it's going more into a narcissistic way rather than a healthy arrogance like for example Magnus has. Magnus definitely thinks that there is something fishy going on, if it's Hans or something else (a rat in his team) who knows. But the world champ quitting the tournament after a loss is something I have never seen in modern chess especially Carlsen he has lost to 2500s before and sure was upset, but never gave up.

[@rainman6090]

A rat seems unlikely, but hacking is probably a real possibility. It makes you wonder how much prep is being stored on computers for these teams. I'm sure almost all of it is. If that's the case, it's only a matter of time until someone decides to hack people's prep. I'm not saying Hans or anyone on his team did and if he did, we'll probably never know. However, FIDE should look into cheating in this fashion and how to prevent it.

[@joshuakei8925]

I agree with this take, if Hans is cheating, this is how he would plausibly do it, not by using an engine

[@griffinq8003]

Makes a lot of sense, and honestly, I dont even think it would be that difficult for someone who knows computers. I'd be surprised if even the top level players were doing game prep on VPNs or encrypted servers, their data probably just sits out in the open

[@s-x5373]

@@griffinq8003 vpns are useless against that kind attacks

[@vogel2499]

@@griffinq8003 Hahaha I bet most GMs would just simply stored their pgns to drop-box/GDrive. I rarely find people who felt that they need to put their things behind private server, and I worked at IT division.

[@TH-dg2mm]

Part of me feels bad for Hans... imagine he is just playing great chess and gets accused like this. The other part of me hopes Hans is a big fat cheater 'cause that drama is juicy AF.

[@quibble9003]

ikr hes such a villain. i love hans but he would be the perfect gm to play this part.

[@countofst.germain6417]

I can't imagine Magnus would put this out there without having a good reason to think it. Also didn't hans beat someone the other week then proceed to lose every game after that. Makes sense if he could only cheat for one game, and his rating has gone through the roof lately.

[@Viewer13128]

Keyword is "imagine" Hans is innocent. But chess speaks for itself.

[@talphazero1036]

@@countofst.germain6417 I think that was a Rapid tournament, and he won games against all his opponents there, just didn't win any of his matchups so ended without points

[@countofst.germain6417]

@@talphazero1036 have you see the new clips of hikaru? and now theres old clips of Nepo saying Hans is using an engine. It's not looking good for him

[@andreweverton162]

You’ve made me love chess way more, and I wouldn’t understand the game eve half as much without you. You’re amazing.

[@ahmadjauhar4562]

Hans should say "skill issue, bro" right in front of his face to spice this drama up

[@shane9095]

I don't comment on videos often but extremely level headed take by Levy. I respect that... especially in media which is an industry that rewards hot takes that are made quickly

[@margobarrett589]

Levy*

[@shane9095]

@@margobarrett589 thank you

[@danepotmo2513]

When I was younger I didn't think Lance Armstrong cheated because I gave the institution of cycling too much credit. I figured he is tested and monitored so much that it is not plausible he could get away with cheating. Then upon learning the systematic way that Lance cheated and easily got around safeguards, I came to realize that organizations are often not run as well as you would assume. You would assume that the organizers check really well, but so many holes always exist that can be exploited by someone willing to take the risks. I'm not saying Hans cheated, but I doubt anti-cheating measures are strong enough in chess to thwart a skilled cheater.

[@Martin-qb2mw]

Cheating in endurance sports and chess is completely different. Cheating in OTB-chess at this level is almost unheard of while cheating in endurance sports is multiple occassions every year since the dawn of time.

[@donquixote8462]

@@Martin-qb2mw Hans has history of cheating. Could not explain his moves. Suggested alternative lines that were dead lost. Played lines that baffled Alireza and Magnus. Commentator knew the lines better the higher rated player that *just got done playing the game against two of the highest rated players in chess history* and somehow, you think that's not extremely suspicious? Ok.

[@JohnS-il1dr]

@@Martin-qb2mw exactly. All Olympians, NBA NFL high level players use super vitamins. Some just hide it better. Top 50 riders definitely take supervitamins.

[@thatrespectablehuman1884]

In physical sports like bodybuilding, powerlifting, a lot of olympic sports, "cheating" is the norm, not using PEDs would just be playing at a disadvantage, so of course everyone does it but tries not to get caught. I don't know a lot about cycling but it would not surprise me if many many of them are indeed on drugs.

[@andrewbradley3305]

@@donquixote8462 No I don’t think a chess gm who hasn’t analyzed the game on a computer would know the lines better then the person who spent the entire game staring at stockfish

[@PLASKETT7]

Cheered by the analysis of the queen and Rook pawn with adjacent Knight pawn ending. I fell into a stalemate trap in that Vs McShane in 2000. But a spectating Speelman said afterwards that converting the advantage was no piece of cake.

[@relinquishedforever8505]

Currently living in St. Louis and been going to this tournament a few times as a spectator, they have a lot of security. They have metal detectors, the guards scan you, and yoy have to check your phone in before you can spectate the players.

[@blowbiden8190]

Awesome, so chess literally has the best anti cheat measure out of all popular pvp games

[@joshaxe6182]

Moved out here few years ago....not the place I'd think a top chess tournament would take place haha.

[@boaconstrictor3754]

Do they check the mouth? Allegedly, he had something in his mouth, it can be seen that he swallowed something big after shaking hands.

[@deejaydee1578]

@@boaconstrictor3754 big brain pills???

[@joe9832]

@@boaconstrictor3754 To to clarify, I'm not suggesting this is what happened - I'm quite casual on chess so don't really care personally about this event. Anyway, I've read a story about a past chess player who had somehow organised a communication device (perhaps a phone? I can't remember) into the roof of the toilets, yknow the industrial roofs separated into square sections, and the inner sections of each square lift up into an open space for wiring/scandalous

[@rossthebesiegebuilder3563]

I can't imagine how he could have snuck in an engine, unless he hid it in his chapstick or something.

[@ToDDHeaDD]

I think the most plausible narrative is that Magnus' prep had leaked and Hans studied it.

[@Bruh-bk6yo]

@@ToDDHeaDD even if it had leaked - was that Hans' problem lol?

[@Bruh-bk6yo]

Stockfish ceiling Stockfish ceiling Stockfish ceiling

[@ToDDHeaDD]

@@Bruh-bk6yo Well yes, if that were the case, Hans made a conscious decision to look at the leaked prep.

[@thomasjackson9993]

Lol

[@erikmarkus7467]

with all due respect, i believe a bigger scandal in chess history have been the direct accusations of cheating in a world championship match - such as kramnik vs topalov and the famous toilet affair.

[@Grandcapi]

You are right! The toiletgate was for the world title!

[@roris8532]

I think he says its the biggest because chess is right now more popular than ever. Much more popular than 1900s. IF that type of even happend now it would without a doubt be bigger.

[@sguitas]

This and a bunch of his videos are a huge clickbait

[@Toshinben]

I thought that scandal was solved; Topalov kept going to the bathroom so he could play every move with post-nut clarity.

[@502themaster]

Even the twitch chess dramas are bigger in these times than whatever happened 30 years ago

[@TheLearningFrontier]

you are innocent until you proved guilty

[@RationalEgoism]

Original title: "Biggest SCANDAL In Chess History" Levy's probably going to change it again.

[@zackdesilva4730]

If hans found a way to cheat he’s honestly a genius lmao

[@Melcavic42]

If you ain't cheating you ain't trying lol

[@williamdunhan341]

An evil genius

[@Terra157]

not so hard, u don't really expect world class GMs to cheat btw, if he was a genius, wouldn't cheat

[@rabailey10]

Wearing a tiny ear piece is hardly an attribute of a genius

[@angba6817]

@@rabailey10 you have no idea how thorough the security is

[@dime124]

The circumstantial and prior online evidence doesn't look good. He may not be "cheating" with an illegal device but something really strange is going on. Guy can't objectively evaluate a position or lines accurately but weirdly studied a 20+ move sideline variation of the g3 nimzo Magnus has never played because he prepared for it by studying a game that doesn't exist. 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@Xbox360SlimFan]

"Guy can't objectively evaluate a position or lines accurately" I highly doubt that. Not that I am a Hans fan, but You have to be fair.

[@dime124]

@@Xbox360SlimFan I am being fair. I was on Hikaru's stream whilst Hans was being interviewed and his opinion was Hans couldn't objectively evaluate a position that flat out hung a piece. Go watch the section of the stream where he was talking to Aejandro and see if you still doubt it.

[@markglennyt9230]

Sounds like ur saying that magnus win only if the position was his Prep..U know its like if magnus mess up hes prep he lose???.. This guys can play chess blind folded with 10 opponent....Its just shows that Magnus s still a human being..

[@Xbox360SlimFan]

​@@dime124 I watched it and sure enough he did not understand the position. I meant generally Hans is able to evaluate positions and lines. The interview was very suspicious though, not gonna lie! Edit: The position is only winning for white if You find that ridiculous engine line. Otherwise white is fighting for equality. His line was trash because it was essentially a tough position. Magnus can play chess, we both know that. Still, it happens rarely that Magnus gets out-prepped in classical.

[@dime124]

@@Xbox360SlimFan A fair reply. I was probably heavy handed in my terminology. It's not to suggest that Hans can't evaluate lines at all, he is clearly a strong player. What is probably a fairer comment is he did seem to show is he was unable to evaluate to the standard expected by someone of his perceived strength and ELO.

[@L.Reeves]

End of the day, even if there is no hard evidence the fact remains that Hans has cheated in the past and Carlsen has lost in the past without making any accusations of this sort. I'm inclined to give the benefit of the doubt to Carlsen on this one, but unfortunately this is the kind of decision that requires absolute certainty, not a 60-40 split.

[@blue-pi2kt]

Why would Magnus just accuse someone because he lost to a relatively high level world class player? I suspect he knows because these people can tell the difference between engine or human moves.

[@redstarkboxingsportsnews4289]

Hans cheated when he was 12 and 16 got caught magnus just mad he lost to the next prodigy 🤷🏽‍♂️

[@measlesplease1266]

He is just a sore loser

[@tiromandal6399]

@@redstarkboxingsportsnews4289 Yes the G.O.A.T is jealous of your cheating "prodigy" idol just like the sun is jealous of a painting of a lit candle. Keep believing it to get rid of that insomnia!

[@miguelbenavides9160]

@@redstarkboxingsportsnews4289 Magnus has lost to many people and recognized their effort, he must have reasons to withdrawn the tournament

[@Hierarchangel]

I want to see you guess the Elo of Hans' analysis of his own game.

[@robertommb]

Naka have wrongly acussed some GMs while playing on-line

[@countofst.germain6417]

Yeah but that's hikaru lol that's not surprising.

[@pedroluiz9670]

yeah thats very common actually

[@izzatIHH55]

@@countofst.germain6417 😂😂😂

[@Mastrmyrtr9]

Relevant comment #101

[@zacharysherry2910]

Andrew Tang

[@MenloMarseilles]

Eh, there's no way this is bigger drama than the Eagles saga at this early stage. That was also super-GM level chess, there was actual evidence of cheating rather than just bad vibes, and not to mention it brought us the iconic "PIPI in Pampers" corncob rant. If evidence actually comes out, then maybe.

[@Brazz27]

Did you just really try to make sense of a clickbait title?

[@juankplaysmusic]

What? Can you elaborate for the people who doesn´t have any idea what are you talking aobut?

[@coldspine3697]

@@juankplaysmusic a guy called Tigran Petrosian (not the old Soviet world champion) cheated in a game against Wesley So. Everyone called him out but he said he has been playing chess since Wesley was doing pipi in his pampers and can beat him whenever he wants, even though Wesley is like a million times stronger than Petrosian. That was a big scandal

[@niranjanrajesh1058]

This is the greatest chess player of all time,this is far greater than the pipi drama

[@MenloMarseilles]

@@juankplaysmusic To elaborate on ColdSpine's explanation: I called it "the Eagles saga" because the cheating took place in a team tournament between national teams (the "Professional Rapid Online Chess League" aka "PRO Chess League" aka "PCL"), and Petrosian was playing for the Armenia Eagles when he produced his suspicious results. Levy made a video about it at the time: kzbin.info/www/bejne/pKLdnWanbqemnpI

[@usgamechamp2323]

Magnus is calling cheating, Hans knowing his play book.

[@KRS_two]

Minor correction Lev. Hans is now 1.5/2 since after Magnus withdrew, his results in the tournament are annulled.

[@sidizen2672]

Hes 2/3

[@shors5841]

@@sidizen2672 no

[@sidizen2672]

@@shors5841 no what? Lol

[@rdspam]

@@shors5841 Beat Shakh, drew Levon and Alireza = 2/3

[@ollievance2258]

I don’t think the games gets annulled if the tournament isn’t past 50% done

[@BlandBandit]

Either Magnus knows something we don't but will find out soon OR we may be witnessing a sliw decent into paranoia and madness like Fischer

[@BlandBandit]

@ im inclined to believe magnus knows something

[@vogel2499]

Magnus has too much money to be descend into madness.

[@menace202]

@@vogel2499Rich people can go crazy

[@Napoleonbonrfart]

I hate when he says "if you skipped ahead hi" because then i feel bad and have to go back to watch it all.

[@PrinceFlynnRider]

I believe it's possible that someone in Magnus's camp leaked his prep to Niemann and if so probably for a hefty sum.

[@muffntheB]

do you really think pro chess players have "hefty sums"? lol, its not a profitable career

[@kingdweeb5065]

Do u think their poor? Lol

[@jazzyrick]

@@kingdweeb5065 Yeah...relatively speaking probably only the top 20 can make an actual living from playing chess.

[@thatrespectablehuman1884]

@@muffntheB well then the people who's job it is to be on their team and help them prep can't be making a lot either, so a hefty sum is a lower amount than if they were rich

[@radscorpion8]

@@kingdweeb5065 they're not their

[@sammymiller7857]

His bio has always said “ beating someone once isn’t revenge” but go off

[@thebluefyrephoenix]

Levy, I love how you can keep an unbiased perspective on events like this.

[@nick_d_730]

TBF Peter and Yasser did a great job taking us through that endgame

[@7inrain]

It was good that you repeatedly pointed to the most basic but also the most important thing in this matter: We need evidence before we can reach any conclusion!

[@henryhawthorn8849]

I think Hans Niemann should be banned from ALL professional chess tournaments and matches, period. He’s name is Mudd ever since he confessed of cheating. How could he ever be trusted?! Having said that, FIDE and the USCF, as well as all other chess organizations, should have tighter controls of professional chess games, applied to all participants.

[@ChipSelden]

For those of you who skipped ahead, the folks who watched the whole thing definitely saw an interesting game that you're missing out on.

[@rafaelcobossanchez5778]

maybe next time he learns not to click bait. I came here to hear about the scandal, not for seeing other ppls games. He has plenty of videos of chess matches.

[@siddharthssvlogs]

I watched the whole video because of this comment. The games were shite. Boring at best. The last part is why he has times stamps on the video

[@goku445]

sorry, just here for drama.

[@hughesfarris6009]

It felt like the fourth wall broke after i skipped ahead and he seemingly called me out to my face....

[@JudePhilips]

😂😂😂

[@Saitawa]

Caruana and Maxime's game is insane. As a beginner that was so complex and hearth throbbing

[@ianmcgregor349]

Hi Gotham. I just wanted to say I appreciate your comments about anxiety in the video. They were subtle but very important to me. I had a very unproductive day because I was extremely anxious about this and I felt silly about it because it’s not relevant to me personally at all. I’ve felt so silly and stupid for wasting so much time exploring and watching this unfold, but knowing I’m not alone and that you also have felt this anxiety about the situation is extremely reassuring and validating. So for that, thank you.

[@MrCjallaby]

Me too. A little disconcerting how emotionally invested I am in the lives of these people that are nothing to me. Because it is Magnus, it makes it all the worse. He is someone you obviously look up to as one of the greatest chess players of all time, and yet I find his approach here to be very unsatisfactory (with an obvious insinuation but no concrete details or accusations). I find Hans to be rather bizarre and his comments to be in poor taste, but it seems entirely possible that he just won the game fair and square. Magnus needs to clear this up and he should not have posted something so inflammatory. Withdrawing is fine and I support that for any reason, but you can't leave things like this.

[@vigilantestylez]

Hans just stole $500,000 with his chess engine.

[@secretcrocodile7499]

This is wild but I don’t understand how people can credibly accuse him without even a hint of how he would accomplish this cheating given that he was patted down and wanded before entering. For it to be true, he would need to come up with some insane cheating mechanism that could circumvent all anti-cheat efforts including broadcast delay.

[@GamingStyleBFH]

There was no broadcast delay that round. It is only since the cheating case

[@ashvintyagi4530]

Just based on all the speculation I've seen, people are attributing it more to Hans somehow finding out about Magnus's prep and taking advantage ahead of time rather than some explicit cheating in the moment

[@aClownBaby-]

Yeah it’s prep I think his team leaked his prep

[@secretcrocodile7499]

@@GamingStyleBFH They are saying he cheated vs. Firouja as well

[@hector9586]

This would be crazy but imagine if someone hacked the network magnus was in and got access to his computer somehow

[@rayblack9522]

I think the fact that EVERYONE at the event is pretty suspicious about the whole situation shows that there is clearly something that we as viewers aren’t there to witness and we don’t understand. And to top it off, that post game analysis interview was hilariously awful. Hans completely evaluated that position wrong.

[@jaideepshekhar4621]

@Shiro You do realise Hans has been CAUGHT cheating MULTIPLE times before?

[@cricfizzer4498]

@@jaideepshekhar4621 he hasnt veen CAUGHT , he was playing a non rated online game with someone , was livestreaming, and was openly trollig by looking at engine moves in front if his audience

[@MagnusMegamind]

@@cricfizzer4498 Nice, but to look at the engine moves while playing someone online is literally the definition of cheating in online chess. Must be hard to live with below 80 IQ my dude cricfizz... Hope that you will be accepted as MC donald worker after some special education.

[@Soeeasy]

That doesn't proove anything at all

[@jaideepshekhar4621]

@@cricfizzer4498 He was banned for 6 months TWICE.

[@danieldebarrosmendes622]

I love that watching Gotham's videos is not only a chess study, but also an english vocabulary study, as I am not a native english speaker and Gotham always uses some very hard words to me hahahahah.

[@doubleairdouble7004]

If I look at Nieman's face, it's pretty obvious where his device was hidden...

[@whatsup4616]

Bobby Fisher was definitely right about one thing. It’s more about studying engine moves than brainpower and creativity

[@kroon275]

As a 500 player thats the main I do not like about chess. Its too much of a memory game. May try Fischer random 😉

[@unbeaunom]

Tu ne dois pas jouer souvent avec un ordi. Il est impossible de jouer comme eux. Les ordis d'aujourd'hui n'ont rien à voir avec l'époque de Fischer... On est rendu au 21e siècle au cas où tu ne l'aurais pas remarqué. On apprend par coeur son propre travail de préparation. C'est comme si tu reprochais à un mathématicien de connaitre par coeur ses formules. C'est carrément idiot.

[@dunadain_aragorn1941]

He bouta speak for himself 💀

[@KRS_two]

The chess speaks for itself. I prefer not to speak.

[@ChildOfGorb]

It’s finally here kzbin.info/www/bejne/pXnKZoaAjrd7d5I

[@philiplee359]

Gotham Chess: people just don't withdraw from tournaments Bobby Fischer:

[@YanickSP]

Hans: The chess speaks for itself. Magnus: The tweet speaks for itself. Hmm.. 🤔

[@nicey775]

The impression im getting from levi is that he's a very logical but very considerate person. I really like him.

[@yoavhofstein3658]

As someone who was accused of cheating (not in chess I'm not that good) but on a national finals exam I'm telling you that you should treat hans as 100% innocent until proven otherwise. We are forgetting he did bit magnus just a month ago and even though he still lost the other two it is definitely possible. The last thing someone who said he wanna drown needs is to be accused of cheating

[@jaideepshekhar4621]

Are you serious??? That dude couldn't even explain his OWN moves!

[@OtherDAS]

@@jaideepshekhar4621 Yeah, possibly because he played from memory of analysis.

[@MasterHigure]

My mom uses the line "The computer says no" with customers from time to time. They never get it :(

[@arkline9937]

Mamedyarov didn't make a single mistake in his game against Magnus, it is impressive

[@PT-dk8oi]

I love how even addressing the controversy, you carry on but keep going back to it. That’s the most realistic take and how we feel about it, because it is a rippling effect.

[@dankness420]

Levy’s just sad that he can’t put Magnus in the thumbnails anymore

[@vinesthemonkey]

that won't stop him

[@Kayrim_Borlan]

Why are you here?

[@dankness420]

@@Kayrim_Borlan probably the same reason as you

[@Stefan0v1]

Why?

[@johndavidalexander6646]

The fact that the guy has previously been caught cheating in chess is enough for me to think he should never be allowed to compete in chess again. Having previously cheated, there always be question marks over this type of victory.

[@DaaimShabazz]

Makes no sense. If you get a speeding ticket driving far over the speed limit should you be allowed to drive again?

[@johndavidalexander6646]

@@DaaimShabazz you're not competing at the highest level when you are caught speeding on your commute. If someone is willing to cheat to win, they will always be willing to cheat to win and they are motivated by how it looks to be a winner, not by actually being the best at something. IMO a cheater doesn't regret cheating, they just regret getting caught. There is no room in sport for that kind of mindset. True competitiors would rather lose than cheat and I think competition should be left to those types of people.

[@CT-55552]

Levy is actually funnier than most youtubers nowadays

[@NousNoesis225]

Absolutely love your content, Levy. Keep up the great work, and thanks for all the great courses as well.

[@jmwvirgil]

Problem is, you can't prove a negative, so Niemann can never clear his name. The stink of this will always follow him. It would be terrible if he's legit.

[@segfault_000]

Well, he could clear up why he made verifiably false statements in his post match interview, and have a believable explanation as to why he prepped a 20-move line on an opening his opponent has never played.

[@carlosguzmanmorales9999]

@@segfault_000 Kolkata IND, rd 9, Nov-25, Hans just got the year wrong. He even said what things did not happen in that game.

[@Reb0rnLP]

@@segfault_000 Stop repeating this false statement. The game was played. Look it up on KZbin.

[@ndnd7614]

@@carlosguzmanmorales9999 but that game deviated quickly compared to the Hans-Magnus game

[@ChocolateMilk..]

@@carlosguzmanmorales9999 Why would elite GM's use rapid and blitz games to prepare for a classic game?

[@NaRoosch]

16:25 Me, an intellectual: I just saw a very interesting game.

[@goblue4795]

This is why I cheat every time, because then nobody will suspect me for a single game

[@messaldo1249]

Cultured man

[@5minuteideas588]

Big brain

[@PrometheanConsulting]

At a MUCH lower level of play, when I was 18 and rated high 1600s, I went 5-0 against the field including a win against a master, then drew a grandmaster in round 6 and lost to the tournament's other grandmaster in round 7 winning the Under-1700 section outright and placing 3rd in the Open section with 5.5 and poor tie-breaks against the two GMs with the same record. People were dumbfounded and upset but we didn't even have cellphones, yet, so certainly none of this social media craze. In my case, I had only played 1-2 rated tournaments a year for maybe 6 years and my rating ALWAYS jumped 100+ points as my ability to think critically improved and my studies advanced my game. There was good reason for my results. And in some cases, you simply play above your level for awhile. Happens all the time in all kinds of fields of endeavor. Or maybe this just is Hans' level and he's arrived? As you say, the burden of proof is on the accuser. It's unlikely that Hans is Magnus' peer/equal. But it's not impossible. And it's certainly not impossible on any given Sunday... that's why you play the games.

[@oz_jones]

Or Carlsen just had a bad game. It does happen.

[@himek070]

Having history of cheating and being suss to many top gm's is another situation.

[@PrometheanConsulting]

@@himek070 That's a nonsense argument. You have a "history" of pooping your pants and bedwetting but nobody is accusing you of that now...

[@himek070]

@@PrometheanConsulting We not talking about being a kid, but what happened last year

[@PrometheanConsulting]

@@himek070 in online play. Not OTB.

[@sahansathsara6441]

Magnus will never lead this controversy unless something seems very dodgy. He is not that sore loser and this is not his first lost to a considerably lower rated player after all. But apparently what hans did throughout tournament was absolutely outstanding. That is crystal clear. But the way he did that is a little bit skeptical. Notably how he reacted in post match analysis is also not even acceptable. Literally he assured that g3 nimzo magnus played back in 2018 against wesley in london chess classic despite both of magnus and wesly didn't even participate in that tournament. Nevertheless it's fine though. It's so humane to forget but to 2700 gm who analysed that match earlier that day will never do that. Anyway the most interesting thing is magnus hasn't played that line for ages. Only match to find was against peter leko in 2006 tal memorial. There may be some transpositions of g3 nimzo that were played but we know that move order really does matter in chess. So how on earth he got that exact position on that day? What made him so sure that magnus will go for that line? What odds will clarify this is just a coincidence. I don't buy it. After all why he analysed that idiotic line in so depth to some considerable moves, despite most of top gms are not even down to play is also questionable. And also hans previous online cheating record exponentially speaks for itselt.These things seem really suspicious but anyway hans is still innocent until proven otherwise.

[@thesteve4235]

Magnus definitely gets salty, especially since he has a massive superiority complex when facing lower rated GMs, that's why he lost to Esipenko. He played a random no name opening then got squeezed in a worse position. There are no computer moves, Hans also blundered a force draw near the end which Carlson missed. Not a fan of Hans, but it doesnt look like cheating.

[@blackhitler8572]

magnus is a dick. thats pretty common knowledge. he would totally do this out of spite

[@sahansathsara6441]

@@thesteve4235 It's a typical kinda mindset to have for someone like magnus. He hates to lose. We all know that. Chess world including himself expects the maximum out of him when he plays against such a lower rated player. So he always tries to grind that kind of battles by taking that lower rated opponent out of book as soon as possible. That's why he plays some dubious moves with some ideas. These things are not rocket science. But hans just literally outplayed magnus without leaving him any counter play. These things can also happen I know. But I mean hans knew everything in that position to some extent. Every single line that would give him a considerable advantage. This line was such a dubious opening in top level in that sense why he was so prepared for that line specifically earlier that day. It is anyway a little bit suspicious. Of course he missed some things in end game. Computers said at some point it's pretty equal but humans are not engines. They can't see those precise moves at some critical points. That Bh5 idea is just an instance. So it was a lost position anyway to play. I don't claim that hans cheated. He is innocent until proven guilty. But the way he did things was really dodgy. And also in 4th round that exchange sac against Alireza merely based on intuition without analysing further possible lines is also dubious. I mean generally 2700 gms don't do these kind of weird things without a concrete idea behind that. After all this is classical chess. If he is in his prime why he is not able to illustrate his own ideas while analysing. His mannerisms are way difficult to understand.

[@vogel2499]

I have a strong feeling that Niemann cheat not just with leak prep, but also chess engine. It's very suspicious that someone who got thrashed badly at ftx crypto not long ago suddenly crushing WC candidates.

[@jaideepshekhar4621]

@@thesteve4235 At the end? You do realise that supports the case against Hans, not debunks it.

[@ProBackgammonequipment]

Hans probably put Spyware on Magnus' computer so he knew what he was planning to play.