can you sleep with your fiance? 🥸 r/AITA

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[@charlie2.048]

Given that Thomas was there in a really significant way through their entire childhood, basically taking on the role of a third parent WITH the mom and dad my bets are that the parents had a lavender marriage or they were actually polyamorous.

[@fallenking578]

Thar was my thought too. Funny how the sister never even considered it could a poly thing, that mom was with him too

[@katie6731]

I've never heard the term "lavender marriage," so I looked it up. Thank you for teaching me something new! I'm fascinated by people's interactions with each other, and the infinite ways we set up our relationships. I'm cishet and monogamous, but I think there are a lot of benefits of poly relationships. I believe that as long as everyone in a relationship can and does consent and nobody is hurting anyone (unless that's their kink 😁), then it's wonderful for people to share love in whatever form works for them. And I agree, it sounds like the parents were a functional triad all along, and were keeping it private. I wonder if OP has considered that Thomas might be bio-dad to themself, their sister, or both.

[@_.-._.-Y0K0-._.-._]

Right- if the mom was okay with the guy being called second dad she was very probably in it, whether in the relationship itself or the knowledge of it. Otherwise it'd probably be uncle Thomas

[@thedopaminedirective]

This was exactly my thought as well, was looking for this

[@iratakeuchi3031]

Yes! A cute adorable polycule

[@kiarimarie]

Casual sex? She is with her partner of 8 years, ain't nothing casual about them having sex. It's also weird to assume they would have sex and don't just want to literally sleep and snuggle next to each other.

[@plutoisthebestplanet13]

Literally!! Like, maybe they just want to sleep in the same room and not with the friggin uncles...? Like, 8 YEARS. They're allowed to share a bed just to sleep.

[@pheonixrises11]

I actually have a hard time sleeping without my partner at this point (;^^) I just like having them in the same room

[@miglek9613]

considering a lot of christian priests and denominations consider premarital cuddling and/or making out to be sinful as well I'm not surprised by this at all tbh

[@bacul165]

Right! Sleeping in this family home with all these oppressive "values" around i doubt they would be in the mood anyways...

[@deadlymelody27]

Literally this is what i thought! Me and my partner have a child and havent had sex in like 2 years but it doesnt mean i dont want him in my bed!! If someone was like oh dont share a bed i would be like fuck off

[@evie9555]

"Just the idea for marriage being the criteria is so weird. I could marry someone in a day..." And that's one big reason why pushing abstinence only, or otherwise locking certain "rewards" behind marriage can be so problematic. It just ends up creating a hell of a lot of pressure for people to marry young and quickly.

[@asthejayflies]

And then frowning on divorce and pushing the obligation to stay together at the expense of everyone’s happiness… i truly don’t get conservatives

[@happytofu5]

also, you don't have to share a room at night if you want to have sex

[@booperdooper9762]

Agreed

[@SartorialDragon]

Yeah...it just creates unhappy, immature marriages. Somehow, i don't think that being married and staying married is more important than being happy together. I'm sad for all those boomers (and other generations) who dislike their spouse and think that's *normal* ... 😢

[@DasSpaceAce]

The first one makes me wonder if they got engaged to shut up the family members asking when they'd get married & they're not actually interested in the whole idea of marriage. Regardless, OP & the family sound super ridiculous. An 8 year relationship with 4 years of engagement is *not* "casual sex", nor does it make her "disloyal". Wtf.

[@squidmom3162]

Like….disloyal to WHO???

[@solsystem1342]

@@squidmom3162 her future husband obviously /s . Don't worry about how half of married couples divorce eventually. It makes sense trust me pal. Lmao

[@barrylangille3523]

@@squidmom3162 disloyal to the parents maybe? It's stated that they're religious so I'm guessing "honor your parents" got thrown out there. Although offering to stay nearby seems respectful of the rules to me. Once or twice over the years I've encountered people who seem to think that parents should have control over their children for life.

[@arianahammer6084]

@@squidmom3162 as someone who grew up with very conservative christian parents i can say that they probably felt betrayed by her decision to have premarital sex. which is ridiculous but when my mom found out i was sexually active (keep in mind i was 18 and she found out because i was using birth control so i was even trying to be safe about it) she freaked out and made it all about herself, crying and pleading with me to stop. parents who raise their kids believing one thing feel very disrespected and may feel like their kids are being "disloyal" when their kids don't hold the same values

[@violetsnotroses3640]

I wonder if we're working from a definition of "casual sex" that might be different from OP's. Like maybe they consider any sex that is recreational instead of procreative to be "casual?" OP's parents are entitled to prioritize their comfort by enforcing this rule, but the sister is also entitled to prioritize her comfort, and she found a way to do that without violating her parents' boundaries. It's up to them to decide whether it's more important to them that their daughter stays with them, or to keep unmarried people from sharing a room in their home.

[@jollypodger7102]

That first one is creepy! I usually agree with the “my house, my rules” thing, but with the understanding that they’re free to choose not to come in my house when/if they don’t want to follow the rules of my house. Sister chose the correct solution, brother just wants to control things that are not his business or responsibility.

[@blaireshoe8738]

Legit them getting a hotel room both honors the house rules and frees up TWO BEDS. If even one person was supposed to be sleeping on a couch... win-win situation! haha

[@spoon1968]

What is with that first family? Many people just enjoy and are used to sleeping next to their partners. It's not enjoyable to be forced apart and made to bunk with a partner's relative. They were being respectful of the family rules by offering to get other accommodations. Ridiculous to say that it's ruining anything by putting up a personal boundary of how they spend their nights.

[@flibbertygibbette]

It's almost certainly a religious thing. And functionally and historically speaking, one of the key things traditionally regulated by religion is sexuality. Parents (specifically, usually fathers have the authority but mothers are deputized as the shame/shaming for not following this usually hits mothers hardest), and to a lesser extent, older siblings (specifically, usually brothers, but sisters also do this) are designated as the regulators of the sex lives of their children, ensuring that they (especially girls) remain virgins until married. A lot of religious parents enforce these rules with unmarried adult children.

[@pheonixrises11]

@@flibbertygibbette I live with my partner, but when I visited my grandparents we slept in separate rooms because they are very religious. It was difficult for us to be apart so much, but I did *not* want the topic of us having sex coming up at all (even though we are sexually active at home and hardly religious)

[@krankarvolund7771]

Yeah it's probably not even a question of sex, I would be incomfortable at making sex in my parent's house, especially if they''re religious, but I will never let my partner sleep with some random family members ^^'

[@Dehlopesp]

I'm in a 10 year relationship, we're from different cities, i'm 28, and this new years eve was the first time my mom allowed me to sleep in the same room as my bf. One in a bed and the other on a single bed. This was one of the reasons that I didnt invite him to come here as often. In his city, we share a couples bed, have other freedoms like sleeping late, and I get to be away from my overbearing mother. It sucks.

[@elianwolfert3879]

I bet that family is already seething with rage the couple has been together for 8 years and very likely having sex without being married. They already look down on her/them 100%

[@NortherlyK]

The last one: it could have been a throuple. Thomas may have been involved with both of the parents. Polyamory is something that was definitely happening more and more in the 70s; then in the 80s it was frowned upon by society. Possibly they were hiding their relationship completely.

[@emporesszia]

This was my thought, too.

[@liolikesgrass]

It was my thought. Like, the mother, the father and Thomas were together. Maybe they decided to keep it secret to avoid confusing the children, or to avoid harassment in school (which could have happened because LGBTQ+ couple + not amatonormative couple = people get freaked out). Maybe they should talk to their father to clear things up and to understand the situation better.

[@kristalpower292]

@@liolikesgrass whatever the situation it seems they need to have a conversation with dad and ask about the whole situation it’s hard to know what aspects of dads new relation the sister has the biggest issue with. And let’s be honest unless her mum has a letter for them or could communicate from beyond the grave the sister may not believe whatever the dad says because she doesn’t know how mum felt. Or maybe she does and that’s part of the issue who knows.

[@charlie2.048]

Given that Thomas was there in a really significant way through their entire childhood, basically taking on the role of a third parent. My bets are definitely either polyamoury or the parents had a lavender marriage.

[@Mike-di1og]

Ten seconds into that one and I was ready to wager my entire paycheck that they were a throuple

[@august1837]

I feel that in the last one if mom didn’t know, tomass wouldn’t be so involved in the family’s life. Just feel that if it was an affair dad would want to keep that as far away from the family as possible so they didn’t suspect anything

[@krankarvolund7771]

Yeah, I can't see how someone would keep an affaire with someone that close for almost thirty years... Unless the mom is totally oblivious, or never think any of it because her husband can't be homosexual ^^'

[@itssteph263]

@@krankarvolund7771 I mean if you look at Candy Montgomery, she befriended her affair partner's wife.

[@naylanihalpern-wight1130]

I agree with Krankar Volund, and given I sensed no homophobia in OP's description, I'm inclined to think your last point was not what was going on.

[@grutarg2938]

The sister in the first one sounds like she behaved well. She first asked her parents openly if she could share a room with her partner during her visit. When they said no, she came up with an alternative solution of staying a nearby hotel. And when even that wasn't good enough for the family, she decided to pass on the get-together. She was honest & willing to problem-solve.

[@LauraDinkins1]

I think Bea gave her friend a great gift! It was a gift of nothing but red flags. Not a friendship I would have a desire to keep.

[@tabathaalshalhoub1653]

right? I mean, I also wanted to add that op was probably saying the whole "men shouldn't act like this around their wive's friends" bit *because* he had been hitting on her. and she felt uncomfortable and knew it was off. I think it was too harsh to just brush it off with "men and women can be friends." like... op knew what the husband was doing (hitting on her) and was trying to be nice about it. and that's another problem, that women are just expected to endure this and not say anything because "I'm just being friendly" like, no dude, you are being a creep and I'm uncomfortable and we should encourage more women speaking out like this.

[@bunji_beans]

The first one reminds me of how growing up in a fairly conservative Christian environment, I saw many couples seemingly rush into marriage and pastors encouraging it so as to prevent them from giving into their "lust" for each other and having premarital naughties. I remember peers in my college church group apologizing and stepping down from any sort of leadership roles for having s*x. Looking back at my "good little church boy" days is surreal.

[@easjer]

I was later married than many of my counterparts (at 25, which is not late by any means), and one of the few still in the same marriage 20 years later. It's almost as if encouraging late teen/early 20-somethings to rush into marriage to enjoy church-sanctioned sex isn't the ideal base for a life-long relationship. So odd, really.

[@bunji_beans]

@@easjer right?! Also also hyping it all up as this wonderful God inspired thing while discouraging being educated on it

[@shez5964]

@@easjer Teens having Permission To Have Sex Ceromonies AKA weddings between lustful teens from Christian conservative communities are pretty much doomed and very unhappy relationships.

[@francescapatti2934]

First one is definitely the asshole. 1) Don't disrespect and belittle your sisters relationship wtf 2) she asked if it was possible to sleep in the bed with her fiance, they said no, so she got a hotel room that she paid for herself and didn't make a fuss 3) just the tone OP takes here... Like tbh I think the "no sleeping in the same bedroom unless you're married"is a little bit weird in my opinion, but if that's the rules they've set then they should be respected when visiting and it's not that big of an issue. However, the fact is that she WAS literally respecting the rule by getting a hotel room. So op is still the asshole no matter what.

[@bunji_beans]

Right?! Such toxic behavior to be like "respecting us means submissively doing what we tell you, no other options"

[@be_me]

Ah, but you forget, parents don't like loopholes. Some parents. It's their rules and no other options. Taking advantage of a loophole makes them feel insulted and disobeyed just to spite them. I fully agree with you, though. It's overbearing and unhealthy, in my opinion.

[@TheAwesomes2104]

One of my friends had a similar situation happen to him, and when his family berated him for sharing a bed with his unmarried SO he just said "How do you know we're not married?" They looked surprised and told him because they hadn't seen or heard about a wedding and he told them "Why on earth would I invite or tell any of you about my wedding when y'all are such creepy weirdos about it? Y'all say yourselves that it's a union between a man, a woman, and god, so I see no reason why any of you think you'd have to be included for it to happen." I don't know if his family even knows today whether they were actually married or not.

[@kittysunlover]

@@bunji_beans Oh man, but this just gave me so many flashbacks. I cannot tell you how many times growing up I heard "it's not about (rule/behavior that got me in trouble). It's about respect." Trying to think how to explain without going into a huge rant about my abusive upbringing but basically, with some kinds of folks, there's no way for you to be right - you could bring up the most reasonable argument or offer the most genius compromise and they would still insist on being right, and thus twist the situation until they are. In my experience, for a lot of people like this, it's about control. Unfortunately it sounds like the brother/OP in this situation has internalized a very controlling upbringing and seeing sister escape that control when he can't produces a subconscious reaction - he lashes out at her because he feels powerless to do anything about his relationship with their parents. My two cents, anyway. I'm not a psychologist, just a hobbyist with too much experience with people like that, lol. ^^;

[@kittysunlover]

@@TheAwesomes2104 Genius. This is the kind of thing that should be on life hack compilations. XD

[@Netherdrop]

Story 1: "My house, my rules" is a totally fine rule to have (and is kind of what boundaries are for), but that should include accepting that someone may choose not to stay at your house then, if they decide those rules aren't something they're willing to follow, which should be their right to decide. Because otherwhise it's not a case of "My house, my rules" but rather "I decided I have the right to rule over another person's actions", no matter if it's inside your own house or somewhere else, and that is NOT an okay mindset to have.

[@dees3179]

The last one, thomas having been involved in family things all along,…..I can’t imagine that the kids haven’t thought about polyamory……we could all be wrong, but that sounds extremely likely. If not though, then father has a best friend who shares all those memories of his late wife and now has found love again too. I’d be buying them some champagne in either scenario. I’m glad they have each other.

[@summeryoung1026]

I truly think the kids haven't thought of this. Some people would be like "oh the horror" at that. And while to regular people it seems cute or quirky what Thomas and dad and mom had, to the kids it probably will make them cut dad and Thomas out of their life, which is probably why they haven't spoke about it to them.

[@BluetheRaccoon]

This scenario strikes me as one where the parental expectations were that of an opportunity to shame their daughter for not being married, and when she set boundaries that denied them that they resorted to guilt.

[@InThisEssayIWill...]

Last story, esh. I agree we need more info from Dad.. but also feel like this is info that Dad should have been volunteering to kids as soon as he announced the new relationship. Dad KNOWS that this is going to raise questions in his kids minds and he is choosing to ignore his responsibility as a parent to ease the situation. Can you imagine looking at every single picture from your childhood and having to wonder about that 'uncle' in the background. Op is definitely overstepping but ultimately I don't think he's the main problem. (Context clues make me inclined to think Mom probably was a beard or at least aware to some degree op says they called him a 'bonus dad' and that's not what my kid calls my husbands close friends.. if anything uncle (even when they're not actually related) and close friends or not they aren't in my kids graduation/prom pictures. The level of involvement certainly seems like mom has to know *something* )

[@RiverWoods111]

I don't think that Dad owes kids any explanation. It is none of their business what dad does or did. They need to butt the hell out of his business and accept and respect him just as he is.

[@InThisEssayIWill...]

@@RiverWoods111 respect is earned. His children don't OWE him anything. He took actions that call into question his children's entire perception of him as a father figure. He may not OWE them an explanation but if he's concerned about preserving the legacy of his character and the values he attempted to teach them growing up it would be in his best interest to do more than "Joe and I are together now, bye."

[@RiverWoods111]

@@InThisEssayIWill... Respect shouldn't have to be earned unless it was broken in the past. As you said, mom obviously knew what was going on. When mom and dad were together being gay was a lot harder to live out in the open. His being gay or even Bi for that fact is just so, and what he was put through in the past or that it wasn't safe for him to live out of the closet in the past shouldn't have to be explained. So, the three of them had a weird relationship, but obviously mom knew, and it worked for the three of them. By the way, on the subject of respect has to be earned??? WTF??? So as a woman I don't deserve to be respected on a first date because I haven't proven myself? Oh, and employer doesn't have to treat new employees with respect till they have been there for a few years to have earned the right to be respected. That is such bullshit! The only time it needs to be earned is when it had intentionally been broken by someone. For all the kids and we know the male friend could have been just a good friend, and then after the wife had died, they became involved. My feeling is the marriage was a front for the two gay men to stay in the closet and gave the wife and them children. It was all prearranged. The kids don't need to know all those details and the father has the right to keep what happens behind closed doors behind closed doors. Mom had passed before the two men became openly together, so that is that. Just like if a man marries a female friend of the family after a wife dies, because he found solace and healing in her friendship. We don't question those because it is between a man and a woman though!

[@vallentinac9513]

OMG the first story made my blood BOIIIIIL!!! WTAF?!?! His sister is an adult and she's even renting a room at a hotel! Who she sleeps there with has ZERO to do with any other person. As you said Shaaba having sex with a long term partner isn't casual sex, but even if she wanted to have casual sex with a stranger... so what?!?! it's her body and her life! I'm fuming!

[@blaireshoe8738]

The assumption that sharing a bed = having sex is what bugs me the most. Like. I can't imagine being in the mood knowing extended family is visiting and knowing how thin my walls are 😂 Just shut up and let me snuggle my partner, it ain't that deep!

[@miglek9613]

@@blaireshoe8738 you see, most christian fundamentalists consider premarital snuggles to be sinful as well so for them it is that deep. Doesn't make it any less messed up though, just shows how brainwashed the family is

[@itssteph263]

They very likely live together, I would also be fuming if my fiance and I had to sleep in separate rooms. We have been together for 8 yrs and living together for 3 yrs. She even offered to pay for them to stay in a hotel if having them sleep in the same bed made them uncomfortable. I bet 100% OP wasn't a virgin when he got married.

[@ashergibson9969]

I don't fully agree with the take on the last one only because, while the sister is entitled to her own feelings and grief, she is not entitled to project that onto others, to make assumptions about her father's dating life, or to set a time frame for his grief, without getting all of the facts beforehand. So I think it's somewhat right that she was challenged on that. I would say NAH, just because it is a complex situation and all parties' responses make a lot of sense given the lack of information they all have. A big team meeting is definitely in order

[@nicked_fenyx]

I agree. Trying to put myself in each person's shoes, I can understand why the sis might be upset if she believes her dad had a secret affair all along. The family needs to clear that up, either way. But putting myself in the other sibling's shoes, I would be sorely tempted to defend my dad if, after two whole years, my sister showed up to every family gathering and proceeded to treat his partner like crap and try to make Dad feel guilty for being in a happy relationship. Sis is entitled to her feelings. She's not entitled to use those feelings as a weapon to make the rest of the family miserable for years on end. She can have her feelings and still choose to be polite when around her dad and his partner.

[@easjer]

Yes ... but also no ... Sis is wrong in a lot of this. She had no right to set a timeline for her father's return to dating, and she's making a lot of assumptions yes. But she is also not entitled to the answers to her questions. They can ask and maybe the relationships won't continue without it, but nothing entitles her to that info. Mom is gone. Whatever she knew or didn't know - it's irrelevant now. Being angry with dad on mom's behalf is not healthy or productive. It is extremely difficult to believe Bonus Dad was THAT involved and mom had zero idea of what was happening or not happening or might happen in future. Unless Sis has genuine proof of her mother's distress (and if so, why didn't she confront him when the open relationship officially began instead of hiding behind it's too soon?), she's deflecting her opinion about whatever aspects of the relationship onto the mother's memory to justify her coldness.

[@sabrinusglaucomys]

I think the sister probably did deserve to be challenged in her bitterness, but that "challenge" could come through offering a listening ear and asking why she's cold toward Dad rather than telling her that she needs to change her behavior.

[@unapologeticallylizzy]

Gosh, I hate the first one. I say this as a Christian who doesn't want sex until I'm in a very committed relationship (partially for religious reasons, partially for acespec reasons, partially for just... sex terrifies me. I don't know why but I want to work on it.) I would NEVER, EVER try to force any of my beliefs onto anyone else though. They're engaged, they've been together for eight years and OP is being hugely judgemental and disrespectful. It's literally none of his business. Who his sister sleeps with and when is nothing to do with him. Honestly, even if she is putting her desire to be with her partner above her family... when her family are being like that, I get it. She does not owe them anything. The fact that it's a man trying to speak on what a woman should do with her body gives me even more of an ick.

[@iratakeuchi3031]

The last story: what if they were a polycule????? That’s how I hope it went, that would be beautiful especially considering how involved Thomas was it feels like a potentially adorable family unit.

[@Elwene2fr]

Story 1: "My house, my rules". Ok, fine and the sister didn't like the rule so she decided to not stay in the house and go to a hotel instead to respect the parents' rules in their house. OP, how is she the asshole?

[@SpookyTeaMistress]

With regards to the third story I fully think that they were in a polyamorous relationship. The fact that Thomas was there for so many significant childhood memories with both of the parents makes it seem this way.

[@ronjaj.addams-ramstedt1023]

That first case is So Bloody Creepy! ew. Ew. EW!!

[@mightymyra]

I also thought there was a possibility of a more polyamorous situ re the last one. Either a trouple (definitely seems plausible with the family photos, etc.) or an openness to multiple relationships that could be about sexuality but also potentially just the way the relationship was. Even now I have poly friends with kids who live mum, dad, kid and the kid doesn't know. Suspect they will by the time they're grown up but with previous generations quite possibly it just wouldn't have been said.

[@sarahm4669]

I have a friend who is married and has two kids, and the couple is both polyamorous and has a long term girlfriend (kids think she just regularly stays over for "sleepovers"). That's also what I thought might have happened here

[@Beanjast]

I can't at the word 'casual' do describe sex in an 8 year relationship. I can't get over it lmao.

[@heather9130]

The conservative family one lol. I was raised in a similar situation, but fortunately my family grew with me. Once they got past the shock that I sleep with my dates, they allowed anyone I was dating to share a room with me if they were in town or whatever. I remember feeling really happy because this was a mark of their acceptance that I live my own life. They sat me down for "the talk" a few times, but they didn't try to impose rules about my sex life. Forcing someone to bunk with strangers is so weird. It reads to me like they were just using the situation to make her pick a side, and then they got pikachu face when she picked her "fiance."

[@MrPotatoemouse]

@Heather Aww that’s so nice to hear that you managed to work things out with respect for each other despite your differences.

[@If-loki-was-a-fox]

In regards to the first story (adding to the conclusion, not disagreeing): As someone with a twin sister whom I have always shared a room with (on vacations and in our childhood home), there are a *lot* of non-sexual reasons to want to share a room with someone you're close to instead of random family members. My sister just happens to be the person I feel most comfortable around, and having her around in an unfamiliar location makes me feel a lot more comfortable. I would feel beyond uncomfortable sharing a room with anyone aside from my closest family members, especial if my twin wasn't there. Anyways, my point is that the couple in the first story absolutely might just like being nearby each other, and feel more comfortable like that.

[@trinidadgondi]

For the last one, while I agree with you that OP was in the wrong for telling her how to feel, I think the sister is wrong for ghosting him. If she can't forgive her dad that's fair, but she should be honest about it and maybe even go LC with the dad for a while instead of subjecting her 19-year-old brother to their passive-aggressive interactions. I think the responses (not yours, the comments) were a little harsh with a teenager that probably feels like a middle-man (even if no one asked him to) between three people he loves.

[@kiryanna]

"Get in the bin, you are the a**hole" nearly made me snort tea out my nose! Agree on all counts, particularly the first one. Hearing the brother call his sister's relationship of 8 years "casual sex" is just so icky!

[@DragonFae16]

I agree with Shaaba that the OP and his sister from the third story need to sit down with their dad and ask him what the truth about the situation was. Not talking about it is just hurting the family, so it's time to clear the air.

[@DragonFae16]

@@EyeGlassTrainofMind However, the father doesn't have the right to lie about the nature of his relationship with his new partner if in fact the daughter is right and it was an affair. If it wasn't an affair, then sure he doesn't have to explain any further. But if it was, he needs to own up to it.

[@sable1334]

@@EyeGlassTrainofMind Family members don't automatically have a right to know about each others' relationships. However, family members with whom you are close (as presumably is the case here) can reasonably expect to be informed who else you have important relationships with and the general nature of those relationships, because those relationships are theirs by proxy. If you have a child and don't inform your parents, siblings, friends and long-term romantic partners, then they have reason to be upset about the omission (unless you have decidedly ended you relationship with them, stopped being in contact with them or are otherwise not at all close). The father in this story has informed his children about his romantic partner, so he has ticked this box. However, in doing so, he has created two major implications. First that he had been romantically involved with this partner during their childhood and second that he caused his wife great emotional anguish by doing so. He is under no obligation to clarify or dispel these implications to his adult children. Is it someone's business if one person they love seriously harms another person they love? It is going to vary by relationship. However it is not unreasonable to expect the relationship between the first two to be damaged or even broken by the suspicion, especially without the third person available to provide any sort of input on how bad the harm was. The daughter does not have a right to intimate details about her father's romantic relationships. However it is reasonable for her to put knowing whether he harmed her mother as a prerequisite to having a close relationship with her father(s).

[@easjer]

@@DragonFae16 Why? He does not owe her that information. That is something that ought strictly to have been between he and his wife, and the partner. If the mom didn't know, then they successfully kept it from her and what is the point of telling people now? What good is it going to do? If the mom did know, then she was clearly ok with the parameters of the relationships, whatever they were and he has zero obligation to share such intimate details with her kids. If the daughter thought this was something that negatively impacted her mother to the degree that she wants to judge her father and cut off contact, then I guess she should ask. But that doesn't mean she's entitled to the answer. And she has clearly determined that she knows, so I don't get the impression she is open to hearing anything outside of confirmation of her opinion. The OP is correct that the mother is beyond caring at this point.

[@DragonFae16]

@@easjer Just because the truth can't hurt the mother anymore, doesn't mean it can't still do harm. The way you speak comes across as you see cheating as the private matter of the cheater alone and no one else has the right to know about it. That goes against the beliefs of the vast majority of people. Cheaters are scum. And the people who knowingly cheat with them are scum. Sure, the father can keep silent about the situation. But if he sees his silence is hurting his daughter, he's a shit father. Being a parent means you give up certain things, including your 100% right to privacy.

[@easjer]

@@DragonFae16 Sorry, no. I simply disagree that I have no right to privacy because I have kids. There are things that are simply no business of my children, and that includes the intimate details of my marriage to their father. If the father cheated, that did not impact the mother during her life - and there is ample reason to suspect there was no cheating. Daughter has made assumptions and judgments and if she chooses to make herself unhappy about something that did not affect her and cannot affect the primary person involved, I suppose that's her right. But no, categorically, having kids does not entitle them to know everything about you and your life.

[@Fabala827]

Re: that last one! My ex’s mother was with a woman while married to my ex’s father. It’s not totally clear to me whether the father knew from the start or found out/was told later, but either way, he was super in love with her mom still and wanted to be with her so much that he agreed to continuing their marriage whilst the mom and her gf continued their relationship. Eventually they did get divorced, but their relationship was clearly complicated and nuanced enough that all this played out as it did, so….who are we to say?

[@itssteph263]

I think the big issue is whether or not the mom knew, and consented to it. An affair is still an affair regardless of what gender or sex the partners are.

[@looc_96]

@@itssteph263 Also if they agree to it because they "still wanted to be with them so much" that they're willing to ignore or brush aside their own feelings. They're entitled to a happy, fulfilling relationship too!

[@Fabala827]

@@looc_96 definitely agree with both of you! The gender is irrelevant; it’s about who knew what, and what their understanding of the situation was

[@pikameer8325]

Actually I disagree strongly on that last one with everyone, I think OP is absolutely NTA. It really seemed less about telling the sister to move on with her grief about the mom's death and moreso a wakeup call because it sounds like she's being cold and/or really rude to her dad and Thomas. People need to get called out when their behavior is inappropriate, especially when the reason for her acting like this is PURE SPECULATION. OP just wants his dad and Thomas to be treated right, and personally, if I was in this situation and my brother was being rude to our parent and their partner based on pretty much nothing, I would tell him to grow up and communicate, or at the very least, be nice.

[@SarahHalina]

That first story: Oh boy. Even my grandma who is 90 and very Catholic doesn't even have this mentality. When my cousins came for my grandpa's funeral, they were wondering whether they would have to sleep in different rooms than their boyfriends, but my grandma didn't care. She's never really cared. It's one thing for the parents to have this mentality (still weird), but the brother too? I have a brother and it freaks me out to even think about him "sleeping with" people and I'm sure it freaks him out to think about me "sleeping with" people. That brother cares way too much about his sister's private life. The parents do too. Let her live her life. Second story: What even is this? I would be extremely uncomfortable if my friend's husband came onto me. This testing loyalty thing is really weird and can honestly backfire. I don't know this is odd. Glad OP went to a hotel and I hope OP cuts these people out of their lives. Their friend doesn't trust OP and it shows. Third story: Wow. Okay, everyone reacts to these things differently and process things on their own time. While yes it's possible that the dad and Thomas were having an affair while the mom was alive, I also have a hunch that mom was at least somewhat aware. If she wasn't aware, then yes it sucks that dad might have been cheating, but she died oblivious and it's weird, but there's almost a comfort in that. She died believing that she was the only person her husband loved. I think the sister has a right to be angry, but I also think that she should try to accept it so she doesn't lose both of her parents. OP needs to let his sister deal with this the way she wants to though. Maybe sit down with the dad and ask whether he was cheating and did their mom know about it. Get all the answers and then proceed accordingly. It's a difficult situation all around and everyone is just trying to move forward after the loss of the mom/wife and everyone just needs to let everyone feel what they are feeling. Who cares if everyone's feelings are different than yours. I have a strained relationship with my dad, but my brother loves him. I don't try to tell my brother that he should hate our dad because I do and my brother doesn't try to tell me that I have to love him because he does. Everyone is old enough to make their own choices and while you may no agree with them, they are valid.

[@soullesscadmium30]

I have a slight suspicion that this story is maybe from a South Asian culture and possibly very religious. There would be similar expectations of me if I were to stay with my extended family, even though my parents don't subscribe to this kind of notion. I'm actually not even allowed to introduce my boyfriend to my extended family until the year before we get married. And currently I'm not allowed to even bring him to the house I grew up in because the neighbours will know and judge me. So like, even though my parents know all about my boyfriend, it's probably gonna be years before they actually meet him.

[@nicked_fenyx]

For the last situation, I kind of agree with you, but also kind of disagree. Yes, the "kids" (adult now) need to sit down and ask the dad what happened, since not knowing is clearly having a negative impact on their family. But as far as the sister's feelings, I get why OP called her out. It sounds like, even though it's been a few years since Dad and his partner announced their relationship, Sister is still being overtly rude and causing drama over it at family gatherings. Imo, while grief affects everyone differently, after two years she needs to at least be amicable and not cause drama over the situation anymore. Here's why I think this way: while you (Shaaba) are defending Sister's right to take as long as she needs to grieve, the rest of the family also have a right to move on and be happy as a unit together. Sister's actions are interfering with that ability. I think the best compromise in this scenario would be to tell Sister that she is absolutely entitled to her feelings, but what she is not entitled to is causing drama and continuing to try her hardest to make her father feel guilty for being in a happy, long term relationship right now. After two years, I think it would be fine to ask that Sister show basic common courtesy to her father and his partner, rather than continue to punish them based on her perspective on things, making everyone else miserable in the process. Tl;dr: Sister has a right to her feelings. The rest of the family has a right to move on and be happy together. Sister is using her feelings to prevent the others in her family from exercising their right to move on. And that is *not* her right. Just my opinion, of course. I def agree w/you on the other scenarios though. ❤🏳️‍🌈

[@stormRed]

These videos always remind me of the Steven Universe song that goes like "Why don't you talk to each other... Why don't you talk to each other, just give it a try you need to talk about what happened, you really do..."

[@sorry_i_missclicked]

Here are just some of my opinions. 1. YTA. I think OP is definitely the a-hole. I think it is very strange for a family member, especially a brother, to be that concerned about what you are doing in bed with you partner of 8 years, ESPECIALLY when you and your partner are almost 30. It's not really any of their business, and it's also weird to get offended when they don't come after you were rude to them. 2. NTA. Shaaba pretty much covered it all. That was a really scummy thing of the friends to do, I would pull away from them as soon as I could. 3. This one is a complicated one. There's just a lot that we don't know about the relationship between the dad and Thomas, but I would learn toward YTA just because it isn't their job to tell the sister how to grieve should grieve. One of my closest friends (I've known and been close friends with him for 8 and a half years now) lost a family member a year or two ago. He wasn't very vocal about it, but me and other friends were there if he needed us.I know that it must have been very hard for him, and it would have been incredibly fricked up for anyone to tell him to just "get over it". That isn't anyone else's job to do, everyone grieves on their own time.

[@krankarvolund7771]

For the third one, he said in an update that he just summarized in the title. He didn't actually told her to get over it, but to stop guilting their dad over his new romantic partner, that was the real point of tension.

[@pikameer8325]

@@krankarvolund7771 ^^^ this 100%. It did not read like he was telling her how to grieve, what I got is that OP was telling his sister that she needed to stop being a dick to their dad and his partner. Her behavior is absolutely in the wrong here because it's based on an assumption and she's taking that out on the family. This is independent (as much as it can be) from the grief stemming from the death of the mother.

[@angel-ke9vs]

"casual sex" how disrespectful 😫

[@aShadeBolder]

so, family 1, why? why aren't they jumping for joy that they now have a whole bedroom (sister's old room) available for someone who would otherwise have to double up? why are they not overjoyed to tell the uncles they no longer have to bunk with their (probably significantly younger) not-quite-nephew-in-law? why no sigh of relief that they're down 2 adults in the frantic morning bathroom rush? why is everyone more interested in supposedly illicit sex that might not even be happening than they are in the practical, logistical benefits of the hotel down the road? "friends" in 2, if a person is upset that you did the thing, the "it was just a joke" defense always makes you the arsehole. yes, there are details that call B & husband's relationship into question, but none of that matters to the judgement. dad 3 was totally with Thomas while married. affair? beard? polyamory? idk. I get that brother shouldn't have gotten in the middle like that, but I get why he did.

[@JhericFury]

Thomas was there for every major life event? I can't help thinking whatever Thomas' relationship with the parents, the mum knew.

[@HonorWillow]

Sharing a bed as a couple isn't just about sex (at least it shouldn't be). It's about comfort and the nice bond of having someone next to you. It's safety knowing they are there. It's an opportunity for intimacy like cuddling! Also marriage is a social construct and, though important to many people, is a stupid thing to hinge a rule on or to hinge the quality or commitment of a couple. It is really the easiest part of having a long term relatioship

[@polinanikulina]

Re the 1st: authoritarian personalities often have an exaggerated interest in OTHER people's sex lives. Look it up, the research is interesting and sadly still relevant

[@SLYKM]

Second one was a perfect response to the "prank," not the AH for a little bit.

[@Ethanwithoutsleep]

I love your videos. Not only because they are fun to watch, but because I learned a lot about how to have a healthy conversation with the most different people. Also as a transguy beeing together with my boyfriend since 1½ year, you and Jamie are the cutest couple an I hope i always have such a healthy relationship.

[@erikken1039]

The second story is super crazy, would never imagine people would put up such twisted tactics to see if their friends are loyal. That woman has got big trust issues. Imagine if her husband really made up with her friend. 😀

[@juniper617]

Just as you don’t get to police your children’s sexual/romantic activities, you also don’t get to judge your parents’. My widowed father (90M) started dating my widowed mother-in-law (86F) some months after my mother died in 2021, and as long as they don’t make my husband and me into step-siblings, we couldn’t be happier. (And probably even if they did, honestly.) My mother wouldn’t want my dad to be alone, and she loved my MIL. And anyway, she’s dead; she can’t be harmed by anything that happens now. My FIL died 9 years ago, in case anyone is wondering. MIL hasn’t dated anyone else.

[@helenblakovich1622]

That first one - I understood it was about sex, but these people have taken it to a crazy level. She said that her fiance would have to sleep in the basement with her uncles, which implies that even married couples are kept separate. WTeverlovingF??

[@LadyAneh]

Lol! I love how the little a$$hole badge snuck up from the bottom. 😅 So glad you’re doing a series of these- they’re always a treat. Exactly-it’s nobody’s business what adult funtime activities are or aren’t happening behind closed doors. (As long as it’s not excessively noisy, I think.) OP and the parents are definitely the a-holes.

[@salamanda11]

I want the kids in the last one to just ask their dad! I think it’s reasonable for them to wonder if there was stuff going on with Thomas before their mom died, and reasonable for them to be concerned that it was cheating. And like you said, maybe it wasn’t cheating, and the dad could clear it up. The kids should stop arguing with each other and just address it with their dad!

[@nicnacsnonsense]

My question on the last one is is the problem that the sister is still bitter or is the problem the way she is treating dad and Thomas because she's still bitter; what exactly does OP mean by "never overly friendly"? If she's keeping her distance, but still being cordial, then OP is in the wrong for trying to dictate her grief. But if she's being passive aggressive or cold to the point of cruelty, then the sister would be the one in the wrong. She's entitled to her grief, but she's not entitled to treat people however she wants because of that grief. Similarly, you can't put a timeline on someone's grief, but it is fair to say that hey, we were willing to cut you some slack when you behaved inconsiderately in the early days of your grief, but at a certain point we're not going to let you use that as an excuse for any bad behavior you engage in; you are allowed to grieve for as long as you need to, but at a certain point you need to learn to manage those emotions so you can treat other people respectfully. (Of course, if the dad actually was having an affair then that may have an effect on how much respect sister feels he deserves, which would be fair, though personally I do feel a lavender marriage or some kind of polyamory is a more likely explanation here.)

[@shhimreading906]

kinda want them to just ask the dad what went on while his wife was alive. i'm nosy, i gots to know

[@sarahwithstars]

"Sounds suspicious" Def suss That arsehole radar is on point!

[@KaylaChan90]

First person is def the AH. I do wonder what, after 8 years, made the sister and her partner decide to put their foot down. Totally their right to of course and in no way the ah for doing so, but am curious the reason for the change that the brother left out.

[@freddie.spaghetti]

calling it casual sex when they’ve literally been engaged for years is hillarious to me. like, very dumb. but pretty funny skddjfj

[@robertofontiglia4148]

On that last one : so Dad was having an affair with Thomas, Mom didn't know, but Thomas was around at every significant occasion in the kids' lives? WTF ? I'm pretty sure Mom knew, tbh.

[@madeleineprentice8008]

I agree with the first one. When I'm coming home, I always consider if I want to bring my spouse-to-be, because my parents have this same rule. Sometimes, I just decide to go without them or maybe not stay the night. That said, my parents aren't shaming me for 'casual sex' that makes me not want to stay, but rather their rampant homophobia, transphobia, racism, etc.

[@availanila]

And for my culture it's _culture_ not religious prudishness. Even my parents married thirty five years can't share a room at their parents' places and my grandparents at my parents. It's not their domain. My sister is married in a culture where not only can she and her husband not share a room, she can't be around his father and uncles alone. And staying at a hotel while with family is an insult. I get his point from the cultural side but not the whole thing over "casual sex." But then again the bar for "married" is so low in my country I was considered married for dating a guy two weeks. You literally don't have to live with your "spouse" around here, it's weird.

[@SRHtheHedgehog]

I'm really not sure why puritanical people act like not being married automatically makes sex more meaningful, and that not getting married for a long time automatically makes sex some kind of thing they do for some animalistic gratification and nothing else, even if they've been in an extremely long term relationship. If anything, expecting people to rush to get married so that they have sex "properly" makes marriage have less meaning.

[@sunflowerspirited4974]

I definitely think the queer dad one deserves some nuance from his kids if they would just sit down and talk to him about it. Daughter should really let him know why she’s been so distant with him and Thomas so he can clarify what actually happened while their mom was still alive. That being said the son shouldn’t put a time frame on his sister’s grief, especially when she thinks their dad cheated on their mom. She’s allowed to be mad at him for that if it’s true, and she’s allowed to be sad that her mom died for the rest of her life because that’s a traumatic thing.

[@krankarvolund7771]

He clarified in an update that he didn't told her to move on with her grief, only to let her dad have a new relationship ^^

[@Toaster-draws]

1st post- YTA- OP sounds really creepy in this post. Also, why is he calling it "casual sex" if she's sleeping with her partner of 8 years? Would her and her partner want to have sex in the same house her family is in? Not all couples share a bed just to have sex. Does anyone know if there's an update on the first post?

[@BeasEasel]

The "I didn't choose to be born" argument didn't work in my house because my parents are Mormon and would always answer back with something about how we did choose to be born when we were in the pre-existence, which is just impossible to argue with because they refuse to see it any other way. :/

[@kittysunlover]

...but also, if I can't remember choosing it, does it really matter? Does it still give you the right to treat me like property and choose how I live my life? Wasn't the whole "war in heaven" supposed to be about agency and our right to choose things ON EARTH? And shouldn't that include changing our minds about how we want to live?? I'm right there with you, buddy. *fist bump of solidarity*

[@BeasEasel]

@@kittysunlover Yeah the whole thing is ridiculous because it sets out a bunch of rules about how the world works that I don't get to choose whether or not I believe because my belief is irrelevant and it'll still be used as an argument against me regardless of the lack of proof or my personal beliefs. Glad I moved out of my parents' house years ago and eventually cut them off because their way of thinking was seriously damaging my mental health and they did little to fix it. Literally every issue I had that I tried to make known to get help and support with was answered with "pray and read your scriptures more."

[@kittysunlover]

@@BeasEasel Oh, friend. I'm sorry that you had to go through that. I understand very well, as my situation was quite similar. I am so glad for you that you were able to get out of that environment and do better for your own mental health and well being. I hope you are thriving now and able to live a fully realized life of your own choosing.

[@BeasEasel]

@@kittysunlover Thanks

[@Donice09]

I feel like the last story was a lavender marriage. It was really common for gay men back in the days to marry and have a family with a close female friend, who would also know about the relationship (or sometimes they would also be gay) whilst having a male partner in reality as a way of hiding their homosexuality. OP should ask if that was the case.

[@josephinedykstra3383]

Sigh... my family has the same rule as the first family, to the point that my sister's boyfriend (they've been dating for 5+ years and live together) sleeps on the couch when they visit my parents. I think it's outdated, etc, but... whatever. The brother is still an A-hole.

[@aurorafraire2528]

With the last OP it could have been that when his mother was on her deathbed and knew she was going to die she encouraged the dad to seek comfort about her death from Thomas because she knew that there may have been something between them that she wouldn't have encouraged beforehand but when she was dying she might have felt that her husband should find somebody else who the dad could love when she died.

[@peechykean]

I think so many of these situations could be avoided if instead of 'calling someone out' they 'just had a conversation'.

[@knate44]

For the last one, I think neither sibling is technically the asshole, because grief is hard. Also shout out to my ethical non-monogomous folks in case it was like a menage a trois or a other consensual polyamorours relationship.

[@Vox-Multis]

Something that really bugs me about the first one is that in spite of the fact that this is the parents' rule, the brother seems to have taken upon himself to jump on his sister and condemn her on their behalf before (even by his own admission) they can get a word in edgewise. For all we know, the parents might've been like "You know what? You're engaged, you've been together eight years, I think that counts." But before they can even consider it, the brother comes out swinging and the parents might feel like they're now locked in on enforcing their rule to the letter. Notwithstanding the existence of the rule itself, we really don't get much of a sense on where the parents stand here aside from a general "we all think" from the brother, which could very well involve some projection.

[@Julessa]

I agree with all your conclusions. The last situation is rough. I hope they have a conversation with their dad and make up.

[@eloidasarmi6815]

The last one with Thomas, mid listening the story I was like: "Ok, now just take your sister and go talk to dad" 😂

[@hannahk1306]

Wow... you found some real creeps in this one! Also, how can you be upset with someone over something you don't even know if they've actually done?

[@16poetisa]

When my college boyfriend came to visit me, my parents asked me not to sleep in his room because they "didn't know how to explain it" to my little brother. The thing is, we weren't doing anything with them there anyway. I was just getting in bed with him in the morning to cuddle. Another time he came to Thanksgiving at our family's old house, and my aunt had roomed me with my sister and cousin, so I'd have to share with one of them. I waited until right when we were all going to bed and moved my things into his room. My cousin asked me if I was "allowed" to do that. I just shrugged. I'd rather share a bed with my boyfriend anyway, and since my he was from California, he wasn't used to old houses and was kinda scared of sleeping by himself lol. I will say, since my dad's one of six and the old house is pretty remote, sometimes the sleeping arrangements are awkward like that. I shared a room with my uncle once when I was visiting my grandparents and it was no big deal. A bit weird to ask of a non-family member, though. That's what air mattresses are for.

[@krankarvolund7771]

4:10 Not even speaking about sex, I don't like sharing a room with my siblings, we do it sometimes, I can bite the bullet. But with brother in laws? No way, I don't know you enough, unless it's an emergency there's no way I sleep with them XD Honestly, I would've said something the first year, not the eight one sister's husband is already heroic for putting up witht that gig for so long XD And also she's a bad daughter because she wants to go to the hotel rather than to her overcrowded family house? What? That's absurd XD

[@kated2147]

Something I always think is crazy about the conservative family stories is, do they really think anything is actually going to happen? Like, time and place! If you’re in the same house as very conservative family, it’s pretty unlikely that they’re going to want to do anything because it’d be weird. Almost had something like that going to my uncle’s for thanksgiving this year, he was going to have my boyfriend(35) stay in a room with my triplet cousins who are 14…. We ended up staying at his aunt’s house who also lived nearby instead.

[@ravenstormchild6491]

While op can’t tell his sister how to grieve, sister can’t tell dad how he moves on…

[@eklectiktoni]

Since I come from a very traditional family myself, I think I can clarify some things on the first one. #1 I'm pretty sure "engaged" means the brother doesn't actually feel like his sister will ever marry her SO. #2 It might seem like the family is overly concerned with the sister's sex life, but their behavior isn't at all shocking to me (someone who's lived in the Bible Belt southern part of the US for over two decades). In a lot of traditional families, there is the expectation that you should marry before having sex. Those who deviate from this expectation are usually pressured to hurry up and get married so their union can be seen as "legitimate" or "honorable". A lot of parents where I live have a similar "not in my house" attitude when it comes to their children having sex with an unmarried partner. It might sound crazy and strange (especially in 2023) but that's just how it is in certain communities. 🤷🏾‍♀ Personally, I think he went too far. He (and the parents) are allowed to have their views, but they can't (and shouldn't) force the sister to live her life the way they want her to.

[@ChibiRandom13]

I think the last one is too nuanced for us to guess on what was going on with the dad, the mom, and Thomas. But I do not specifically think OP was being an asshole. I don't also think he wasn't! The answers to the poor guy aren't very helpful, but here's my thought process: he's clearly worried and trying to articulate that to his sister, altho he did it in an AH way. The thing I would suggest to him is to ask the dad and the sister to have a sit down talk about this. It's clearly bothering his sister and since he knows that's what's bothering her he could (could being operative word here bc it may be too meddlesome idk) suggest a talk to one or both of them to let them figure it out together.

[@nixhixx]

Mostly agree, but I don't think adult children DO have a 'right' to know a parent's full relationship history.

[@rosieg6989]

Maybe not full relationship history, but it is quite clear that the not knowing is causing the sister tremendous mental distress, and it would be ethical to try and help her by telling the truth.

[@sophyoung920]

the first family is a massive red flag. its probs nothing to do with sex, and everything to do with that couple needing a room where they can chill and unwind and get away. If he's sharing a room with uncles, and cannot go in his fiancee's room, then he has no way of taking a break if things get too uncomfortable. Which is likely considering the family and their odd behaviour and expectations.

[@hopegold883]

Re the second one: once again, not ok to involve outsiders in your kinks without consent. .

[@shirleyjeanpilger3482]

I would bet my life mom knew since she was also at every event. No woman would be that blind to romantic interest of her husband with another person - - - for years.

[@bluexwings]

Last story: I totally understand how OP's sister felt that was too soon. Generally it's expected that one should wait a minimum of year or so to date/introduce a new partner to children after a spouse passes away. I also agree that it sounds like they had something going on in the past. Perhaps it would be good for OP to discuss that topic in a calm, adult manner (as they are all adults) while talking with her dad & Thomas. Or perhaps as a family. It might give her sister some peace to know the truth, if it the situation had consent from all parties. I hope they are able to resolve some of the tension- that is a long time to carry that grief and feel alone.

[@sami5261]

After seeing this today I have been binging these the whole day while washing and ironing and cooking. I just can't stop, but might have seen all now.

[@emeraldqueen1994]

When you’re grieving you’ll recover at your own time… wether it takes you 2 years or 20 years, it is valid!!

[@yellowbubble7]

My parents can actually one up that first family. When I was around 3 or 4, my grandfather and his fiancé (his first wife had died around six years before) came to visit. We had one guest room. My parents had me sleep in a sleeping bag in their room, assigned my grandfather my bed, and his fiancé the guest room because they didn't want them to set a "bad" example. My grandfather ended up started off the night in my room, then sneaking to the guest room for the entire visit. And little me I couldn't figure out why I couldn't just have my bed.

[@EloquentTroll]

I can't imagine a scenario where Mom didn't know about Dad and Thomas doing stuff if they were doing stuff. My brain sees a polyamorous triad, but I am polyamorous so I am predisposed to leaning towards that hypothesis. Also OP had 2 dads and mom, that sounds awesome.

[@barrylangille3523]

"I wish I gave in to that great guy then" wasn't a bad response. WHY would you want to test your new friends (and I thought this was an old friend?) The woman and her husband are playing with fire and got a little singed. I wouldn't want them as friends since they need some kind of cringy initiation ceremony to reassure wifey she doesn't have competition. Does he get her to come on to his guy friends?

[@anony-missy]

Also, the husband constantly seeking her out to flirt with her and asking her out even after she clearly indicated she wasn’t interested is edging into sexual harassment territory for me.

[@barrylangille3523]

@@anony-missy exactly. It's creepy enough that they have to "test" the wife's "friends" to make sure they don't want to poach her husband, but pursuing it after he's been told to stop is worse. It's also the kind of thing you'd expect from adolescents. Well, apologies to adolescents everywhere. I'm thinking of immature adolescents who haven't been brought up right.

[@Fruityflootloops]

13:22 Yep, happened with my parents but my mom is actually bi not a lesbian. They were still “monogamous” but she had some “fun” with a woman or two with permission. My dad however refused to agree to overall open up the marriage for himself so he just straight up cheated on my mom a lot.

[@hellyhellhound]

man that first one was crazy

[@danielreher1987]

I agree with all of your verdict's. The last one is tough. I think their father deserves happiness. If the daughter can't deal with it that's up to her.

[@renedemers8218]

That last scenario reads a lot like the father, "Thomas" and the mother with polyamorous, that much involvement in the family is usually a lot more tangled than not.

[@kooskoos1234]

For the first one -if i understood it correctly- OP’s family: “well if you stay here you can’t sleep with your partner until marriage” OP’s sister: “okay I’ll stay at a hotel then” OP’s family: *surprised pikachu face*

[@sd7785]

I wonder if the first family know that people can have sex outside of bedrooms...

[@lucialma]

Also, I agree with other commenters that there are throuple vibes in the last story. “Bonus Dad,” him being in their family photos, etc. There was a very similar situation in my family. My uncle had a male best friend during his marriage to my aunt, and after they divorced due to her infidelity, he started dating (and eventually married) his best friend. Even after they had been together for YEARS, my uncle’s husband did not join into family photos of my uncle and my cousins. He’s not in the family pictures from my wedding, and they’d been together 12 years at the time (granted, they kept their relationship very private for many years, did the classic “we’re roommates” thing, so that was a factor) But yeah, I can’t imagine the mom didn’t know because clearly she accepted Thomas as a family member.

[@nj586]

Story 1: Wouldn't they also be afraid of him sleeping with the uncles? No? Interesting

[@easjer]

When my sister was engaged back in the mid-90's, my parents were very conservative and despite the fact my sis and her fiance lived together, said no sleeping in the same room in our house until marriage (my brother and I being younger and impressionable, you see). Not that there was anything but fold-out couches for them to sleep on anyway, but they did make their intent clear, which looking back was kind of rude. But my parents offered to pay for a hotel room for one or both of them, so they weren't total assholes. My sister was unamused when my husband and I slept in the same rooms when were dating, but not because she was monitoring my sex life. She didn't appreciate the hypocrisy (but times had changed and my parents divorced so it was all different).

[@LadyQuotes]

Your rules, your house, that's cool, but then you don't get to be made if people don't want to go to your house because of your rules.

[@TransGuyShane]

If I am ever in an aita situation, i will defo be going to shaaba for advice lol ♡

[@badyherz]

At 7:14 you said that giving children different rooms is okay. I can't understand that. For me it was always forbidden to stay in the same bed or room with my friends (private or on school/social trips) They always wanted me to stay with random boys and people I don't know. It was scary, and sometimes I fled and slept outside, because I felt uncomfortable being with people I don't know instead of my friends. Just because people assume I would have sex with my friends. Disgusting.

[@UltraPrimal]

When Shaaba said "you know what time it is" did anyone else think of that Lizzo song?

[@MajesticJewnicorn]

The first one- I am the opposite. I need my own room because hubby snores and I have health issues and need lots of sleep so whenever we stay over, I'm the one insisting on separate rooms. I think they agree based on my... lack of cognition due to a lack of sleep lol

[@itssteph263]

My fiance's grandparents don't share a room. Grandpa has sleep apnea, which makes him snore really loudly, and he has to be on a CPAP machine.

[@bradiedean7466]

Last story: it's also possible that the parents were in either an open or closed triangle polyamorous relationship

[@AichanKitsune]

With the first family, I relate a lot. My fiance and I got engaged just before covid, and we have not been married yet, as it's expensive and name changes cost a bundle. It's fine to have a long engagement. Secondly, as an ace person (my fiance and I both are) I can vouch for the fact that sleeping in the same bed does not equal banging XD