Captain 'Sully' Sullenberger shares insight into pilot shortage

With an alarming pilot shortage on the horizon, Captain Chesley “Sully” Sullenberger weighs in on proposals to raise the retirement age and reduce number of training hours. “Diminishing the standards is absolutely the worst thing we could do,” he says. “It would be more effective to encourage more people to join aviation and do some financial assistance to widen the catchment area that we can have more people come into the aviation industry.”
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#flying #plane #captainsully

[@charlesharrell3643]

It’s ironic that the same industry that took advantage of an oversupply of pilots by paying extremely low wages, especially for pilots on the regional level, are now complaining about pilot shortages. You reap what you sow.

[@soonerguy8011]

Yeah now they are paying us regional guys six figures just to sign the paper

[@micclay]

Every industry is going to pay wages according to supply and demand. Any company that doesn't won't be around for long, as competitors will out price them.

[@TitaniumTurbine]

⁠@@micclay You’re forgetting one critical element which is that commercial aviation requires years of training to become a certified commercial pilot. Anyone looking to become a pilot will reasonably look at the average salary for the position and decide to go a different path, which is how we eventually ended up with a pilot shortage in the first place. The whole “free market” and “supply/demand” argument is a bad one here. You cannot compare highly specialized career positions like this in the same vein as consumer goods, like iPhones. Pilots (and many other careers) should be paid what they’re worth at minimum and then there should be competitive pay on top of that. I made a higher salary working from home than airline pilots and it required no personal/financial investments or years of rigorous training.

[@jasonchristopher5316]

The problem with an airline pilot career is the high barrier to entry. The upfront cost is too expensive for most. An effective solution would be airlines creating their own training programs where they cover each student's tuition. The graduates then remain employed with the airline for an agreed number of years. To offset the airline's expense incurred from the training costs, new pilots can receive a lower income until the amount is recouped, or some other viable alternative. Airlines like United have implemented their own programs but it's not sponsored. Any scholarships they offer are based on eligibility, not admission. So the shortage is not because of a lack of interest, but a lack in personal capital. It doesn't have to be a complicated issue, but it seems any social initiative involving profit margins tends to generate undue resistance.

[@jimw8615]

Abs initio program

[@MrSweetAsbru]

There is no pilot shortage. It's a shortage of 1000hr pilots. Many folks get a PPL and give up as they see their instructors still there after years trying to find a good right seat job.

[@jimw8615]

@@MrSweetAsbru heard of MPL programs? 100hr on a GA aircraft. Then straight to a Jet. After the Sim, you are in the right hand seat.

[@MrSweetAsbru]

@@jimw8615 and you think there's no shortage of guys wanting to sign up for those? I've been to a pilot job interviews where there was a lawyer and even doctors wanting a career change to be a pilot. It's not a lack of supply that is the issue.

[@jimw8615]

@@MrSweetAsbru so how’s yr interview?

[@bornwithoutboundariestarot]

I sent my son to Embry Riddle Aeronautical University and his 4 year bachelors degree in Aviation, along with the flight training and certificates, cost me $500,000. I will be In debt for the rest of my life. How is this the pathway to more pilots? It’s exclusionary and exploitive.

[@MrSuperStar4ever]

500k😳 My cost me 68k

[@LACSACR]

Why would you invite Sully for a 2min interview? At least 15min-30min talk!

[@SimPilotMika]

One of the universal reasons why I can’t be a pilot (when I want to) is because it’s incredibly expensive. I’m not spending $100k on a “maybe”

[@MrSweetAsbru]

I did..and yeah it's a bigmaybe In my PPL class only 1 out of 20+ got a job at a big airline and hes flying for Cathay as a second officer. The rest gave up after getting ratings, still instructing or flying Cessna's in small dodgy aerodromes in Africa or south east Asia making no money.

[@juliamaxwellmarin]

I have tremendous respect for Captain Sullenberger. My salute you sir.

[@RobOnRefresh]

The problem as Sully mentioned is primarily financial. Getting all the certifications and hours (1500+) needed to fly commercially with an airline takes a serious commitment. Plus, after spending close to $100k to obtain those certs and hours, there is no guarantee you'll get a job making six figures. It all depends on circumstances, your networking abilities, and a wee bit of luck. It can certainly happen but it's a super long road for those who make it. Many work for years as a CFI (certified flight instructor) making peanuts just to get those hours.

[@bengarcia9612]

Taking ATP as an example, as its the largest flight school in the US, it takes 1yr+ at typically just over 100,000$, then you work as a flight instructor through them for 2 years at 17$/hr. Ridiculous

[@EricaBeee]

I agree with Captain Sully. I’m a second career, student pilot and it is expensive! I have been applying for scholarships left and right! Pray for me. I really want to fly.

[@rohenry9962]

Go fly in the military, they pay for flight school. Serve 10 years, lots of cool experiences, build leadership skills and discipline. Then get out and fly for the airlines.

[@0226memo]

Sully is and always will be a great pilot. But I disagree with him that mentioning the standards and flight hour requirements is the " worst " thing we could do. Just because a pilot builds 1500 hours in a Cessna DOES NOT mean he/she will be a good airline pilot. it all boils down to training. as a pilot, we spend all that time getting to 1500 just to get a job at the airlines, and for the first six months, we get trained to forget everything we were taught at a flight academy, and we are retrained on how to fly an airliner, which is completely different. if they really want to fix the pilot shortage, they need to either lower the flight hour requirements to something more reasonable/attainable, or lower the cost of training.

[@0226memo]

and for those who would say, oh just go to the Instructor route and pay your dues like everybody else had to do. That is starting to bite people in the butt because I’ve met tons and tons of instructors who don’t care about the student, they just care about the next 10 hours that they’re going to get in the plane. Which in turn means that they’re passing pilots for check rides, and flight reviews that shouldn’t be getting passed. Which means more mistakes and more accidents down the line.

[@armongabril7283]

Solution: Do what Europe Has Done, there’s a reason they don’t have a Pilot Shortage, it’s this Wonderful Thing Called, Making Pilot School Affordable by Airlines co signing with student pilots and having them agree to have a contract with the airline. That’s why most pilots in the FO seat are in there early-mid 20’s by the time they are flying A320’s, not in there 30’s starting in the regionals. Don’t hear any safety issues over there.

[@soonerguy8011]

It’s changing now, but airlines in the US don’t want young pilots and never did

[@armongabril7283]

@@soonerguy8011 Which is sad to be honest, here it’s how much ur parents got makes u break it or make it, rather than the skill of the actual individual. The U.S being behind in education vs overseas has been nothing new for years.

[@stevechance150]

If you want to see how to do something right, whether it's flight school, or healthcare, or adorable Universities, look to the European countries. Don't look to the United States of "Profit is Our God" America.

[@natthaphonnoble7946]

@@armongabril7283 for real same with regular colleges a lot of the kids at big universities come from a well financed family or higher average. You would be surprised just how few of them actually are on scholarships or academic awards. Money money money money, also a-lot of them are also in debt or financing there way as well.

[@mikelindellspillow2609]

Airlines need to do a 10 year commitment plan. Fly for that airline for 10 years and they cover the tuition debt. Kind of like the GI Bill.

[@Burnlit1337]

Or just go into the service as pilot of a fixed wing aircraft. Yes you have to change your lifestyle but if you go to Airforce or the army's airforce then it's not as bad.

[@rohenry9962]

@@Burnlit1337Exactly this is my path. I’m going Navy tho.

[@soonerguy8011]

Some airlines are…. But no union nor pilot would sign that

[@micclay]

ATP flight academy can be financed all the way through.

[@andry954305]

LOL most pilots who earned their licenses before 2009 only needed 250 hours to get to the airlines. The Union that represents the same pilots and all current us airline pilots (ALPA) doesn't want congress to drop the hours from the current 1500 because it purposely creates a barrier to entry which at the same time creates a shortage of pilots. We all know how supply and demand works and what it does to salaries. They might say its a safety issue but it's really not as most pre 2009 pilots only had 250 hours and you don't see them crashing planes every year or so, they just want to keep getting pay rises. Which i guess is good for current pilots but not that kid that has always dreamt of being one but cant get in cause of the high costs of training and lack of banks willing to give you a loan.

[@drew8979]

I looked into it and my Post 9/11 GI bill will not cover my private pilots license and then from there it gets super expensive.

[@gvue4396]

Theres no shortage, its the 1500 required hours. CFIs cant get hours if no one signs up. There should be pilot training and pilot shadowing to make up those hours.

[@SamIIs]

Kids don't even want to drive cars forget about jets.

[@paletobay1017]

They should push to make it more easy for people to get into aviation

[@FlyShamu]

Outstanding Capt!

[@scottcampbell7249]

How bout making the training more affordable, cost is a big deterrent for most people. Most of the recent aviation incidents mentioned are primarily maintenance induced so place more emphasis on maintenance training & safety . Also programs like Civil Air Patrol are grossly overlooked and these type of programs get the future generation interested in aerospace.

[@6862ptc]

Everyone seems to ignore the fact that the airlines are currently flying smaller narrow body aircraft domestically then they did a few decades ago. These smaller aircraft carry far less passengers than wide body aircraft, requiring more aircraft (more pilots) to fly the airline's system schedule. In the 1970's airlines were flying DC-10s, A300s, L-1011s and 747 on U.S. domestic routes. After 9/11, airlines retired their domestic wide-body fleets in favor of RJs, MD-88s, 717, A320s and A220s. Airlines need to switch back to flying widebodies on domestic U.S. flights. Larger aircraft fly MORE PEOPLE with LESS PILOTS. Problem solved.

[@dimitristripakis7364]

I think regionals have few passengers per flight, so larger aircraft will simply have more empty seats.

[@6862ptc]

@@dimitristripakis7364 ?

[@xplayman]

It’s too expensive, period. As a kid I didn’t even dream of a career in aviation because I grew up with a single mother collecting food stamps and being raised in project housing. Did I want to do it? Of course! But as a poor kid I knew aviation wasn’t for poor people like us. As a kid I knew I didn’t stand a chance. Wasn’t until my 30s that I got a literal lucky break to start. I’m progressing so quickly because of my lucky break and I’m talking with other pilots who are stuck part way through because they cannot afford to continue. Some people who have been working on it for 10 years (the cost has skyrocketed since the 1,500 hour rule). Many people don’t even want to start only to get stuck part way through like some of these other pilots. Make it more affordable. Get financial assistance into aviation careers. And not just talking college either, because the college I went to for graphic design also had an aviation program where their administrators said tuition does not cover fuel or checkrides. Imagine!

[@gavinthehammer5390]

The one big roadblock I’ve hit in my aviation journey is being type 1 diabetic. Yes the FAA has now allowed type 1 diabetics to obtain their class 1 and 2 medicals to fly commercially. But they are super strict about it. And they have all these regulations and if you don’t meet those requirements then they can pull your medical. Then I’m out of a job and thousands in debt

[@TheHealthyAmericanPeggyHall]

So no one is pointing out the fact that so man pilots became human pinchusions as the cause for the "shortage"?

[@loveoneanotherasihaveloved8327]

Seems like he went through a lot of work to come on a show for 35 seconds

[@TheShooter95]

I am currently have about $135,000 in student loan debt at 17% interest to pay for flight school and I still need to work full-time to afford the cost of living. The federal government should help students finance this education.

[@SKS8080]

And part of the problem no one was to go in the military anymore

[@chromebomb]

i luv sully

[@topofthegreen]

If there was a pilot shortage, they would allow pilots to fly past 65, reduce trains hours back to 250 quality hours, that would work.

[@erauprcwa]

ICAO will not allow pilots to exceed the age of 65. The US is not all of Aviation. Also, many people flying that age, don't fly as much, so raising the age means nothing.

[@jimw8615]

MPL program?

[@topofthegreen]

pilots should not fly over 65.

[@19ld]

There you go…

[@MS-nm2kt]

Look captain sully we all do respect but america is the only country that has this 1500 flight hrs Europe and others offer 275 or something like this they have busy airports but don’t have the amount of incursions like we do so the hrs are not the problem it’s something else reduce the flight hrs have the regions stop using pilots as slaves and watch how we solve the shortage in America

[@TheAlexIceman]

🤙🏿

[@beepbeep1281]

He shaved off his mustache I almost didn’t recognize him.

[@ctbt1832]

I heard spirit is laying off over 200 pilots

[@oreojsn92]

Absolutely too expensive. I dreamt of flying as a kid, but to shore up $80-$100k for flight school? Then spend another 1-2 years collecting the minimum 1500hrs before I can fly commercially? No thanks. I spent $6500 for truck driving school and was licensed in 3 weeks. Loan paid off in a year. Nearly 10 years on, I'm making a healthy 6 figures. The barrier to entry was significantly cheaper. Drop that a couple notches, and you'll solve the pilot shortage.

[@blue81blue81]

The financial aspect is a factor but no more than any other professional career....doctor, dentist, lawyer, CPA, engineer. They all cost thousands in education and training.. The pilot career simply isn't attracting as many people. First the word pilot is obsolete. There's very little flying done on todays jet flight deck. You push buttons and shuffle paper work. It's BORING! . You sit there and sit there and sit there. Not to mention you better have a law degree to keep yourself out of trouble in todays complex aviation legalities. The military is not providing the supply of pilots to the civilian world it once did. They have their own pilot shortage. And then there is the time away from home. If you are single great. But with a spouse and kids you will miss birthdays, soccer games, holidays. You will be spending Christmas Eve in some hotel in Little Rock or San Jose. Then when you upgrade you have to start all over with seniority. Are you going to move to your new domicile?......or commute? Commuting can be a nightmare. These are the real realities of the job. Trust me it gets old!....which has caused folks to select other careers and current pilots to take early retirement. Lastly, just because you can fly doesn't mean you are airline pilot material. That's what interviews are for. With the heat lamp on some wilt. Those are the last folks you want at the controls when things go bad. There are not enough strong candidates to fill all the crew seats. Period.

[@scottp6539]

BUT The Airlines WON'T hire many people like me! 7500 SAFE Flying hours with 121/135 experience! 15b years experience!! My issue is I am NOT Current! The Airline REFUSE To help people like me get Current! I've been told their are LOTS of Pilots like me out there 50 something with LOTS of hours! YES Training cost WAY TO MUCH! is the other issue! The Airlines can ONLY Blame themselves!