When air springs leave you flat! CAR WIZARD shows the headaches of air suspension on 2015 Panamera

[@Panamera2014]

The Arnott air spring is $455 at fcpeuro. The Porsche part is $1854. BTW, fcp gives lifetime warranty on any parts purchased. While OEM is always preferred, at some point the price difference just makes no sense, especially on a kind of beat example like this one.

[@houseofno]

That's just for one. If one is bad, the other is likely not far behind. Unless you just like paying for the same labor twice.

[@davidpackphoto]

@@houseofno But it's not the same labor.... It's twice the labor, it's not like you have to remove one sides spring to remove the other.

[@Nordic_Mechanic]

arnott often deletes the active valving in the struts so beware. I steer people away from them on the 04-10 audi a8 cause thats the case on that model

[@ruwithlee1970]

My 1987 Lincoln mark 7 had air suspension a they wanted a fortune to fix it, I deleted it and and put a race Spring conversion kit in it Is way cheaper! Basically a Mustang came in handy!

[@Nordic_Mechanic]

@@ruwithlee1970 It's a choice if you want to make your comfy car sporty instead.

[@loufaiella3354]

If I saw a car with 20" wheels, a partial wrap, "custom exhaust", and other custom features, i would RUN as fast as I could! You can almost certainly bet it was abused and maintenance money was diverted to "cool" stuff! As I get older I appreciate Basic engineering as done by the factory. It's tough to find basic cars anymore. These cars are money pits!

[@philb707]

All the people I know with "20 inch wheels, a partial wrap, "custom exhaust", and other custom features" maintain their cars better than you. Car enthusiasts of a certain age take care of their cars, dont make a broad assumption like that

[@elenarobert]

Who ever owns this has been racing, judging by the after market rotors, non reflecting finish on hood, and scrapes on the bottom of the car. He probably could not afford the dealership!!!

[@terry-zi7eh]

20’s were probably stock. Someone put 22’s on and there goes the neighborhood

[@anthonyxuereb5410]

very well said

[@mig0s]

These come with 20" wheels stock lol

[@keithcurtis6671]

Alternate conclusion...The original owner made the best decision for themselves by using the least expensive air spring possible and dumping the car while it was still working. Sure, he screwed the dealer and subsequent owner, but he saved $.

[@that1guy82]

Thats what i was thinking. The guy that did the work saved some money, but cost the new owner money. Sounds like he is getting a whole new set tho.

[@russelljacob7955]

And at the depreciation. Get that suspension fixed and into a detailer for a bit of black cleanup? New owner still making off better. If I had to tinfoil hat? Looks like original owner loved to park by feel. I am betting hit a curb which is also a reason for the new wheels.

[@gglen2141]

I like the way you think.

[@discerningmind]

This is one of the common things that people do to dealerships. We always think that dealerships are the bad guys but people lie and trade-in vehicles that have hidden problems.

[@eaglewi]

What if that part had a lifetime warranty

[@keithhilton1564]

You are lucky to have magic mike, he seems like a methodical worker.

[@drsethsr]

No, he is Presbyterian!!

[@streetpreacher7176]

Hoovie is lucky to have the wizard. And the wizard is lucky to have hoovie

[@magicmikethemechanic]

Thank you for the kind words!

[@kylehansen2122]

@@magicmikethemechanic You have your own channel !!! I subscribed, we're best friends now.

[@frederiquekruger4818]

It's very hard to find a dedicated and highly enthusiastic and diligent worker these days. This can be said about all industries.

[@Alex-xi2nz]

Air suspension in the automotive world seems to be a lot like McDonald’s McFlurry machines.

[@DanaOrtiz]

Every car has it and it works on none 🤣

[@chrislangstaff]

this is a great analogy!

[@Oldjohn52]

Both are equally expensive and complicated to repair. Both are DESIGNED to be expensive to own and maintain.

[@OMGWTFLOLSMH]

No issues on my W220 in the past 4 yrs of ownership.

[@shiftfocus1]

Yet they’ve been used on transit buses for almost 70 years.

[@javierb8497]

Probably didn’t help the air suspension driving around in those 22in wheels with practically no tire on them.

[@Rambogner]

The ride on that must be horrific. Do Porsche come with run flats?

[@IMajst3RI]

Buy a car with an expensive air suspension for ultimate driving and instal wheels with with less air in the tiers than a small pack of lays

[@martinsvensson6884]

@@Rambogner It would be if you put them on an old cheap car :) But its not going to be horrific on a newer Porsche with air suspension.

[@misterchow]

No name tires are always a red flag.

[@joshuakhaos4451]

@@misterchow This car has all the signs of a former owner that bought too much car for his income, so he just treated it like shit while he could afford it before maintenance piled up. Then when it did, I just put cheap replacements on it. Theres lots of owners of cars like this, pretty low on income(But enough to buy the car used), They put aweful aftermarket stuff on, wrap them, abuse the car and make cheap fixes until they can sell it. A classic example of putting lipstick on a pig. I would love to own one of these or am older 911 one day, But I'm going to buy one that has been maintained and kept stock. I'll pay the premium so long as I get a well kept car.

[@alanhassall]

If the previous owner fixed it with the aftermarket air spring I’d say it worked out for them. It worked until they traded it while everything worked.

[@lutomson3496]

and the dealer knew also when they sold it as during the inspection they would know it was aftermarket buyer beware and always get a PPI done

[@olikat8]

Yup- I'm sure the dealer wasn't padding his pocket on both sides anyways...and if there was financing involved? Dealer got a lick from that as well

[@rosscoeradio3741]

@@lutomson3496 usually dealer won’t know about previous repairs unless it’s something obvious. Usually sales people, not mechanics. Even their “mechanics” are just oil change techs anyway. They send real issues back to dealer or specialty shop. If air suspension gave no faults, they wouldn’t waste time messing with it. Same with transmission without issues. They don’t pull and tear down to inspect for every car they sale. If it works, they thanks their god and move on to whatever is holding it up from being legal or pleasing to sell.

[@billyjoejimbob56]

The previous owner? You mean the original $1000 per month lessee? I looked cool for 3 years, now it is someone elses turn to look cool. Second "owner": You like? looks like new... yes we thought so too. Tires? $1,6oo ?? Holy sh*t!!! Brakes? Waddayameant $2400 ? It is only 4 years old!!! Air spring?? I didn't know this POS even had air springs!!!

[@lutomson3496]

@@billyjoejimbob56 the current owner is the fool not previous and look cool safety hazard vehicle

[@JonesNate]

I'm a truck driver. Air springs also usually have slow leaks, (at least the ones on semi trucks usually do) so every time I start my truck I need to let the air bags fill before I move. If I start driving my truck before the air bags fill, they can tear themselves.

[@aussie2uGA]

Thats interesting and somewhat makes sense as so many trucks start and then just sit there for several minutes.

[@mannypaneser3342]

I'm sitting in my rig right now at a delivery listening to one of my airbags leaking ever so slowly 🐌 🙃

[@JonesNate]

@@aussie2uGA In compressed air systems, you don't usually chase down every small leak. You don't need to, since you can just put in more air via the compressor. Fluid systems are different; when you lose fluid, you can't just get more out of thin air.

[@Nordic_Mechanic]

the issue with air ride on cars is people dont service the air dryer and water gets in the line. They dont know and their mechanics are clueless as to how air works. Having industral air compressor and commercial truck experience I know and do the service on my clients air ride cars.

[@JonesNate]

@@Nordic_Mechanic I haven't messed with the air dryer stuff yet. What you say makes sense, though.

[@pricklydingus8604]

Maybe your customer likes the color combination of this thing, but it might be one of the worst clashes of paint I've seen.

[@ozarkliving7263]

Agree. Very tacky

[@406Steven]

Between the wrap, the booger welds on the exhaust, and parking by braille I was surprised they hadn't plasti-dipped the wheels. That's Craigslist shitbox stuff, not Porsche level modifications (and I'm not even a Porsche fan).

[@LS-ye5pp]

Ricer Panamera

[@rezainglis]

Tacky hooptie sh*tbox. I suppose the dropped suspension adds stance to the vehicle that will look great to a ricer :)

[@myyoutubename152]

I bet the whole thing was wrapped but they pulled the rest of the wrap due to it being damaged and peeling

[@AaronsTalks]

Air suspension is a serviceable item on any car... I have had S class, R class, X5's, X6's, Panamera's, etc. and I just replace the rears as soon as I buy. It's generally only $100 each side and sometimes down to $50 per side, depending on the car. They always come with metal rings - Even the cheap aftermarket ones... I would say that is just very unfortunate case that the band blew off. The fronts always last longer, no matter what car. But I would recommend changing rear air bags every 5 years, no matter what car you have. There is a reason they are extremely easy to replace... It takes about 30 minutes on your driveway with the original car jack... 1 hour for both sides... Super easy. Nothing to fuss about. They are engineered to be changed at regular intervals. Porsche Panamera is a great car...

[@thethomasj1795]

Rule of thumb with Mercedes is if one blows replace the corresponding one. I just went through this with my S class not too long ago.. The passenger side front blew out and I replaced both sides. Now, I wanted to buy OEM which is Blistens and they were back-ordered for the 4matic set up 45 days. Arnott was back-ordered as well. I couldn't wait and bought a set from Rebuild Master-Tech. They were highly recommended by the MB forums. I sent by cores back so the next person that needs a set doesn't get shut out.

[@carlos2003177]

“The cats aren’t rattling… they’re not meowing either” 😂😂

[@williamjones4483]

I'd say that there could be some correlation between the tires and this air suspension. Ordinary tires with ordinary sidewalls will flex and absorb some of the harshness of the road. These tires have very little sidewall to absorb road shock and thusly transmit all of the road shock to the suspension. In my opinion it could make all of the difference in the world.

[@AlienLivesMatter]

I second this position

[@xFactoryUSA]

my initial thought only observing the THUMBNAIL 🤣🤣🤣

[@jlang1959]

I would disagree, I own a PPT... the original turbo wheels are only about a 1/5 inch difference than the ones shown. These cars are meant to be sporty, ride lower etc... the difference is minimal and would not contribute to this issue. This issue is just a common maintenance issue that must be addressed. I have had similar issues on my S550 4matic and I drove it on stock 20s... and 22s... same results.

[@trevorgarrett7602]

@@jlang19591” difference. And almost everyone agrees that the 20 inch wheel option rides a lot smoother than the 21 inch turbo wheels. That extra inch of sidewall probably makes a massive difference according to most people.

[@jlang1959]

@trevorgarrett7602 and I still will disagree, I've logged countless hours in H1 with 16" sidewalls and it wasn't more comfortable 😅 my comments are based on actual real life experiences not traditional perceptions. Cars are now being offered with standard 22" wheel sizes and bigger on trucks. There is science and engineering involved, manufacturers spend millions of dollars before coming to this conclusions. People just equate smaller with less comfort. Think of a 10 or 12 speed bike vs a mountain bike or a beach cruiser. The 10 has smaller tires but has a much smoother ride and more importantly... it's is built for speed.

[@really9025]

I trust the Wizard will inform us of the total final cost to repair the suspension when completed. Other sites suggest it could be well over $5,000!

[@warrenmichael918]

Im not sure he will talk in detail on the price here since the dealer is footing the bill.

[@richardsmith2721]

I'm with Mrs. Wizard. Those are aftermarket wheels and they have virtually no sidewall. That's rough on the suspension. It also looks like the owner doesn't seem to tiptoe over bumps in Kansas. Yeehaw!

[@sixteenseven123]

Yeah I would assume more sidewall would absorb more impact and alleviate some stress from the suspension components, the force of an impact has to go somewhere, right? Although I'm not too sure how this particular system works and if the vehicle has sensors it could be constantly adapting to road conditions and purging then reinflating the bags accordingly? Not too sure, but I certainly don't think less sidewall would help the suspension at all

[@dylanmovchan6139]

doesnt help that you can see the sway bar end link on the other rear side makes contact with the outer cover for the air suspesion. if the passenger side was missing the metal cover that could be a bad mix. rubber boot on the good driver side is ripped if you look closely around 13min mark

[@aborted4196]

I don't get the no sidewall trend

[@waynelutwiniak797]

We had an Audi A8 same problem. Lr air spring and a dead compressor. Cool car, but what a repair cost. Happy to fix it and even happier that it wasn't mine.

[@respectpeople9181]

I had this happen to the wife's GX 470, I converted it to coil springs from FJ Cruiser $56 bucks a piece, versus $2000 dealership airbags and labor.

[@lfkatzke]

Looks like that there are two radiator clips on the bottom by the valance that have been sheared off. Only one holding the radiator at the bottom (or so it appears).

[@johnbates606]

Oh the pro tip is that these premium vehicles use Billstein shocks. When I was reading the paperwork that comes with them it always says replace both. Ie if it is a front shock do both front shocks don’t just do one. Puzzled me at first however I guess it is recognition that one can pop and the other side is compensating so if you can afford to do it make sure you can do both.

[@Nordic_Mechanic]

Air springs; some are better than others. My car went 503 000km on one, 543 000km on right front. My client went 413 000 before front left failed. 04-10 audi a8 were great. I replace a lot of broken coil springs. Air ride is durable if you keep water out. I service dryer every 2 years and that IS needed if you want air ride to be reliable. I replace rusty, broken coil springs at way below mileage and age than air spring nowadays. My 2012 beetle had 2 broken coil springs at 125 000km. Friend bmw , 40 000 km, then 103 000km. Audi a6 2008, 236 000km

[@prabeeshsidhu]

Do you know anything about the Porsche Cayenne air suspension for the 2015-2018 generation?

[@Nordic_Mechanic]

@@prabeeshsidhu Same system as audi Q7. They have same air spring construction as a 2011up audi a8. 2 outer seals instead of 1 like on the D3 audi a8. Currently editing air srping replacement (spring only) on a D4 so sub to me and when the video is out you`ll see practically the same type as on a cayenne

[@prabeeshsidhu]

@@Nordic_Mechanic I see your located in Canada, would you avoid the system overall if you could? I’m looking at a cayenne that has it and I think our extreme climate and poor roads will lead to a failure earlier rather than later

[@Nordic_Mechanic]

@@prabeeshsidhu No I'd go with air ride with any car that offers it. You have it the wrong way around. Air ride is better for extreme roads and will save the rest of the suspension from harm in potholes. As far as reliability it's equal or superior to steel spring. Volkswagen products are known to break coil spring. In quebec we have terrible road and my car had the first air spring failure at 499 000km and other at 539 000km. My beetle broke both rear coil before 127 000km.

[@prabeeshsidhu]

@@Nordic_Mechanic I’ve been worried about parts. They seem to be more scare as the time moves forward. The steel spring will wear out over time while a bag will go out at once and require me to source a part immediately. Air suspension also seems to have a lot involved including all the sensors, valve block controllers and air lines etc. Just seems like a lot. I haven’t been able to get over it because from the starting of time it’s been drilled into me to avoid air suspension due to the obvious and early failures in merc and Land Rover systems. This vw design seems better but it’s the salt on the roads and the -15 to -20 degree winters that makes me feel like things will go bad faster.. are you a mechanic if I may ask? What servicing do you need to do for the air bags ?

[@drtofuu]

Very interesting. It would be so nice to see an aftermath video with the car fully repaired and working as it should.

[@Sup3rSn1per]

The previous owner must have really beat on that suspension on track/street. The air struts used on Porsches are the longest lasting and most reliable ever put on a car. My Panamera has 160k miles and it's on its original air suspension, no leaks, no issues. Mine is an S, not a GTS, so I don't know if there's any difference between the two, but I think the GTS owner (it being sporty) must have driven it hard. That, or lived in a city with bad roads. Definitely doesn't help that it has 22 inch wheels.

[@davepaturno4290]

So Porsches are meant to be driven like Subaru Legacies?

[@OB1jcoby]

we do have some bad surface roads here. the problem is the drastic swing in temps all year. we go from 105+ during summer, to sometimes in the double digit negatives during winter. rough on concrete and asphalt.

[@timokuusela5794]

My brother has a similar one but a hybrid version. When he lifts the suspension up to cope with bad road or something, it places more stress to those condoms, and they may fail doing that. Speed bumps driven over with too much speed or summer cottage road can be the last straw. He used to have an Audi 8, and the suspension failed twice.

[@joshuakhaos4451]

I've seen how fast people will go over speed bumps, I'm always waiting for a suspension collapse or a control arm to snap one day. I get honked at all the time for creeping over speed bumps and being easy, but then watch my friend hit them at 15 miles an hour like they dont exist.

[@seabass1059]

When I start to get chub for a car I know I shouldn't touch, Car Wizard always brings me back to earth. Thank you for saving me millions Car Wizard!

[@hungryhungryhummer]

I want a word with the guy who welded that exhaust😂😂

[@andrewausterfield6710]

I think you found the reason why the dealer had a 50k Porsche for sale on the lot. The previous owner had it fixed on the cheap and got it traded in fast. Perfect decision for him and provided the new owner has a warranty, worked out ok for him too!

[@Djmelo94]

I’ve noticed in your videos you don’t properly check the suspension components right … when a vehicle has an upper and lower control arm / short arm/long arm suspension .. you need to pre load the suspension before checking for play .

[@AlessandroGenTLe]

Similar problems with electronically controlled suspensions. I own a Giulia and mine has standard ones. When they will start to leak I can choose Blistein, Koni and few other aftermarket (good) ones also being able to select if I want "oem-like" (like the Blistein B4) or more "sporty ones" (the B6 ones). But for those who have the electronically controlled ones: OEM only (and A LOT of cash...).

[@saadgt2009]

That's one that might have been on its way to Hoovie's Hooptie Heaven, if it wasn't for Wizard's (and Magic Mike's) skills and a loving owner with the $$$ to put into regular maintenance and essential upkeep 👍👍 🖖🙏🇨🇦

[@loganholmberg2295]

My Dad had two dodge rams that went through 3 air suspensions. Ram did not properly test the system for Canadian winters and drivers who don't keep their trucks in a garage. Supposedly the issue is fixed in the 2019 and new trucks as they added a dehumidifier to the system. Unlike a tractor-trailer, its a closed system and you can't add glycol to get rid of the water. It stays there till it bursts something. But my Dads diehard Dodge. He recently switched to the all-wheel-drive Pacifica and hasn't looked back since health issues forced him to sell his boat and camper trailer. He LOVES that van.

[@greathornedowl3644]

Thank you Wizard and Mrs. Instead of fixing air-suspension system, I'd switch to shocks

[@SuperMauricem]

Mercedes SL ( some ) have the same type of air suspension when rather fail the cost here in the U.K. is horrendous especially from the main dealer. Many will swap it out with conventional springs maybe this can be an option for many of these air rides

[@mattneil1449]

I would swap for the conventional springs

[@jruerph]

My SL55 had a hydraulic suspension which I eventually converted to coilovers

[@QuietStormX]

For whatever ride I own I invest in their factory service manuals to learn before I start work or service I've not done before or buy parts...

[@americanindeon]

I know this problem very well. In fact I had all the air suspension replaced with StrutMaster springs and coil. No more air for me.

[@chad15x]

@ Aboriginal InDeon can you switch the air suspension on a porsche?

[@prabeeshsidhu]

Which Porsche did you do that on ? Is that possible on a cayenne 958.2

[@jruerph]

Stutmaster is junk

[@americanindeon]

@@jruerph I have to agree with you. I don't feel their struts and shocks are sturdy enough and there is too much noise and creaking going on in the rear.

[@jeangeppert6300]

We replaced with Strutmasters on 2013 Panamera. Can’t figure out where to put module to bypass chassis suspension failure readout. Any suggestions?

[@videhvora2927]

Imagine owning a car with air suspension in India with beautiful, lovely roads.

[@stuartstuart866]

I have seen KZbin videos of Indian mechanics fixing all sorts of mechanical equipment, in their dirt floor shop, with very basic tools. I am awed by their resourcefulness.

[@taunuslunatic404]

@@stuartstuart866 Could they deal with high tech systems like those in modern high end cars?

[@stuartstuart866]

They likely could replace/repair the ruptured bag, making the vehicle functional, but probably not reset the dash trouble code

[@videhvora2927]

@@stuartstuart866 you'd be surprised by what mechanics out here can do, they can reset codes of any kind. They can fix any kind of damage.

[@BarryRudge]

Like any other car beauty is always in the eye of the beholder and I agree with the Wizard, and the good thing about this model a 6ft 2 inch person can sit comfortably in the rear, the rear seats fold down and its a hatchback which makes it even more desirable for a family man who wants a sports car. As for this car I wouldn't touch it as it looks like it has been used and abused especially underneath where it has been driven at speed over road bumps no doubt helping to cause a problem with the air suspension

[@GreenAppelPie]

7:49 color is hardly and indication of wether or not a small light is an LED or not; let your finger tell you, and in touch the cover and see if it’s warm.

[@chubbrockstar187]

Mrs wizard was correct aftermarket wheels do affect airbags on Porsches I know because I've owned dozens of Porsches

[@JakesMoparGarage]

13:17 it appears the sway bar end link is rubbing against the other sur bag. Possibly something to do with why the one that let go, let go? Metal wasn't there and rubbed a thin spot?

[@murry001]

probably why the metal is there lol

[@stephenmellentine]

Regarding the fuel filler door: My Audi Q5 TDi (same VAG family) had an opening issue. Dealer says fix was only possible by entire rear quarter panel replacement ($800+). Luckily, there is a release cord behind a carpeted panel. A little cleaning to the spring-loaded lock in its boot, good to go. You’re welcome, Wizard.

[@christopherrempel8168]

As a GTS owner i wish there was standard spring conversion kits.

[@eddyrocket8737]

What’s your verdict on overall reliability for the GTS?

[@christopherrempel8168]

@@eddyrocket8737 just had the car a year but engine and transmission are pretty solid. As wizard points out electric fuel pump is really the weak point. Air suspension will blow by there are a few solutions and isn’t any more prone to fail than any other air suspension. Overall very happy with the purchase.

[@prabeeshsidhu]

@@christopherrempel8168 how has the reliability been now? What year is it?

[@christopherrempel8168]

@@prabeeshsidhu i had her 2 years. Suspension held up till sale at 65kmi

[@bestblackoutvideos]

13:15 car wizard, why is the sway bar link starting to slice a hole in the side of the air shock?????im shocked you didnt mention it lol

[@cthis4786]

You should never use aftermarket suspension parts and also big wheels deteriorate the suspension parts much faster.

[@jlang1959]

Lies! This vehicle is at about 50k miles and already had factory OEM parts FAIL! This issue is very common on air suspension "luxury" vehicles. The A aftermarket sturts are rebuilt from old OEM ones... but rebuilt better and last a hell of alot longer! I saying this from experience on multiple vehicles.

[@thomasmicka2375]

Compressor failed on my 2010 Panamera 4S, total collapse of all four air springs. As I recall the system refill is not air per se but purified dry nitrogen. Ordinary air (oxygen and nitrogen) under pressure is ultimately damaging to elastomeric parts in contact with it. Good quality air springs (OEM) are likely to high antioxidant content in the elastomer portion. The Wizard is so right about this.

[@Adam1nToronto]

The air spring contents are not sealed, but contolled via a solenoid valve that enables a separate air compressor to add air or similarly to release air. The air that is pumped in goes through a dryer, removing moisture from the compressed air. When venting, the dry air exiting the spring passes through the same dryer, picking up moisture on it's way back to the atmosphere. Air springs which leak air mean the dryer doesn't get to re-moisturize the exiting air (since it exited through the leak), and so moisture builds up in the dryer. When replacing leaky air springs, the dryer needs to be replaced too (or otherwise dried out).

[@miketeeveedub5779]

Overheard at Cars and Coffee: "Why is your car so low?" "Uh, um...oh, I like to ride low and slow bro." "Betcha it's broken" Vape Bro: "Is not - shut up!"

[@mannypaneser3342]

"Vape bro" hahahahq

[@thecman26]

It is broke

[@fleurdewin7958]

It is so low to prevent catalytic converter theft.

[@Derek8487]

Low and slow? Wtf is he a crock pot? 🍲

[@gasolara2002]

Wizard put the nail on the head with this. Air suspension is designed to compensate for heavy loads and ride comfortably regardless of the load the vehicle is carrying. And no wheels and tires have nothing to do with it. Over time the material wears out. Im sure the previous owner did a band-aid rigging job just to trade it in. Even the good aftermarket air struts have the metal inside so the rubber rolls back on it during inflation and deflation. Glad the person didn't crash or anything.

[@Jakobly]

love how he corrects himself every time he says “ruff”😂

[@mike_f]

It's a Ruf Porsche.... :)

[@durkbros7418]

Been hanging with Hoovie too much😂😂😂😂

[@paulbaril3831]

I had a beautiful Mercedes S430 for about 6 months. Terrible air suspension problems we called it crouching tiger.

[@bebomarin]

No European car should be owned outside of its factory warranty. Air ride has been used in Grayhound busses since GM introduced it in the 1950’s with benefits that far outweigh the maintenance involved. Rule of thumb: don’t buy an exotic car you can’t afford to repair.

[@lukeheffernan]

I wouldn't say any European car. My '12 VW hasn't had any repairs (besides routine maintenance, of course) and it's got 111k miles (about 50k outside of warranty). I'd certainly say any exotic European though, you're right.

[@jdrancho1864]

Compare that to the fact that air suspensions are the norm nowadays on 18=wheelers. They are dependable (they have to be), they are a relative easy and cheap fix when not working, and parts are commonly available.

[@efraing2482]

“The customer JUST bought this and it’s ALREADY broke” Me: Hoovie. Is that you? Come on out.

[@MrMightyytau]

HA HA well spotted

[@charlescummings2205]

Lol

[@Lowbrass64]

When you mentioned how the entire suspension will drop when one corner goes, I wouldn’t be surprised that this is the reason the underside is so scraped up. The airbag maybe blew and the original owner had to drive it with it slammed.

[@racekar80]

I have purchased many Air struts from Arnott for Mercedes vehicles. They are actually built better than the OEM and have a lifetime warranty. Never had one fail, and they make them for almost all air suspension vehicles.

[@ImTheJoker4u]

I put Arnott air springs under my Towncar, stuffed about 400lbs of speakers in the trunk, and never gave them a thought for 60k until the Trans went, and rot determined its demise.

[@jlang1959]

For those commenting on the wheels, I own a PPT... the original turbo wheels are only about a 1/5 inch difference than the ones shown. These cars are meant to be sporty, ride lower etc... the difference is minimal and would not contribute to this issue. This issue is just a common maintenance issue that must be addressed. I have had similar issues on my S550 4matic and I drove it on stock 20s... and 22s... same results.

[@matthewhaddon599]

They are a pain when they go wrong, but they are very simple and don’t break very often if well maintained. If the Range Rover was in the UK I’d definitely buy it…..usually easy repair! Might cost a few quid at a garage as it takes time to diagnose. Air bags should last at least 60,000 miles. They can be replaced individually, but it’s best to change in pairs. The valve blocks can be cleaned as they tend to get dirty. The compressor filters need changing occasionally….maybe every 40,000 miles. Compressors can fail, but they are reasonably cheap and easy to change, on Land Rovers anyway, probably more expensive on Porsche.

[@andycaldwell5917]

0000

[@kensmechanicalaffair]

Most people are super dense. You sound prudent..probably read a book or two every week.

[@autohog]

I converted my 2016 for coilovers. Can you tell me how to disable the compressor from going on? Thanks

[@jackdawson3276]

I got a full 6 year warranty from RoadVantage that actually covers the air springs and shocks!!! AND they actually pay a good amount quickly. I have a 2018 4S with 13k miles that I just bought. I already used the warranty for a faulty AC oring. My mechanic had to recharge the system. RoadVantage paid more than what my mechanic asked within 2 hours of the claim being made!!!! My freind has a Mercedes Benz and RoadVantage covered two air springs (4k) He only paid 4k for the warranty!

[@lukegilbert7985]

In Australia, Porsche extends warranty for up to 15 years. So if your Panamera has air suspension issues, then no drama!

[@cuadstar]

Mrs. Wizard may be on to something with the aftermarket wheels maybe it being the cause of blown airbag. An aftermarket wheel that is much heavier then OEM with added unspring weight could cause extra stress on suspension during operation. Cheers to all 🍻

[@nanakeseohemeng7230]

"It's awesome until it breaks" , wise words 😂

[@toddritter5638]

i think the unsprung weight would have an effect on the suspension, absolutely. i'm not saying this is the case but i know larger wheels and smaller tires tend to weigh more although they can provide more consistent geometry although i doubt this was the goal with this application. if you were so inclined you could compare stock weight vs. the aftermarket and see how much of a difference it is and maybe recommend returning to a stock weight to eliminate future failures. I appreciate your methodical approach to repair and maintenance.

[@GreenAppelPie]

Why electronically controlled an oil pump? When the mechanical version is so simple and reliable

[@dragoonTT]

Das auto

[@moloono1]

To help out the dealerships with that sweet maintenance $$$

[@alanhassall]

It is German. When do Germans do anything simple? The Beetle was a very long time ago.

[@hirisk761]

yup just look at BMW's liquid cooled alternators

[@pawsnpistons]

Because the hundreds of overpayed engineers need something to do, so they just design something to keep their jobs, doesnt matter if it makes sense.

[@kevinsboxster2310]

I am considering the purchase of a used Panamera in 2 or 3 years. (I have a 2000 Boxster and a 2005 Mercedes C230 with almost 200,000 miles on it. The C230 may not be economical to repair at some point in the future and the Panamera would replace it.) I understand that any Panamera will have above-average maintenance and repair costs, but I'm willing to trade off ownership cost against the enjoyment of driving an upscale car. Based on this and another Car Wizard video, I am focusing my research on 6-cylinder cars without air suspension. I'm probably going to avoid all-wheel drive cars because we don't have much snow in my part of the country, and I will avoid one more potential failure point. I appreciate the in-depth explanation of the possible issues with air suspension cars.

[@jefffenn5016]

Wizard, I love most the video, however, how could you have gone twenty minutes without starting and revving this engine? It's got such a beautiful exhaust note! Also would love to know the cost of replacing one and all four air Springs. I'm definitely in the market for a Panamera GTS someday! Lovely vehicle

[@redbaron6805]

The factory one's run somewhere around $1000 each. The estimate for replacing all 4 with OEM struts according to Repairpal is around $6000 give or take....

[@ivannarvaez367]

Yeah, I love how an air suspension feels. I absolutely hate when it goes wrong.

[@yasinmusse5723]

Look at those rubber band tires.

[@gsmith207]

My mom has a red ‘17 4s Turbo. Looks like a strawberry shortcake with off white interior! and we love it! Got winter tires for it too for Maine weather. Cool cars but expensive per year. We got the extended warranty for sure!

[@ZeroBlackfire]

I know with some caddies, some people just say "fck it" and will do a conversion to springs. What about this car?

[@tech4pros1]

A spring conversion is a common permanent fix for the troublesome air suspension on land rovers.

[@OMGWTFLOLSMH]

If you can't afford to replace the air suspension, don't buy the car.

[@CPLAYZGAMEZ]

@@OMGWTFLOLSMH if you can't afford to replace the engine don't buy the car

[@AlienLivesMatter]

Hydro SLS was way better than air

[@ImTheJoker4u]

@@OMGWTFLOLSMH I've bought two nice Town cars that I've had to replace the cart springs some fool stuck under them, with the proper air springs. Do it properly, or GTFO😡

[@subaruwrxsti300]

Ooooof the numbers of buttons around the "shift stick" looks insane!

[@CumminsDriver100]

Speaking of OEM being the way to go, when the compressor for the air suspension on my Navigator went, I looked up the reviews on some after market ones and that alone made up my mind. Even though it was easy enough to replace being that its just behind the headlight, the thought of doing the same job over every two months was enough to make me want to chew trees down with my own teeth.

[@prabeeshsidhu]

So what did you do in the end..

[@rysterstech]

You can see alot of 2nd generation Lincoln Navigators that have collapsed air suspension. Don't see it too often on ones that don't see alot of towing use, but if you tow with them you will want to convert it to coilovers, which is easy as it's just expedition parts and you just install them and flip the switch on the back.

[@pistonburner6448]

Yeah, so the customer is getting it repaired under the warranty? I have bought a Mercedes with air suspension (standard on all C-Class hybrids at the time) which was slightly used, I just made sure that it has extended warranty for as long as I own it and far beyond that too so I can get a buyer for it. I had no problems at all, and didn't expect to since it was so new still. But I knew I'd have to cover my a-- just in case because it can be so expensive if you have bad luck. With air suspension you simply either buy the car cheaper because of it or you make sure you have a warranty on it all the time. Air suspension isn't expensive to fix, it's cheap to buy and then you have the repair money in the bank... Or then you pay for that extended warranty on top of the cheap vehicle price.

[@houseofno]

A car that old and you think it's still covered under warranty? That's pretty funny. The Car Wizard doesn't do warranty work. He is certainly not going to spend hours working on a car and then WAIT for the factory to reimburse him later.

[@pistonburner6448]

​@@houseofno You are trying to say that something I wrote was funny? Oh buddy, this isn't going to go the way you thought: -Why on earth wouldn't it be covered by warranty? He specifically said that it was sold by a dealership. I don't know what kind of a s---thole you live in, but in most countries of the world all dealer-sold cars MUST have a warranty. I am not versed in the exact rules of every state in the US, but even there it is an exception, only some states allow dealers to sell cars without any warranty at all, and even in the rare cases that they are allowed to sell cars "as is" there are strict rules they have to follow and how they have to warn and notify the customers before doing that. Most US states require a minimum warranty for all cars sold by dealerships. In some states it depends on mileage, but even then the lowest I've seen for a car with not crazy mileage is 30 days. Car Wizard said that car was bought in the middle of last month and that video was shot at latest on 5th of October, so that car was broken far less than 30 days after purchase. That's why people like to buy from dealerships: there are extra consumer protections. In really really many countries, including the USA you can also buy cars with used car warranties. That's a normal thing in this world. So why you would find that total news is beyond me! -That car looks to be a facelift model version of the 970 model Porsche Panamera, so it is MY 2013 or newer. I don't know if the facelift models were only available in the USA as MY 2014 actually. Porsche USA has several model year 2009 Certified Pre-Owned Porsches for sale. In case I have to spell everything out for you: that means they have a warranty. For 2 years I believe. There are several CPO Panameras on offer, including 2012, 2013 and 2014 Panameras. Including a GTS with air suspension. (In Europe Porsche offers their factory warranty, and extension of warranty up until the car is 12 years old. You can even have a car with expired warranty re-warrantied after an approved inspection. So in Europe you don't even have to buy from a dealer to have the warranty in force. You can buy a car with warranty privately or a car without warranty privately and have it inspected and pay for the warranty. I don't know how it works in the US exactly, but for sure you can get Porsche-warrantied used Panameras exactly like that one. In Europe it's typical for all major luxury brands to offer used cars at least up to 10 years old with proper warranties, I've usually bought mine used and bought extended warranty totalling 5 years of coverage.) -In addition to Porsche dealerships, other dealerships also offer all kinds of warranties for used cars. There are many warranty companies that cover used cars, so you can even get a warranty on a privately bought used car. But for dealership-bough cars? They will typically have at least a short warranty automatically and good ones offer a proper warranty of at least half a year or year if they're any good. I guess a Porsche like that isn't bought by a schmuck like you from a janky cash-dealership or Craigslist like you buy your cars... -Car Wizard specifically told us that car dealerships bring those cars to him to be fixed. I guess you didn't understand the simple concept of what's going on here: the dealerships either have received cars to sell which they internally noticed has an issue and needs to be fixed before they can put them up for sale; or it's like this case where they have sold a car and the customer has come back to them with an issue which they of course must fix as they have sold a car with a fault. And they have realised that Car Wizard is the best guy to deal with those issues so the dealers bring it to him to be fixed instead of doing it in-house. So that is the dealership's customer's car, that the customer bought from the dealership (with a warranty of course) and the customer noticed a problem with it, brought it back to the dealer and the dealership said: "we'll take car of it ASAP" as it is their responsibility to fix, and they decided to bring it over to Car Wizard so that they can get it fixed fast and properly and without it costing massively. That way the customer is satisfied as the car if fixed properly and with one visit to the shop, and the dealership is satisfied because they didn't have to spend a massive amount on that warranty work for the customer and the matter is put to rest quickly without wasting much of their time. The dealership pays Car Wizard just like anyone else would for his work. So are you still laughing? Did this go the way you thought it would?

[@LiqdPT]

@@pistonburner6448 in the US, the only warrenty on a used car is the manufacturers warranty (if there's any left) or if the buyer specifically buys an aftermarket warranty (which frequently aren't worth the headache of dealing with or the paper they're written on ). And to be clear, the way Wizard worded this, this car wasn't bought at a main dealer. It was bought at a used car lot (similar to Euroasian Bob).

[@pistonburner6448]

@@LiqdPT Wrong. The exact laws depend on the state, but very few states even allow any "as-is" sales clauses. And even then they have to jump through many hoops in informing the customer about the "as-is" sale. The norm is that a usual used car sale by a company has a mandatory warranty. Even lemon laws apply to used cars in general unless certain factors rule it out. Car Wizard seems to be operating in Kansas and in that state "as-is" sales are NOT ALLOWED at all! There is no such distinction as "used car lot" that would give any company different rules from dealers. The law kicks in the second you sell a certain amount of cars per year. Then you are considered a "dealer". In Kansas that seems to be 5 used cars in a 12 month period. Besides, Car Wizard specifically used the word "dealership" so I don't have a clue what you're trying to argue about? Are you a used car lot salesman who doesn't want people to know that you can't sell defective cars to people? In the US you have to look into state-specific laws, but it is very rare for there to be no extra consumer protections. I challenge you to list any states where it's possible for any company that sells used cars to sell a car without being responsible for faults for at the very minimum 30 days!! (Not including them having specifically informed the customer of an "as-is" sale and had that text in the documentation as well as an assurance that the customer was informed of this as per law! Because no-one would be that stupid as to buy a Panamera like that "as-is"...) You really are a clueless consumer!

[@LiqdPT]

@@pistonburner6448 Woah, back up a little. I wasn't sure where you were and was just trying to clarify for those across the pond as they have different terminology for these things and it sounded like you might have been in Europe. In my 17 years in the US on the west coast (and various car clubs) I've never heard of someone going back to a dealer for a warranty fix that wasn't a) manufacturer's warranty or b) an aftermarket warranty sold to them. I just checked the paperwork on the last 2 used vehicles I've bought (the ones I currently have) and both sales was "as-is".

[@audimanao]

The air shocks and active front shocks on my 03 Yukon Denali with 155k miles is still original and not a single problem. But the system is not as advanced as this porsche. I priced new oem parts if the system failed on my car and it costs a couple thousand dollars.

[@douglasburford8452]

Semi rigs hauling 80000 pounds and more on air rides run 100's thousands miles with few failures.

[@RODZILLA65]

I love this version if the Panamera.. One of the best looking German 4 doors.

[@RJon2006]

My 97 Town car has air springs in the rear. Still going strong 170k miles later…..I hope I didn’t jinx myself.

[@donventura3844]

When an air bag suspension is in tip top shape and working it is pretty amazing. However when it fails the suspension drops on the bump stops. This happened to my GX470 on the trails.

[@strat0871]

Even on Mercedes of the 60's, like 300 SEL 3.5 or 6.3, the air suspension system was unreliable.

[@AlienLivesMatter]

Hydro SLS was the best. Air suspension is just another expense.

[@sukhwang4554]

Changing air springs aren't so expensive if you think about the cars that have them, its usually equipped to a high end cars. They do awesome job until it breaks. It will work another 100k km until it break again!

[@joshuakhaos4451]

Its all relative to the price of the car.

[@nowornever81]

13:17 is this screw rubbing against the air-spring?!

[@robboyd427]

That will be the next one to go.

[@MarkRubel]

Thanks for this video. I knew about the issues with air suspension, but this provided me some good information to keep in mind.

[@kylewhisman]

Arnott bags are what we use on our cars as replacements. Great quality, no issues and a 3rd of the price of OEM bags

[@badopinionsrighthere]

Sometimes, you can buy the expensive part once or the cheap part twice

[@janibeg3247]

the air suspension on my wife's 2002 Lincoln Continental is still working A OK.

[@vincedibona4687]

So that makes everyone else with a problem _persona non gratis?_ No. So good for you? And you aren’t helping. Have a great day. Thanks.

[@OMGWTFLOLSMH]

That's what's known as a miracle. They were notorious.

[@ImTheJoker4u]

Knock on wood Conti air struts are notorious, and pricey last I checked.

[@janibeg3247]

@@vincedibona4687 you seem to be having a bad day

[@vincedibona4687]

@@janibeg3247 Nope. Just telling the truth.

[@lakeman411]

You and mrs. Wizard are sounding more professional with every video. Thank You For Your Entertainment

[@koolkeiths]

Nickel worths of free advice~~> Next time I'd get a 4S with OUT air suspension sunshades and soft close doors. (Panamera's CAN be SUPER reliable if specked without the all malarkey)

[@theGermanXperience]

For the record, air suspension issues aren’t common on Porsches

[@Molitoth]

@@theGermanXperience They are on Panamera's from what I've read. I just replaced my Cayenne front Air struts at 190k miles which are more reliable... but they will all go out eventually.

[@alexsystems2001]

I agree these things add a level of complication to the car and add a tier of possible unreliability (one more thing to break) BUT my 2007 Lexus LS460L has air suspension, the shocks inside the air bags failed before the air bags themselves at 98,XXX miles, that was only on the rear, the fronts were still holding air at 135,XXX miles, I had them replaced because just like the rear the front got a little soft but you could let it sit for quite literally more than a month and it wouldn’t sink down. I think some manufacturers hit the quality of the air bags spot on and others don’t.

[@larrywhittemore9362]

Friends car 2013 gts, 60k miles, front air bag $9k, said fronts always go out!!!!, Transmission failure, shudder on take off, replacement,new, $17k!?!!, Internal water leak $3k...all repairs done at Porsche..Paid $125k brand new, $32k given, no problems, trade in for new Porsche gts, $145k.....

[@TakuroSpirit77]

I work at a CJDR dealer and we NEVER replace more than one air spring on RAMs and Grand Cherokees... In fact the spring themselves aren't an issue. Now the compressors and air suspension modules...

[@abdelrahimmohammed1814]

I can never unsee a dog taking a crap when looking at this car lmao Thanks Car Wizard

[@volvo09]

I was going to say that! Squatting dog! Funny stuff

[@rpraetor]

Not as bad as the Chrysler Crossfire.

[@Rambogner]

@@rpraetor true. Truly the most awful looking car ever made

[@vincedibona4687]

“ I can never under a dog taking a crap when looking at this car lmao” - in English, can you tell me what that means? I can’t make any sense of it

[@abdelrahimmohammed1814]

@@vincedibona4687 it was supposed to be unsee Damn autocorrect

[@wriddle082]

Could the original air spring possibly been damaged by, say, getting a flat tire, and forgetting to put the vehicle suspension in “jack mode” before jacking it up to put on the spare? Then when the original was replaced with the aftermarket, could one of the requirements for the aftermarket part be to transfer that metal sleeve from the old to the new? Not knowing a lot about the basics of air suspensions, I feel like these questions need to be asked.

[@AtlasCroc]

With mid 50K miles - this thing is kinda trashed IMO and the glitz items look terrible. The exhaust welds are pathetic and not maintained very well.

[@ToreHansen]

6 months winter here in Norway, is a real trouble for airsuspension, cool video as always!

[@cetindenizdemircan9148]

That rear brake cooling vents caught my attention. They look really neat.

[@azthundercloud]

Work colleague had one and front air bags went out. Lucky for him it was under warranty or it would have been $3600. Parted ways shortly after that.

[@philabrahams383]

Wizard go and get the Range Rover as it may just be the air compressor in the boot that has failed and the unit is cheap to buy on ebay. Have a look for a Wheeler dealer video where Ed China worked on a Range Rover with that same problem air compressor.

[@RickDominick69]

This is why I own 90 and older vehicles American vehicles. I just ordered two rear leaf springs for my 89 Chevy k 1500. $329 delivered. About 3 hours worth of work and the suspension will be back to its original height. Priceless

[@dumbeezy5480]

Good for u

[@BCNeil]

I remember how difficult life once was for people, who had to close the trunk with their hands. Some electronics that eventually fail is a much better idea.

[@tim3172]

I don't know, the kick sensor on my Audi keeps me from putting down my boxes, saves time, and my bananas don't get smashed. If it fails I'll replace/fix it (like anyone who could properly afford 110k+ MSRP car like this Porsche would.) That's just me, though.

[@thomasmiddlebrooke1012]

Air springs are a part I only do deletes on. Got a Range Rover in the shop currently (an 08 I think), and it hit something hard. Blew both left tires, and damaged the same rims beyond repair. Beyond that though, the LF air strut was blown too. Let's just say it's gonna be a big fix bill. No, I'm not doing it. We're shipping it to a shop that deals exclusively with Eurotrash.

[@jjlegend3922]

"Not meowing either" Lmao, I can't wait to use that one

[@kennethmoureau5123]

lol I almost spit out my food. Wasn't expecting that one.

[@jjlegend3922]

@@kennethmoureau5123 I spit my coffee out, and choked on my own spit for like 5 minutes. I love his stale humor. It's always unexpected 😂😂

[@milesdavis8665]

Learned that lesson with an X5 I had. Will never own another car with air suspension. After I had the rear ones replaced the front started going. That along with the smoke coming out the back made me get rid of it. Started buying nothing but toyotas after that

[@clownworld-honk410]

Air suspension is good for business... for car manufacturers. Seems to me that they're designed to fail.

[@DapimpBDSD]

Air suspension is the best for ride comfort but they break and well they aren't that cheap to fix (depending on the issue). These generally last a few years before causing issues but obviously there are exceptions.

[@martinsvensson6884]

@@DapimpBDSD All car suspensions break sooner or later.

[@DapimpBDSD]

@@martinsvensson6884 yes but generally the part cost isn't over $500 for a suspension part.

[@OMGWTFLOLSMH]

Air suspensions are generally found in luxury vehicles, and the people who buy them can afford to fix them, off warranty. It's posers who buy used vehicles and spend their entire budget on the car with nothing left for maintenance, who run into issues. Most mechanical parts will eventually fail. If you want a great ride, you gotta pay to play. Otherwise, stick with a used Camry or Accord.

[@dumbeezy5480]

@@DapimpBDSD Lot of engineering that goes into it so of course it’s gonna cost more.

[@rustler08]

Contrary to what some people like to spout based on anecdotes that aren't even their own experiences, air suspension isn't all that unreliable. In fact, many cars will go 100,000+ miles on the stock air struts. When you factor in the cost of replacing your gas struts every 30k miles like you actually should, the cost of replacing the strut when it eventually fails isn't all that different. On top of that, air suspension is vastly superior to conventional suspension for comfort and adjustment. At the click of a button you can raise your suspension so that you clear those horrible roads. And it's just so much smoother and more in control. If you're broke AF, don't buy air suspension. If you're okay with the higher price for the superior ride, keep it. Do your research before you buy, you'll see which models do and don't have issues with the air struts. Cars like the LS430 and LS460 are plenty reliable on them.