Chevy 350 Bored .030 The Old Way, Using the Van Norman 777S.

[@acrescueguyhvac3901]

Awesome to see that the old school way will still get the job done. 1950?! That’s cool!

[@edsmachine93]

Hey Chris, I appreciate you watching and commenting. Yes 1950, and she is a real treasure. Take care, Ed.

[@bertgrau3934]

A/C That's interesting on the 1950. Because Ed used that machine to bore my 1950 Ford flathead V8 . That was in 1988 I think. That engine ran so smooth and I don't care how cold it was, it would start with less than a full turn. I kept the original point distributor, and 6 volt system.

[@terrygrover6440]

Hey Ed the last time I saw something like this on KZbin was never what a great video and a lost art doing things old school, this is what separates the men from the boys great job and thanks for sharing this 👍

[@edsmachine93]

Thank you Terry for watching and commenting. I really appreciate you. I am glad you liked this, I sincerely hope other people will like this like you did. People like you make it worth the effort. Take care, Ed.

[@heshtesh]

This is the machine my friend used to bore my 383 and 406, when I tore down the 383 with 75,000 miles on it had ZERO ring ridge and never burned oil.

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks for watching. Yes, they are good machines. Can do a very good job with the right operator. Sounded like your friend did a great job. Take care, Ed.

[@jimmattingly4234]

I have a vn bar 777 great tool I do my on a heavy engine stand

[@jimmattingly4234]

I still have a set of roll over stand

[@edsmachine93]

Hi Jim, I always wanted to get a boring stand. I do most of my boring and milling in the Comec ACF200. You can see in my other videos. Thanks for watching. I have been boring with the 777s for 37 years. Many years with a FN Kwik Way. And F2VB Rottler also. Take care, Ed

[@edsmachine93]

Very nice Jim.

[@whiplashmachine]

Worked in a shop once that used a KwikWay block mounting boring machine. Pretty much same thing. Good video Ed👍

[@edsmachine93]

Hey Jay, good to hear from you. I hope you had a Merry Christmas. I had some people that wanted to see the Old way of boring a block. I have a Comec ACF200 Vertical boring mill. But I still get out the old 777s. I actually learned on a FN and FL and FT Kwik Way. One shop purchased a new FN Kwik Way, that was a treat, very nice. I have been looking for videos from you. I see you have some new ones, I'll watch them. Take care, Ed.

[@whiplashmachine]

@@edsmachine93 I spent time in two engine shops. The first had the KwikWay and the second had a Rottler F2B with fixturing. I would buy A F2B for for sleeving as I do my boring on my HBM. But sleeving on the F2b was nice and simple. Can't really pound in a sleeve on my current setup, though I do have a neat system for installing them. Will have a vid on it one day. Christmas was quiet, which equals Merry to me lol. I'm off till the second although I may go in to putts around and prep for the new year. ThankssEd and have a happy new year🍻🥳🍻

[@edsmachine93]

Hey Jay, I would like to have a Rottler also. They certainly have their place. Nice that you have some time off. Happy new year. Take care, Ed.

[@scotteric8711]

Such an awesome machine! I will keep my eyes peeled for one of these as they would be perfect for agriculture machines. Is the machine in the background with the Peterson sticker a Sunnen hone?

[@edsmachine93]

Hi Eric, thanks for watching and commenting. The boring bar is Van Norman 777s. Great machines. The honing machine is a HC2DP Peterson PowerStroker. Take care, Ed.

[@CCR414]

Hey Ed! I use a couple of old VN 904S boring bars myself. Very reliable machines.

[@edsmachine93]

Hey Creedence, thank you for watching. Is that a 944s? Yes they are. Some of the best boring bars ever made. Take care, Ed.

[@CCR414]

Yeah, 944s. I tell you I really like the quality of older machines. Built to last for sure.

[@jimmattingly4234]

If have to ridge ream time to bore like he said don't cut the ridge

[@edsmachine93]

Hi Jim, thanks for watching. Yes, I see blocks that would not clean up after a ridge reamer went through it. Take care, Ed.

[@ronmusco8757]

I recently subscribed via JustMoparJoe. Just wanted to say that I found this very educational and thoroughly enjoyed watching and leaning from this. My only question is why no cutter lubrication? Well 2 questions lol. No chance of cutter chatter? Thank you!

[@edsmachine93]

Hey Ron, thanks for watching. When you machine cast iron it is usually dry. No coolant or cutting oil. Chatter is usually not a problem as long as the tool bit is ground properly. Insert tooling can chatter if speed is not correct, usually boring to fast is the problem there. Take care, Ed.

[@JustMoparJoe]

Thanks for sharing, Buddy! If there was one machine that you ever sold me, I think bud choose this one. Definitely a solid old piece that’s probably been used on thousands of engines. 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼

[@edsmachine93]

Thank you Joe. I will remember your request. The machines are awesome. Take care, Ed.

[@bertgrau3934]

Joe, Ed used this machine on my old 1950 Flathead Ford V8 . I have watched Ed use that machine many times. I know it may sound odd, but I have enjoyed watching that machine and Ed.

[@nhzxboi]

I can't remember. It's been 30 years since I've used the VN bar. Is it relative to the deck or to the mains? I'm used to using a table that is based off of mains.

[@edsmachine93]

Hello, thanks for watching and commenting. It is off of the deck. When I do a performance build we deck and square. But we have a Comec ACF200 bore mill. With a precision 90° fixture for blueprinting. We locate of the mains and cam. Take care, Ed.

[@V8Lounge]

Hey. I loved the video. Thanks for sharing. I'm from germany and I've never seen such a machine. Are there different models on the market of this brand or is this one the best for SBC and BBC? I recently bought an 'In the Block crankshaft grinder' and I like these old tools. I like to collect these items but I keep them operational to use them from time to time. Here in germany we have to convert them from 110 60Hz to 230V 50Hz. Greetings from the V8Lounge

[@edsmachine93]

Thank you V8Lounge, I really appreciate you watching. It will do small and big blocks. The machine is a 1950 Van Norman 777s. Very versatile machine, wide range of boring capacity. Bores from 2.600 to 5.343 in. I have bored small cylinders, like cycles to 3208 Caterpillar diesels. Bored and installed sleeves. Very precision boring bar. They were called PerFecTo. Do to the precise capability. I still use mine. People wanted to see the Old School way of boring, so I made a video. Take care, Ed.

[@AryDontSurf]

This is really really cool. Makes alot of sense too. I can't imagine having to chock up a heavy tall block like my stovebolt. Beautiful machine, gotta love how they hold up.

[@edsmachine93]

Hey Ary, thank you for watching and commenting. I have done old 216 and 235's. This boring bar is what I used. I did a 1954 235 first year all pressure oiling. We decked it and balanced it. Was real nice. Now I have the ACF200 COMEC, so I can really get to the precise numbers. I just wanted to show people what they never had seen. The Old School Way! Take care, Ed.

[@scottnusser6232]

I've got a 1923 storm Vulcan boring bar. Bored alot of holes back when. Haven't used it in many years,this video has me hankering to try it out again!

[@edsmachine93]

Hi Scott, the Storm Vulcan sounds very cool. I'd like to see it. Thanks for watching. Take care, Ed.

[@richardpalleschi4807]

Last place i worker had 3 Kwik-way boring bars. That got given away to an antique truck club that the owner belonged to when he sold the garage. Also went the valve grinder a couple of lathes & other equipment. Some from as far back as the mid 20's. Even the brake relining machines. The boss's uncle started the Garage in 1925.

[@Russeljfinch]

Ed I don’t know about machining ,don’t engines index of the crankshaft ? Looks like this does it off the deck.How do you know you are square ?

[@edsmachine93]

Hey J Russell, thanks for watching. This is how it was done for many years. For blocks we want right, and correct what's wrong I have a ACF200 COMEC. I have a 90° Blueprint fixture. Blocks are correct to the main bearing bore. Look, guys wanted to see old school machining so I showed them. This block seemed to be pretty good. Take care, Ed.

[@bertgrau3934]

Hello J, I can say for a fact, Ed bored a 1950 Ford flathead V8 with that machine, and when I put the engine back in my F2 (3/4 ton ) It ran great. And very smooth. In fact, when I went to start it the first time my battery was low, and wouldn't turn the engine over very fast, so I had a gentleman give me a pull to get it started we pulled it about 20 feet. I stopped because I didn't realize it was running, and I was going to advance the timing when I opened the hood it was running. I did advance the timing some and took it for a drive. You may not think the block is square enough, but in the knowledgeable hands of Ed, I can assure you that the machine work is correct. Thank you for your question sir. Ed and I have been friends for a lot of years, he has done work on several engines for me. Top notch in my book

[@Russeljfinch]

@@bertgrau3934 great info from both you & Ed ...thanks

[@jeeprenegade1985]

I would deburr the top of the cylinder bore that was just bored before sliding the machine to the next bore. You don't need your machine sitting on top of a burr and sitting it out of square to the crankshaft centerline.

[@GrandPitoVic]

That's true. You don't see ridges in the newer cylinders anymore. Engines with over 250k miles you can usually hone them and put new rings in them. Lol. I was watching those Pakistani videos of them redoing engines from over there and I seen them us a boring bar. I didn't know that's what it was called. I was telling my wife about it 2 days ago. And then this video popped up. Lol.

[@edsmachine93]

Hello Hugh, thanks for watching. Yes you can bore, sleeve, counterbore. Etc. I have a plate to put the boring bar on and done cycle cylinders and small engines. I have a Comec ACF200 Boring mill for Boring and surfacing blocks. The Van Norman 777s is a amazing machine. Thanks for the comments. Take care, Ed.

[@Scarlet_1971_cuda]

Very cool. So you don't have to have to spend a ton of time leveling the surface of the block because the Van Norman base is also machined and therefor it will automatically bore straight. When watching I was thinking how is this setup not going to bore on some odd angle. Good stuff!!

[@edsmachine93]

Thank you for watching John. The set up is only as good as the factory block. In this case, it will be fine for this customer. Total budget build. Take care, Ed.

[@Scarlet_1971_cuda]

wow commenting using the cell phone is not good. Sorry about that.

[@edsmachine93]

@@Scarlet_1971_cuda Hey John it's OK. Your perfectly ok.. Thanks again, Ed.

[@cobramike13bravo63]

Somewhere out there a tweeker has watched this and is now boring blocks out of his garage.

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks for watching Mike. Ha, you are probably correct. But maybe and hopefully it will help someone on their journey for the best. Take care, Ed.

[@cobramike13bravo63]

@@edsmachine93 I would love to find one of those kits and give it a try. Very informative video. Appreciate it sir.

[@kuyaearly143]

can it do a 4.125 bore ? 🤔

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks for watching, yes it will cut 4.125 easily. I think 5.300 if I remember. Have a great day.

[@TheProchargedmopar]

👍💪

[@edsmachine93]

Hey ProChargedMopar, thank you for watching. Take care, Ed.

[@nicolasgrachek9709]

I’m guessing you are going to use the nice honing machine in the background with a torque plate. But back in the day after boring the engine did the machinists just use an adjustable honing stone with a drill and no torque plate to get to final size? Thank you, and nice job!

[@edsmachine93]

Thank you for watching Nicolas. This engine does not get torque plate honed. To do that you need to leave .004 to .005 to hone. This is a budget build. Customer can't afford any more expense. We do high performance block work. We have a ACF200 COMEC boremill. Take care, Ed.

[@nicolasgrachek9709]

Thank you for the reply. Top Notch!!

[@malcolmgeorge]

@@edsmachine93 Small block Chevy's really get lumpy around the head bolts. I just started torque-ing 5 bolts around the cylinder with some home made thick washers and then hone away. You can feel the lumps come off as you hone. Time consuming, but works until I can find a deal on a plate.

[@edsmachine93]

​@@malcolmgeorgeGreat idea Malcolm. Just anything to stress the block alittle.

[@markbryant8395]

Tap them 1/4 pipe and the one under rear main cap problems solved

[@edsmachine93]

Ok, thanks for commenting. I appreciate it.👍

[@markbryant8395]

Your welcome seen A few of them in my day. Bin and engine machinist all my life big diesel last 20 Keep up the good work peace, my friend.

[@edsmachine93]

@@markbryant8395 Thanks Mark, I sure appreciate the positive feedback. Take care and have a good evening. 👍👍

[@dirtlump]

Still one of the best to this day ! We used to 'square' the Block Decks parallel to the Mainline beforehand.... then mount the Van Norman to ensure Holes as close to 90* to the mainline as possible. Just say'in.... not uncommon to see old Block decks 'tilted' end to end and not 'parallel' to the mainline from factory.... the old Mopars especially.

[@edsmachine93]

Thank you for watching. The customer did not to deck this block do to cost. I have a Comec Bore Mill for precision deck and bore combination. And I can square at 90°. Do full blueprint. People wanted to see boring the old way, I do that to. Take care, Ed.

[@malcolmgeorge]

I like to check my setup with the paws at several points in the bore. I have a .003" feeler gauge that I feed in the top or the bottom and check the clearance and all 4 shoes. If anything is wrong you will see it then.

[@Just1Spark]

Excellent video! Alot of help! Question, how does turning the cutter to the front, allow it to retract without touching the bore?

[@edsmachine93]

Thank you for watching, I really appreciate it. The column or spindle has clearance in it, so when you retract the spindle, tool to the front. The top of the column moves or deflects from the drive mechanism making the tool contact a minimal amount. You may have a miner tool mark, but it will clean up during the honing process. Tool to side or in the back will leave a very noticeable tool mark. Hope this helps. Have a great day.👍

[@moparnut6286]

Ed I was just searching for these videos thank you for an excellent video!

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks MoparNut, I appreciate you watching and the comment. Have a great day.

[@Kenny-1958]

Get your self a over head hoist system and after 40 years I don't lift by hand anything in my shop.

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks Kenneth, I appreciate your watching. I'm working on things. I appreciate the input. Take care, Ed.

[@matthall9099]

So starting out you could use a boring bar to bore holes. What would you use to deck the block and heads on the cheap?

[@edsmachine93]

Hey Matt, thank you for watching. I had a VM 2000 Winona Van Norman. A 85b Storm Vulcan Block Master. But a Vertical Mill surfacer that would have CBN and PCD Milling capability with be the best as you could mill modern blocks and heads. Meet the head gasket specs for MLS gaskets and modern gasket compatability. But for old engines just the Storm Vulcan 85b. Take care, Ed.

[@derekmcdonald2856]

Awesome! I saw these machines for sale and was curious how it worked. Thank you for video.

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks for watching. I appreciate that. Take care, Ed.

[@wildrosegarage4208]

Awesome! Watching your videos makes me question my career choice.

[@edsmachine93]

Hey Nolan, thank you for watching. I appreciate your comments. I'm not sure what you do. But you have a shop at home and you could get a few pieces of equipment and start a part time deal at home. Nights and weekends. We're all on a path, sometimes we hit a fork in the road. Take care, Ed.

[@wildrosegarage4208]

@@edsmachine93 I am a plumber but I am pretty well rounded, I can pipefit, weld,Operate equipment and so on but what you do I would enjoy even if it was just a side gig and a couple motors per year.

[@pauloconnor7951]

The Beauty of youtube; is helping to prevent lost technology.

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks Paul, I really appreciate you watching and the positive feedback. 👍

[@79asspin]

Very nice.

[@edsmachine93]

Thank you Jaybo. I appreciate you watching. Take care, Ed.

[@jobeuirl]

It’s great to see the old machines but a this video could have been way shorter.

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks for watching.

[@davidhosticka]

Really enjoyed the video.

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks David, I appreciate you watching and commenting. Take care, Ed.

[@1000186ful]

Wish i could afford to buy one these machines

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks for watching. The Van Norman 777s is a good machine. Take care, Ed.

[@Transient901]

Kinda funny that the old way and the new way(no pun intended) result in the same thing.

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks for watching. The basic principles are the same. I have a Bore Mill and it has advantages. But I do both. The oldway still works. Take care, Ed.

[@Transient901]

@@edsmachine93 You completely missed my point. I am very aware of the principle's, the theory and the practical applications as well. Thanks for responding. And NO I do Not wish to debate this any further.

[@jseal21]

I know my way around just about any auto shop there is but I know nothing about machining, other than how to tell the machinist what I need done. I understand why you do the things you do but even watching that video I couldn't figure out for sure how you knew that you were perfectly aligned with the center of the bore before you began your cut. Was that why you sent it down the hole and sent the cat paws out? Even then it doesn't seem like they are strong enough to move the whole rig to where it needs to be and not be knocked out ot true themselves.... Seems like I missed something... Good vid anyway, really enjoy seeing the old school still being just as precise without a single computer chip to be found

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks for watching Joshua. The cats paws expand via a scroll, similar to how a lathe chuck works. And you typically center on the unworn portion of the cylinder bore. Now as a machinist I know sometimes you have to adjust things to make it clean up. Through experience I know what a person can get away with and still be serviceable. I have more advanced equipment to do block blueprints and correct bore centerlines and spacing. But think about the geometry if you are boring a block .030 you can't be very far off center line or you would not clean the wear and the bore. The cylinder is 4.000 going to 4.030 finished size, honing included. That's only .015 a side x 6.0 length cylinder. So if you were off very much on perpendicularity the cylinder would not clean up on the diameter and up and down. I hope this helps understand a little bit of what really goes on with re boring a block. Some guys wanted to see to old way, I showed them. I can do work on all levels. Take care, Ed.

[@jseal21]

I absolutely love seeing it. I've often wondered how the old timers did it without lasers and CAD/CAM and all the things that make now so much easier. Like machinists my age, 40, and especially younger have never even seen these machines much less used them. I know that the computer aided stuff has its own challenges but I wonder how many of these "master" machinists nowadays could do their jobs if all the keyboards disappeared.... In our daily lives, no matter the wonders we do and see, we should always strive to remember that the heights we achieve are only possible because we stand on the shoulders of the giants of the past.

[@edsmachine93]

@@jseal21 Well said Joshua. I am so greatful to the men that taught me. Took their time to share with me and others. Sad to think, today people do not remember the past. Because it was great, paving the way to the future. Take care, Ed.

[@jeeprenegade1985]

I hope the scroll behind the catspaws are in better shape than some of the lathe chucks I ran. Usually they centered a part .001" to .003" of center. Wear and cutting chips in the scroll affect them.

[@xxkingslayemxxgamer5553]

You are exactly right about running the engine at 190 to 200 it will last a lot longer

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks for watching. And commenting. Thank you.

[@stevenbelue5496]

I put 300k on a 3.1 v6 that didn't have a t-stat from 80k on, so around 220k with not t-stat and those cylinders looked good to the naked eye, no ring groove, didn't use no oil. Broke the head off a valve around 300k and I pulled the head, grabbed a piston and valve from a junk engine from work. I think the only thing I bought new was oil, filter and type 999 gasket maker. I reused the head gasket, the tty bolts, and i used the intake gaskets from the junk motor, pressed the new piston on, lapped a used valve in and threw it together and drove it for a couple more years before I traded for a 97 gmc sierra with 5L/nv3500 with a broke shift rail fork. The ol girl still ran like a top when I traded it off.

[@BubbaAyers1969]

Nice 👍, Ed if ever get a 90’s 880 2-bolt or 4-bolt block roller ..someone never picked up after machine work let me know I could use another one … Great video and thanks for sharing with us

[@edsmachine93]

Hey thanks for watching Bubba. If I get one I will keep you in mind. Take care, Ed.

[@johnnybrigham8154]

Nice work ed were did you get the long rod that's hold the block on the jack stands was looking for a used one ed thanks john.

[@edsmachine93]

Good morning Johnny. That is a piece of steel tubing. May even be a piece of pipe. The jack stands are old Craftsmans, like 45 years old, ha. On inline blocks I just put blocks under the pan rail. Take care, Ed.

[@johnnybrigham8154]

@@edsmachine93 like to get one of them pipes would you have one ed?

[@edsmachine93]

@@johnnybrigham8154 no I do not have a extra one. Had this one for over 36 years.

[@johnnybrigham8154]

@@edsmachine93 what dia and length is it ed? Aluminum or steel ?

[@jackashton708]

Nice to see someone that knows what he's doing 👌

[@edsmachine93]

Thank you Jack. I appreciate you watching. Take care, Ed.

[@JO753]

I alwayz hated thoze snap gajez. Too eazy to goof up.

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks for watching JO. Well I like snap gauges or Telescopic Gages. Just takes practice. It is a Technique to use them. Set gauge bigger than the bore, push through once or pull through once. Usually repeats within a couple of tenths. .0002. Have a nice day.

[@JO753]

Thats pretty good. I coud never get the same number within .003, so just made plug gajez wenevr I needed to be perfect.@@edsmachine93

[@janbill79]

This is something I've never, seen back to the video

[@edsmachine93]

Thank you for watching. What was it that you had never seen? Take care, Ed.

[@janbill79]

I had never seen a boring machine that was sorta portable , that used the engine block for a table or base to work off of. And all those cutters those things remind me of the lath tool with all the angles I had to l learn to sharpen in high school shop class. How small do they go can you do a small air cooled engine's as well . I suppose the block has to be large enough to support the machine. thks Bill

[@joespratt413]

Video much?

[@edsmachine93]

What's your point, explain please?

[@Shade_tree_garage01]

stupid people want WAY to much money for these, you can get a chinese copy for 2200 brand new....

[@edsmachine93]

Thanks for watching Shade Tree. I have seen the imports. But if you can find a good used on here. May be worth picking it up. Problem with imports is parts and electrical can be an issue. Take care, Ed.