Cinderella (2021) is a Failure of Magical Proportions

[@JustStop]

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[@edcaous]

I like how the usage of re:zero clips suggests that the experience of watching this movie is a comparable level of agony to being tossed into an unforgiving world, isolated from everyone else while enduring excruciating pain countless times... 'cause you've 100% hit the mark there. (should this be a separate comment instead of a reply?)

[@applecat5234]

Just stop this needs to stop Disney!

[@thatperson1009]

Man even the 2015 version wasn’t this terrible

[@uzziahmartin3394]

you missed seven nation army

[@darkhorseman90]

@@thatperson1009 ikr? but if we're talking about "bold" live action adaptations from Disney, Tim Burton's Alice In Wonderland will always hold top spot in my mind.

[@lynniersl3854]

NGL what upsets me the most about people bashing Cinderella, the OG Disney one, is calling her weak. Think about it, from a young age to adulthood, she was abused mentally, emotionally, and physically by her step mother and sisters BUT she never let that break her as a person. She stayed humble, kind, loving, true to herself and in the end SHE WON. She got out of her hellish life, got to marry a good guy, and got to become a princess. How is someone staying strong in the face of abuse a weak person?

[@MrJoeyWheeler]

You know, when you put it that way, it makes it seem like Cinderella is best "re-imagined" as a kind of blue collar workplace story about an exploited intern who is granted the chance to go to a company retreat and falls for the boss. Hey Hollywood, this is how you come up with good reimaginings.

[@sleepy_koko]

Cinderella, snow White, and Ariel get so much shit when they are really interesting and good characters For example Snow White has been to hell and back by the end of the movie, it has a similar message to Cinderella, good people get good things And Ariel never went to Ursula for the prince, it was because her father destroyed her collection and it was basically a dumb choice of spite as teenager would do, the prince part was for Ursula to set an impossible tast that Ariel will try and fail to achieve

[@icantstopsparkling7450]

@@MrJoeyWheeler I'm so angry that this version doesn't exist

[@Yvonne-Bella]

Even Cinderella 3 doubled down on this while giving her MORE agency.

[@Yvonne-Bella]

@Ugh exactly! Plus, this subtle bit of comedy are gold. 👌

[@tgs9929]

One thing I dislike is how much they want a "modern feminist" Cinderella is missing the fact she is an abuse victim. The fact she can be enslaved and abused but still be kind to other take so much strength and I wish they focus more on that aspect then trying to force in a girlboss message.

[@Saltedroastedcaramel]

Women can't be victims unless they're victim to the patriarchy. Other than that, vulnerable women is misogyny

[@DummyEste]

@@Saltedroastedcaramel What do you mean by that?

[@Saltedroastedcaramel]

@@DummyEste Cinderella was abused by the women in her life; her stepmother and stepsisters. Cinderella has always been victim blamed for the situation she's in even through there's no way she could get out. She keeps her head up high regardless, but that's ignored and is always seen as the damsel in distress waiting for a man to save her even though that's not true. Feminism, especially modern day, always say that women are always oppressed by the Patriarchy even to the point of being sexist to both genders without self awareness. Mainly women can't be vulnerable. They have to be strong and independent. Cinderella's character is progressive in her right for staying strong despite being abused. She only broke down when her dress was torn by her stepsisters instigated by her stepmother.

[@mysryuza]

@@Saltedroastedcaramel this 👌🏼

[@maxipadloud2086]

They don't want to "traumatize" little girls or give them the impression that it is acceptable for their family or anyone else to abuse them without facing consequences. You are absolutely right, but the writers are trying to follow the modern social reform that encourages everyone to be a "child" until the age of 26 or so. This may sound odd, BUT think about it- "Cinderella" in this movie goes as far as to say that she refuses to even attach a label to her and the prince's relationship. This is an obvious nod to modern society that frowns upon marriage (or any real commitment whatsoever) and encourages adults who are not orphans to continue living at home until they are 40 or something.

[@motxmod]

Another thing on the writing, Cinderella wants to be a dressmaker. At the supposed time the film is set, women making clothes was not an unusual thing.

[@dancorneanu9144]

Heck, actual women in those times had a bad life if they were poor. Like poor men. Then she would be forced to do the things she whines about: cleaning, cooking, washing, mending, taking care of the household. Because a true poor woman would have to do it. Either that, or she starts working in the fields with her husband from down to dusk. Or there is.... the oldest profesion. But that was for real poor peasants. Dress making was normal for girls with some funds. Heck, it beat milkmaid, tavern wench, tavern owner, innkeeper or worker, metal smith, baker. Those were the way to survive in those times. Noble women had a lot more freedom, even over noble men.

[@mr.perezident9381]

@@dancorneanu9144 Wait, is Cinderella not poor?

[@dancorneanu9144]

@@mr.perezident9381 Cinderella is poor as herself, after her father dies, but she actually comes from a family that is wealthy. Either minor noble or trader. So she would be above in rank than someone on the lower level. The usual peasant, that didn't even own land in some cases. Only later did peasants started to own land. Men or women. Judging by her condition in this movie, the way her step mother acted and after she escapes her reach, being a seamstress is not something extraordinary for her status. Even a downgrade, in some cases. Seamstress or dress maker is a decent job, that women of higher peasantry or tradesman level could take. Is expected and wanted. Depending on your status, your cliantele changes. This movie treats it like something barred to women, but it was decent and the only thing stopping someone was funds.

[@HelluvaOpp]

@@dancorneanu9144 Agreed.

[@Graycata]

I feel like a few movies have come out recently with poor understanding of what women's status was in the set time period and place. Specifically women

[@irkenpony17]

I hate when a "strong woman" character is basically just the character hating men or is disrespectful to people and property because "they aren't like other girls". It really infuriates me as a woman myself- tbh I think the only couple things I liked was the butterfly fairy godmother (he was just kinda fun to watch), and that the step mother WANTED Cinderella to be with the prince and live I the kingdom, so she can be happy and live a dream as well as help herself and her daughters in a sense, because I've just never seen it before in the Cinderella story personally, I found it interesting.

[@ducantist4913]

I know I’m late but, dear goodness, YOU ARE SO RIGHT!! It’s like, you can’t be a strong woman unless you’re rude and, ironically, have masculine attitudes. It’s just so STUPID!

[@Me-dr9dv]

Yup, and the worst part is that the majority, if not all, of these characters become some of the most popular and profitable female characters. I also find it kind of funny that the "not like other girls" thing/cliché is basically contradicting itself with how much it is used now.

[@delusion5867]

also, the "I'm not like other girls" mindset is such a gross and toxic ideology. It only exists to masquerade as feminism when it's really just internalised misogyny and an excuse to bully others for liking/doing traditionally feminine things.

[@MaxKarmaCat]

*godparent

[@avengefullgirl95]

My favorite adaptation of cinderella is a book called "before midnight" if you like the portrayal of the step mom in this movie, you might like the step family in the book. its far more fascinating to watch unfold

[@isiaadiel3468]

"Disney princesses are bad influences." So heroism, reading, independence, general kindness, and literally overcoming abuse (and racism) are frowned upon? Are they trying to be blackholes with the density?!

[@DrawciaGleam02]

It's the thought that these girls waited to be rescued. Which isn't really something females should do in modern times if they can help it....

[@thedeliveryboy1123]

not moana reconnecting with the roots of her culture and her ancestors in a way that already hits too close to home for many AAPI people

[@jmurray1110]

If reading refers to belle then that’s not quite right She wasn’t a scholar she just got caught up in her fanatuses through books

[@ktw5574]

The only Disney princess that's a bad influence is Raya. She's so lame.

[@sakareeh]

@@ktw5574 fr Raya was horrible. Mulan better was better rep than raya will be

[@hassathunter2464]

The best use of an existing pop-song in movie is still "I need a hero" in Shrek 2. And I doubt that title is going to be taken any time soon (if ever).

[@jtmcf]

Ooooh don’t forget about Bad Reputation Joan Jett in Shrek 1

[@despinasgarden.4100]

@@jtmcf and "all star" in Shrek 1

[@jtmcf]

@@despinasgarden.4100 Or I’m a Believer That rendition slaps

[@microwave8931]

And Funkytown

[@sonofab30]

let's just say that any pop song used in a shrek film is gonna be a banger

[@fuyutupx1437]

The fact that the way they chose to show cinderella being unlike the other girls by having her be low key extra rude and disrespectful by climbing and siting on the former King's statue and then talking back to the current king when she's told to get off the statue and them trying to frame it as strong girl power is the absolute worse. Especially when in reality if you really did do that there would be big consequences.

[@monotromatic]

It wasnt "girl power" at all, it was downright disrespectful

[@everythingz888]

Yeah and the whole thing with the original Cinderella is despite her rough upbringing she was still extremely kind!

[@dancorneanu9144]

Get of my father's statue! Ha ha...funny joke. Guards! ... Next noon she would be in the stocks. Or hanged.

[@HelluvaOpp]

Yeah!

[@HelluvaOpp]

@@everythingz888 yeah. THEY THREW DISNEY VERSION OF HER OUT THE WINDOW AND INTO A GODDAMN DUMPSTER OF USELESSNESS!!!!

[@astral-from-afar]

Another weird thing is that freaking TIANA from The Princess and the frog did it better from a stand point of an independent woman which is funny due to her being able to run her business AND being married to Naveen in a 1920s timeline. (ALSO PLEASE EXECUTIVES DO NOT REMAKE TIANA’S STORY IM BEGGING YOU)

[@thefanwithoutaface8105]

THat was back when it wasn't considered a sin for women to want to be independent AND Happy or Married. Now being Independent basically means being extremely selfish and only pursing your career, which might sound nice on paper until you realize all it ends with is you being sad and alone.

[@wannabehistorian371]

Why is it funny that Tiana did it better?

[@cdupdetat]

@@thefanwithoutaface8105 what are you even saying?

[@5ft2mikahakkinen]

I have a felling that you just jinxed it.

[@Saltedroastedcaramel]

@@wannabehistorian371 I think they mean funny in an ironic way

[@wuwuink]

I despise the misconception that Cinderella was always weak. Little lines come where she mutters under her breath about her frustrations about her stepmother or sisters appear, showing humane emotions where you can see that she *does* have frustrations about how her stepfamily treats her, but she has the patience to continue her work. She works hard, and she's patient. The point is, she's strong in her situation. People now expect "strong" people to be the outgoing people with their voice loud over everyone else's but that's not the case. Emotionally, Cinderalla is strong. I'd definitely say I wouldn't have the strength not to beat my step family to death from the amount of ridiculous bullshit they say.

[@kelly9236]

Fun fact, Cinderella's dream job was actually completely normal in the story's historical setting! In the 1600-1700's, the dressmaking industry was almost exclusively run by women dressmakers, called mantua-makers at the time. So Disney's "bold take" on Cinderella is actually less progressive than the real-life historical time period it's trying to shidd on.

[@elizabethfrohn-hengst296]

This one wasn't made by disney

[@darthestar8791]

@@elizabethfrohn-hengst296 True, but the point still stands. This movie is being less progressive than it's "trying" to be by pushing a false narrative about what women can and can't do (alongside royalty) just for the sake of having a version of Cinderella who's "Progressive"

[@miithzz]

This one was made by Amazon

[@mmmirei]

It was made by Amazon but still, yes. Dressmaking was such a feminine trade that it (or weaving cloth) was basically the only job a woman could get all the way into the 1800s, so thinking that it was frowned upon is insane.

[@Hi-jw7oq]

Also it was a job literally no woman wanted. If you had an out from a job like that, you took it

[@chidivids2005]

I wish Hollywood would just learn the difference between a strong female character and a strong character that happens to be a female. Yes, there's a difference

[@jdawson7877]

unfortunately hollywood is way to dumb to understand that

[@mr.perezident9381]

I disagree with this take cause both are good. Strong female characters make a point in how being a woman is an important part of the character’s journey because it’s echoed in how society treats them during the story, and thus is written in a way that’s supposed to resonate with women. Strong characters that happen to be female aren’t focused on making a commentary anything about womanhood, but they can still resonate with women by virtue of being women. The main issue I think is conflating strong female characters with and only with female characters that act masculine. Cinderella is a good example, because the original Cinderella wasn’t a weak character, she was still strong, but how she demonstrated that, through optimism and optimism, are typically feminine traits, so through the lens of shallow and lazy Disney feminism, she’s not a strong character.

[@chidivids2005]

@@mr.perezident9381 I know. I'm talking about what Hollywood has stapled as a 'strong female character'. The girl who's 'not like other girls'. "Getting married? Pfft, I wanna run a business. How's that for a single personality trait?"

[@AdrienneJung.M]

Yaaaaaaassss Queeeen!!!! But, in all seriousness, these writers need to quit preaching and relearn how to tell a good story and create interesting characters independent of social agendas.

[@liamdell6319]

@@AdrienneJung.M But that would take effort though.

[@whatalsaid]

The scene where Cinderella goes to the ball was such a letdown, because A, her dress is awful, and B, she doesn't stand out and gets washed out in the crowd. Take the 2015 live action Cinderella for example. All of the ball guests are wearing elaborate dresses with patterns, textures and dark coloring, but then Cinderella shows up in this gigantic blue dress that's a lot lighter and less ornate than the other guests, so she stands out. But here, she catches people's attention by tripping over instruments, which is pretty dumb, especially when you consider that this Cinderella is supposed to be a "talented" fashion designer. Also, I'd like to point out how funny it is that this Cinderella movie is trying to present itself as the first "feminist" Cinderella, when Ever After came out 23 years earlier.

[@FrenkTheJoy]

A lot of Cinderella movie versions are "feminist" (I hate that term in this context, as if doing chores in your own house and then going to a party is implicitly not feminist??) The whole point of the story is just being rewarded for being kind, I hate that filmmakers feel there has to be some kind of Big Message behind it because it's not enough to just be kind despite a horrible living situation?

[@emtims1670]

Ever After- Another superior Cinderella story

[@freddyready8756]

Or rather nothing needs to be "feminist". Bringing in feminism as an movement is just to bring trouble with different groups with their views. Like to not be with a man or need to have to be an "girlboss" moment or other stereotypes that can be a lot worse than in the older movies. While I do agree that modern movies could give more of an "voice" to the female characters.

[@LoonyHalfBlood]

Hey! Person with random knowledge about dresses. Not only is Camilla's dress ugly as sin, it's incredibly ill fitting! The corset isn't supposed to look like that at all and I'm gobsmacked when amateur seamstresses gushed over it on TikTok. It's an ugly dress all around but the real kicker is recognizing the background characters dresses. A good portion of those are pre-existing quinceañera dresses. The black one I recognize the best from a Mexican designer. They really shit the bed in costuming.

[@Sly-Moose]

Ever After was THE BEST Cinderella adaptation and no one could ever tell me otherwise!

[@ingloriousMachina]

I know it's ridiculous to do so in a setting that has rap and borrowed pop music, but I will nitpick the costumes *all day long.* And I'm sorry to tell y'all this but a woman making her own money isn't exactly revolutionary. Seamstresses have existed forever. However I admit it would be impressive if she was able to make a living off of it, considering her designs are *awful.*

[@kshitijsrivastava6440]

I would have sympathized with this Cinderella a little bit more, if she had a passion for designing dresses but was looking for a way to learn to be better at that. Also if she wasn't so full of herself in his movie.

[@ingloriousMachina]

@@Raya-ir4tm It was also just practical. More women knew how to sew than men-

[@ingloriousMachina]

@@Raya-ir4tm The mother of one of the main characters in my book used dressmaking to pay for her tuition and became the first woman in her lower class family to attend college.

[@KaliqueClawthorne]

Margarete Steiff lived un the second half of the 19 century. Even while she did it with the help of men she build her own company. And men liked her and weren't mostly against it .... Like. A worldwide known company, still here till this day was build from a woman who at first only had women as workers making a damn revolution in the industry for children toys and being a damn icon. (Margarete Steiff was the founder off Steiff plush toys. Also she was disabled in a wheelchair her whole life)

[@rwin6401]

@@ingloriousMachina may you please elaborate on what makes her designs awful? i don't know much about fashion so i'm quite curious :D

[@somedandy7694]

Anyone else remember that 90s Cinderella musical with Brandy, Whoopi Goldberg, a Korean prince and an almost 0-whites cast, but it STILL managed to be utterly charming to all audiences 'cause the songs were original, the choreography passing, and the talent on point? Yeah...I remember that.

[@mychannel-rt2gn]

That’s because it came out in a different time. Everyone is too sensitive these days. Now, if you see a single black character in a movie people scream “SJW PROPAGANDA”

[@Victoria-_]

YESS!

[@somedandy7694]

@@Victoria-_ Lionel: "He'll find a wife at this ball. I feel it in my bones!" Queen Constantina: "You'll feel it in your bones if he doesn't!"

[@MaeArt725]

Wasn’t that movies anniversary this year?

[@tanishambrowne1137]

I remember this one it was so good 😊

[@whitethunder9064]

THANK YOU! I hate when people bash the OG princesses, saying they're "just waiting for a man." No, they weren't! Actually watch the movie! Every one of them had a different story, and were kind and pleasant, despite their circumstances. That's admirable!

[@atomicnumber202]

Don't forget the Angsty songs referencing them

[@WeegeeSlayer123]

I'll never understand why anyone will watch a live-action adaptation over the animated version. Animation will always be better in my eyes.

[@tuckerjohnston1844]

Because there are still some people (idiots) that thinks all animation is for kids but that’s obviously BS.

[@ingloriousMachina]

Animation almost always ages better than live action. There are just some things you can achieve easily in animation that will become outdated quickly in live action special effects.

[@thechefisacookin]

The only real exception is The Lord of the Rings.

[@ingloriousMachina]

@@thechefisacookin I adored Arthur Rankin's adaptation of The Hobbit. The Return Of The King, not so much.

[@papaya216]

i like animation as a medium in general a lot more, but i won't lie, the live action cinderella story with hillary duff was way more enjoyable than the animated disney version

[@demi_shin]

The moment I heard Camila Cabello was the lead role for this, I immediately thought it would be bad. Cinderella is a story about a peasant girl becoming a princess. It teaches young girls that no matter their status, they can be important to someone else. The moment they cast a popular musical artist in the role, it undermines the meaning of the original story. It basically makes young girls think they have to have qualities and talents only celebrities have. I just don’t think this works at all in retelling the story nor being modern. It will become dated quickly and eventually forgotten and hated. That’s just how it works. If they casted Cinderella as some unknown actor and used original songs, it would’ve possible been passable

[@Loudshark_]

That’s why lots of older cartoons still survive and being loved by everyone. They have good characters, original plots and music in it, and they basically still relevant enough for viewers to watch and go : ah this is quite relatable Edit : wrong words

[@okami-chan9772]

It would be pretty interesting if they end up having someone, who's a up and coming celebrity that nobody knows yet, to play as Cinderella.

[@NeedyBoBeedy]

holy crap it’s shinji from Neon Genesis Evangelion

[@WhiteDarkness3113]

@@okami-chan9772 or we could have a Ashanti in Muppets Wizard of Oz

[@angelaziegler6713]

Hey they did cast an unknown as Cinderella and had original songs…back in the 2015 Disney remake (far superior)

[@am3thysts]

“Look at this Disney Princess of woman empowerment! Look at how progressive we are!” Oh, but Merida from Brave isn’t empowering to women? A young girl not wanting to be married away and choosing her own fate, but learning to not be reckless about her actions? And, she wasn’t looking for love, and never ends up with a love interest. Or Tiana, a hard-working African American girl in the old south who made her dreams come true, who didn’t seek love but found it within a supporting partner who was actually broke? Or Mulan, who worked hard and outperformed all of the men in the army and was regarded as a national hero for her courage, bravery, and strength? Again didn’t look for love but found it in a supporting and trusting partner. Or Repunzel from Tangled, who was generally physically stronger and more adaptable than Flint, but main weakness was being ignorant and naive from being manipulated her whole life, but broke out of her imprisonment? She would then even change the whole royal guard to use her weapon because she was so effective with it. And once again, she didn’t look for love, but found it with a supportive partner.

[@princesscrystal6410]

This was made by Amazon thi

[@the_furry_inside_your_walls639]

@@princesscrystal6410 But it's based off of a Disney film.

[@a110coolio9]

I have never seen anything so right

[@mileyscool97]

@@the_furry_inside_your_walls639it’s based off of the story of Cinderella. The story that the Disney movie is based off of

[@sev1120]

​@@mileyscool97they knew they were going to draw comparisons to Disney by making the movie, especially because there's no subtitle or anything to differentiate it from the disney movie

[@sophieamandaleitontoomey9343]

I HATE when people call the original Cinderella from the 1950’s version a weak woman. How she’s weak because she never stands up to her abusers and never tries to escape her situation. No no no no. She is not weak. She is a victim of years of abuse. She is constantly tormented and belittled by her family in almost every way. And yet, throughout all of that, she somehow manages to retain her kindness and compassion. And even more amazingly, she somehow manages to keep her positive attitude and never tries to give that up until the dress ripping scene. Also in regard to escaping where is she going to go? She also never asked for the prince to fall in love with her but it was a happy coincidence that she met him while just wanting to go to the ball. She’s the one who won. She got a way out of her shitty situation and ended up with the happiness she deserved. We root for her because of these things. That’s why she’s such a great character. Not every character needs to be physically or mentally strong. The strongest people are the weakest ones on the inside because they push through that pain and still get up every day and try to be compassionate for others anyway. This version of her? What exactly is she compassionate about? Who is she compassionate to besides the butterfly for plot? Where is her kindness? What exactly about her makes her strong? Her being turned into a “girl boss” is not what makes someone necessarily strong and it’s very out of character for Cinderella. And between the insistent songs that don’t fit together, the lack of good writing for the female characters, the Prince being insufferable and the dialogue being awful, this film is just a gigantic cringe fest.

[@sev1120]

Plus, the "she never stands up to her abusers" argument is kinda stupid because, as the story explains, until she meets the prince she has literally nowhere else to go to. What's she supposed to do when she stands up to them? Live in a barrel on the street?

[@DrDolan2000]

I guess they just expect her to live in the woods because of her connection with animals? Except those were barn animals, not wild ones

[@mousekateer627]

I grew up with the Disney princess movies and they taught me the importance of kindness, bravery, intelligence and hard work. Even as a dumb kid, I didn't think "I want to marry a prince when I grow up". Why are people especially women being so unnecessarily harsh on the Disney princess when they're just cartoons based on fairytales not history. On that note, I wish we could have more traditional musical or non-musical fairytale adaptions that compel to us emotionally regardless of age. Especially when there plenty of folk tales from all over the world we haven't seen on screen.

[@CleBiscuits]

Same i miss them :')

[@mediocreskullduggery]

I’ll never forgive Disney for taking Esméralda off the Princess roster. She was my favourite.

[@CleBiscuits]

@@mediocreskullduggery kida too!

[@mousekateer627]

@@mediocreskullduggery I got the same gripe for Alice and Megara

[@tgiacin435]

@@mediocreskullduggery yeah, I get she’s not a princess, but still.

[@arnold20139]

My theory is that the producers of this movie wanted to make Cinderella into a Moulin Rouge type movie. With colorful sets, craziness, and random music. But the producers didn’t understand what made Moulin Rouge a cult classic to many.

[@MoostachedSaiyanPrince]

Yeah, my thoughts exactly. I haven't seen this movie, and don't plan to, but literally every bit of footage I've seen from it give me a "Moulin Rouge knockoff" vibe.

[@aliceduren6542]

also moulin rouge looked gorgeous and this looks cheap af

[@The_13th_Hussar]

Well, it looked good when the editing was slow enough you could appreciate it.

[@cecelialeone2654]

@@aliceduren6542 just like amazon lol

[@HelluvaOpp]

That theory is not a theory. It’s the truth.

[@thepylonperspective]

“I hate Jukebox musicals…” Shrek: *stares motherfuckerly*

[@hhoop3876]

There are always exceptions, never absolutes

[@parasaur4595]

Only a sith deals in absolutes.

[@Smugly33810]

Shriek isn’t a musical it’s nondiagetic

[@jvondd]

The Shrek movies aren't musicals.

[@morganyoung3557]

I just thought of a way to make a Cinderella story that doesn’t make romance the most important part of her story, but doesn’t undermine romance like this movie seems to do. Have it focus a lot on Cinderella’s desire to have a family, she wants a family since what she thought could be a family with her stepmother and stepsisters didn’t work out because they are cruel and abusive towards her. Have her go to the ball and have her interact with not just the prince, but also other members of his family too and the royal family represents the type of family she wants not because of their status, but because they care about each other. Also have the royal family impressed with Cinderella because of her kindness and many other positive traits that she had displayed throughout the story and have them be just as invested in finding the girl at the ball as the prince was because they like her and they also want the prince to be with the person he fell in love with. Have it be a triumph for Cinderella that she not only found love in the prince, but got the family she always desired.

[@YelenaSkunky]

I think, it's quite common in adaptations to have at least a brief moment of Cinderella interacting with the Prince's family, to show that they get to like her too. A good writer could take this plot point way farther. In a meaningful way. It made me remember the Soviet movie adaptation, where Cinderella and the King share some sort of a bond.

[@StriderStryker]

And this movie gets nominated for an Oscar for *Fan Favorite.* _Welcome to the 21st century where everyone is devolving quickly as possible._

[@ajpat9620]

This has got to be a total joke. Honestly, this is preposterous. Unbelievable.

[@sonicfanboy3375]

Source?

[@VidtopiaEntertainment]

Funny thing another Cinderella musical also came out this year, which is Andrew Lloyd Webber’s Cinderella which has been getting rave reviews and actually does something different with the story with having Cinderella be kind of a rebel, and the songs are pretty good with my favorites being Bad Cinderella, and I Know I Have a Heart with Mulan lyricist David Zippel doing the lyrics. So far the show is in the West End and we will see if it makes it to Broadway, so forget the 2021 movie go see Andrew Lloyd Webber’s Cinderella if you can.

[@turma8eac]

I mean, sure, but Webber has been lackluster for a while now (cats/ phantom fanfic/ etc) Will give it a shot but don’t expect much

[@lll.24601]

FAR TOO LATE SLAPS THOUGH-

[@bigboss425]

I don’t really enjoy the live action mulan music as it isn’t really that thought out but this sounds pretty good is it only on broadway?

[@ThatRandomEncounterGuy]

Or just watch Cinderella 3: a Twist in Time. A Disney sequel that’s, not only really great, but genuinely does take strides to subvert and call attention to the fairy tale tropes of the original, and even does the whole “empowering Cinderella” thing in a way that both the dumpster fire Cinderella’s after it (the Disney live-action remake and this one) failed at spectacularly. Mostly because it doesn’t beat you to death in the corner with its lack of subtlety because FEMINISM or something.

[@VidtopiaEntertainment]

@@ThatRandomEncounterGuy I agree that’s also a good choice as I think it’s one of Disney’s best direct to video sequels.

[@psychoPilgrim36]

I wish “strong” women characters would stop acting like they only have time for their career and nothing else. Its unrealistic and just stupid. Most people know that you have time for a career AND someone you love. It doesnt make you weak because you want a boyfriend and for them to act like it does is so counterproductive and kinda just sexist?? Like why do they act like we are only capable of doing one thing? Cant a strong woman love her work and also be like “yeah i want a boyfriend that seems nice and fun”. Im just sick of it being presented as one or the other, and that real “strong” women dont have time for petty things like romance. Like no, i would say that MOST people do want to find love in their life and they arent vehemently against it because of their career goals. It just makes the characters feel so one dimensional, and if you are trying to make a feminist movie then you really shouldnt make your main character be one dimensional?? You should try to make them realistic because thats what most people can relate to which makes it easier to actually learn from. With that said, i havent actually watched this movie so this critique isn’t necessarily JUST about this because idk if its even totally applicable, but ive seen a lot of reviews and i do get that “i dont have time for romance i need to do work!!!” vibe from it. But mostly this is just a general critique of any and all movies that do that

[@growingsage]

I would say it's an outdated cultural holdover from the 80's power suit wearing career women. People in charge of writing these stories still seem to think most women want to be independent and even hostile to the idea of relationships. And while some women do want to be by themselves and focus on other things, it's certainly not a majority. But the ones who know you can have both aren't the ones telling the stories sadly. Writing a strong independent woman who don't need no man is a "safe" cliche. No need to think deeper about it. It's there and that's it.

[@jdawson7877]

seriously i don't what these people over at hollywood are smoking that makes them think this how real strong women act.

[@growingsage]

@@jdawson7877 I would say cocaine but they're probably huffing paint fumes in reality

[@juanchoresultay2704]

@@growingsage true there are other strong women for me who also has balance of career and healthy love relationships like the Queen from the Crown or Madam Secretary those for me define a strong women not those who are labeled to not having love in personal life just saying because being strong also comes from support not just yourself !

[@Pollicina_db]

Boy I have a movie for you: The Frog Prince (2009)

[@chaoticeiris]

I feel like James Cordon legit begs to be in anything and everything. He's so awful as both a person and an actor/'comedian. I feel like the UK sent him over here to punish us.

[@HerrDeutschBlood]

James Cordon’s presence in Hollywood is much like that relative that seems to be despised by everyone else in the family. No matter how much you want to see it gone, it simply refuses to just die.

[@OverlyPositiveFanboy]

Trust me, we didn't send him.

[@whatif3271]

I think it was after he was in Into the Woods. Then everyone started putting him in their musicals

[@FiveFoxesInATrenchcoat]

James Corden is the Antichrist of film

[@microwave8931]

Imagine waking up and realizing that you gave birth to James Cordon

[@Telawin]

13:40 as someone who absolutely loves performing in live theater I can tell you why. it's because a movie is there to make money, we try to make the sets, costumes, movements, and songs as good as we can because we love it and want as many people to love it as we can... and it's just more fun than film acting

[@stingingcake853]

on the topic of queens having jobs, I think there could be an issue with her selling her dresses. Mostly because in certain places nobles having real jobs was seen as lesser/taking advantage (as in, you already are getting tax money, why do you need this other money). However, her making her dresses as a hobby would be totally fine, and if she were to auction them for charity/give them as gifts that would also be fine. In fact sewing as a hobby is probably one of the more socially acceptable ones a queen could have! Also, can't get over how ugly all the dresses she makes are.

[@annieandelsieofarendelle3294]

And if she became queen she could use her new position to promote the rights and independence of women all across the kingdom.

[@boyroy4u]

Ngl it never occurred to me how few of the original princess in their movies actually cared for love or marriage. Like I'm embarrassed to think that I ever thought Snow White or Cinderella were looking for men cause they definetely weren't, they were trying to escape their terrible situations and worked hard to do so, just cause a dude came in last moment to pick up all the glory doesn't mean they didn't take their own action. Im suddenly much angrier at the remakes and people who try and "subvert fairytale tropes" like they are better than them

[@jdawson7877]

what's funny is that at this point subverting fairytale tropes has became a trope itself

[@HelluvaOpp]

NGAH! I agree!

[@jdawson7877]

@@HelluvaOpp do you know what i would like to see a traditional fairy tale movie that mocks fairly tale parodies that would be funny.

[@Пинагод]

I wouldn't even call the pinces who've picked up the glory - They're the people that blindly saved these people from terrible situations. Outside from initial biases, Cinderella and Snow White were both victims that were subjected to horrible situations, and any help in their circumstance is absolutely necessary, let's not pretend that any independent actions could've helped them as anyone in their situations wouldn't know what to do themselves. So for both of them to find their happy endings and to receive the help they deserved, I'd say all the glory, even till the end, is meant for them. I guess people just thought it was a way that if you got these men to save you, you're happy; When it's not like that at all. Having the romantic interest is a bonus, what's more important is that they've gotten out of the situation and are with someone much more decent and preferred.

[@JuMiKu]

Disagree. Snow White started the movie wishing for a man. She was definitely all about the romance. Regarding Cinderella, on the other hand, I agree with you. Cinderella wanted to go to the ball and just see the prince. Basically, it seemed like she wanted to have a good time for once.

[@yever4635]

22:27 Even before all of these live action remakes, Cinderella 3 did this and was still more successful. A straight to DVD Disney sequel is still better than what we got over the last decade. It's by no means perfect but I can tell they put in genuine effort.

[@curryfishheadenjoyer]

yea, its subversive without shoving its subversiveness in your face if that makes sense, like it dosent explicitly set out to "fix" cinderella or be all "women empowerment!!"

[@tarotsushima3332]

Cinderella 3 is one of the few sequels that are actually better than the original movies considering how they develop both main and minor characters as well as being a lot funnier yet heartwarming

[@HelluvaOpp]

Agreed!

[@HelluvaOpp]

@@tarotsushima3332 NA-NA-NANI?!?!

[@OverlyPositiveFanboy]

You know you fucked up when a Direct-to-DVD Disney Sequel is better than your bigger budget live-action movie.

[@tgs9929]

Amateur folklorist here: Cinderella (or the basic outline of a maiden rising from the ashes into royalty with the aid of a little magic) is one of the oldest and wide spread stories and there are hundreds of versions.

[@nothanks7063]

They just don't get the point of Cinderella as both a character and a story, they keep trying to "modernize" and to "empower" but keep failing to understand the actual message.

[@DustyHoney]

Cinderella is a story with a lot of potential. She’s an abuse victim who gets through it with her own kindness and finds love.

[@renatotejada8073]

Wasn't Cinderella the daughter on a noble, and the reason she lived like that was because her step-mother?

[@lunagrace2872]

In the 1950 animated movie Cinderella was not a noble but her father was just rich (mostly because he was a great merchant) but when he died the Stepmother took over the house and made Cinderella a indentured servant (a slave that was legal)

[@andrewgreeb916]

@@lunagrace2872 you've always been able to work your children, why do you think farmers have 8-12 kids

[@schmeeps4052]

@@andrewgreeb916 the problem isn’t that she worked. It’s that her guardian took total control of her life and treated her like a second class citizen in her own home while her step sisters led a charmed life (off of her father’s money).

[@cookiemocher388]

Depends on the version, in Ever After I don't think he's a noble but I know her step mother defently is

[@dancorneanu9144]

Her father was a merchant. Not noble, but preety high up in hierarchy.

[@tartagliatheharbinger8744]

On a slightly unrelated note: Anybody know a story about a women or girl who believes that strength and feminism is being independent to the pointing of refusing help, but by the end of the story realizes that strength is being independent while acknowledging their flaws and asking for help? Maybe I don’t watch enough movies or read enough books…

[@somethingspontaneous4982]

Encanto came out after this comment, but i whink it lands what ur saying?

[@billiebloojeans]

even though it's been beaten to death at this point, Frozen. Elsa's storyline is exactly what you're looking for

[@Пинагод]

@@billiebloojeans I'm not exactly sure about that, since Elsa wasn't really trying to be 'feminist' in a sense. And usually with these types of people, the idea of wanting feminism always fails on them because they don't actually understand what it means to be one, and their reasons are usually very unreasonable, while Elsa had a more justified reason as to why she wants to be independent and alone. Actually, I'm rather sure Elsa was a double double track. Her main problem in the first part of the film was that she was 'trying to be strong' and keep her powers in tact. But the actual problem finally comes when she DOES release her powers and be herself. Her problem wasn't that she believes too much in herself, in fact her problem was that she doesn't believe in herself at all. I think what the commentor was looking for was a story about an obnoxious woman who thinks that the problems happening are because of an outside source rather than understanding that the problems can come from a deeper level of complication. Elsa isn't obnoxious and doesn't blame her problems on the people around her.

[@yomilemondragon1721]

The Princess and the Frog.

[@tartagliatheharbinger8744]

@@Пинагод This and what other commenters have said thus far. I’m both looking for “I must be strong and independent” and “I also ignore the problems that are happening to me, that are caused by me, and refuse to either change or get help.” I want obnoxious and overly prideful, only for them to get knocked down several pegs. I don’t want a devil for an MC, but I crave positive change and growth of maturity.

[@ohnosmoarlulcatz]

Too many movies are also trying to do the Guardians of the Galaxy thing with Peter Quill's music from his mom without understanding how they work. Those songs had a special meaning to Peter, his mom, and his dad, which is why they kind of work. Even Quicksilver at least showed that it was part of his love of music. But in other cases like Suicide Squad? They serve no real purpose despite trying to emulate the same thing. It would be different if Deadshot used it to concentrate or Captain Boomerang used it as a timer, but they're just forced in because they wanted to have music. And like it is said in the video, songs can be used to convey emotion. However, I don't get that feeling in the modern takes of the song. In fact, most rehashes of existing songs get used for the wrong purpose. A good example for this is the song Prince Ali in Aladdin. In the classic song, it's Aladdin and basically what he imagines being a prince is like. But in Disney's live action remake, it's mostly just the Genie parading around the streets. You don't see much of Aladdin. This is especially true of the Mulan live action. They use a bit of Reflection when Mulan removes her armor, but you have to completely ignore the fact that Mulan was basically able to do whatever she wants until she joined the army for it to work.

[@cameronfrye8311]

Gotg’s implementation of the music is so underrated. The music is the only human thing Peter has to latch onto in this alien world he’d been brought into, and it grounds gotg and makes it more a crazy marvel sci fi movie. Peter Quill’s my favorite marvel character, one of the reasons being his driving force being his mother. Despite him being taunted and used by the Ravagers, his music sorta represents his human side and the heart he has, despite being ripped of any sort of happiness. In the opening scene of gotg we see a Quill with heart, one that steps up to bullies and protects innocent life like the frog that didn’t do nothin’. His music reminds us of this side of him, and the songs are always used to perfectly

[@BabyGirlTiny]

You can tell marvel was the first movies you've ever watched if you think they're trying to copy marvel. I'm sorry to say this, but movies have used popular songs before guardians of the galaxy. Hell, glee was doing it.

[@HelluvaOpp]

That’s a bit dumb!

[@admirallily]

This video wonderfully goes far deeper than "What's Wrong With 2021 Cinderella" into "Why 99% of all movies and shows today are just not fun anymore." Their story and characgters lost to "the message" being pushed. We no longer get to discover the story and message, it's spoonfed or beaten into our heads like a baseball bat. Thank you.

[@pastelfan9730]

Cinderella has always been my favorite Disney princess. She lived through hell and was abused by the people that were supposed to care about her, yet she didn’t let any of that stop her from being a kind, thoughtful, and humble person. I hate when a reason people give for her being a “bad role model” was because she just wanted to be with the prince, yet if they had actually watched the movie, they would know that she doesn’t even realize she danced with the prince until AFTER the ball. I’ve looked up to Cinderella since I was little, and I will continue doing so.

[@libramoon1582]

Good examples of songs having an emotional impact if done right are "How Far I'll Go " depicts Moana being torn between leading her people as the future chief and accepting her destiny to return Te Fe's heart and (unrelated) Leo Whitefang's theme in Guilty Gear Strive explaining his tragic backstory and how he adopts an prideful personality to cope with trauma

[@Ramsey276one]

Sugar Punch explains that one!

[@egomegayolo4127]

Hey Guilty Gear Strive! Me likey. Pretty much all of the character themes in that game have that thing going on of using lyrics to tell that characters, well, character, as well as the general story that motivates them.

[@zoazede2098]

You did not just called Te Fiti "te fe" right??? Σ(ಠ_ಠ)

[@mysryuza]

@@zoazede2098 Sequel to Moana: Adventures of Te Fe

[@zoazede2098]

@@mysryuza XDDDD

[@nova_beam]

Jukebox Musical are typically something that most studios aren’t capable of doing well. Ironically one of my favorite movies is Moulin Rouge. Cinderella really misses the mark when it comes to the Jukebox musical. It’s everything that’s wrong with the genre. There are also Cinderella movies that have a more independent version of the characters. This is a shallow, hallow, husk of a movie. It treats it viewers like idiots. Billy Porter and Idina Menzel deserve better. Hilariously Baz Luhrmann’s Romeo + Juliet is also one of my favorite movies.

[@homosexualitymydearwatson4109]

I enjoyed mamma mia here we go again, as a jukebox musical.

[@Musicradio77Network]

“Mamma Mia” was a great example of a Jukebox Musical.

[@definitelynotalizard]

A lesser known jukebox musical that I feel chose its songs well is Strange Magic. It's not revolutionary, but they fit the story and progress the plot while sometimes conveying feelings a character can't say outright (Say Hey sung by Sunny) or minor foreshadowing (Love is Strange sung by Sugar Plum). Also I'm a sucker for uncanny valley animated magical creatures.

[@stingingcake853]

@@definitelynotalizard Lol, I love strange magic. I feel like it's music choice is super strong because it definitely finds music that fits the moments. It also gets music from different eras which adds to it honestly. unironically the strange magic duet cover is my favorite version of that song.

[@definitelynotalizard]

@@stingingcake853 I love it too, it was the perfect romantic duet for them. It's also nice that the Bog King's voice is rough to suit his character but not grating like in some other shows. My favourite though has to be their version of Three Little Birds, it's so catchy and never fails to lift my mood, plus I think it really suits being sped up a bit.

[@fluffy-hellhound]

Here's a better "bold take" on CInderella: _So Cinderella skipped the ball and asked her fairy godmother to make her the first woman president. Realizing that the monarch was obsolete, the prince opened a video store._

[@HelluvaOpp]

Oh hell yes! That’s one Helluva bold take on the classic story! And what? Is the king gonna open a movie theater?!?!

[@KevinKess]

@Fluffy HellHound A good comedic sketch or cartoon short could be made out of a premise like that.

[@realtimberstalker]

That would make her a dictator though, because she wasn't elected.

[@gaspardp7314]

you know what? A thousand pages story about a revolutionary woman who falls in love with a prince and how they slowly realise how a monarchy is not a viable system for the common people to thrive in, and have the conflict between the prince's morality and his comfort and the love for his family, and the dilema for Cinderella to either try and live a happy luxurious life or let go of a comfortable future for the sake of a change that might not even bear the results she hopes for, that would absolutely make a great story if the Hollywood scenarists who think that "gatekeep gaslight girlboss" isn't actually feminism don't get to touch it but rather actual feminists, that is

[@philip1557]

a Better Movie

[@djoctavio5014]

I can't get over "And now may I present, Tissues, the dress." I started cackling

[@da-yechung564]

I think that if you know the origin of Snow White, it's interesting that she really only got "saved" by coincidence because the original has the prince try to carry her and bump her, thus dislodging the apple piece that was stuck in her throat

[@kingbash6466]

Ever After still remains the best Cinderella movie to date. This movie somehow made me appreciate the Disney live-action remake.

[@TheKpa11]

Really? I’m the opposite. In a more fair world THIS would be the only cheap remake live action, but Disney beat them to it with their shallow cash grab. So this by comparison was overshadowed by the previous cashgrab

[@jandm4ever716]

@@TheKpa11 I disagree. I think the live action Cinderella with Lily James was beautiful and one of the few live action moves that actually had heart behind it.

[@HelluvaOpp]

@@jandm4ever716 understandable, have a great day!

[@alejandromolinac]

@@jandm4ever716 OMG.... I just can't with the Live Action Cinderella..... "I can't leave my house"..... no problem leaving at the end.... Gets locked up in the tower.... Just whines..... At least in the cartoon, she is proactive and pretty much directs the mice and dog to get her out out......

[@doesthisIookinfected]

I really liked the one with Selena Gomez idc sue me

[@umbrella3235]

Pros: This movie is free if you have Amazon Prime. Cons: You'll still feel ripped off after watching it. Conclusion: Watch Guns Akimbo, Invincible, or literally anything else free right now instead.

[@lmahu6627]

I watched this movie through a not-so-legal source and I still feel ripped off.

[@HydraSpectre1138]

I couldn’t get Amazon Prime Video because the rest of my family said no since there are no Korean dramas there and we are stingy with money, so only Netflix for us. I really wanted Amazon Prime Video so I can watch the Rebuild of Evangelion films. I have to pirate 90% of everything because we are poor. Netflix has mostly terrible Western original content and barely any third-party content but at least their anime is good and my family likes the K-dramas they have. We are planning on getting Disney+ when it comes out here, though, and we also have this streaming service Viu just for more Korean dramas.

[@doesthisIookinfected]

Madagascar 3 😎

[@HydraSpectre1138]

Watch the Rebuild of Evangelion movies, they are great.

[@keoniflow2019]

I like how when people say things like “bold new take on a classic story”, that they really mean “make it ridiculously feminist and also #relatable to the #youth with #slang” instead of doing something actually ground breaking, like having cinderella be cast as someone not conventionally attractive, or making cinderella a guy, or prince charming a girl, or doing a complete gender swap, or even just have it take place in an abnormal and interesting place, like space, or an alien planet, or something at least remotely different from the stereotypical medieval country or modern city.

[@keoniflow2019]

@Caiden Leonard because theyre more interested in slapping “feminist” on a movie and being done with it than actually doing something ground breaking.

[@sparklingdeath1730]

I actually love to watch a gender swapped Cinderella movie

[@FrenkTheJoy]

Especially this one, it didn't do ANYTHING different other than giving the prince a sister. Person of color as the lead? It's been done. Mismatched costuming and set pieces to give a sort of timeless fairytale look? Been done many times. Cinderella has skills other than cleaning the house and dreams of doing something else? Been done many times. The step-mother is a Broadway legend? Been done. It's also dumb because so many other cultures have what's basically their own Cinderella story. Why not adapt one of those for once, rather than the common European one??

[@itsflappletime]

There are so many pieces of media that do the whole quote on quote 'feminist' thing much better. Good examples are shrek (not 3), undertale, and the how to train your dragon books. All of the female characters in these have pretty obvious flaws but are so powerful in the message that they send when it comes to women being able to, you know, do stuff without being overly pandering. I can bet that all of these have been a bigger good influence on young girls than Cinderella 2021 will ever be.

[@reynarudydharsono603]

I personally think they missed an opportunity. Another review suggested that since the prince has a sister, the princess and Cindy should've been a thing. Instead of a fairy godmother, the prince is THE godmother. Constantly changing between his two personas; a kind villager and brother to play matchmaker. THAT'S a Cinderella reimagining I've yet to see

[@Paratet]

It's funny that you mention the "Jukebox" Musical at the beginning and even call out Romeo+Juliet as a great example of retelling an old story since Baz Luhrmann is the reason the problem exists, but he's also the answer. Moulin Rouge utilized contemporary music in the same hyperkinetic style to tell an old story with a modern spin.

[@tristyone1]

i was also going to mention moulin rogue as a great jukebox musical! when i first heard el tango de roxanne i couldn’t believe it was a cover haha

[@a.p907]

Also, people have been "deconstructing" fairytales by making the darker and gorier and spitting on the original tale for years and the only good example of it I saw was the Stage Play of Into the Woods (movie sucked. also starred James Corban.) Its also my second favorite version of Cinderella. And you can tell the writers respected the original stories, while pointing out the flaws. (Its also a great musical. See Sideways' video on it for the full details.)

[@rainHellsing]

If they want a darker story all they gotta do i go to the og sources

[@henryjones5253]

@@rainHellsing There are already dark moments with the stepsisters cutting off their toes to fit into the golden slipper and getting their eyes pecked out by the birds that always assisted Cinderella and the Big Bad Wolf eating Little Red and her grandma in the film. Even then, it’s an adaptation. I’d want some elements to be changed when adapting to another medium. So I could care less about there being less violence.

[@henryjones5253]

I disagree about Into the Woods being a great musical. It’s honestly the most overrated musical and not worth the praise. I’m actually glad it lost to Best Musical to Andrew Lloyd Webber’s Phantom of the Opera, a much better musical. Even Stephen Sondheim’s previous musicals were much better than Into the Woods like West Side Story, Gypsy, A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Forum and Sweeney Todd: The Demon Barber of Fleet Street. Into the Woods is just full of way too many plot holes and conveniences like Rapunzel’s twins disappearing, the fact it only takes 9 months for the Giantess to finally notice her husband is killed when I’m certain she would have gone into rampage mode right away, Jack and Little Red Riding Hood being the wrong ages when they’re supposed to be kids in the original Grimms story, heck Little is in Little Red’s frigging name, just an excuse not to bring in child actors when there are plenty of musicals with great child actors like Annie, The Sound of Music, and Peter Pan, and the appearances of Snow White and Sleeping Beauty are honestly unnecessary as they only serve as blatant references to Grimm’s other fairy tales when 4 fairy tales is plenty and doesn’t need anymore. You might just as well say after the Witch disappeared she moved into a Candy cottage and tried to eat 2 lost children, oh wait, 2 lost adults in this case if we’re gonna have adults be playing roles much more suited for child actors. Not to mention their appearances is part of the plot holes in the musical, if they were found in the same woods, then why weren’t they killed by the Giantess’ rampage? I’m certain they’d be dead like Rapunzel. Clearly shows Stephen and James Lapine should have taken another look at the script before doing the workshop. Honestly, Best Book of a Musical should have went to Phantom. At least its book was coherent and not so full of holes and conveniences.

[@samueltitone5683]

@@henryjones5253 glad I’m not the only who thought Into the Woods was garbage. In a post-Shrek world, it feels so been there done that.

[@SpyroTheGerudo]

Nobody has sat down and actually watched the movies these remakes are based on. This Cinderella's whole personality tries so hard to be empowering, but ironically, the most empowering thing about the original character was how someone who was abused and enslaved in childhood all the way to adulthood finds the strength to get up and make others happy and helping the less fortunate out and also dreaming of a better life. She isn't just a social justice wacko who doesn't want to be in a fairy tale like she is in this movie. It tries to call you out for watching it!

[@Izhen_UwU]

This movie is another feminist movie,just like everyother hollywood movie nowdays.

[@mattwolf7698]

I've never had an issue with dated music in a movie, I think it's actually interesting to be reminded of songs from whatever era the movie is set in even if it was set in the present when it came out. Also unless it's in like a fantasy setting the technology like cars, tvs and phones in the movie will still date it to an extent anyway. That said, the songs are badly picked sometimes.

[@egomegayolo4127]

Really, my issue with stuff like that is the sensation of mood whiplash using modern-sounding music in an obviously medieval or fantasy-like setting, not even mentioning using aspects of modern society and cities in said setting. I can't get engaged because I'm just confused by the whole aesthetic and how it can't make up its mind about what it wants to be.

[@sharkjumpingwalrus6744]

I think that the whole "Disney princesses are bad role models" comes from two factors. People taking the jokes made about these stories, like the one about beauty and the beast showing stockholm syndrome, which was just a joke about how Bella and beasts relationship started out with her giving herself to be the beasts prisoner in place of her father at face value. That's a problem with memes, eventually they lose all context, and get distorted into painful imitations. When that becomes your first exposure to a story, you tend to develop certain biases. I don't blame people for getting the wrong idea from a joke that lost all context. I can blame them for ignoring countless people who have done their best to correct the misconceptions. I've also noticed that modern day "feminists" seem to be ashamed of anything labeled as effeminate, which is especially prominent in the comic book industry. It's not enough to portray a female as being muscular, they have to have to be shaped like a male body builder on steroids'. It's not enough for them to stand on their own, they can't rely on anyone. Bear in mind these are the same people who complain about toxic masculinity, yet they invalidate any female character that is not a wet cardboard cutout of male paragons. If a female is not allowed to be a female because so called activists said that female traits are bad, then feminism is dead.

[@oncreativemode5486]

Yeah, I'm always weirded out by Hollywood Female Empowerment™. Instead of making women embrace feminity and telling them they're as strong and talented as everybody else, they instead tell them "heyyy uh we want you to act male, being girly is pathetic so you should be strong" like some not-like-other-girl, then kicks some guy on the nards and calls him a sexist

[@aquariussolaris2492]

You had us in the first half.

[@michelecastellotti9172]

One thing i dont get is the trope of belle being affected by stockholm syndrome, she is NEVER a sub to the beasts orders, she constantly defies his orders, she stands up to him and even goes so far as to teach him, none of these are symptoms of stockholm syndrome, so this is also a case of people being ignorant.

[@meb4224]

@@michelecastellotti9172 There's also a great characterization moment where, after the Beast saves Belle from the wolves and he collapses from his injuries, Belle looks at the unconscious Beast, turns to get on Phillipe, pauses for a moment, and _then_ helps Beast back to the castle. Keep in mind that the scene before this was Belle basically going, "fuck this shit, I'm out" after he scares the living daylights out of her with his temper tantrum, meaning she was about to _deliberately_ leave Beast to die in the snow before her conscience gets the better of her.

[@Hanmacx]

@@michelecastellotti9172 compared to the beast, Bella is a Top not a Bottom xD

[@corndogbark5915]

Fun fact, the original Cinderella fairy tale was inspired by the myth of Cupid and Psyche (: The list of parallels includes the evil stepsisters, making friends with random animals (and a sentient river reed) who help her do stuff that mean people inflict on her (the mean person here being Venus), living happily ever after with a man of elevated status (although in the myth’s case, it’s with a god and not a prince, but… same idea) and more! Another fun fact, I literally forgot this movie existed. TWICE

[@talynhastime9343]

This film was released just as the idea of “girlboss” was on its downward spiral and became a meme. “Girlboss” is for white women who were bullies in high school and are now trying to start their own business. It’s a cheapening of actual struggles women go through and plays into the tired misogynistic “not like other girls” trope that we grew up with during the 2000s and especially the 2010s. It arbitrarily divides women into two categories: ‘Normal’ and Attention-Seeking Whores, the implication being that women who are feminine or even those who love male attention are somehow unworthy of respect.

[@Quackervoltz]

It's a feminist film written by a man basically

[@eagleofceaser6140]

Before modern industry the ability to make clothes was considered a very valuable talent for a woman to have whatever her social status. 1st Roman Emperor Augustus often complimented his wife and daughters ability to produce quality tunics and dresses. So it would have been perfectly acceptable for Cinderella to continue making dresses after marrying the Prince.

[@jackhanson3856]

“I watched The Book of Life when I was but a little ten year old” Wait… You… You’re younger than me? That’s not true. It’s impossible!

[@ansleyzigzag]

yeah, what? that would mean he's like 16 or 17. there's no way that's true, right??

[@notactuallyacat.]

This is probably a useless comment given the time context, but he says in the newly-released Santa Inc video that he’s 17

[@ansleyzigzag]

@@notactuallyacat. geez Louise

[@askinredroads5132]

@@ansleyzigzag He mentions he’s 17 in one of his videos.

[@TheDigitalApple]

The first time I saw the trailer for Cinderella 2021 was the exact same reaction when I saw the trailer for Q-Force, I thought they were both parody………..oh man I was wrong!

[@serenajackson6717]

To be fair Q Force is definitely supposed to be more satirical and making fun of queer culture. The movie…is a little TOO serious.

[@XxSherlockianHeroxX]

I will accept no slander to the movie ‘Sing’. It’s the only Illumination movie I like, and it deserves some respect.

[@loadbearingskull]

14:51 so I’m very late to this party but La Belle et la Bête (2014) is absolutely gorgeous. Belle wears at least six dresses that have the same silhouette but are all so intricately detailed and styled that they all stand out from each other. And that’s just belles dresses and not the other female characters wardrobes

[@metaknight115]

When I first saw the trailer I thought it was a PARODY movie, like it was trying to be the new spaceballs or something. I thought it was meant to be comedic, like poking fun at modern troupes and stuff. The surprise when I found out the movie was taking itself seriously was ENORMOUS.

[@chameleoncove]

Maybe it would work better if it was a parody. 😕

[@metaknight115]

@@chameleoncove it would be an amazing parody

[@schedar_cassiopeia]

ayyyyy, there’s the one person who actually knows what the book of life is that i’m looking for!

[@BigpooXD]

My family watched it alot. I thought i was the only one who saw because i never heard people talk about it

[@bellpepper3166]

I only saw it once but was a great film. Need to watch it again.

[@therwbyfamilton8023]

@@bellpepper3166 I think it is on Netflix

[@amirgarcia547]

@@bellpepper3166 It ain’t on Netflix, but it is on Disney+.

[@UMAtronic]

Its a pretty good movie. Im just so glad that it taught kids that cheating is a bad thing. Thats a moral that you can do a lot with.

[@TheGuyWhoIsSitting]

Honestly I want to see copyright law revised to be shorter. I know some people have had changes of heart on it but like… I think it’s long enough and I also think Disney isn’t going to let Mickey Mouse cartoons be made for profit. I think that’s why they push steamboat Willy at the start of every movie they make. And it’s their mascot. So I bet they can use that for legal caveats and loopholes. Can’t wait for the logo version that literally uses all of Walt’s characters.

[@growingsage]

@videoluver7 to be fair, if that were adopted, it would just encourage Disney to make bad movies just to keep the copyright. Like Sony and fox making spider man and x men movies just to keep the rights theirs, regardless of quality. I'm not knocking the idea, but there's also the angle of quantity over quality we have to look at, cause Disney would absolutely make some loopholes to skirt around giving up copyright.

[@FrenkTheJoy]

@@growingsage I disagree. If the law is phrased a certain way, it would let people maintain copyright as long as the product is being used in some way, which would include merchandise and ought to include streaming. So they wouldn't have to keep making remakes all the time, they would maintain the copyright just for continuing to host the movies or series on their streaming service. All in all, I don't get why anyone even cares anyway, other than for older stuff that's got weird rights issues (like there are some movies or tv shows where it's unclear who actually owns the rights at this point), so them being in public domain would make it easier on us. But my life isn't any better or worse for Citizen Kane not being public domain.

[@akheavee2485]

what saved the 1950 cinderella wasn't a man, but what saved her was the result of her persisting kindness, her animal friends, which I think is symbolic of what the kids that are watching can achieve irl

[@kinggalactix]

I know that Shrek doesn't count as a jukebox musical, but the way they implement their music is perfect. It not only represents their anti-Disney story but also conveys the feelings and moments of the characters very well. There's a lot we need to learn from Shrek as a movie and as a character. Edit: hmm... no replies or polite convos. Well, this stinks. Edit 2: this is a nice floor. It looks real nice.

[@sleepydemon516]

I agree! Now please stop looking at my floor.

[@kinggalactix]

@@sleepydemon516 It is my floor, sir or miss. You are clearly mistaken.

[@bonedude666]

Thanks, I just waxed it last night.

[@rontheauraknight9606]

I’d say a better version is one I watched when I was roughly 13 or so on a Nickelodeon original movie “Rags” which was basically modern Cinderella but the male is the one in poverty and the female is the daughter to a record producer. They do good to decent original songs about the obvious, following ones dreams, the female lead (Keke Palmer I believe) storyline is focusing on trying to get her father to stop her making music she dislikes, with Rags’s song on the CD he left behind being the catalyst. Also it does inverse a couple troupes such as one of the stepbrothers just being more of an idiot that is kind of forced to go along with the evil brother and stepfather

[@wil.d_sage]

I kinda want to watch that now

[@amirulamani1487]

Oh yeah, i remember that one. Instead of a shoe, it's a recording of his voice

[@fadingaway...]

Did we really need ANOTHER Cinderella?

[@lll.24601]

I guess for the small kids to remember the story. You have BOOKS. Not everything needs to be technology. Fuck Amazon.

[@andrewgreeb916]

There are thousands of versions of Cinderella stories, basically every culture has it's own version. In a sea of options you have to do better to stand out, and this movie is lacking.

[@niccagepolling7837]

No

[@mattc2306]

If it weren't for the Amazon logo, I would've confused this for one of those abysmal Disney remakes.

[@mr.perezident9381]

Wait, this isn’t Disney???

[@mattc2306]

I know, color me shocked.

[@elizabethweigle6146]

I’ve read the original Cinderella fairy tale from the Brother’s Grimm Fairy Tales, and Cinderella never wanted to marry the prince. Even in the original Disney movie, she only wanted to go to the hall so she could have a fun night out basically, wear a fancy dress, eat nice foods for a change, and pretend that she’s not enslaved by her step family

[@themightysusbus8695]

This made me think of Sofia the First the show. Where her mother was a tailor who made clothes and dresses for the children of the king, the king married the tailor and Sofia becomes a princess. Her mother I'm pretty sure, still makes dresses for her now children.

[@undeadladybug7723]

Not to mention there was way more effort put into Sophia the First

[@penginlord9396]

The stupidest thing is that Cinderella couldn't make dresses if she became queen. Like, needlepoint and embroidery would already be common practices for noblewoman and royals, so why not? Sewing is seen as a feminine activity, so why not? It's not like she wants to do fencing or drag racing or something that's not normally seen as a feminine activity. She's making Dresses. (And I would look further into the details in activities queens did during the time period, if I could actually nail a gimme period for this film. But that's impossible because the directors didn't care about anything like that at all)

[@zoazede2098]

So, this "grounded and modern Cinderella" wants to live by selling dresses... If I wanted to see that, I would rather watch Barbie The princess and the pauper, and if I wanted to watch some Cinderella, I'll just watch the 2 animated Disney ones (the 1 and the 3, the 2 doesn't exist XDDD) BTW, woman who sells dresses was the most common thing for ages, back to ancient egyptians, where the first Cinderella story was ever made, about Rodope who was helped by he gods, specially Ra

[@doesthisIookinfected]

Whoa Cinderella 3 is a hecking classic!

[@DCT-tt8ib]

As someone who was in a high school performance of the stage version of Mamma Mia, I can safely say that the stage version superior to the film version. The stage version is far from good (The script is one of the most incoherent, nonsensical, and narratively broken I have ever read, complete with cast of mostly one-note characters and way too fucking many plotlines that the play is just ill equipped to handle), but it knows it’s dogshit. It knows to not take itself serious in the slightest and to just have fun, and you have fun along with. It’s basically just a shitpost but for theatre kids. The only time you’re not really having any sort of fun during the stage version is during the Act 1 opener up to the end of the song Mamma Mia. That’s like the only part of the play barring a couple of the later songs like The Winner Takes It All that actually attempts to take itself seriously for the most part, and as such you’re left with this really goddamn boring musical about affairs, marriages, and other relationship stuff. The film version, meanwhile, falls flat on its face because it tries to take itself seriously and make the plot somewhat comprehensible. And when you do that, you’re left with an absolutely bore of a movie that feels like something from the Hallmark Channel but with a higher production value and musical numbers.

[@turma8eac]

Winner takes it all can be really great if you go all out over the top Chew that scenery!

[@meb4224]

Doesn't that show even encourage the audience to sing along and dance in their seats and/or aisles (the Broadway show used to, anyway)? I don't have an opinion on ABBA one way or another, but I thought that always seemed like a fun time.

[@jandm4ever716]

I disagree. To me, the mamma Mia movie is a fun time.

[@heejsaan5648]

Never seen the stage version so can't have an opinion on that but I actually enjoy the movie. Sure, the script and all may suck but that's not really why I watch it + as a young adult girl it is nice to see female friendships that isn't toxic or breaks up over one guy or where the friends are suuuper petty to one another all the time. (I feel like any other film or series for teenager/young adults always have super shitty or weird female friendships)

[@theheavenlyfb4071]

The most ironic thing in history has to be Disney trying to destroy public domain and copyright laws while having their most recognisable content being books and stories in the public domain

[@roxycauldwell544]

The thing that most people forget about the OG Cinderella as well, is: THE PRINCE DIDN'T WANT TO GET MARRIED EITHER. His dad was trying to push it on him for grandkids and what we would consider TODAY as "old school"... back THEN. Their relationship and love was completely organic. He wasn't trying to trap her or something

[@DeeDee35904]

Ella enchanted is still one of my favorite Cinderella adaptations/jukebox musicals tbh, it’s such a fun story and the songs gift pretty well

[@billiebloojeans]

what's even funnier is minnie driver is in both and her role in ella enchanted is SO much better

[@munromister777]

Book of Life is always my standard for Jukebox Musical, since they pick their songs so well. I love the movie so much, and it's great to hear people talk about it. I also think it's funny that we have Sing, a pretty terrible Jukebox Musical, to thank for getting Taron Egerton for Elton John in Rocketman.

[@adamcdonald240]

Minor Nitpick: "Can't Stop The Feeling" was written specifically for "Trolls" and released alongside it

[@jendoe9436]

Minor confession: my favorite song from “Trolls” is “True Colors” not sure if it was original to the movie or not, but I think it fit pretty well Now “Trolls: World Tour” I would say did much better with the song integrations. Except the one at the end with the genres at the volcano concert, though that could be because I hated Poppy’s outfit at the end 😅

[@daleksupreme922]

I don't know why Hollywood totally forgets music has to be rehearsed when singing is resolved. When it's pure instrumental that are fine with it which is why you have such good music in like Star Wars, Jurassic Park, Indiana Jones. As soon as you hire a singer Hollywood insists no rehearsals.

[@Blargaha]

Holy shit! A modern movie aimed at children and teenagers that manages to be at the same time completely out of touch while also insufferably preachy on social issues? *Chocked Pikachu-face*

[@MariusWales]

"Even Worse Than Modern Disney." ...You know you can't take that back, right?

[@jakew6162]

Cinderella (2021):The worst jukebox musical Strange Magic:Hold our beer

[@definitelynotalizard]

At least the songs in Strange Magic actually did something for the plot though, and made sense for the characters' motivations. This Cinderella feels like it just has songs because "fairy tales work best as musicals, right?"

[@pepsiisbetterthancoke6283]

can Hollywood please stop hiring james corden already he's not even funny.

[@masterseal0418]

I'm James Cooooooooooooooorden! Haven't you watched Razzle yet?

[@Nothingeverhappens115]

Same thing with Amy Schumer and Camilla cabello

[@dlm292]

19:07 being honest, I would’ve guessed the movie was a Fairly Odd Parents movie before Cinderella

[@donnamitsuki281]

I actually like when people can take lyrics and shift the meaning completely giving it a nice twist,I'm not saying this movie does that it doesn't and if at any point it tried it fails at it,I just want to say changing the meaning is possible since music is art and art can be interpreted,but it's hard to do well. As always,I truly hate trying to make Cinderella strong (and failing awfully at it since she has very little agency here) ignoring she already is,she's strong in her compassion,she has all the elements of a tragic villain backstory but she's not,she's a kind noble woman who treats everyone with respect. The force of will you gotta have for that is HUGE and it's strength people often ignore.

[@brianrodgers7963]

Did anyone else watch the Book of Life when they were little, because I thought I was the only one.

[@TheDigitalApple]

Hell yeah. Watched it loved it

[@brianrodgers7963]

@@TheDigitalApple I also loved it and he just brought back all my memories of that movie

[@honeytoast9204]

I watched it in my Spanish class

[@NurseAmamiya]

I've just noticed... People's childhoods from almost any franchise getting ruined with such live action, remake films seem to have become a huge trend these days.

[@cliffturbo2146]

The only one I've seen was the Jungle Book remake.

[@lll.24601]

They want everyone to get a nostalgic feel. Sigh. You know what Amy Rose said: “studios need to stop remaking stuff and do something original for once”. Why would YOU NOT LISTEN TO THE PINK HEDGEHOG?

[@Saltedroastedcaramel]

Milking the nostalgia bait

[@andrewgreeb916]

The point of remakes is to guarantee sales without risks, however it seems clear that these films aren't worth anyone's time and until people realize that they're only making these movies because we're still paying for them. We have to put up with these trash remakes Because they still make money.

[@Ilovegrunge123]

The only one I'm excited about is Hercules. The women already had a independent attitude and they had diversity with the singers. So hopefully they dont think they still have to change stuff.

[@milktea6676]

jukeboxes are just extremely expensive playlist marketed as movies

[@SnuSnuDungeon]

The only 3 Cinderella movies I like are the original, Ever After and Roger and Hammerstein's Cinderella featuring Brandy

[@shakurburton9358]

Good choices, good taste all around, especially the Brandy film.

[@XDoFairiesHaveTailsX]

I agree, the Brandy version of Cinderella is top tier and WAY better than this boring, regurgitated "modern take".

[@garreonlefay6703]

No one kill me...but I also liked the one produced by Whitney Houston

[@SnuSnuDungeon]

@@garreonlefay6703 oh I haven't seen that one. I'll check it out

[@yellowstalk6653]

For a long time I was like "Man, the princess is INCREDIBLY familiar, I can't place my finger on it." She was in M.I. High. There's a bit of total recall for any brits watching CBBC in the 2010s.

[@setablaze1802]

Best live action Cinderella movie is "Ever After: a Cinderella story" by far. Its not a musical, it has morticia Adams' actress as the stepmother (with a humanizing take that explains why Cinderella is treated horribly without justifying the stepmother's actions), and of course: LEONARDO DA VINCI AS A FAIRY GODMOTHER.

[@ajpat9620]

2015 live-action version of Cinderella by Kenneth Branagh was also good, let alone the best.

[@ViscousJelly]

“Moulin Rouge!” was my first experience with Jukebox Musicals & honestly it’s still my favorite of the genre for how it remixes so many songs My friends & I would sing along to The Elephant Love Song medley (including harmonies) while driving around after School

[@trixxartarchive7705]

Like it kind of reminds me of how Frozen constantly kept saying you can't fall in love at first sight but even worst.

[@hillary96renteria82]

I actually liked it when Frozen did it.I don't know why exactly, but it made sense in that universe and with Anna's personality. After being locked in a castle for years she was willing to marry the first prince that she locked eyes with

[@trixxartarchive7705]

@@hillary96renteria82 that does kind of make sense but I just didn't like how smug they where with it

[@hillary96renteria82]

@@trixxartarchive7705 that’s true. At this point it’s been overused to death. They can’t go a single movie now without making fun of their old ones and it sucks because their older movies are literally the classics

[@trixxartarchive7705]

@@hillary96renteria82 I know like I think the only movies they haven't done that are Moana and Zootopia. And personally I think that Tangled address the idea of marring someone you just met a lot better as it shows Eugene and Rapunzel getting married after a long time of getting to know each other.

[@artemis1993]

@@trixxartarchive7705 The message *at it's core* is a good message. So many people make the mistake of falling for the wrong person because they couldn't look past the "first look". I made that mistake myself. However, you are right that there is a certain smugness to it. Frozen and many other supposedly feminist media like Sailor Moon for example, have been "weaponized" by extremists far too often, unfortunately.

[@punkopunko5637]

Honestly, even if there are some good ones out there, I don’t think I’ll ever understand the appeal of jukebox musicals. I just don’t see how it could come off as anything but cheesey as hell.

[@Eques_Umbra]

Maybe thats the point. Put enough cheese in something, and people will eat it up. Works for me and nachos.

[@brianaguilar8283]

20:00 just because a fictional element exists in a story doesn’t mean that nothing else should make sense

[@Klvn-eq9kn]

I love how they were using British accents but Cinderella is FRENCH

[@Zephyrs009]

Thinking about how perfect I'm a believer was in Shrek

[@aliceduren6542]

perfect example of pop music being implemented in movies done right

[@tarotsushima3332]

If you hear a song that was used in a soundtrack and almost always equate it to a movie regardless of where it's used then the movie did its job soundtrackwise. Another example imo apart from Shrek is Megamind

[@d.tsukuyomi1869]

And 'Holding Out for a Hero' in Shrek 2. That was perfect.

[@trixxartarchive7705]

The only song that I thought fit in Sing was I'm Still Standing.

[@lll.24601]

YESSSSSSSS

[@trixxartarchive7705]

@@lll.24601 ironically another Elton John song

[@KH0LRA]

Sometimes I think that this is how they got Taron Egerton to play Elton for his Biopic because he was actually really damn good with this cover and his role as him

[@aequitad4411]

You used the 8-Bit Universe cover of Dancing Queen by ABBA as background music? You have great taste, good sir. Anyway, I was immediately turned away from this movie as soon as I saw that Camila Cabello was being cast as the lead and James Corden was, surprise, cast as a “comic relief”. But hearing the movie being thrashed by critics makes me happy that I didn’t bother touching it with a 39.5 foot pole. Especially considering that I really don’t like jukebox musicals. PS: You mentioned Gnomeo and Juliet, a movie that has Sir Elton John songs solely for the sake of him being a producer for this movie that do the bare minimum to further the plot, during your rant about jukebox musicals. I immediately thought of a far better movie that has a soundtrack of predominately Sir Elton John called “The Road to El Dorado.” Have you ever seen that movie, and if so, what are your thoughts?

[@mystery_mickc]

also elton worked with tim rice as well in the lion king

[@Ramsey276one]

Link please to that tune?

[@aequitad4411]

@@Ramsey276one kzbin.info/www/bejne/jKTPko1tf8aEeMk

[@Ramsey276one]

@@aequitad4411 thanks!

[@lowberrymix]

Honestly, the discontinuity of the time period is what bothers me the most. Bad outfits, bad music numbers or even weak writing are annoying too but seeing electric saws, metal frames, a modern guitar and modern plastic carriers (and that modern looking broom) along victorian/1800-ish-ish ballgowns and a monarchy with bad geographically knowledge makes me feel itchy all around. Like, pick a struggle, but this pulls down the quality so much more than if they had put in the effort to keep a consistent time period. Even something more "imaginary" like Bridgerton would work if it was at least executed in a cohesive way