Cleric Class Changes in D&D 2024

[@lordptk4115]

War domain is so much better, I love it. Firstly, they allow you to use to bonus action attack without having to take the regular attack action first, which was something that held that feature back massively, since you couldn't use a spell AND make an attack, which is kind of the core idea of the subclass in my opinion. Also the bonus action attacks recover on a short rest, which is neat too. The concentration free Shield of Faith and Spiritual Weapon are really neat too, especially since now, due to the new wording of the spells-per turn rule, which only disallows casting more than one spell with a spell slot per turn, means that you can throw down Spirit Guardians (or any other Action-casting time spell) AND a spiritual weapon in the first turn of combat.

[@pederw4900]

Finally, set up Spirit Guardians and Spiritual Weapon on turn 1!

[@pretty_fly_for_a_jeskai]

While casting Spiritual Weapon is a bonus action, I want to say Channel Divinity is still an action and technically, the Cleric is using their C.D. to cast the spell, it's going to be weird to interpret but I would say it's a Channel Divinity first so a full action, and no concentration is the reward. Otherwise, magic initiate for Blade Ward, True Strike and Shield, and you're set up to be a fairly consistent front line hitter when you need to be, on top of doing everything else a Cleric wants to do. By level 6, if you need to go on the offensive, throw up Spirit Guardians first and then pop Divinity for whatever is best in the situation if you feel it's best.

[@MrSeals1000]

​@@pretty_fly_for_a_jeskaiPlenty of Channel Divinity don't take an action. I can check later on the war cleric to confirm if it does take an action, or if you simply expend a CD when you cast it to do so without expending a spell slot and without concentration. At the end of the day it's pretty cut and dry. If a spell slot isn't expended to cast it, then it doesn't conflict with the rule.

[@northernsun6003]

@@MrSeals1000Agreed. If the text says “spell slot” and you’re not using a spell slot, it’s permitted. People are pointing out things like Fey Touched or a Wand of Fireballs do not use spell slots, so they are totally compatible with leveled spells. This is a huge change in the rules. Disclaimer: I do not have the book.

[@alemar1122]

I always just used it as a dip to attack twice per turn with a heavy crossbow from range at level 1... that was pretty cool with the old ways

[@obi-wan-jacobi840]

I have noticed since the subclasses were first announced that the four chosen subclasses in this book correspond to the four “classic” party roles: Life=Cleric(healer), Light=Wizard(blaster), War=Fighter(frontline), and Trickery=Rogue(sneaky). That’s definitely not an accident and it shows exactly why the Cleric is the most versatile class in the entire game.

[@VinceValentine]

Light is no longer all Fireball and fire spells though. Jeremy Crawford said the domain is also about revealing what's hidden, so I guess there'll be more divination spells.

[@moonlight2870]

Probably not. I think someone else found another theme on reddit and Wizard's more or less confirmed it. If I find anything I'll show you.

[@pretty_fly_for_a_jeskai]

Cleric is absolutely not the most versatile class in the game. Certainly more versatile now

[@robertb6889]

Still makes me sad there is no tempest domain. My favorite cleric with a bunch of smitey lightning.

[@Awoken0]

Ever class has themes going on with their subclasses. In Cleric Light and Trickery are opposites cause Light is about illumination and Trickery is about deception/stealth.

[@MrSkillcap]

About the healer feat, alot of the buffs to healing spells in 2024 edition have just added another die to the healing. For example healing word is 2d4+modifier instead of 1d4 (4d4 at lvl 2 etc). So there is a pretty high chance that you will get alot of value from rerolling those 1s.

[@obi-wan-jacobi840]

I started salivating when Monty described the Magic Initiate True Strike combo with a heavily armored War Cleric. I think I’ve discovered what my first 2024 character will be.

[@bukharagunboat8466]

It's better on a Druid because it stacks with Shillelagh.

[@adambielen8996]

Just double check the wording on the Cleric abilities to make sure that they actually work. Because I'm pretty sure that Potent Spellcasting specifies Cleric Cantrips, and thus would not apply to Wizard Cantrips gained via Magic Initiate.

[@MrSeals1000]

​@@adambielen8996Depending on wording, just take the Melee attack Blessed Strikes option. Since even though it's a cantrip, you are still making a weapon attack

[@bukharagunboat8466]

@@adambielen8996 Potent Spellcasting allows the Wis Bonus to be added to the damage; True Strike already does this, and I can't imagine it could be added twice, so yes I agree that True Strike sits best on the Weapon/Armor Cleric.

[@mythno394]

​@@bukharagunboat8466 that restriction only applies if a bonus is from the same source. You can get multiple abilities feats and items that let you add proficiency bonus for example and they'd all stack.

[@CoolTrainerGavin]

I know it's not in the 2024 PHB, but a War Cleric taking Booming Blade via Magic Initiate to use as a reaction attack to help keep enemies inside your Spirit Guardians, while also getting Shield is going be nasty.

[@kevyndrago9632]

In the 2024 book, I don't believe you can use magic initiate for Booming Blade.

[@CoolTrainerGavin]

@kevyndrago9632 I imagine it would be up to your DM. I don't know the exact wording of the feat off the top of my head, but I think it says something to the effect of "2 cantrips and 1 1st level spell from either the Druid, Cleric, or Wizard spell list." I think you could make an argument that since it doesn't say "...spell list in this book..." you can use older spells as well. I'd allow it at my table personally, but to each their own.

[@eggy_conch1876]

I like kellys hat changing position every video 😂

[@Psuedo-Nim]

I got Coach Z from Strongbad vibes :)

[@davea6314]

Having to wait until 3rd level to take a subclass will change strategies for multi-class dips.

[@MrSeals1000]

Definitely, but also more base classes have more in them at lvl1. Like Paladin for example, it gets a Lot lvl1. A fantastic dip

[@veraducks]

If you sit down and look at the what classes get what and when, you start to notice that outside of very specific abilities multiclassing isn't as nerfed as you'd think. Bladelock is better than ever.

[@codenameera3709]

I liked when Monty said “it’s cleric time”

[@moonpeter150]

Me either

[@paternusowen2106]

He really clericed all over them

[@jordanhubbard940]

He said “It’s cleric time” and all the audience started clericing

[@leivaslt666]

I’m looking forward for all 300 tier lists updated

[@floofzykitty5072]

Emanations like Spirit Guardians do damage when you move it into a creature's space now. Not sure why that wasn't mentioned, I feel like that's the biggest buff to it. You can easily hit every enemy with it now and Spirit Car-dians is real now.

[@ICHBIN0000]

Cleric/Rogue ... IN and OUT every round :) Tabaxi Cleric ... IN and OUT every second Round. The Damage are extrem, even with Only 2 Enemies (3d8 = around 12dmg and @50% Save-Success about 18 Damage) per Round just by running in and out.

[@thejammiestjam]

I played Trickery Domain for 4.5 years, up to level 20 (and beyond 20), and I love these changes. I made a post on the DNDBeyond forums even, with the changes my DM let me make to it a few years back, and it included the ability to swap places with your duplicate. Glad to see that it's official here! I think it's more streamlined too. 2014 Trickery seemed all over the place; poison damage for your weapon, but no heavy armor or martial weapon proficiency, a tiny bit of illusory magic, no extra skills for deception, sleight of hand, or stealth, or disguise or poisoner kits, etc.. The old domain spells were fantastic, but I felt like there was some stuff lacking in opportunities to really make you a trickster that Loki or Hermes would be proud of.

[@pier-lucmorin5695]

Glad you took time to provide comprehensive feedback. I'm really hype to try the cleric as a class. Trickery domain included

[@jkspencer777]

really digging these episodes. Im super excited for your ranger episode.

[@Jasta85]

More uses of channel divinity are nice, there are some really good ones so even one more use in combat could be quite helpful. And now spiritual weapon is pretty much a war domain spell only, although that domain in general is looking a lot more attractive now.

[@donaldcrankshaw1627]

One thing I didn't hear mentioned is that Spirit Guardians now works when you move it to a target (like in BG3), not just when they come to you. So the fact that they don't take damage at the start of their turn is less of an issue. I've seen people proposing that this means you can do a ton of damage if each PC moves the cleric on their turn, since each PC's turn is another chance to make the enemy save, but I think that only works if it doesn't cost you your own attacks (like with an 11th level Open Hand Monk spending ki to do a no-action Step of the Wind with a passenger), as focus fire beats spread out damage, and if you don't focus fire on the enemy, they'll be focusing fire on your cleric.

[@malmasterson3890]

This is how all emenation spells work and I do like it. Makes it easier to attempt getting 2 triggers a round, but also gives the enemy a chance.

[@jude4a]

The Circle of Mortality feature for the Cleric's Grave Domain is slightly better now. From this feature, the Grave domain used to be the only subclass that could cast Spare the Dying at range. Now the spell has been buffed and scales with each level range.

[@christinefarrell6438]

Can you clarify how spare the dying has changed? I haven't been able to find it written anywhere

[@MrSeals1000]

​@@christinefarrell6438Spare the dying now has a range of 15 feet. And it's range increases as your cantrips scale.

[@jude4a]

@@christinefarrell6438 in the 2014 phb, the range was touch. in the 2024 phb the range is 15ft at level 1, 30 ft at level 5, 60 ft at level 11, and 120 at level 17.

[@StatsScott]

Very glad to hear they address backwards comparability. I alternate between a monk and a knowledge domain cleric. Was very excited about the monk adjustments in this version but worried when knowledge domain wasn’t one of the cleric subdomains as I didn’t want the monk upgrade at a cost of a lost cleric domain that really fit my character concept.

[@Fury2580]

I'm kind of excited about the Trickery Domain changes, I always felt like their kit made it hard to be a super viable choice, their domain channel divinity feature was alright but kinda wasnt always easy to justify the use of you divinity, but with the added versatility i feel itll come up a lot more. And the armor choice at level one makes it so much easier to take the subclasses tht usedto be less than ideal for some campaigns. I do wish the tempest and order domains had made its way through though, I always liked those ones.

[@mikecarson7769]

OMG, this video series is so great -- fun and informative, plus feeling comfortable nostalgia about your older videos in the basement :) :) :)

[@rickspotten8497]

As usual, your videos are informational and enjoyable. I'm getting a ton of info, and inspiration, out of these. Can't wait to hear your thoughts about the Dancing Bards. Also, are you going to be doing breakdowns of any Racial... I mean Species changes in the new book? I haven't heard much about them, besides Aasimar and Goliath are in, and something about two more branches of Tiefling. Thanks for all the work you do explaining things to us in ways we understand.

[@AunShiLord]

Divine Favor is also buffed and now does not require concentration, which boosts war domain cleric even further

[@EpicRandomness555]

4:10 I would say that even if Undead are immune to Frightened, Turn Undead would be the one thing capable of Frightening them.

[@daikatarokamegawa542]

And, specific beats general in the ruling

[@murphieslaw6932]

Exactly. In the end, the 'frightening' is their reaction to unbearable pain, not from literally afraid. The idea stems mainly from old-timey vampire movies, but I think it always applied to skeletons, zombies, etc. Recoil from my cleansing light ! I will totally allow it, either way :D

[@AMRosa10]

I think people need to reread Spirit Guardian, because the way it is described in a lot of the videos doesn't fit with RAW. And the reason is that the rule says "A creature makes this save only once per turn" not "A creature makes this save only once per THEIR turn." Here is the relevant text from Treantmonk's video: "When you cast this spell, you can designate creatures to be unaffected by it. Any other creature's Speed is halved in the Emanation, and whenever the Emanation enters a creature's space and whenever a creature enters the Emanation or ends its turn there, the creature must make a Wisdom saving throw. On a failed save, the creature takes 3d8 Radiant damage (if you are good or neutral) or 3d8 Necrotic damage (if you are evil). On a successful save, the creature takes half as much damage. A creature makes this save only once per turn." The creature makes the save only once per TURN... but there are multiple TURNs per ROUND. So, Let's say the Cleric casts Spirit Guardians and moves into range of a creature on the Cleric's turn, then the creature needs to make a Wisdom save (Cleric's Turn). Then, if the creature attacks the Cleric on their turn and stay in Melee range with the Cleric, the Creature has to make a Wisdom saving throw (Creature's Turn). Then, let's say a party member knocks the creature out of the AOE of the Emanation during the round, and another party member drags them back into the Emanation, the creature needs to make yet another Wisdom saving throw (Dragging Turn). So in the scenario above, for that round, RAW, there were 3 turns that the creature would have needed to make Saving Throws and 3 turns they could have taken damage from the Spirit Guardians. The key again is that the rule leaves out the word "THEIR" from the once per turn language. So, you couldn't have it where your monk grapples the creature and then moves them in and out of the Emanation multiple times on the Monk's Turn, but if you can cause a creature to move out and come into contact with the Emanation on multiple party member's turns, there should be stacking.

[@andyenglish4303]

Losing polymorph is rough, especially when it's replaced by friggin Confusion.

[@Helorean]

The thing I think helps the Cleric the most is actually the changes in abilities in races. The old 5e have so few wis based races. Now you can use anything you want

[@SlinkyTWF]

Really looking forward to playing a life cleric based on Aqua from Konosuba. The party will probably be less enthusiastic.

[@awilson5684]

Dump Int and spend all of your time casting Prestigitation.

[@Mark-ki7ic]

ÑKelly's "Little Wish", is what I needed 😊. Does the War domain get weapon mastery at 3rd lvl, that was in the PDF btw, loved that with War Hammer with Tobble

[@gnorizon]

Great video as always guys! You mentioned that Aid was the same - but I thought I heard from another video that Aid was now temporary hitpoints, so it won't stack with anything anymore? Would love to hear back from you if this is true/false - thanks!

[@DungeonDudes]

Nope, it still increases hit point maximum.

[@gnorizon]

@@DungeonDudes Thank god. Thanks for the response!

[@marshallarnold4827]

Dungeon dudes, more like the Fungeon dudes, because this is rad!

[@Marb315]

with the changes to how spirit guardians works Magic Initiate Wizard seems like it's gonna be a game changer for war clerics on top of war caster to just lock people in place

[@joeyjoseph7137]

Loving the coverage of the new book! Great work as always

[@Chetthew21]

The love is real, so much content 😭

[@RPG_Bliss]

Hey it’s the Dungeon Dudes!! Time to sip some coffee and enjoy some cleric chats.

[@basselstineart]

Can't wait to see your cleric+fighter = paladin build.

[@StarRightStarTight]

Maaaaaan - ya’ll been wearing those shirts for 3 days in a row. :P People might start to think this was all shot in one day

[@Jimmy-p9n]

Yep not noticed the shirts but also noticed their love of the game

[@RoboBlocker]

D4 made a video with all changes if you don’t want to wait weeks for each class to be drop fed one at a time.

[@charrleschervanik3632]

I love that My War domain Cleric finally gets warpriest charges back on a short or long rest. It's defining feature isn't straight up outclassed by PAM. Funnily enough, however, I can see taking Magic Initiate Druid as the origin feat to get sheleighlagh, PAM, Warcaster, and cap wisdom by 12. Meaning you can both be heavily armored and high wisdom, a problem the War Domain has had for quite some time.

[@christiangex2055]

Send more videos ! Thanks and continue like this.

[@solar4planeta923]

Totally agree on splitting the martial/mystical choice from the subclass. I've played a more mystical tempest cleric and more martial grave cleric and been frustrated in both situations.

[@DSpiritwolf]

Just finished the wizard video and was hoping a new one was put up. I was not disappointed

[@Balthamir]

New turn undead was mvp in shrine of tamoachan when they got to turn the vampire which failed the save and got incapacitated which then allowed it to be staked in the heart

[@mattdahm4289]

Thanks dudes!

[@ferencfeher2647]

Time for the Cleric Divine Lawnmower!!

[@hoodinifail2536]

Getting you subclass was the big selling point for playing the cleric. Everyone else felt more damagy but because they had to wait to get some of their buffs it kind of evened things up.

[@mattjennings101]

I'm sure they won't do it because the parent companies want money, but it would be a huge olive branch to the community if they just released "The Subclass Book" with all the previously published subclasses instead of the current position of having them spread out over like 5 books. Cmon Wotc, do the right thing

[@RokuroCarisu]

For the old Death Cleric, Holy Order: Protector and the new Chill Touch are a godsend - pun intended. It's time to unleash the buffed double finger poke of doom!

[@MrSkillcap]

Warlock tomorrow? :>

[@LawrenceDomkowski]

What is nice is how Clerics have evolved over the decades. I like these changes.

[@dmnemaine]

I like the idea of adding your Wisdom modifier to Religion and Arcana checks if you choose the support cleric. It makes proficiency in Religion (and Arcana) more attractive to clerics.

[@Bookworm159]

I've been trying to find the answer to this because it's very important for the 20th level ability. Do clerics who use it suffer wish stress? Honestly, I don't really like either alternative, because either they get access to the most brokenly powerful spell without the inherent downsides and risk in the spell, or you can lose your capstone ability with poor luck. Either way, I want to know what they went with.

[@malmasterson3890]

I believe in one of the articles they said that you can still lose it do to stress. Honestly Wish wouldn't even be that overpowered if they just made sure all the static effects lasted only 24 hours. The fwct that you can still theoretically gain resistance to all damage is really dumb.

[@MrSeals1000]

If you're asking about the wording of it... the capstone does not explicitly say you ignore the stress of casting Wish. However, Id argue that you also cannot lose access to the wish spell, because you're not actually really casting it? Need to double check. The wording says that you can choose Wish as the spell when you use Divine Intervention, and then the 2d4 days of wait before you can do so again. I need to reread the Divine Intervention rules when I get the chance.

[@MrSeals1000]

Okay. So. Looking at the wording... I think you can lose access to Wish. Divine Intervention: "As a Magic Action, choose any Cleric spell of level 5 or lower that doesn't require a Reaction to cast. As part of the same action, _you cast that spell_ without expending a spell slot or needing material components." Greater Divine Intervention: "When you use your Divine Intervention feature, you can choose Wish when you select a spell." So, it is treated as if You cast the spell. It's not emulating a spell, and it's not you choosing a spell that your deity casts for you. Wish: "The stress of _casting Wish_ to produce any effect other than duplicating another spell weakens you.... Finally, there is a 33 percent chance that you are unable to cast Wish ever again if you suffer this stress." Which means... I think, you can lose Wish. YOU are casting it, therefore you suffer the stress, and because you suffer the stress, you are subject to the 33 percent chance to lose Wish. Due to the wording... technically you can Always _choose_ Wish with Greater Divine Intervention. But if you've lost the ability to cast Wish... nothing would happen, since you can't _cast_ it anymore. Maybe? Really need a dev to come in to clear it up. Wording makes it seem like the anwser is you *Can* lose it. But there might just be something Im missing.

[@_zurr]

The new Spirit Guardian rules also mean that if you have the room and the action to spare, you can hold your action to dash on a different turn and double up the damage, instead of having to find some way to pull and push your enemies. Holy blender go brrrrr

[@michaelmuirhead910]

I’d like to shout out to Colby of D4 (he’s already assumed responsibility) for getting the “once on a turn” rewrite for spells like spirit guardians… Clerics will still be a very good class to play regardless.

[@customedge1]

My first 2024 character build is human 14 cleric-war domain/ 6 fighter-champion maul wielding. My buddy is playing weapon master fighter sword & board with protection. Starting with magic initiative with blade ward, true strike & shield at lvl 1 fighter with feat Savage attacker and fighting style Great Weapon Master. Minimum 9 damage per hit at lvl 1. Bring on the kobolds lol

[@Justchadthanks]

I humbly request Kelly’s pink gencon suit for the new bard breakdown if not already filmed.

[@vincentesposito4843]

Light domain, magic initiate with fire bolt, true strike, and shield, mobile at level 4 and spirit guardians at 5…I’m ready 👍

[@Acatia2]

The buffs are smaller cuz clerics were already good. Obviously they didn't get ignored, but they didn't need nearly as much help as others. Idk if I'd call having fewer subclasses compared to what they had previously matters all that much. Even with all those options, you'd still mostly just see Mercy and Twilight, so the option numbers were basically superfluous. Mind you I only started playing after Xanathar, so I do not have the full picture on release, but I don't imagine the change would be that drastic.

[@ChoseeComprende]

Love your shirt Kelly. :3

[@THESHADOWMASTER9]

God, when yall mentioned the trigger time change on spirit guardians I genuinely felt pain.

[@emilymiller7827]

i would like to hear more about the backwards compatibility because there's a lot of stuff from 3.5 that conceptually worked in 5e, just the mechanics changed, and i hope the same is true from 5e to 5.5 or whatever this is called

[@DungeonDudes]

We have a video all about it here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qXnGcqeBe7CNa6Msi=MtQ0HvCFEzYUJexb

[@douglaspope-gz1eq]

Oh great and powerful dungeon dudes the gods of the D&D community what is your favorite change to the cleric and what is your least favorite change to the cleric?!!!

[@joelsasmad]

Level 10 Domain Expansion with Divine Intervention into Hallow. Lets you make all enemies vulnerable to slashing damage and have the fighters destroy.

[@jrg305]

The origin feat for acolyte is cleric magic initiate tho. I guess yall mean you're getting another magic initiate option if you took a different background

[@neilm838]

Little saddened by lack of tempest but I like what they've done with the 4 subclasses chosen.

[@carolxs]

Is magic initiate the new great weapon master? Meaning, the feat that everyone feels they should have? And it's not even just for martials, it's for everyone

[@corpesmen1830]

While I like the idea of the Holy Order choice at first level for clerics, in practice I think martial weapons and heavy armor is still more valuable to the backline casters than one extra cantrip and adding wisdom mod to arcana or religion

[@logangoodner9559]

Cant wait for the monk episode.

[@ashleyien1222]

My poor Spiritual Weapon... that was my go-to since I didn't need to worry about it... 😅

[@WolfmanXD]

I feel like, with the spirit guardians change, sentinel is also going to be a valid feat option for martial clerics.

[@ronaldmulsoff4431]

The only thing I wish I would have seen is the Life cleric beyond a bonus to user l using a healing kit similar to the Healer feat in the 2014.

[@GrumpyGrobbyGamer]

Cleric changes sound pretty cool to me.

[@kevinglass1186]

I like that they went the route of Pathfinder 2 and doctrines for the cleric, separating out the heavy armor and spell bonuses for spells. I hope they add other domains soon, as there are many that I enjoy (death, twilight).

[@LordOz3]

While I like the boost to healing spells, I'm glad they didn't go further. If players can outheal damage, there's little risk.

[@luidprand]

Magic initiate would allow find familiar, which means you can do cure wounds and other touch heal/harm spells at range

[@TsorovanZero]

So what you're saying is that the Trickery domain is now an Echo Knight?

[@ChaosWolf3]

The one change I know I’ll revert for my table is the change to Inflict Wounds. There was no reason to lower its damage to 2d10 instead of 3d10. That damage boost is the only reason to use it over Guiding Bolt.

[@MrSeals1000]

If you keep it as a save, with half damage on a success, that might help out against all the times it misses. But Id suggest changing the damage to 3d8 instead of 3d10. The damage would be within +-0.5 of the expected damage of original Inflict wounds (taking into account crit damage too)

[@ChaosWolf3]

@@MrSeals1000 Thing is, compared to Guiding Bolt, the idea of getting close to deal that damage and potentially putting you at risk in the process, Inflict Wounds was already a worse spell overall, having only a few niche cases where Inflict Wounds was the better option. Guiding Bolt has comparable damage with range instead of melee and the advantage effect compared to melee range with slightly higher damage potential. There was no reason to reduce the damage of Inflict Wounds. Not if you're going to leave Guiding Bolt as it was. There's now no reason to use Inflict Wounds instead.

[@NessOnett8]

@@ChaosWolf3 You're demonstrating why this was changed. And proving why it was a *GOOD* change. In 2014 there was literally no reason to ever use Inflict Wounds. Because Guiding Bolt was just objectively better in every single way. Casting Inflict Wound was *ALWAYS* wrong. It was only ever used as a hipster spell because it was so bad. But enemies are different. Some have low AC, and so you can target them with Guiding Bolt. Some have High AC and low Con.(And specifically, these tends to be enemies that you want to be in melee with). Now you have a spell that can target those enemies effectively. By making it a save, it gives it a reason to cast it over Guiding Bolt. But since save spells are better than attacks, by definition, the damage needed to be lowered to be balanced. So now it has 3 distinct niches. 1. guaranteed damage for finishing things off(Guiding Bolt can always miss, even if they're at 1 health...and it's also bad at finishing things because the rider is wasted). 2. Low Con enemies...of which their are a lot. And they tend to be ranged enemies or casters, things you want to be next to. Inflict Wounds would previously bait new players into charging into melee with low-AC enemies like Ogres and Bears...which is bad. And 3. It upcasts so much better. To the point where it actually stays competitive with higher level spells due to the guaranteed nature of the damage. Inflict Wounds will be picked and used *Substantially* more with these changes. And it is objectively a much stronger spell, and makes the Cleric overall better by having more unique tools for different situations(The reason why Wizard is/was the best class)

[@woutvanostaden1299]

​@@ChaosWolf3Well if you had owl familiar flying in you could still just cast it him. I think it was nice have default (ranged) and oh sh*t (melee) option, even if being found in melee is bad for you.

[@MrSeals1000]

​​​@@ChaosWolf3Hmmm... my feelings on the subject, is that comparing to Guiding Bolt doesn't quite feel right. In my mind, Inflict Wounds is and Always was a spell to keep in your back pocket in _case_ you were caught in melee. Guiding Bolt is great, but at the end of the day it's a ranged spell, and while strong, it's value plummets when you get into melee. For me, Inflict Wounds was almost never a reason to make yourself get into melee to use it. Which is why I like that its now a save for half spell. Before, there was a fairly decent chance you would be in the risk of melee range and still do _nothing._ This changes that. Now, enemies get punished regardless of if they succeed. But I understand, I don't like how low of damage it is now. It shouldn't be super high, the save for half takes care of that. Though it should be more than 2d10. 2d12 would be better, but I think 3d8 is best for slightly more damage, and a better standard deviation for the average damage. Though, 2d12 has bdtter upcasting. Which could be nice.

[@Ty-yy7zr]

Now I'm kinda hoping that it's gonna be harder to multiclass in the first place since some dips are almost too good.

[@adamhunter1223]

So the holy order thing is like the Pathfinder 2e Warpriest vs Cloistered scholar options.

[@chriswaddle7450]

I've always played a cleric as a damage dealer, especially by the time you get to level 11.

[@3veraj]

The only question I have that nobody seems to be answering is: with Blessed Strikes becoming a class feature now (per D&D Beyond article) and moved to level 7 instead of 8, does that mean the subclasses get new features for level 8? I mean that is of the subclass features weren’t also moved since they moved the level 1 features to level 3. But I doubt that.

[@gloryrod86]

I love divine spark, its so cool

[@Maseman90]

They did tempest dirty.. my favorite 🫠

[@gregevans4126]

I was so disappointed with the War Cleric in 2014. Sounds like this a great improvement. So looking forward to trying it again!

[@thomasquesada7248]

Yes it’s fantastic now

[@Tirfing88]

i just wonder if there's any reason to go life cleric anymore. I mainly went that route because the bonuses greatly helped with the puny healing you do early on. Healing word/cure wounds now do double healing and on top of that you get divine spark.

[@secretlyditto7716]

Hey, when you guys cover ranger (assuming you haven't recorded it already) would you cover hunter's mark in full along with the ranger spell list that replaced pretty much all the unique features rangers have? I keep hearing bad things about ranger, but it seems like they put the focus on spell casting, which is fine as long as the spells are effective ya know?

[@c.colville]

Is it just me or do a lot of the changes feel similar to some of the pathfinder class features; cleric types and weapon features included

[@korylytle9045]

Yup, and I think that is on purpose. D&D and Pathfinder refine, emulate, and straight up steal from each other throughout their entire shared history. Pathfinder 2e is basically D&D 6th edition aside from the saves and the old D&D 3e scaling. They are and will probably continue to be extremely similar games.

[@razzy6593]

You mentioned in the video true strike works with potent spell casting but is true strike a cleric cantrip? I thought it only worked with Cleric cantrips not all cantrips?

[@dominicpalladini7290]

I'm going to say it here: the choices for the Holy order and for all of the classes that feature (druid as it as well I think) he not a bad idea on paper BUT.... why on earth we do not receive a proficiency bonus and even expertise in the skill predestined to be with your class. For example, the cleric: Not a lot of them will have high intel (because of the mechanics of the game or if you do so, you sacrifice something else). Therefore, their religion check will never be awesome. Why that those classes don't have (for everyone who plays it) an automatic bonus to those skills with expertise OR the appropriate stat?

[@sarahbettany7546]

I DM my husband who is a druid and I've houseruled Nature to be Wisdom for exactly this reason - in winter he DMs me, and I'm a cleric - it's a ridiculous mistake they've made there.

[@dominicpalladini7290]

@@sarahbettany7546 I agree. Even with the 2014 rules, how can a wizard be more verse in religion vs a cleric or nature vs a druid? It is a nonsense. With responsible DMs, you get what you and your husband is doing or the DM will get a lower DC for those when a wizard throws the dice for the same knowledge...

[@PandaKnight-FightingDwagon]

Because there's a major flaw to the logic behind this. Is someone who's religious automatically knowledgeable about all religions? Or even their own? Is someone who spends a lot of time in the woods automatically knowledgeable about all flora and fauna, even those not native to where they reside? The answer to both these questions is no, and is also why Druids/Rangers and Clerics/Paladins don't automatically get bonuses to the relevant skills.

[@dominicpalladini7290]

@@PandaKnight-FightingDwagon The answer is yes; certainly more than a wizard that need to devote his time to learn arcana. Now there is always the Dm in those equation. For all the example you present, the DM should taking those factors into consideration. BUT, those classes should always have a nodge ahead of everybody else. Druid, because they are attuned to nature. So they are able to discern more quickly the flora and fauna of a region. For a Cleric, he can always ask his god to know more. It let those classe be good in what they are suppose to be good. Now, for the mechanics of the game, We need more intel base skills even if we already have investigation, for Intel to be more relevant in my scenario! But for your arguments, the answer is definitely a yes.

[@blankff906]

it's 2024 and clerics still touchy

[@integrity9186]

I got a question. At roughly 10:32 Monty suggests to take true strike via magic initiate and that it may stack with potent cantrips. However, in the articles it was stated that the effect stacks with your CLERIC cantrips. Do I understand that right that, from now on, cantrips picked via magic initiate are added to your classe's spell list, henceforth enabling true strike to be a cleric cantrip when picked?

[@damedley75]

2:30 whoa the cantrip sounds like a bad deal in comparison

[@carolxs]

I'm feeling pampered with these daily videos ❤

[@TheDirtBurglar]

We re waiting for the release on dndbeyond before we start our next campaign

[@crownlexicon5225]

Clerics being the go-to dip for heavy armor is something I've said for quite a while now that I REALLY hate.

[@guyver6622]

DM, who art in heaven; Hallowed by thy game

[@chrisscott9564]

Inspiring leader works on wis and cha now? soooo, we can have an inspiring monk...... is everyone gonna start building Goku or is it just me?? :D

[@wizkid915]

I played a life cleric for my first character, got to level 15 before I got disintegrated (still bitter, don’t ask). The spirit guardians spiritual weapon combo being removed is a bummer; that being said, there were a ton of combats where I would concentrate on party buffs or control spells, which now eliminates the weaponized BA with SW, which I feel like is being underplayed bc of SG. hopefully theres other ways in PHB2024 to get a reliable BA usage on your cleric, I’d love to know if anyone knows of a few methods besides PAM.

[@xiongray]

❌️ 1 Action Hallow ✅️ 1 Action Ceremony: Wedding

[@armonkaviani7808]

If taking magic initiate origin feat on a cleric, what do y’all think: shield or find familiar? 🤔

[@JelenedraKTulsa]

Another thing to do as a cleric would be to take Sentinel so you can keep people in your Spirit Guardians.

[@michaelcords4006]

Can yall confirm if Booming Blade or Green Flame Blade is in the book? Because id love to do exactly what Monty said with magic initiate - except pair it with Booming Blade so i can get em twice

[@simonkane42]

this is so good, magic initiate, warcaster, Spirit Guardians. Get in close, if they try to get away from Spirit Guardians then Booming Blade as opportunity attack, so you get them then and when they carry on moving it goes off again :)

[@michaelcords4006]

@simonkane42 that's the exact idea behind it! And then spiritual weapon behind to catch them if they get out! Sadly no creators have confirmed if BB or GFB is in the new PHB - they only seem to talk about the changes made to spells or new spells

[@secretlyditto7716]

Booming Blade and Green Flame Blade aren't in the 2024 PHB, but I believe you can still use them because everything is backwards compatible. Monty and Kelly have confirmed that it isn't in the video where they discuss the changes in fighter :)

[@MrFirefan1234]

You would have to use the 2014 versions of the spells, which unless 2024 War Caster changed its wording, doesn't work with Booming Blade or GFB because those spells have a range of Self, and Old Warcaster you had to use a spell that would target the enemy

[@MrSeals1000]

​@@MrFirefan1234Actually they Do work with warcaster. The Target is not self, the Range is self, simply meaning that is the origin of the spell. The spell says the Target of the spell is "one creature within 5 ft of you". Which applies for Warcaster.

[@ducksinthewild]

I feel like Cleric is still top 3 classes in the game. Despite being “nerfed” in subclasses, the rest more than makes up for it