Driving Fail | Undertaking Problems

[@reise4406]

Biggest cause of undertaking is the complete lack of lane discipline, the amount of people who just pottle along at 60 in the middle lane is mind boggling. 4 lane stretch of the A2/M2 near me are pretty much reduced to 2 lanes because there seems to have been a migration of people who decided lane 3 is the new middle lane. I'm absolutely guilty of sitting in the lanes 1 and 2 just gliding past everyone on the left, and lane discipline is the reason behind that. Problem is that there is practically zero consequences for people not moving back to lane 1.

[@martinhoare9525]

It's your decision that causes your undertaking. Don't try to excuse poor driving by blaming others.

[@wl660]

Ever heard of root cause and effect?

[@frogsplorer]

Move left and you can be ruthlessly boxed in

[@ibs5080]

Totally agree with you. Although I'm currently in Vancouver Canada, Canterbury is my UK home and I'm very familiar with the M2 / A2 and can totally relate to what you describe. Especially the Medway bridge area and stretches either side of it, with four lanes in each direction. Rest assured I keep left unless overtaking or helping someone merge onto the carriageway via a slip road...or if there's an upcoming lane drop (though I don't move out too early either). Btw it's rather nice to be all the way here on the west coast of Canada and read a reference to a familiar stretch of road near home in the UK

[@csjrogerson2377]

@@martinhoare9525 If the other vehicle wasnt lane hogging with their mind in neutral and their thumb up their arse, there would be no where to undertake as they would be where they should be. Duh!!!

[@richsmart321]

Poor lane discipline is extremely common these days - just like lack of indicating. Ive heard colleagues complain "I was doing the speed limit in the middle lane". No - you were driving badly by not moving back to the left after overtaking. Many people don't see the issue of hogging an overtaking lane.

[@kenbrown2808]

"if it wasn't for poor lane discipline, there'd be no lane discipline at all."

[@nicjansen230]

The problem starts at "I was doing the speed limit". There's a grey area between doing the posted limit on your indicator and barely getting a ticket which varies day to day. Idk the exact situation in the UK, but in the Netherlands there's a correction and a threshold before you get a ticket. The correction is there to make absolutely sure the you're doing at least that speed and the threshold is there to allow for better flow. This, combined with the usual margin on the indicator, means that this grey area is about 10% of the speed limit on top of your indicator (100-110 km/h or 60-66mph). Since your indicator and the police equipment may vary day to day, there's no such thing as simply doing the speed limit. Thus there will always be people who want to drive slightly faster than you while trying to barely not get a ticket just like you.

[@kenbrown2808]

@@nicjansen230 in the US, it's pretty consistently a 5 MPH margin, which, of course, a majority of people abuse. so then you get the amateur speed limit police driving exactly the speed limit in the passing lane, with the intention of forcing obedience; and the ones who add another 5 MPH on top of the 5 MPH. personally, I think it might be worth a try to have a graduated speed limit on motorways: I.E. cruising lane speed limit at 60 MPH, next lane at 65 MPH, and if there is a third lane, 70 MPH, etc. it might make lane discipline much worse, though.

[@PenisMcWhirtar]

When I was a fairly new driver, I got a very valuable lesson in lane discipline when I got pulled over by the police in the middle of the night on an empty M62... 👁 👁 👄 for driving in the middle lane!

[@hausmaster9801]

Keep left unless overtaking… it’s a simple rule yet many don’t seem to understand it to the point many duel carriageways and motorways in my area put it on the overhead gantries. Still no one pays attention to it though.

[@Sarge084]

I undertake regularly, in my defence I do so because I'm driving an articulated truck in lane 1 approaching a slower vehicle (usually a car) in lane 2. I can only use two of the three lanes on a three lane motorway, so I either slow down to match the speed of the car in lane 2 and thereby create a rolling roadblock, or I pass on the inside. You'd be surprised how often this happens to me, but this is because I mainly drive at night and very often there are only a handful of vehicles in sight so middle lane hoggers tend to stand out more. I've even been on stretches of motorway where there are only two vehicles in sight, I'm limited to 56mph and there is some numpty doing 50 in the middle lane. Even the ones going faster disappear off into the distance, as the only vehicle, and still they won't give up the middle lane. If the police had just one vehicle out at night they could recover the cost of the police officers salary and the running costs of the patrol car in middle lane hoggers fines each night!

[@harbor.boundary.flight]

Just driven back from Watford to Liverpool today. Practically zero vehicles using lane 1. Most just sat in lane 3 of 4. Their complete unawareness of anything is absolutely shocking.

[@TheRip72]

The extra lanes are a complete waste of concrete & tarmac if nobody uses them.

[@patrickhd34]

I love lane 1. Very few people in it, plus you have the safety net of a hard shoulder on the motorway if you need to avoid anything.

[@nowster]

This is it. They've taken root in lane 3 (of 4) on an empty motorway and have switched off their brain. If they're not taking notice of the traffic around them, they're potentially dangerous.

[@TheRip72]

@@patrickhd34 & a much safer stopping distance too.

[@pratosaurusrex1128]

@@TheRip72 they are not a waste. Just because the traffic is not heavy enough for you to use them at the time you are driving, doesn’t mean they are useless.

[@BeanoMark]

I only just found out your father is the Liverpool FC Legend, Phil. Your work on KZbin is great, I gave up watching ‘bad driving’ compilations to instead watch you and other improvement focused driving videos. It’s amazing how driving is a lot more calmer when you realise to care less about the numpties, and focus on improving being a better driver yourself. And I’m a biker too. Thanks, Ashley.

[@SultanSaeed_99]

Interesting, TIL. I’ve watched Ashley for many years and never knew about this.

[@ItsFrusciantesGhost]

And the fact Ashley was a professional footballer himself. I'd been watching for years till I found that out. 😅

[@theequalizer3330]

And he is Jason stathams brother

[@joeroberts2156]

😂​@@theequalizer3330

[@kamo7293]

wow. looking it up, turns out Ashley himself was a pro footballer too. interesting

[@burgersnchips]

Something that I think is important to remember: If there is enough room to your left for someone to pass you, there's reasonable a chance that you're in the wrong lane. If you swap over the purpose of the lanes by not keeping left, then there's a chance someone will pass you "on the wrong side". And finally; if that annoys you, keep to the left and let them pass using the passing lane instead 🙂👍

[@iscmiscm]

Some peoples idea of enough room to pass is about two cars length and these idiots will never be appeased.

[@backjarton01]

@@iscmiscmIt is interesting that the most egregious moves in this video have been from unmarked, dirty, old white vans No idea why these guys overbook themselves and then have to drive like that to get to their clients That or it’s foot down Friday and they want to have a wank in the shower before going out with their mates to watch footy

[@WiseOldBill]

"If theres enough space" is bollocks, if you're building a 2 second gap for the vehicle behind you before you move so they can stop without hitting you thats 96m at 70mph! This mindset just encourages dangerous and potentially unnecessary lane changes

[@alexanderbyfield6077]

Not if you cause the driver on your rear left to actually tailgate you.

[@SolPhantasmagoria]

3:30 There is perhaps an argument to be made there Ashley that you eliminated the van's safe braking distance by moving in. Yes, he could have also slowed down to regain that space at the cost of a little progression, but that situation, whilst a pretty non-event, did appear to be caused by yourself, so your movements caused the van to have to change.

[@ianmason.]

There's also an argument to be made that the van driver eliminated his own safe braking distance by accelerating into the space that any "competent and careful driver" would have expected Ash to pull into.

[@SolPhantasmagoria]

@@ianmason. As I said, Ian. One should always reflect on one's own driving as well as others around them. Assuming everyone is going to drive safe and competently is, ironically, neither.

[@BionicRusty]

I’m afraid I have to agree. If I didn’t know better, I’d say that this was an engineered situation. Ashley is pacing the white car in lane 1 but stays in lane 2! If I was the white van driver, I’d have seen a driver being bullied into moving and , in the process, cutting me up. (Along with middle lane hoggers, one of my pet peeves) I would have either accelerated until a safe area was available or allowed the van to undertake me.

[@MRDNRA]

I found myself thinking that probably had I been in the same situation, I may well have let the van by, and started indicated as they were passing in order to pull in after they had passed (should there not be anyone too close behind said van). Of course it's easy for me to say that looking at a video, but I would like to think this is what I would do were such a situation to arise!

[@samdavis9093]

​@@BionicRusty gotta get those clips I guess

[@cathallynch1]

7:03 I like that you mention the toxic structure of delivery companies pike Amazon. It's no excuse but only encourages dangerous driving.

[@williamstrachan]

Yeah - no way the attitudes taken with timekeeping in controlled areas (like warehouses) should be allowed to be transferred to uncontrolled public spaces like roads. Glad my job van driving isn't piece work.

[@OkenWS]

In that case I wouldn't be surprised if the lad or lass was heading back to Avonmouth for shift end as they're going north on the M5 at the Gordano Cut. One day they won't get home if they drive like that. My trainers at Sainsbury's were excellent on this and used to say "It's just groceries, don't put anyone's life at risk for it. Or even the van."

[@johno4521]

200 drops a day is never going to be conducive to good driving.

[@spacerockerlightyears]

@@OkenWS I did some driver training work for Sainsbury years ago, I must agree, the company take their driver responsibility very seriously. Amazon on the other hand, seem not to!

[@timprice5]

That stretch looks like Clevedon/Portishead section of the M5. It is notorious for people lane hogging, particularly on the 4 lane section that then drops to 3 lanes further up.

[@1over137]

My technique for right hand lane blockers is to undertake only after holding pace with them for a while, then move into the left lane and observe them for a while to be sure they are just going to stick there and follow their lane, then I will proceed past with caution. The most risk you have from this technique is the Audi or BMW behind who wants you to undertake and get out of their way so they can. Often, a singular flash of the lights before you proceed. Just be careful they don't just wake up and move out of the overtaking lane when you do. DO NOT rapidly flash, that's agressive, but a single flash to say, "Hi! You see me?" can help.

[@allothernamesbutthis]

1 flash when it is safe for them to pull over, if not, i move over, let the tailgater behind you irritate them then undertake both :)

[@irishRocker1]

Same! I give them a chance. If the lane clears and they dont move over, and then there is traffic in the lane again, then the next time that lane is clear I undertake. Cos why would I expect them to move over when they havent when they had the chance. Only when there is plenty room, unlike some of these clips. And it has happened where the lane hogging was intentional cos having had plenty time to move over in the past, they then indicate and try to move as soon as they see you move over. Or on one occasion, mf tried to speed up to block me returning to the lane having been going well under the limit for like 10minutes.

[@stefansoder6903]

Why do flash a driver that never looks in the mirror? They won't notice it anyway.

[@Hirotoro4692]

You really shouldn't flash lights too try and communicate. It can often make matters more confusing

[@edrose5045]

I'll only do this if I can't overtake because of traffic conditions. If I can get around them on the drivers side I'll do that instead. If there is another lane to my left, I'll always use it to keep a bit of distance between us. Obviously not always possible. If I'm hanging back behind them, I will make sure I can see their face in the mirror which means I'm definitely not in their blind spot. I try to complete the manoeuvre quickly - not bombing past them unsafely, just minimising the time I'm alongside them - and I'll be watching very carefully for signs that they're about to change lanes in case they do decide to move over. To me it's a higher risk manoeuvre so I take extra care and only do it if I feel it's necessary I don't use headlights because I don't want to startle them and cause them to veer over without checking

[@Ep1cure]

3:05 seems a bit close to pull back in there. Vast majority of the time, Ashley's driving is excellent. Can't agree here though. If someone is determined to undertake, that's on them. I admit, I'm not perfect either, but I don't like small space margins. Some of these typical (though not all) white van drivers though, get close but don't undertake or overtake, but leave scant room when you signal your intention to join their lane. Then scold you with the horn, when you finally do knowing full well you need that lane. More common on roundabouts as well. To be frank, they do it for the lols, so don't worry about it, because they won't.

[@WreckItRolfe]

The worst drivers in my experience, along with delivery drivers, old people and taxis

[@coolsunday6339]

I agree. As Ashley had decided to pull back into the middle lane, he should have accelerated to at least match the van's speed.

[@FlavourlessLife]

I usually keep 2-3 seconds behind the car in front, and the large separation distance at 70 mph is very triggering for a lot of people. People assume if you're not stacked up 0.5 s behind the guy in front that you're going slow / lane hogging. Also, when they see a gap they just can't help themselves but take it. Very annoying.

[@Mikeb1001]

Me too. The older I've got the more I hold back at little to give myself some safe space, however idiots see that as in invitation to cut in

[@mikehunter2844]

Its not only if you undertake recklessly that the police would be interested. They'd be interested if you overtake recklessly, or changing lanes recklessly or doing any manoeuvre recklessly.

[@PedroConejo1939]

There is an oft-repeated myth that if you can be undertaken, you should be in the left lane. It's just not true in many circumstances, probably used to justify their actions by people who routinely undertake. If you are in a middle or outside lane for no good reason, then, yes, you should move over but I've had people go for the gap as I've passed an HGV and am trying to leave a decent gap before pulling back - just like the situation at 5:34. Another problem occurs when the vehicle being overtaken speeds up to match or even beat the speed of the overtaker, whether side-by-side or as I've had a couple of times, from behind at the point when I've been on the cusp of moving back to the left. These are the ones I just can't fathom, they're clearly not impatient. There seems to be another psychological factor at play there.

[@Dedubya-]

You're right, some drivers just don't like you being there, overtaking them after they've driven at 62 on a clear motorway for some time, they decide to go 75, putting you in a tricky position as you pass. Then if you pull in behind them, they slowly revert to 62, I wonder if half the time they're oblivous, just cruising along, not paying much attention to anything...but sometimes they are just being inconsiderate obnoxious dicks.

[@smilerbob]

I will admit to being a “lane 1 pass on the left progressor” in my previous days of commuting in the M25. Everyone would camp out in lanes 2, 3 and 4 while lane 1 used to be relatively empty. I wouldn’t go past vehicles quickly, usually around 5 mph quicker but never faster than 70 mph. Then one day I realised that most vehicles I had passed on the left were overtaking me a few minutes up the road once the “lead” vehcle in that lane moved. Since then I still use lane 1 but keep behind and out of the blind spot of the vehicle in lane 2. Once things speed up I then time the move to lane 2 or beyond to be in keeping with traffic flow. I will still pass on the left safely in queuing traffic on the motorway but that is the only occasion now Thank you for a good video and thank you to your viewers for their clips 👍

[@aleopardstail]

to me there is a difference, I see "undertaking" as making an actual manoeuvre to pass on the left, I don't view passing on the left because some berk is lane camping as the same - though obviously you need to be aware they are not paying attention to anything and use sense likewise passing in lane one when someone is in lane three seems reasonable

[@horsenuts1831]

@@aleopardstail Yes, I consider 'undertaking' to be two lane changes (from middle, to inside, and back to middle). If you're in the inside lane catching up with somebody in the middle (or outer) lane, there is no reason to make extra manoeuvres. Undertaking is the act of lane changing to make progress. If you don't change lanes, don't use your horn in retribution (tempting as it is), pay attention to blind spots, and have an emergency escape (the hard shoulder), then you're not doing anything dangerous. Furthermore, the police won't come down on you.

[@Jarv263]

Ashley I think you shouldn’t have moved into lane 2 with the white van being so close. That’s a dangerous lane change in my opinion, regardless of the van being in the wrong.

[@damedusa5107]

I agree, ash made the situation develop into what it was.

[@Jarv263]

@@damedusa5107 it looked like he changed lanes to punish the van driver.

[@ers5920]

I was going to ask that too. Looking at the driver too... just asking for aggravation.

[@Jarv263]

@@ers5920 this is why I don’t rate Ash as high as a lot people do. He does things he advocates against, and as far as I’ve seen, if he gets called out on it, he never admits fault.

[@drumnbassjd]

I was going to ask exactly the same thing. I did pretty much the same thing yesterday and thought to myself Ashley would probably have told me off for that. Now I'm not sure!

[@BoskiM]

I worked as an Amazon delivery driver and the pressure from Amazon and your service provider is immense which usually results in poor driving standards and scrapes and scratches

[@hydorah]

That's interesting those Amazon vans are always battered to f*%k. Are they monitored? What happens to a driver if he damages one?

[@BoskiM]

@@hydorah I drove the transit, sprinter and other large vans. The van was free as well as fuel. They give you a limit of damage after that insurance will tell them to let you go. That is what happened to me lol 😂 The vans are monitored. the Amazon transit ones have direct link to the police if stolen for example

[@sarac.3259]

​@@BoskiM Informative comments. I see 3 or 4 Amazon vans a week in my road or adjacent roads (my road in south London virtually a cul de sac since our council shut off access so can't comment on their driving).

[@SPTSuperSprinter156]

@@BoskiM that's frightening. so basically you have free reign to ding up the van until you run out of lives. prime is a brilliant thing but I'd rather pay a bit more for it so drivers didn't have to make as many drops and perhaps be less risky on the roads. Though I suspect the reality of it is they would be told to behave in the same way and Amazon would just cream off more profit.

[@Bambitheman45]

I worked as an "Amazon" driver. First time they spoke to me about being "slow" they were reminded of the Road Traffic Act, speed limits and the Construction and Use Regs because they were trying to overload the van. I also asked them to put their complaint in writing... They never did put it in writing nor did they take any action. I suppose it helped to be reading the regulations and requirements from a lovely time called The Traffic Officers Companion... They haven't got a leg to stand on.

[@Benjamin-ej8oz]

It was obvious that van was closing the gap. In my opinion staying right and letting them undertake or accelerating to build a safe gap were better options than proving a point.

[@weevilinabox]

Ashley, in the clip with the middle finger white van, at 4:02 you move to lane 3 in case vehicles moved suddenly from lane 1 to lane 2. At this point, the nearest vehicle in lane 1 was the (admittedly erratically driven) white van, which was about 1 second ahead of you. However, the vehicle approaching from behind in lane 3 was about 2/3rd of a second behind as you changed lane. It seems like the lower risk approach would be to remain in lane 2, ease off the accelerator, and be ready to brake if a vehicle does change lanes at the last second? If you recall your thinking at the time, was this a near 50/50 call as to which approach you took? If not, i.e. if the lane change was clearly the safest move in your opinion, then I'd be very interested if you would explain your thought process.

[@davidvanderklauw]

The vehicle in lane 3 was barely above Ashley's speed, and was either being cautious or was right lane hogging. Either way it posed no danger. The van however was a proven reckless driver and was likely to cause an incident with a sudden swerve.

[@jimmybloggs3029]

Judging by all the problems he caused, it seems like Ashely completely lost the ability to perceive distance in that clip...

[@jimmybloggs3029]

@@zbf5h89ftb I generally agree that staying well clear of erratic drivers is a good idea (particularly as a motorcyclist) and I think the second part of the clip around 4:00 is less egregious. However there are still significant problems, especially since this is meant to contribute to a discussion about lane discipline and undertaking! 1) The lane change back to 3 was into the path of a following vehicle which was (slowly) catching. This was (again) without leaving sufficient gap behind and with poor indication. If you really want to avoid the white van the best way to not impede other road users is to just back off a little from about 3:55 and slot in behind the BMW. But the entire decision to avoid the white van by switching lanes was an imperfect plan formulated about 10s too late. 2) The second part of your point is essentially the usual "I should move to right-most lane because I'm afraid that someone would try to over take me" mentality. Some people can do stupid things at slip roads but hogging lane 3 for no actual reason is not a solution.

[@shawnrahoon6789]

@@davidvanderklauw He cut ibn in front of the car in lane 3 leaving less than a half second gap. That is unacceptable, and especially for a driving instructor. Moving out to lane 3 with no traffic behind in either 2 or 3 is acceptable. What he did here is not.

[@composedlight6850]

he ust wanted to keep away from the poor driver -- and given the reaction when he passed the van, he made the right choice.

[@eddyrourke5514]

I remember watching an episode of room 101 were the guest put forward "Lane hogging" and i cannot remember who it was but one of the other guests argued that the real problem was the people who continually changed lanes 🤣 Always stuck in my mind this because I still find it hard to figure the mentality of people who sit in there lane when lanes to the left are free. Another thing I always remember is when I was asked "how many traveling lanes do motorways have?" when I was training for my HGV license.....I answered "three or sometimes two" of course I was wrong because there is just one traveling lane, the other lanes are overtaking lanes

[@ditch3827]

@@WarrenF Breaking the speed limit is fine with you!!?!??

[@David_D.]

I think it was Bill Turnbull, if I'm not mistaken.

[@kossfan]

I find it hard to figure the mentality of people who undertake in lane 1 when lane 3 is free.

[@ditch3827]

@@kossfan Totally agree; it is so dangerous as the car being undertaken in lane 2 would not be expecting it and might pull over to lane to avoid lane hogging lane 1 just at the wrong moment and collide with the undertaker.

[@Seanmcdhuibhne]

@@ditch3827 Would you be one of those who would not bother to check if it's safe to move back into lane 1 after an overtake, or would it always be someone else?

[@robg521]

It is getting to the stage where is difficult to stay at the speed limit on a dual carriageway. You are doing 70 in the outside lane while passing slow traffic, you pull back into the inside lane to let the faster cars pass and then get blocked from pulling back out again as you approach the next set of slower traffic. It pressurises you into either going faster than the speed limit to stay in front of the faster cars, or to refrain from pulling back in because you think that you won’t be able to get back out again.

[@ditch3827]

Or to drive a little slower and more safely in the inside lane

[@robg521]

@@ditch3827 Yep, spot on, I do 2 types of motorway journeys, I often do a 4hr journey across the country. So I get on the road at 4am and because I am in no rush I just cruise at 65MPH all the way. Other times I am working away and it’s about 1 or 1&1/2 hr journey home, in those situation a need to get to certain areas before the rush hr hits, so drive at 70 all the way so to get through before the traffic jams start.

[@DynastyHeroes]

If you are doing 70mph there shouldn't be any "faster" cars

[@robert6106]

You stay at 70mph and continue your journey, you don't give way to traffic behind you. If they want to break the speed limit its their problem not your's, its no different to an A road with a 30mph speed limit, they will just have to correct their speed. If the view of them in you rear mirror is a problem move the mirror down and worry about them no more.

[@Weird.Dreams]

@@DynastyHeroes Speedo 70mph or GPS 70mph? Loads of people do under a genuine 70mph.

[@MrJohnny3shoes]

3:15 "Was I actually doing anything wrong there"? 😂😂😂 Even the emoji's are laughing at that one!

[@rappapolex]

I agree with all other comments that Ashley didnt help the situation by not moving into lane 2 early on, when there was space, then moving to lane 2 when van was right behind him. But I also think Ashley’s unnecessary long double look at the van driver to see him do middle finger was bad. He should keep his eyes on the road ahead, especially at that speed. A small glance is fine but he did quite a head move, a very minor point, but thought id raise it.

[@alanhindmarch4483]

Thanks again Ashley for a great video. I just wish more and more people would watch your channel and get themselves better educated. Keep up the good work, I always look forward to the next video. As a driver who passed their Motorcycle Test in 1970 and car test a year later and even though I was a driving instructor for approximately 20 years, as well as fleet training and advanced driving coach and assessor, I still beleave I have something new to learn everyday. Once again thank you.

[@shawnrahoon6789]

Changing in to another lane cutting in front of the white van as we see here is better education for drivers what NOT to do.

[@stottybox3185]

I do a lot of motorway driving, in the winter months the gritters drive in the middle lane, this allows them to grit all three lanes, most cars will pass in the outside lane but there is nothing wrong with passing in the inside lane, the gritter driver knows this will happen and is quite aware of vehicles doing this, it works quite well.

[@chrishall6364]

Interesting and thought provoking video, thank you Ash. I must admit that when in lane 1 and slowly gaining on traffic in lanes 2 and 3 that really should have have moved over, it is extremely difficult and seems unreasonable not to undertake at slow speed while being ever mindful that the traffic in lane 2 may choose to move back to lane 1 as you are doing so. Poor lane discipline is at the root of this.

[@usernamemattie]

I get where you're coming from, sometimes it does feel safer and easier to glide past on the left at a slower speed if you've followed them for some distance then move out across several lanes and back, also sometimes you may not have the choice with cars coming flying behind from nowhere then moving out before you get the chance

[@2462bf2]

Yep agreed. Even more so late at night, empty motorway yet someone is sitting in lane 3.... Why is it safer to move across all lanes, to now sit behind someone who is clearly not very good at driving. I will sit in lane 1 and pass them at a safe distance

[@usernamemattie]

@@2462bf2 exactly, think they need to look at certain rules instead of drumming some new rules that let's face it some are stupid and dangerous

[@chrishall6364]

@@2462bf2 yes, I agree with you entirely.

[@Mikeb1001]

I take that view to a point as well, particularly on a 4 lane motorway - you're correctly in lane 1 on a quiet stretch of motorway but you're coming up to an idiot sat in lane 3 out of 4. It seems safer to pass in lane 1 (given that there is still a lane in between you and the lane hogger) than it is to move across across 4 lanes and back again

[@jamiesumner8311]

I undertake often. If I’ve been following a middle lane hogger with cruise control on slowly catching up. Moving from the first lane to the 3rd lane then back over in my opinion is more dangerous than under taking. The clueless driver probably won’t even notice. That or they will speed up because I hurt their ego.

[@robertbench4664]

I was a bit surprised you didn't go into detail about major roads where the overhead gantry tells you to go into specific lanes for different directions.Certainly near me on the A46 Warwick By-pass it gets hairy when people decide to suddenly lane swap or leap between lanes without checking on the surrounding vehicles positioning.

[@Figureight]

I'm conflicted with the van clip because on the one hand it appears that moving back to lane 2 put you far too close in front of the van, essentially cutting him up and placing him in a potentially dangerous situation where he was way under what is considered a safe following distance, when his intentions seemed clear by him going into lane 2 and speeding up that he was wanting to do an undertake and could have been worth spotting his intentions and just letting him do the undertake. But the van was doing a really poor job in reading the road. He had front row seats watching the Citroen move back to lane 2 in front of him (where he still continues to speed up and tailgate the Citroen), and then seeing Ashley now commit to the overtake in lane 3, showing Ashley's intentions that he had been waiting to pass the Citroen, and given the Citroen then moved to lane 1 during the overtake; should have held back anticipating Ashley to move back into lane 2 himself. But he doesn't. He continues to speed up, even once Ashley has started indicating and showing his intentions to move out of lane 3, you could visibly see the van speeding up still. If the van driver had any sense, he would see what was playing out in front of him, would assume Ashley in lane 3 would come back into lane 2 now the lane was free, and so the van would either move to lane 3 to overtake properly, or given that his stupid attempt to undertake by putting himself into lane 2 now meant others that were behind him in lane 3 had now started to overtake him and close the gap; admit that his maneuver wasn't going to work, slow down to increase the gap, then fit into lane 3 once it was safe to do so. To me it seems once he realised he had put himself into that situation, and actually made it harder for himself to get past and in fact lost spaces in the traffic, he had got angry and as you had prevented him from doing what he was clearly hell bent on doing, become angry at you when really, ultimately, was all on him and his poor driving decisions. So yeah one side it looks like Ashley shouldn't have moved back, but also he was removing himself as an obstacle that would cause people to undertake by placing himself back in the lane he should be in, allowing people to then pass him safely in lane 3.

[@Tigermad]

You cut the white van up at the 3 minute 21 mark. You can see this in your rear camera. That’s why he swerved into the overtaking lane aggressively and gave you the middle finger. You can’t just cut someone up just because you think they are going to undertake you.

[@alaneggleden1388]

I agree, if it’s not safe to move back to lane 2 you should have held position in lane 3 and kept your left signal on untill there was enough gap to create a safe stopping distance for the van or waited untill he undertook you, poor driving from you ash I believe… with respect I think you could do with some further training and maybe an advanced driving course… all the best

[@tpfrobsonable]

Thank you. It's quite worrying though that three of your viewers were happy to send in videos of themselves so clearly driving in the wrong lane, and presumably they believed this was perfectly fine.

[@richardperry5538]

Well said 👏

[@coolsunday6339]

In this one, Ashley does the same as he winds up the white van driver.

[@shm5547]

2:55 excellent driving from the black Citroen. They stayed in lane 3 until past the slip road of joining traffic and waited until out of the trucks blind spot before moving to lane 2. Also a nice pause before the move to lane 1. But I would not have moved into lane 2 as Ashley did. The van was catching and there wasn't room. Instead of cutting them up, I would either allow them to undertake, or more likely, briefly exceed the speed limit to get out of the situation.

[@TimpBizkit]

True I would have gone faster to make a bigger gap in front of the white van before moving left.

[@stevie-ray2020]

My pet hate is when you're passing parked cars as you're approaching an intersection where you're intending to turn left, but unfortunately it seems that the driver behind often appears to see your indicator as a challenge (...or they don't see it at all!) & accelerate into the gap as you move over to the left! This was particularly common when I was driving medium-sized council-buses &/or the street I was entering was narrow, requiring a wider turn!

[@snakesocks]

I haven't been riding motorcycles long, but sometimes I feel like the disproportionate deaths of bikers is just because of guys like the ones in these clips....Absolutely insane

[@BeanoMark]

Soon you’ll develop your ‘spidey-sense’ where you feel potential incidents occur before they do, and hopefully if you follow Ashley’s advice about positioning on the road, you won’t get the dreaded ‘SMIDSY’. Stay safe out there, mate. 👍

[@diegestive4167]

Nothing to do with how bikers lane split and do exactly the same as the undertakers here… some bring it on themselves.

[@marklittler784]

Anticipation it's rare you cannot predict what others are likely to do now or in the very near future.

[@gingernutpreacher]

20% of bike acsdents don't involve another vehicle so not a small %

[@breid3492]

I was once in the overtaking lane doing somewhere in the region of 85mph, when a superbike overtook me (barrier side) at what must of been approaching 150mph. Scared the absolute crap out of me. Never saw him coming, first I knew of it was the scream of the engine past my window.

[@iabaca]

I undertake a lot. I admit it. Why? Because right land is going under the speed limit. Mid lane is hogging the middle lane at 60, and left lane is completely open. I just hop in the left lane, get to 70 and stick down the open road.

[@sirnoob_1503]

Great video highlighting the importance of prediction and observation to keep safe, keep it up.

[@jarthurs]

Nationally speaking the length of drivers fuses seems to have really shortened over the past few years. Obeying the rules of the road seems to be a red rag to the impatient and the ignorant, woe betide anyone who drives at the speed limit or stops *before* the light goes red. I'm old and boring these days so I generally let people 'get away' with all sorts of entitled manoeuvres. I'm glad to see that Ashley is promoting the education of drivers beyond his own clients, we need to see more of this awareness on the roads.

[@saundersdachicken6197]

Q... When can we overtake on the left hand side? Ans... When the right hand side is moving slower.

[@mac2135]

I'm not excusing the Amazon vans actions, but to answer the question of does the pressure of time cause it, ABSOLUTELY. I am an Amazon delivery driver myself who also drives a sign written prime van. The number of parcels we are expected to deliver per day is outrageous, and losing 3-5 sometimes more minutes on a motorway will cost you between 1 and 5 delivery stops, which is the difference between recieving and not recieving a day bonus, which on current wage makes a MASSIVE difference. A side note, 90% of Amazon vehicles are fitted with a neutadyne camera which uses AI to automatically detect dangerous driving habits including undertaking, and the driver will receive repercussions if it persists

[@MartinCorrigan-xd2js]

You are trying to give the impression that undertaking involves changing into an inner lane. It is not. It is simply passing a vehicle on its left hand side.

[@koncorde]

I've been commuting to Manchester a few days a week for a few years now, and the number of people who do not seem to have any idea of the correct distances to keep is pretty remarkable. Strangely when I used to drive my Yaris I used to get a lot more people assuming that I couldn't "do" the speed limit and pushing hard, particularly on leaving Switch Island, or merging on the East Lancs or 62, regardless of the lane I was in. They'd urgently surge around me given chance. A few cars later and that seems to have stopped - now instead they sit behind, as if they have evaluated my car and thought "you can do 86 in that, so why aren't you?"

[@paladinoestetica]

Thank you for all your videos. Even though I don't drive I can tell what people are going to do. In undertaking I think it's safer when the person in front can't drive safely. So if you can tell the person in front is probably going to cause an accident, I believe, although not clearly legal, it's the right thing to do.

[@paladinoestetica]

@@zbf5h89ftb nah I said I think you should undertake in that situation mate. But you can take one for the team if u want :)

[@laceandwhisky]

Traffic cop I know stated you should always stick to speed limits and keep left if you are in an overtaking lane and cannot overtake stay where you are unless the left lane is clear for you to sit in within the speed limit if you use that to undertake to make way and go back out into an overtaking lane to progress we will pull you. If you are in the left and undertake doing the speed limit then overtake then pull back in the left then that is not undertaking illegally. I stood in court and quoted this when I got pulled and case adjourned. I think many people stay out in the overtaking lanes cos the sat nav says so when coming to slip roads, people can't drive without some computer aid now a days

[@klapiroska4714]

In the last clip, it might be OK to stay in your lane through the bend. In tight bends, you cannot necessarily see too much in your mirrors, and the blind spots are mostly in the outter lane. This is especially true, when driving a van or some other vehicle, where you might not have a rear view mirror or windows on the side to look through. I think in these situations, it is advisable to avoid changing lanes if possible, more or less the same thing as changing lanes in a roundabout. Was this such a tight bend? Maybe. At least it was tight enough to justify warning sings (maybe even reduced speed limit?), but it's difficult to judge that on the video. Presumably the cammer overtook those vehicles earlier, but why are they catching up now? No matter the reason, it was probably some poor planning.

[@mattmccaul365]

Thanks for your videos. Always makes us better learning about other road users. Even how long we have been driving. Lives are precious. Thank god for dash cams

[@TheWhiskeyMan-rk7qv]

Well personally I think the blame should lie with those who choose to sit in the overtaking lanes when it’s not necessary. This is something I deal with in the the M2 almost daily which is massively frustrating, and I’ll never understand the logic behind it. I will hold my hands up and admit that if a car is gonna sit in the right hand lane and refuse to move over even after a polite flash of the lights, I will blow past them in the left hand lane accompanied with a couple of warning taps on the horn.

[@rhonacarpenter1352]

Mike says: Looking at the situation at 2.30 don't forget that HGV's are governed to (I think) 57mph. If you are doing 70mph it doesn't take long to reach the next HGV. On a busy motorway you risk getting trapped in lane one if you move over for what is perceived as a good distance between trucks. You commented Ashley that the undertaker would not have done so had the two cars moved over. I would certainly have stayed in lane two given this situation and the volume of traffic in the clip.

[@pj1758]

Ashley doesn’t seem to recognise that often the motivation to overtake (left or right) isn’t to save some seconds, nor only to be x many vehicles in front. Instead it is to not be enclosed/trapped by a bunch of cars and instead seek the safety benefits of a lot more space. This misconception of Ashley’s seems to be summed up by the comment @7:20

[@shawnrahoon6789]

He seems to think that you won't get to your destination a bit quicker by undertaking but you will by overtaking. 😂😂

[@ibs5080]

I have to "admit" that on occassion I have undertaken slower traffic that's in Lane 2 whilst I was constantly in Lane 1. As Ashley has pointed out (and the subject of previous discussions), under those circumstances, the undertake is generally not illegal. However, any time I have done this, I have also exercised caution and there are certain circumstances whereby I would chose multiple lane changes to overtake a middle lane hogger on the right rather than undertake by remaining in the same lane. A few such examples: 1. I would at least hold back my undertake if approaching a motorway exit or already across it, just in case the vehicle on my right suddenly decides to take that exit 2. Similarly on a smart motorway when approaching a refuge area 3. I would consider multiple lane changes to overtake on the right if no hard shoulder or even if a hard shoulder and it's night time on an unlit motorway. All just in case the lane hogger decides to move left whilst being undertaken 4. I will often refrain from undertaking a truck (lorry) that's in the middle lane, especially if it's UK registered. I will often also "pause" my undertake before entering the lane hoggers left blind spot for increasing the likelihood of them seeing me before I disappear from their view. Thereafter, I won't linger in their left blind spot for too long but I won't speed either. One thing I won't do is flash my lights to "let them know I'm there" in case they mistake my flash for a "feel free to come back over to the left in front of me".

[@jefflerner7526]

Another thoughtful response but could you please explain your point #4?

[@ibs5080]

@@jefflerner7526 Hello Jeff, how goes it? Yes certainly re #4. If it's a UK registered lorry, chances are it's right hand drive, with similar blind spots that a left hand drive lorry would have on it's right hand side. We've all seen videos of cars getting swept into the front end of European registered lorries when overtaking normally on the right. Now some might point out "But that doesn't stop you from overtaking foreign registered lorries on their right side does it, so why shouldn't you undertake a British registered lorry on it's left side as long as it's done properly. Same difference surely?" True in a way but the difference is with a normal overtake of a lorry on it's right side, you have little choice if you want to make progress. With an undertake on the left, you would at least normally also have the choice to go around it on the right via Lane 3, with less " blind spot" risk if it's right hand drive, at least in my opinion. Of course, like any other driving situation, it does of course depend on the individual circumstances at the time. I wouldn't go as far as to say never undertake a British registered lorry on the left. I just feel it requires special care and consideration, more so than undertaking any car for example. I hope this helps.

[@jefflerner7526]

@@ibs5080 Thanks!

[@MrJohnny3shoes]

@@ibs5080 Whenever there's a collision between a car and truck the "blind spot" is always mentioned. Its never due to trucker being on the phone or reading something or just general distractive driving. People are obsessed with b.s it seems to be a trendy thing to talk about. A truck on a motorway does NOT have a blind spot. They have 4 mirrors on the left and usually 3 on the right that cover all along both sides of the truck. Cars dont have them either.

[@sw01ller]

what does "recklessly" mean? coz im ex blue light trained and can quite safely undertake!

[@BlueVanMan]

Seen this on Twitter, awful bit of driving. Didn't read the situation and forced the van to break and make an aggressive manoeuvre. You should have moved into the inside lane and let the van continue instead of hogging the middle lane. We all makes mistakes but this was poor judgement.

[@ashley_neal]

You missed the gantry signs as many did. What would you have done differently?

[@BlueVanMan]

@Ashley Neal like I said in my comments, moved into the inside lane or waited till the van had passed. To many think the middle lane is there to just sit in.

[@ashley_neal]

Which is the view from people who undertake and think it’s acceptable. If you’re correct the van would have pulled the same stunt with a police car.

[@BlueVanMan]

@Ashley Neal where have I said its acceptable to undertake? I doubt if the police would have made the same manoeuvre as you, and so cause a problem. Traffic needs to flow, and you stopped that flow.

[@ashley_neal]

So in your opinion traffic that wants to move back to the left so others can overtake properly and legally is interrupting traffic flow? Genius.

[@ankledsquid]

hey ash, what would your opinion be on this: lets say you have a 4 lane motorway, you have a car in lane 3 doing 60, is undertaking an issue there? imo moving over 3 lanes and then back again seems a lot more risky rhan just passing

[@colinprice712]

Just had a trip up the M5/m6 and back. If I’m travelling at 70mph in lane1, and there’s a vehicle in lane3 (4 lane motorway) travelling at 60mph, I think it’s more dangerous to change from lane 1 to lane 4 and back. Staying in lane 1 gives me a lane width between us…

[@FlavourlessLife]

Undertake in lane one 100%. Do it swiftly and get the heck out of there.

[@fujohnson8667]

I’d just go past in my lane.

[@w3w3w3]

honestly.... no one really cares about undertaking lol, it only happens because people are slow in the "fast" lanes.

[@RobManser77]

Personally I’d have indicated earlier so the van could plan. He thought you were staying out.

[@malccraven5276]

Must admit I'm a serial undertaker of a sort but it's more like the situation of the blue car around 6.30 in the video. I suspect they were travelling much faster than I do however. For me it's most commonly on the M62 as I travel both ways between Liverpool and Manchester on a particular evening each week. I'm usually doing 62mph on cruise control in lane 1 and find I regularly approach, pass and continue past numerous cars in lanes 2 and 3 without ever needing to change lanes or speed myself. I feel this often has less risk than changing from lane 1 to lane 3 or 4 to pass them then back again immediately afterwards.

[@stefenney3126]

I used to have a situation during morning rush hour traffic taking my daughter to work along the M62. On joining the motorway I would notice that the majority of traffic would immediately move into the second and third lanes, even if the 'slow lane' had no traffic. I would stay in the first lane and literally have it all to myself. The problem that would arise is that both the other lanes would become standing traffic, yet my lane was open, so I would undertake the stationary traffic, obviously using caution in case any of them actually woke up and could see that the first lane was empty. Every morning was the same, yet all they wanted to do was to sit in the middle and outer lane as if they were making imaginary progress !

[@hotdoug1000]

My gripe with city timed bus lanes is that people don't look at the lane as free when it's not in use. They still use the outside lane (coz that's where you overtake and it's faster) and can slow down traffic in a 40 limit when they're sitting doing only 30 because they're totally unaware of their surroundings and signage.

[@ianmason.]

There's a traffic light controlled junction near me with full time bus lane + 2 lanes before the junction and part time bus lane + 1 lane after the junction. Lane 2 drivers before the junction all pile into the outside lane after the junction blissfully ignoring the sign that makes it quite clear that they can go directly ahead into the part time bus lane for 20 out of 24 hours. Do the drivers stopped at the traffic lights have *_forever_* to read the sign with the bus lane operating hours on it? Yes, yes they do. Do they read it? No. Indicative of poor situational awareness? Absolutely.

[@colinprice712]

It would help if the hours of operation were in larger characters. I’m usually giving my attention to the other traffic/road layout to try & read 20mm high letters at 25metres. And you have to read the sign for each section of the bus lane - there are some that have different restriction on the same road…

[@ianmason.]

@@colinprice712 Or even a "smart sign", an illuminated or flip sign that is controlled as to time of day. It's not like that kind of technology is exactly hard to do nowadays.

[@lapamful]

Good compilation and analysis as always, Ashley. Thank you. It's my pet peeve when people don't move back into the left lane after overtaking. Although some people argue changing lanes a lot is dangerous (I guess it depends on how built up the road is), as your video shows, provoking people by hogging any of the overtaking lanes (lanes 2 or 3) is far more dangerous because of the reaction/behaviour of other motorists.

[@Rover200Power]

I'm sure the number of mushroomheads on the road is increasing every day. Not that long ago I was doing 70ish in lane 1 and managed to undertake someone doing 60ish in lane 3 of an empty motorway. These days if lane 1 is empty and I'm doing 70 I'll just go past someone dithering in lane 2 (after holding back to see if they have spotted me).

[@sergarlantyrell7847]

With regards to the Transporter (in 5:50) at the beginning of the video they're gaining on the camera car in the left lane (so legitimately in that lane to overtake), then after the car behind them pulls in, the space is then too tight to for the Transporter to pull back in and have adequate stopping distance once they realise that they're not actually gaining on the camera car anymore. I don't know who changed speeds, but as someone who uses cruise control a lot on the motorway, other drivers keep speeding up and slowing down again are the bane of my existence. It seems like every journey I start an overtake, only of the other driver to speed up while I'm alongside.

[@Jonc25]

The worst thing to do is try to stop them from doing it. It's my usual response. Let them be on their way.

[@smilerbob]

Agree, I would much rather keep an eye on them in front than be worrying about what they are doing behind

[@PedroConejo1939]

Always keep the dick in front of you. I can often be heard on my dashcam saying, 'Bye, bye, I'll never, ever see you again.'

[@billyporter1389]

Ashley stopped the van from passing in lane 2 by making a dangerous lane change that left about a quarter of a second gap. . He should have stayed in lane 3 and let the van that was gaining speed undertake.

[@kamborio]

I undertake, a lot! Not dangerously though like in some of those videos, I think there is a difference between undertaking swerving between lanes to get ahead and what I do. I am sorry but I won't be moving 2 lanes to the right and then back to the left to get ahead of a car in the middle lane doing 50 MPH. And most of the time I don't even do 70 MPH on the motorway, I stick to 60 with cruise control. On a mostly empty motorway I think it is safer to undertake an slow lane hogger than changing 2 lanes and risking being hit by someone doing 80.

[@tqminnz1405]

Would really appreciate your thoughts on how to deal with passing a car driven at 5mph under the limit and hogging the right hand lane of a dual carriageway. Some advocate flashing their lights, some tailgate, some go directly for the undertake. Happy to be patient but when does it become reasonable to lose that patience? A mile, two miles, ten miles...

[@AlmostLastJedi]

Ashley isn’t going to like this but I would weigh up the risk and just undertake. Like he said, it isn’t illegal. Just don’t undertake recklessly. The saying goes, if there is room to undertake, there is room to pull over.

[@davidvanderklauw]

If driving 5mph below the speed limit appears too slow to you then you should vote for a government who will increase the speed limit. I regularly rev my car engine 30-60% below the rev limit. So why is it that 5%-10% below the speed limit is considered to be a problem by many?

[@StupStups]

@@davidvanderklauw drive at the speed you want but perhaps not in the over-taking lane.

[@MC-fj1me]

In my opinion, if they are hogging a lane and going slower, and you pass on their left within speed limit, you are not "undertaking".

[@MrJohnny3shoes]

@@AlmostLastJedi He gave situations where it's allowed to overtake on the left One of them was *if vehicles are turning right* there's no issue with going pass on left. That's incorrect. Whether a car is turning upright or going straight it is quite legal. Motorways are no different.

[@grahambassett1956]

Hi Ashley, I don't want to come across as 'holier than thou' but something has me a little curious. At 2:38 you correctly ask 'If the 2 cars in lane 2 had moved back to lane 1...' and yet at 3:10 you move from from lane 3 to lane 2 with 2 vehicles behind wanting to pass. Why didn't you move back into lane 1 too? I would have as the vehicle was quite a long way ahead in lane 1 so there was plenty of room and your speed differential was only slight. 🤔 But maybe you spotted something I didn't see, or you had a good reason I haven't thought of? I love your videos buddy, and they've really made me think more about my driving too 👍🏻

[@QuentinStephens]

2:40 the car immediately in front of the cammer was going to move into lane 1 - it briefly indicated - but aborted the manoeuvre when the car moved from lane 3. 3:14 Maybe the lens disguises the distance but I would suggest that it was dangerous for you to move back into lane 2 so close to the van.

[@BunkerMentality]

Well, the van driver clearly didn’t believe it was too close, as he proceeded to close the gap further as soon as Ashley began indicating. It wasn’t a great situation to be in (and it was created entirely by the van driver) but I still think Ashley did the sensible thing. The alternatives would all just prolong your exposure to the driver you’ve identified as a risk. Better to get over, get them past you and let them continue on towards their next crash.

[@jimmybloggs3029]

​@@BunkerMentality The van driver is clearly a very aggressive little chap but I totally disagree. The obscenely small following distance was totally created by Ashley when he changed lanes... and then proceeded to slow down to match the speed of the traffic in lane one!

[@ferretfansdad]

I think the rise in undertaking is in large part due to the increase in middle lane hogging. Esp. in Greater London where there are so many junctions close together on 3 lane dual carriageways people just sit in the middle lane as they can't be bothered to move in/out for traffic joining. Made worse by them sitting there less than the speed limit.

[@ianmason.]

One thing that exacerbates this is London is poor signposting on the major roads like the A406 of lanes that either continue on, or become exit lanes. People sometimes hang in lane 2 because they not sure whether lane 1 is going to continue on or become an exit lane. All it needs is a sign just _after_ each junction showing whether lane 1 is going to continue at the next junction or become an exit lane.

[@spychopath]

3:12 What did Ashley do wrong here? Well, I can answer that question (and no, the answer is not "absolutely nothing"). He's pulled in front of that van WAY too close. 100% that is cutting up. This is likely to have two impacts; 1: It creates a dangerous situation where the van is now right on Ashley's rear bumper and has no reaction time. This increases risk unnecessarily. 2: It can - and probably will be given the mindset involved - be interpreted as deliberately impeding. Which probably explains the middle finger afterwards. A better way of dealing with this situation would have been to stay in lane 3. Wait for the van to either complete his own overtake and move to lane 1, drop back or (most likely IMO) complete a left hand overtaking manoeuvre. Then, when there is adequate space to safely move into the left lane, Ashley moves into the left lane. My rules for moving left are; dont do it unless it is safe to do so, AND you don't percieve an immediate hazard. I.e. No vehicle within 2 seconds up or down the lane and no prospect of a vehicle moving into the lane from a lane even further left.

[@Kyxul]

Who tf asked for your paragraph, tf. Get a job 🤣

[@joules531]

Just spotted your post. I totally agree. Ashley should have recognised the dangers of this chap in the white van, and stayed in lane 3.

[@MrPianist7]

The ever changing road layouts create many the issues you highlighted. Multi lane highways and 'split' roads make it extremely difficult to always be in 'the correct' lane. I decided long ago that safety is more important than being right or wrong rather than try to teach bad drivers a lesson.

[@shankly1985]

Currently learning to drive. When I mentioned under taking to work colleagues that have been driving for 10+ years they didn't know it was a thing.

[@PedroConejo1939]

It shouldn't really be a thing. Passing on the left in circumstances permitted in the HWC is one thing, but mostly when we talk about undertaking we're referring to the knobbish behaviour seen in many of the clips.

[@shankly1985]

@@PedroConejo1939 it really depends on the situation. The left lane is the driving lane so you should always allow drivers to get back into this lane. Giving enough space to the car in front on the right lane allows them to get back over into the left. The other issue is driving close or passing cars on the right you could become in the blind spot of that vehicle wanting to get back into the left lane.

[@mikehunter2844]

@@PedroConejo1939 it's also legal to undertake outside the exceptions in the Highway Code. They are advisory rules. Travelling in congested conditions does not have a certain speed. Vehicle to your right does not have to be taking the next right turn for you to be allowed undertake.

[@kenbrown2808]

this is a perfect clip for Ib S' and my observation that in the state of Washington, the motorway rules are the same as in the UK: cruise in the left lane, pass in the right lane.

[@picklestheswift]

Great video highlighting the dangers of undertaking! I have learned something from this!

[@demil3618]

Can’t blame the guy at 06:12. The VW should have moved back in to clear the outside lane as he was not passing anyone (or too slow to do so).

[@Chrus600]

What of situations on 4+ lane motorways, where you’ve people sat in lane 3 doing under the speed limit? Would undertaking in lane 1, going maybe 5mph faster than them be reasonable? With the speed cameras and epic levels of inattention on the M25 this is often a decision I debate, and it does mean I’m one less car in lane 4 squeezing past.

[@mikebooth6634]

4 Lane Motorways make me laugh, because middle lane hoggers are unsure which of the two middle lanes they should hog..... Often the left lane is the fastest!

[@Seanmcdhuibhne]

Ashley it is not illegal if you go outside the 4 or so exceptions you gave. None of them are legal requirements. The only time they would be is if they're carried out without due care and attention or reasonable consideration for other road users. You can also undertake on a single carraigeway with two or more lanes in your direction.

[@shawnrahoon6789]

4:05 Ashley you made a manoeuvre that obstructed the car from behind making progress. If I was your examiner i would fail you on that manoeuvre.

[@calum3527]

yes but he was driving in a defensive manner, that van driver was unpredictable

[@saads7]

Feels like he baited the van a little bit but pulling back into lane 2 when the gap between the two vehicles didnt look like a lot. This seemed to have trigger the van driver. All he had to do was speed up a little until there was a bigger gap, then move back into lane 2. These sort of actions tend to 'create' issues where a bit of consideration would likely make 'incidents' like this pass off with no issue.

[@uavr1286]

Ashley, keen to know your opinion of undertaking a vehicle in lane 3 by passing jn lane 1. I observe a lot of people with poor lane disciple in lane 3 of 4, often doing about 60, when traffic levels are medium to quiet. It seems lower risk to pass in lane 1 than move from 1 to 4 and back to 1.

[@UltimateOwl1993]

This is absolutely fine, you aren’t even undertaking if you stay in lane 1, undertaking would be to go from lane 3 to 1 to get past someone. If you remain in 1 the whole time this is absolutely fine as long as you’re vigilant.

[@mikehunter2844]

Not one of those videos showed simply undertaking safely. They showed weaving in and out of lanes and speeding. Undertaking on it's own is not classed as careless driving. Weaving in and out of lanes also shows overtaking which hasn't been mentioned. The car in front to your right does not have to be tuning right for you to undertake. If it's alongside you how could you see if it's right indicator is on or not. One side of a dual l carriageway is similar to a one way street and is legal to undertake. Whether traffic is congested or not it's also legal to undertake. Undertaking up to 70mph is not illegal. Constant lane changing carelessly to undertake is.

[@shawnrahoon6789]

So Ashley and Jon, the question everybody wants to know the answer is - If a vehicle is in lane 1 doing 70mph and the other lanes are moving slower, is it legal for that vehicle to stay at 70mph to pass on inside? Yes or No

[@MC-fj1me]

Yes

[@shawnrahoon6789]

@@MC-fj1me 👍

[@MrJohnny3shoes]

Yes it is legal. Don't expect Ashley or Jon to reply to that question. They will never admit to being wrong.

[@keith6400]

Yes, Ashley even says undertaking in the UK is not illegal in itself.

[@shawnrahoon6789]

@@keith6400 He also said "so what situations are we ok to pass on the left hand side"? When vehicles are turning right. So what he's saying is if a car is not turning right, which would be any road with two or more lanes on the side you are travelling on is going straight it's not acceptable. He also said "If there's a queue of traffic" it's acceptable. If there's only two cars in the description I gave is it legal? Temporary speed limits concern speed rather than undertaking. On a one way street. He's saying If the car to your right is not turning right it's acceptable to undertake but is not on a dual carraigeway. What he's saying is it's not acceptable to overtake a hogger on the left at 70mph. That is incorrect.

[@chrissansum]

I always set myself a rule of never pulling back in in front of someone until I can see their car in full in my rear view mirror. Otherwise you risk making forcing the other vehicle to be too close to you, which is dangerous and can trigger them. It seems like Ashley maybe should not have pulled in with the white van so close - there wasn’t adequate stopping distance for the van once he pulled in. The van driver’s response was dangerous and unnecessary, but it doesn’t seem like the best decision to have pulled in so close in front of him.

[@tinaheron5825]

our reactions and thoughts as to why drivers do things are partly due to our own perception and experience which could be way off the mark. I followed your reasoning for the white van incident but why did you then make eye contact with him giving him the opportunity to give you the finger, surely this gives the driver the impetus to escalate. As a driver, it is vital that we just let things go and not encourage further contact or reaction.

[@andyuk2010]

6:30 - absolutely no problems with this undertake and I myself would do this and indeed do it regularly on lane 1 of a 4 lane smart motorway in which, for inexplicable reasons, no one ever uses lane 1. It's safe and people aren't moving lanes just to undertake so I don't believe there is any issue with it, under law or otherwise. It is far more unsafe to traverse across multiple congested lanes to pass.

[@MattiusHawkEye]

So we're gonna just ignore the fact that in the clip at 2:47, the middle lane is completely free, as you can tell from the rear view camera, there's no one in the blid spot either, the lorry to the right of the van is moving over, so creating more space, and there's a good six to eight seconds of time/space where Ashley could have moved over, allowing the white van to stay in the lane and not have to dangerously undertake from you closing the gap and reducing his braking distance. Bombing it up the third lane and closing in on the black car in front when there's space in the lane beside you to make room for other road users to pass safely isn't exactly the best demonstration of your "make events non-events" philosophy, Ashley. You can't be holier than thou while disregarding your own driving imperfections.

[@MyMednas]

This. Hogs lane 3 then wonders why a van tries to undertake.

[@I_am_Simon_Cooper]

I've been working the last few weekends on the west side of London so have needed to use the south side of the M25 to get there, the amount of drivers just sitting in lanes 2, 3 and 4, even at midnight with little other traffic, without overtaking anything is ridiculous. For some reason they often seem to think sitting in these overtaking lanes doing 50-60mph is acceptable. To be in an overtaking lane you need to be overtaking something imminently and not in ten minutes time.

[@kevinjbakertribe]

What are your thoughts on the classic "M25 lane 3 hogger doing 55mph with no other cars about". If I am in lane 1 doing 65 is it reasonable to just carry on in lane 1 or should I try and get over to lane 4 to pass? The law seems to lack clarity here. A video from Black Belt Barrister from a while back seemed to suggest it was OK to do it (as you are not changing speed or lane to do the pass), but it really is not very clear!

[@ianmason.]

It's all a question of balancing risks. There isn't a hard and fast answer, and it's going to depend on the other traffic about. Which, in the particular circumstances, is going to involve higher risk, sweeping from lane 1 to lane 4, or passing briefly through the nearside blind spot of a (probably) inattentive driver with a 1 line buffer between you? If the lane 3 hogging driver is as inattentive as they are realistically likely to be, you're probably going to be a surprise to them whichever side you pass them. Personally *_if_* I've made the assessment that a lane 1 pass of lane 3 is going to be safe enough to execute I'll often add a blip of speed to minimise the time where I'm in the danger zone. More often than not I'll just hold back and wait for a safer opportunity to pass to present itself in a minute or two. What I won't do is hang about in their blindspot - better to be further back or further forward.

[@Bellezzasolo]

At some point was a passenger in a car on the M1, and we approached a driver sitting in lane 3, and wobbling around. Passed in lane 1, as it gave more space. As we passed I saw that he was texting. The offence isn't undertaking, it's careless driving. There's an argument to be made that maximising space during an overtake is being the most careful!

[@ditch3827]

If there are no other cars about, how do you know he was in lane 3 doing 55mph 🙂? The highway code is quite clear on the matter in that overtaking on the inside is not permitted except in slow moving queueing traffic or if the other car is turning right. The CPS say overtaking is a section 3ZA(2) offence and breaking the highway code immediately makes you liable if there is an accident.

[@Rover200Power]

@Ditch wrong again. "In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right. Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake."

[@ianmason.]

@@ditch3827 You've already been corrected on this, several times by several people. I really don't know why you keep littering the comments here with misconceived and often plain wrong statements about what they law says. Ergo, you say "The CPS say overtaking is a section 3ZA(2) offence" which is clearly arrant nonsense - overtaking is perfectly legal, heck the Highway Code even has a whole section telling you how to overtake. And for the umpteenth time the Highway Code DOES NOT establish strict liability, you can't "break" it, all you can do is fail to follow its guidance which *_may_* establish liability when taken into consideration with the statutory standards set for liability.

[@frogsplorer]

Seems to be a lot of frustration here with ‘lane discipline’ and ‘middle lane hoggers’. I think the main two causes are to avoid getting boxed in, and inattention. Avoiding getting boxed in and avoiding boxing others in is something I try to think about on the motorway. It’s just human to lose attention now and then on long journeys. I don’t get how people don’t get it. Instructing people to move left will change nothing

[@stonestreaker]

Going to have to disagree with your critiscism of the Transporter at 6:01. What are they to do, change lanes into the gap in lane 1? Way too close front and back. I make it about 2 lane marker lines. They're perfectly placed, in a staggered position as they are.

[@p.a.1675]

In normal situation, I would say you are absolutely right. But the idea here was not to escalate. The merc driver was already giving all signs of impatience (approaching at high speed, flashing lights, tailgating). If the transporter van used his left indicator it would be a signal for the black car behind to widen the gap. Much safer than what we actually see in the video.

[@wirdy1]

I hadn't appreciated the camera compression when I viewed the video, but you are quite correct. The vw transporter would've caused another problem whilst trying to solve the impatient-Mercedes problem. Best option is exactly what they did, sit tight & not be intimidated into a manouvre that inconvenienced the lane 1 traffic whilst rewarding the aggressive merc behaviour.

[@АдамБреннан]

Have to agree, think Ashley missed the bigger picture on that one

[@shawnrahoon6789]

If you stick to Ashleys idea of a staggered position then all the outside lanes would be lane hogging.

[@user-mv5zt8qd9l]

Stuff like this is why I avoid overtaking if the other vehicle is only going marginally slower than myself and there are people already approaching from behind. Ultimately, a 5mph decrease in speed over the course of one road link in my journey isn't going to bring my schedule to its knees. More to the point, you're likely not going to actually decrease your journey time - just the amount of time you spend queuing at the next junction.

[@mrchips1795]

At 2:55 you should have moved lanes. Makes no sense to stay in outside lane there when the other lane is clear

[@PhilDurber]

The clip where the white van was right up your chuff, you had 15 seconds where you could have been in lane 1 comfortably. The clip previous you talked about the other cars not moving back to lane 1, you were essentially those cars.

[@robert6106]

In truth he had no reason to do so, you don't give way to your rear view mirror unless reversing which he clearly was not.

[@Timtherunner]

Sorry to say but you are lane hogging when you leave a long stretch with no one in the left and you're in the middle. If you can be undertaken then you haven't moved over soon enough

[@rcraven1013]

In many instances drivers who have just overtaken actually move back far too early and then cause danger and concern to the driver they have just overtaken,. I have often been overtaken and then when that vehicle is only 20 or 30 ft in front of me I have been cut up by it moving back to my lane. , not a nice thing to see. That said many drivers do continue too long in the overtaking lane but where does one draw the line. If one is travelling at say 70 mph and in the middle lane overtaking another car doing 60 mph what distance should he give to that overtaken vehicle and to return into that previous lane.. The H.C say to return as soon as possible but not to cut in? We know its not 20 or 30 ft as some give as that would be cutting in so what distance should we give that is relatively safe and within the law and also reasonable to others. . To be safe and to not enable tailgating the safe distance to return into that lane would be some 60 metres or more, maybe 70 metres which is some 230ft Perhaps that is too large a distance to give as one is likely to be considered to be mid lane hogging at that distance. If its not 20 or 30 ft and not 230 ft then just what distance is safe and reasonable.?

[@samuilplamenov4749]

The issue is not drivers but the highway exit system in the UK. Everywhere else in Europe in order to take an exit you have to willingly change to a new lane that opens up. However in the UK lane 1 is often the one that diverges into another route. This, coupled with the fact that slow-moving vehicles are in lane 1, is enough incentive for people to just stay in lane 2 most of the time to avoid having to check directions so often.

[@robg521]

Excellent video. It’s such a wide variant of situations that you need to take them individually. Someone slowly and carefully undertaking a slow lane hogger is one thing, and an idiot bombing through on the inside in a dangerous and reckless manor is another. In the 1st people are succumbing to the natural human nature of impatience. In the 2nd people are actually using their reckless driving as a statement to everyone around them. [How dare you hold me up, get out of my way]

[@TheRip72]

I see your point but would argue that "slowly and carefully undertaking a slow lane hogger" is a contradiction in terms. Vehicles have a larger blind spot on their near side. If you really "need" to get past, you need to be through the blind spot & into their forward view fairly quickly. By passing them slowly, this is not as careful as what you could be.

[@ethanleighton9060]

I see a lot of undertaking in my journeys as I normally do a few hundred motorway miles each week. Ive commented it before but I still think the M27 is one of the worst roads in the country for lane discipline which triggers a lot of undertaking. I have been guilty myself of just sitting in lane 1 at 70 and only moving out to lane 2 to overtake lorrys and just undertaking all the traffic in lanes 3 and 4 because noone ever moves out the way

[@PedroConejo1939]

There are a few places on the road network where the culture seems to change at a certain point. We always say we know we're in Hampshire on the A34 when the driving gets narky. I try to miss the M27/A31 unless it's quiet by dropping down through Salisbury and Blandford. The same thing happens on the M4 when you get past Newport.

[@w33ksy]

Perfect example of yourself not moving over into the left lane. You hogged the middle lane (3 minutes in) 😂🙈

[@rufusgreenleaf2466]

He didn't though, he was slowly overtaking the vehicle in the left lane.

[@w33ksy]

Should have pulled to the left lane behind the bmw until the white lines started to change. That’s why the van driver was pissed off. (Rightly so)

[@rufusgreenleaf2466]

@@w33ksy I actually made an original comment on the video stating this fact, looking into it i actually agree. I do think Ashley could have continued left and waited until the van had cleared the area.

[@peenergysolutionslimited8903]

Regardless, the van driver is a danger to other road users and probably does that every day.

[@KID_LAT]

Ashley, my wife and i came across this video literally last night, i wish i had a dash cam, cos while i was driving today i was signalling to get into lane 1 and i just about noticed a plonker in my left blind spot slowly speeding up from behind me and zoomed past me! 🤦🏾‍♂️ it felt pretty close!

[@paulcostache6733]

I think you could have waited another couple of seconds before moving into the middle lane. I would have. Be at least two seconds or more behind or in front of another car. You basically cut in front of the van. Not to worry, learn from it, move on.

[@todortodorov6056]

When I took my drivers license in Denmark around 1998, the terminology was not left or right lane. We used *driving* lane and *overtaking* lane. The rule was; you *have to* drive in the *driving* lane (in our case, the right lane) and only use the *overtaking* lane (the left lane for us) for *overtakes* . If the driving lane gets too congested, by definition, you will have to overtake and this gives you a reason to use the overtaking lane. But if there is space in the driving lane, you *have to* vacate the overtaking lane and move into the driving lane. This means that you will have to switch lanes left and right to get around slower vehicles, but you give faster vehicles a chance to move. Unfortunately, very few get fined for not vacating the overtaking lane.

[@0zzyp0zzy]

3:10 wasn't the van a little too close to be moving to the left? I would have either sped up to complete the overtake safely or slowed down and let the undertake happen. You're also a little close, but not as close as before to the black car at 4:05 although they seem to be much more accommodating.

[@MeFreeBee]

I too though that about the white van. Seems like you were forcing his hand a little.

[@bushpig6837]

Or move all the way back to lane 1 (which there was time to do) and the van would have been able to overtake in the middle lane.

[@0zzyp0zzy]

@@bushpig6837 Doesn't seem like the best idea, he presumably wants the A5300 to get to Liverpool, he might get 'sucked in' or stuck in the lane heading to the M6 if not careful.

[@JohnLynch-r4c]

ALL lanes can be used for overtaking at any speed up to the maximum speed of that road.

[@Duncan94]

In my experience most undertaking happens due to poor lane discipline, as displayed by a good number of the clips in this video. The best part is that delusional dashcammers submit their 'dangerous undertaking' clips to Ashley then he, quite rightly, calls them out on their shit driving.

[@billyporter1389]

At 3:13 many commenters on here were right to criticise Ashley when he filmed himself driving without due care and attention.

[@Duncan94]

@@billyporter1389 Yeah I did think that at the time - it wasn't the best lane change from Ash. The van is gaining ground in lane 2 and by Ash changing from lane 3 to lane 2 he forced an unsafe following distance for van.

[@SteveMcIlhennie]

Ashley you explained on many occasions what to undertake means. It's the passing of a vehicle on it's left hand side. Why do you include lane changing in this video.