Episode 18 - Have BSA Got this all wrong?

Ian & Gareth take a tour of the upcoming, new Hot Air Range & the BSA Ultra CLX Pro Wilderness edition, is it worth the price tag?
Join this channel to get access to perks:
/ @hotair4269

[@tillysgunstocks]

I can answer the queries on the cheek pieces. The way they are manufactured at minnelli,the cheeks are effectively milled off the main stock body. All the cheek pieces are then built from an entirely different blank or even species of wood in some cases . It reduces costs significantly mainly as its all automated and doesnt need someone accurately cutting the cheeks off and then jigging them up post shaping to be inlet on their underside. Doing it the way they do reduces sanding too by a huge amount. When you look carefully at some rifles that have a matching laminate cheek youll often notice some that have multi colours, the wrong way around 😆 Re custom stocks on factory limited edition rifles, ive been asked regularly.. its a no thank you. Ill design and prototype a design, they can then use it under license and have it made by a 3rd party. 😉

[@BionicRusty]

I hear what you’re saying about customer stocks on factory rifles, Tommy and I agree it’s a danger, especially if with an offshore company, but if you were to keep design ownership and tie them (BSA?) in, via a contract, at the design phase, then you are legally covered and protected by law. I worked in this area in the Defence Industry for many years and all main Defence Contractors like BAES, Raytheon, Thales, etc, use this method. They come up with a concept and work under contract with the subbies who actually design and prototype the sun-components for the Main Contractor to assemble and test the main design. Promise I’m not trying to teach granny to suck eggs but it could be pretty lucrative for you. Get Tilly’s to knock Minnelli a little. 😁👍

[@brynybach7741]

Totally agree with you on BSA, they seem to have lost their way. Limited editions are being brought out by everyone at the moment for the only reason they think they can sell more, but people are seeing straight through this Ruse. The take down rifle was a joke, their piston break barrel is being taken back to dealers because they are greatly underpowered. The rubber coated cheek risers are just a problem for the future which to my mind has probably been forced onto all manufacturers who buy these Minelly stocks. As you mention, it's probably a production problem with a quick fix solution. I pulled out from a drawer an old mobile phone the other day which had the same rubber type coating and it was so sticky where the nature of the rubber had changed, that it made me think straight away about these same coated stocks. I won't touch one with a barge pole. Let's just see what they are like in five or ten years time and it's not just BSA. Quantity over quality seems to be the new mantra and that will only bode disaster in the end.

[@marksaunders9292]

BSA quality is really poor. My new R12 was a dog . In fact it was like being bitten by a rabid dog. You don’t go the again. Take down rifle. 😂😂. And the tone of their emails. 😩😩.

[@user-sd2pg5vd5d]

What can i say?, i have the wilderness and love it. Recent purchase. It will be going through mud and rain in the field so hope it lasts.😁Seen several excellent reviews about it, so it was interesting to see another point of view on items i actually liked.👍

[@V4victory2025]

The range is looking great. I 100% agree about the BSA Ultra CLX Pro wilderness Edition! To me the “Package” seems to be thrown together with parts that don’t really fit together well to justify a massive price tag.

[@user-pq4fd3dq6e]

Hi guys great vid top springer has to be the HW77 the first gun I ever bought new from a shop from Monks Chester made up with it had loads of rabbits with it and it’s still going strong.

[@ianwoods1384]

Hello Gentlemen, Thank you again for your video. I always enjoy listening to your views, opinions, and comments. I think you do people like me a great favour in profiling different things and telling us what you really think and why. You have your shop, you deal with air rifles every day, you've both got fingers on the pulse, and you're both honest, which I feel is great. Thank you. I have a BSA R12 CLX PRO. I love it, I think it's a great air rifle. I think it's beautiful, accurate, and overall fantastic. Personally, I like the cheek piece. I feel it's nice and soft and blends in well with the other colours of the rifle. Reading some of the comments, though, I'm not sure how it will last, long term? If I'm being honest, I think the manufacturers should be thinking about that and not us. That should be their responsibility. I like BSA, I think they're great. However, I think they really need to think how they go forward from here. The scope mounts and scope rail issues you showed us are inexcusable to me. That, I thought, was shocking for a manufacturer of BSA's quality, to supply incorrectly sized scope mounts to a rail. I also like you don't see any reason for a price hike and certainly not double. That's just ridiculous. Overall, I'm disappointed with BSA, as I don't think they're far off MP territory, though they'd still have to go some, to rivall their never-ending pantomime! Yes, although, at a glance, overall a beautiful air rifle, but disappointing, in some areas, and I don't see any point in doubling the price. Thank you, fellas, and best wishes, Ian.

[@paultowns9880]

The range looks superb. A 97 for the father in law. Another great video, take care.

[@HarryBunnGRVOTV]

I can’t get past the black cheekpiece on that bsa! Oh & the price!

[@1001space]

that's why I watch this channel because you are honest guys . great video yet again

[@stephenbroadhurst7653]

Sorry I’m late to the party, but if BSA made a CLX side lever with a shrouded barrel, walnut stock and have an inline regulator which had an 11mm dovetail and have no scope supplied I would buy one straight away. I don’t know what percentage of rifles they sell in America but I think it’s about time they did away with the 3/8” dovetail ,or at least put a Picatinny on it to cater to both the American and European market. As for the price if you pay £1,300 for a rifle would you leave that £170 scope on it, that would be the first thing I would change.

[@ian436]

I think if you check all BSA rifles have 13mm dovetails not 11

[@paulbeese2665]

brilliant guys shooting ground looking great this show his so honest from start to finish, light and so refreshing, great team cant wait for the next,

[@allanwilliams8403]

Great video and great to see the progress on the range. Get your father in law a Cometa fusion star.

[@michaelholt7963]

When the ultimate sporter came out a few years ago i thought why o why have you stuck that horible shity black cheek piece on that gun and completely spoilt its flowing lines, but the more i look at it specially on the bsa's the more i like it, goes well with the black metalwork

[@IanBradley-ns1bg]

I have owned a Clx utra for a while now. The 1st issue with the gun was it dragging a pellet back into the cooking mech. I started to notice that after about 30 shots the gun started to shoot high, and then after about 20 shots settle back down. I decided to run exhaustive tests over my chrono and noticed and it became apparent that the inaccuracy coincided with a power spike at about 160 bar (what some call the Sweet Spot). I realise that the gun is not regulated, and there will be a power curve, but in this day and age and especially given the price of the Ultra there should be a regulator fitted to flatten the power curve. I only shoot targets and have adjusted to this quirk in the gun, but I would not use it for any sort of pest control as the strange inaccuracy in the mid pressure point would render it unethical. I wonder if any other owner has noticed this trait, and whether fitting a regulator would cure the problem. I feel there are many more guns at the Ultras price point that would have been a better buy.

[@byroneckhardt4131]

Air arms .It's a no-brainer .only the best when it comes to your old man .

[@casperboo5465]

Hw 97, caunt go wrong with them toped off with a Vector veron scope, Cheers guys 👌👌👌👍👍👍👍👍

[@memememe2674]

Those thumbs up at the end of your comment, are they the ones hw97, s have flattened with that bear trap design?

[@neiledwards8931]

Just looking though your sheds and the fields in front them this is going to be a first class shooting rangers brilliant, I used to come to the shop when Reg Gizze owned it good friend and his wife great people, Happy days .

[@NeilPickering-kd4cx]

Well done that's great to introduce a range to us and younger generation keep the hobby pushing forward, well impressed great video 👍 I recon hw 77 or 97 for your father in law 😀👍

[@Ian-zt8bu]

Coming on nicely guys. Looking forward to getting out there and trying out the range.

[@Getting-Older]

After getting that hw95 from you I would recommend that as a springer of choice, light accurate as a pcp and superb build quility! (BTW thanks for your help and time on that) In fact anything from Weihrauch! Range is looking good!! Agree on the BSA, 3-12 or 4-16 scope.

[@hotair4269]

Thank you mate, glad your enjoying the rifle.

[@jasonfreeman2555]

Super vid as always fellas👍.The range is looking good and looking forward to seeing the finished result.As for the BSA I do like the colour of the stock but they have spoiled it with that cheek piece.I agree with you that it should come with the barrel shroud and a few more more brassy bits but for that price I'm sorry for me it can stay on the shelf. Oh and for your father in law what about a HW98.

[@unclebob8139]

Good video chaps, the range is looking good, that Ultra is a lovely little gun but not worth the money, like you said its to just shift stock..

[@Happy-Me.]

The HW95, HW98, HW97, Pro Sport and TX200. I own all of these and would go for the TX200!

[@hotair4269]

We got him a TX200 :) he’s very happy

[@user-xy7ze8ub8m]

The range is looking awesome guys For Clive’s range rifle can’t go wrong with the tx200

[@stephenthomas6019]

Great honest review boys

[@baikal627]

Great job guys

[@Happy-Me.]

My ex has the BSA Goldstar and has had a few issues with it!

[@PaulMoorhousehankooks]

Looks a good setup on the range

[@user-cr9ge5bm2i]

At last , real reviews and not sales videos. Thanks for sharing your time and honesty 👍 Almost forgot HW97KT

[@Fiftypellets]

Hw77 for the springer❤

[@vak1a]

Walnut tx200 mk3 👍

[@Fiftypellets]

I thought bsa was a 13mm rail?

[@harryhunter2055]

I believe the black cheek piece comes down to manufacturing costs. The stock will be machined on a CNC, to cut the stock and cheek piece from one piece of wood requires a thin tool be used(Maximum size of tool is the gap between the piece and the stock to ensure good grain consistency) and multiple depths of cut so the tool doesn’t break, this would be expensive to make from one piece with the grain running correctly. Alternatively the piece could be cut from the stock with a suitable saw but this would involve another step in the manufacturing process and now introduce human error. As stupid as it may seem its just more cost effective.

[@HarryBunnGRVOTV]

They managed it on my weihrauch!

[@harryhunter2055]

It’s more than doable but not if your trying to keep cost down. Personally I think for the money you should be able to choose your own tree 😂

[@perki496]

Range is looking good guys! Another good video I’ll be interested to see who your stock maker is? I’ve had a bad experience with a well known one I’ll have a chat about it next time I’m in the shop 👍

[@mattodp]

Hi Gents top 3 IMO - 1. AA TX200 .177 2. HW 97 laminate .177 2. HW 98 .177

[@lcc8394]

i'll be come down to the range (only in mold) best ranger springer walther lgu with rowan trigger....cheaper than tx200 and 97k and shoots 60meters with ease, maybe a bit heavy for some though

[@allanwilliams8403]

I don't have a BSA and I have never ever considered buying one due to mixed reviews from folk who have them. I'd buy a Gamo instead, made by the same company.

[@ellsed5916]

Totally agree lads I hate these black cheek pieces my mates bought a lovely walnut ultimate sporter it has a fantastic stock then they have put this black cheek piece on and ruined it, same with redwolf daystates I'll stick to fully walnut stocks I'm a traditionist, agree with you on the bsa mounts also issue I've spent a small fortune on bsa 13 mm mounts but have a ton of 11mm ones, anyway good luck with the channel and range lads.

[@philipbooth9755]

Has to be a Whiscombe 😂😂😂 still love the TX though ❤ The BSA Ltd edition are are all black above the forend line, so the cheekpiece matches the cylinder/ barrel etc

[@hotair4269]

Hahahahaha not sure my bank manager would allow that mate hahaah

[@fieldsportcymru4636]

Range is looking great 👍 cant wait to get down their . Nice looking rifle but as you say a bit of a con limited edition this and that all the time .

[@robrobertson1586]

Luv the honesty when it comes to the reviews. You are unique with regards to that compared to other channels. Seems most channels are to worried of offending a manufacturer rather than giving a factual review. Your range? Why not a indoor range for at least 10meter and a bench rest hut? Is it solely for plinkers?

[@Floody2010]

It's got to be a HW97k Best spring rifle in the world when tuned 😊

[@stephenmann5553]

Range looking great mate….. can’t wait 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

[@chrisjohn4101]

First of all, well done on the cheekpiece moan, secondly (IMHO) finally a video that gives you both some credibility where you dare to criticize a major brand for obvious reasons - many review sites don't. Keep going - you're getting there.

[@robnelson840]

Think BSA are pricing themselves out of the market as regards the general shooter or first time buyer, Airarms are doing the same. in my hubble opinion.

[@petethefeet5281]

Nice to hear a good 'warts and all' review instead of the sycophantic nonsense that some other reviews churn out - bty i'm going backwards, done rifles and shotguns now back to air rifles - good fun and the amo is cheap!

[@Mike_P646]

Everybody should be hammering BSA for the ridiculous 13mm dovetails, it's their setup and they don't care what people think. Tilly's gunstocks addressed the minelli cheekpiece issue. The scope on that is a rebadged vector Veyron/mtc copperhead model,a decent scope in a magnification (over magnified) a newbie likes. Basically BSA are trying to cash in on that combo, not for me. A beech tx200 is perfect for the range. Great vid👌

[@cl_foto]

The scope and mounts on the gun are re-badged Vector Optics, the scope is a veyron.

[@david.williams2150]

100 %agree with you la and keep these honest videos coming and can't wait for the opening day

[@clivelockwood3236]

I think its a very good looking gun, it needs to loose that black cheek piece and come down to around the 7-800 mark and i think its a winner.

[@stigg333]

Nice video and think a TX with a 4-16x44 sfp ir scope would be good for your father in law!!!

[@geetee7154]

Great review guy's, the Range looks superb, class leading I would say, in respect of the Ultra, it does look superb, but in every respect it is overpriced 😮

[@cl_foto]

There is only one springer air rifle that comes to mind with me, Weihrauch HW97K, in my opinion, best springer out there. (HW77 also as it’s practically the same rifle) 😊

[@leecolclough2492]

Dad in law hw95k. 177 decent powered hawke scope sorted he can then tune if he wants 😀 grand lads cheers 👍👍👍

[@davidmayoh657]

Pro sport or tx200 both amazing.

[@paulcarruthers1314]

Try and part ex a R12

[@carlsouthern3673]

I tried mate nobody wants them

[@eskimojulie]

Why on earth would you put a custom stock on a prosport anyway ? the air arms walnut stocks knock spots off them , the mounts on the BSA just prove that its form over function 😒.New subscriber 😀

[@rickydowning7557]

BSA need to get with the times. Magazine system needs updating, regs need updating, action needs updating. Fallen way behind with the competition. Easiest and simplest thing would be to get Huma to do their regs. They already have a big following, with many people who can tune them. Magazines…… the hw100 has been around for 20 years, it’s simple and works flawlessly, copy and improve it.

[@carlsouthern3673]

I agree

[@markgaines2550]

TX 200 HC, mine shoots almost as good as my PCP.

[@adamcarr8457]

Hw97kt amazing rifle for him

[@janrobertbos]

...air arms pro sport/wh 97...imho...

[@Bodhi504]

Hi guys it's great that you're doing a range in North Wales, but if possible could we see something different. There seems to be a trend nowadays for ranges to be shooting just from a bench. I'll be honest but this is getting a tad boring and really not something that would motive myself or my friends to do more that a couple of times. It's nice that you have some distance there but from what I see at the moment and I appreciate it's not finished, but apart from some great views and a decent distance there's not more that is being offered? I would love to see a area maybe just a wooded base where you could chose to go prone, sitting (on the floor), kneeing, plus some posts where you could also add in supported firing positions. Also it would be fantastic to have a 10 target course of fire where you could replicate Precision rifle discipline, shooting for different fire positions, shooting low down through restricted aperture's, off of barricades, off simulated roof tops (obviously very low down) etc. That would be something different. I could get behind that with a group of friends, just for practise or running it timed course of fire with a bit of healthy competition, thrown in, great for people with multi shot PCP's. Just my 2 pence worth, keep up the good work chaps, and you should get your father in law a TX200 ;-)

[@hotair4269]

Thank you for the comment :) There is an area where you can shoot kneeling or prone or off sticks. Between the two firing huts. In time the range will develop and we will certainly consider all and any suggestions to better the facilities

[@ianbath4776]

BSA, a bit lazy on this rifle

[@andycarruthers1]

Black? Just because it can be a smaller blank to start with without the cheek piece. Small margins but still a margin.

[@samsawyer2145]

My 98 with custom walnut stock is on guntrader now with brand new Hawke air max Bargain 😜

[@hotair4269]

Hahaha sounds nice

[@allanwilliams8403]

Any sign of the DRS yet?

[@hotair4269]

Hopefully today or tomorrow mate. I promise you i am continuously chasing.

[@GStone-jl1ov]

Get some airmaks guns on

[@hotair4269]

Definitely on our to do list

[@kerrywilliams9995]

Hw97k best gun

[@dazacan1]

hw97 for the father in law 🙂

[@nathanstupple3848]

All manufacturers these days doing the LTD edition watch maker are bad for it . Ltd gun were always Very Special . BSA are obviously trying to do this . The Wilderness edition is Sub grand gun say £800 tops be a great value thing . Not £1369.00. To expensive Cheers

[@hotair4269]

100% agreed mate

[@wills400]

Hw 98 range gun

[@martyn52]

What is the name of the shop please.

[@dgg7377]

I really like the black cheek piece, even on the legendary Daystate Red Wolf the cheek pieces don't match the stock! I have even had the cheek piece painted black on my red laminate Red Wolf, I like them that much! That said BSA have completely lost the plot!

[@user-mp7ij7eb7r]

Hello , where is the range going to be located ?

[@hotair4269]

Babell in Holywell

[@patthewoodboy]

I have been beqeathed a CLX pro ... it sh1te and is off to ratworks in an attempt to improve it as it owes me nothing

[@MrPitpilot]

The black cheek piece is the sole reason I went away from BSA 🤯 so glad it's not just me

[@martyn52]

It’s not really bsa anymore is it.

[@hotair4269]

Still made in the same factory in Birmingham, all be it owned by a Spanish company.

[@darrenstephens1147]

Can’t believe they’re supplied the wrong size mounts? No thought put into that ! I have an R10 which shoots nicely and I wouldn’t mind buying this gun but not interested in the package.

[@stvincents2007]

Can’t they put an air gun trigger set up on a rifle so you don’t have to keep bloody cocking it.

[@richardough5004]

Do you mean cock it once at the beginning of the magazine and then have a semi auto mode? AFAIK it's not legal in the UK for sub 12 ft lb air rifles. Only semi auto allowed is very low powered pistols, and the airsoft brigade. After that it's a rim fire .22 semi auto or nothing

[@ACshinealight]

BSA have been poor for 20 years. Cheap and nasty like all other things “British made”

[@christophersavill4785]

I'd love 2 see someone build a copy of a webley mk11 service but in pcp. Mounted with a small scope it would be the dogs

[@Nick-Antoniou]

TX200HC