Family's Expecting Us To Take Care Of Older Dependent Sister When Our Mom Passes r/Relationships

[@yque4733]

I have two siblings like this. Once our mom died, both I and my older sister told them they're on their own financially. Guess what happened? Our younger sister suddenly found a job and started taking care of her kids. Our brother found himself a girlfriend to mooch off of.

[@truthseeker9249]

Well at least your little sister managed to see the light.

[@khaleesireyna731]

I feel bad for whoever your brother shacked up with to mooch off of. Hope she realizes her own value.

[@MuDkipzCHancelLOr]

@Kelsey Harper In my line of work I see this a lot and they'll just go to a local church and beg for endless years and the dumbies will pay for their rent for a decade. Many of them are loser couples scamming together. Not saying that's the case... but birds of a feather.

[@OmniscientlyMe]

Jen: Family should help and support each other. Also Jen: Has never supported another family member financially at any point in her life.

[@chaudx]

Family should help...by family she means others helping her.

[@tinycrimester]

"paula said she cannot knowingly let jen suffer" why not? jen wouldn't return the favor if the roles were reversed.

[@crem-crem4070]

Story 1: the fact that she is so dependent on others is very likely a major factor behind her poor mental health and depression. Jobs/careers can give a sense of purpose and control that is very much needed, based on Maslows’ hierarchy of needs. Jen needs a purpose and structure.

[@usagi18]

As someone who was the potential financial sponge... this is absolutely correct. You have no idea how much happiness it brought me to see my own baby car (paid by myself, of course), when I found it hard to land a decent job for so many years.

[@maddydavidsdottir9862]

Not always, if you grow up in situations like mine where you have had to be self sufficient since a very young age (5 for me) working can be very traumatic and daunting. I've had a successful career as a nurse before medically retiring but the idea of going back to work, especially now my chronic illnesses have progressed to the point they have, I have actual panic attacks at the thought. It's got so bad with my anxiety, I developed agoraphobia. When I worked, I was living and working in norway (my home country) but in the uk I have so much against me, employers won't hire me as I am a risk to their insurance, they would have to pay out of pocket for or fight a lot of red tape to adapt work for my medical needs and wheelchair, I'm severely limited as to what jobs I can do as I am not a registered nurse in this country and I couldn't do half my job anyway as I am an ambulatory wheelchair user and when I don't use the chair, I use a walking stick. I would be financially worse off in work despite my medical benefits barely covering my bills. When you're hit with all those realisations all at once and you realise exactly how hopeless your situation is, depending on others and working, it makes your mental health way worse. It's not as easy as "just cut her off and force her to work" that will and can make things worse and no, I don't depend on my family, I'm no contact, I can just relate to ops sister (minus the narcissistic traits)

[@Callimo]

@@maddydavidsdottir9862 Well that's the thing. You were pushed into independence at a stage when you should have been able to depend on older people. So, I can see both sides to this in that yes, folks need to know that if everyone else was gone they could still manage for themselves BUT also be able to someone to fall back on in case it gets too much. In OP's sister's case, it seems that she didn't have the teenage urge to pave her own way and *always* fell back to mommy. And, unfortunately, mom never put up or held firm to any boundaries. So now you literally have an adult baby on your hands. OP's sister needs to be trained to do rudimentary tasks by herself and once she sees she can do those little things then move onto bigger responsibilities.

[@GiordanDiodato]

You ever try to get a job? It's not easy. A dozen applications and nothing

[@Callimo]

@@GiordanDiodato It depends on the area and what you want. A McJob paying like 12/hr are always looking for people due to their high turnover rate. It would be a start, and heck even have some isolated positions so sis doesn't have to interact with people.

[@FakePoison164]

i have a spoiled/ dependent aunt who is 30 ish, lives in a trailer house on my grandparents' land next to our house, she died 3 times in the hospital from extreme drug use after her body gave out in 2008 from liver failure from extreme alcoholism. grandparents always say, "you guys have to take care of her after we are gone. ".. they don't know we, mom, uncle, my siblings, plan to leave her to rot. Shes genuinely the worst person I've ever met, entitled, spoiled, racist, and homophobic. I'd have to write a book to explain everything. btw she is still alive, addicted to pain killers, and a mean ass women. i hate her and avoid her as much as i can, i yell at my grandparents how much i hate her, but im just the mean one..

[@takanuva_9355]

Sometimes you have to cut off rotting parts for self preservation

[@ComaLies225]

Holy crap do we have the same aunt? My aunt is a mean, narcissistic, lazy, spoiled woman who often asks for help but expects everyone to go out of their way to do things for her like we should be flattered to do so. She’s greedy, manipulative and for some reason thinks she’s Gods gift to the world and thinks everyone is envious of her beauty and intelligence despite the fact she’s dumber than a box of hammers and aging poorly because of her addiction to sleeping pills and other random meds. She’s notorious for projecting her feelings and accusations onto other people and has no problem swearing on her sons life. When she’s called out on her bs, she goes silent and has the surprised Pikachu face/deer in the headlights look. She never takes accountability because nothing is ever her fault. She’s vindictive and petty to the point she did some unforgivable things to my late grandma (but worry not, my mom bopped her in the head a few times because fuck her.) and she constantly looks for trouble. My mom feels obligated to help her even though she’s burned bridges with everyone in our family and never apologized for the stuff she pulled. I keep my distance from her because as much as I hate to say it, she brings out the absolute worse in me and I often get into screaming matches with her.

[@Callimo]

Yeah, when they get that bad, best to let them lead the isolated wilderness life they seem to want to lead.

[@khaleesireyna731]

As nasty as this sounds, I think there are some cases where it is acceptable to say "I don't love my [insert family member here]". Why on earth should I be expected to love someone who hurts me over and over again and refuses to acknowledge that and change? Why on earth is that acceptable. Sometimes, love isn't enough. And sometimes, we really need to acknowledge that there are family members we don't love and we are under no obligation to do so. Love and respect are earned/gained. They're not entitlements. I don't love my parents. They treated me horribly and I don't owe them love. Let's normalize not loving toxic assholes were unfortunately related to.

[@OmniscientlyMe]

Honestly, that seems like a lot cleaner emotional situation than the subtle, manipulative narcissism I grew up with. Just tell me she doesn't have any kids.

[@nicknitro86]

She's not dependent. She's spoiled.

[@immortalsofar5314]

Agreed. Won't look at low income housing and won't consider any job under $15/hour isn't mental illness, that's entitlement. I had 2 years of severe depression when I was forced to live with my parents but I got myself a van I could at least survive in. I never felt ready to get back into the workplace but I threw myself in the moment I felt I might, looking for an easy intro job to start slowly - money wasn't the issue.

[@MasterBuilderDragon]

And lazy.

[@Ospyro3em]

Yeah, when I read the title I thought she had a severe handicap- either physically or mentally. But nope, she's just been spoiled

[@kimsvisualdiary]

@@immortalsofar5314 yup. Insisting on living in bougie ass apartments and refusing to work unless she gets a job with a wage well above her abilities or worth isn’t mental illness. The mother is at fault for letting shit get this bad. And now the siblings are forced to pick up where mommy dearest left off. And the fact that the OP and oldest sister feel guilty for living their lives for themselves and not letting everything revolve around their entitled lazy sister just burned me up.

[@maheenahmed6653]

Yeah I thought maybe she had a disability or illness since that what dependent implies. Meanwhile I’m working with a client facing homelessness with his family who kept on asking for work, anything.

[@dandotvid]

OP needs to learn that you are NEVER responsible for how someone else feels.

[@samalvarez8776]

How is OP the selfish one when the sister is the one expecting everyone else to take care of her?

[@user-wr3vt8uq4s]

What a giant perpetual baby. Honestly, Jen will not change unless something dramatic (like being evicted) happens.

[@kbomb234]

See, I thought this was a disability story, not a financial sponge. Nah, Op. Tell her to buzz off

[@TheDarwinProject1]

Borderline personality disorder & bipolar disorder are disabilities though.

[@kbomb234]

@@TheDarwinProject1 let me rephrase. Her potential diagnoses, which the story doesn't explicitly state by the way, can be disabilities if unmedicated and unsupervised. That I fully agree with. The issue here, unfortunately, is that the sister has been conditioned to be helpless. The lack of boundaries and the expectation that she will be catered to no matter what have created the disability as opposed to the disability being there. If the sister struggled but was actively taking steps to improve, I'd say that yes, the people around her need to continue being her support system and helping her as she becomes more confident (even if she never becomes fully independent). But this is a mess created by their mother and possibly continued by the other sister. OP needs (and did) to stand up for themselves and place hard boundaries. If not for the sister's sake, for their own sanity.

[@deborahyoung1873]

@@TheDarwinProject1 its still no excuse to be a worthless mooch.

[@WaitingxInxSilence]

@@TheDarwinProject1 The sister has to want to change, but her family and therapist can’t force her.

[@haraldjensen3935]

Oh wow, Jen is so lost in her own ways, thanks to mom. It's definitely not right to put that burden on the sisters. Mom is the one who has failed all her daughters in this situation, and I don't envy them having to navigate the mess mom eventually will leave behind when she at some point passes away.

[@owl7072]

"I've always been there for them!" Yeah, when they had something you wanted 🤔

[@samalvarez8776]

I wanted OP to look at her and straight up ask "when" lol

[@MegaMegaman87]

@@samalvarez8776 lol

[@crackedporcelain2047]

The sister sounds almost (at least to me) like an addict that hasn't hit rock bottom yet. It's like she addicted to help from her family. But you can't make and addict quit, they have to want to. I wish OP luck, and I hope the sister actually wants to do what she said...

[@paulastiles5507]

She sounds exactly like an addict. She seems to be addicted to letting other people take care of her.

[@ScooterBond1970]

You certainly can't convince an addict to quit by continuing to give them the thing they crave.

[@PinkMarshmallows]

Story 1: I say, throw the "unwell" sister into a home. If she wants to act like that, then she's going to get that treatment. I have no pity for people who act like spoiled little brats.

[@leegraves8878]

She has to have a diagnosis of something before that can be done.

[@jacquiethebibliophil]

But "homes" cost a fortune. Even the bad ones. She would have to show some need to get Medicaid in order to be eligible for that. In some states it is easier but in the south, forget it. You can be really sick or physically unable to work and be turned down at least once or more. My brother died of a heart attack, after years of heart disease and smaller heart attacks, waiting for a hearing to reconsider his last no. We are in Texas. There is no physical or mental--as in mental retardation--reason for her not to be able to work. Short of serious mental illness, which is provable, and no one said that, she is not going to get assistance. I wonder who is paying for that psychologist. She is too old to be on her mother's insurance and how is she getting Medicaid to pay for it now. If it is a county thing based on need she would not be seeing the best.

[@PinkMarshmallows]

@@leegraves8878 Then let her ass be homeless. I'm so damn tired of people babying other people. It really gets under my skin.

[@TheDarwinProject1]

@@jacquiethebibliophil assuming she has borderline pd or bipolar, those are both SERIOUS MENTAL ILLNESSES that frequently prevent ppl from working. Disability, especially since she doesn't have many work credits, won't be enough to live on, though, & she will still need a lot of family help, both emotional support & financial, to avoid homelessness.

[@PrimateProductions]

Easier said than done...and someone still has to pay for it...🙄

[@Raaslen]

Story 1: Jen is using her depression as an excuse to do nothing, and as someone that struggles with the same problem I can say that the worst thing OP can do to her is to keep enabling her behavior, because as long as she doesn't need to do anything, she won't do anything.

[@erickaennis2738]

Jen is using her mental issues as a crutch. And for manipulation. There are people worse off than she is, but they manage well. Jen is going to run Paul into an early grave.

[@heatherv3417]

Story 1: you can’t help someone who doesn’t want to help themself. Until the sister wants to change, she’ll always be that way. Tough love is what she needs now, but it’s uncomfortable for both parties to do that.

[@floraposteschild4184]

What Jen needs is room in a group home, with people like herself struggling with "adulting" issues, and trained staff there to guide them. THAT'S the help I would give as a family member, not be a full time carer! Jen is never going to let go of leeching off her family otherwise.

[@KE-hr4sb]

S1: I learned the hard way you can't help someone that refuses to help themselves. She's not taking care of what she's able to, she's not honest in therapy, she doesn't even try. This bird should have been kicked out of the nest a long time ago. "Never set yourself on fire to keep someone else warm." Especially as, in the case of older sister, she has her own family that is actually dependent on her. "We should never not help each other! I've always been there for you!" How, pray tell? Jen has been nothing but dead weight and refuses to do anything for herself OR anyone else. Sure, family should help family that needs it. The difference here, is Jen *doesn't* need it.

[@kbf9644]

OP needs therapy herself because even her definition of selfish is warped. 😔

[@nikkiwhray1598]

It's amazing that Jen can see others as selfish. "I would be there for you" is such bs, coming from the person who is always taking. In reality, they HAVEN'T been there, because their situation renders them incapable. Plus, they prevent others from being there for you by using up all of the family's available resources (financial and emotional) with their own needs.

[@Loaves_of_Cat]

Jen is the toxicity in Paula’s house.

[@artistwithawanderingeye908]

I hardly use the word narcissist, but Jen is a narcissist that only thinks about herself and how others SHOULD help her. She wouldn't do the same for her sisters, and refused to see what the therapist was trying to say.

[@ttrev007]

I don't think she is necessarily a narcissist, she sounds like she has a lot of mental health problems and you become selfish when you feel desperate. When you feel that its the only option then you tend to ignore how messed up it is. But, she certainly needs to take step towards being able to take care of herself or she could end up on the streets, the sisters are not responsible for her.

[@shebakoby]

she only says she would (despite NEVER doing ANYTHING EVER, INCLUDING CHORES) so she can continue to be a leech, because she thinks she'd never even be in a position to actually "be there" for OP and the rest of the family in the way that Jen's mom is "there for" her. IDK if she's flatout NPD but Borderline can have narc traits too. Those cluster B disasters can overlap symptomwise.

[@ynmonroe]

Yeah, I love that she says she would help them if they needed it, while ignoring the fact that they "need" her to help herself. Doing so would help them all.

[@shebakoby]

@@ynmonroe they need to get her to prove to them she would be "there for them' NOW, by helping sick mom with chores. And tell her, if she does not help mom with at least chores, she is proving every day she wouldn't actually 'be there' for them.

[@ijornhribrudkrvir]

Yeah she genuinely doesn't seem to understand that family support is supposed to go both ways

[@damien678]

There's a reason it's called 'TOUGH love'. Coddling is the furthest thing from true kindness.

[@lydianelson7737]

So if the sister is gonna say “family need to support each other no matter what”, what is she doing to support her family? It sounds like a whole lot of nothing.

[@roseykitten798]

I actually shut this crap down in my family. My mom has 2 living kids, my older sister and me. From a young age my sister was spoiled because my parents lost a child before she was born, and she was born physically healthy with no early developmental issues detected. I was born with health issues that arose in early childhood. Ever since I was born my sister was favored by my mom's family because she had been treated a certain way since she was born. First grandbaby, first healthy baby, first to walk, crawl, etc. Theres 5 or so photo albums of her as a child. There's half of one for me. This continued as we got older because, apparently, I was "my dad's favorite" after the divorce even if we only saw him once a week. Spoiler, we just shared more common interests and my sister didn't like being treated equally with me and our much older half siblings. Fast forward to my mom rebuilding her burnt house. She decided to only build one room instead of two and claimed it was because I had moved out (I hadn't, the news of her decision actually sent me into a horrible place) and after the house was done which I helped them build while my sister didn't bother to lift a finger, my mom mentioned if anything happened to her. How she wanted me to share the house with my sister. I told her flat out that no. I wouldn't accept the property, I wouldn't carry my sister, and as far as I'm concerned my sister can take over as my mom's advocate when she gets old and I won't contest any of the decisions. Up to and including sticking her in a home. My mom shut up quickly after that, and every time it comes up I remind her my sister will be power of attorney and I won't lift a finger about it. My mom, realizing all her eggs are officially in one basket, has sort of deteriorated herself a little now.

[@Deedoof]

Assuming your family will take care of you is like buying a huge house before winning the lottery; it's a bad life-changing mindset.

[@TriXJester]

I have been around addicts my entire life, and I have come to accept that you can only help those who want to be helped, and only the ones who want to change actually will. No one is Sisyphus, you cant just keep pushing that rock up a hill, it's never going to reach the top.

[@BallinSloth]

Op didn't "give up" on their sister. Op's sister gave up on herself

[@dracawyn]

There can be a fine line between making accommodations and enabling. Making accommodations allows people with disabilities, disabling mental illnesses, severe addictions, eating disorder, etc. to not just live more comfortably but can also enable them to thrive. Enabling makes symptoms of most of the above mentioned instances far, far worse. OP's sister does pretty clearly need some accommodations given her issues. But this does sound a lot like enabling and codependency. (Though, the lens also might be slightly skewed because it also sounds like OP might be struggling with invisible child issues that stem from growing up in a household where one sibling has more severe needs than the other and this gets more attention).

[@dracawyn]

If she's incapable of working on any of these things, OP may want to look into adult care facilities.

[@didyasaysomethin2me]

This would be an eye opener for Jen IF people would stop indulging her demands to be mollycoddled the way OP did.

[@missingbobsburgers]

And they should do it before mom dies. At this point mom is the only one still literally killing heralded for Jen.

[@dharris2005]

I am in the same situation. My youngest sister is bipolar adhd depression, she turns 30 this year never worked a day in her life just receives SSI. My mom cares for her. My mom is worried who will take her if something happen. My older sister refuses to take her in. I told my mom “I will take her in but I promise you before her bags hit my floor I have enrolled her in a self sufficiency classes”

[@Riunlarose]

Story 1 I love how Jen says they need to take care of her cuz there FAMILY And that “she would do it for them” But won’t even get off the couch or do literally anything to relieve the stress of her off them so actually no you wouldn’t do it for them

[@Swnsasy]

I cannot, cannot stand when parents do this to the siblings.. "Oh, I know, I enable her sooo you guys are just going to have to as well." I'm sorry but no, no WE do not have to take care of a grown ass woman! Stop feeling guilty about this. She CAN, CAN take care of herself. If she doesn't want to take care of herself then tell her she can go live in a shelter and start learning how to pick herself up... I understand the guilt feelings, I absolutely do, I've been there!! It would be different if she was disabled but, she's not.. She is absolutely capable! You guys better write to Dr. Phil so he can be you guys, "emotional compass." lol...

[@pippo17173]

I feel this has golden child syndrome. Mom spoil her rotten and this is the result.

[@jjr9792]

I don't understand on why no one called Jen out? Every time she said "I would do it for for you", they should have demanded proof: an example of the last time she did anything for anyone

[@2Cambell]

My brother and I are going through this right now with our older brother. My dad passed several years ago and my mom has recently passed away. Our brother never worked and basically lived off of mom. Her will has everything split 3 ways, including the house, which has to be sold. Our older brother thinks that we should ignore the will, let him stay at the house and that my brother and I could just pay all of the bills, for groceries and his doctor visits. My brother felt responsible for our older brother, so this has made everything take longer and be much more difficult. Our older brother has been a complete pain in the butt through this process, by not moving out when he was supposed to, not cleaning up after himself, not keeping the yard cut, blatantly having stuff in the way when we come over to prep the house for sale and verbally lashing out and being hateful to me and my brother. So now, my brother is less sympathetic with him and finally hit his breaking point. Now, my older brother has to be out of the house by the end of the month. He has a place to move to, he just wouldn't do it before now. 25 days left!

[@MegaMegaman87]

sorry to hear that

[@2Cambell]

@@MegaMegaman87 It's going to okay. It'll continue to be ugly for 25 days and maybe for a while afterwards. But once that house is sold (homes sell fast here) and the estate is settled. It's done.

[@KCohere33]

I can’t imagine being so dependent on other people for everything when I know I can take care of myself. I would feel so much shame.

[@JohnSmith-xq1pz]

Sorry but Jenn needs a reality check

[@EMShelley]

Story 1: My parents did the same thing with my older brother. Long story short: Brother was the golden child and was enabled his entire life. Therefore he learned pretty early on that he could lie, steal, take advantage of others, and not have to put any real effort into anything because mommy and daddy would always be there to bail him out. After mom died, it only got worse, as my dad would continue to drain his savings and retirement funds to support his shit lifestyle, even though he knew he was being taken advantage of, as he would constantly bitch to about it to anyone who would listen, but ignored any suggestions to put his foot down and cut him off. Eventually, brother destroyed his body with alcohol and drugs and died in a horrific manner. Then dad followed a week after with his smoking and COPD. Leaving my sister, myself, and our very emotionally fucked nephew to pick up the pieces.

[@MegaMegaman87]

similar situation as well

[@MegaMegaman87]

im disabled but i agree Jen needs to get her ass in gear. even i work and pay rent ! i have a similar situation on my horizon too regarding my brother . i am worried i will be forced to care for my on oxygen brother when i have issues of my own if anything happens to my mother . im currently looking for a new job and a vehicle of my own as im the only one of the two of us who drives. so im planning my safety net just in case shit hits the fan.i plan to get in collage at 37 plus but i dont plan to be tied down much longer.

[@Kleomenides86]

Don't give up and keep fighting for yourself, change job and go to college....trust me, even if you decided to help your brother, you will get stuck in a difficult situation and regret it, even knowing you technically did the right thing. I'm 36, I have a genetic degenerative disease in my muscles and connective tissue called ehler-danlos syndrom, which has given me problems since I was 1 year old: in my country it's not recognized as a disability even if it is (it takes me twice the time and effort to do every normal taks, I have to rest frequently, I'm always in pain, I have tons of allergies and other problems and I have to go to physiotherapy and take medication that here you must pay by yourself) and my growth stopped at 16, only to restart at 26....I had to give up university at 22 to help my mum and then my dad, they both got cancer quite young and now mum is on a wheelchair and we cannot get any help due to covid (we must isolate since their immunitary system is severely compromised) and due to the fact they need a cargiver and housekeeper and those things aren't passed neither by the state nor by any insurance.....I know I did the right thing, but I regret it since it's tiring, time-consuming and frustrating and I never have enough energy to study after I have helpd them and taken care of the house....I felt I had to help because they spent a lot of money on my illness since I was borne. Now I have decided to restart college and told them, sorry, here is where I draw the line: I know you helped me a lot, but your situation could last for other 20 years and while I'm not sure I'll be able to finish my studies and find a job due to my condition, I'm 100% sure I will not be able to do anything if all my energies go towards you two. They get it but don't realize what it means practically since I have done almost everything for the past 12 years: I feel like shit, but I cannot live for someone else and never build my own life.

[@MegaMegaman87]

@@Kleomenides86 i feel your pain brother at one point i was living in a group home just vegetating and one night about 10+ yrs ago i decided enough no matter what happens from now on i need to push my self forward. this was before my brother got ill 4 +yrs ago . im plotting my escape plan right now out of this mess. and honestly today at 37 my birthday im tired of looking out for other people. i have spent since my dad got sick in the early 2000s till he died in 2016 caring for other family members. i need to get back on focus again it is time.

[@TheDarwinProject1]

Ew, that's even more gross hearing this ableist crap from another disabled person. You know not all disabled can work, right? Get out of here with your superiority complex of seeing those unable to worry as lesser than you or malingering. Disgusting.

[@Kleomenides86]

@@MegaMegaman87 Actually I'm a girl 😝 but you cannot tell by my nickname 😁 Yeah, you did a very nice and wonderful thing taking care of your dad (I'm sorry you lost him so soon) and relatives, but it's better to focus on oneself at some point and better sooner than later...if you don't do it now, you will only be free when everyone else will be gone and you would feel even worse because you won't have any set up future and no relatives anymore. And if you don't act now, you don't know how long will you have to wait for the situation to change and to have an opportunity to live your life. I guess for me it's even worst, not only because of my physical condition that doesn't allow me to work yet (but since even in my country remote working has become more normal, I have hopes) but also because women are kind of expected to take care of the family...nothing wrong with it if you have the time, health and resources to do it, it's wonderful to help others, expecially family...but one must draw a line at some point anyway. Happy birthday 🥂🍰 I sincerely wish you all the best for your future and all the luck possible for your excape plan.🤞May God keep you safe.

[@MegaMegaman87]

@@Kleomenides86 I am so sorry for the confusion! My apologies. But yes you have a wonderful one too

[@CreepyBlueAnimals84]

Dependent Sister: NOPE!!! She refuses to help herself or even try!! If she won't, she can figure it out on her own.

[@ashleystefanson6276]

My dad was like the sister in story 1. It took my grandparents loosing their house and having to move for my dad to finally leave.

[@only1one1me]

“I’d do it for you.” I’d call her out on that. “No you wouldn’t. You can’t even do it now. You know supporting you would financially wreck Paula, but you won’t even get a job at Mcdonalds.”

[@agnesblack1974]

OP: There are group homes that cater to these kinds of issues. I am bipolar and work HARD to be a productive, normal person. Its the results of many years of therapy, my parents working with me, and staying solid on my medications on time every time. You have to be willing to get better.

[@jodilewis5593]

This one hit very close to home. My 2 younger sisters and I were raised by a narcissistic mom and thus endured varying degrees of mental and emotional abuse. My middle sister(#2 from hereon) got pregnant at 17, and Mom forced her to give the baby up for adoption. She pretty much spiraled downhill from there. Every time she would get close to rock bottom, Mom would bail her out and taught my baby sis (#3) to do the same. I never would. I gave her as much emotional support as I could, but I would not enable her. Mom passed away in the early 2000s, and at that point #3 stopped speaking to #2. But, without mom to constantly remind her of what a "failure" she was, she got her sh*t together. And, she (#2) and I are closer than ever. OP should hang tough. Hopefully, her sister will get it. But, you cannot help someone who doesn't want to change. #2 and #3 are now reconciled too.

[@patriciaalastre2546]

Op has a responsibility with herself first, that shit “but faaaamily” is toxic and the therapist was telling them that yet they didn’t listen

[@broken_queer_but_fighting8589]

Whoever is reading this i send hugs and great vibes. Drink water, eat food, nap, take a break, take care of yourself gosh darn it. And if you don't I swear I will find you and keep you in a cottage and take care of you. 🤗🤗💜💜🤗🤗💜💜🤗🤗💜💜🤗🤗💜💜🤗🤗💜💜🤗🤗💜💜🤗🤗💜💜🤗🤗💜💜

[@tailsimp]

"Family helps each other!" Okay how are you helping your family?

[@MegaMegaman87]

Exactly

[@candiebarr6745]

I don't get how anyone could just expect their family to take care of them... even as a 10/11 year old I had started making plans to take care of myself when my mom died

[@emmullgn]

I am disabled, extremely. Legally blind and have 7 diagnosed chronic diseases. I am currently dependent on my mother, I've worked hard many years until my health got to the point where I couldn't. However, I'm now going to university so that I can get a job that I'll be able to physically do. OP and sister need to give other sister a reality check. Nothing else is going to work..

[@amandarose4469]

As if MacDonalds wants someone like Jen working there.

[@Josku2411]

Oop early and went berry picking today with grandma and i wish everyone could experience the pure bliss that is pulling off the sweaty rainboots,showering and putting on cozy clothing and then snuggling up by the PC or TV with a bowl of cranberries and homemade caramel sauce

[@bellegold2303]

That sounds awesome

[@Josku2411]

@@bellegold2303 Oh it is..the caramel is also hella easy to make if you ever get some nice fresh cranberries just get brown sugar and Double cream put equal parts of both(i made a big batch and put 5dl of both) and slowly simmer it in a pot while gently mixing it on low heat till it's well blended and thickish..then before taking it off the stove mix in a small bit of butter for a bit of extra shine and flavor and boom..homemade caramel sauce(added the crucial thing of mixing it while it simmers)

[@jennilynne1977]

I hope everyone is having a great day/evening/night! Peace, hugs and love to you all!

[@WhitneyDahlin]

‼️If they loved her they WOULD NOT support or pay for her or let her live with them. Period. End of story. She won't help herself because she hasn't hit rock bottom. She will NEVER change unless you guys cut off all financial support. If anything else could work it would have by now. Let her live in a women's shelter for awhile and she will start to learn to care for herself. At that point she HAS to there is no choice. You have to kick people like that out for their own good. The whole family is nothing but enablers and they made her the way she is. And they aren't helping by enabling her to be a helpless child. Force her to get her sh*t together by giving her literally no option but to do it.

[@albertgongora6944]

I'm just going to say this bluntly in all honesty I think the sisters just being lazy and I think she's just so used to their mother doing everything for them that it's a life she grew comfortable with thinking that she can always rely on this person to pay for everything that she wants and needs and she knows for a fact that a guilt as her mom is dying knowing this probably would know that the mom would be guilty enough to make her siblings be the ones to take care of her for next and look I could maybe get behind this person of they had like a very severe form of mental illness where they couldn't function in society or they had a condition of some sort that kept them from being able to actually do anything at all then okay fair game but this is not one of those situations the fact that there is information about the fact that the sister at one point could hold down a job says so much about the situation and says how badly the mom fucked up and I'm sorry to see it like that cuz I do feel bad for this woman and everything she sacrificed and I also feel bad for Op loss of losing their mother but the fact that even they have to acknowledge the fact that their mother is responsible for creating this monster really is on them and whatever happens with the sister all they can do is just move forward and let go I hate to say it

[@janglesthearsonist5265]

This would be easier to read if it wasn't the longest run on sentence I've ever seen! Punctuation could go a long way in getting your message across.

[@amberleeannalee1999]

She’s got failure to launch as they call it. Boomers often do this to their sons or the youngest usually. They usually have a personality disorder themselves if not just martyrdom. Mom sounds like a martyr and probably grew up in an alcoholic family. Enabling etc. it’s a sick family system

[@Nikephorus]

I have a cousin like this. He's 32 and still lives with his mom. He's only ever had 1 job for about 3 months. He just plays video games all day. Doesn't do anything else. My aunt and uncle got divorced recently because of him. My aunt just continues to enable him. Not sure what he will do when my aunt dies.

[@peteranon8455]

*knock knock*

[@topazcoyote5482]

Jen's attitude and behavior reminded me of a drug addict. Like all that matters is getting high, not getting better. I noticed that she projected onto the significant others of her siblings, saying they were the toxic ones. I wouldn't be surprised if she was attempting to isolate her siblings.

[@avaphynx]

I knew someone who was like the sister. I had to step away from them. They refused to do anything about it.

[@MGP2210]

I would love for Jen to explain how she has "been there" for the family she is draining of life and joy.

[@broken_queer_but_fighting8589]

Hey you yes you remember to take care of yourself gosh darn it, you are always valid, and I love you and care about you so please take care of yourself 💜💜🤗🤗💜💜🤗🤗

[@dandotvid]

"We're family and I would do it for them" No, you wouldn't. Because you aren't even doing it for yourself.

[@kristinewatson3702]

This story hit me in the feels. My so called brother was just like this and my parents enabled it. Flash forward to me taking care of our mother with dementia and him hindering and then abusive. It's an ugly position to be in but I had to get him out. It was emotional and also dangerous in my case. I hope OP can find peace with finding other solutions that don't involve them personally helping.

[@justinchristoph3725]

Story 1: That sister is that way because she was catered to all of her life. You would be surprised at how many people manage to get their shit together when they finally realize that no one is going to come and rescue them.

[@dolly15rox]

Last question really hurts because I can see her thought process and how shes using it to drag herself down. So, if a kid said something mean to another kid would you make them apologize? Yes. But, if the other kid had constantly hurt the first kid, name calling, taking toys, etc. And then the first kid says they dont want to be friends anymore, and the second kid came to you saying the first hurt their feelings, would you make the first kid apologise and be friends? I'd say no. Hurting someone intentionally, selfishly, or even just carelessly is more than enough reason to distance yourself. You dont owe anyone your time, attention, effort, or money. Not even your sister.

[@cm06c]

Wish we could’ve had a feel good story at the end. This was depressing and infuriating

[@k.a.4522]

If this is US, then Disability is Federal; and she will be denied the first time and then will have to apply again and then, if approved, she will get it.

[@nuyabuisness7526]

My parents made it clear that after hs the expectation was either be in college or working while saving up. Rent wasn't a concern, but forward motion was expected. I was working while attending school part time, and moved out at 22. I would have moved out sooner, but I couldn't afford rent and tuition in my area. I transferred schools, moved states, and am now making 50k per year with a nice room in a house and a paid off car. Compassion is good, but firm expectations are better in the long run.

[@ukchanak]

My husband's cousin is like this. He was spoiled his whole life, and then when he was 25 his mother died. He had dropped out of HS so no GED or diploma, never worked a day in his life and addicted to drugs and video games. The house was left to him but he couldn't afford the mortgage payments so it was repossessed. Now he lives in a homeless shelter and will probably not survive for long. It's sad but when you refuse to grow up, you must eventually adapt to reality or perish.

[@Giggl3z0404]

Taking care of yourself isn't being selfish. Wanting everyone to drop everything to take care of you is being selfish.

[@qnkendra1523]

As someone with a chronic condition that has struggled to get help with it... don't let your sister weaponize her condition. I push my loved ones who help me and others with chronic conditions to maintain their own health both mental and physical. I got so bad in part because I kept putting my own needs behind the needs of others in my life until my condition knocked me so far down I had to address them. For me I also have a lot of taught responsibility for other's emotions and actions so I owned the burden I was on them and took away their own agency in my mind. Now days even when it hurts I remind myself that others are responsible for their part in the relationships in my life and hurting myself mentally or physically doesn't help them. Many who were used to me setting myself on fire for their warmth find me selfish now but the ones who truly love me appreciate and accept that sometimes I just can't do things and that I have more limitations then most. that doesn't mean they put themselves in harms way to help me instead they support me as healthily as they can.

[@anniel3305]

I can so, so relate to this story - I feel this woman’s pain, her doubt, her guilt, but also just having reached the end of her rope with the utter nonsense of someone who cannot get out of their own way and causes 99% of their own problems. The sheer and utter loss of patience rips you up when you have a sister you love dearly, but just cannot take their utter lack of motivation to change, to even just try ANYTHING, even just baby steps to make things better. The fallback excuses - please, no one has a life that is all sunshine and roses - everyone faces physical, financial, emotional, and mental health issues in their lives. It does not absolve one of living, of trying to make a life for themselves. It does not give you the excuse to create havoc that the rest of the family must clean up behind you. LORD ABOVE JUST DO SOMETHING, ANYTHING to prove, even just to yourself, that you can. The emotions of guilt, anger, doubt in yourself for feeling heartless ends up making you resent the person you love. It makes you angry to the point of having zero patience and zero tolerance for their behavior. You even end up angry at yourself, not liking the person you have become because you feel so resentful and angry towards someone you are supposed to love. IT IS BRUTAL.

[@eileenhathaway1674]

Since FAMILY helps each other, then how exactly does Jen support and help anyone? She seems very fond of this phrase, so when , by her own definition, has SHE acted like Family? When has she done anything to be like her definition of family? Turn the tables, mention the word "burden", tell her she should be ashamed to be one (maybe too harsh). Tell her that she has to get this done before Mom dies, as after will be too late. She needs to make her Mom proud and not worried about her before she dies. THAT'S what family does.

[@Mia_or_Mika]

Jen is not (significantly) mentally or physically disabled based on the story. There's no reason other than laziness and being spoilt that she can't take care of herself. OP absolutely should not be made to feel guilty for refusing to enable her

[@emnorfolk5559]

I thought the first story was going to be about a disabled sister in which case it would have been nah... Nobody is under obligation to look after a sibling. Then I realised it was an "enabled" sister and it's 100% nta (except the enablers)!!!

[@pippo17173]

Already this family is freaking high and mother basically destroyed her sister livehood for being a doormat.

[@AndyyWithAY]

My heart does go out to Jenn. I have a friend with mental health issues around the same age. She really can't live by herself. A lot of the time she behaves "normally", but she does have her issues. But, she does have to help herself. Her mom has enabled her a lot. OP is not wrong to not want this to consume her life.

[@Nstachow]

I grew up in a household where it was expected of me to not have a life and to stay home and take care of my dad. They didnt want to help pay my bills but they also didnt want me to have a job. I no longer speak to my parents. You cant help people that dont want to help themselves.

[@dm9078]

This is not OP’s problem. NTA! If Paula wants to be a doormat that is on her and her husband. Hope OP doesn’t let them drag her down with them.

[@OZARKMOON1960]

This is much like the story of the brother living with parents a few days (weeks?) ago; the elderly parents moved to assisted living, sold their house and left him to his own devices. It had to be done. This is much like what OP and her sister need to do to Jen. Give her hard deadline and stick to it. Give her a little help maybe with assist from her Dr. with numbers to call, but no more monetary support. Most disability takes about 3-4 months, so that is Jen's hard end date. Either she can get off her duff and do it or she gets a ride to a shelter and her belongings put into storage for say six months. It has to be done.

[@saxmusicmail]

Jen will destroy Paula's family. She will use up all resources that should to to Paula's children. The added tension may very well cause a divorce. There is nothing that can be done for people like Jen. The best the family can do is to not let Jen destroy them all. Do nothing for her, no money, don't buy her groceries, don't pay her rent, don't pay any of her bills, and certainly don't let her move in with the family. It's hard. Such people as Jen use "we're family" as a weapon.

[@Kiarean]

As someone in a similar situation to OP's dependant sister, I've thought of an analogy that might help people understand what it's like (in my experience, at least) to have depression/anxiety.. It's like if you had three trains. Train one is normal and represents a normal person, there's a track it's on that helps it move and and there's an engine you feed fuel into to make the wheels turn. Trains two has no tracks and represents someone with a physical idsability - no matter how much fuel is fed into the engine it won't go anywhere, because it's lacking the tracks that enable it to move. Train three has no fuel and is of course our depression/anxiety sufferer - it has a track to move on and is a fully functional in theory, but no matter how much it might want to go or the destinations it might dream of visiting, there's no fuel to drive it along. In short, it's not neccesarily a lack of motivation that keeps someone with depression/anxiety from doing stuff (though don't neglect to insure they have positive motivation too), it's a lack of drive. Another common mistake is the use of negative pressure - telling someone they HAVE to do this and that, that they'll suffer for it if they don't; we already KNOW that and it just makes things worse, we are ALREADY suffering. Positive pressure and re-framing is more likely to work - telling them that they are strong enough to get through this and Do The Thing, that the follow-up and Horrible Things isn't true and we're almost all our own worst enemy especially when depressed. You'll also need to be gently persistent - don't take an initial no for an answer but do take stronghly insistent refusals (like 3+ times). They will have days that are better or worse than others, the important thing isn't succeed, it's to slowly do more step by step as they are able to.

[@peteranon8455]

Story 1. It's tough, but the best thing to do is literally nothing.

[@oakenshadow6763]

If you were raised to be responsible for other's feelings, than she was too. She hurt all of you. She needs to take responsability.

[@shebakoby]

OP, Paula, and the mother need to say to Jen, "Oh, you'd be there for us if we needed it? Hows about you PROVE it. Prove it by picking up the slack in household chores, for starters. If you don't, you will prove you never meant what you said about being there for us." Heck, the mother's already had a serious health scare, and yet Jen was NOT "there for her" by any sort of help.

[@khaleesireyna731]

That one commenter talking about how Jen might end up homeless and if OP knew what she was gonna do then? I have some experience there (but it's with my mother, but she sounds a bit like Jen). My mother treated me as an emotional punching bag, screamed at me, stole from me, and worse and for a year and half I kept trying to get her help. It finally took a therapist reminding me that I wasn't responsible for her for me to see it. And I realized that yeah, it does suck to have to keep your mother or sister away from you, but if they refuse to do anything, guess what? They'll drag you down, too and keep expecting more from you. That's your choice with those situations. You can't get them out of their own hell. You can either drag yourself into their hell and suffer too, or just walk away. Both are painful, but at least one of those isn't putting yourself through hell. I truly want to send as many virtual hugs as possible to the OP, because that kind of situation is awful and I wouldn't wish it on someone I hated.

[@shells500tutubo]

The term is Emotional Vampires. They use and use and then when you are sucked dry they discard you immediately and find someone else to use.

[@khaleesireyna731]

@@shells500tutubo pretty good analogy. Too bad a stake to the heart tends to be something that only works for Buffy and if anyone does it in real life it's "disturbing" and "attempted murder" and "messy". Jk of course. Don't stake the emotional vampires. Physical violence is never the answer to emotional violence. All jokes aside, great analogy.

[@janglesthearsonist5265]

Jen should move back in with her mom to become her caretaker. If Jen doesn't want to get a job then the least she could do is care for the woman who's given Jen everything in this woman's final weeks/months/years!

[@Callimo]

I dunno, with the way she can't even take care of herself, I can't trust her with someone in such delicate health

[@janglesthearsonist5265]

@@Callimo I've got a slew of mental health problems and ASD but I was still able to move back home to care for my mom when she was going through chemotherapy. She's helped me so much and as her only child I felt the need to give back to her. I mainly ate frozen meals before but I had my mom instruct me on how to prepare and cook some of her favorite dishes before she began getting weaker. I'm very pleased to say neither the cancer nor my cooking killed my mother and she made a near full recovery. I can see how the Jen not driving could be an issue but I'm sure OP and her responsible sister could pick up meds and give rides to their mother and Jen for doctor appointments. Uber is also a possibility as well as grocery deliveries.

[@Mewse1203]

Be kind, be safe and take care of yourself. Have a great day

[@Vipre-]

21:00 If the friend is hurting the kid and the kid starts pulling away which then hurts the friend's feelings the person ultimately responsible is the friend and the kid has no need to apologize or feel guilty.

[@virginiacrowder2357]

Depending on where your from, she may qualify for disability. My brother 5 mental disorders and it took me 10 years to get his started and my parents always took care of him and now I do.

[@KCCAT5]

I had a friend whose brother was similar to this girl. He had alcoholism he frequently found himself being thrown in jail and mom was always there to bail him out. When mom was sick sister had had enough. My friend gave her brother so many months to clean up his act and that when mom died she wasn't going to pick up the pieces for him well mom died and guess what? Brother picked up the pieces to his life and started to live right and do the right thing. Sometimes tough love is the best thing there is

[@lesleyboulant4053]

Jesus Christ, these people are at the, “we need to call Dr. Phil” phase

[@MartiniGabu]

I have depression, anxiety and adhd with a lot of sensory issues. I've been there were I used my mental health as an excuse for my actions and not being able to do some stuff. It took me a lot of time to change that mind set but It is possible, you need a good support system and the most important thing is wanting to get better. Im a Child therapist who works with adhd and asd kids and My journey actually helps me to understand and help kids to deal with there issues before they got out of their hands. People with mental health, especially kids, needs patience but also needs really strong boundaries, they do need to be called out on their actions and they nees calls to reality. I hope everything gets better for the sister cuz I know is not an easy journey.

[@Bloodshewolf]

Gods, the first story reminds me so much of my family.

[@FlamesofJagger]

Waaafffllleee Gaaannnnggggg!!! Take care and have a good day/night wherever you are. Much love all.

[@kbf9644]

Two of brothers were Jens. 14 years between them. You’d think Mom would have learned the first time. She did not. I turned my back on both of them and while I didn’t like what my brother’s life was I didn’t feel any guilt. All responsibility, obligation, even basic empathy I had had long since burnt to cinder. They were anchors. I refused to pick up the chain and tie it around my waist.

[@shells500tutubo]

Amen!

[@kbf9644]

@@shells500tutubo I haven’t always drawn my boundaries so well in life. But I tell you what, those two sure made it easy. 😏

[@sabrinahinton1774]

Story 1) If the mom has been ok with being used thats her problem. She created a monster and at sometime in life you've to be responsible for your actions. If threw out there you either sink or swim. I'm not putting nobody over my kids and the sister need to put her family first. I'm surprised her husband is ok with their money being spent on the sister like that. She isn't crazy she has adapted to her surroundings and taking full advantage of the situation. Why should you set yours on fire to keep someone else warm family included. Maybe she needs to be homeless maybe that's the reality check she needs.

[@emerald6182]

I've got a sibling like this too. My parents do everything for him, and he has done nothing to better himself. I've already said that I'm not taking care of him when they go. I don't have the means, and he doesn't live close. Maybe that makes me selfish and terrible, but I can't just pay for his shenanigans while trying to take care of myself and my kiddo.

[@W0lfscythe]

If my dad didn't pushed me to be more independent. I would be an dependent mess of a leech.

[@lexawatson2295]

I also have a "Jen" in my life too. People like Jen are summarized by the phrase "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink" it's infuriating and I can see what OP keeps trying to explain. It's not the lack of resources it's the lack of effort and pure stubbornness on Jen's part.

[@amandab8433]

Last Story. Is EXACTLY my husband's family. Three of his brothers never left home, never had real jobs, aside from maybe yard work for the neighbors if they really needed money, and were fully supported by their mother until she passed away. So you have three men in their 50's and early 60's who thought they would just be able to continue to live in the family home and everyone would support them. Well the house was sold, money divided up, and that was that. They finally realized that no one was going to support them, and the money they received ($100+k each) was it. Surprise surprise, they actually figured it out and went in together to purchase a rual property with a house on it. Whether they can keep it is up to them. There was NO WAY I was having them live with us, even though we had three empty bedrooms. We did that earlier in our marriage and it was a disaster.

[@DarkCrystalSage]

Show your sister 1000lbs sisters - specifically the Slaton Family Vacation episodes. The entire family is done with Tammy. This is essentially what you're going through OP, say "You are a mother to your kids, you are not Jen's mother." Tell Jen to get her ass in gear if not then leave her in a home if she refuses. Do not put up with it.

[@vagrantmessiah]

I can relate to this on a personal level, I have an older sister (I'm 43m and have 3 sisters, 31f, 37f & the sister I'm talking about 44f) who hasn't even LOOKED for a job or ANYTHING that people of her age do in the last 20+ years. Our parents (mid 80's m fatter and mid/late 70's f mother, divorced) coddled her to the point of complacency and when they pass it will be expected that she'll leach off of us siblings (my other sisters have 8 kids between them, while I have none), I make the most money of my siblings but also the most strained relationship with all of them and in the event that the worst happened wouldn't even start the conversation unless she had at LEAST held a job for 6 months and showed signs of self-reliance.