Fanatec CSL Pedals vs Thrustmaster T-LCM | Load Cell Face-Off

[@Standby4titan]

a little hack for the fanatec csl and csl elite pedals: swap the throttle and the clutch pedal if you want more resistance on the throttle and dont mind a very light clutch/

[@ChrisHaye]

Very good point! I'll pin this for visibility.

[@ChrisVmovie]

Thats a great advice. will keep that in mind.

[@theoopsdrivers]

As soon as my loadcell pedal arrives, I think I will use the current break as clutch and the clutch as gas :D we will see.

[@MenniePlay]

T-LCM, I swap spring of clutch and gas too.

[@ThePutnz]

yep, I did this on the 1st day for my CSL Elite pedals too - much better.

[@ptpracing]

I have the T-LCMs and would agree that 100kg is too much for the stock springs. I used to have them reach 100% when the pedal bottomed out, roughly 75kg using 2 reds and max washers. Eventually with the aid of a 3d printer some TPU and Tinkercad I designed a replacement for the lower spring that really helps make it feel more realistic and the pedal never bottoms out so I can run 100kg. I think I am still only using 80-85kg as running it any higher wears my leg out in even a short race.

[@ChrisHaye]

Ah, that's very interesting. Could you share a picture perhaps? I've not printed in TPU, how does the structure handle the load? I presume 100% infill!

[@phaedrussocrates7636]

so, if I may inquire, is there an adapter to let you use Thrustmaster pedals with DD Pro? Logitech pedals also? Thanks

[@matteomorellato1004]

@@phaedrussocrates7636 Simply connect pedals to an USB port, they're standalone. Logitech needs Leo Bodnar's cable that convert the logitech port to a standard USB

[@phaedrussocrates7636]

@@matteomorellato1004 Thank you, but I can't do that on PS5. But there were always adapters for me to connect old Fanatec gt3rs base to Logitech pedals... or Thrustmaster TGT to those same pedals with Ricmotech adapter... So I wonder is there something like THAT

[@TheInsaiyan]

@@ChrisHaye kzbin.info/www/bejne/hZ6kYmSCgcZsj9E Sim Racing Corner has a good video for a simple and very cheap DIY solution

[@givemeajackson]

Good comparison. I'm on t-lcms and swapped one of the springs out for a very soft skateboard bushing. Feels incredible now, much more resistance, and no hard stop anymore like before if you've completely compressed the springs.

[@krakentortoise7531]

Great video Chris! These are 2 highly compared pedals and I'm happy to see a video on it so quickly

[@ChrisHaye]

Thanks man. I wanted to include the T-LCM in my review of the CSL Load Cell, but I couldn't get on in time.

[@Lyxess]

I got the T-LCM because they were 160 euros when the CSL pedals where 220 euros. Thats quite a difference and then i just spent 10 euros for some rubber bushings to replace the springs in the T-LCM and it feels amazing!

[@IronManPeter]

Could you show which you have bought?

[@pablovi77]

Well, most of the world can’t actually choose, Fanatec is not available in 90% of the world. So we’re stuck with TCLM pedals, that I love, but they’re the only pedals I’ve used since the PS2.

[@MrMarmmalade]

Mostly to represent real life brakes better

[@Tropid166]

is it just me or are your latest videos all a bit out of sync?

[@nanoghg]

I think is a voiceover thing it's honestly hilarious once you notice it 🤣🤣

[@Daz5Daz]

Love this guy's content. Always superb.

[@jzyyz]

The point of the right angle protrusion on the T-LCM is to reduce the mechanical advantage by extending the lever length. It more closely matches the distance from the fulcrum to pedal compared to the CSL. The stock springs are definitely a weak point on the T-LCM but can be replaced cheaply with skateboard bushings/rubber spacers or even other materials you might have on hand, for those who have the will and resourcefulness. The CSL are probably more convenient and better out of the box, but the T-LCM have a higher performance ceiling with some tweaking.

[@poorfarmertv1116]

can you elaborate more on your comment? I like what you are discussing.

[@joesyrnichenko8156]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned aftermarket elastomer spring replacements for the TLCM pedals (such as 3drap offers). It makes a massive difference in pedal feel while retaining adjustability, ultimately negating any advantage the fanatec pedals have

[@MitchGP]

Love the videos mate

[@rjcraft18]

Chris Haye seems like such a chill dude.

[@ma14.27]

Keep in mind you can buy a polymere mod for the T-LCM for about 20€. You can also get Rubber Spacers instead for less. I upgraded mine a few days ago with Shore A45 and A38 Rubber Spacers, It cost me 20€ and makes a huge difference, now they have a much more progressive feeling without the sudden stop when you hit the max compression of the spring. My lap times in ACC went down for a few tens.

[@stefan-georgfuchs9618]

-Hi, interesting comparison. I don't own the Fanatec pedals but the T-CLMs since about 4 months now. I am in my rig ( Motedis ) around 2 - 3 hours a day. I also use the Fanatec CSL DD 8Nm with the McLaren GT3 wheel. I can only say, that the upgrade from "Normal" pedals to a loadcell was a massive step forward. I tried the T-CLMs with various settings of springs and washers and adjusted the pedals with the calibration software from TM ( connection via USB, not through wheelbase ) . I use the pedals with 5 different sims ( AC, ACC, AMS2, R3E and rF2 - one for each workday ;-)) ) I also "drive" different types of cars from GT1, GT2/GTE GT3/4 , Formula 3,2,1 recent and vintage as well as prototypes. So I found theres a range of different strength and ways of braking necessary to drive all these different cars. It's not just slapping a ton of weight on the brakes and push against a wall of steel...modulation is, as you said, the name of the game. I can only say that the T-CLM has been through a lot of hefty footwork for the last couple of months and are still as stable as a rock. Nothing has bended or broken. No screaching or worn out parts. I have set them up now in a way, that I can feel the brakes in all my sims with my large left toe. Also the throttle pedal offers just enough resistance to allow a smooth push down and / or release with out backsnapping. So all in all, I would buy the T-CLM pedals again as they offer a great value for what they cost. As much as I like the Fanatec stuff, I am not really a "Fanboy". I really like the CSL DD but it was more of a luxury purchase as my TM TSXW was almost as good for most of my racing.

[@lil_lemonade_03]

Is it worth upgrading to DD from the Tsxw?

[@stefan-georgfuchs9618]

@@lil_lemonade_03 Good question. Difficult to answer. What is "worth" in your eyes ? I drive almost 3h a day, have a sim-rig and "consume" sim-cars like others their trousers. But even then, from a pure racingpoint of view, a CSL DD alone doesn't make you faster. I explained it earlier by saying it is not better or worse then a TSXW. It is different. 8Nm vs 6.5Nm is not a world of difference in strength. I ran the TSXW on 100% in ACC and run the CSLDD on 70% because the direct drive delivers it's power more direct. I also have to see the complete unit : wheelbase and wheel. For GT racing with cars up to early 2015 models, the TM combination I had made perfect sense and brought tons of fun. For very MODERN Formula, GT and Prototype cars, the CSL DD and a formula or new generation GT wheel ( i.e. McLaren GT V2 ) is the way to go. So it highly depends on your individual requirements. If you have only the TSXW, I would first go for a stable rig with a good seat and loadcell brake / pedals before taking a DD. Especially the latter will help more to make you faster. Then go for a very good, fast monitor ( I use a 43" UWD curved from Asus ROG ). Then perhaps for VR and then think about a DD AND a good wheel as well.

[@lil_lemonade_03]

@@stefan-georgfuchs9618 id consider myself a pro sim racer. Was on the Tx for a few years and got the Tsxw 2 weeks ago and will be getting the csl dd pro on Saturday. I just want it to be worth the upgrade. I have a wheelstand and seat. Tlcm pedals… TH8A shifter. 2 different wheels. I just want a DD because of all the talk I hear about it lol. But it needs to be worth the upgrade. I’ll be getting the boost kit and Loadcell brake with it as well

[@stefan-georgfuchs9618]

@@lil_lemonade_03 It will be worth the upgrade. Use Fanalab recommended settings for the driver and ingame setups of the wheelbase to start with. In case U drive F1 games 2020/2021, you need 350 degrees wheel rotation, not 360 as recommended. ACC runs on 900 or 1080. Just make sure you use the same in the driver and in the sim. Most other sims run well on "Auto" as the ingame settings are selected by the sim. One point to mention : Fanatec CSL DD and the wheel use already two slots in most controller setups of sims. Pedals use a third. You might need to check the best way to assign all devices in case the sim does not recognize them in one go. Best way is then, to unplug the pedals before setting up and calibrate the wheel. Then assign all buttons, save, leave and re-open controller-setup and plug in the pedals USB connector again. This procedure worked for me quite well in ACC, AMS2, rF2, PC2. Raceroom recognized the full setup immediately...

[@lil_lemonade_03]

@@stefan-georgfuchs9618 sweet thanks for the tips

[@mindofmyown333]

Do you think the T-LCMs would be best for someone racing in an office chair? The CSL-LCs are nice but I’m worried they might have too much resistance for my chair

[@givemeajackson]

The t-lcm tip over if you brake hard, even if you put them against a wall. Imo not useable unless you mount them to at least a big wooden plank on the floor. Which is a perfectly good option for a desk setup btw, grab a wooden board, screw a 2x4 on the end of it, bolt your pedals on there, and then hook two wheels of your office chair over the 2x4. Boom, cheap ass "sim rig" and no more rolling away from your brakes.

[@bartonez123]

I think the CSL pedals are the clear winner in terms of quality, but it's reasonably easy to find big deals on Thrustmaster products (due to their wide prominence through many different stores). It's pretty common to see as much as 40-50% off their stuff if you dig hard enough. Whilst the list prices sometimes make the products pretty comparable, in the real world they kind of sit in entirely different price ranges, which can make them hard to compare, and make the choice much more personal to the individuals budget and expectations.

[@TheDabbinDave]

Too bad the CSL can’t be used with my T500 in GT7 :( The the steep angle of the TMs faces affect your ankles at all? I was using my T500s in the inverted orientation in GT6. I didn’t use my wheel much at all for GTS. Im definitely not in racing shape like I once was. So, I’m thinking about flipping them. Because of how I had to have the pedals hard mounted to the pedal plate, I can’t just flip ‘em and press the buttons. I’m doing some research.

[@jamesgrant4227]

And here's me having just bought a set of V3's with the BPK and wishing I hadn't wasted my money and just stuck with my T-LCM's! Hoping it is just teething issues!

[@DavidGarcia-oi5nt]

It will not be teething issues, the V3s have always had issues

[@SSmallwood]

@@DavidGarcia-oi5nt ive been eyeing some v3s and havent seen any problems in reviews, whats the issues with them? not saying there arent id just really like to know before i drop money on a set of nice pedals

[@rekt4guud134]

Elastomer on CSL LC seem to be very hit or miss in terms of squishiness from what i can gather online and when i compare some videos to my pedal. Yours seem VERY soft compared to mines, with all my weight on it the pedal barely has any travel and at 100% on the software i max out the LC. Had to swap out 2 elastomer for a blue spring to get it to feel decent for me. Also went with the racesimengineering clutch and throttle upgrade, it's a really great piece of kit for them instead of upgrading to V3s.

[@jeremywrc889]

Serious guys, I have the tlcm, explain to me how the clip behind it, although it is too big, can be connected to the CSL DD base.???

[@bradpaca]

Did Fanatec include all the add-on kits to make them a fair comparison....? Got to have the add-ons...!

[@SonNY3600]

Any T-LCM mod recommendations? or videos how to setup them to have the best braking performance

[@alpha007org]

3drap.

[@peterrod444]

ApexV2R brake mod

[@jamesgrant4227]

Sim racing corner have a video showing a cheap and easy way to upgrade the T-LCM's using skateboard bushings! Worked well but did cause a fair bit of flex in GT Omega Art!

[@PistonBrokeGaming]

@@jamesgrant4227 yup, i use that mod, and i love the brake pedal now.

[@ChrisVmovie]

Great review, I did order the GT DD pro. So I’m very curious how it will compare against the T300 with the T-lcm pedals I use at the moment. One cheeky question, the upgrade pedal plates what kind of bolts do they use? M4 or M5? I ask this because my father in law has a metal construction factory and going to make custom made plates for me ( some nice personal logo on it )

[@ChrisHaye]

Custom pedal plates.... now that's a good idea! I'm not at the studio to check at the moment. Could you drop me an email (link in video description) to remind me and I'll check for you tomorrow.

[@SSmallwood]

man i just went from the t300 to a dd 8nm, youll love it!

[@Frihman]

I've used the T-LCM unmounted up against a wall and for that they work excellently with less resistance and more customisability than the CSL elite pedals. I haven't used the Fanatec CSL loadcell pedals, but I imagine they wont work as well unmounted as the T-LCM. If anyone plans on using these unmounted, keep this in mind!

[@saltyitalianguy3243]

you literally haven't used the other pedals, that should automatically disqualify you from comparing them.

[@Frihman]

@@saltyitalianguy3243 For what it’s worth, I have used the old CSL Elite pedals without a loadcell. It was stiffer than the T-LCM pedals and CSL Elite pedals didn’t work as well because of their stiffness when unmounted. Not saying that the T-LCM pedals are better, just putting it out there that a less stiff pedal could be better suited for unmounted use. It’s worth keeping in mind for someone who is looking at one of these sets.

[@saltyitalianguy3243]

@@Frihman eh i guess that sorta makes sense

[@SSmallwood]

you can adjust the load cell in the software to 10% of 18kg (its weakest setting for the elite)

[@DJDiarrhea]

So let me get this straight. You use a loadcell to brake using pressure instead of distance, right. But wouldn't you want a static pedal then? Aren't you still braking with distance when you're compressing the spring to load up the loadcell? So why not just put a heavier spring in a poti brake and call it a day? Seems to me like it would archieve the same goal.

[@tommynott4310]

Does anyone know a good mod for the T-LCM? There must be some good aftermarket springs or system to change it up.

[@monoxidedark]

Use a red spring and then replace the other spring with a couple skateboard bushings. It's cheap and easy and greatly improves the feel and performance of the brake pedal.

[@ChrisVmovie]

I never used them, but I know that 3Drap.it sell’s spring upgrade for this pedal set.

[@peterrod444]

The ApexV2R brake mod is very good. They ship worldwide from Canada

[@bfife22]

ApexV2R and Nox3d mods both improved the feel dramatically

[@LupusAries]

@@ChrisVmovie I have that for the T3PA-PRO in my T500 pedals and I rather like it. Good pedal off feel good on pressure feel, has improved my braking a lot over the G27 with GTEYE sprungs I had before.

[@joshuachan8203]

Are the v3s worth the price which almost double the price of the csl pedals？ Deciding on which to buy

[@piereligio_mods]

I think the CSL v2 are clear winners, but to be honest I might make a use of the 75% springiness? I mean, I want to have a good kart pedal feeling (I'm making a rental kart mod for AC) and they actually have the same feeling. You get a springy part, and at the end of the travel you can vary the pressure further with the pedal barely moving. Now I'm confused lol

[@laulen3448]

Really good vid, I was really hesitating between the two pedal sets and I kept going back and forth between which one to get. Well that was 2 weeks ago but I went "fuck it imma get the clubsport V3s instead", just got them yesterday :P

[@ChrisHaye]

Good choice man, they're a level above. I still have my V3s, now around 4 years old, and a little worn looking, but working like new :)

[@tomchamberlain4329]

Hey might seem like a naive question, but are the Fanatec CSL Load Cell pedals compatible with a T300RS wheel? I have the standard t300 pedals and they are shite. From reading online it seems the fanatec pedals are the better suited upgrade to my situation, but only if they are compatible!

[@terrylu4894]

I don't know why but thrustmaster always uses springs too soft to many people's liking. Not only for TLCM, but also for the TSSH handbrake mod. I really don't know the reason, I mean does harder spring cost much more? XD

[@Arkkis27]

TLCM pedal are not made for simrigs and are tailored to be used with wheelstand/on the floor. If they had harder springs in the box, people would struggle to use them. That being said I have those pedals with red springs (the hardest) on wheelstand against a wall (so it wont move) and those are just hard enough to get the right brake pedal feeling.

[@WOES888]

Tmaster load cell extremely customizable. i have a rubber boot off truck shock absorber on mine it was free and feels amazing.

[@thatonespot5878]

Question are you using them on the fanatec wheel or do you have to Switch the wheel base

[@jase874]

Am I right in thinking : either manufacturer are only compatible with their own wheels anyway? i.e. Fanatec pedals only work with Fanatec wheel?

[@PistonBrokeGaming]

Dunno about the Fanatec pedals, but the T-LCM pedals are also USB and work with any wheel.

[@Blerpa]

A friend uses the Fanatec pedals of a CSL Elite with a TM T300, so it seems they are functioning on other manufacturer wheels.

[@flowsy5294]

Fanatec pedals you can use with any wheel.

[@caaarlos]

I've seen cheap mods with elastometer on the TLCMs, would that make more comparable? My frustration is not being able to try stuff out where I live.

[@OsirisPL]

Keep in mind that this review is from a guy that wears shoes with hard soles and obviously has a preference for very stiff pedal. I tried both and for me Thrustmaster was much better. The brake feel was good because I had some pedal movement range while using moderate force. Also pedal face is more comfortable as it's wider and higher and doesn't bite into the sole of your foot. If you race in socks and prefer pedal force similar to road car (nor formula race car) then I would suggest trying out Thrustmaster.

[@DavidGarcia-oi5nt]

But race car pedals are hard.. I never cared for my tlcms even after modding them, they bottomed out way too easily and it barely felt any different to the G29 potentiometer pedals. Finally got a nice set of pedals and its night and day (Simagic P2000 pedals), I can now finally modulate my braking force and its made driving much more precise and consistent.

[@lawrenegummy4736]

Shoes or not, a race car has hard brake pedals. So what you say doesn't really make sense imo.

[@DoWorkNP]

I went from using the TM300 with tlcm for 2 years to the gt dd pro 8nn bundle with the load cell and was blown away by the difference in pedals. I thought going to the dd pro from tm300 would be the biggest difference but it wasn't. The fanatec pedals with loadcell kit compared to my old tlcm pedals blew me away.

[@mrj3217]

Fanatec DD for Ps4 drops suddenly we get new old pedal reviews for Fanatec. How does the too teor fanatec compare to the T LCM pedals?

[@Daisudori]

Hey Chris a question for you: When u do the pull test with the 30kg brake on the Fanatecs, is that also maxing the loadcell in them when set to 100% in the software?

[@Steve30x]

You can modify the T-LCM brake pedal very cheaply to feel like or better than the Fanatec pedal.

[@richardmiklos]

How?

[@IronManPeter]

Yes how ? 🙂

[@D1CE579]

Can I use the existing CSL brake pedal for as the new clutch pedal if I buy the loadcell upgrade pedal?

[@ranakirti]

TLCM , Brakeforce Settings help. Hi, I have set Brakeforce at 0 on tlcm. But i still find it too hard to get desired braking. i would prefer for it to be easier than 0 to get 100% braking. Is there a way to reduce this below 0 or change any other setting, so i have to press the brake with lesser pressure/force to get up to 100% braking....? Thanks.

[@kecimalah]

Then you probably need pedals without loadcell.

[@patenaten5128]

This makes me feel bad as I bought the Tlcm pedals few months ago for a better brake feel. I can relate to the weird 75% load. It made me crash into people online in braking zones while I brake in the exact same spot as usual. It seems I should have waited and bought the Fanatec kit

[@ChrisHaye]

We've all been there Peter! It's usually with computer equipment for me, always immediately outdated. The T-LCMs have a lot going for them, and I think they would benefit greatly from one of the elastomer bushing mods made by third parties. But, I've not tried for myself yet.

[@patenaten5128]

@@ChrisHaye true, that's always the case. Doesn't take away the pain though 😉 do you have an example of such a mod? I love the video by the way, good stuff!

[@MelfjeProductionS]

@@patenaten5128 Well I have the same, I bought the TLCMS a couple months ago but i'm not sad. The CSL loadcell are probaly always out of stock like the rest of fanatec, and the customer service from fanatec is really crap. If something happens with my TLCM I can safely return it to the store I bought it and get a RMA with no problem. And they are 40 euro cheaper. On the EU website the CSL are now availible on March 14, 2022. Like come on man...

[@PeatCowman]

I replaced the bottom spring with a rubber test-tube bung. It cost £2 and works nicely.

[@LupusAries]

Have you tried the 3drap brake mod for it? I have the one for the T3PA-PRO and it works nicely, really improvedy laptimes over my old G27 pedals with GTEYE springs and the conical as well as the T500 brake mod.

[@magnusenamd]

why aren't there hanging pedals? or should you have pedals you had on cars 100 years ago?

[@PresidentScrooge]

You should consider reviewing the moza SRP at the very same pricepoint.

[@lopez69lyon]

Hello, is it possible to install the Thrustmaster tlcm crankset on the fanatec gt dd pro base to play on ps5? Thanks

[@nicechasinchasegods7051]

Question: if I'm using these on PS4 can I still use the computer software to calibrate the pedals or does it not matter since I'm not actually using a PC? I play gt7 alot some Assetto but GT7 doesn't allow for wheel or pedal calibration besides FFB

[@FretFreak02]

Interesting review. I’m wondering though, can you use the Fanatec pedals on a Thrustmaster T-GT II base? I’m looking to upgrade my stock pedals to a load cell one, but I rather fit the Fanatec because I can leave out the clutch on it (which I never use). The Fanatec two pedal configuration, which can be spaced apart as well, just seems perfect for me but I don’t know if it fits the servo base.

[@bridgetring2839]

You have to use the usb connector that comes with the loadcell kit for that. It won't allow your setup to work with games that don't allow multiple controllers active (typically older titles from pre-2010) but can be used perfectly fine in games that do. Just connect the pedals to your platform of choice, separately to the wheelbase.

[@semmelboesel]

I'm playing on PS and PC. Does anyone know if I can use my T GT with a Fanatex pedals? Just PC or on both systems or does this not work at all?

[@wolo]

Do the Fanatecs work standalone as well? Can one use it with, like, t300?

[@duanebusch72]

i have had both the Thrustmaster throttle is terrible. i could not get used to the angle. it needs to be hinged from the bottom. i preferred the thrust master as delivered brake pedal. also, the clutch pedal pressure but the throttle is so bad on the Thrustmaster, that it was a deal breaker

[@09monos]

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but are the V3 that much better than these two? I own the TLCM that we’re enough on my old Playseat challenge, but now that I have a Simlab gt1 evo, the brake feels way more lighter. As said by others, it’s easy to press the brake full 100%. The new CSL are on its way, but don’t know if I should sell them and get the v3

[@rorigillmore141]

but does fanatec work with thrustmaster on ps5?

[@rekt4guud134]

no

[@walterswdf2]

Thanks, Chris! Do you have an opinion on whether I can use my existing T-LCM with a Fanatec CSL-DD and Xbox One? Would I need a Drive Hub (e.g. Collective Minds or similar)? Cheers,

[@Maverik770]

I know you asked this months ago but for console you may need a hub. It seems consoles and even some games on PC (Forza Horizons) don't detect multiple input devices. Since your 2 devices aren't part of the same eco system and the pedals don't plug into your wheelbase, you will likely need a hub to tie them together into a single device to use on console. Now on PC you could just plug them both in via separate USB plugs and most games would be fine with them as separate input devices.

[@lancetaylor6647]

I got the csl pedal and getting no way near the travel you get

[@s_n9210]

Both are pretty evenly matched, Just get whichever's cheaper and readily available. As a T-LCM user I am disappointed by the fact that the brake pedal is so easy to depress 100%. A set of elastomers and packers would cost TM practically nothing to include in the package.

[@stefan-georgfuchs9618]

Put the washers in the pre-load spring and use the red springs. Loadcell measures pressure, not distance of pedal pressed. 100kg Cell = 40kg pressure. Set pedal at 100% in the calibration software....more power then necessary for any of the sims out there.

[@s_n9210]

@@stefan-georgfuchs9618I keep getting told that, as people assume I haven't tried using the red springs or preload. The red springs are pretty weak, so the brake pedal still feels pretty flaccid and the easiest way you can change it is if you get uprated springs or elastomers. I think people that say the red springs are strong enough are probably experiencing a load cell pedal for the first time or don't use shoes while gaming or have don't have the pedals mounted on a pedal tray/sim rig. Which probably makes sense as it's an entry level product. Still, at the volumes TM sell, it would cost them a few cents per unit to bundle a few uprated springs and elastomers, for those that would require them.

[@stefan-georgfuchs9618]

@@s_n9210 Have you pushed the brakes of real race cars or why are you so sure these springs are so "weak". I assure you, I know how a break pedal in a sportscar has to feel ( I own 2 ) and how a loadcell works. It's measuring muscle power, not distance. The stiffness of the feather is rather relative. In order to submit the "power" to the loadcell in the most sensitive way, you would normaly replace all springs with a bloick of metal. But of course, this would feel completely unrealistic for 99,9% of users. Even for those who never drove a car before. So all these springs or elastomeres ( or other products ) try to emulate the feeling of a hydraulic brake system used in racecars. Which, btw, varies quite a lot from car to car. Also brakes themselves and their temperaturs make a huge difference . However, neither in simracing nor in reallive , you don't have to stomp on that pedal like an elephant. Yes, you need a certain power to push the brakes of racecar. The untrained normal person will feel like kicking a concrete wall for the first times until muscles develeopped and trained. Check this vid out . Explaines really good what a racing brake does. Watch @ 6:22 how the guy pushes the pedal with his indexfinger and how flexibel the whole system is.. kzbin.info/www/bejne/d6enqY1qi7uBq8U As far as sim goes, some people still insist , that that they have to keep their progressive brake setting in the sim although they use a loadcell now. Again, each to it's own, but it makes no sense at all as growing brake pressure ist only provided by the muscles in your leg and mesured by the loadcell. So the "progression" is already in your muscles. Also, sim-cars are not reallive Racingcar with twice as much load on the brake as the T-CLM can offer. Sims try to replicate the feeling by programming brake simulation in a way that the feeling of a heavy brake is "simulated" . But it has to work for people with controllers ( no pedals ) as well as for those who use premier products . For those who have so much muscle in their legs ( soccerplayers and bicycle drivers come to my mind ) that even the red springs seem not to be enough ( asking myself for what exactly ? Modulation is asked in racing, not raw power ) : There are elastomere's out there. Check the internet. Also, this "Entry-Level" is more than capable for what it does and what is needed for. The loadcell is actually quite a good one , as many tests on the net have revealed. Entry level pedals usually come along with a wheelset , all for under 150 $ typically. I wonder how all the people has driven sims for the last 125 years without loadcells. At the end, we still talk about computer or playstation games, although they all have more or less elements of a real sim ( which would cost hundreds of thousands of $ btw. ). Also, the majority of simracers is not going to the gym 5 days a week like real race drivers and train all their muscles ( see Road to LeMans series from Porsche with Michael Fassbender here on UT ) and most of the time they are also not running races ( stints ) for more than 30 minutes or so. At least, that's what I take from what I see on UT. As soon as people start simulating real racing, rather than hotlapping a few times, they start feeling that the breakpower of both sets introduced here is way more than enough for the average trained person to achieve what's needed in Simracing. Unless you're in the upper echelons of the Simracing world of paid drivers, that is, of course ;-) But each to it's own. So if really necessary, and you have the moneys, you can buy something from Heusinkveldt or similar, where you get everything customized... Sorry for the wall of text.

[@s_n9210]

@@stefan-georgfuchs9618 ​ "There are elastomere's out there. Check the internet." That I know. My issue is users shouldn't have to spend extra bucks or effort for something that can and should be added in the box by TM. Look, even Fanatec have that on their entry level CSL pedals. "In order to submit the "power" to the loadcell in the most sensitive way, you would normaly replace all springs with a bloick of metal." "asking myself for what exactly ? Modulation is asked in racing, not raw power" Agreed. Modulation is necessary. But a pedal that is easy to max travel out is much harder to modulate on a load cell setup. You need whatever medium you use between the loadcell and your feet to be as stiff as comfortably possible. The issue here is not the lack of power; the load cell's rating as you mentioned correctly is perfectly adequate. Heck I felt the 20KG DIY load cell setup I've had previously on a G29's pedal were enough. It's the springs that are clearly lacking. "this "Entry-Level" is more than capable" "you can buy something from Heusinkveldt or similar, where you get everything customized..." Yes the T-LCM's are decent, but they could be so so much better with simple tweaks; Think of it as wasted potential. Jeremy from Sim racing corner claims the T-LCM's brake pedal feel as good his Heusinkveld Pros with simple elastomers/dampers he probably picked off from ebay. Heck, I own a set of DIY Sprint replicas too and can relate from experience. There are countless testimonials from other T-LCM owners about these mods elevating their experience. If one small change can positively impact a product's functionality, there is clearly some merit in for TM to consider shipping T-LCM's with such a setup. "the majority of simracers is not going to the gym 5 days a week" That I have no counter for. :)

[@SEVENTEENPOINT1]

I understand that, nothing is worse than pressing too hard on a turn and losing laptime for no other reason.

[@LaszloNemeth]

Grrr loadcell on pre order, deliverable march 2022

[@DavidGarcia-oi5nt]

Agree with all your thoughts here Chris, good video. I had the TLCMs coming from the G29 pedals and tbh I never noticed much of a difference between them. Though I do have to recommend the Apex V2R mod for the T-LCMs it gives a much harder pedal. Now I have the Simagic pedals and its night and day, I finally understand what a load cell pedal is supposed to feel like!

[@TheBoostedDoge]

I mean you can't really compare a $200 pedalset to an $800 one, that's like comparing a DD1 to a G29..

[@virenpatel4419]

@@TheBoostedDogeyeah exactly his comparison just doesn’t make sense is like he’s comparing a bugati engine vs a toyota

[@virenpatel4419]

You should know trustmaster products are more user budget friendly if they want to do a 800 dollar pedal they can but they do not want because their Marketting target is for budget friendly

[@chrisjohnson261]

Looked like latency in the dd pro.

[@MalcomMcLeod]

That spot on the tip of your shoe bothers me.😆

[@ChrisHaye]

Yeah.... me too!

[@PhantomMark]

The lag on the audio and lip sync make this a funky watch Chris, sorry......

[@SwigerQ86]

I think the TLCMS are better for ovals, CSLS are better for road.

[@johnnybanana8004]

ive seen somone who tryd to convince me that thos washers ar for mounting🤣

[@ChrisHaye]

Well.... They are the right size :D

[@eriktoupal8437]

Fanatec win?

[@JURacing]

Let me put it this way...hardware-reviews may bring you more $$$, but if you're not in the market for new gear you really do miss videos like this: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eIPGl2x_eaZgidk I hope these kind of vids will return some day.

[@wipexx]

the review it's great. You voice it's out of sync tho

[@Bobbarker23455]

So Fanatec all day basically.

[@jessejames1999]

What about software , fanatec are not up to speed as there software is totally not compatible with mac book . So disappointed I can't tune fanatec on my mac book pro . Hopefully thrustmaster have had common sense and mad there software compatible with mac book along side windows . Fanatec really missing out here . Plus customer service from fanatec is shockingly poor . And I'm being generous here . They are horrendous for customer service

[@jwv220290]

I want to add in the pots in the fanatec are terrible Over 3 years iv gone threw 4 sets

[@Lukew360]

Couldn't watch it sorry, the lip sync is horrendous!

[@messiahshow]

Like an old Kung Fu movie "you killed my brother (lips moving), now I kill you! (lips moving)

[@WOES888]

rolls eyes lol

[@jcarlossantos40]

I'm playing on PS4 Gran Turismo. Does anyone know if I can use my T-LCM pedals with the Fanatec GT DD Pro?