Grinding Out Fiberglass Stress Cracks And Getting Ready For Some Major Work!

[@bsfishing7073]

Great that explains why my boat is cracking up as well 😢damage is very noticeable and it would explain why it would happen great video very informative

[@Thatboatdude]

Love all your work man! Im a powerboat/fastboat man but i love to see all your videos! I restore to boats almost every year since i was 12 year old. Absolutely love it! Thanks 👍🏻

[@appick01]

So so much glorious sanding in your future!

[@Living_Lodka]

thank you Andy

[@TheDecguy]

As I was thinking about the forward deck a little more this week I remembered doing the rotisserie method. Restorers do this often when replanting the bottom of wooden boats in this size range. Although it seems like a lot of work to get the hull flipped over it makes it very easy to redo the core and laminate under the deck. You can work right side up and the boat won't care about being upside down. Another resource on how the original B25 was laid up is Carl Herndon. He was the production manager for Bertram back in the 60's. Later he was president of Blackfin then Jupiter Marine. The last time I checked he was still around in Florida. You might want to hurry however, us old guys aren't going to last forever!

[@B._Smith]

Do satisfying to watch. Thank you Andy!

[@_noname617]

good to see you take the right approach.. video on the motor tune-up would be nice - thanks!

[@jeffkatzer]

I'm digging this project. Best of luck.

[@phillipr6676]

You’ll never stop the cracking gel coat until you address the flex in the deck. I have a 78 Formula 233 with the same problem. I cut the deck off in front of the windshield. Flipped it over, stripped the plywood blocks out, reglassed it with end grain balsa. My deck has an arch in it so I needed a material that would form to that shape. For the money balsa saturated with epoxy is the strongest thing for the price. Re installed the deck, glassed it back and faired it out.

[@tankneverfull3931]

Looks like you've got a lot of work ahead of you.

[@aaronbolinger6581]

I would definitely buy a where’s the glass T-shirt!

[@todddunn945]

Andy, I have to say that I am definitely in the camp for adding glass to the underside of the deck. It looks like the plywood is simply bonded to the top layer with no bottom layer of glass. Adding even a single layer of 1708 will more than double the stiffness of the deck. If I was doing that job I would do it in pieces. My procedure would be: 1) remove plywood in an area 2) replace plywood with 1/2" foam 3) add glass to underside of foam. Ideally I would combine 2 an 3 and vacuum bag the glass/foam to the underside of the deck. Working in small areas your could build your glass/foam composite on top of a small piece of luan doorskin as follows - luan, vacuum bag, breather, peel ply, glass, foam. Once you have the layup done, put butyl tape around the perimeter, push the layup/vacuum bag assembly into place with the luan, brace it and turn the vacuum pump on. Once you are pulling a vacuum you can remove the bracing and luan if you want since the vacuum will hold the foam and layup in place. This method completely removes the hassle of putting glass on over your head. If you want to get really fancy you could even resin infuse the foam/layup (have to use epoxy for this though). Replacing the plywood with foam will likely result in a lighter deck (which is good) that will never rot should you have eventual water intrusion (also good). The down side is that it will cost a bit more - foam is expensive, but that deck isn't that big so the foam won't be all that much (around $500 retail).

[@arnteriksen5773]

Hey just say it. Someone have put alot of car faring compound on that top. And that is not strong enough for boats. Sanding glorius sanding to get it better, then 3 lawer of fiberglas on top before new fairing compound. Sorry I dont write so good English, but hope you understand. Merry Christmas from Sweden.

[@georgemorris9323]

Hi Andy. My pennies worth...repair the top then if you are able spin the boat and working thru the hatch add 3 layers of glass to the underside. Spinning the boat might cause a few headaches but will make working on the roof so much easier.

[@pezpengy9308]

thank you Andy! I am having similar crackling issues with the deck of my macgregor 26d (or maybe the deck wasn't built for 280 pound fat people.... which is more likely). I cant get to the underside of the deck to run stringers without more work than im comfortable DIY'ing, so I'm watching this particular series with GREAT interest. Bad thing is though - theres little to no stress cracks outside of the cockpit. A few superficial ones around the daggerboard trunk. You inspire me sir! Happy face for you! :)

[@stressfreepro6529]

all the best :)

[@emilycrisp691]

Thanks Andy. Really enjoy your glassing tips. Looking fwd to seeing this boat restored. I was thinking on your last update that spinning the boat upside down may have been an option for working under the forward deck. I see somebody else mentioned same, although i imagine this baby weighs a ton (or two) anyway, watching with interest.

[@DesmoProfundis]

Andy, I have a 1968 Bertram Bahia Mar 20 that I seriously need help on. I am willing to go on Patreon to pay for your help because I'm not looking to get something for nothing. This boat is a family member and was left to me by my dad just before he passed in 2015. It's been with me my whole life and is now in need of a lot of help. I have her off her trailer in my backyard and have sanded all the bottom paint off. The hull is in such bad shape with deep chipping and stress cracks everywhere. It's so bad that I've decided to sand all the way up to the gunnels and restore everything from there down. The deck is still in good shape except for a little rotting where there's a penetration for a flag pole holder or some such device. I've been watching your channel for a while and have to tell you how much I've enjoyed it. Being from Binghamton, NY originally, I started out working in a boat shop there sanding on boats and doing fiberglass work when I was a kid, so your upstate accent makes me feel like I'm home. When I was 19 I joined the military and have since found myself living out West in Tacoma, WA near JBLM. I'm a Union Carpenter now but still call Upstate NY home. This boat has been part of my family since 1979 and in 2016 I was able to drive back East and get her, an epic journey that's a story in itself. Now that the Covid-19 virus has us all sitting at the house, I have pulled out the random orbital sander and tried to remember all the lessons I learned when I was 17. Any help you're willing to offer would be extremely helpful as I don't have the funds to drop her at a shop and have the work done for me. Thanks for your help, and again, I am completely willing to pay for your time. I will take all the pictures of Bertram original structure you could possibly want. She's not a Moppie but she's the right age and size to be similar in many ways. The only mod that has been done to this boat is the Volvo Penta 5.0 and the Duo Prop outdrive. Other than that, she's all 1968 classic Bertram. Cheers, Galen

[@Thomas_Speck]

Sometimes you look extremely stressed? Take care of yourself! Love your Channel since it starts, Super-infomative!

[@nogoodnametochoose]

Could you use a vacuum infusion process for under the bow? I’ve had success using the harbor freight vacuum pumps for continuous use for a few projects. That way you could use 3M77 to tack the glass in place, add seal tape, infusion stuff and bag it. If the wood is dry I’d leave it and not pull it out.

[@jimmiller4951]

If it was in my shop I would grind it , lay two maybe three layers of S glass , two of cloth and gel coat it .Put a couple of supports below and call it a day ( or week ;). No way I would separate it because it would just add more stress in opinion. And flipping a boat that size would be a nightmare.Also , the windshield isn't a light object and probably led to a lot of the stress cracks on a poor job from previous work so that could use some added support.I would support the " rabbit hole" with a simple bulkhead and press on to the other surprises you are going to run into. Peace and Merry Christmas !

[@UweBehrendt]

A good assessment Thanks

[@mdaddley]

Mads is in the USA right now, have him come and help with the Glorious sanding.....

[@TheTim16964]

Dude, you come off as the world's nicest guy. I'd have you over for Thanksgiving!

[@kwasg3]

Here's an idea for you.... MIGHT help your structure enough to avoid the urgency of bottom structure fix.... If you get that whole deck down to glass, why don't you do a slow drying wet lay up of a base layer, then some 4mm coremat, another build layer or two, another coremat, and then your finish layers. Then, the key to getting the most out of the laminant you just made is taping up a deck shaped bag from the edges to the hatch and vacuum bagging for the compression while it cures. Love using coremat, it adds lots of rigidity to pannels when in the middle of the laminate stack... be a cool vid too... :)

[@mikemulrooney4574]

Honestly its not always the guys who sat in school and got a degree that will know what will work.I can think of plenty of times in the building industry when if we ignored the architects plans and did it the right way the failures that we all saw coming would have been avoided!I guess what I am trying to say is take what they say into account but you have been doing this for a long time and if you believe something might work well then run with it and don't worry about what some people might think because in the end they are not up there with you grinding and glassing upside down!:)

[@rodbaker2097]

This area looked repaired with fairing or bondo then a layer of white gel coat then more fairing.I am working on a boat that has inpact spiders all over it.As I sand out these cracks the glass also has cracks that ive sanded out leaving a concave to be glassed or filled back in.I want to know why I cant simply use peanutbutter with 1/4 chopped fibers instead of csm.Hoping you throw me a bone on this some day.

[@2DCardBored]

I think you are on the right track, there has to be enough glass there to hold it together!!! Who knows what happened, someone may have mangled it and that was the repair....I like your vids, but all I got is moral support. MB.

[@douglasthompson2740]

For whatever it is worth I have had many boats most of top drawer quality and all of them with only one exception had way too much flex in the bow and flybridge decks for my taste. I found the solution for me was to open up the underside, put a post in if it wasn't in the way to cut the span, and to steam bend some oak deck beams which I epoxied in and then layered in some roving with epoxy. Where possible I glassed in knees at the joint with the hull to spread the load. A royal pain but the epoxy did pretty well upside down and with that installed the problem was solved. I also insulated with foil bubble wrap under the headliner for two reasons: one, increase the radar visibility to other vessels, and two for heat retention and condensation reduction (I live in Alaska and boat year round). I have been around a few Bertrams of your vintage and was always impressed with the rock solid build quality so it leaves one wondering how yours received such a dearth of glass? Even after the fuel shortage and oil price increase of the mid seventies where many boat manufacturers skimped Bertram kept his glass schedule up. Reading the periodicals of the time confirmed my personal experience. I loved the old 26es of the sixties that NOAH used on their survey vessels for tenders. Always a heavy boat but reliable in quality. I am enjoying the video as it brings back memories of the many projects I did that were similar. Take care. Doug

[@mennonitefarmingproducts]

I noticed you mention Bondo used as a fairing compound. What is the difference? Could it be used one as the same? I normally work on aluminum boats or automotive so I would think any type of automotive filler would work fine. Thanks. Waldo.

[@Brik-in-the-sticks]

Yeah, I thought so. Not enough fibreglass, same a my current project. Boats in the 60'- 70's were just pumped out as quickly as possible. Loose chopped fibreglass stands in a thin layer and in the corners full of air bubbles. "Doesn't matter just bog it eh?"

[@turdfurgeson517]

I remember that you had lots of trouble removing the wood below. My bet is once u finish laying glass back up to 1/4" perhaps roving then matting then west system. Unless your gonna be dropping bowling balls up there and u use epoxy. Bullet proof. People dont use epoxy enough to put in there 2 cents. Either do I. Look forward to next week.

[@rustycanadian]

Hello Andy, I think it would be a tremendous waste of alot of time to fix or band aid the repairs to the top. Would it be better in the long run to just use the existing top as a mould and build a brand new top ?

[@renoacct]

Andy-Would it be worthwhile remove the engines and flip the boat over to do the structural work on the underside of the deck?

[@billiondollardan]

I don't know much about this stuff but is there any way you could build a little frame underneath the foredeck? Is that just not something that you do for boats like this? Like put a few crossmembers in place maybe?

[@coffeefish]

Adding glass to he bottom side of the deck will do the most to increase stiffness. Imagine a person standing on the deck; the top layer of glass will be under compression and the bottom layer will be in tension. A flat panel of glass is strongest under tension. It will compress just like rubber. And,,,there's not as much grinding to do on the bottom surface.

[@jim-jf5rn]

I've been watching your videos for a while now and I've learned more than I thought I would how to repair boats and I appreciate everything you are willing to teach people.. I'm about to start a project restoring a 1987 chris craft 167Br scorpion inboard/outboard. But, unfortunately it does not have a floor nor any stringers. So, my first question is how do I measure for the stringers and the engine mount? I have deep chips and cracks on the bottom of my hull up towards the bow on the Center Ridge.(not sure what you would call it) how can I repair the ridge and keep the shape of it without making it looking deformed?

[@boatworkstoday]

Hi Jim, that's a bit much to try and answer here through comments, when you have a chance please look over my Patreon page as I do offer consultation there :-) www.patreon.com/BoatworksToday Thank you!

[@mikemulrooney4574]

Build the floor and stringers !There is plenty of youtube content on that for you to make a run at it!!Good luck:)

[@1982mako224]

If I had your shop I would remove the cap completely, flip it over and replace the existing core or add core to it.

[@robertwilbert1317]

Awesome vids .....i learned alot from you....where did you get that makita belt sander from....need one bad

[@boatworkstoday]

Amazon has the best price I've found. Here's a link: a.co/d/ixoeaqj

[@robertwilbert1317]

@@boatworkstoday thank you

[@robertwilbert1317]

Having trouble matching grey gel coat...any suggestions as what i can add....gel on boat is grey...gel in the can has blueish tinge to it

[@ascott6804]

Mads has to say "Glorious Glorious sanding!" Lol!!

[@thattoolguy9432]

Looking forward to see how this is done, i have the same problem on my boat.. do i scrap it and buy something else.. or brave it and fix it?

[@turdfurgeson517]

Fix it

[@williamadams7315]

Love all your videos. May I make one suggestion from a business standpoint? In your details section, make the amazon and patreon addresses into hyperlinks so people can click directly on them. I also watch Curtis Stone (urban farmer) and his KZbin business model is excellent (as an example). He manages to monetize everything.

[@boatworkstoday]

Done! I didn't realize that needed to be included to make it an active link :-/ Thanks!!

[@svdellajean253]

Great video. What brand and model number is that sander you were using around the hatch fillets?

[@svdellajean253]

The link in your reply doesn’t work.

[@boatworkstoday]

How about this: amzn.to/2QyAdSx If that doesn't work then this? www.amazon.com/dp/B00004YOH7/?ref=exp_boatworkstoday_lv_dp_vv_d

[@svdellajean253]

My apologies, I didn’t realize you had responded until now. Both of those links worked fine. Thanks for the help.

[@ConfusedSoul24]

There's no need to reglass the whole front deck. All it does is add work and weight. Just flip the boat, work on the inside of the deck through the hatch opening. rebuild the structure underneath by adding foam beams and glassing over them. After that, flip it back, grind down the cracks and add two layers of 80g cloth in 45° with epoxy where the cracks were. Then do the fairing and paint. You will have less work, add a lot of stiffness and stop the cracks coming back. Less work, less material, better result.

[@xenafido]

re glass the top then your not going to like this ,separate the hull to rebuild the inner structure from the gunnels to the bow . the advantage you wont be working upside down. considering all the cracking noises you had from side gunnels to the bow .

[@coffeefish]

Do you think it's possible to separate the deck from the hull?

[@shoresharp8349]

Your exactly right separate the cap flip and tear out the old core and replace core and reglass. Only way to stop the cracking and flexing

[@ConfusedSoul24]

It is possible, however I would strongly advise not to do it. You open up a new can of worms. Both hull and deck lose their rigidity when they're seperated, thus one has to build a frame for each in order to ensure they don't deform. Otherwise joining them again afterwards will be mayor pain in the a$$. It is a lot simpler to flip the whole boat upside down to work on the inside of the deck.

[@tankneverfull3931]

Given how much of the thickness of that deck turned out to be non-structural material, I wouldn't be surprised if re-glassing the top will add enough strength.

[@beetlearms]

@@coffeefish anything is possible when doing composite work. The better question is, "is it worth the effort?" Maybe, maybe not. It depends on how much is involved verses the return.

[@georgelawton9075]

Hi Andy: I think you should replace the forward deck. Sorry 😐 Nucleotide

[@djmjr77]

Thanks for all your hard work, is it possible to start making these vids a little longer, with some more actual work content. Are there longer vids for this same bertram project available to patreon members?

[@boatworkstoday]

Some weeks are longer than others, just depends on what the tasks are at the time. Supporters on Patreon get additional video's weekly, not necessarily longer versions of what you're seeing. The bonus vids range from tips to behind the scenes / planning, etc. But the biggest benefit is that depending on the level pledged they also get 1 on 1 consultation for their project either through email or video calls

[@djmjr77]

That sounds great, i will look into it, thanks for the reply!!

[@SailingWithTheTide]

I disagree. The thorough explanations are amazing, please keep talking and filling us in. There are tons of videos out there on “how to” but never ‘why’ in the first place. I have been resorting my sailboat for the last two years and through listening to your ‘why’ something is doing what it is doing, I have been able to find how to videos to help with what you are describing. Sometimes you do how to videos and that is amazing, but I come to you to find out why as I learn how to not have insane issues show their ugly heads in the future. Summary, why is as important as how. Keep it up.

[@pcahill10]

It seems as though your fixing the roof when the foundation is bad. Doesn't it make more sense to repair the underside of the deck first? I like Martin Gauthier's suggestion of the rotisserie method. All in all, much good content, can't wait for the next video.

[@Cameron-ur2tk]

I bet that top is going to be strong enough once glassed thicker. Its already has a core.....

[@AlexVargasPipa]

Apart from repairing the top of the deck, why don't you just turn the boat up side down and reinforce the under side of the deck?

[@seangreene64]

Take the cap off. Then remove all that old plywood from under.

[@mypronounismaster4450]

what made that guy want to sand off all the material from the deck to begin with? I understand people using the wrong material to put it back together, but why in the hell would someone grind off all the fiberglass on their deck?

[@tedjackson5272]

Can you do a quick tour of your Jonh Deere loader?

[@SailingWithTheTide]

I disagree. The thorough explanations are amazing, please keep talking and filling us in. There are tons of videos out there on “how to” but never ‘why’ in the first place. I have been resorting my sailboat for the last two years and through listening to your ‘why’ something is doing what it is doing, I have been able to find how to videos to help with what you are describing. Sometimes you do how to videos and that is amazing, but I come to you to find out why as I learn how to not have insane issues show their ugly heads in the future. Summary, why is as important as how. Keep it up.

[@netpackrat]

This can of worms illustrates one advantage of a wooden boat over a fiberglass boat.... If all else fails, you can always burn the wooden boat. 8^/

[@mateoluckydog]

as you say , that you like comments .just a tiny one......taking logos out you can use a string or fishing leader line and there is less risk of breaking them ....I already braked some Jah jah....

[@ascott6804]

You know your gonna have to cut that whole deck out?? Just aint sayin!!

[@TheAssaultScar]

Bullshit

[@matthewmillar3804]

Looks like you need an apprentice...

[@fishingfool2644]

“Where’s the glass?” T-shirt is a bad idea. Glass is also another name for meth.

[@boatworkstoday]

Lol :-)!! I did not know that!!

[@Cameron-ur2tk]

hahaha wouldn't have guessed that

[@thesickhorseranch]

@@boatworkstoday How about a big SPAM type can labeled Boatworks Today- All BEEF! NO filler! I would give money for something with a dash of humor to it. :)

[@UweBehrendt]

As to the videos they will get better with time , get you better half to edit them that would give you more time to work 8 hrs of video for 10 min of production always hurts Thanks

[@boatworkstoday]

Wife has no interest in editing plus she's busy with her own job and the Girls :-/. Hopefully down the road I'll have the ability to hire out some of the background work but for now the funds are not there. I'm trying :-)!!

[@edrussell7960]

@@boatworkstoday your doing great Andy. Keep it up buddy.