Don’t give them what they want: Terrorists should be starved of the oxygen of publicity

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Why do they do it? Again and again, after every attack, our media react by giving the terrorists exactly what they want - maximum publicity. Of course, the public should be told that an atrocity has taken place. But each attack dominates the news for days at a stretch. The TV networks go into overdrive, flying out their journalists to the scene of the attack and saturating their airtime. All this plays into the hands of terrorist organisations, allowing their killers to be glorified in the eyes of their supporters. In addition, the wall-to-wall news coverage creates a climate of fear and fuels the more authoritarian and xenophobic strands of our politics. President Trump’s recent actions - banning refugees and appearing to reference fictional terrorist attacks in Sweden - might be seen as an inevitable consequence of this hysteria. We should get things into proportion. After all, you’re more likely to fatally slip in the shower than be killed in a terrorist attack.
This is the line that was taken by former Times editor and Guardian columnist Simon Jenkins. He was joined by Fawaz Gerges, a prominent expert on ISIS and al-Qaeda who has extensively researched the historical roots of jihadi extremism on the ground in the Middle East. Gerges explained how the West has played into the narrative of terrorists by portraying them as an existential danger, rather than as mere common criminals.
But for national security commentator Douglas Murray, the only way to defeat terrorism is to tackle it head on, speaking plainly about the true scale of the threat. The recent wave of attacks by ISIS was just the beginning, he argued. Over a thousand foreign fighters have recently returned from Syria to Europe, and are highly likely to pose a risk to our security. It’s vital that our media and authorities keep the public fully aware about the terrorist threat and encourage everyone to be vigilant. Honest reporting is absolutely crucial, especially when society itself is under attack. As for ISIS, how they are portrayed in the mainstream media is a matter of indifference to them - their publicity strategy is all about broadcasting their attacks on social media to an audience of millions, not headlines in the press.

[@ftmuna]

Thank goodness for Douglas. Always has a way of inserting practical clarity when sophistry and imprecision abounds.

[@5starjonny467]

Blue Chain Douglas is a lone wolf 🐺

[@HeavySmoker22]

Blue Chain Indeed. Douglas the only light in this discussion. Fawaz typical of a morally bankrupt, pontificating prat.

[@JV-wi4dz]

WWDD

[@katherinekirkwood9632]

Douglas is 👑 makes all very clear 💯 talks the 🗣

[@gstar3569]

Douglas cuts through the intellectual pontificating and posturing.

[@croquet121]

Please add the moderator's name and job title - Clarissa Ward, senior CNN international correspondent - to the description of the program above. Thank you.

[@JimRiven]

If you ignore a problem, it magically goes away. Great advice.

[@PS4sos21]

Yep, if we ignore cancer, it will disappear by itself.

[@rainbowsalads]

Not ignoring, the guy on the left wants people shut up on social media!! time ref = 1.14.10 secs.

[@Rubashow]

Did you actually listen to him ? Good job on missing the point ...

[@ASkepticalHumanOnYouTube]

+Jim Riven - I think terrorism is one of those very rare areas where ignoring it or covering it to a much lesser extent actually *will* contribute to its disappearance-or, more precisely, to its decline. Think about it: Terrorism is only effective insofar as the targets become aware of the terrorism, because obviously they can't have their behavior and thinking altered if they're completely unaware of the events whose endgoal is to modify their behavior and thinking, or if they view these events as just one of many things going on in the world-and not some earth-shattering catastrophe that they hear every minor detail about for 5 straight days no matter where they turn in the media. (Note that covering a terrorist atrocity as just another one of many stories in the world is much different from endlessly giving it days of extensive coverage. The effects on the public mind are going to differ between these two approaches.) Given that providing terrorism with much less media coverage would undermine the primary thing that makes terrorism a viable strategy in the first place-publicity and the subsequent fear that's engendered-I think this is the best way to deal with it. Insofar as our behavior makes terrorism a less effective and worthwhile strategy, *our behavior ultimately saves lives because it reduces the incentives to commit acts of terrorism in the first place.* That last part is the most important point, because it directly refutes your position. That's not to say that treating terrorism differently in the media and in our individual lives will completely cause it to vanish. But it will undoubtedly cause it to decline.

[@JimRiven]

Got a TL;DR version where you cut the bullshit and just state why your opinion and the facts differ but we should just accept what you say is true because you like to pretend you are smarter than everyone else? What you do now is post evidences backing up your bullshit :)

[@XLDoubleDouble]

Terrorist acts are a deliberate act, Terrorist acts are not accidents. Accidents don't have a person to blame, for intent, or negligence. Spilling your coffee is and accident, setting off a bomb isn't a accident.

[@stratatk5724]

They always go back to that statistic of 6 deaths annually since 2001. How convenient of them to leave out the 3,000 deaths of 9/11. That would bump the number up to more like 200 deaths annually. And that's with the increased security efforts and vigilance.

[@CyberChrist]

Compare that to traffic fatalities.

[@CheapGodiva]

Simon Jenkins seems very much a haughty, insufferable elitist.

[@hjyigo4759]

He is. Typical smug liberal leftie. It amazes me that Thatcher liked him. Considering she liked Major in 1990 it shows that she wasn't always the best judge of character.

[@npickard4218]

Well said, I agree completely!

[@MilitantOldLady]

It's a tight write act between spreading awareness of the threat and unintentionally being the PR department for Islam.

[@johnstockwellmajorsmedleyb1214]

Teutone Where do yall come from? All religion is escapism, a path of ignorance to follow. Is there a cure for historical ignorance?

[@earthynomad7160]

Just for telling the truth? How brainwashed

[@earthynomad7160]

@@jakoblundberg759 we are still suffering the aftermath of Christian bloodshed

[@bopatzable]

14:25 for Murray fans. Gotta love this guy! :D

[@lloydhowe6912]

keep you're hands off our social media no censorship

[@npickard4218]

YESSSSSSS

[@antichris78]

Why do the number of terrorist attacks we prevented never get a mention? One every other week in Europe atm. Death count would be huge if we weren't pouring so much resources into prevention. It also indicates a much wider problem.

[@Amadeus_2061]

This analogy of comparing victims of terrorism to lighting strikes is fallacious. The reason why there are only 6 people who have died annually from terrorism is because there are huge resources devoted to stopping terrorist plots. We cannot stop lightning bolts, and uncontrolled they at random kill 30 people. But if we stopped countering terrorism and if it were allowed to function as randomly as lightening bolts, then the toll would be substantially higher than 6 victims a year, and possibly even 30. This alone should incite deeper thought about the real dangers of terrorism if underestimated. As for blowing terrorism out of proportion... People treat you like you allow them to treat you. Look at the countries that have normalized terrorism, how functional and safe they are (Afghanistan, Yemen, Iraq). And look at the countries that have absolutely no tolerance for it (Poland, Japan, New Zealand). The left is asking us to tolerate and normalize "occasional" acts of terrorism, but the point is that we want zero acts of terrorism. And we don't want to be anywhere near the slippery slope where the margin of occasional terrorism grows larger and larger. What sane people will settle for any type of occasional violence that is preventable?

[@marcusmariya2747]

59:44 thank god douglas could control himself, Almost shot that old man.

[@haruspex1-50]

The greatest problem isn't terrorism, it's jihad through high birth rates, dawah and community islamisation

[@sigmagrindset7848]

Jihad translation to English is struggle or to struggle...What do you mean?

[@haruspex1-50]

@@sigmagrindset7848 there’s two meanings for jihad. Lesser and greater jihad. And your definition is one. The other is holy war.

[@sigmagrindset7848]

@@haruspex1-50 no the holy war is Harb Al-Muqadasa, small Jihad is for example working to get money to feed your family or a mother taking care of her children or a child going to school, greater Jihad is like fighting to protect your land or family or saving another life by giving up yours. Islam doesn't have holy crusades and if there is a conquest it has to be for defence not to just get land to steal the goods of other nations.

[@NeetiSharma26]

The question about India was completely unanswered!

[@trevorwongsam8178]

Why is it that on these IQ squared debates it seems as a rule that Douglas Murray is the only one who talks any sense?

[@egonfang]

Douglas Murray to the rescue!!!!

[@ashalivarma4623]

Jenkins does not know what he is talking about. For years we have to go through stringent checks at airports.

[@musicunitedforever]

This is one of the most interesting and informative debate i've seen thus far, LOVE IT!

[@KaLeCaFe]

Douglas Murray lone voice of reason.

[@egonfang]

round and round we go again and again and again. I think calling it publicity is idiotic. limited nuisance... as long as your not bothered. apologist for terriorism. this is academia?!?

[@jeannemeyer8069]

I will never believe CNN ever again !

[@McMike83]

Of course there is a clash of civilizations and it is not what Westerners desire, but other civilizations want. Especially Muslims deeply believe in the clash and this is why there is increasing religiosity in the times of science, humanism and technology. They become more religious because it unites them and gives them power.

[@GETJUSTICE4U]

Siddhartha02 The people (of the world, especially muslims) need to learn Islams true.origins and history based on empirical independant evidence from all available sources. Modern humans have been around for 200, 000 years and for most of that time they did not have mythical religious ideologies for the vast majority of that time. This needs some explaining (ideally by god). At what point did a god become necessary to humankind and why?

[@ziggelito]

Terrorists are an enemy force waging asymmetrical warfare. people claim that terrorism "has political motives", ALL war has political motives, war is the ultimate and final method to implement policy. basically "if you do not do what we want, we will force you" In that regard, "terrorism" and "honourable" war is the same. The reason why people are so angry at limp dicked politicians is that they refuse to fight. If you have an enemy, you fight them, until they give up or are destroyed. Yet the political class of Europe don't want to, they want the people to be the Eloi, to just "suck it up". Of course people are getting angry when all they hear is "we won't even try to protect you, you are just going to have to live with it"

[@dmdmorg]

Hoaxes and media manipulation. Be so scared of things you can't see and never will.Remember, everyone has a smartphone with good pixel count, but you never do see really good pictures...Why? The internet can't stop you from uploading an image.So where are the images?

[@TheLivirus]

Clarissa did a great job in allowing the discussion to evolve way past the point of departure without devolving into irrelevance. She also contributed constructively with her perspective as a journalist. I really liked the fluid format of this discussion as opposed to a formal debate with a firm proposition.

[@agricolaregs]

Either a purposeful misrepresentation or an accident, but there are Muslim clerics who do support ISIS. Anjem Choudary and Muhammad Abd al-Ghani supported ISIS.

[@papasha408]

The question is, who are the terrorists. I agree that they should be starved of the oxygen of publicity. So, stop watching, reading, or listening to the American, British, and Israeli media. If the world did that, they may actually stop terrorism.

[@peruvianauthorities1739]

The public has the right to know! Btw, who should be the geniuses to determine what coverage the terrorist get? Btw, 'this oxygen' just goes to show that the terrorism is systemic with a foundation of supporters! Who are the supporters of terrorism . . . where is this foundation?

[@agricolaregs]

Why does her accent sound so fake. Like she's trying to do an uppity American accent. I don't know. It's weirding me out. All I can focus on is how the host is talking...

[@Amadeus_2061]

Can someone explain to me why no one on the panel is saying who is committing the terror attacks in Lebanon and Sudan and the rest of the Muslim world, and for what purpose? I would think that would be relevant to understanding the "phenomenon" of terrorism.

[@apexinfovore7309]

Fawaz 11:00 'ISIS really frankly is the West, think about it!' Thought about it and declare this as most Orwellian statement so far in 2017.Also Simon Jenkins nodding in agreement would indicate the brain power here tonight is not as incredible as the hostess first claimed.

[@korruptnovellst4751]

Apex Infovore Orwellian?

[@jafo49]

I think the media should make sure the terrorists don't get what they want. But not by censoring news but by showing the people who are not afraid, and who will not be silenced, who are steadfast in their beliefs, who fight the terrorists.

[@aaron4820]

56:02 *Paraphrasing "More people die from lightning than terrorism since 911" If trillions upon trillions are spent on lightning safety after a bad lightning killed 3000 people and flattened two sky scrappers along with a few planes, and yet people are still dying from lightning and seeing countries that aren't spending billions on preventing lightning deaths are losing lives to lightning on a daily or weekly basis, then I'll at least want to read about it.

[@nimcofarah9803]

Fair publicity create a solutions to every problem that hidden from the citizens of the wold let them judge for them self.

[@cinemar]

As long as Douglas Murray is part of the conversation all bullshit will fall.

[@XLDoubleDouble]

Ignoring the terrorist acts, will only cause the terrorist groups to conduct larger terrorist acts.

[@johncarlisle2755]

That guy with the ginger hair and the green book didnt vote for or against...and he didnt know.

[@ASkepticalHumanOnYouTube]

Great forum, by the way. I think this is a clear example of a conversation being more informative and fruitful than a traditional antagonistic debate.

[@PS4sos21]

The shitty little seats they have them sitting on...

[@EuSeiT]

I bet that guy is a "frequent guest at CNN"!

[@LiamEshikari]

if you called it Muslim extremism instead of Islamic extremism then they would just say you're calling every Muslim and extremist.

[@cinemar]

All muslims are extremists. You don't have to be a murdering psychopath to be an extremist. Thinking Allah is your saviour is nothing but extreme.

[@earthynomad7160]

@@cinemar so who's supposed to be the savior?

[@7777777roma]

ISIS is an Eygptian Goddess wife of Osiris

[@RobBenjamin557]

Good discussion. the girl is fit.

[@buzzardbeatniks]

It's funny when people "thumbs down" debates on youtube. Are they just unhappy that the debate took place or...

[@footsoldier857]

They are really, really boring.

[@marcuswright8418]

Ok so why are we talking about "White Supremacy" and "Neo-Nazis" groups? Since they are considered terrorists movements and want more publicity and going by both of your logic why should we give them that publicity? Last i checked you have politicians raging about Charolettesville but totally silent during the Barcelona terrorist attack . So are we picking and choosing which terrorist organization get's publicity?

[@EtherasFox]

Not much of a debate... 3 panelists that all basically agree. Sort-of expected more from intelligence^2 than being force-fed talking points from whoever set up this circle-jerk. And I'm not saying that they're wrong either, I'm saying _How can you know if you only hear from one side of an argument_ ? You must understand both sides to hold a cohesive opinion on anything. Usually Intelligence^2 is one of the best places around to hear enlightened discussion on ideas... but apparently not on this one.

[@thirdfiddle3652]

Who ever knows a little bit about philosophy will quickly conclude that the format of these debates is evil incarnated... Seeking the truth is not a function of a civilized discussion that ends with a "vote" : often, it is that kind of procedures that hides it... Truth is not a matter of "sharing opinions", but a careful and lifelong career of study and work... When someone somehow got it right in a way, you see that he does' : because it's obvious... Which means that we also need a long career of thinking, and some honesty, to recognize it... This is just games for sophists and other demagogues... The questions of this discussion are completely ill determined...

[@faza553]

"The consumer of "news" will go where they want." It's 2017. Adequate alternatives to national press. Islamists didn't forsee the outcome that: everybody can now read their doctrinal triad and can determine it's potential contribution to violence, for themselves.

[@SnoutBaron]

The assassination of Archduke Ferdinand wasn't the catalyst to an overreaction by states that started WW1, it was a justification by Austria-Hungary to impose their will on the Balkans which then spiralled out of control. It's a misconception that the assassination caused the war, it was just a reason to start a war that was already on the verge of happening.

[@npickard4218]

My response to Mr. Gerges: It is BOTH a clash of civilizations and a clash WITHIN civilizations. Gerges negates the former and gives credence to the latter but it is BOTH.

[@hjyigo4759]

Simon Jenkins seems most uncomfortable with Douglas Murray. He seems nervous and unsure of his argument whilst Murray is far more confident in his approach.

[@sleepygardener5633]

All the talk of concern over how the media coverage could be shaping public opinion, and none about whether shaping opinion is something the media should do, or has the right or responsibility to do. I acknowledge that ham fisted or biased reportage shapes opinion; but the way it is shaped is internally, by the individual recipients of that piece. Personally I think the media trying to direct the opinions generated by the public is a gross overstep of their role.

[@teresajohnson1352]

I enjoy these debatws enormously!! WE ALL NEED MUCH MORE OF THESE DEBATES ON TV. EITHOUT FEAR!!!

[@paxdriver]

Great question from the audience! "isn't the bigger issue our susceptibility to sensationalism? Shouldn't we be worried we are so easily riled?"

[@horiaalbu9306]

Just put a dot after oxygen. That will reflect lucidity, and most of all the instinct of surviving.

[@dw3585]

Had to rewatch this brilliant debate in light of recent political situations.... The taliban having twitter and all....

[@ManInTheBigHat]

Cute blonde.

[@GrowlerBox]

Stop saying incredible. They're actually all fairly credible for the most part.

[@Tuatara1989]

1:14:00 - Can't wait to 'properly regulate' social media. This guy is scary.

[@allmyfriends159]

is she acting like its a junior high debate. homer would moon for rebuttal

[@aririyadh8359]

"Panel of distinguished guests" .... Whom we gave the best school chairs in the house to.

[@MrBishopsClasses]

Massive crush on moderator...wasn't even listening to the points on either side.

[@paxdriver]

I wish this was the primetime tv that got talked about by the office water cooler..

[@neil5551]

HOW peoples thoughts has changed does she mean have A journalist eh

[@THEANPHROPY]

ZOMG Ms Ward is BEAUTIFUL XOXOXO

[@russiandrivers9986]

Close Al Jazeera Arabic

[@agricolaregs]

Plus...the newspaper is dead already...

[@RAMSEY1987]

Starved of attention! Good luck

[@XLDoubleDouble]

Don't deny telling the truth.

[@teresajohnson1352]

Great topic!

[@allmyfriends159]

does her accent change every 8 seconds?

[@cinemar]

Yes I noticed that too. She started out with an english accent and then moved into an american accent.

[@DragAmiot]

At least there should be no notoriety for the perpetrators.

[@teresajohnson1352]

👍👏👏👏👏👏👏

[@TheKolbeg]

Fantastic dialogue format. Great panel and moderator!

[@Rams3040]

People seem to forget they live in the age of the internet. This whole "don't give them a platform" is completely irrelevant and inconsequential. They already have it, even without mainstream media. Your choice is whether to engage them in a debate(if they haven't broken any laws that is) or, if you're a journalist, to do what your job description is and report the news when, and if, they've done something to merit it. The metric for that shouldn't be that hard to establish, journalists already have a Deontological code to guide them. Just inform and report, don't manipulate data to suit your ideological agenda/point. Commentary is also essential,but make the distinction between commentary/opinion and report; never report your opinion. If you fail to do this, you leave the entire field to "alternative media" who may have even greater political agendas and with less inclination and guidelines, to restrain said agendas, and who also have a vested economic or/and popular interest in delegitimizing Mainstream Media/News. You also leave the door wide open for more and more conspiracy theories and continuous obfuscation of the facts, not to mention, rabid misinformation which is a serious threat to a stable Democracy. Do your job and don't try to manipulate public opinion when reporting on the news, otherwise become even more untrustworthy and irrelevant.

[@Neptun776]

she s hot! (not Douglas..)

[@johnstockwellmajorsmedleyb1214]

This channel is by far the most ignorant of the idiocracy of capitalist values. Yeah intelligence, more like follow the leader, don't question anything, and critical thought is not necessary.

[@Orcbanger]

wth are capitalist values, its an economy system not an ideology

[@johnstockwellmajorsmedleyb1214]

skankhunt42 IDK where you live or what specific career of chattel enslavement you are giving your energies to, but you may wish to research some of the aspects of which you speak of. How is it not an ideology of class society? How is it not an ideology of anti-econo economy? If Capitalism was merely an economic system you should be able to explain to me how it is that nearly every other social ideology has been violently put down by the hierarchy of totalitarian capitalists? By definition you are correct, in real life I dont see any difference. I would cherish a logical real world explanation for how what you say is true? FYI when a national military is used to racketeer for banks, wall street, and corporate interests, that's an ideology as much as a financial hierarchy. Much love to yourself and respect to your reply. Much love ❤ to all life , Priceless in every miraculous way.

[@performancepoo]

t. assblasted commie

[@johnstockwellmajorsmedleyb1214]

performancepoo Intelligent rebuttle from another Public School Genius. Lack of critical thought👍 Follower👍 Chattle Slave👍 Rock on, dont be all jealous of our massive Anarchist Cocks. Just keep working to enrich the Hierarchy. Relax and make someone wealthy.

[@johnstockwellmajorsmedleyb1214]

In Vino Veritas I went to public school. Is the library available to anyone with the desire for knowledge? Was it Socrates said, "Question everything, on the premise that I know nothing." paraphrased Is it not the responsibility of man to educate themselves and the next generation? I am not sure is the USA a Republic? or a Democracy? An Inverted Totalitarian Theocracy? Do you see any similarity to 1930's Germany? Why did WW1 end? Much love to you, and all life.

[@jaewok5G]

this is such an incredible video … really incredible. completely unrelated. i find the moderator lacking in credibility. who is she and why is she here and how can get her to go away?

[@vDCampbellv]

I'd suggest first finding out about someone _and then_ criticize her credibility. That would seem to be the logical procedure. She seemed thoughtful, balanced, and close to the topic to me. From the intelligence squared website: Clarissa Ward Award-winning senior CNN international correspondent who has reported extensively from war-torn Syria, where she has interviewed Western jihadists, witnessed mass-casualty airstrikes, and visited areas where no Western journalists dare to travel. She also reported from Paris following the November 2015 terror attacks, contributing to CNN’s recent award for Best Breaking News Coverage from the Royal Television Society.

[@jaewok5G]

well at least now i know her name and have an opportunity to find out more about her and her work. i think i was clear that my criticism was based on just this performance, which i stand by. i found her more distracting than anything. she came off as a morning tv light news host. eg how many times did she say 'incredible' - such a weak adjective for an award winning intrepid journalist. perhaps she's just out of her element in the safe and friendly environs of the academy.

[@jaewok5G]

also, you may have misunderstood the thrust of my complaint, it wasn't that i felt her remarks were 'completely unrelated' to the topic … i had used that phrase as a conjunction in my own comment.

[@teresajohnson1352]

All men!!!!

[@gstar3569]

So what? Its moderated by a women. Put your panties back on the discussion is opened to everyone. Don't bring that equity crap here... not the place for it