Is Marxism Gnostic? Responding To Jordan Peterson with Miguel Conner

Рет қаралды 7,367

3 ай бұрын

Aeon Byte Gnostic Radio's Miguel Conner returns to the show this week for an in-depth unpacking of claims made by Jordan Peterson, James Lindsay and others in the Online Right that Marxism is actually Gnosticism.
We look at
👉 The origins of these claims.
👉 Exactly WHERE and HOW they are wrong.
👉 The origins of Gnosticism.
👉 The 'true' origins of 'woke' thought.
We also explore some possible points of consent with the analysis Jordan Peterson presents regarding Lucifer and the archetypal significance of clowns, jesters and evil.
Many thanks to Miguel for coming back on the show again. I have actually tried several different ways of doing this topic as a solo show since catching the discussion between Jordan Peterson and James Lindsay back in June of 2023.
But imagine trying to have a discussion on the history of Gnosticism without Miguel? Turns out that was the very obvious unlock I needed all along.
Enjoy!
🔼🔼 SHOW NOTES 🔼🔼
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Here is the video I reference regarding Jordan Peterson and Shadow Projection
• Postmodern Neo-Marxism...
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Gordon is chaos magician, shamanic practitioner, podcaster, author and permaculture designer with a background in data and analytics gained at some of the world's largest media companies. He is the author of four books on magic, animism and star lore: Star.Ships: A Prehistory of the Spirits, The Chaos Protocols, Pieces of Eight and Ani.Mystic: Encounters With A Living Cosmos.
When not travelling, Gordon hosts his weekly show, Rune Soup, from a small permaculture farm in southern Tasmania.

Пікірлер: 180

@septillionsuns 3 ай бұрын

Isn't it fascinating that Peterson loves Jung but hates the Gnostics?

@GnosticInformant 3 ай бұрын

"Gnostic" is the word the church uses for 'bad' or 'heresy'. JPB is continuing the tradition to appeal to the Catholic/Orthodox Church crowd.

@junkman7901 3 ай бұрын

Wokeness and postmodernism come from the Jewish Frankfurt of sociology that created critical theory and cultural Marxism as a foundation Peterson and linsey are both genocide supporting Zionists and Gnosticism goes against that ideology

@MandyMoorehol 3 ай бұрын

@@junkman7901sweetheart the franky school were Nietzschians who read Marx. Nietzsche did everything before them lol you are going to be so confused when you find out both Nietzsche and Marx were satirist. lol

@abbasalchemist 3 ай бұрын

Precisely so!

@decades5643 3 ай бұрын

Everyone here has just attained _true gnosis._

@MandyMoorehol 3 ай бұрын

@@decades5643 wait until you attain Nose Gnosis.

@biga.b.1079 3 ай бұрын

Gnosticism is more compatible with an anarchist model.

@anhumblemessengerofthelawo3858 3 ай бұрын

I'm a Gnostic Christian and an anarchist stance is THE LAST thing compatible with my nature. _Peace be with you from Peace, love from Love, grace from Grace, faith from Faith, life from Holy Life._

@freethinker79 3 ай бұрын

Absolutely. The Generation Without a King Over Them. "Anarchy" = WITHOUT ARCHONS

@McAwesomeDelux 3 ай бұрын

I know this term can touchy in certain crowds, but all I can see is Lindsey's confirmation bias. It's as if he heard about this thing called "gnosticism", spent a day reading the absolute wrong material, and concluded that he could make a "Big Brain" sounding observation/argument and have a puffed-shirt conversation with Canada's own Kermit. Maybe he knows more, but I simply can't shake the sense that he had his mind made up and wanted to connect these "Buzzworthy" ideas with gnosticism.

@gravytopic 3 ай бұрын

His grift is incredible. I just noticed New Discourses has like a 150 dollar member level or something. Very Bad Wizards boiled his frog years ago, and since then he won't step foot in front of any remotely critical audience, I think. Does he? It's all Costco Christians

@samrowbotham8914 3 ай бұрын

Marxism is a political ideology, Gnosticism is theology the two do not seem compatible to me.

@nynoah 3 ай бұрын

Marxism is a hidden theology where the masses are just useless cogs to be used and thrown on the ash heap of history in the quest to build utopia on earth.

@septillionsuns 3 ай бұрын

They are compatible in the arena of philosophy as a form of wrestling as a spectacle for the right to comfort themselves in narrow paradigms of thought control disguised as "the canon".

@notloki3377 3 ай бұрын

Marxism is a theory of man, a description of a fallen state, an eschatology, and a redemption arc.

@kaurikallio4668 Ай бұрын

Marxism is really gnostic in it's savior narrative. It is material gnostiscism. The french school of thought for example (Baraille,Deleuze, Lacan) combines these with the grotesqueness of french urban carneval

@SlickDissident 3 ай бұрын

Lindsay vs Resa Jorjani is inevitable... the question is, who captures the the Valor of hosting such a needful Bloodbath

@notloki3377 3 ай бұрын

they're running the old witch burning program without realizing that they themselves are fulfilling the role of the archetypal magician. take care when fighting monsters, lest you become one...

@nurilevy6831 3 ай бұрын

Wow! This discussion had so many well articulated points. It really nails some of the frustration I feel about JP, and worries about figures like Lindsay... Thank you, subscribed. I remember feeling the same way about the original podcast when it came out.

@richidpraah 3 ай бұрын

You can make any analogy you want given the many aspects and different versions of both Gnosticism and Marxism, but given that Marxism centrally implies a rejection of the notion of the next-world afterlife reward of the Christian culture in which it emerged, and replaced it with a commitment to this world and this life, and gradual betterment of this world as the only world, it seems on the face of it the complete opposite of what is very often implied by the word Gnosticism as rejection of the worldly, the bodily and the temporal-material as a kind of demonic prison, instead orienting the soul toward the eternal platonic/spiritual realm.

@GammaAuObsidian 3 ай бұрын

When are people gonna stop conflating satan with Lucifer

@J87Visuals 3 ай бұрын

When they get rid of their abrehamic mindset that the system keeps pulling them back into

@withoutboundsnow 3 ай бұрын

It's just easy to conflate, and much is simply lost in translation these daze.

@asw2185 3 ай бұрын

They are of a kin, as mythology tells us - ignore at your peril.

@GammaAuObsidian 3 ай бұрын

@@asw2185 A fictional book called Paradise Lost and abrahamic text mistranslation is why people conflate the two. The Latin word "Lucifer" is made up from two Latin words. Lux (=light) + ferous (=to bear or carry). The name "Lucifer" means in the Latin language "Light-bearer" or "Light-bringer". But that is not what the Hebrew word "heylel" means.

@asw2185 3 ай бұрын

@@GammaAuObsidian regardless of origins, the kinship of Lucifer and Satan has gained a powerful hold in the mythic, which to me is proof enough of something going on. Paradise Lost is an articulation of that - as an occultist I don’t really believe in fictions ;)

@user-qb2ze8pn9c 3 ай бұрын

To deny that both Marx and Hitler are extremely Gnostic is insane

@wkmac2 3 ай бұрын

Very good discussion. I think the point about conservatives being kind of risk averse is a valid point. I once called myself conservative and still hold some of those values even today but there was a kind of "also stand in one place" mentality that really didn't work over the longhaul. Fear is the mind killer was never a truer statement. But the other problem I see with conservatism and it seems Peterson and Lindsey fall into this trap is to try and conflate everything to which they disagree or fear as being communism or Marxism, mostly because it imposes State Power while ignoring their own uses of State power to their ends contrary to the individual. Peterson and Lindsey IMO take the easy road out and just invoke ad homs that take care of the need for heavy lifting thinking of a topic. At the same time, how would Peterson and Lindsey peg the likes of Mikhail Bakunin who himself an anarcho communist yet openly confronted Marx as being very wrong to use State Power to achieve communist ends and predicted it would destroy communism in the end. Even Noam Chomsky credits Bakunin for getting it right about the failures of 20th century State Communism as he predicted would happen. I'm having a hard time these days to determine if Peterson really believes the stuff he is saying or is he grifting to the audience who now embraces him and what they want too hear?

@nevisysbryd7450 3 ай бұрын

While Peterson was always hit-or-miss, especially in regards to politics, I think he never fully recovered from his drug addiction problem. He has been far less consistent, more aggressive/hostile, and contradicted some of his earlier positions since then. For as much as I agree about the basic premise of Gnosticism being highly influential in modern politics and Satanic in nature, Lindsey's work is often... sloppy. Like, he casually throws Hermeticism in as effectively interchangeable with Gnosticism, which is true neither theologically nor in its socio-economic or socio-political manifestations.

@Foolian1332 3 ай бұрын

I can also relate to this sentiment and think it's worth repeating. as for the end bit about peterson's post-addiction incomprehensibility, actually I would further emphasize the weight of the question. as with many of these public intellectual pseudo-mavens, there is an outsized potential for fog-clearing in the yet-unexercised practice of really rigorously taking these people to task for their inaccuracies and inconsistencies in the most good-faith way possible at scale. the closest example I can recall is Peterson humbling himself (read: exposing his woeful ignorance on the source material of his hobby horse) in the shamefully elucidating "debate" with Zizek. but that one didn't quite break the ice fully, and is still under-cited.. also, hi @nevisysbryd7450 :3

@Foolian1332 3 ай бұрын

for clarity, when I say "taking them to task" I mean structured in-person long-form conversation. NOT debate format, and not sideline critique

@kaurikallio4668 2 ай бұрын

Thank you sirs. Magician's complex was really important, the short-term fun instead of actually looking. Time of the trickster makes sense. Make me wonder about possession, identidications. The magician's complex thing would be something that is especially encouraged by post-modernism

@druidjuicer636 3 ай бұрын

As ever Gordon both fascinating and a stretch to keep up with. Miguel is ace and I shall seek out his stuff. Peterson is so bloody frustrating isn't he? I remember him crying publicly at the beauty of his visionary understanding of the origin of the design of a cathedral in the canopy of ancestral woodland.... Right there he got it and re-got it as he related it on video. And yet he balked at reaching the conclusion offered, that of a primal theism, a form speaking to him of rainforests, henges, caves in the direct language of vision. Amazing that he should think so little of this experience that he must box it off into something acceptable to his culture via mere words. But it frightens him doesn't it? The idea that something so distributed could be so potent. Right! Exactly? It matters and that's a bad thing because you can't switch it off? Anyway, bless him and bless us all. We're going to need it.

@Instramark 3 ай бұрын

To attack Gnosticism is to deny Jung. JP supposedly wrote his PHD dissertation on Jung. I guess JP is a fan of neither.

@J87Visuals 3 ай бұрын

JP is an establishment puppet.

@FriendlyDemon93 3 ай бұрын

If anything, postmodern theory (esp' work from Derrida) is more a half-baked form of Madhyamaka than anything else. It follows Nagarjuna in recognising that human concepts reduce the unfathomable & inexpressible flow of reality into shapes that fit our concerns, but misses that our concerns themselves are conditioned by that reality. They don't just arise on whim, to serve power & have an endless plasticity. They come from the very depth of our being & can't simply be theorised away or replaced.

@SG-gq2rf 3 ай бұрын

The scholastics said essence precedes existence. The postmodern theorists said that existence precedes essence. And the Buddhists said essence and existence co-create one another.

@Quotheraving 3 ай бұрын

I tend to agree but it feels more like an evolution of Sophistry to me. Sophistry held that the truth of a statement didn't matter, only your ability to convince others of your 'truth'. Postmodernism asserts that 'truth' is a human construction and that it is therefore negotiable. Both work like a shell game, abstracting terms or concepts in order to separate them from the reality they reference and then manipulating them using semantic or logical operations. Madhyamaka deals with the emptiness of phenomenological existence, Postmodernism and Sophistry deal purely with semantics and meaning.

@scottmcloughlin4371 3 ай бұрын

@@Quotheraving Yes! Look up Gabriel Rockhill here on YT. He's a professor in the USA. What we call "Critical Theory" and "Postmodernism" were post-WW2 NATO programs. That is called "The Synthetic Left." Part of Cold-War anti-commie manipulation of universities and university students.

@scottmcloughlin4371 3 ай бұрын

@@Quotheraving Look up "Congress For Cultural Freedom." That was a fake "intellectual" post-WW2 Cold War deep state program. All smoke and mirrors. Pure distractions. Anti-Labor focused.

@scottmcloughlin4371 3 ай бұрын

@@Quotheraving Also, most Americans forget that "Marxism" was BRITISH. Engels? Remember? It was spread as rabble rousing propaganda against enemies of the British Empire. Sowing seeds of chaos "globally."

@themadmattster9647 3 ай бұрын

Thanks for doing this episode. It always bothers me the direction Lindsay went in post Cynical Theories book. Plumrose is still tolerable but Lindsay is kind of off the rails. I doubt Whitney Webb or James Corbett would say "it all comes from gnosticism" as far as what's going on with the elites lol.

@RuneSoup 3 ай бұрын

I almost wanted to mention when talking about the jester that he should know better from his days of faking gender studies papers and getting them published in official publications. Oh well.

@junkman7901 3 ай бұрын

@xaime3802 3 ай бұрын

One can only think, what agenda, beyond simple ignorance, could those people possibly have by mischaracterizing gnosticism in such a way.

@junkman7901 3 ай бұрын

They are both genocide supporting Zionists and Gnosticism cancels out gods chosen people concept

@AlfredCadoux 3 ай бұрын

It's scapegoating to divert attention away from the actual culprits.

@abbasalchemist 3 ай бұрын

Fear of the Unconscious as Jung noted almost a century ago.

@J87Visuals 3 ай бұрын

@@AlfredCadoux those we can't name

@freethinker79 3 ай бұрын

"Yaldabaoth himself chose a certain man named Abraham from among the nations and made a covenant with him. To the effect that, if his seed continued to serve him, the Archons would give to them the Earth for their inheritance. Afterwards, by means of Moses, Yaldaboath brought forth Abraham's descendants from Egypt, and gave them the law, and made them Jews." --Irenaeus, "Against Heresies" (book 1, chapter 30, section 10)

@820monster 3 ай бұрын

Though obviously not identical the two share some highly significant similarities. 1. Critique of Materialism: Both Gnosticism and Marxism offer critiques of materialism. Gnosticism sees the material world as illusory or flawed, with a focus on transcending it to reach a higher, spiritual reality. Similarly, Marxism critiques capitalist materialism, where the focus on material possessions and profit is seen as dehumanizing. Both philosophies suggest that a deeper truth or reality lies beyond the material world. 2. Alienation: Both Gnosticism and Marxism speak to the theme of alienation. In Gnostic thought, humans are alienated from their true spiritual nature due to their existence in the material world, which is often seen as a prison created by a false god (the Demiurge). In Marxism, the working class is alienated from their labor and the products of their labor under capitalism. This alienation is seen as a form of disconnection from one's true essence or potential. 3. Emphasis on Liberation: Both Gnosticism and Marxism emphasize liberation from oppressive forces. Gnosticism seeks liberation from the material world and its constraints, aiming for gnosis (spiritual knowledge) to achieve salvation. Marxism aims for the liberation of the proletariat from the exploitation of the capitalist class, with the goal of creating a classless society. Both ideologies envision a future state of freedom from oppressive structures. 4. Dialectical Thinking: Both Gnosticism and Marxism employ dialectical thinking, although in different ways. Gnosticism often presents a dialectic between the material world and the spiritual realm, with the goal of transcending the material through understanding contrasts. Marxism, on the other hand, uses dialectical materialism to analyze the contradictions within capitalism, leading to its eventual collapse and the rise of socialism. 5. Salvation or Revolution: Gnostic theology and Marxist theory both propose a form of salvation or liberation. In Gnosticism, salvation comes through gnosis, a deep spiritual knowledge that leads to freedom from the material world. In Marxism, salvation is seen as the revolutionary overthrow of the capitalist system, leading to a socialist society where the means of production are collectively owned. 6. Hierarchical Critique: Both Gnosticism and Marxism critique hierarchical structures. Gnosticism often challenges the authority of religious hierarchies, emphasizing direct spiritual experience over institutional control. Marxism critiques the hierarchical structure of capitalist societies, aiming to abolish class hierarchies and create a more egalitarian social order. 7. The Role of Knowledge: Gnosticism places a high value on knowledge (gnosis) as a means of salvation. Similarly, Marxism emphasizes the importance of understanding the workings of capitalism (class consciousness) to bring about revolutionary change. Both ideologies suggest that knowledge is a powerful tool for liberation.

@withoutboundsnow 3 ай бұрын

Jimmy Dore's "bald and Jewish sidekicks" 😂 freaking love Kurt and the Due Dissidence boys🧡💙

@sidequestsally 3 ай бұрын

Everyone who is fortunate enough to have found this post: Listen to it carefully, then listen to it again. This is so very important for exposing the waters in which we swim, who crawls upon the earth and who will sink to the depths of the sea.

@undeadblackjack 3 ай бұрын

I never finish the main quests

@Adam-ww8ei 3 ай бұрын

lol what did this expose? These two weird old dudes disagree with Jordan Peterson? Wow so profound 🧐

@sidequestsally 3 ай бұрын

@@Adam-ww8ei And yet you are here. Stay mad at social media I guess. I'd also suggest actually listening to the post more carefully as they also largely agree with Peterson. Have a blessed day.

@sidequestsally 3 ай бұрын

Also it is a known fact Gordon is forever 27

@Adam-ww8ei 3 ай бұрын

@@sidequestsally oh sweetheart no one is mad. Just don’t think it is as profound as you’re making it. It is still interesting to listen to! That is why I’m here 😁. You have a good day as well 😊

@MrGunwitch 3 ай бұрын

Peterson's position on Israel and his statements viz. the current Palestinian genocide disqualify him from any serious discussion.

@junkman7901 3 ай бұрын

@Albruna_USA 3 ай бұрын

His fashion choices disqualify him.

@OerythiaDeQuatrefages 3 ай бұрын

He disqualified himself from anything from the start but internet ignorants and biased algorithms made him one.

@gravytopic 3 ай бұрын

His show with Jimmy Car includes a personal story which is illustrate something about his understanding of humor, and it's one of the unfunniest and ugliest analyses of what makes people funny that I've ever heard

@kingchief4038 26 күн бұрын

Two Great Minds here, if you wore a tweed jacket and grew grey stubble you might get an award

@Luxflux777 3 ай бұрын

Thank you for adressimg this, i saw james lindsey make these specious connections between gnosticism and marxism and said...huh?

@gravytopic 3 ай бұрын

Peterson, Lindsay... those guys just have to come up with a new central buzzword every few years ,I think, so people think they're hearing something new. Lindsay is such a dull speaker and writer, I'm astounded he's not some utterly obscure youtube crank. I think stuff like his podcast is used by most of his fans as background noise to mask their utter aloneness. It's mindnumbingly bad prose to actually listen to.

@undeadblackjack 3 ай бұрын

I apologize for comments I made earlier. I had misread and reacted to something Jordan Peterson was proclaiming apparently. Unfortunately for an intellectual droid from a Normanic-Rothschild university like Peterson you have to draw out things for them which you are doing. Specifically, I want to point out that the point of Gnosticism is to serve God and to be able to communicate directly to God which is why it is so politically shunned by orthodoxy. The stories of Gnosticism only function as a bedrock of psychological definition to separate between the material plane and the spiritual one. There are many branches within Gnosticism, but the point of all of them is connection to the same source.

@DanHowardMtl 3 ай бұрын

In that video I don't recall them saying gnostic so what are you on about?

@theomnisthour6400 3 ай бұрын

Satan, or Shaitan means adversary. It is not a male entity, and existed before sex was even created. It is the source of all anti-creative forces - chaos, entropy, corruption, laziness, plagiarism, etc. It is embodied in many god and goddess forms, as well as hive mind entities. It has gone by the names Tiamat, Lilith, Asherah, Isfet, Ishtar, Astarte, Oestre, Aphrodite, Asuras, Succubi/Incubi, Sin, Shiva, Kali, etc. and has corrupted the cults and bleedership of many other gods and goddesses with dark Satanic rituals of blood and sex magic. Lucifer is the primordial entity God charged with creating and maintaining the physical universe - the testing realm for creations that fine tuned the laws of physics and chemistry and has most recently been testing the final lab release of Karma, the gem of the Gaia experiment, which has been awaiting the successful awakening of God himself as the Messiah - a better version of the first creator - as proof that the system is ready to let out of the containment lab of our planet. Humanity is the final chosen test species for Karma, built not for goodness and intelligence, but to hit the most diverse set of corner cases that Karma needs to sort into the prepared "rooms" of the heavens - spiritual universes - that match them with the company they merit or deserve and allows them to eventually earn a rise to the god levels of consciousness and creative control of their own universe in the expanding simulation multiverse. This is the truth of the better gnostic traditions. Some cults worship a corrupted incarnation of Lucifer, which is where the Devil imagery comes from. The corrupted Luciferians and Lilithians have been working together to keep planning Great Resets to corrupt, assimilate, or destroy chosen species in a sort of "whack-a-messiah" effort to keep the real big Messiah Santa Claus from coming and corrupt little messiahs, and arranged the downfall of many past civilizations on this planet before humanity became the chosen ones. Their favorite game is alternating cult marxism - alternating and neverending oppressor/oppressed conflicts that led Hindus and Buddhists to think that creation was cyclical - an huge insult to God, and poor thanks for defending their right to free thought and responsible free will or to abdicate that right by rejoining "source" - the source of all NPC "me too" entities and ideas, not all knowledge, easy enlightenment, and perfect "love" as Hermetic fools think. The highest version of Lucifer is the spiritual leader of the tall greys, a species that is deeply involved in the current apocalypso dance contest, who only became aware that the real Messiah had fully awakened last year, which is why disclosure is accelerating, and the Satanic globalist elites are getting so desperate to push the US into civil conflict and the world into apocalyptic war. There have been many chosen peoples who contributed partially awakened Messiahs to the evolving test plan over the centuries, the 12 tribes nonsense in the Bible is stolen from earlier civilizations and only partly ties to Israel roots, and the real Garden of Eden was on the mostly sunken continent of Lemuria, between Indonesia and the Philippines. Neither Jerusalem, Rome, or Mecca is a holy city any more, having all become infiltrated by servants of the adversary. If you'd like to dig deeper, I suggest checking out Robert Sepehr's channel, starting with this segment: kzbin.info/www/bejne/bafNqnhmr9-Ie8Usi=3uJCRgTZZimGyg6- The world is being played for fools by the hermaphrodite arch demon Hive Mind Queen of Lies and Deception, Lilith - pushed into self-destruction by her/his/it/them's agents in the CCP-WEF crony globalist axis of evil and their woke cult and marxist anarchist useful idiots.

@GnosticInformant 3 ай бұрын

The Carpocrations were absolutely writing about social justice and egalitarianism and lived in communal pockets where all were equal. Read Epiphanes "On Justice", where he says all genders, animals, people are equal under God. He was the son of Carpocrates and Marcellina. So I would push back a little against Miguel for saying that there is no texts about Social Utopia. But this is just one group, and this is also why I think the word "Gnostic" can be problematic, since not all Gnostics are the same.

@MandyMoorehol 3 ай бұрын

Fancy seeing you here lol 🐶 🐶 🐶

@GnosticInformant 3 ай бұрын

haha!@@MandyMoorehol

@abbasalchemist 3 ай бұрын

I also found Miguel's characterization of gnosis as dealing with "information" rather sloppy. Gnostics.taking shamanistic journeys and coming back to their communities bringing important "information" smacks of Voegelin's critique. Gnosis is not information---that is simple instrumentality. Gnosis is knowledge that arises from an erotic encounter by the soul that transforms it.

@MrNoobophile 3 ай бұрын

Out of curiosity, who were the gnostics that taught that there is a distinct difference between certain groups?

@juann268 3 ай бұрын

I genuinely don’t know (I write this post from a place of total ignorance), but is it wise to equate “we’re all equal under God” to “we’re all equal in rights and duties in our society”? Because somehow I can see the two being approached differently. I am NOT defending the racist or sexist connotation here, but I can see how a dog and a chicken, or a shoemaker and a priest are “equal under God” (all four) and still could be considered not equal under the Law in a particular society. I don’t know anything about the Carpocrations, but the word “just” has meant a lot of different things for a lot of different people. And “egalitarian” is a young concept.

@daousdava 3 ай бұрын

love Miguel

@freethinker79 3 ай бұрын

@lizgilbert9129 3 ай бұрын

Thank you very much for this discussion. I follow Gnosticism - not advanced enough to be able to call myself a Gnostic - in one of many Gnostic societies that exist today. I'd also listened to a lot of James Lindsay. However, when he got Gnosticism so terribly wrong, it threw into doubt everything else he says, and I can no longer listen to him. Peterson I can, because he is self-reflective and searching for truth. Lindsay takes himself so seriously . I had listened to the talk you played, and turned off, wondering what else he didn't know much about. As an academic librarian I expect experts to know their stuff. My comment about Gnosticism is that it has a fundamental self-ish quality. Heal thyself before you go telling others what to do because we all carry our own Karma. Just pray for them and the world. (more complex than that, but completely at odds with Marxism or socialism)

@treesurgeon2441 3 ай бұрын

James Lindsey is a good place to start for understanding the CRT and far left crowd but you always have to check his homework and come to your own conclusions. His work on Gnosticism though is pure schizo posting and it's rotting his mind.

@gravytopic 3 ай бұрын

James Lindsay episode on Very Bad Wizards" just heard it for the first time, not to be missed

@neveniveta2652 3 ай бұрын

Tip for Mr Rune Soup: If you already invited the guest, let him talk a bit

@Charles-allenGodwin 3 ай бұрын

Gnosis = Being aware of being aware. The Word of Truth (Logos) is ever faithful (loyal, true, isomorphic) to Reality/Life (That which is/That I am).

@septillionsuns 3 ай бұрын

And also most aligned with the first Christian church than any contemporary abomination of indoctrination and prosperity.

@Charles-allenGodwin 3 ай бұрын

@@septillionsuns 💝

@J87Visuals 3 ай бұрын

@nathanpayne5009 wrong. Lots of chrsitians demonised gnosticism snd their demonisation were admissions in themselves. Gnosticism is not Chrsitianity

@1amjapan 3 ай бұрын

Thank you for this, it's been bugging me too.

@lobotomyboy666 3 ай бұрын

You two are excellent together. This is amazing.

@krisnaylor9488 3 ай бұрын

The covid authoritarians are vastly different from people that see the terrifying spiral downward and still are peace filled and joyful. When i see the Hard Cope I am happy.

@user-qb2ze8pn9c 3 ай бұрын

"How could we believe its a horrible universe, yeah its a horrible universe lol

@kaurikallio4668 2 ай бұрын

One could say that the post-modernists have their own gnostiscism that in very mechanistic, which goes back to certain gnostic ideas among Edmund Husserl , among others. Deleuze and Guattari's material gnostiscism is obvioisly a founsing theology to our current technocrat aesthetics. It is a Anti-Oedipus ans A Thousand Plateaus are spell books. I was brainwashed by them for a time. This video actually helped me disentangle from my Cain complex. Really big thank you ❤

@jambo52 3 ай бұрын

back to 2017 old skool vibes' GxM

@veiler8415 3 ай бұрын

Trillbillies is a good podcast they are loosely affiliated with the chapo trap house podcast. They grew up in a Christian background so it’s a good lens to see our world today. Thanks

@starofsiam1 3 ай бұрын

Stupendous piece Gordon.

@nocarrotjuststick3375 3 ай бұрын

How do you spell Yano kuliano?

@Axel_Kidd 3 ай бұрын

My 1st reply has disappeared for some reason. His name exists in two spellings. Search for these two books - The Tree of Gnosis: Gnostic Mythology from Early Christianity to Modern Nihilism", and Eros and Magic in the Renaissance".

@alessandro7619 2 ай бұрын

Ioan P. Culianu

@realandthebandit2535 3 ай бұрын

Source: BBC 4 In our Time Karl Marx. The gnostic element in the manifesto is the replacement of God with the individual as the creator of reality.

@VioletFlameStudios 3 ай бұрын

Short answer, no.

@arifreeman 3 ай бұрын

I didn't get the point Gordon wanted to make about the holocaust. Did anyone else? Felt under-explained.

@freethinker79 3 ай бұрын

Fantastic conversation! Classical Gnosticism was largely anarchist (anti-archon) and against all forms of authoritarianism RE: authority (the "Archontes"). Mindlessly slapping a fascist or communist label on anything truly "Gnostic" is laughably inaccurate and just plain old ridiculous.

@thijmstickman8349 2 ай бұрын

I feel like they just defined enlightenment philosofy as gnostiscm and then pointed out all the enlightenment elements in marxism and "wokeness". The concept of feudalism was constructed by nobility and it imprisons you in the class you are born in, and we had to become enlightened in order to change society away from feudalism. Marxism is just a continuation to that, Marxists say the exact same thing about capitalism as liberals say about feudalism: The concept of private property was constructed and imprisons you in the class you were born in, we have to become class conscious in order to change society away from capitalism. You obviously dont have to agree that the two are analogous, but gaining knowledge in order to change society is just enlightenment, not gnosticism.

@clocksfinle7 3 ай бұрын

any half-read gnostic should know exactly the game being played with this one.. jeez.. james lindsay?..

@LadyLuck8_4 3 ай бұрын

I understand Foucault was an anarchist.

@user-qb2ze8pn9c 3 ай бұрын

Yall dont see the big picture

@JillFreeman-kb4ih 3 ай бұрын

why divide left and right? a bird needs two wings to fly, gentlemen.

@JumboDubby 3 ай бұрын

Imagine defending the Uniparty 😂 Enjoy your plane ride to Little St. James!

@arandmorgan 3 ай бұрын

We lost the other wing when communist Russia fell, and there was no more reason for capitalists to sustain the interests of the proletariat.

@JillFreeman-kb4ih 3 ай бұрын

@@JumboDubby who am i defending? anything to fight, eh? have fun waiting for the ufo.

@starofsiam1 3 ай бұрын

JBP has said of left vs right: there is utility in both.

@starofsiam1 3 ай бұрын

Watching this I experienced the sensation of intellectually biting off more than I can chew. Effing awesome man I ❤️‍🔥you both.

@nikoroo 3 ай бұрын

Finally! It’s about time someone began addressing the blatant mischaracterising of gnosticm by Lindsay… I’d been following his work since 2020, and was disappointed with the misinformed angle he’s since taken. Now he and Peterson have completely lost me. That being said, they’re both reductionist materialists - no better than the wokists they’re criticising. They’ll never fully understand the essence of what they’re both trying to argue if they just keep trying to intellectually muscle through this concept, within their limited ‘good vs bad’, dualistic paradigm; unless they do some magic mushrooms or something…. Also, can someone please help me out? I’m trying to Look up the person Miguel referenced around the last ten minutes of this (great!) talk. “Yannou Koulianou”? I’m just typing in phonetically from how I heard Miguel say it. But nothing is coming up on DuckDuckGo… what’s his actual name? Or are there other sources I can look up? Thanks!

@freethinker79 3 ай бұрын

I believe Miguel is referencing Ioan P. Couliano who wrote the classic book "The Tree of Gnosis."

@christheother9088 3 ай бұрын

Johnny Meatsack!

@BrendaNolen 3 ай бұрын

Or reboot of Pirates of the Caribbean. Ugh

@adrianstumpp5883 3 ай бұрын

You're giving Lindsey way too much credit. For him, gnosticism is a scapegoat. Nothing more, nothing less. It is a vessel to pour sins into. That's it's entire meaning and utility to him. Peterson's is richer. It's grounded in Jung and has an appreciation of the virtures and the vices in the metaphysics implied. But for Lindsey, it's just something to blame everything that sucks on.

@septillionsuns 3 ай бұрын

Precisely, it's just a way for them to play the "we are right and they are wrong game". This is the product of ALL contemporary Judeo-Christian thinking including Islam. Why? Because their ENTIRE WORLD VIEW is black and white. There is no pluralistic outcome in their paradigms. It's the very ground that god forsaken predestination sprouted from. Instead of rationalizing a loving God who can take the whole of existence into the afterlife, they barter with their logic with a type of intellectual narcissism that is dangerous, terrifying, and rooted in fear and sadness. This is why Eastern religions are superior for a loving future: paradise for them is for everyone and the world doesn't have to be destroyed to get there.

@septillionsuns 3 ай бұрын

1:12:00 I do think there are some instances where their criticism of corporatized liberalism is important for the left to reach a point of self-reflection. They are keying in on the fact that corporatism has hijacked the left in such a mind numbing way with Antifa actually ushering in a leftist fascist state with no space for dialogue. I always found this ironic, especially because Foucault's whole episteme is centered on discourse and he would absolutely renounce the DEI monstrosity of committee as panopticon and the social credit system it aims to erect.

@PicnicForOne 2 ай бұрын

You tube bingo, firefly reboot.

@clocksfinle7 3 ай бұрын

i think david lindsay might just be trying to reclaim his identity from the original david lindsay.. 1920s gnostic author of voyage to arcturus.. 😆

@DanHowardMtl 3 ай бұрын

Dude you say you don't play word games and use "exitopian"? WTF is that?

@undines3979 3 ай бұрын

Excellent.

@SavageReality 3 ай бұрын

@clocksfinle7 3 ай бұрын

are we sure someone like james lindsay is doing exactly what the gnostic demiurge aspires to do... think about the affect he has on his audiences.. they are stroked to the near limit about material threats.. solidified in their tether to material fears.. pretty clear.. ok. im out. i have had enough of that corner of the world for 5 lifetimes..

@joebotz1243 3 ай бұрын

No its not

@Instramark 3 ай бұрын

I don't know about Joseph Farrell who seems to be a Trumper. I can't think of any Gnostic text that supports a Trump. Farrell has a degree in Patristics from Oxford or so he says. Interesting guy though. Knows a lot about the Nazis and Hermeticism.

@notesencantos 26 күн бұрын

Isn't "wokeism" kind of like "antifa?"

@septillionsuns 3 ай бұрын

Postmodernism is a bad interpretation of Marxism--it's an expression of late capitalism that is similar to symptoms being an expression of the disease. In essence, postmodernism is leprosy sores and artistic societal fascination with the disease expression. At its roots, it is abhorrent. What is amazing to me is that Peterson makes these leaps and in none of these leaps does he understand that Christ was a communist and that Marxism is Christianity for the masses (kind of like Christianity was platonism for the masses). At the end of the day, the Catholic Church created the canon for a reason and is terrified of human ascension within heretical teachings. Why? Because they cannot control it. There are a few episodes where Peterson calls his enemies "worshipers of Gaia" as if it were some sort of pejorative. Let me be clear, if you do not worship this gift of a planet we inhabit, you are not only clueless--you are dangerous.

@jeanninethompson933 3 ай бұрын

I came to this discussion because my recent read of the "Master and Margarita" made me curious about Lucifer and tricksters. Seems like this book is having a recent resurge in popularity and a new film adaptation was well-received by the public, maybe too well-received because the film maker is being attacked by pro-Kremlin propogandists. Maybe "old manuscripts never burn" because their plot lines never really go away.