Is Zbrush Dead? Artists react to Maxon's new Policy

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

What do you guys think about these thoughts that we shared? How do you think this is going to affect the majority of the artists?

[@MrSanson]

Well , I'm afraid of this deal, to be honest, luckily you were on the conversation and offer another point of view to all of this, JHill is a really NICE dude, but like lots of americans, he doesn't know about other people's country economy situation. What scares me about it is if JHill being a really good guy, thinks like that, just imagine Maxon CEOs... I don't disagree with himi much, in fact he is RIGHT in most of his points, yes pay once , it's terrible for business, this model isn't good for zbrush I agree. His Unreal example is really good . But what might be "cheap" for americans its often a fortune to other countries , including Brazil (my country) u$1 = 5,57Real(Brazil money) and raising... and yes there are worse country situation. Ok you might say there are successful Brazilians artists... but they are exceptions here, believe it or not. But... let's wait... 🤷

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

@@MrSanson Thank you for the comment. Every business exists to generate income and that is how it should be. the question is who is going to pay that money. people that can not afford it or big corporations that can afford to pay more for all softwares. The reality is that nothing is free in this world. you may not pay it upfront but somewhere you will pay for it otherwise no one would make anything. I totally understand your point of view and let's hope for the best and stay positive because we all need to use ZBrush as it changed lives.

[@Imhotep397]

Can anyone explain to me why we deserve this? It’s just something that I have never understood…whenever there’s some kind of revenue shortfall the answer always ends up as “Stick it to the artists” when the software companies “should be” working with us. We’re not making the hundreds of millions of dollars. The corporate entities that we work with DO NOT KNOW HOW TO MAKE THE TOOLS OR HOW TO USE THE TOOLS. The only reason they have the money is because we continue to allow them to keep most of it and refuse to work together to demand what’s fair relative to what our part is in generating the revenue. I’m going to keep using Zbrush, because I bought my license 2 years ago, but making blender integral to what I do is now my main priority.

[@fractalelement857]

Zbrush is not dead but character art is. Now it's all technical. Metahumans for example are one of the great examples, downside of it is that reduced number of 3d character art job positions. I am talking especially about newcomers here. Now everybody can make a 3d character, even somebody who is not a character artist. It's easier for the 3d character artists who are already in the game for years. This is going to become even worse in the future because everything is going towards automation. You will be able to generate any kind of characters/creatures in the next 10 years. Better go study for a lawyer or doctor, or web designer.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

@@fractalelement857 concept design is probably the way to go :D

[@DavesChaoticBrain]

For me, in Canada, Substance is $52 per month and includes Stager, Painter, Sampler, and Designer. That DOES NOT include any Photoshop/Premier/Etc plans which are separate at a minimum of $13 per month for JUST Photoshop or $70 per month for Adobe's "All Apps" bundle which DOES NOT include the Substance software. These are the prices for an Individual. So this, combined with subscriptions for many other tools adds up VERY quickly and becomes EXTREMELY out of reach for many people who might want to do stuff as either a hobby, or to learn to eventually get a job.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

this is what we talked about exactly. many people can not afford it if it becomes to expensive for them which is sad.

[@mr_don_key]

or $70 per month for Adobe's "All Apps" bundle which DOES NOT include the Substance software

[@DavesChaoticBrain]

@@mr_don_key Where do you live? I'm looking at the list right now for the package that costs $71.99 per month here in Canada. It lists 27 apps and the Substance ones are not on that list.

[@DavesChaoticBrain]

@@mr_don_key There is a separate package available for $65.99 per month that includes Stager, Painter, Sampler, and Designer. There is also a smaller package for $25.99 that doesn't include Stager. But I have no options available to me, that I can see, that includes the Photoshop and Premier collection of apps WITH the Substance Apps.

[@mr_don_key]

@@DavesChaoticBrain Oops, you are correct on the missing substance software... Adobe cloud desktop made it appear it was included (it's at the bottom of available apps).. but it's just a trial version.. those bastards! (i have not a use for substance yet, as i use marmoset toolbag 4, zbrush itself and 3d coat for texturing , so therefor never installed it from the cloud, but i saw it in the available apps list multiple times).

[@CajkSe]

Subscription model in my opinion provides very poor incentive for developers to add any new functionality to programs, especially when it concerns software that is an industry standard and has objectively zero competition.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

That is another concern that I have too. I hope they consider all the artists before they make a big change.

[@creativeearthian1702]

Nomad Sculpt. It's coming to desktop for peanut price and once it spreads its legs, it really should spell BIG trouble for Zbrush. Pros in the 3D field are still largely oblivious to just how great piece of software Nomad really is

[@ZephrusPrime]

I would be excited if Epic would have bought Pixologic, Maxon is as scary as Adobe.

[@rodames1089]

Lol I have just wrote the same

[@innerguardianXIII]

I agree. You would have thought Epic and Pixologic would be bosom buddies (and even mix ZBrush with Quixels Megascans/Mixer). Maxon on the other hand....who here uses Cinema 4D? I for one don't and have no real care for it. Cinema 4D is less known than Maya and there are 2 programs that blow those out of the water and into space. Houdini (which does have a free use licence as long as you mention it's Houdini and keep the watermark on your Houdini project) and Blender. It's like, why get Photoshop, when you can get Gimp (which is slightly better and Free)? Hell, why get Photoshop when you can get Clip Studio Paint Pro (which might not be free but it has Animation functions and has been used to make official Anime)?

[@joshua42777]

@@innerguardianXIII steam at least has substance painter on perpetual. Maxon isn't doing that., I hat maxon more.

[@MarquisDeSang]

Don’t worry, Blender is slowly but surely getting closer to Zbrush.

[@svendkorsgaard9599]

Well at Least it aint Autodesk.

[@msimon1984]

Look at corporations these days. Money gouging, low quality updates, with the least respect for the consumer

[@beldaross1912]

As someone who relies on student licenses, I hate this. When you start adding up all the subscriptions you need to get an asset through a industry standard pipeline, it gets ridiculous.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

It’s turning into a big profiting machine. It’s even hard for professionals to keep up with all the subscriptions!

[@saschasteenaart7589]

@@EdgeloopAcademy And that's for professionals who are already making money. Imagine being a starting artist now. It's next to impossible.

[@Patxi__]

What I plan to do is work with a pirate version of zbrush and if anyone ask, I made it with blender. I also never paid for photoshop and Ive been using it for 12 years.

[@4Ddraftsman]

Молодец

[@Novanim]

Sorry but I don't find the arguments in favor of the new business model too compelling. As you guys are saying, it's too early to come into conclusions, so we don't know if Maxon is going to make actual improvements over the software . At the same time, it seems you are justifying this new business model by how much Pixologic has given to the industry. If they were bought by a bigger company, it's highly probable they will get a better deal in terms of money already. The rest of the earnings...who knows where that goes. Not to mention, these prices are not necessarily adjusted for artists on development countries....so points to Blender I guess.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

Thank you for the comment. Blender so far has no use case in any game studio but who knows when that could change. I guess we just have to wait and see at this point.

[@hectorescobar9450]

@@EdgeloopAcademy actually, there are a lot of Indi game studios using Blender as well a bigger studios such as Ubisoft animation studio. I come from Maya and now we switched to Blender. A few Netflix shows are using Blender as well as Japanese studios. The guys behind Evangelion use Blender as well as Tesla. Funny how little people know about this.. Blender is starting to gain ground. People who don’t use Blender often think is a subpar tool. (Myself included before really properly using it)

[@Scultronic]

10 dollars per month in my country Ecuador is kind of affordable, the current 40 dollars is a huge amount of money when the minimum salary here is only 100 dollars per month LOL you basically spend half of your salary in ONE software.

[@omaior20]

Piracy will save us all, cgpeers made more professional artists than schools. I don't know a single person that paid for Zbrush to learn it and I don't know any professional artist that can't afford to ply for Zbrush. This change for now means nothing, people that pirated Zbrush will keep pirating and people that paid will keep paying and if the price gets way too high people will just move to blender.

[@opusepynomus9995]

Dude wtf ..don't openly mention names of such sites on socal media platforms Do you want it to get banned .

[@gabe687]

It looks like Blender sculpting is not bad at all now with the High poly models. They changed something in the code and now I can sculpt on a 14 + million point model like it's nothing. Scrubbing my brush as fast as I can, and I feel zero lag. I couldn't get even close to that a few builds ago and it kind of blew my mind. It can't really compare yet to the sculpting tools in Zbrush, but it makes up for it in many other ways.

[@MovingDungeons]

Blender is great but you can only work on one 14 million object at a time. That’s the advantage of ZBrush is that it switches unselected models into 2.5D Pixols and that’s why you can go into the billions of polygons and not have to work on one 14 million polygon object at a time.

[@gabe687]

@@MovingDungeons That's true, ZBrush is still way more powerful, but I can get around 85 million in blender and switch between the objects pretty quickly with the hot key alt+q while hovering the mouse on a mesh. It takes a second + to build the cache, longer the more objects you have, but then it's buttery smooth on the sculpting. It's more than enough for the stuff I do at least.

[@aryafin]

its not about polycount, blender is like baby, where as zbrush is a god.

[@gabe687]

@@aryafin Zbrush is my main sculpting tool, but I find that most of the time I only use the basic tools anyway. Overall Zbrush is made for sculpting, so a dedicated app is expected to be better at their subject. But then it can't do a ton of the stuff that a traditional modeling application can, so give and take. I'll use anything, jumping back and forth as needed. I use Blender for polygon modeling mainly, I like the way it handles. It has some cool features that Zbrush is lacking, like how you can sculpt on a rigged and animated mesh. You can modify the topology on a sculpt without destroying it, or having to reproject anything. The viewport is better than Zbrush, the retopology tools are way better. If you want to look at it that way then Blender is the God compared to Zbrush, but who cares anyway, use both.

[@rodames1089]

I wish were Epic who bought Zbrush as they did with Megascans… things would be different.

[@696mutte]

Nice to get an Idea how you guys think about it... but a bit naive to even think that any company will ever pay for my subscription as a freelance artist... and I don't think Maxon will give any free stuff tbh beginning or pro.

[@BlackJuju13Gaming]

Any subscription model for the software used in CG is just predatory. Like Jason Hill said, it is good for business. I think it is good only for businesses. On the user end, it not fair at all. Keeps people paying a lot of money instead to pay only once, or even pay for a new version now and then. And about what Jason said, what does it mean "to nice"? How being nice got to be kind of a bad thing? All in all, in my opinion, I think it's all about money, and nothing else. And about what Siamak said, that it's about business models, not art and fun, seams kind of odd, because I imagine both speakers here got to where they are because of there passion for art, and maybe fun. I get that both of them got to a point their carriers when they are thinking more about business, but what about the younger people, for whom the passion for art is more important, or people in many parts of the world who do not have the same oportunities or money to constantly pay. There are other thoughts that are coming to mind, but this is the first time for me writing a comment here, so I'll stop. :) Anyway, these are just personal opinions, nothing more. Other than that, keep making great art, people! :)

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

Thank you for your comment. Please read this carefully to have a better view. For sure business exists to make money! I have not seen a single corporation that would say "let's help people and let's not worry about money". They solve a problem and make money. I made this channel to support artists because of the things I went through in life. I am not coming from a rich family and lived under many hard circumstances that I wanted to give up many times or even thought about suicide when I was younger, so I really don't understand where was the fun that you mentioned. It was not fun to live under a dictatorship for 22 years under constant anxiety, stress, pressure and poverty. It was not fun to move to another country and be bullied days in and out and it was not fun to live in the streets for 2 weeks because I could not afford a room to rent when I left Iran. It wasn't also fun when I was called a terrorist and got gaslighted at work because I was coming from the Middle East! Despite all that I did not give up, left my lead job from a big company that everyone dreams to work in to pursue something that felt more valuable to me. I got involved in art because I am a creator and I can not change that and it is a lot more than passion and fun. I know how it feels to not have money to eat and to not have money to buy an application! That is why I mentioned I hope they really do something for those that really need it to support talents but I know that will not happen and we can not change that. On the pixologic side, I think they did what they had the right to do and they already changed many lives and they owe nothing to anyone. Please stop imagining about people that you don't know. 36 years is a long time to imagine it in a sentence! Thanks for watching the video and thanks for your support.

[@BlackJuju13Gaming]

@@EdgeloopAcademy Thank you very much for the reply. :) If my post seamed like a personal attack or judgement, I am sorry, it was not my intention. I really respect both of you as artists and what you do for the CG community. I also now some thing about your personal life story, as I am following you for a long time now, and, from what you said, your life was definitely not easy. For the "fun" part, I was meaning to link it to the art part, as having fun while making art, I was not speaking about fun in general. Yes, business is about making money. What I wanted to point out is that, in my opinion, making money and greed are different things. And yes, 36 years is a long time to imagine it in a sentence, as well as 45. :D In the end, I want to say that I really appreciate what you and many other established artists are doing the for the next generation of artists and for the art community in general. All the best!

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

@@BlackJuju13Gaming I didn't get offended. words don't deliver the feeling without sound. Yes for sure greed is a big problem in our modern society and it is getting worse. It won't be sustainable this way for too long. Thanks for your support. I appreciate that you spend the time to read and comment. Also don't be sorry for stating your mind. Unfortunately the path is so rough for artists that the fun just gets sucked out of it.

[@michaelkoros592]

@@EdgeloopAcademy Hello sir. I learned that the hard way from loving and learning the guitar when I was a 12yr old daydreamer. Now at the age of 55 I want to learn Zbrush and all the other popular software and I am starting from an informed but "learn everything the hard way" type of beginning . I wasn't raised from a life of affluence but I think that's the "nebula" for many a creative young, growing mind. Thanx for providing an informative KZbin channel sir.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

@@michaelkoros592you are welcome! Glad to hear that you like the channel.

[@SerafinGrivel]

Super good video. good combination of you two talking :) and i feel the same about this topic, lets just wait and hope, that they'll make the right choises

[@cgeye292]

I would hate it if they do something like a Cbrush4D instead of upgrading ZBrush stand alone.

[@Giga3D811]

bingo. thats exactly what theyre gonna do :)

[@languin12]

C4D has really shitty development.

[@likesyrup_creative]

They should def figure out a way to make the price regional

[@oakmin9047]

tbf the development of zbrush has been really slow. There is so much they could've done last few years like improving texturing and layer system but did not capitalize on it. The only saving grace is that what they have is already great and older users are not asking for much either.

[@KRGraphicsCG]

I've had my ZBrush license since 2006 and I'm honestly not upset about this merger... For my projects, ZBrush had been a cornerstone in my pipeline and it will be there to STAY!! I use it for nearly everything from Characters to Engineering projects... I am not a "paid professional", but I have mastered ZBrush so much that I cannot replace it. If the subscription is reasonable, I'm on board

[@OST1350]

I tried to buy Zbrush perpetual license from a retailer but I got the money back because the licenses were no longer available. That is when I heard of Maxon for the first time. What a bunch of trashfolk are the ones at Maxon. I hate them.

[@LEGIT134]

Yeah, blender. You said it. I am slowly trying to brush up on Blender for the faithful day when my Zbrush doesn’t work because I am not paying the monthly subscription😲

[@babi92100able]

"safe investment, I've never been charged for any update since 1992 BC" I bought perpetual licence last year and was happy to do so because i like pixologic, the community etc. Aaaand my ass hurts now.

[@Imhotep397]

Zbrush is dead ☠️. Pixo should have charged annual maintenance for all those years or funded some entertainment products that were successful and/or charge studios points on the revenue on all the various projects Zbrush was used on. It was never $100-$200 to buy Zbrush. Now is really a bad time for this with nomad sculpt and blender and kodon and 3Dcoat and it seems like more sculpting apps may be coming. Younger people don’t have the kind of dependency on apps people that have been in the industry for a while have.

[@mr_don_key]

indeed the 1999 price was (non intro price) 600-ish usd.

[@jayberan]

great conversation, appreciate both perspectives and thoughts it was enlightening and thanks for sharing!

[@Rikitangoable]

I don't get how no one has made something as powerful as Zbrush, tried blender and 3dcoat but they aren't anywhere near the sculpting capabilities of Zbrush.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

I think if they could, they would do it. There are always products that stand on top of the rest of the products out there.

[@Rikitangoable]

@@EdgeloopAcademy that's true, could be a huge opportunity for someone to come by with their more powerful program and snap up the people sick of Zbrush's prices.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

@@RikitangoableHow are people sick of ZBrush price? It was the cheapest 3D software so far as far as I know.

[@Rikitangoable]

​@@EdgeloopAcademy just like you say in the video how are students meant to learn with prices like Zbrush, its a gap in the market imo, it doesn't effect me but it would be nice to see the people who can't afford it be able to use programs like these for learning.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

@@Rikitangoable Yes I understand now. for me also it is ok. I guess people that can not afford it will crack it anyway and probably they don't care about this.

[@martinschemmel84]

I think taking sides is a little crappy. Like saying "oh they did so well towards all of us, they deserve to get more moneys" I'm sure they made their time worthwhile, but for a company based on investors there can never be enough money to be made. So here is the difference. It's not like some individual or a team suddenly gets a pat on the back for making more money which they DESERVED, it's investors geting more money which they certainly didnt deserve to many extends. That's at least usually the case. now Maxon is a mixed bag. There is Maxon GmbH and Maxon Inc. one is based on stocks and investors. So where does the money go to? Now I wonder.. when you go out there to the regular stores around you.. let's say you wanted to ride a bike, who does offer you the bike for a one time payment and who offers you a subscription? XD And I DONT think those people DESERVE more money on their portfolio.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

Thanks for the feedback. That is a good point of view.

[@saschasteenaart7589]

"for a company based on investors there can never be enough money to be made". And that's why the world is going to shit. Money is all that matters and it all flows into the same few pockets while the rest of us will be left behind. And no, they won't need us forever to keep the market going, what do you need a market for when you have the resources, the means of production and the money already? Most of humanity will be living in squalor while the rich will live in gated communities. In a few decades, when i will fortunately be dead, at least 40% of jobs will be gone and they won't be replaced. We know this already but humanity has a major problem looking ahead further than 5 years into the future. AI and automation will get cheaper and cheaper and better and better and you can't reschool someone with an IQ of 90 to compete with that.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

@@saschasteenaart7589 I think something major is going to happen. MIT research also predicted collapse of human society by 2040 but new data shows we are ahead of the schedule already.

[@saschasteenaart7589]

@@EdgeloopAcademy i was kind of hoping covid would have shown humanity is on the wrong path and that a concentrated effort would have been made to innoculate the whole world. Instead we chose to ignore the plight of poorer countries, left them to rot and now deal with mutations that traveled from there to the west. Good job world. Unless we realize that to make it as a species we need to lift up everyone i don't see it ending any other way than the oppressed at some point rising up against the rich and the end result will be an absolute hellhole.What we need is: curb private wealth accumulation (nobody needs more than 5 million to be happy and nobody is worth more than 5 million), laws against massive mergers and lobbying (big corporations have too much power to influence democracies with the end result being corporate fascism), UBI (there won't be enough jobs for everyone but everyone's needs need to be met), a science council that sets goals for governments (because politicans think ahead 4 years to the next election and are mostly guided by what people want, whereas scientists tend to think ahead much further and have a better view on what people need). But that's a tall order for a selfish myopic species.

[@LandOfBits]

did you mentioned 3dcoat ???

[@fractalelement857]

Also the thing i don't understand is how come they didn't come to hair / groomming solution so far after many years. They could provide a lot of free examples of haircuts,brows,lashes, or to make some new haircard feature at least. People are struggling to make something so so generic like freakin eyebrows, or some simple male/female haircuts. That is something very important but they didn't do anything about it. Fibermesh sucks.

[@mizgovfx]

I am definitely with you guys in supporting the tool creators. If I as an artist rely on some tool because I need it, or it's a better match for me than another tool, it should be definitely projected to the price of that tool. Free updates for a lifetime is a terrible business model, if there isn't something else like ads in the product, data collection with intention to sell that data and other similar things we definitely don't want in professional tools. My opinion differs in one thing and that was a bit addressed in the end of the video. Subscriptions are good for projected planning in the company, yes. But it is not a good practice / model if it is the only way to "buy" that product in my opinion, because customers are forced to rent the software licence. There is no ownership on their side and that has a lot of drawbacks. One ovios one is when someone does not have money to pay all the subscriptions all the time, as was addressed in the video. Second one from the same idea pool is, what if you have your work saved in app dependent format and you want to re-export it to your new portfolio, because you lost your work and you are in a bad finance situation? You can't, you must pay sometimes a full year, sometimes one month of higher price as if you pay for an annual subscription to do that. I don't think that is a fear model, because you paid for the possibility to use that software for that work. You own that work, but you can't use it if you wont pay again. Third one is, you can not sell rented licenses, but you can sell buyed licenses in the EU for example, even if the EULA is prohibiting it. Forth one and from my perspective the worst one is that the subscription model brings "too much" comfort to the business. In most cases it will change how the software developer plans new features and bug fixing. If you have competition and you need to make a new update appealing for new and old customers to pay for it, you must bring something valuable to your customers. If you lose / don't have proper competition, you can slow down, but not too much because old customers won't update if the new version has just a new splashscreen and some bug fixes. If you don't have ether, it will take a really dedicated team to work hard on their product. That is possible, but not very compatible with "big" parent companies. I have been trying to buy commercial licenses of the software I am using from my student days. I dedicated time to create workflow with use of some tools. I want to use that knowledge and build on it. If developers of that tool won't have adequate money from their work and stop the development, or someone else makes a better tool, because they have more money, I will need to learn it, what is fun for me because I love my work, but not cost effective fun with possibility that alternative tool won't be as good match for me as that old one. I am Ok with paying a discounted price for the new version. I am OK with paying maintenance, to give tool creators that assurance of a constant stream of money. It is absolutely OK in the commercial world. If they are able to create a model like Unreal has, more power to them. As you guys said, it is free advertisement and free generation of young artists with knowledge of their software. I just don't think that subscription as the only option to buy is a good model. (or only reseanoble option to buy, when perpetual license has higher price with no updates ;)) If we give this level of assurance to the companies we won't be able to own almost anything in a few decades. This is not good for the human psyche and for times when you are not able to monthly pay for everything you have. Imagine that pressure if you can't save up for a car, or house, or your workstation, cintiq and zbrush. You can have it cheaper, but you must make 600€ every month just to pay rent for a PC, Cintiq, NAS, network switch, Internet, Zbrush and Photoshop and if you don't have that you can't take a new job for a client, you must find a job for a studio with these benefits. Yes you can say OK you can save up in the same way as you are saving now and have that money in a bank, but would you? Would your "compettision" do that while you work in MCDonald and stagnate with your art skills, or work in a free tool which doesn suit you? And what happens to your savings in account if you pay for an annual subscription and something prevents you from working full time for a longer period of time? If you both perpetual licence you can stop maintenance payment and work in older tool how long you need to. We don't own application licences on our mobile phones. Apple or Google can delete the app from your phone when they decide to ban it from their store. M1 MACs have their proprietary chips. Apple can decide if you can or cannot run other os on them (even its ARM). When Macs were Intel x86, you could run everything for x86. When they were PowerPC, you could probably use software for PowerPC (I did not own one). Now you can't. Windows 11 requires a secure boot and TPM chip. If most people switch to win 11 in a few years and this will be a default requirement, all linux, and free BSD, and booting diagnostic software, and ... developers will need to ask Microsoft to give them permission to run their software on your computer to get through that security system .... If professional software will be all subscriptiption based, most workstations will be cloud based, or some rent policy, .... it sounds great, everything is cheaper, but why? Because they can catch more people buying it this way. You won't have time to manage all your subscriptions job per job and if you try it, it won't be cheaper because most of the subscriptions are far more expensive if you are paying monthly if it is a specialty tool. Why? Because they don't have that many customers and it wont make sense for them to give you the possibility to pay just a few bucks here and there when you need that software. And that's OK. It will be less effective for them as if they let you pay full price for it here and there when you decide you want the new perpetual version. If you want to do that subscription jumping, you must pay more. In some models it's there to make cheaper ways of quick expansion for some project specific needs. Studio will need 20 more seats for 6 months. They can pay a subscription and pass that cost to their client / budget for that. But that's why it is not more cost effective in every case, but definitely it can be more cost effective. Photoshop is much better with subscriptions for most of the users. I can pay for five years of a photoshop monthly plan and get it probably cheaper than it was back in the day of perpetual Adobe licences (even if I won't count in inflation). But for example Maya, I am still on a 2020 and I am a subscription paying customer. Three years of Maya subscription (non indie) is more than one perpetual license was. And new updates were quite a lot cheaper than a full new license.They are companies and these are business models. Some can be more effective, like what Unreal is doing, but in most cases they are made to make them more money. Illusion that the subscription is in all cases cheaper for the customer is not correct. It can be cheaper like with photoshop. That's why I am a supporter of choice for the customer created by software developers to get space for both.

[@fractalelement857]

11:18 thats what i was talking about. It is such a pain in the ass when you have to export a model to another program just to check render/lookdev. ZBRUSH C'MON FOR FUCK SAKE !!!!

[@christuusgnosis]

One of the things that will be positive. a proper render view, and maybe a replacement of matcaps with standard pbr

[@tormxnta]

Too bad it’s not like Unreal. I have no access to the updated versions and can’t afford it at all. 6months in the future after receiving my Maxon email. This sucks.

[@mikkelmelby]

great stuff, i completetly agree. zbrush blew my mind 5 years ago and got my committed, c4d and redshift is my favorite workflow...but unreal&houdini though :D

[@hectorescobar9450]

Blender has gone a long way, would be interesting to imagine studios supporting it and help its development, specially being open source.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

You can use whatever software you want for modeling and sculpting in any studio. Just ask them to install it for you!

[@hectorescobar9450]

@@EdgeloopAcademy thankfully most of the game studios in Asia are using Blender now. We have finally mo Ed from Maya into Blender. In fact, you do t even need permission to install blender in any machine as it is as simple as just downloading it in whatever device, without too many questions asked

[@3djooboy]

they want to squeeze more money out of existing customers. It's bullshit and NOT why i bought Zbrush in the first place...

[@darkknight4353]

Your title says "Artists React" i thought the video would include more than one artist. but again. great video.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

Yeah because we are 2 artists. Glad you liked it.

[@Tahldon-kun]

I've gotten to a point to where I like to be a bit reasonable with changes in technology, more or so thanks to your channel and your discussions with professionals. You have a very level head about things, Siamak, so thanks for sharing these opinions. On the topic of Maxon's changes with Zbrush, I'd like to stand in the camp of them changing Zbrush for the better (modern UI and what-have-you), but I can't help but to feel a little annoyed about the prospect of them eventually doing away with the Perpetual licenses altogether considering many of us just recently purchased Zbrush and immediately will have to slip into the subscription model. So many subscriptions for all of this software eventually sours the feeling of feeling as though they are a cheaper option. Either way, there is no going back now so we will see what they do when they do it. We all adapt.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

Thank you for your support. we have those concerns too. I try to take a positive approach hoping that they would not take a destructive path but this is something they own at this point and I think the demand will dictate what direction they would take. if everybody keeps paying for it then probably it will become more and more expensive over time.

[@bdragon254]

3:38 if you think that, then you don't even know what you're talking about

[@tednygma7304]

Very true

[@christuusgnosis]

Ok We don't get free updates, you get 1 years worth. you can still buy a perpetual license which is good. save your old install so you can go back to it. Maxon will give zb some bone posing tools, rigging, better import export, pbr instead of matcap (I'm sorry, but I hate matcaps, if I put a material on the model I want the material exported as I see it) they used to have a product called bodypaint which was very good. Zbrush won't die, because nothing else has its feature set - yet. I would wait to see the second actual update after Maxon. But keep your old install hidden and you'll always have at least what you have now. I don't think they will break it. The biggest worry is that they'll do an adobe and make it only subscription with no lifetime version. Then they will lose about 1/3 of their customers.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

Great view. Thanks for the comment!

[@languin12]

id rather pay that monthly money to blender

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

I think Blender will slowly change the market over the long term which is good for the industry!

[@msimon1984]

These guys are speaking from their perspective than the regular consumer perspective

[@longphan1943]

The subscriptions will be $479.40/year !!!!!!!

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

We didn't know that when this video was recorded. thanks for the info.

[@robertbuchanan5504]

@@EdgeloopAcademy If that's true works out to be 678.00 dollars Canadian with taxes roughly the price I paid for my legal license when I bought it years back. Looks like the 6 month sub is slightly cheaper, works out to roughly 40 Can a month but of course once you stop paying you lose access to it. Hopefully Maxxon will offer ZBrush upgrade prices for a reasonable amount but I feel even that would be at least half the cost of a yearly sub and until that is revealed it is wait and see.

[@harrysanders818]

Most popular game engine is still Unity, its what majority of game devs use aside from the AAA sector and especially for mobile (Unfortunately imo). Most 3d concept artists heavily make use of 3d coat (e.g. Jama Jubarev, Roman Chaliy), as it offers completely topology free sculpting/modeling, and advanced auto exporting of completly PBR painted, decimated models with auto UVs in one click. Not to say no concept artist use zbrush per se, I've also seen it, but 3d coat in conjunction with blender is much more common among concept artists. 3d coat, jus like zbrush, is also a very artistic application, just like Zbrush, it feels great once learned, and it on top offers all the tools for game production art as well: Full PBR viewport and texturing, even onto your high poly, the most artistic Retopology, incredibly streamlined UVing alongside retopo process, and also lightspeed loading and handling of high poly data. Talking about game production art, zbrush offers nothing really usable besides maybe polypaint for creating game ready models. I love ZBrush. I hope it remaims the same. This whole thing and discussion is like a dejavu, its the same as when Substance was Adoberized. Jus the other day I also realized how expensive ZBrush really is for people in non western countries. It makes me sad. And I am really empathizing with colleagues abroad.

[@fractalelement857]

Zbrush is not dead but character art is. Now it's all technical. Metahumans for example are one of the great examples, downside of it is that reduced number of 3d character art job positions. I am talking about newcomers here. Now everybody can make a 3d character, even somebody who is not a character artist. It's easier for the 3d character artists who are already in the game for years. This is going to become even worse in the future because everything is going towards automation. You will be able to generate any kind of characters/creatures in the next 10 years. Better go study for a lawyer or doctor, or web designer.

[@samdavepollard]

everything you said is true interesting though that lawyer, doctor, web designer are three careers somewhat less secure v AI than once thought plumber, on the other hand .... :-)

[@JoseFuentes-mq6fw]

another good one man, keep em coming

[@shawnastrom]

Spot on. Nice to hear from some real pros in regards to this merger.

[@Figster62]

I already pay 39.95 USD per month for ZBrush.

[@jamesburnette6982]

My wish would be multiple viewports / monitors that would save me so much time.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

That would be amazing!

[@martinschemmel84]

also I think this whole Epic Games model, use for free, give us % when you make money, is also pretty crappy. It seems nice at first, but yea WHEN you make money, they want a lot. Even more so when they feel like they got a monopoly position. Then, let's say Steam takes 25% another 25% for the engine. Which else software you want to give some percentages? The full extend such things can take you see at places like Roblox. probably 5% of the profit of all creators there is actually paid out and once Epic owns the entire industry, they will turn that way, too... Cuz sure, you use their metahuman, you use their 3d scans, you use their portfolio pages... what did you actually make? well, here you go.. have some 5%.. But yea, they just wanted to enable you and thousands of others to have full freedom of creation, right? You do it for the passion. You don't really need the money XD

[@MartinS84]

@@Capeau now. until they outrun the competition. obviously thats the strategy. they throw money in all directions right now cuz who cares. Chinese investors money. until there is no other choice

[@msimon1984]

No it's not cynical it's reality. You don't keep giving me free fortune cookies for 20 years and then start charging me for them

[@berkilter4556]

2 LEGEND SPEAKING!!! And my opinion is when adobe bought allegorithmic(substance painter) people thought it will be awful in the future for Substance painter but it was opposite they improved that is why I am thinking about this situation will be not bad but maybe not so perfect we will see in the future, otherwise keep drawing and keep sculpting.

[@garywillett4146]

If you buy something it's you own it . I sell you a car or a house you don't own it ... I do.

[@nelsondelarosa5337]

Well honesly at frist I was thinking selling zbrush was dumb , theirs no money in the world that will buy zbrush, but I guess I'm wrong. you guys mention zbrush is a powerful program and although is not updated in a modern way where u don't have all the light features and real time Render. I don't think we will get all the cool zbrush tools we used to get with zbrush now that is bought.. yea we going to get those cool renders and features but it will get boring, pixalogic never had zbrush sitting on boring scale they had always challenged themself to give us great features to make it easy for us artist. With sculpting tools, so thinking all this also may had been a good idea just selling it because of blender. BLENDER had come a long way they will get to a level as zbrush , they will have all the cool tools like zbrush pretty soon i think , and even if is not u can still do pretty much everything u can do in zbrush and is free and u can do so much with blender. So just maybe selling zbrush was a good choice since blender is free and has so much to offer. Also paying monthly yes is cheaper in payment form but not really if u are a active artist . MAXON will juice up all the money they can. They won't be as nice as pixalogic .. thats my thought.. I'm hoping I'm wrong with Maxon and deliver us great tools..

[@angryteapod1765]

my opinion is. you own nothing and you will be happy to.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

Nah I will not be happy owning nothing. No one will be.

[@msimon1984]

Stop giving these corporations your money and power over you

[@angryozziebogan3046]

Stop talking like this software only cost $100, most of us paid over $1,000 not that long ago, and are now told get the very expensive sub, or too bad.

[@rsunghun]

This video is unlikable in many direction. First, click bait title, and your opinions are so naive and biased. If pixologic wasn't sold to maxon and they charged more money from existing users, people were not so upset like this. They are upset because in most people's mind pixologic zbrush was something different from other softwares in good and moral way. Now that's forever gone. We are not foolish, we know there are many business models without selling zbrush to Maxon. Don't underestimate your view's intelligence.

[@white_sky_11]

Totally agree with this, I believe ZBrush is one of most that people want to buy instead of pirate it from knowing how Pixologic behave from the past. And now they're selling customers trusted for greed so this is not gonna end well.

[@NicolasRouelle]

I love zbrush, it's an impressive software and i always wonder why they never charge for updates, who was paying for there jobs? what a strange business model. Efforts have to be rewarded. And maybe with the help of Maxon C4D UI guys, they will update the UI to be more user friendly.

[@jaunty_tunes]

And I just bought it. Ugh.

[@EdgeloopAcademy]

You will be fine. Don’t stress about it.

[@potatosalad5355]

Yeah Pixologic was "nice" company....yeah right? They buy SCULPTRIS twelve years ago and then put it in the FREEZER under key.,..do you can image how be today SCULPTRIS with all those years of development???

[@HatemEngab]

I left them All I deserve Blender

[@googleslocik]

I agree, zbrush stagnated too much. Its been 15 years since last big update, its unacceptable and something has to change.

[@HarvestrX]

BLENDER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ALL OTHERS CAN GO TO HELL!

[@alexanderxaviercastelan4697]

blender fanboys are so toxic lol

[@silverbulletin846]

ithink this a very biased view as its the program you guys (in your pipeline) use to make monny, and are better at vs other programs , i feel it why you dont want zbrush inside 4d ect. i feel in reality soon there s gonna be a "super program" as zbrush did 15years agow, could very well be a paid version of blender with coprate standart support and stuff so its 100% a reliable tool.

[@KarelChytilArt]

For People Who really enjoy ZBrush There is no problem with Maxon.

[@mr_don_key]

because?

[@LizzyKoopa]

i think zbrush's monthly subscription right now is perfect. 39 a month. hell make it lower get more people in. i am sad my perpetual license wont allow for free upgrades. if pixel has asked us who has perpetual's to upgrade yearly for a price of like 200 a year, i would of done this, they deserve that. but this subscription has to be cheaper, if not it's only going to push people away. most artist's pipeline's are multiple programs. me (( zbrush + substance + blender + unity)) if i have to pay zbrush's 39 monthly, annually that results to 359 a year. substance 20 = 218 a year meaning my pipeline is 577$ usd a year. but like other's have said in the comment's, with all these subscriptions, until you find your pipeline and workflow, learning and diving into paying monthly can result in overpricing before you even get your foot in the door to get a job or create your own buisness. if anything, i am only going to be seeing my price's increase for my customers witch suck's if they go any higher in asking price's and i need said tools to use for my customers. i hope they improve the software, i just hope they don't kick the little guy's like me out of the game.