Israel-Palestine Debate: Finkelstein, Destiny, M. Rabbani & Benny Morris | Lex Fridman Podcast

Norman Finkelstein and Benny Morris are historians. Mouin Rabbani is a Middle East analyst. Steven Bonnell (aka Destiny) is a political livestreamer. Please support this podcast by checking out our sponsors:
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TRANSCRIPT:
lexfridman.com/israel-palesti...
EPISODE LINKS:
Mouin's X: x.com/MouinRabbani
Mouin's Podcast: • Connections Podcast wi...
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Benny's Books: amzn.to/3Vf7NNU
-
Norman's X: x.com/normfinkelstein
Norman's Website: www.normanfinkelstein.com/
Norman's Books: amzn.to/3IqouxU
Knowing Too Much (excerpt): jumpshare.com/v/8EUbbP40Do44I...
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Destiny's KZbin: / destiny
Destiny's X: x.com/TheOmniLiberal
Destiny's Subreddit: / destiny
Destiny's Website: destiny.gg
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Norman and Mouin provided additional links to supplement the discussion. See them here: sites.google.com/view/israel-...
PODCAST INFO:
Podcast website: lexfridman.com/podcast
Apple Podcasts: apple.co/2lwqZIr
Spotify: spoti.fi/2nEwCF8
RSS: lexfridman.com/feed/podcast/
Full episodes playlist: • Lex Fridman Podcast
Clips playlist: • Lex Fridman Podcast Clips
OUTLINE:
0:00 - Introduction
4:42 - 1948
1:03:14 - Partition
2:07:47 - October 7
3:01:59 - Gaza
3:28:34 - Peace
4:33:18 - Hope for the future
SOCIAL:
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[@lexfridman]

Here are the timestamps. Please check out our sponsors to support this podcast. Transcript: lexfridman.com/israel-palestine-debate-transcript 0:00 - Introduction & sponsor mentions: - ExpressVPN: expressvpn.com/lexpod to get 3 months free - Babbel: babbel.com/lexpod and use code Lexpod to get 55% off - Policygenius: policygenius.com/lex - Eight Sleep: eightsleep.com/lex to get special savings 4:42 - 1948 1:03:14 - Partition 2:07:47 - October 7 3:01:59 - Gaza 3:28:34 - Peace 4:33:18 - Hope for the future

[@ComradeCooper]

Podcast length record breaking day.. this should be good.

[@pumpernickel1955]

the intro is litty🔥

[@joea959]

There is no debate when it comes to genocide. Poor civilians are starving, crying in pain, and dying in horror on mass. I'm usually a fan but for yall to be well feed and rested put all this effort into nothing when it's yall with the money and influence... Shame.

[@paulsacramento5995]

Yes. What Hamas is doing is horrific and, perhaps worse is how the Muslim and Arab world could care less about the Palestinians.@@joea959

[@davedavisness]

Please interview: Rabbi Elhanan Beck, George Galloway, Ilan Pappe, Christopher Bollyn, Mohammed El-Kurd (part 2)

[@SilverStrum]

What an unfairly set up debate. How is Norm supposed to take on Mr. Bonnell, Mr. Burnelli, Mr. Morelli, AND Mr. Borelle at the same time?!?

[@Ian-ky5hf]

😅😅😅😅😅😅

[@amorpaz1]

He was having so much fun doing that haha

[@Cagliostro85]

Old codger.

[@Zubshady2333]

By running circles around him

[@jumpvelocity3953]

@@Zubshady2333more like slowly floating around by the speed he’s going

[@CockatooDude]

I'm glad that this was hosted in a 1970's airport interrogation room. Really adds to the international politics feel.

[@sivannatalie]

😂

[@kwg5044]

Nice

[@scaife]

Niche but excellent comment

[@genshishio9316]

😂

[@DanBarry851]

Thank you for this comment, I got more enjoyment out of it then the entire debate.

[@Sikandros]

Teacher: “No talking in class.” Me and the boys in the back:

[@consume_vegetables]

M. Rabbani, whose is most affected and whose home is under siege, is the most composed, calm and eloquent throughout the whole debate.

[@omeryavin2899]

"such a fantastic moron".. yeah, about as composed and eloquent as every other Hamas supporter from the streets.

[@aarongreenberg159]

Underrated comment

[@MM-rv5he]

These guys are all clueless! Arabs living on this land are of 1 of 3 groups of people: 1. descendants of the Arab Caliphate (the 5th largest colonizing empire in HUMAN HISTORY) 2. Arabs that migrated from what is today Egypt, Jordan, Syria or Lebanon. 3. Jews and Christians that were converted into Islam (often against their will). The Arabs that lived on this land along side jews never got along! During the Ottoman Islamic Empire colonization, The ottomans favorite the local Islamic people and made the Jews among other non Muslims live as 2nd or 3rd class citizens with no rights. The current conflict has nothing to do with 1948, Zionism or land dispute. Anyone that thinks that is totally clueless! My proof? Here you go.. Here are just a few events in history of Muslims attacking Jewish community like (October 7th genocide attack) before Israel and before Zionism: 1517 Hebron attacks = 431 years before 1948 1660 Safed Massacre = 288 years before 1948 1834 hebron Riots = 114 years before 1948 1834 Safed Looting = 114 years before 1948 1921 Petach Tikvah Attack =27 years before 1948 1921 Jaffa Riots = 27 years before 1948 1929 Jerusalem Massacre = 19 years before 1948 Today Jihadi cult uses “Israel” “Zionism” “fake apartheid” “fake occupation” as an excuse, when you ask them why did the Muslims attack Jewish communities for hundreds of years on this land before “Israel” or before “occupation” they are totally confused and have no answers. They dont even know the history of this land and dont know that Arab’s continuously attacked jews on this land since the Original Nakba of 632 where Arab’s from the Arabian peninsula colonized Jewish tribe lands and committed a genocide. History didn’t start in 1948 and anyone who pretend it is, is hiding the terrible crimes committed by the 5th largest colonizing empire in human history (the Islamic Arab Caliphate).

[@bubblesqueak835]

which one was he? idk them by their names 😅

[@FILIPFROMSALMO]

as composed as a seasoned lawyer

[@LakshmiKc-ug4jr]

How tf we have 0.5x, 0.75x 1.00x 1.25x and 1.5x speed in the same debate

[@birkli2959]

Rabbani is my 1x standard here,, Morris is a little bit quicker

[@revelacol2149]

I’m on x2 on Finkel and it’s still too slow, once someone else interrupts I lose 5 paragraphs tho

[@areichental]

We need a unifying speed edit

[@mofishin2648]

.5 speed is for when Destiny talks 1.5 speed is for when Stinklepeen talks and it's still not sped up enough lol

[@Destiny.Hassan]

😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@rotoninja]

Two historians, a journalist and a video game streamer walk into a bar...

[@Sukhix05x]

I don’t particularly like Destiny… but he’s been putting his work and time in this.

[@ADmeditate]

​@Sukhix05x maybe he shouldn't 😂

[@beansdestroyer]

A discredited historian **

[@etaithegamer1560]

A Holocaust denier, a journalist, a historian and a political streamer walk into a bar

[@i-rogi]

@@beansdestroyer discredited by who and why?

[@anthonytam5633]

This needed way more mediation than it got. Conversations were completely de-railed and became personal.

[@aygunsamedova1083]

Yes, thank you! At some point I couldn’t tolerate Finkelstein’s screaming, cutting people, silencing, the disrespect. It was too much and unprofessional.

[@kathrynmoore2370]

If norm and destiny were gone it would have been way informative .

[@BAD_CONSUMER]

Mouin is so level headed in the midst of all the shouting. What a boss.

[@whatoh3407]

To be fair, nobody was shutting him up and insulting him.

[@ave3087]

@@whatoh3407 For a reason, respect is earned.

[@whatoh3407]

@ave3087 Respect is a two-way street. You have to give respect to get respect. You can respect an individual while not respecting his or her knowledge on a topic. Unfortunately, there was one person in this debate who completely disrespected everyone in the room and the audience. That person also admitted to not taking the debate seriously. That person doesn't deserve respect, especially if he's not going to respect the time of his audience.

[@ave3087]

@@whatoh3407 Are you talking about Destiny??? Mouin seem respectful throughout hence my point, if you respect yourself and others, others will respect you.

[@wolfumz]

I really think Mouin got his points across nicely. Rabbani and Destiny rest part of their argument on "Palestinian Nationalists, they are inherently irrational. You can't reason with them. Peace is impossible, because you're not dealing with rational actors... unlike Israel, who, despite their misgivings, are at least rational." This irrational behavior is variously blamed on Palestinians religious beliefs, desire for personal power, violent culture, or some other moral failing or character defect. I think this argument is a bit silly, on its face, and Mouin answers it well throughout. There were plenty of times, I think he revealed a flaw in Rabbini's characterization. I remain undecided on Israel Palestine.... but one thing that drives me crazy about the pro Israel side is how they want it both ways. When they're ring to make a point about how Palestine is bad, they talk about how Isreal is a secular, progressive, high tech democracy. They act like Israel is in the same camp as Sweden and Norway, culturally. They use this characterization to appeal to progressives. But when they need to claim right to the land, or justify seizing the land, suddenly, they are no longer a secular nation state acting on a democratic mandate. Instead, they're a Jewish country for the Jewish people, and they are meant to serve this ethnoreligious group, according to their religious principles. Its very annoying to me how, in these debates, the pro Israel side picks whichever characterization they find most convenient at the moment. To be sure, extreme far right religious views have played a huge role in how the nation has conducted itself with respect to Palestine... but Rabbini and Destiny act like this is negligible. It's not. It's behind a lot of Isreal's worst behavior. In realty, Isreal is both of these things, in different measures, and these two poles are always in tension with eachother.

[@cyruscheng499]

Every time Mr. Finkelstein said his name: (00:02:05) Mr. Borelli (00:33:07) Mr. Bonnell (02:00:00) Mr. Barelli (02:18:05) Mr. Bonnell (02:45:18) Mr. Borelli (02:47:45) Mr. Morelli (02:48:15) Mr. Borelli (02:52:43) Mr. Bonnell (03:01:14) Mr. Burelli (03:10:44) Mr. Bonnell (03:12:20) Mr. Borrell (03:17:46) Mr. Berelli (03:18:54) Mr. Farelli (03:19:11) Mr. Berelli (03:21:51) Mr. Berelli (03:24:38) Mr. Bonnell (04:19:27)Mr. Bonnell (04:20:42)Mr. Bonnell (04:21:33)Destiny (04:22:19)Mr. Bonnell (04:23:57) Mr. Borrell (04:24:06) Mr. Birrell (04:26:55) Mr. Bonnell (04:41:18) Mr. Bonnell (04:51:40) Mr. Birrell

[@rustlings0ul]

Thank you for your service

[@Jedidine]

🤣 bravo 👏

[@thetotaldepravity]

Appreciate the levity in these dark times.

[@ksulli5505]

He also called him Destiny once or twice when he was heated

[@axaeyexus]

😂😂😂

[@acinnamonroll-fn9ee]

Destiny: *utters a single word* Norman: Mr. Raviolli brace yourself

[@hopesy12u4]

Moeen Rabbani: [breathes] Morris: [smiles coyly] that is also a red herring.

[@shacharlavi8556]

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@Galilelo_Telescope]

I can’t tell if it’s good or bad that he doesn’t respect him at all.

[@sunset2.00]

Norman did factually correct a lot of times on destiny.

[@SjlaydGaming]

Ok there are many funny comments but this is my favourite by far! XDD

[@jeremysanders8138]

If international law is irrelevant than why is the un recognition of israel in 1948 legitimate?

[@dinuraboody1249]

The 1948 partition resolutions was approved by the UN general assembly which has no legal power, it's basically a recommendation. The 1920 League of Nations resolution, however, is binding by international law (the resolution called for the founding of a Jewish state in the area of Palestine (which included the territory of modern day Jordan, Israel, and the Palestinian Territories). Thus, if you want to play the game of legitimacy, Jordan and the Palestinian Territories are illegitimate and belong to Israel.

[@jeremysanders8138]

@dinuraboody1249 wrong, there are 4 factors conducive to sovereignty that are the foundation of international law regarding the establishment of a nation state. This includes recognition of another country, whether it be a group of them or not. Being that the league of nations did not exist anymore, the un had to step in and relegitimize said rule. It was absolutely not a recommendation. It was 100% a legal premise to establish Israeli sovereignty as it has been the rule for thousands of years. Most laws are based on principles that have logical/philosophical reasoning behind them. Those 4 factors have been around (not knowing used, however) for a very long time.

[@jeremysanders8138]

@dinuraboody1249 I would agree it was not necessarily an established law such as criminal law but the "recommendation" as you refer to it is based in rules that have previously existed and if were not followed, whether it be by the un or the United States, israel would not have lasted very long...making it a necessity to facilitate in order for israel to be established. The very early and prompt national recognition definitely carried israel in the long run.

[@jeremysanders8138]

@dinuraboody1249 it's the same philosophy behind the rule that countries will not negotiate with terrorists as it legitimizes them

[@dinuraboody1249]

@@jeremysanders8138 I'm sorry that you don't like the facts or that you've criticism regarding the League of Nations. But what you're saying is just false. The resolutions approved by the League of Nations don't require any factors to go into effect. The League of Nations had much more power than the UN. Anyway, the point still stands, if we'll Play the stupid game of "legitimacy". So most countries were founded after WW2, there're international law foundational basis is faulty, and nobody cares

[@matusmotlo3854]

Rabbani debates like a sharp knife. Quick, precise and cuts straight to the point. Easily the best here. Raises many imporant points. Hope he's given more time to spread the message in other media as well.

[@MM-rv5he]

If you think Muslims today hate Jews because of Israel and Christians because of America, you have been completely brainwashed.. I copied and paste just a few verses directly from the Quran. Take a look. Source: The Qur’an: “0 ye who believe! take not the Jews and the Christians for friends. They are friends one to another: And whoso among you takes them for friends is indeed one of them. Verily, Allah guides not the unjust people” “Among the Jews are some who take words out of context, and say, “We hear and we disobey”, and “Hear without listening”, and “Observe us,” twisting with their tongues and slandering the religion.” “Due to wrongdoing on the part of the Jews, We forbade them good things that used to be lawful for them; and for deterring many from Allah’s path.” “You will find that the people most hostile towards the believers are the Jews and the polytheists.” “For the Jews We forbade everything with claws. As of cattle and sheep: We forbade them their fat, except what adheres to their backs, or the entrails, or what is mixed with bone. This is how We penalized them for their inequity” “The Jews said, “Ezra is the son of Allah,” and the Christians said, “The Messiah is the son of Allah.” These are their statements, out of their mouths. They emulate the statements of those who blasphemed before. May Allah assail them! How deceived they are!” “Ask the Children of Israel how many clear signs We have given them. Whoever alters the blessing of Allah after it has come to him-Allah is severe in retribution.” But remember we are told the Quran/Islam is a peaceful, loving, accepting religion 😂 as a person whose read the Quran 3 times, in speaking to many Muslims, I can assure you all, that majority of Muslims have not read the Quran themselves not even once! What a racist vile book! Truly is. By the way, the Quran mentions Israel 43x, The Quran mentions Palestine 0x. But remember brainwashed Jihadis in 2024 want you to believe that “the jews colonized Arabs”. The Arab Caliphate is the 5th biggest colonizing empire in HUMAN HISTORY!! The Arabs are originally only from the Arabian Peninsula (Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Oman, UAE, Kuwait) but yet society has everyone brainwashed to think Arabs are somehow also native to the Levant (Israel, Lebanon, Syria) and North Africa (Morocco, Algeria , Tunisia, Libya, Egypt)! 5th biggest colonization empire in HUMAN HISTORY! Those are the fact!

[@RitaKamil]

I like that he is soft spoken and articulate...but he can't shake his extremism...he mumbled Anwar Sadat (the Egyptian PM who made peace with Israel) SHOULD have been assassinated...that's like wait...WHAT?!

[@itryesitr8053]

rabanni was awful and refuses to answer any quesiton

[@MisoAntro]

@@itryesitr8053well that’s clearly false to anyone who watched the video.

[@matusmotlo3854]

@@itryesitr8053 Taking the time to explain the context of a biased question before anwsering can only be seen as a refusal to anwser by a goldfish with the memory of 3 seconds that can't even concentrate on watching a tiktok dance...

[@TheMitcher]

Norm: "What is your name please?" Destiny: "Steven Bonnell" Norm: "Okay thank you Mr Burnout 3 Takedown for the PlayStation 2"

[@masonscott2168]

😂😂😂

[@mmoolloo]

The guy is delusional and senile. Give him a break.

[@italoruiz474]

Jajajaja

[@copsuicide]

Nebraska Steve loves to get publicly humiliated lmao

[@joespheigo2061]

Solid game. Burnout revenge was the one I played the most though .... 50 car pile ups 😅

[@chrisgarciahostof-isitjust6697]

"With all due respect, you're such* a fantastic moron." 😂 that one caught me off guard.

[@segasys1339]

Y u no put timestamp?

[@nsolo7490]

Lol.

[@Zone47.]

It shouldn’t. Thats all finkelstein ever does

[@retwerts]

Yeah, what a great “counter argument”

[@BaconCrumb]

its in the intro dw@@segasys1339

[@ultralysp]

:Often, the only allies of the dispossessed are those who experience similar circumstances" 4:38:47 perfectly said

[@jeremysanders8138]

Something was definitely edited out at 1:07:16. I want to know why

[@reigningwhiskey]

4:27:16 seems the same here too.

[@Marshmellow3971]

Norm Finkelstein: ‘What is your name, please?’ Destiny: ‘Steven Bonnell’ Norm: ‘Ok, thank you Mr. Burnelli’

[@beetie1308]

Loved it 😂

[@emy_2510]

i heard borrelli hahah

[@leastbased]

wtf is this lol, 3 actually kinda important people worth listening to and then theres this unwashed looking double divorced weirdo lmao

[@tylerr4478]

😂 Mr. Bostiolli

[@tylerr4478]

😂Thank you Mr. Boselli

[@brendan1904]

Mr. Bonnell x17 Mr. Barelli x1 Mr. Borelli x2 Mr. Morelli x1 Mr. Berelli x4 Mr. Borrell x2 in case you were wondering

[@2lostbikes]

😂

[@niazismail2803]

😂😂

[@elliotlake1882]

😂😂😂

[@Levisavolent]

😂😂😂😂

[@homelessengineer5498]

😂😂😂😂😂

[@nstar7545]

Lex as always I love your podcast and thank you for continuing to do them without fear! This is by far my favorite for several reasons and informative on many levels! Again thank you for what you're doing and please keep pushing people to talk!

[@fidomusic]

Yeah, like when he lets one side go off for several minutes while the other team are out of the room. Debaters are supposed to be given equal time. Lex's bias wasn't even subtle.

[@marcchehab7187]

I'd enjoy a calm discussion with just Rabbani and Morris 👍

[@Williamottelucas]

I'd enjoy a calm discussion with just Rabbani.

[@right8630]

Yeah but in reality this so called history expert supporting Hamas tells me he isn’t he is literally cherry picking and straw manning everything.

[@daddykipperflipper4600]

Yep. Get those two babies out of here, maybe have Lex learn to moderate as well.

[@kathrynmoore2370]

Yes

[@imnezu8940]

@@Williamottelucasguy proved himself to be a complete moron when they brought up who killed Israeli’s in Oct 7th. Disgusting loser refused to even answer and implied Israelis killed their own people. Idc how good of a historian he is after that he lost all credibility on this topic.

[@DAMASHi.]

I already know I'm gonna need a cigarette for this I dont even smoke

[@RocketGator05]

Me neither... I rolled 4 blunts. Cheers

[@rm809]

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@Gallowglass7]

Hah

[@wisemage0]

You do now, buddy...you do now.

[@dougsfriendskeeter]

​@@RocketGator05two minutes in and im on my fifth blunt

[@user-rb3xz8tt3g]

I fell asleep watching this and woke up at 2AM angry in the middle of an arguement.

[@ahmxddd]

😭😭😭😭

[@aSSGoblin1488]

i fell asleep and woke up in the middle of finklestein trying to take destiny's kid away from him

[@vibesverily]

​@@aSSGoblin1488yeah, cause norms a humanitarian. just seeing destiny on the internet is abuse, imagine the psychic trauma of having to interact with him in real life and knowing that he's your father. yikes!

[@joelkaben]

Lol 😂

[@rodhabb271]

same here

[@Rammbock]

Can we all agree how criminally underrated Mouin Rabbani is? I’ve never heard such a wonderfully eloquent, calm and composed speaker. It was a joy listening to him!

[@dorbach7240]

Hey Lex. I admire the work you do/your podcast a lot. I thought it would be super interesting to see this redone but instead of being framed as a debate which implies side has to win, having it framed as a conversation or negotiation where both sides try to agree on whatever topics they can.

[@Undoublethinkful]

"It is called attaching VALUE to WORDS, Mr. Banjo-Kazooie"

[@hamzamahmood9565]

I choose my words very carefully, Mr. Majooki

[@sethdhanson]

I read this comment this morning and have been laughing about it all day. Thanks for that.

[@anFy81]

@@sethdhanson same - it really cracked me up

[@joshfranklin9941]

Finkelstein has severe dementia.

[@jjbama8201]

I kept thinking "Do names not apply to your rationale on your superior intellect..."

[@official_catholic_church]

I love how Finkelstein spent the entire first half of the debate quoting Benny Morris at Benny Morris

[@Ajsopranosrubberdux]

Morris really couldn't come back he just blustered

[@Thetb93]

let me quote you yourself from my own book

[@alejammi]

​​@@Ajsopranosrubberduxsuree buddy. Go read the actual content of the quotes that norm casually takes out of context and you just gulp it up like a good boy

[@Ajsopranosrubberdux]

@@alejammi I've read Righteous Victims...

[@jack123xyz]

@@Ajsopranosrubberdux with the reading comprehension of a toad apparently

[@jingxuanzhang8518]

Norman Finkelstein and Mouin Rabbani played bad cop/good cop in this debate.

[@equityjustice2695]

Destiny played Kcum Dumpster. Morris played serpent 🐍

[@itryesitr8053]

They both played dumb comps

[@saynotoyoutube]

Finklestein is a clown. He ruined any chance of a good discussion with his constant theatrics and name calling.

[@LesageSinging]

50m in and I gotta say, this is a very thorough book review.

[@notmyrealname4511]

Norm: What's your name? Destiny: Steven Bonnell Norm: Thank you, Limoncello

[@GreyKnight7777]

I love that 100+ comments exactly like this showed up days after its initial release, indicating that this it isn't an organic thought but instead regurgitation from Destiny reviewing the video on stream. Especially because he correctly responded with "Bonnell" in response to Destiny's reply, proving it's a completely fabulized deflection.

[@samuelc.7212]

​@@GreyKnight7777This was published today was it not?

[@randomnamerandomname]

@@GreyKnight7777 He's such a grown up baby for miscalling his name the entire time but when he thought the camera went off he was like "Mr Bonnell", what a slimey little smug Finklestein is.

[@Epicgamerytt]

​@@GreyKnight7777 you love that comments came after people actually watched the 5 hour video, rather than commenting 5 min after upload or memeing about twitter clips taken out of context? You're really going out on a limb there GayNight666

[@GreyKnight7777]

@@samuelc.7212 It was not.

[@uwu4u90]

Norman Finkelstein and Benny Morris are historians. Mouin Rabbani is a Middle East analyst and Destiny is a girls name.

[@Moose-wj8sc]

Lmao nailed it

[@Deadmeet100]

AMAZIN

[@absoms8311]

Definitely a stripper name.

[@elracionalista]

Finkelstein is just an arrogant asshole.

[@666atyler666]

Perfect assessment!

[@sonderman8079]

Thank you so much Lex for organising such debates. I have just introduced this to my 18 year old son to watch and learn.

[@meylinlibertaskeef3346]

18 year olds shouldnt be watching 5 hour "debates", coming from a 19 yr old

[@captainzappbrannagan]

Lex. Excellent format. Excellent speakers. Excellent moderator. Keep em comin!

[@garyrutiaga1426]

Nightmare blunt rotation

[@87rish]

LOL

[@hexchad765]

So true

[@m0nZt3r]

xDDD

[@LigetiVoy]

Without finkelstein it might be a fun blunt rotation lol

[@bp_mufasa8799]

😂😂😂

[@SmilingAzaleaFlower-kw3eh]

I died when finklestein said “I don’t use those machines” in regards to a phone hahahahaha

[@billybitchcakes8611]

You might be interested to know that he doesn't have a cell phone of his own. He uses a landline lol

[@krille696]

@@billybitchcakes8611he should use a landmine, or nvm his walking speed probably wouldnt activate it anyways

[@user-xd7jh4ih4g]

he read a book about it, he good@@billybitchcakes8611

[@MXS369]

I think he meant the ipad

[@exposedhobo]

Trying to explain to a man military aviation hierarchy and process when he doesent even own a phone

[@EliCass-kr9ty]

Lex Friman is a good man, he gives people a voice. Thank Lex...you good people.

[@bluefunk05]

"Often, the only allies of the disposessed are those who experience similar circumstances." 💯

[@hassanalkhalaf1115]

Which would be Ireland

[@jonathanbuckenmyer4888]

I got evicted once. Still prefer Israel.

[@charlesa5333]

“Don’t change the subject, Mr Spaghetti!”

[@jarettmitrani9498]

hahahaha

[@FarvaU23]

I find it strange that Finkelstein sees himself as a rigerous academic, based on all of the criticisms he throws out, but half of his arguments against destiny are ad-hominem. It is a bad look.

[@AG-gp1kd]

@@FarvaU23 well to be fair, Destiny was being a motormouth

[@markpozsar5785]

@@AG-gp1kd ikr he should have rather grandstanded for 30 minutes

[@zoey4623]

@@FarvaU23because he’s fighting the dehumanisation of of a people. I think another person would feel the same heating and upset someone justifying the holocaust

[@ColdSamra]

Where the heck did the time go? Can't believe I allowed my blood pressure to fluctuate for 5 hours 😂

[@poet.alhashimi]

Lol

[@wearelovedbyGOD]

All those Laughing laughing.is zionist propaganda

[@Brandon-ne3xz]

Agree. Totally engaging discussion. Grueling 5 hours revealed truth- the story of two unfortunate nations. The West is doing injustice to both of them.

[@alabrrmrbmmr]

According to my watch I just completed my most intensive workout of the past 12 months. Also, it is telling me to contact my physician.

[@jocsanabdala9456]

Finklestien is HALARIOUS😂😂😂

[@gavinhillick]

Who thought it was appropriate to bring his nephew to this discussion?

[@stuarthamilton3832]

Thank You for this lengthy, expansive debate/ discussion. Very illuminating.

[@KidoBedo]

Can we have a reupload of this debate but having a 5 hour long shot of Lex to see his facial reactions during the debate?

[@KontenderTV]

Lex doesn't have facial expressions lol first time here?

[@RomOzer]

Willing to pay for it 😂😂

[@rwmack3523]

I'd subscribe to a patron for that cut. It'd be like watching the saddest, slowest tennis match ever, but I'd watch with buttered popcorn and a coke.

[@ryo92254]

No expressions from hitman 47

[@calvinpafford]

😐😐😐😐😐

[@PoshByDefault]

Finkelstein: What's your name? Destiny: Bonnell Finkelstein: OK. Thank you, Mr. Vermicelli

[@LoneWulf278]

😂😂

[@MilliePlateau]

Destiny is a lot like Vermicelli

[@user-sd7et3wx1g]

🤣

[@eugenkok]

Don't mention it, Mr. Frankenstein

[@goldeneagle256]

the irony are tho despite how many times he got that name wrong, thats propably what i had least issues with. for someone that uses a terms like international law so many times its absurd how little he know about it, and someone like finkelstein should really know that UN and its resolutions are simply political opinions and have nothing to do with international law, or any other laws for that matter. the only exception are resolutions under chapter 7 given by the security council, but those are so rarely used i think last time was in the ballpark of 2005 or something regarding something that happened in lebanon. its allso absurd how he state that the israeli settlements are not legal according to international law, yet theres nothing in that law that actual in any way say they are illegal

[@hmmob3956]

Fireworks starting at around the 2:00:00 point. Good timing, Lex.

[@yakushitamahacka4199]

Thanks for this debate Lex! Like always, those conversations I think are what we should do more instead of acts of war which we should do less. This free type of debate was nice. I would also like to see another format where debaters would have some clear goals in mind. Being on the same page with common starting goals could have beneficial outcome on the conversation and could make debaters more likely to work with each other to find a solution instead of getting defensive. Understanding the intentions of each individual from the beginning would also help me as a viewer understand their reasonings better. Lack of this common goal brought a lot of context switching which surely got a lot of brain fuel from them. Maybe breaks (hours or even a day) could also help regarding this in order to keep system 2 running for them and not have to deal with system 1's not-beneficial responses. Despite my constructive feedback, it is very nice to watch such conversations and debates and I learned a lot from how you let this one unfold!

[@priestholmes8931]

shout out to my homies who not only watched the whole debate but did so at normal speed

[@davidmelamed2774]

I'm afraid you're in league of your own if you didnt keep on switching speeds depending on who was speaking.

[@DavidVenegas-rq2cy]

​@@davidmelamed2774nah you need the whole range. It cant all be the same. It's like different textures on a sandwich.

[@Ian-ky5hf]

@@davidmelamed2774No he’s not.

[@Ian-ky5hf]

I think it best normal speed all the way.

[@priestholmes8931]

it is a perfect video for someone trying to build a mega city on city skylines@@davidmelamed2774

[@evanmaltz6103]

This made me nostalgic for Thanksgiving dinner

[@69Fabulosity]

😂😂😂

[@janetfox-petersen2790]

😂 thanks for bringing in humor among such tough stuff.

[@ave3087]

@@janetfox-petersen2790 It’s really not that funny. Especially not for the natives of the land🤷🏽‍♂️

[@ziadmir]

This is such a fascinating debate. It hurts that there is no resolution and I feel that this will be the defining conflict of our times

[@robertorolfo]

What resolution do you want? There are still so many people in the world that hate Jews for no good reason. And then there are those that rightfully defend Jews, and of course we have given Israel the ability to defend itself. Until those ignorant people stop attacking Israel, what do you expect?

[@DanielBlak]

The Destiny-Finkelstein dynamic is absolutely bananas.

[@Mofflin1]

Lex: “hypothetically we find a peaceful solution, how do we get there?” The room: *20 minutes of screeching*

[@samidavidkarl]

Meine Damen und Herren, Bürger und Bürgerinnen dieser Erde. An die 2 Völker palestina und Israel. verehrte Mitglieder der internationalen Gemeinschaft, sowie Vertreter der israelischen Regierung, es ist an der Zeit, nicht nur Worte zu sprechen, sondern Taten zu zeigen. Es ist an der Zeit, dass das israelische Volk und seine Regierung den Charakter zeigen, der sie auszeichnet: einen Charakter von Menschlichkeit, Gerechtigkeit und Versöhnung. In einer Zeit, in der wir nach so vielen Jahren der Unterdrückung und des Leids stehen, ist es an der Zeit, dass wir uns der Vergangenheit stellen und die Zukunft gemeinsam gestalten. **Erklärung der Initiative:** Einführung eines alle Regierungen zum Schutz des vom Notstand betroffenen Volk verpflichtet. Wenn wir etwas aus dem Holocaust gelernt haben sollten. Ist es, das damals das jüdisch Volk auf die internationale Gemeinschaft angewiesen war. Einmischung von Aussen auf Hitlers Genozid. Wardie einzige Chance war dem blinden Hass und der entmenschlichung einhalt zu gebieten. Und das aus Vernunft. Aus Pflicht. Und um die 'VÖLKERVIELFALT dem interesse des einzelnen Volkes entgegenzustellen. Ein Staat gegen VÖLKERVIELFALT ist ein unrechtmässiger Staat. nationaler rassentheorien unterworfen. Initiative Notstand Palstina Die Initiative zur vorübergehenden Rechtssicherung der palästinensischen Interessen und Bi but v Menschenrechte vor der internationalen Gemeinschaft ist ein Schritt, der unmissverständlich klarstellt, dass das palästinensische Volk Anspruch auf eine politische Vertretung hat, die ihre Rechte in vollem Umfang wahrnehmen und verteidigen kann. Es geht hier um mehr als nur Prinzipien; es geht um die Wiederherstellung der Würde und Gerechtigkeit für jeden einzelnen Palästinenser. **Argumentation gegen eine Zwei-Staaten-Lösung:** Die Propagierung einer Zwei-Staaten-Lösung ist eine Beleidigung für jeden Palästinenser und Israeli gleichermaßen. Eine solche Lösung würde lediglich die Mauern des Gefängnisses verschieben, ohne die grundlegenden Ungerechtigkeiten zu beseitigen. Jeder Palästinenser verdient genau die gleichen Rechte und Sicherheiten wie ein Israeli, einschließlich eines israelischen Passes und eines effektiven Schutzes seiner Interessen vor Gericht. **Darlegung der Grundrechte:** 1. **Menschenwürde und Schutz vor Diskriminierung:** Jeder einzelne Palästinenser verdient Respekt und Würde, frei von Diskriminierung und Unterdrückung. Die Vergangenheit hat gezeigt, dass diese Würde oft verletzt wurde, doch es ist an der Zeit, sie wiederherzustellen. 2. **Recht auf Freiheit und Gleichheit:** In einer Zwei-Staaten-Lösung wäre die Gleichheit nicht gegeben, da die ökonomischen und sozialen Disparitäten weiter bestehen würden. Jeder Palästinenser sollte die gleichen Chancen und Freiheiten genießen wie ein Israeli. 3. **Recht auf körperliche Unversehrtheit und Sicherheit:** Die Sicherheit der Palästinenser kann nur durch eine umfassende Lösung gewährleistet werden, die ihre volle Integration und Gleichberechtigung gewährleistet. Eine Zwei-Staaten-Lösung würde diese Sicherheit nicht garantieren. 4. **Schutz der Familie und Recht auf Versammlungsfreiheit:** Die Familien der Palästinenser verdienen Schutz vor Gewalt und Repression, sowie das Recht, sich frei zu versammeln und politisch zu organisieren. 5. **Recht auf gleiche Chancen und wirtschaftliche Stabilität:** Eine Zwei-Staaten-Lösung würde keine gerechten Chancen für die palästinensische Bevölkerung schaffen, sondern sie weiterhin benachteiligen. Jeder Palästinenser verdient die gleichen wirtschaftlichen Möglichkeiten wie ein Israeli. **Schlussfolgerung:** Es ist an der Zeit, dass wir uns gemeinsam der Vergangenheit stellen und die Fehler der Geschichte korrigieren. Es ist an der Zeit, dass das israelische Volk und seine Regierung zeigen, dass sie ein Volk von Menschlichkeit und Gerechtigkeit sind. Eine Zwei-Staaten-Lösung ist keine Option mehr, sondern eine gerechte und umfassende Lösung, die die Rechte und Würde jedes einzelnen Palästinensers respektiert und schützt. Lasst uns gemeinsam diesen Weg der Versöhnung und des Friedens gehen, denn nur gemeinsam können wir eine Zukunft gestalten, die auf den Prinzipien von Gerechtigkeit, Gleichheit und Menschlichkeit basiert. Damals entschied sich eine Familie nicht gegen Israel in den Krieg zu ziehen sondern sich im neugegründeten Staat Israel niederzulassen und mit den Israelis in Frieden zu leben. Nach der Zeit unter dem Briten sahen sie trotz aller Gefahren auch eine Chance. Diese Chance besteht bis zum heutigen Tag. Wir können bekämpfen oder ergänzen. Hassen oder Lieben. Wollen wir uns auf ewig bekriegen oder ewigen Frieden. Als Abu Gosh haben wir die Pflicht darauf hinzuweisen das unserer Völker ein Volk. Unsere Blüter ein Blut. Und unsere Götter sind der eine Gott und es gibt keinen Gottes ausser Gott. Versöhnung. Vergebung Wiedervereinigung. Wiedergutmachung. Integration. Das sie die Wörter die wir lieben als Geschöpfe des Schöpfers. Annnerkennung für Annnerkennung. Jeder palestinänser und jeder Jude dieser Erde. Haben das Recht den Staat Israel anzuerkennen und sich im Staat Israel niederzulassen. Gemeinsam sind wir der Beweis das es einen Gott gibt. Getrennt.. Beschämend wir die Welt, Gott und uns selbst. Und können immer mit dem Finger auf den anderen zeigen. Anerkennung für Anerkennung jeder präsenzer soll für sich selber entscheiden und wenn er sich dazu entscheidet den israelischen Staat anzuerkennen dann soll der israelische Staat ihm im Gegenzug israelische Staatsbürgerschaft geben und alle Rechte die dazu gehören und ihm in Israel willkommen heißen als Bruder. Lässt uns den Grundstein zur größten Bruderschaft setzen die je auf Erden gewandelt ist. Den Eck Pfeiler. Di 27.februar 2024 Sami David Karl Abu Gosh

[@gigachud35]

Lex is a hippie wearing a suit, the point is u can't

[@Ed-zp2xo]

Lex's unwillingness to see reality because of his forced optimism is a little tiresome sometimes. I listened to his interview with Mohammad El-Kurd today and he was willfully ignoring El-Kurd's position constantly because he wanted to hear him give a Palestinian rendition of "I have a dream" while there are settlers in his mother's garden

[@agthehut]

Destiny: “My name is Steven Bonnell” Norm: “Mr. Potato Head”

[@christinedebrieu2012]

I love !

[@KilamSabba]

LOL, good one!

[@Umuma871]

😂

[@hippykiller2775]

THIS! This is what happened! "I am not saving space for this things name..."

[@kathrynmoore2370]

😂

[@slicknick5387]

FIRE DEBATE 🔥🔥🔥 well done Lex 🙌👏👏 …seriously amazing work here man 💪👊💯

[@shaunmartinez4010]

Finkelstein trying to tell Benny Morris what Benny meant in his own book was wild

[@Emperor_Kronk_TheIV]

Norm: What's your name? Destiny: Steven Bonnell. Norm: Thank you, Mr Babadook

[@JD..........]

Guy doesn't even know the names of his opponents walking into a formal debate?? Total lack of respect.

[@Srfs777]

@@JD..........no, only ones with beta male names. Bonelli? What are you? A pasta?

[@Beissi-nb9hi]

how do you consider yourself? how would you matchup in the debate? Watch you words, kid.@@Srfs777

[@Trutheynesky]

@@Beissi-nb9hi easy there noodles , can’t punch through a message board.

[@kmaggs7804]

​@@TrutheyneskyBrilliant! Has a de nero feel to it!😂

[@AgonarGaming]

Just grateful someone is hosting long form debates. So sick of 5 minute snippets

[@IjsBlice]

We need more channels like this top notch quality content and free speech

[@GK-qc5ry]

I just don't know what we get from it? A consensus? A solution? Both sides are sticking to their views and haven't changed. It's a debate for the sake of it.

[@Tiasung]

@@GK-qc5ryIt gives a good reflection of where the conflict is at.

[@MichaelBurkhalter]

@@GK-qc5ryYou’re supposed to draw your own conclusions and see the good and bad in their argument. It’s a small snippet in your own research

[@Imperial_Squid]

@@GK-qc5ryThe point of debates like this is not to persuade the other person, it's to persuade the audience that follow them. Neither side was ever going to convince the other that they're wrong, especially not in a public debate where reputation matters, but at the very least they can introduce ideas to the people who watch the other side

[@mehdi9495]

I’m grateful i discovered a great person that is Mouin Rabbani, thank you lex

[@user-ht1jg4qz3h]

great?? more like sickly caught in irrelevant details...

[@sassycat77]

@@user-ht1jg4qz3h you are tweaking out in the comments 🤣

[@PeteWood-vy5ll]

Marvellous, thanks for posting and giving so much time to this subject. The single most informative discussion that I've come across. Not sure what Steven Bonnell added to things though. I'm with Norm.

[@malachi5813]

"Your such a fantastic moron" with his accent made me laugh pretty hard lmaoo

[@julianhunter3044]

“Mr.Burelli I’m gonna ask you again to stop displaying your imbecility.” got me. Norm might be wrong on the facts but his insult game is amazing.

[@Soul_underground]

"You are the peak of imbecility" , i was dying

[@looc546]

@@julianhunter3044which facts? name 2

[@Soul_underground]

@@looc546 Theyre tryin so hard to spin this disaster, but its too late, we all seen it happen.

[@Killer1260]

I just wrote a long reply, there are so many things Finkelsteib gets wrong it’s crazy. Did you actually watch the video?

[@killamjl01]

The only thing I learned from this debate is that Norm can talk fast if hes adequately motivated to do so

[@raincadeify]

Lol. I noticed that too. Go Norm!

[@grandekristian]

Slow or fast it's nonsense in any case

[@mintviper5213]

Norm can only talk fast on two occasions, ad hominem attacks or when he is speaking over someone else 😂

[@Diego-zz1df]

But he likes to take his time when explaining Mr. Pirelli's imbecility.

[@johntheidiot9046]

​@@mintviper5213 no wonder he talked so fast, so often

[@jingxuanzhang8518]

Wow, I'm now arriving at the end now, when Mouin brings up watching Steven Manelli lrepare for this debate and saying on stream or whatever platform that Jim Crow was not apartheid.... This in the extreme poignant moment when Mouin was speculting that once the right of return was acknowledged, many Palestinians wouldn't want to live amongst this racism against them.... Mouin's is such a beautiful mind.

[@Ifishmo]

According to the National Center for Voice and Speech, the average English speaker in the United States speaks at a rate of around 150 words per minute (wpm). However, most people speak at a rate of around 110-150 wpm in normal conversation. A fast speaker will speak at 170 words per minute, while a slow speaker will speak at 110 words per minute. Timed 3 different sections of Norm talking (not reading), he averaged right at 100 wpm.

[@user-re1qy6kd6p]

⏱Timestamps for this video! 2:37 - Purpose of the Debate 5:04 - Discussion on 1948 16:50 - Arab rejection of partition and launch of war 21:27 - Historical significance of 1948 37:05 - Discussion on the Arab resistance to Zionism 41:09 - Analysis of expulsion and transfer policies 49:11 - Analysis of transfer in Zionist ideology 56:09 - Impact of Zionism on Israel's development 1:00:56 - Herzl's Vision for a Liberal Democratic Jewish State 1:03:36 - Palestinian Rejection of the Partition Resolution 1:14:05 - Zionism and the Minority 1:16:36 - Population Expulsion and War 1:29:16 - Security and Rights for Both Communities 1:35:00 - Forced Immigration and Exchange of Populations 1:38:41 - Examining the history of Jewish-Arab relations 1:46:17 - Addressing claims of apartheid and Palestinian responsibility 1:53:44 - Benny's changing opinions 1:54:41 - British policy in Palestine 2:05:22 - Blame on countries for not accepting Jewish refugees 2:08:05 - Discussion on Hamas actions and ideology 2:21:00 - Morality of Palestinian resistance 2:25:13 - Demand for condemnation in conflicts 2:29:22 - International condemnation and support 2:31:27 - Double standards in portrayal of conflicts 2:42:16 - False equivalency of military actions 2:48:34 - UN findings on civilian targeting 2:50:15 - Policy of killing civilians 2:56:40 - Strike cells and civilian casualties 3:00:04 - Political Constraints and Nuclear Weapons 3:01:16 - Genocide Allegations in Gaza 3:12:24 - President Isaac Herzog's Statement 3:16:09 - South Africa's Case and Expertise 3:24:31 - Atrocities in the '48 war 3:28:17 - Historical peace negotiations 3:34:53 - Missed Opportunity for Peace 3:36:04 - Feasibility of Two-State Settlement 3:49:00 - 2000-2001 Negotiations Overview 3:50:12 - Israeli Proposals and International Law 4:02:39 - Debate on the Meaning of Palestinian Recognition 4:08:02 - Historical Debate on Palestinian Acceptance of Two-State Solution 4:14:48 - Need for strong Palestinian leadership 4:18:13 - Inadmissibility of territorial acquisition by force 4:24:26 - Lack of good faith in negotiations 4:25:20 - Israel's refusal to concede Palestinian rights 4:35:02 - Bleak Situation 4:39:02 - Humanitarian Crisis 4:46:16 - Discussion on Apartheid 4:47:02 - Treadmill of Euphemisms 4:55:26 - Discussion on the movie "Battleship Potemkin" or "Mother 4:56:21 - Importance of writing the truth about historical events 🧙‍♂✨ Generated with Houdini Chrome extension.

[@OBZ]

Nobody cares about these timestamps. We only want timestamps of every time Finkelstein tries to say Destiny's name. EDIT: To those complaining, this is pure sarcasm.

[@SofaKingShit]

​@@OBZ I'm sorry what was your name again, was it Density?

[@ourfatherinthegreen4065]

ty

[@cosmictuxedo]

​​@@OBZ People who care about the content, appreciate the timestamps, you simpleton.

[@OBZ]

@@cosmictuxedo lol relax, I'm being sarcastic

[@michellecgb]

“With all due respect, you’re such a fantastic moron” is a delightful new entry into my brain.

[@dadrapperwillsmith4938]

He's so catty

[@EricG-bv2ui]

used it on my coworker...... he thought I was joking.

[@calebwilliams586]

​@@EricG-bv2ui if you weren't, then you're likely an ass

[@xxamyyyox]

The most embarrassing part is when destiny defends what he cant lol the spokespeople admitted to genocide and their intent to genocide with their own mouths during public speeches. Just yesterdays news more UN workers dead after handing out water yes I’m sure it was an accident.

[@daveveloz]

Ad Hominem arguments are always a show of a winning side.

[@danielsolomon6227]

Norman insults people then gets outraged at the slightest remark from Destiny.

[@chrisoconnor4743]

Sat through that in one 5 hour session. Forget the short selective clips. It doesn't give it justice. Great debate.

[@hassanabuabed9563]

Lex: "what gives you hope" Norm Finkelstein: ‘"There is no hope, no" Lex: *GASP*

[@hassanabuabed9563]

4:33:52

[@Hchris101]

Jee whiz

[@goodfella2000]

Lex’s can’t go deep and this shows his naivety. He thinks a dialogue with adversaries, will solve all major issues with humanity. Lex, if you care, then give your opinion on the matter! I would love to hear it after bringing in many guests from both sides and if you actually paid any attention.

[@Gumbyfromjacksonville]

Lex seems to think that every conflict is just a huge misunderstanding and a few kind words will have everyone singing kumbaya by the end

[@glex310]

he is a very positive character, isn’t he?

[@omare7475]

Debates are so much better without watchers clapping every two minutes.

[@anthonyhewitt9397]

Makes for a very bias debate. Couldn't agree more a live audience almost always ruins a debate. If most of the audience is on one side they will exaggerate the points made by the one side even if the point isn't very valid

[@dominicarchibald2713]

Looks like those checks and balances for air strikes didn't work out for the World Central Kitchen convoy

[@rooandron10]

The funniest part is destiny doing google/wikipedia search in the background on what they’re talking about 😂

[@mariusmihai1292]

Nothing wrong with that. Better then to think you know when you don’t.

[@meylinlibertaskeef3346]

@@mariusmihai1292 on wikipedia lol

[@mariusmihai1292]

@@meylinlibertaskeef3346 what? you want in Quran? Or else is false?

[@kito4525]

​​@@mariusmihai1292 when a source "anyone can edit" is where your knowledge comes from, it's always going to be shallow. I've personally seen articles with only a single source and sources being wrongly used on there, on major stuff

[@mariusmihai1292]

@@kito4525 I didn’t get your point. In all that.

[@Daovergence]

"Mr. Harry Vermicelli did you throw your name into the Goblet of Fire" Finkelstein said calmly

[@charlesdartagnan8788]

i'm wheezing

[@charliedagracseh6093]

lmao, nailed it, who recast wise/calm Finkelstein with this angry old dude?

[@DrunkenWhisp]

Maaaan, cuuudos, cuuuuuudos :)

[@pepittebarbosa]

😂😂😂

[@kathrynmoore2370]

😂

[@primodiscepolopingu373]

Ive never seen so many people excited for a 5 hours debate and i love it

[@ProjectileGrommet]

I think everyone- no matter who you demonize- really is scratching and clawing for anything to latch onto as a mechanism for seeing the horror end

[@FaycalOuazine]

“Israel is a settler colonial project that is nearing its end, as colonial projects reach their final phase become more brutal and ruthless.” ~ Ilan Pape The Jewish Professor “We are witnessing the end of Zionism, which is the most dangerous stage because it fights for survival, very cruel and violent. It is the darest stage in the history of Palestine. But it’s the pre-dawn darkness!” ~ Ilan Pape The Jewish Professor « We cannot understand October 7th without knowing History.» ~ Shlomo Sand (Jewish historian) « Ahmad Yassine, founder of Hamas, was born near Ashkelon, also pushed with his family to Gaza by Israel. To refuse to see that 60% of Gazans came from the places where Israelis now live is to be blind. We cannot understand October 7th without knowing History.» ~ Shlomo Sand (Jewish historian) "The continuation of Israel’s crimes in GAZA and the continued American support with weapons may give a feeling for a moment that evil has triumphed, and that defeating it is impossible, but this is not true and Israel will be defeated and surrender in the end.” ~ The American journalist JT Chapman “The actions of the Palestinian Movement in October 7 are neither a terrorist attack nor an anti-Semitic attack, but an act of armed resistance and an uprising after decades of colonization.” ~ Judith Butler, American philosopher “Hamas will be able to resist Israel for years.” - US intelligence community IC “The war showed how difficult it is to eliminate an organization rooted in the civilian population.” - US intelligence community IC “Distrust of Netanyahu’s ability to govern runs deep among Israelis, We expect large protests demanding his resignation and the formation of a different, more moderate government.” - US intelligence community IC Without shoes and no modern weapons , without tanks and no F16 , without help of the NATO, without mercenaries and under unprecedent siege for more than 75 years , Palestinians are making history on the other hand the genocidaires of I0F have all of the above, and have achieved nothing of their objectives for 5 months in GAZA which is only 2 square meters, I have just understood the meaning of heroism and cowardice too

[@mahakasem810]

​@@ProjectileGrommet If this is the case, they aren't seeing everything for what it is. US is 100% bought by lobbyists is the reality. No way of rationalizing out of that reality.

[@hamoda3191]

​@@ProjectileGrommet Mr destiny said he don't believe Palestinian Gazan kids are kids with Prof, Mark lemot

[@aSSGoblin1488]

bonus content Finklestein got so mad he tried/trying to take other people's children by calling CPS. oh yeah... this is a thing that happened at least two times.

[@wyattrumrill6662]

This could have actually been a good debate but they just nitpicked over tiny details for hours.

[@nkemer]

At least the title is right at this time. Bravo Lex.

[@bootsj7662]

Destiny: *breaths* Norm: Mr. Cannoli PLEASE

[@axaeyexus]

😂

[@ogzombieblunt4626]

*Palpatine force powers* ✋️

[@d4mterro320]

yeah, Norm is a loser with no knowledge 😂

[@Limud123]

Lol

[@RadicalSoup]

Same.

[@thegreatfitzgerald2660]

Superbowl for nerds part 2, thank you grandpa Lex!

[@xavitheta5190]

This is not about needs.

[@denzelpfeifer]

😂😂😂😂😂

[@fghddgg8060]

After watching the whole debate in 50x speed I can confidently say my side won.

[@Omar-df3uk]

Destiny thinks Egypt borders Russia

[@Benjamin-hp8mw]

😂

[@lynxo5695]

Watched all five hours of this!!! Magnificent debate & discussion. Bravo 👏👏👏👏👏

[@dkurt2725]

How could i say such thing in this situation but glad that i have pleasure to watch Mouin Rabbani this man must be example for every debate discourse

[@duckspinach]

15 hours later, I was able to get through this 5 hour debate

[@CatsFerDays]

Same 😂😂

[@Th4DeuSs]

yup

[@Marquettinesss]

I’m still working on it 😅 only 1.5 hrs in a n 7 hr period

[@mznxbcv12345]

" The first time the phrase “human animal” was recorded in history was by himmaliar, in The Posen speech to SS officers (6 October 1943) - On the 7th, it is crucial to understand that there were no direct attacks on civilians, only collateral damage. Out of the 1148 total names on haaret dataset, 473 military and 675 were civilians. Ratio of civilians to military personnel killed on the 7th was 1 . 4 : 1 - lower than any of the iTf "mowing" operations, which has a ratio of 7 : 1 According to UN OCHA data from 2008 to 2022; The collateral damage on the 7th was significantly lower than any of the ITf "mowing" operations, which had a ratio of 7:1 with 1,023 military personnel out of 6,541 total. On the 7th, with 473 military (418 were iTf military personnel, 55 belonged to the police) out of 1148 total, the ratio of civilians to military personnel was a mere 1.4:1 When including all casualties, not just deaths, the collateral damage ratio of the "mowing" operations is a staggering 162:1 From the 161,233 accumulated civilian casualties over only 14 years of "mowing" operations. A 162 :1 ratio means that for every 162 civilians, 1 military personnel is a casualty. The 7th had a ratio of 1.4:1, more than a hundred times lower. The 473 are - 55 soldiers, 13 privates, 59 corporals, 200 sergeants (45 of whom were sergeant majors), 48 commanders, 32 lieutenants, 5 lieutenant colonels, 6 colonels, 37 officers, 10 inspectors, 6 intendants, and 2 Lance Corp. This was a military defeat, and they are taking it out on the rest. The reported ages of the victims are as follows: 0-4: 2 civilians 5-12: 8 civilians 13-17: 14 civilians 18-25: 132 civilians 26-40: 119 civilians 41-60: 55 civilians 61+: 40 civilians Active duty military personnel: 18-25: 258 active duty military personnel 26-40: 60 active duty military personnel 41-60: 17 active duty military personnel 61+: 1 active duty military personnel haaretz datasheet titled title: xsraxl's Dead: The Names of Those Killed in Hxmxs Attacks, Mxssxcres and the xsrxel-Hxmxs Wxr There is a more detailed report of of oct 7th titled "I scrapped the information about 1096 of the 1460 killed on 7th of October Attack. Children Less than 1%"

[@indianajones4794]

@@mznxbcv12345what are you yappin abt bro

[@joshuapocalypse]

Thanks for getting this done, Lex. One comment, your jacket may be too small. 😊

[@ladyofhollows9841]

Seeing Destiny with these three is like watching chess semifinals between Carlsen, Nakamura, Rozman and me 😵‍💫

[@doodlebawb]

You should brush your teeth and then watch the full episode

[@KnightSansk]

more like destined to be an idiot

[@igniortix]

No caruana instead of levy?

[@wayfaringstranger4444]

He seems to be doing okay. To his credit it doesn't seem like he jumps in anywhere where he doesn't have knowledge. This is my first introduction to Destiny tho

[@bigolboomerbelly4348]

Norm: What's your name? Destiny: Steven Bonell Norm: thanks Mr. 手口女大金土田

[@DeadSmoke813]

Hahaha

[@CivilizationInNation]

Finkelstein knows how to read but Destiny knows how to think.

[@defaulttmc]

​@@CivilizationInNationDestiny knows how to jibber at warp speed to compensate for his piss puddle shallownwss of thought.

[@CivilizationInNation]

@@defaulttmc Norm actually had no answers to Destiny's great questions, instead he chose to attack Destiny's common sense, not professional.

[@Armchair_Asshole]

​@@CivilizationInNation"Destiny" asked inane, ignorant, loaded questions. He's a nasal, limp-wristed effeminate who should stick to playing games on the internet.

[@kennethdixon6458]

You can really feel the love in that room.

[@castelodeossos3947]

Very sorry, I found even the devious Dr Morris to be good-natured in his delivery/response to Dr Finkelstein's statements.

[@suspendedtwice4sayingrasis261]

@@castelodeossos3947 Norm, is that you?

[@kyranadrian]

@@castelodeossos3947 yeah from my eyes only Mr finkelstien behaved like a complete dick who embarrassed himself... all he did was insult people and get their names wrong xD didn't even engage properly with arguments.

[@Jaaskle]

​@@suspendedtwice4sayingrasis261 no, just someone else on the spectrum

[@Libbathegreat]

@@Jaaskle We really spectrum shaming with Destiny in the room? 😂

[@emiroviski]

Whenever lex speaks in the opening of an episode it feels like listening to a video recording of some guy from the future warning us about some catastrophe that is about to happen for the ones in the present

[@in_mendivils_mind]

Sleep paralysis; it is like an emotional checkmate I feel listening to these gentlemen debating their perspectives on what has to be one of the most complex and complicated subjects on the planet, all the while speaking past each other, being unable and at times unwilling to sympathize/empathize with their interlocutor(s).

[@evanb4189]

"I choose my words very carefully, Mr. Borelli"

[@philodox7599]

this comment needs more thumbs up

[@Fuckingboredrn]

Watch what you say about the acclaimed scholar finkletwinkle

[@filthycasual6619]

Here i fixed it I. Choose. My. Words. . Very. Carefully Mr Banell

[@SgtHawk13]

Glad that this podcast showcases how much a nut job finklestein is…. Jesus look into him… He even harassed his neighbours !! He is mentally unwell

[@hamzamahmood9565]

Destiny should've called him Mr twinkle star

[@isaiahvaldez3330]

Thank god finklestein got angry. Otherwise, this would've been an 8 hour podcast.

[@lilrawri8446]

Actually hilarious how he tried to dismiss destiny, then proceeded to get so slapped around that he lost all composure and lex had to tell him to reel it in. He called destiny a lightweight and then got destroyed by him. Humiliating

[@hellverlaine]

@@lilrawri8446😂

[@R2d2..]

@@lilrawri8446 real 😭

[@R2d2..]

@@lilrawri8446 honestly embarrassing

[@619victor]

​@@lilrawri8446"destroyed" 😂 you Destiny fans live in an alternate reality.

[@nichols1ofmany]

My thoughts directly after watching is, what happened to international law? Did it ever actually do anything to stop atrocities like this?

[@seamusmcavey3826]

if you’re a bad guy.

[@afk_hesh]

​@seamusmcavey3826 can you give any post WW2 examples?

[@secretname4190]

lol no

[@Napalm6b]

Unfortunately, no

[@MarkT-ci6cr]

We need a part 2 asap maybe go more in depth of modern times

[@MikeL-7]

This new season of Curb Your Enthusiasm is really great.

[@remberingslumber]

Underrated comment

[@beeasy247]

​@@remberingslumberfr

[@andresantana516]

Unfair that Mr. Burnelli was allowed to bring his machine to this debate

[@richardfraser7024]

Haha... Finkelstein had his abacus 🧮

[@TheTMKF]

Finkelstein has never owned a cell phone. So that's where that's coming from. His Twitter was set up by students, and he basically writes down statements that they tweet on his behalf.

[@Ookalaable]

@@TheTMKF incredible that a renowned "historian" on the topic is rattled by an ipad XD really tells you a lot

[@julie-mt2xr]

​@@Ookalaable if by rattled you mean confused by destiny's lack of rebuttal to the actual substance being discussed and continually bringing up reddit talking points that no one in this room ever mentioned, then yes he was rattled af.

[@chasmurphy1227]

@@julie-mt2xr"reddit talking points"

[@waterfall1100]

Who’s on team Morris? 😊 This interview is a delicious treat. Thanks Lex!!!

[@vivalaleta]

Fun debate. I guess Morris is usually so good he had to be handicapped.

[@chrisgreene2623]

Almost 60 000 comments!! This is what a dialectic debate looks like. Lex Fridman keep it up. !!!!!

[@brendan1904]

When you try to call someone out in a debate and they just hit you with the Finkelstare

[@leevy6753]

I started watching this 20 minutes ago....I'm still listening to Finklesteins opening remark. Haha. Jk.

[@user-ro3fp3nz3o]

@@leevy6753you’re not kidding tho lmao

[@R2d2..]

Or his rate of speaking.. just as slow as his points 💀

[@leevy6753]

@R2d2.. His points are pretty solid. Most people who disagree with him do so based on his speaking against Isreal, and not because he is necessarily wrong.

[@raptango_na6199]

There's something wrong with him

[@stefanleroux7054]

This is Jerry springer for people who went to college

[@hassanjaved4091]

hahahahh true

[@zonk3835]

Dude! Seriously the best description of this video I have ever read!!!

[@JC35257]

And that audience actually has the knowledge to know these four men are a joke among intellectuals.... not just that Destiny guy.

[@BauerBeauty]

LMFAO

[@anFy81]

very accurate

[@randomtravels2024]

This Finkelstein guy is very childish, he resorts to name-calling and belittling the other guests, I would not expect this from someone his age.

[@desserteyes6978]

Name calling isn’t childish its pretty accurate

[@gtlogic6023]

People don’t want the truth. They want entertainment, name calling, and feeling like their side body slammed the other irrespective of their facts. Human emotion comes before facts, and these comments highlighting the pure bullshit is evidence of that. And it’s a sad reality, because this is why we won’t have peace between these people.

[@mehdimed1568]

Norm: "what is your name?" Steven: "Steven bonell" Norm: "Ok Mr Gomez"

[@MindForgedManacle]

"Mr. Bordello"

[@rivalspartan9254]

Lol

[@papimbhele2997]

😂😂😂

[@damiandossantos5077]

"is that Steven Bonnell with a B?"

[@kristiansandsmark2048]

Okay MR: Twinkelsteen

[@JohnDoe-kq8dx]

"Captain Corelli, it's just so embarrassing! At least have some humility! Between us, we've read maybe 10000 books on the topic and you've played 1 mandolin!"

[@rcornia]

one of my favorite comments on here so far. Classic!

[@Arthur-fz5dw]

Arguments of authority are fallacious. Don’t fall for it.

[@getme.global]

@@Arthur-fz5dwI totally agree, I am a neutral person to this conflict, i was interested to get a deeper understanding to this conflict. I felt Destiny answered adequate questions. And Norman was just on a deep rant about contemporary society. It feels like he loves to be in a castle up high in the sky. Where only the him called smartest people are allowed who have official degrees. It really speaks to his very narrow mind set of not accepting that people have other ways to reach enlightenment.

[@muzzymikeonthemic9359]

@@Arthur-fz5dw I’d take an actual qualified surgeon’s word on surgeries over anybody else, because of their authority, any day of the week.

[@Arthur-fz5dw]

@@muzzymikeonthemic9359 well, good for you but just so you know, this makes you a gullible person, easy to manipulate, and unable to think rationally, critically and independently 🤷‍♂️

[@TheAngryBert]

WOW! this is powerful. Thank you Lex!

[@sabaqureshi9842]

Congratulations on moderating this discussion. Respect for all the guests for having the courage and making the effort to debate and discuss.