The Forgotten Sonic Moves

[@SplashDash_]

wow, a new ideo!! Only took 2 months!

[@Brian_Griffin_Gaming]

I have your home address

[@charmingmagican9821]

Congratulations

[@jubeasta0135]

Ideo

[@SwiftGamer_YT]

wowzers

[@norpheus6305]

New idea or new video?

[@Koko-cy4ff]

The springs actually do have different functionality. You cannot use the homing attack on the classic springs. And... that's it. But there is a difference!

[@JustinJulian-00]

How is that supposed to make sense it would have been useful if you can use the homing attack on those springs and also Sonic feels slow in cyberspace even when I use the boost he doesn't even feel fast and cyberspace to me are nothing more than filler levels because the only thing you get from them are just portal keys and due to the fact that's they reuse the same designs from Green Hill chemical plant and even sky century why don't they give us the level designs from the adventure games or the storybook games or unleashed or even colors of all people don't you agree that we are tired of the same levels like Green Hill like chemical plant and sky sanctuary over and over again if anything those levels from those previous games never even got in Sonic frontiers or even a motorized design of them

[@Magnet_Chaos]

​​@@JustinJulian-00 First, I want to introduce you to this thing called "Punctuation". Sebond, the Classic Springs are not meant to be useful. They are just meant to be another aspect of the level to keep in mind. Because if you can use the homing attack on them then they are no different from the Modern Spring. So at that point why even have them? Everything else you mentioned is an entirely different conversation.

[@Itz_Kwame]

He can’t even compete in the Olympics anymore due to this amnesia🤦🏾‍♂️

[@fr0stdr4ke95]

Nah. Just NFTs.

[@TheSultan1470]

​@@fr0stdr4ke95 Cool! Sonic'll make an actual profit!

[@derple8524]

He won't be able to compete at all, none of them will 😭

[@animosity3771]

bro is ash ketchum

[@hendester05]

Sonic's forgotten ability: ROLLING.

[@reverendfatheruncleruckus7059]

I think the last mainline game to have it was sonic 3&k what a joke.

[@hendester05]

@@reverendfatheruncleruckus7059 Actually, the advance and rush games were the last games that used it.

[@NoNamex1412]

​@@hendester05actually it was sonic superstars

[@NamelessCrusad3r]

@@NoNamex1412superstars isnt mainline

[@NamelessCrusad3r]

It’s a spin-off using classic sonic

[@YetAnotherLetsPlayer]

Fun fact: the spin dash is actually in the PS2/Wii version of Unleashed. If you press the boost button right when GO appears you'll spin dash. Get the timing perfect and you'll also fill up a boost bar for free

[@JustinJulian-00]

Yeah I have done that a few times playing this version of Sonic unleashed and you can do that while you're on dash panels as well

[@gManGabe]

Sonic will also spin if he hits a dash panel while boosting. No gameplay effect, just visual+sound.

[@VermillionDBL]

It's so satisfying.

[@elivcdxv1852]

only minorly related but god drifting looked cool in unleashed

[@LilXancheX]

I literally discovered that as a 12 year old one day. I thought I was a genius for that

[@RefreshingMirage]

Watching this video made me realize how inconsistent this franchise’s game design is and how many moves it doesn’t have anymore, and also how the rules break even with the very same moveset

[@HazzMataz]

Yeah same, I didn’t realise it at first

[@TheSultan1470]

You just realized Sonic is rough?

[@geoffreyrichards6079]

Well… at least it keep the series from getting stale.

[@SwellStuff483]

It will never not piss me off that Sonic doesn’t have the drift in Cyberspace since the left shoulder button (which is used for the Sonic Boom attack in the overworld) doesn’t do anything.

[@valtheemokid4005]

It's literally the literal move he needs because he can barely turn for shit on turns

[@JustinJulian-00]

Yeah man Sonic can't even drift in cyberspace like you wanted to be because sonic just goes against the wall if you were trying to turn left or right for example you can only do that in certain areas of cyberspace that should have been one of the main movesets for Sonic so I can drift and tight corners much easier while maintaining my speed

[@dolomite1067]

Not until you unlock the Spin Dash, but, yeah.

[@sonicdml4175]

You can slide

[@JustinJulian-00]

@@sonicdml4175 I know I can slide I just can't drift in certain areas of cyberspace and drifting is all about turning in sharp corners and drifting and sliding is not the same thing

[@JasLamArr91]

Hot Take: I liked the parkour in Lost World. It was wonky though.

[@Bobo12300]

It was a neat idea that should have been properly expanded upon in a game like Fontiers

[@felixdaniels37]

Lost World had a lot of cool ideas that I felt like could've worked had Sonic Team actually STUCK with the gameplay they were going for and fleshed it out going forward. Instead they just cowarded out and made Forces, a game specifically created to appeal to as wide an audience as possible.

[@jezSonic]

This is just an opinion that everyone has right to have

[@pass_]

can't wait for sonic to use the infinate jumping mini sonic crystal in sonic movie 3

[@evdestroy5304]

Purple Gem

[@kingbash6466]

It still pisses me off that parkour has practically been left to rot in Lost World since that's actually a cool mechanic that could have been explored more if they bothered fleshing it out (no I don't count Frontiers, since they only cover certain colored walls.)

[@Rusty_Spy]

I'll never forgive Sonic Team for that

[@MaeMaeMochii]

I don’t know why but I’ve always had a love for the Super Peel Out. I think it’s one of the best things to be introduced to a Sonic game but it needs to be in more modern titles!

[@JustinJulian-00]

What good super peel out would do sure you will be super fast when you use it but your left open to enemy attacks I mean it can be optional to put the move in there but it's not the most beneficial move to have because while you spin dash you are more protected from damage from the enemies

[@SonicTagTeamPlush]

I don't see apoint for it Spindash does the same thing.. and kills enemies in your way.

[@legoboy7107]

@@JustinJulian-00 You can roll immediately after launching from a Peel-Out making you just as protected as with the Spindash but with the Peel-Out's speed, if anything once you start doing that trick the Peel-Out makes the Spindash less useful, other than you still being vulnerable while charging in place which is hardly an issue.

[@mikeanthony3300]

​@legoboy7107 Actually, that makes the Super Peel Out worse since you need an additional input to make it more effective. The Spindash gives you speed and protection upon being used. Super Peel Out requires you to quickly press down right after using the move if there is enemies in your way. At this point, it's only main unique trait was the running animation which as of Superstars has become Classic Sonic's full speed running animation.

[@legoboy7107]

@@mikeanthony3300 I mean, I don't exactly find pressing down on a dpad to be a particularly difficult challenge to be honest, that seems entirely negligible and also doesn't really impact which move is better in terms of abilities and usefulness in-game, that's an external factor.

[@fryguy9704]

At least all of us can agree that Sonic’s moves change almost every week.

[@Danominator]

When you said "Sonic Moves" I thought you were talking about his dance numbers in those commercials from the 2000s And that's not even mentioning Shadow

[@reginlief1]

Classic being from a different dimension wouldn’t have been lame if they did what I THOUGHT they were doing with that plot. The phantom Ruby was already doing some weird dimension-y stuff in mania. I was confident the villains Infinte was using were plucked from timelines that they had been victorious in. A chaos that had wiped out all life, a shadow that had followed through with his plans, a zavok that… lost hexed all over the place? Idk I never played lost world. Instead, they’re just… projections? Copies? They’re lame. The phantom Ruby was undermined and a great potential story arc for all four of those villains was missed. Just IMAGINE shadow talking to a past self that didn’t realise Maria’s true last wish…

[@HOTD108_]

That's an awful idea. If there are alternate timelines where other outcomes happened, then the events of each game become meaningless. It's the ultimate tension killer. Sonic's victory in any given game means nothing is there's infinite timelines where he lost and everyone died, and vice versa. It's impossible to introduce a multiverse into a series without erasing all meaning from any and all plots.

[@zacnmac]

lost hexed all over the place 😭

[@tgbell6567]

@@HOTD108_I disagree, it can be done extremely well. Just look at the Spider-Verse movies

[@fabiosonhandogrande1697]

​@@HOTD108_It's basically needing a "main timeline" that stays focused on. With how Sonic goes, the idea'd only be in Forces. Unless manipulated, the other timelines wouldn't matter... Just do it 'cuz it's cool this one time, then move on as Sonic tends to do

[@_veloxity91]

Multiverse stories only work when there's a set number of them and each universe is different from one another (including characters)

[@jubeasta0135]

Sonic prime can NOT be canon bruh what😭

[@Nebnub]

When everything is Canon nothing is

[@blubrrybeanie]

@@Nebnubi mean basically nothing happened in the end right?

[@Kirb01992]

Pretty sure they confirmed it was canon

[@killerblodychuky6]

They said that the show was made to be canon but that after production started the writers of the show at Netflix disregarded pre existing canon and did whatever they wanted

[@rando6677]

I mean it is but Season 3 ending pretty much just makes all of what actually happens in the show useless soo Idk even

[@FanicTheHedgehogYT]

In Sonic Lost World there's forgotten move, When Sonic's uncurling from the Spindash and spinning without the Ball Graphic, just hold down the Spindash botton again you literally do this by spinning in the Water without fall it

[@Slimeonian]

14:55 oh my god…. I never realised LS Mark and SplashDash were the same person. I may be stupid

[@masedaace5473]

I thought that was the case, but couldn't be sure until I found your comment. Thanks.

[@PikaPhantomVG]

Nah they're just really good friends 😛

[@Dante...]

I've never watched an LSMark video so I was confused as to why he kept getting recommended to me. Now I know it's because him and Splash Dash are the same person lol.

[@trashmouth2020]

Dude it was the first time i saw a video from this channel and all the time i was thinking ''man this dude sounds SO MUCH like mark''

[@michaelkindt3288]

@11:40-.-Don't worry, the final Avatar solo level is The only level where you can wall jump. It can't be done in any other level, which is why mark forgot about it. And technically, Sonic never did the wall jump, so he is not wrong.

[@RyderPlatinumWarpstar]

Funnily enough, Frontiers technically goes back to the way the boost gauge fills up in Unleashed in Generations as well because collecting rings while boosting (when you don't have an unlimited boost that is) will fill your gauge back up slowly, so collecting rings while boosting is useful in Cyber Space. Just a fin tidbit. They're going back to how it works in Unleashed and Generations in Shadow Generations, so that's fun. They better have the wall jump in there too.

[@sonicdml4175]

In Gens it also filled up by defeating enemies, which I don't think it does in Frontiers or Shadow Gens

[@GUNS_jk]

I like the way they handled Boost and Spindash in Frontiers. Boost to go fast yet glued to the ground and Spindash to go fast and basically enable physics. I like those options.

[@JustinJulian-00]

@@GUNS_jk just don't use it in cyberspace because otherwise you're not going to get any faster after you use it while you are faster on the islands as long as you have all of your rings

[@MrBeatsrealamongus]

At this point. Sonic has brought back the old games so much at this point that it isn’t even nostalgic for old players anymore. Sega is the opposite of “let the past be the past”

[@bogdansgaming8106]

Fun Fact! In frontiers, Sonic was actually meant to have the drift and it was removed last minute, BUT THEY SOMEHOW LEFT IT FOR SUPER SONIC. You can literally do it while fighting Giganto in the vanilla game, it's insane

[@Laekith]

Sonic's moveset peaked with SA2, both in 2D and 3D (Advance 2 and Adventure 2)

[@mrmelonman2893]

this guy gets it.

[@shemayahalexander6601]

Lol what a coincidence 😂

[@Dante...]

I'd give it to Mania for 2D and Adventure 1 for 3D.

it peaked as the amount of things you can do but sa1 does less things but better, movesetwise

[@modernsonicv6newsandinfo]

i liked rush, rush adventure and unwiished's playsytle better

[@rhonddaboy13]

To quote Shadow's song Never Turn Back: "I take one step forward and two steps back," Pretty much that with different choices of gameplay.

[@loganangove7695]

Dang I was just watching "your friend" LS Mark's video of 4.5 hours of sonic, tell him to add this

[@MOVIEMATYT]

1:07 the actual cutscene has borders covering that spot which is why it pops out lmao

[@SonicTheBlueBlur15]

9:22 its weird seeing cinematic 120fps of unleashed gamesplay and sudden jump into 5 fps

[@ace_icemaster8157]

So funny thing about the ring system in forces. You still can’t recollect rings after getting hit, but that’s only a thing in easy mode for some reason. Normal has them function like how they should

[@Change51]

0:50 Mar- I mean Splash Dash, it was a mistranslation the whole time

[@castform7]

I feel like it's very obvious that Classic, regardless of which translation was used was supposed to be interpreted as a seperate dimension from Modern.

[@AydenWilliams-yl7nc]

I liked how they used the spindash to drift in gens it was really fun to use

[@SuspiciousCat13]

“Wake up, babe. Splash Dash just uploaded a new video.”

[@kanyejones3194]

Ill always love how he puts his logo over his "friends face"😂

[@aluzion2616]

Mannn.... FINALY someone talks about it. I hate how every thing is inconsistant in this franchise. And also the button layout. How the f they can't make a consistant button layout?

[@Aidensuperstars]

“Sonic prime is canon fat fucking chance” is so real

[@mr.thefrog5356]

Had to drop a like for "please clap." Best clip

[@Nobodyshere1105]

Yeah NO. Sonic Prime isn't canon, no matter how much they try to push it. If they had consistency between the Sonics then sure, but Prime 'Sonic' is *not* Sonic of the mainline games- and even those are inconsistent!

[@Lucid0000]

Too be fair with the classic springs in frontiers, they have gameplay mechanics, you can’t homing attacks the classic ones

[@kernosbattoons6504]

you are so good at making sure to be vague with these topics when you tease em, gosh

[@bracken8782]

Ok, so the classic style springs may have been implemented into lost world and modern stages in forces for nostalgia purposes, but in frontiers, they actually have a distinction: they can’t be locked onto. You can’t homing attack the classic springs.

[@sleepylmguy9968]

Ok hold up 12:00 about the drift. While I get people like it. But is it REALLY needed now a days? It was only implemented in the boost games because they couldn’t figure out how to make Sonic turn correctly while going at high speed. Now as we see in Frontiers Sonic can make tight turns now. Which of anything that’s a good thing. Sooooo, why do we need it back or want it back? What would be the point of it can Sonic can turn in high speeds now? The only reason it would if they mess up Sonic turning. But again I ask, why in the HFIL would you want them to make Sonic’s Turning crap again? You see, I don’t get this. Someone help me out here cause either I’m dumb or everyone wants Sonic to regress backwards.

[@Err0_Will]

I think the thing with Frontiers is that Sonic is inherently slower most of the time so he can make tighter turns easier, the drift is way more useful for a faster Sonic so if they make him faster again in the future, the drift would help a lot

[@cristianovogt5586]

​@@Err0_Will Fun fact, if we go by code, Sonic in the Cyberspace stages is actually the fastest Sonic has ever been when compared to the boosting games. It's all in the camera angle.

[@miadatenshi9903]

This has also to do with the fact they change engines every few games. Some things don't work in specific games so they just don't have them

[@GottaBGlitches]

The rings in Forces dissappearing when they're lost isn't exactly new, the same thing happens in Unleashed, and I think it would've been better this way, since Forces is so easy.

[@conspiracydawg]

I appreciate the "please clap," as I reference it quite often.

[@StefanoAbruzzi]

Super peelout and insta-sheild: Am I a joke to you?

[@misterzygarde6431]

I thought of the idea where the equivalent of Cyberspace in the next game have two styles. One could be Sonic Adventure style and the other the boost gameplay. Like have an in game explanation that Sonic notes that some of the zones he’s going to make boosting too risky explaining why Sonic would switch to the Adventure style. 6:58 That idea is much better though.

[@glowdonk]

Lost World's motobug is such a cutie patootie

[@LolipooChimichanga]

Sonic X shadow Gens really shows the problem with having the moveset being different in every game. It's revealed that you have the option to use the controls Frontiers had in Generations, most notable changes being the change for the homing attack and the boost being on the shoulder button. It's good for people who don't want to hassle with changing their muscle memory when switching between two characters, but when you actually start to think... ....this doesn't work at all. Hear me out. The open zone gameplay of Frontiers never has the same focus on having tight reflexes the same way the previous boost games do, such as using the slide and quickstep. These moves happen to be the most underutalized in Frontiers. Trying to boost with r2 while using the shoulder buttons to quickstep feels awful to do. That's why it's most comfortable to use the boost and quickstep during the squid chase sequences, since you can use the joystick to quickstep instead. It's also why one of the update 2 challenges that involes the quickstep in kronos island feels wrong to do when trying to boost, because it was ONLY built for quickstepping, meaning that sonic team knew that was the case.

[@tommythesparta4912]

I actually like the way the spindash and boost co-exist in Frontiers, and there are trade offs for using one over the other The Spindash has a faster top speed than the Boost, making the Spindash the faster choice on the other hand, The Boost has more sticky-ness to the ground, a much tighter turn, and can stop on a dime, making it a much more controlled speed So it basically becomes a choice of Pure speed or More Control

[@natecgames4612]

11:40 As far as I'm aware you just found the one and only time that you cant reasonably wall-jump in any level in the entire game.

[@punishederic4761]

I really had trouble understanding this video for the first 2 and a half minutes because I could have sworn the title said "The Forgotten Sonic Movies"

[@jackhumphries1087]

18:34 actually I think the reason they kept them was to distinguish them from springs that you can homing attack, since you can’t homing attack the classic-style springs

[@Wablr]

I’ve always preferred the bounce to the stomp tbh. I’d love to see it make a return someday

[@Doodle1678]

I’m surprised he went the whole video and didn’t even mention the drop dash..

[@Sephus912]

I don’t mind the spin dash in Frontiers being the way it is, I actually think it’s an amazing move to have. But also the reason I think that is because Frontiers is an open world game, and so there isn’t really an intended way of progressing through the campaign. Although when it comes to Cyberspace, there are some skips you can take, mainly in regards to 1-2, 1-5, 1-7, 2-6, 2-7, 3-1, 3-3, 4-1, and 4-2, that really make the spin dash feel like a cheat code.

[@derekg5006]

The "everything is canon" thing to my knowledge was nothing more than a joke in response to some poyo poyo pop collaboration

[@memiix]

I think they meant how in sonic frontiers they name drop a shit ton of things that appeared in past sonic games

[@derekg5006]

@@memiix sonic's twitter made a tweet saying "everything is canon" in response to one of their collaborations and then someone took a screenshot of it isolated and everyone started taking it super seriously for some reason

[@memiix]

@@derekg5006 i see

[@_veloxity91]

@@memiix No, it was a joke. They were only bringing up events that everybody knew were canon.

[@memiix]

@@_veloxity91 damn i never knew, its not like someone told me that already

[@Monhamd1000]

The irony while Mario having no canon.

[@passtheapplejuice2619]

*and no inherent focus on story.

[@JustinJulian-00]

@@Monhamd1000 because gameplay is the only thing that matters in Mario than the story itself

[@JumpyKaput]

@@JustinJulian-00true, Mario doesn’t really need a strong compelling reason to shout wahoo and stomp on mushrooms and turtles

[@Aktedya1-jt7vw]

Mario doesn't really TRY to have a canon, so it works out

[@Jacob-Jack]

18:54 I have a possible explanation on the Motobug thing: -Colors & Generations Motobug is meant to be a design evolution, making it fit the more modern "tech-y" style -Sonic 4 Motobugs are weird like that, because they try to add modern edge to the classic shape (being somewhat emblematic of Sonic 4's identity crisis where it puts a modern coat of paint over classic stuff) -Lost World gives the Badniks a VERY toy-like look, so gotta make the Motobug all cartoon-y then once Frontiers rolls around, they come back to the tech-y look, so the Colors & Generations look it is again (and I do like that look, it is a very solid evolution of the design) question is if Sega intends to commit to that look or make ANOTHER major change due to reinventing Badnik aesthetics again or being in a nostalgia haze

[@Dante...]

I think the reason they used the Generations Motobug was because most of Cyberspace was just re-used Generations assets.

[@Jacob-Jack]

@@Dante... that too

[@crocodileman94]

14:54 Just because he likes to take credit for your work, it doesn't mean you should stoop to his level and take credit for his comments.

[@TheSultan1470]

"work"

[@kao7143]

great video! when you pointed out the classic springs showing up in modern games it made me remember how much i hate that the dash panels are falling into the exact same camp like for some reason forces EXPLICITLY ONLY USES the classic dash panel design and then in frontiers it flip flops between them? i specifically remember a section in 1-3 (the only 2D highway level) where it starts out with a classic dash panel, switches to a modern dash panel in another section and then back to a classic one, like, why??? they dont function differently so why flip flop?

[@PhaxtolgiaLegacy]

12:01 I honestly don't understand why they did this, because in the Wii version of Unleashed, you 100% could drift without any context sensitive inputs. You could do it whenever you want if you ran fast enough.

[@thawkade]

You couldn't play that game with the Wii Remote only though, Unleashed needs the nunchuk, Colors doesn't. Really they shouldn't have done that anyway, 3D games with just a dpad feel bad.

[@chocolatesensei5648]

Frontiers introducing a base sonic and cast combat system opens new avenues. Sonic’s moves like his eagle kick could make a return and chain with the homing attack if with anything. It could even cause a screen shaking explosion as super sonic as good for thought. Sonic’s kicking slashes from frontiers doesn’t have to be a cyber energy exclusive move since theoretically sonic can just kick wind that fast. And speaking of wind Sonic should definitely have more tornado moves. If they wanted to reference something they could have him move around while spinning around like in sonic underground just for the cheeky fuck of it. And that’s just sonic Also fun fact super sonic was accidentally left with the drift in frontiers despite regular sonic not having it outside of that one cyber space mission

[@cristianovogt5586]

Eagle Kick IS in Sonic Frontiers, you just to hold down when doing the basic combo. The combo finished will launch the enemy in different directions depending on what direction you are holding, if you are holding down, Sonic will kick the enemy down into the ground while doing the Eagle Kick.

[@castform7]

I miss the Generations drift so much. It looked so damn good. To this day I'm disappointed that Sonic's visuals peaked in Unleashed and Gens. It's been 13 years!

[@JaredThe]

Even though they are probably less significant to the evolution of Sonic’s game design compared to the console games, I do think it’s interesting to note how the 8-bit games by Aspect handled evolving Sonic’s gameplay in tandem with the 16-bit games. The way they attempt to evolve the formula and adjust to the limitations of the Master System and Game Gear over time are interesting and smart and they feature additions to the gameplay I’d always have liked to see in mainline. Sonic Chaos was the first game where Tails could use his flight in gameplay and featured both the peelout from CD and the Spindash from Sonic 2 on Mega Drive, it feels like they wanted to make full use of Sonic’s moveset at that point in time and take advantage of ideas that may or may not become mainstay once the higher budget console games released. I especially love how Triple Trouble added to things with letting Sonic briefly curl into a ball out of springs and his fall animation while also accommodating the Game Gear’s inability to load all the rings you drop when getting hit by having only up to 5 or so fall out of Sonic, but you can only loose up to 30 from the counter. Genuinely such an amazing little change for balancing the 8-bit games’ often radical difficulty issues because you can gain enough rings that you can accumulate a sizable health bar for riskier sections of the levels, and be able to spare rings to enter the special stage boxes even having gotten hit, but when you are starting out the level or start to get low you can still end up in that state of risk that makes the system satisfying. Sonic Blast further tuned the system by having you only lose about 10 rings I think which while surely makes the game a lot easier, can’t say that it’s really a bad thing for this game’s case given everything is so chunky and hampered by screen crunch that making he game generally easy to beat and play otherwise is for the best. It also is the only game in the franchise I’ve seen where Rings act as an additional timer that drains away once your air runs out under water. It’s a really cool mechanic for handling Sonic’s whole limited air system, and another small idea I think if the mainline games had would make them feel more satisfying, even if the only level you’ll see it in is constantly snagging you by the balls through vacuum tubes. Holy Shit Blue Marine Zone.

[@thealandude9146]

18:57 I do like how classic springs are not able to be homing attacked in Frontiers

[@danyo5786]

Hey maybe the boost could be fully cut out of sonic's gameplay moving forward and it could work a lot like 06's mach speed sections. Like, say Sonic is trailing a ship in the middle of the ocean or something in the story, and has a actual reason to be going faster than usual, then you could make a nice boost level with a huge focus of spectacle and speed again.

[@theblacknexusyt]

I really hope Shadow’s Story in Generations will have a dark tone with deep writing. I mean if Shadow is copying King Venom, she definitely should

[@TimDespairBear11]

Remember the sweep kick in sonic unleashed? That was straight up pointless and its only use was for destroying furniture/boxes in the hubworld. Also unleashed had the “tap” jump, where if you tap the jump button sonic will do a small jump while keeping your speed. I THINK generations had it too but they got rid of it in future games. And the light dash. Before frontiers it was basically gone since like unleashed. Colors didn’t have it besides using the green wisp, and generations only had the light dash with some specific trails of rings. I don’t even remember if forces had it but frontiers finally brought it back to normal. The bounce bracelet. SA2 had it, 06 had it, and then frontiers kinda brought it back albeit it’s pretty gimped. No idea why those 3 games have it and no others. What about the magic hands in SA2? That serves absolutely no purpose? Dude I can go on and on and on.

[@thawkade]

Colors and Generations have the short hop as well, I assume it was dropped because Lost World didn't have it and Forces and Frontiers are built off that game for some reason.

[@Skibster-w9l]

When you really think about it magic hands is one of Sonic’s most powerful abilities.

[@leonlegend]

Small correction: The double jump was actually introduced in Sonic R.

[@NoramiYuuki]

...I can't believe this is how I find out splash dash and LSmark are the same person

[@world9129]

honestly i think that in the next game i hope they mix super peel out and boost, like charge it up like the spindash and reach ludicrous speeds

[@dluxx3719]

14:54 that’s not you splash dash, that’s famous Cartoon Critic, LS Mark

[@_veloxity91]

Can't wait for the next Tails solo game where he can't fly but he can bounce on a spring

[@tmta4089]

3:20 it’s funny that I can immediately tell this gameplay is from project-06 and isnt from a console port

[@tempest6027]

9:05 i grew up with 3ds lost world and in that game it is so useful i love it

[@randomgamer625]

6:38 honestly I don’t see the issue with that. Games should reward creativity

[@TheSultan1470]

Games should be good and not rough, Sonic is broken

[@randomgamer625]

@@TheSultan1470 How is skipping large portions of a level with clever Speed boost and routes a bad thing? Play Sonic Adventure or look at the short cuts people found. That’s creative thinking, not broken

[@TheSultan1470]

@@randomgamer625 That is exploitative video game playing and is not the result of intentional game design. If you find a way to do it, cool, but that's not part of the game itself. randomgamer: (skips 90 % of Sanic to suffer less Sanic)

[@randomgamer625]

@@TheSultan1470 And Zelda breath of the wild has multiple solutions to one problem but I’m pretty sure you don’t count those are broken. Also it’s a speed based game. There using stuff that’s already in the game. There not breaking through walls or teleporting, there literally using the tools the game gives you like the spindash and momentum to make huge leaps across the map. That’s creative thinking

[@Aktedya1-jt7vw]

I don't play Frontiers, but I think the question is: does it feel like creativity, or just abusing an ability? Cause to me, it looks pretty easy to cross large distances with it. (The example shown specifically at that time frame looks impressive, but I'm wondering how many smaller challenges can be easily skipped with it)

[@zac9181]

Spindash >>> Boost

[@AsecasJavi]

They aren't even the same tool

[@JustinJulian-00]

l say Sonic and the Black Knight has the best boost because it's not dependent on rings or tricks the only thing you need is the red fairies at the beginning and as you level up Sonic you will gain the ability to naturally fill up your own soul surge meter as you run and then you can just boost from there and why hasn't Sonic games done this yet like you're running speed in a Sonic game should naturally fill up the boost meter and when it's full or you have plenty of it then you can use it to your heart's content I hope you agree with what I said like they should make a Sonic game where does spin dash or the boost can either be optional or you can use both to experiment with them because you have to stay still to use a spin dash anyway while boost just acquires you to use while you're moving

[@surenderreddy8144]

Depends on the games. The spindash in sa2 is way less fun than the boost from say, colors, because it’s not all that strong, annoying as hell to use due to having only 2 buttons, and with how linear the level design in sa2 is, there’s not a whole lot of wide spaces where the spindash can really shine like in sa1

[@TheReZisTLust]

They work wonderfully together in Sa1 with the turbo mod. Spindash for combat and variable mobility and boost for limited mobility, both for amazing fun.

[@jubeasta0135]

14:51 it’s already been 7 years since sonic forces released.. that makes me feel old and I’m still in middle school😭

[@JP2427]

They better bring back shadows stupid flip kick thing from 06 in Shadow Generations, or me and John Sega are gonna have a few words

[@bluebellsforever]

I read that as "the lost sonic movies" and got really confused when he started yapping about sonic movesets

[@Magaflamewolf]

I get the dislike of being able to break the level design. But i personaly like it. It opened up alot of creativity, and i loved that. It just made everything feel so natural and if you want to play the level normaly.....then do it. Idk thats just me. I like more open levels which is why i like adventure 1 more then 2. While you still could be creative it felt much more difficult and it ruined a bit of the fun

[@rando6677]

12:36 Super sonic also has a drift which is really weird But I think Kishimoto said sonic was meant to have one And super sonic having one is a remain of the scrapped mechanic

[@cristianovogt5586]

The reason Sonic doesn't have a drift in Frontiers is because the whole point of Drift was to help Sonic made tight turns since he couldn't do that properly during the boost games, but since Sonic already turns well in the open world naturally, they just removed.

[@shreeder4092]

13:08 >loses 10 rings >says 20 rings Nice vid though

[@yamandoesstuff9755]

10:35 In Frontiers the boost meter can also be filled back up by collecting rings! I'm surprised people don't know about this.

[@panetoneninjacanal2692]

Insta shield is so forgotten that it is noot even mentioned

[@cashbrady4074]

bro forgot the bounce attack or as 06 calls it'' bound attack''

[@nora-yc6fi]

On the subject of the boost, I feel they should change it to be like how it was in Unwiished It would really help the game's not all feel like boost to win if you had to strategically decide when to use the boost instead of just... holding it down for the whole level I'm not saying to copy paste it but I feel that's the direction it should go as I feel more and more people are getting fatigue of how it works

[@Aktedya1-jt7vw]

I personally prefer the Colors Wii boost in that regard. Where you can still hold it like the regular boost, but it's limited by White Wisp capsules

[@BronzeFacade]

Here's what I'm thinking: Double Jump w/flip (course correction and extra height in exchange for more vulnerability and less momentum) Air dash/homing attack (dependent on if there's an enemy or spring to target or not) Stomp to shoot down and slide Trigger for crouch a la Mario, used for the roll and spindash Maybe have an extra button/left trigger for a boost meter, but use it for things like drifting and insta cyloop, sonic boom, basically a mana meter.

[@jayeraine]

13:00 To be fair, the whole thing where you loose only a certain chunk of your rings upon getting hit was already a thing way before Shadow the Hedgehog, Triple Trouble did this back in the Game Gear days IIRC

[@hyperburno7310]

Getting rid of boost is probably the stupidest thing you could have ever said, spin dash and boost can't be used in tandem but tbf boost is better in literally every way, with spin dash you've got spindash and that's basically it. With boost you got drift, and arial boost. While i like the amount of freedom you get with spindash jump it's extreamly broken and you can just skip levels, with boost as the base mechanic you can't break the game, and thanks to unleash and generations diverging routs are possible and more quick time then previous games

[@t-bird6853]

1:01 Never thought I'd see the day where LS- I mean SplashDash referenced a RedMoa animation

[@XBC3403]

I think Frontiers showed well how the boost and spin dash can both exist in the same kit for Sonic without making the other redundant. The boost in that game lets you move faster, while keeping the same level of control over sonic, he can turn just as tightly as you want him to, it can be used on walls and in the air, and when in the air, it lets sonic change his direction in an instant and gives him some additional height as well as distance. but in turn it lost its offensive utility. The spin dash in contrast allows sonic to reach even faster speeds and make it easier to take advantage of the physics and geometry of the levels and world, it can deal damage, but its harder to control and can only be activated on the ground. These traits make both the spin dash and boost useful for reaching high speeds but geared for different purposes. The boost being more of a pure movement tool that can be used anywhere while the spin dash is more of an offensive and exploitative tool that you have to find and figure out how and where to make the most use out of it.

[@sonicmeerkat]

i'm genuinly surprised rush wasn't mentioned, not only did it include both the spindash and the boost (while gating the boost from bosses you could actually roll in the normal levels so you could save gauge by rolling downhill) it also refilled in the most unique way, tricks. be it rush 1's spamming off any spring, aerial dash pad or rainbow rings or rush adventures finisher system which only rewarded the vast majority of the trick boost when performing a combo finisher which while existing in the first game mostly acted as a way to extend momentum or gain a second jump. i S ranked every rush level so i should know how situational that was i'm not surprised nobody noticed it, and the fact the homing attack was on R was like... wtf?

[@markandrew287]

This has been probably the most frustrating part of the franchise for me. Like, is it that hard to just have a consistent moveset for a character that's been existing for like, 30 years now? Hell, why are even the RUNNING ANIMATIONS not consistent!?

[@Frank-zb7zh]

Changes to gameplay style or art style can be frustrating but it doesn’t mean that the game itself is bad. Look at games like Jack and Daxter for the former and Ratchet and clank for the latter. And I could name many more examples. At the end of the day the priority should be on quality and making sure that the game is fun to play.

[@markandrew287]

@@Frank-zb7zh True, making a good game is always what matters. But the thing is, the lack of consistency sure hasn't always helped the franchise as well. Unleashed is my favorite game but the fact that they decided to change an entire gameplay style--one they could have still built upon--is not a great decision in retrospect. And even when they have a set gameplay style there's so many needless tweaks that it can lead to something like Forces when they really should have just been building upon what Unleashed and Generations set out for them. You bring up Ratchet and Clank, but notice how Ratchet still has a base gameplay set we know him to have and that rarely changes. With Sonic, that can vary from game to game almost every time and that's not always a good thing. I don't really see anyone who likes the Boost games prefer Forces control scheme to Unleashed or Gens. Also, with Ratchet you can say that the artstyle evolved the games whereas with Sonic we have debates on how long or how short his quills are, whether or not things are photorealistic or too cartoony or what color blue his fur is.

[@Frank-zb7zh]

@@markandrew287 I brought up ratchet and clank as an example of the art style not the gameplay. The example of the gameplay was Jak and Daxter. Even still, I feel that ratchet suffers a similar problem that sonic suffered in the 2010s. And that’s the lack of original identity that those original games had. The element of satire went away and was replaced by something a lot more uninteresting. Like for example, I think rift apart is a more than fine game but the story most than anything reminds me of the Phineas and Ferb movie. It took time but at least it feels than sonic is going back to its roots and for all the bad choices that sega made in the past, at least they are making sure to show that they are going back to what people like as fast as possible without compromising the next game. Meanwhile we have to wait to 2029 for the next Ratchet game to see if they do something more interesting

[@TheSultan1470]

Sonic struggles to be Ever Good let alone consistent.

[@mediamuncher69]

14:55 Splash dash confirmed as Ls Mark!?

[@deltaquarayza]

So the LS in LS Mark stands for Light Speed

[@AnnoyingGremlinCat]

I misread this as “The Forgotten Sonic Movies”

[@animosity3771]

@@AnnoyingGremlinCat Sonic Armageddon

[@user-mf2yn7dd7z]

My glorious king is back 👑👑👑👑👑

[@bebopknux5857]

The funny thing with the "parkour" system is that parkour is a pretty vague term. So it never made any sense to me why one game had it and one didn't. Obviously one could pin it down to "they can't fit all scenario's for said skill" but that's kinda why sonic is mainly an *adventure* game. It's been in his code to re-run through levels and level- up ur skills in said levels obviously it's not very optimal if sonic could start climbing every wall but all they'd really need to do is just... Do it like unleashed and make it a cinematic, thusly nobody questions and you can keep the smaller scale of movesets.

[@NoseyOk]

Sonic has 2 things that are always in his moveset. Running and jumping (unless you count the vehicle games, then he just drives or rides a board)