Jim Cornette on How Vince McMahon Evaluates Talent

[@danielburger1775]

Creative Genius.. Stone Cold Steve Austin as The Ringmaster The Rock as Blue Chipper Rocky Maivia Kane as Isaac Yankem DDS The New Age Outlaws as Rockabilly and The Real Double J Batista as The Deacon John Cena as Mr Ruthless Aggression Terry Taylor as The Red Rooster Rikishi as The Sultan That's good shit, pal.

[@glasschin871]

Duno how duke the dumpster or Adam bomb didn’t get over with them amazing gimmicks

[@Tarantula1522]

He also re-created a lot of those guys into their mainstay gimmicks

[@danielburger1775]

@@Tarantula1522 That wasn't Vince McMahon. Austin came up with Stone Cold and Austin 3:16 himself. Cena came up with his own gimmick too. Jim Cornette and Bruce Prichard came up with Kane etc.

[@glasschin871]

@@Tarantula1522 Which one’s Steve came up with the stone cold basing it on the serial killer the ice man. Jim Cornette came up with Kane and Bruce named him. Batista started working out with HHH and was added to evolution last minute. Billy Gunn and the road dog got themselves over. John cena was Stephanie’s project.

[@johngallagher72]

Jesse Barr as Jimmy Jack Funk Mike Shaw as Bastian Booger Bill Irwin as The Goon The list is endless

[@rofbagging9749]

I always thought Ahmed would’ve been a bigger star as a kid, but it makes sense to 40 year old me. As talented as someone might be, it all comes down to attitude and if people want to work with you.

[@tysontomko]

I still mark for the pearl River plunge

[@set1237]

He comes across as a bit dumb. D'Lo Brown confirmed he wasn't very bright.

[@mattm7798]

Agreed. He definitely had a great look and an it factor, but his attitude was horrible not unlike a certain Warrior

[@travismcdonald6576]

Johnson had a weird build and his promos sounded like a heavy metal album being played backwards.

[@Voysh2Voysh69]

I always thought Matt Morgan was gonna be a star. Even after WWE, Morgan went to TNA and became “the Blueprint.” I figured he’d connect all the dots at some point and become the greatest big man in wrestling.

[@brendanwilliams106]

Ahmed Johnson had a great look and then he opened his mouth 🤣🤣

[@danielburger1775]

Bobby Lashley? Brock Lesnar?

[@fightrudyfight5799]

Matt Cardona is definitely doing great for himself out of WWE.

[@nassornuru3418]

Let's not forget that he is definitely doing great for himself out of WWE, because he was in WWE. He was on the biggest platform for wrestling which makes him arguably the biggest name in indie wrestling right now because he would be an automatic draw if idk GCW has Cardona on the card. A better way to reevaluate your statement is by also realizing that we don't know if Cardona would have been a big name on the indie scene before coming to the WWE like Tyler Black or Kevin Stein who are now the more known and more paid Seth Rollins and Kevin Owens.

[@D4NK1]

I think Pat patterson's affection for Rocky Maivia was also responsible for Rocky's push

[@RobertSimmonsAirship]

We're all waiting for his reaction to the Cody news.

[@marcuslee1927]

I just hope it’s at least 20 minutes long

[@vincentkennedymcmahon50]

@@marcuslee1927 still waiting 😭

[@glasschin871]

Pushing Bret hart to the side to make way for diesel was genuine genius lol 😂

[@thedishonestjeffsokol2489]

Diesel was over as a heel then they made him a smiley face.....exactly the same as they did with Roman. Stupidity

[@georgevarughese4886]

Lolz 👍🏿

[@georgevarughese4886]

@@thedishonestjeffsokol2489 don't forget Eilas!

[@shahzadimam8497]

Bret was always Mr Right Now rather than Mr Right for Vince. Vince was always looking past him for the guy he really wanted on top...back to Hogan, Luger, Diesel, Shawn...

[@norbertschnurrbart936]

Freddie Prinze Jr. said in an interview that Vince McMahon has such a high understanding of psychology, like no one else he has ever encountered. All the backstage politics, mind games, testings, "walking on egg shells", hierarchies all happen for a purpose. Vince tires to find the right person, who can work a lot under all this pressure, being confident enough in themselves, but are also willing to give their lives to work for WWE. Soldiers, who do what they are told, but who are also stong enough mentally to survive in the WWE and having the drive to stay on top. Having a great look, intelligence, charisma and overall talent will help as well of course, in an image like Vince sees fit!

[@Tim85-y2q]

That may be true to some extent, but the problem is that when Vince is the ONLY guy who understands what he has in mind (as often seems the case), it becomes hard for other people to function within that framework.

[@The80sWolf_]

If you give Vince a stiffy or make him laugh, you are pushed

[@shahzadimam8497]

Being a flatulent hot blonde is probably his dream ticket then

[@xGodofAcidx]

She's going to give Vince credit for "seeing something in Reigns when nobody else did"? Did she not see those YEARS when Reigns was supposed to be a breakout star, but Vince knew exactly how to book him so that he wasn't?! Or are we just going to conveniently forget that? We all could see what was there, but Vince almost ruined it with his own ego and refusing to book the guy in a way that he'd get over. Now, he's finally done that and it is working, but he's eroded that much more of the audience in the mean time. I would not be patting him on the back. This is like drafting Peyton Manning, forcing him to be a Running Back for 4 years, having that be a complete failure, then begrudgingly moving him to Quarterback where he begins to flourish and having someone sing your praises for being a visionary.

[@satsubatsu347]

Bad example. Peyton Manning would've been "retired" as a running back three or four games into a career.

[@soulofanerd9364]

@@satsubatsu347 true 😆😆😆 maybe a better example would be Bret Favre or John Elway or Steve Young who could all run pretty effectively especially Young

[@IIBonafide]

Well stated. I feel that Vince is given too much credit because he's produced more duds than diamonds. Statistically WWE/WWF would have more successes due to having more resources to create & draw from a pool of talent, which can get over if properly pushed. You also have to look at all the talent that he's passed over such as Cesaro, Owen Hart or Gail Kim. The aforementioned despite being great talents, weren't properly pushed because Vince didn't see their worth.

[@pirateradio6429]

Depends on what the definition of push is. Being a World Champion? Or drawing money? For example: Roddy Piper was one of the biggest draws in the industry but never was World Champion (Whether he should have been or not). It depends by what someone's definition of success and a push is.

[@Vans1989]

Vince's biggest down fall was when he bought WCW and ECW. He dropped the ball on that he had a master play book and throw it away.

[@Vans1989]

@@pirateradio6429 Piper is like Hall being World Champion was not important to them they where about the business

[@soulofanerd9364]

@@pirateradio6429 great point and Piper came in as a star already hence why Vince didn't have to do much to draw money with him including NOT worry about putting a championship on him.

[@kamfisher1714]

Others were better than owen hart and cesaro

[@apassionatenerd.3564]

I thought the title said: "How Vince McMahon executes talent" Honestly, given bearcat Lee and gimp suit Kross, thats kinda accurate.

[@georgevarughese4886]

Exactly 💯 💯 💯

[@jadasheekstyles2000]

I really want to heat Jim's take on the rumor that Austin will be dragged out of retirement

[@tobiasfarragut292]

That will be fuckin pathetic for WWE and cringe for Austin..he looks old and atrophied..and with good reason he’s 20 years older and 20 years removed from Gym, training and bumps..that wont be good for anyone lol

[@gold2040]

@@tobiasfarragut292I believe Austin said on a podcast that the stunners he has left are in the single digits, since his knees and back are fucking shot pretty much

[@UnsilencedOutspokenTikTok]

@@tobiasfarragut292 makes no sense for them to do this considering how Austin looks. Like with them bringing back Goldberg just because. Yeah he's in better shape until he starts walking.

[@The80sWolf_]

WWE is truly Disney of wrestling. Even the rehased nostalgia

[@CamSTL]

I always think of Carlito and Chris Masters. Pushed to the moon in 2005 and some of 06. Both featured in programs w HBK, Cena, HHH, Flair, etc. Despite not getting over WWE continued to push them both until both guys person issues caught up with them.

[@Ahmed-og2jm]

Actually Carlito got over af after but at that Point McMahon moved on so he didn't do anything of note

[@RKO1988]

He has been wrong a lot too…exclude the 90s and the attitude era. He was wrong about Punk, Daniel Bryan, Lex Luger, Ultimate Warrior, the Miz, didn’t care for DDP

[@surajpratap_1]

You know it's not about if he was correct or not...its about did he correct himself?? He did to all of those guys except maybe DDP..But there that he didnt care about ..E.g. Cody, Cesaro..Kofi..., Rusev People think that they can be even bigger star but most of them already touch their ceiling ..i dont think they can bring something big..

[@RKO1988]

@@surajpratap_1 CM Punk he was seriously wrong and tbh that set the business back

[@JenMistress]

And in the case with Roman Reigns, he was correct on him being a star, just was incorrect on how to book him. After turning him heel, and head of the table, that was shown to be what was needed to get him over.

[@joshportie]

Nah

[@RLSmith-uo9zs]

But is it that Roman was a star from the beginning or was he presented like a star for so long that fans just had to accept him? When I think of modern stars, (DB, CM Punk, Cena, Orton, Ect.) I think guys who are organic. I’m a huge fan of 20-22 Roman Reigns but he still feels like something out of the WWE factory. I just think WWE final gave him something he can work with enough for him to be comfortable with. It’s an interesting conversation

[@TraumaER]

@@RLSmith-uo9zs this!!! Roman Reigns is still trash to me. I just see a stumbling doofus on the mic with mediocre wrestling skills and lame super move and forgettable look overall. Ain’t no one trying to be like Roman Reigns. Lots of people wanna be like Rock, SCSA, Hogan, Hart, etc. Does Roman Reigns even have a catchphrase???

[@steverogers2799]

@@TraumaERThat's just fucking lies. Jim cornette and Paul Heyman, two of the greatest talkers have said that Roman's great on the mic and who else you need to validate. He consistently had great matches over the last few years with Jey Uso, McIntyre, KO, Edge, Bryan Danielson, Cesaro etc. His "Acknowledge me" and "Tribal Chief" catchphrase among others.

[@arnabmukhopadhyay7078]

Head of a table?

[@bipolarminddroppings]

The mention of Roman bugs me, Roman was always great in the ring, idiots were just too blinded by DBry getting fucked to see it. The only thing thats improved for Roman is his promos because hes actually allowed to be himself now.

[@mydogsnameislucy768]

Lol na. He was the shits. He used to gesticulate more than Kenny.

[@SharpShooter700]

Imo hes awful all around. Extremely boring also.

[@wilcee675]

@Bipolar Mind Droppings That’s a complete lie. Reigns makes Ahmed Johnson look like Ricky Johnson. His finisher is a spear. Wow. And it’s a crappy one too.

[@goodday2760]

As we can see in these replies, the power of propaganda and group-thinking is tremendous.

[@wilcee675]

@@goodday2760 Cool story lady.

[@bleemwisspillow8686]

Saying that people didn't see Roman Reigns as great before is nonsense. People booed him because he was booked badly. Back in 2014 people were like "Turn him heel." In damn near 2021 they did it and, what do you know, the fans were right. Some foresight by Vince. Whoever wrote the email is baffling. "They have bad attitudes or big egos"? Yeah. Not like those humble nice folks JBL and Sean Michaels and Hulk Hogan. And this person seems to forget people like Zack Ryder, Sandow, and Rusev, who got over in other ways, and Vince pulled the plug on them. Vince thought people were chanting for Rusev ironically. That's how out of touch he is. Hell, he almost fired Cena until Stephanie vouched for him. Bray Wyatt kept working despite really bad booking. People wanted Bray to win feuds so he could be taken seriously. The Fiend was over to the point they were selling $2000 belts. Again, despite nonsense like HIAC 2019.

[@seereadnhear]

Well when Cody comes back and everything he's going to realize "When the hell did he get that lisp pal?"

[@ravanpee1325]

"Welcome back...Stardust"

[@robertschumann7737]

Vince used to just steal the best talent from other territories. Since he can’t do that anymore he now has development. Vince seems to strike out a lot too. Remember the guy that used puke? Wanting to call Mick Foley “The Mutalator”? Preferring Dean Douglas over The Franchise? His biggest hits are usually legacy wrestlers or indie stars. Plus he had guys like Jim Ross and Cornette to push wrestlers on him. I don’t think Vince really has a great eye. Look how he pushed Triple H until he hooked up with his daughter.

[@soulofanerd9364]

Well said

[@thejanglezclan]

I think most people understood the intrigue in Roman Reigns, it was just the corny "happy go lucky" babyface didn't fit him. At this point, he might already be better than a lot of folks thought he'd ever be.

[@sOUnerfan]

He usually got the best reactions in the Shield era early on, then as soon as they split, everybody turned on him because he was being "pushed", despite reacting to him like they wanted him to be pushed.

[@markabboud8564]

I will say that Ahmed, when he was Moadib in GWF on ESPN, was pretty good for a greenhorn rookie. A 300lb guy doing flips over the top rope to the outside was pretty cool to this 13 year old when I saw it.

[@tobiasfarragut292]

Just make sure to send him a Limo for a bullshit spot show or he’ll bitchhh out and pout in his Hotel room…

[@tempestfennac9687]

@@tobiasfarragut292 That's why you make sure you get the phone number for his hotel room before he starts pouting. :P

[@tobiasfarragut292]

@@tempestfennac9687 quick! Someone dig up Dennis Coraluzzo I have my pre cell phone pen and paper 📝 ready for both Chicks beeper and Ahmeds room numbers

[@tempestfennac9687]

@@tobiasfarragut292 Excellent. It would be a pity if Ahmed couldn't hear how angry you are about him no-showing. :P (Being serious, I can't say I'm the least bit sympathetic towards Ahmed due to his attitude).

[@tobiasfarragut292]

@@tempestfennac9687 classic dennis C. funny story

[@kwetribute3838]

The premise of the writer's assertions is invalid on its face in 2021/2022. Vince didn't think Keith Lee was worth keeping. He didn't think Karrion (Killer) Kross had anything to offer. He wasted EC3. Much of the recent NXT black and gold roster never got a proper chance on the main roster. And the suggestion Vince sees something in people years before others is arguable. People saw what Roman Reigns had to offer. They just didn't want him shoved down their throats as a babyface and the anointed heir to John Cena as the face of the company. It's hard to quantify what Vince thinks. Brian has it right, he's a demented old man. Vince lives in a fantasy world where Goldberg is a headliner, Eva Marie is worthy of a second chance and Finn Balor has nothing to offer.

[@Mogwai-ug9op]

You could say that, due to AEW's ratings, Vince was right not to see any star power in the NXT Black and Gold roster, he was right to never give Punk a Mania main event, he was right in his belief that Rusev was a goof and Ambrose was a mudshow mark.

[@aceloco817]

People fail to understand that this is all Vince's story that he's the main author of. As his audience, we'll read whatever he feels like writing.. now, then & whenever he quits the business.... lol

[@soulofanerd9364]

2:37 onward Jim covers it all. He's not "so good" at finding talent but he knows how to force or push whatever he feels worthy. It's basically called knowing your brand and knowing your audience. And then how hard is it to push someone who already has the tools coming in from a different promotion? Or is this question about people who were brought up under Vince only???

[@Dr170]

From what I can tell, Vince delegates such matters to his invisible alien friend Ozmodiar these days.

[@johnberry2678]

Yes, that’s how he picked up on prospects like Bianca Belair and Bron Breakker

[@josephrother7950]

@@johnberry2678 Mr. Magoo could have seen they were stars right away.

[@goblue8410]

Bruce

[@johnberry2678]

@@josephrother7950 but apparently Vince has lost his mind ???

[@josephrother7950]

@@johnberry2678 He hasn't lost his mind. He is doing the same crap he has always done. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. The same could be said for any promoter, ever.

[@xziggy_stardustx6786]

This is an interesting question. I think out of the qualities listed (look, personality, in-ring work, determination and professionalism), you have to, at minimum, be adequate in every area to have a chance of being signed, but to be a star you have to be exceptional in either look, personality or in-ring work -- with WWE putting less emphasis on the latter. Some of Vince's failed experiments were usually with guys who looked *incredible* but had nothing of substance to back it up.If you compile a list of the best wrestlers to ever work with the WWF/E almost all of them tick every box. To Jim's point about The Rock, he was off the charts in every area -- you could ask someone who knew nothing about wrestling to assess the roster and they'd pick him out as the star.

[@lastsinnersa8002]

Seeing it and pushing them down the viewers' throats for years are very different things. Reigns did eventually get over but those early years really were rough with how crowds reacted. And can we truly say Vince has picked talent well in recent years if there is no true star from recent years carrying the company?

[@psychobluesfxt]

Brock Lesnar

[@PhillyLeotardo25]

The people who booed him during that time were CM Trump supporters. The people who cheer CM Punk are racist scumbags.

[@switchlite44]

@@PhillyLeotardo25 wait what 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@calvinmcbride8950]

@@PhillyLeotardo25 Okay Phil back to the nursing home it's okay

[@kamfisher1714]

“Pushing them down viewers throats” how else are they going to get over? By your logic stone cold was “pushed down our throats” ladies and gentlemen this guy right here is the epitome of a smark.

[@TheMagnificentMongoSlade]

Vince is simple: size and charisma. Verbal skills a plus. Wrestling skill optional. But work ethic is key for Vince, esp if you want to be a major player. Sometimes you gotta go through a series of QBs or PGs before finding the starter but you hire guys based on potential and raw ability. Once you recognize raw talent, its about bringing it out.

[@RLSmith-uo9zs]

I actually think Verbal Skills is a must with Vince. I don’t think you can be a top guy in WWE unless you can talk.

[@MrJjburgess11]

@@RLSmith-uo9zs which explains why he never really pushed Cesaro. Guy has the look , the size . Great in ring. But his promos were usually pretty weak.

[@RLSmith-uo9zs]

@@MrJjburgess11 Yes. But so we’re Roman’s. Until he was paired up with Heyman and allowed to “be himself”. My point if you were to present Cesaro or anyone really in the same light as Roman. They maybe able to get over as well to varying degrees.

[@RLSmith-uo9zs]

*were

[@albinomaybe2323]

I still think that Vince is still a genius

[@TraumaER]

You need to get off the drugs.

[@jasonwoot5199]

@@TraumaER with out Vince, you wouldn’t have other products.

[@Ticketman99]

As a businessman? Definitely. Booking wise? Doubtful.

[@TraumaER]

@@Ticketman99 this. Too many idiots can't separate the two.

[@toddwebb7521]

Well willingness to roll around on the Warrior bearskin rug has something to do with it

[@andrebdd5818]

Sorry to disagree him but Rocky was the shits when he started. That's one of the main reasons why people didn't like him. It wasn't until he turned heel that he looked less awkward in the ring

[@gabet1075]

Vince looks for what worked in the past, and it has had a few monumental failures (Lex Luger). It is ironic that the question is being asked at a time where Vince releases so much potential talent and is forced to bring back tired old talent and part-timers to fill his events. As for Reigns, Reigns wasn't accepted until they told him to do what Scott Hall did to Tony Montana to the character of Khal Drogo in Game of Thrones. Even then, I don't know how over it would have been without the current best in the business, Paul Heyman.

[@CarmeloA.]

Another amazing short from the CULT OF MEAT WITH EXTRA CHEESE!

[@LegendoftheAce1]

Roman is a poor example for years, the fans wanted him to turn heal and Vince insisted on keeping him face. Which was not going over

[@magzieforfunj187]

Vince is overrated. He is a competent businessman in an industry that was plagued with too many wrestling minds who couldn't manage a business responsibly.

[@whatwelearned]

This is a good take

[@kamfisher1714]

Delusional

[@dionius4549]

Vince could see future big stars, but he often failed to book them right

[@WillS724]

I said the same thing.. if Vince has no idea what to do with you.. what can others do? Look at Cole.. farting around with the best friends

[@thelionsshare6668]

One thing I've observed is that there are almost always things going "wrong" in the ring. Somebody makes a mistake, somebody does something too early or too late, somebody misses a punch or a kick. So automatically, the guys who cannot change up, who can't improvise and adapt to how things have changed, they should be fired, or held back. Presence of mind during a performance is key.

[@stephonwilliams5232]

Facts but even more important than in-ring talent is mic skills

[@thelionsshare6668]

@@stephonwilliams5232 In the olden days, if a wrestler didn't have mic skills, they paired him with a manager, or put him in a tag team with a guy who could. Ricky Morton could talk, Robert Gibson couldn't. Neither Condrey or Eaton could talk, but Cornette could. In modern times, the monstrous Brock Lesnar sounds like Michael Jackson, so having Paul Heyman as his manager, at least for while, made all the sense in the world.

[@stephencrewsjr]

Wow, was that writer of that question related to Vince or something? He misses all the time.

[@soulofanerd9364]

Exactly 🤷🏽‍♂️

[@lalomontoyajr.9282]

Vince Mcmahon isn't a genius. The greatenest that got created in wrestling was created by him Vince Mcmahon but also Patterson, Prichard, Finkel, Russo, and Cornette. And many others I'm sure. It was all a collective effort. It's like Old Money.

[@SF-rn6ng]

One thing he has that Tony Khan doesn't is the willingness to keep going with someone if he believes in them there's no way Roman Reigns would be a big player if he was at AEW

[@davidgerow]

Vince was a wrestling genius. His time has come and gone.

[@steverogers2799]

Maybe he is maybe is not

[@chestercastaneda4920]

>was Yeah, that's why they're making record profit now. Because his time has come and gone. 🙄

[@SplitGoose]

@@chestercastaneda4920 He's not doing wrestling anymore mate. Are you thick?? Vince McMahon is a content creator for live entertainment. Not wrestling lol. Apple was making record profits and they weren't in the wrestling business either.

[@mikeawesome9212]

@@chestercastaneda4920 holy, get a clue.

[@rofbagging9749]

I might not like WWE as much as I used to, but Vince is doing something right to have a product that keeps getting worse yet somehow keeps making record profits. It’s an interesting case study of going against what your fans want but they’ll keep wanting more.

[@judokarl2757]

sometimes it feels like wrestlers overcome everything and just become stars regardless of bad booking because of sheer talent like young Randy Orton (failed babyface run) or Daniel Bryan during the Yes movement

[@pettyjones]

Randy's legend killer run got him over. It wasn't gradual. He beat the undertaker.

[@SteelCity570]

I hope you do a video on Cody Rhodes leaving AEW

[@jtaco4101]

He's certainly going to mention it

[@bigfella6898]

I hope you shut up for 12 years.

[@wildchild423]

From what I heard the reason why the Rock got his push it's because he was willing to play the game with Pat Patterson. It's never was proven but there's been a lot of recent talks and suspicion on that. If it's true it paid off big time.

[@Ted_Bell]

When Cody comes back he will be the Jamaican menace that wins the U.S Title.

[@disciple2742]

I still cant stand Roman Reigns from having him pushed down our throats so much.

[@dustinrhodes4793]

He sucks, his finisher is a punch

[@SHAKHIR2Super]

He's the star. Imagine if fans of Marvel movies got mad that Ironman or Captain America got shoved down our throats more than Idris Elba's gate-keeping character from the Thor movies just because he may be a better actor.

[@dustinrhodes4793]

@@SHAKHIR2Super Captain America has been over for 50 years, horrible comparison lol. Hogan, Flair, Austin, Rock, Taker were stars. Roman isn't

[@bobdonda]

I got sick of Roman during his face run, but I love him now

[@azzman9947]

@@dustinrhodes4793 he quite literally is no matter how you twist it. Sure it was annoying when they were forcefully pushing him but now he's definitely a Star.

[@ladistar]

Vince needs to bring kayfabe back and start presenting WWE as a legitimate sporting competition again

[@lsj6721]

Wayyyyyyyyyyyy less money on making it “legitimate sporting competition” And WWE has been evolving with the society for being a publicly traded corporation, doing charity work, working around cancel culture, etc. We just have to accept the fact that WWE will never as edgy as it use to be

[@lsj6721]

Wayyyyyyyyyyyy less money on making it “legitimate sporting competition” And WWE has been evolving with the society for being a publicly traded corporation, doing charity work, working around cancel culture, etc. We just have to accept the fact that WWE will never as edgy as it use to be

[@Ticketman99]

Why? UFC already exists...and even has better storylines than ANY pro wrestling promotion ever.

[@wayneking9997]

WWE has never been legitimate it's you so called fans that ruined it by constantly spoiling and putting news on the internet we never had this problem in the 80s and the 90s even when the internet was becoming a thing then

[@ladistar]

@@wayneking9997 dude I’m all for kayfabe and protecting the business. the smarks killed wrestling by posting spoilers to matches online. Also, the WWE doesn’t help when its own wrestlers expose the business on social media, taking pictures with other wrestlers they are feuding with, etc. they don’t even try to pretend it’s real. During the attitude era, very few people know it was fake and that’s what made it so great.

[@easter_sunday]

It’s like music. If someone is a star it’s pretty clear when you see them.

[@michaelspringer4532]

Hurts my heart to hear those things about Ahmed Johnson . I was a huge Ahmed mark as a Kid

[@Thex-W.I.T.C.H.-xMaster]

Vince can’t see real talent today and hasn’t for YEARS. Vince has been out of touch for years 🤔😬….. that is a fact. WWE wouldn’t be in the shape it is now if McMahon was like he was in 1998-2002 want Vince still knew what he was doing. Sure The Ruthless Aggression Era wasn’t as good as the Attitude Era but it’s still a hell of a lot better then what they been doing since 2008 When Linda McMahon started running for the Senate and Vince changed the company to “PG”/PC kids show 🤔😒🙄……

[@bigfella6898]

And yet they're making record profits and continue to grow.

[@MrJjburgess11]

1 huge problem is you can't get away with what they did in the attitude era or ruthless aggression era these days . The audience is way too sensitive. You have to work around all that or you will lose sponsorships. Just look at what happens on AEW. A fan brings in a sign saying something about a heel. They kick him out of the show. It's a joke these days .

[@danielburger1775]

McMahon didn't know what he was doing around 1998. That was an other Vince...

[@benng9302]

Still refuse to agree with pushing Roman Reins to be a top guy. The Rock was undeniable as a once in 50 years or 100 years talent.

[@TheeIdol]

anything Vince and the WWE do right goes unnoticed

[@ravanpee1325]

What did they do right in the last decade except the deals with Fox and the Saudis?

[@goodday2760]

@@ravanpee1325 Who is Brock Lesnar?

[@TheeIdol]

@@ravanpee1325 debut of AJ styles and his career there. Women's royal rumble and the success of the women's division. Dominated AEW in ratings despite them signing cm punk and Daniel Bryan and many other WWE superstars. The performance center The production value like lighting, stage, pyro, camera, audio etc Marketing, branding, cross-promotion with non wrestling enterprises like Amazon, Domino's Pizza etc. Cater their show to everyone even casual viewers and not just smart mark Indy cult fans only.. should I go on?

[@jasonwoot5199]

@@ravanpee1325 all the charities/helping underprivileged kids/ woman’s cancer… what has any other product done?? Absolutely none.. simpleton

[@rg8547]

I feel like this applies to Keith Lee. I thought he was a sure fire star on the main roster, but seeing him in AEW he doesn’t seem that healthy and doesn’t move as fast as he once did in NXT.

[@GM_Sanjit_Ramesh]

He got covid some time agoand hasn't wrestled in a while

[@spoderjuan6695]

You got the conclusion from one squash match? Lol

[@tonyjackson4078]

I don't think Vince ever evaluated talent on anything in ring. He valued look, promos or selling them. He doesn't care if they can wrestle.

[@MrJjburgess11]

What about Bret Hart? Bret was pushed to the moon. And his greatest attributes was his wrestling. His promos were usually weak. And he wasn't a big guy in comparison to guys in the 90s. So he had to value in ring skill to some extent.

[@Tarantula1522]

He definitely cares if they can wrestle.. he’s released people because of bad botches, botches eventually lead to injury

[@soulofanerd9364]

@@MrJjburgess11 Bret and Shawn represent the few exceptions to Vince's predominant philosophy of you ask me

[@loufaulk6812]

I disagree on Roman reigns have a great attitude and all of that but he sucks in the ring he does the same basic moves and he just doesn't have it in my opinion

[@Macephtopheles]

I think people are too harsh on Vince when it comes to talent. There's always shouts about how he "fucked up with..." but the truth is the WWE generally presents people *WAY* above their level. Like Damien Sandow was having fans scream for how he should be champ and when he left it was all "Vince will regret that!" Where is he now? By the reverse, look at Drew McIntyre. He was announced as the chosen one by Vince and people roundly turned against him. He left the WWE, switched to Drew Galloway and everywhere he went people were like "Guess Vince called it..." If you take all the wrestlers WWE apparently "fucked up" with there's *FAR* more who done nothing than made a name for themselves.

[@SHAKHIR2Super]

Good post. Fans like wrestlers that are trendy for a week with no long-term ability in any of the criteria for the business.

[@wilcee675]

@Macephtopheles No. You can’t tell me that Vince didn’t screw up Zack Ryder, Malakai Black and Keith Lee. Not only did he screw them up, he activLEE (get it?) buried them. Damien Sandow just gave up after how he got future endeavored.

[@Macephtopheles]

@@wilcee675 Did I say he hasn't fucked up? No. But there's far more people who people claim should have been leading the company that go elsewhere and do jack shit than there are those who seem like world beaters. Folk just tend to focus on negatives with Vince (of which there are many) and ignore positives. Sometimes it beggars belief that he/the WWE fail with some talent but there's many, many more who you see outside the WWE and you're like "...thought they were good..?"

[@hesohit]

It’s like looking for a franchise Qb. You grab the prototypes hope they grow into the role. Are driven and want to be the best?

[@TraumaER]

Only if you are a bad franchise that doesn’t know what to look for. Otherwise you see talent regardless of what school they went to and if they won the national championship. The same teams picking QBs from Alabama are the ones that never will win anything.

[@hesohit]

@@TraumaER picking a qb you look for winning at all levels, arm strength, arm talent , etc

[@TraumaER]

@@hesohit no you look for those with a brain that can understand and know a playbook. Everything you described seems like any jacked up 'athletic' QB that ends up failing in the NFL the first time they are sacked or miss routes and throws turn into INTs.

[@hesohit]

@@TraumaER we all know a 6’3” qb freak athletes is going to get a shot before a 5’9” qb average guy even if he is smarter

[@TraumaER]

@@hesohit yeah it's unfortunate.

[@davsavchav]

Vince is currently being controlled like Anthony Hopkins in _Meet Joe Black_

[@tessbush753]

Vince McMahon will be remembered in 2500 not trying to be funny he is a master

[@bighand1530]

It would be interesting for someone to study on Vince McMahon in history class for sure.

[@danielburger1775]

@@bighand1530 But the "history" would probably be written by Meltzer

[@kurtshastany1945]

Teddy hart was over like crazy in MLW, mike awesome was booked as THE ultimate force in ECW,

[@SHAKHIR2Super]

People still cant see the reason behind Cesaro's start and [immediately] stop[ped] pushes when it is as clear as the many languages the man speaks. Vince gets it.

[@CtKEngage]

From an in ring standpoint, he's great. He's average at everything else, but not awful. He should have had a higher TV position in the company, and we can fault Vince for not seeing value in steady supporting talent like Cesaro.

[@justinperrotta2701]

That’s bc he kept pushing Roman no matter what. Yet they say wins and losses don’t matter lmao. Like cena he just kept pushing and pushing and pushing. When most people get bood Vince drops them like he did his own son.

[@robertbarnes4666]

Most of his stars were big before they came to wwe the rest were no major stretch

[@soulofanerd9364]

Exactly. No genius or eye for talent to it at all really

[@robertbarnes4666]

@@soulofanerd9364 while i partly agree i always look at the genetic jackhammer VKM as a master promoter he takes stars and turnes them into superstars and superstars into legends that is a talent as is business management in my humble opinion

[@soulofanerd9364]

@@robertbarnes4666 I can give him that. I just don't think he necessarily sees "talented" people well, it's that he sees what he can do with "certain" people. And half of the time it's a no brainer in my opinion because he's reactionary as much as he is some "eye for talent". His marketing has made stars into superstars though that is undeniable. It's all about WHAT EXACTLY do we give him credit for.

[@AllanAdamson]

Vince also started as Vinnie Lupton and he had to become Vince McMahon and he looks for guys who will transition from Lupton to McMahon

[@timmc8444]

corn nuts is busy preparing a 3 hour vid on the cody rhodes news...long after everyone else has reported on the story

[@travismurell5228]

She's giving Vince to much credit.

[@TheRightone177]

Vader was another

[@offtheradar5767]

DUBLIN GA LETS GO!!!!!!

[@hurrigame]

Vince evaluates talent the way he always has...by looking at all that beef! It's well known Vince McMahon loves big, sweaty men...Vince McMahon loves big, sweaty men...Vince McMahon loves big...sweaty...men.

[@oslowilde6961]

I thin Vince takes a lot of known talent buys them and goes with it. I mean Hogan was already big. Warrior was look but sting was better. Steve Austin was huge to WCW fans prior to his much bigger WWF run. At the same time Vince ruined Vader. Ruined Dr Death. Dropped the ball on Rick Rude. Dropped it on the Steiners. The Rock was legacy. Orton legacy even Reigns has connections to legacy

[@soulofanerd9364]

Totally agree. It's no genius to it at all.

[@secularbelt]

Vince was wrong about Austin Foley Luger

[@TheOJObserver]

It's a self fulfilling prophecy

[@danielwestwood]

I believe that Vince now tells his loyal kiss asses Bruce "Brother Love" Pritchard and Kevin "Bucky Beaver" Dunn which ones to push and which ones to "Future Endeavour".

[@frankstern5270]

Vince Mcmahon is smart, ruthless and vindictive. With that he can afford to be out of touch.

[@RLSmith-uo9zs]

I kinda disagree that Vince sees or doesn’t see talent, I believe he is a genius but I think it’s all about presentation. Roman Reigns for example was shoved and shoved until he tripped on a good Idea that Vince can present. Cesaro for example could have the same presentation because truth be told Roman and Cesaro both struggled in the mic department in the beginning. If Vince presents Cesaro the same way, I think he could be over too. I think it’s case by case.

[@RLSmith-uo9zs]

However, the system of WWE has proven to show that some guys should not be left to their own devices. Would Stone Cold have worked on WCW? Definitely an interesting question

[@maeschder]

If anything that whole heel version of him probably came about more due to Heyman than McMahon

[@RLSmith-uo9zs]

@@maeschder Right!

[@TheMagnificentMongoSlade]

Cesaro could never be Roman. He lacks the size, verbal skills, acting ability etc.

[@RLSmith-uo9zs]

@@TheMagnificentMongoSlade Fair. But a few years ago, Roman wasn’t a good promo actor whatever either. He has the whole heel package that’s elevated the verbal game. I’m not saying he can be Roman exactly but I am saying if Cesar was presented like Roman, he has the potential to be equally as over. Also, Cesar is taller than Roman.

[@josereyes1148]

I think vince is crazy over rated. Austin as the ring master, vinces direction for him was not to talk. Yea that was good call. Rock as smiling idiot. Mankind as mason the mutilator, bret hart he wanted to be a cowboy. Kane was a dentist. It seems like he has a history of looking for the "Hulk Hogan" role and neglecting everything else. Lets look at wwf under vinces vision in the mid 90s. complete crap. He changed to stay in business. Lets look at his product now. He has been a huge influence to wrestling and has also been a huge problem to wrestling. Now, id say he has been a bigger problem then influence. He ruined it.

[@redkritter1225]

I think we forget that Vince is the owner and has the ability to make someone a star. Reigns couldn’t get over for years until finally he pulled the trigger and turned him heel. He almost had a Rock transformation, he couldn’t get over as a face until he turned heel.

[@JeremyKasperson]

How about the premier talents Vince has ruined? Rick Martel, Curt Hennig, The Road Warriors were all AWA champions that he failed to use. Jim Duggan, JYD, Terry Taylor, and Ricky Steamboat were turned into cartoons. Today, how do you let somebody like William Regal go?

[@jkranites]

more people know about Mr. Perfect then Curt Henning....Stop you mark

[@bigfella6898]

Can I buy meth from you?

[@tammyforbes2101]

He probably looks for the needle marks make sure their on the gas.

[@Spongemonkey26]

Vince wanted to call Stone Cold Steve Austin, Frosty McFreeze or some stupid nonsense close to that.

[@jasonwoot5199]

Yet, he is Stone Cold Steve Austin. Biggest star/merchandise seller. Great response simpleton.

[@Spongemonkey26]

@@jasonwoot5199 what are you blabbering on about?

[@jasonwoot5199]

@@Spongemonkey26 just calling you out on your attempt to be funny.

[@Spongemonkey26]

@@jasonwoot5199 You understand the WWE literally wanted to call him that right? Like, I didn't make that up...

[@jasonwoot5199]

@@Spongemonkey26 yup, but they didn’t tho eh

[@kamfisher1714]

Vince already stated what he looks for in talent. Work ethic, charisma, Verbal skills.

[@ravanpee1325]

That's not true. He always looks for big sweaty men

[@lunchb0x1986]

And puking on cue.

[@bigfella6898]

@@ravanpee1325 A.K.A. what has always drawn the best in the entire history or pro wrestling.

[@MichaelSmith-fq6hz]

I think the questioner overstated Vince's record. Yes, Vince saw things in a lot of guys and has a pretty good track record overall. However, look at all the talent Vince had to be talked into either hiring in the first place or giving a push to. Foley, Austin, HBK. Even Cena was almost fired before he rapped in front of Stephanie.

[@inarar5334]

Beat me to it. Whiffing on Austin and Foley when just about all accounts has very reliable people pushing them to him really proves he's more lucky than good sometimes. Hell, he just came out on the Foley documentary on A&E that he was *hoping* Foley would fail so he could lord it over JR because he wouldn't drop bringing him in.

[@MichaelSmith-fq6hz]

@@inarar5334 Yeah, he definitely comes off as petty at times.

[@goodday2760]

So you're saying if he wasn't talked out of his view by Stephanie we'd be on the wrestling equivalent of colonizing other galaxies by now instead of being in the wrestling equivalent of the western dark ages? Sounds like a great mind to me.

[@Jukeboxster]

Well, if he gets talked into it, then he does still get credit for that. That's why you hire good advisors, to cover your blind spots.

[@goodday2760]

@@Jukeboxster How about thousands of advisors in the Hammerstein Ballroom in a match with RVD?

[@violetmick2221]

Not true he almost fire john cena but Stephanie saw john rap and she was amazed he almost fire stone cold if too there story behind it and he didn't want to sign Randy Orton because of he's incident when he was a marine thanks to Jim ross convince him and many more

[@geneanthony3421]

Vince didn't seem to see anything in Steve Austin and thought the Beyond the Mat guys should focus on Ahmed Johnson over Mick Foley. He saw nothing in CM Punk and thought Tom McGee was his next Hulk Hogan. He's been wrong plenty of times. As far as Reigns you could see a lot in him but he booked him horribly for years.

[@roberthinman158]

Also not apparent until they leave because wwe is good at covering their weaknesses.

[@jasonwoot5199]

Vince the King!

[@allencollins5666]

In The Thumbnail Vince Had On Lipstick.

[@purvisvandongen4258]

long, dopey question. had to get jen's in.

[@NorthWalesKid]

If you’re a big guy Vince likes you

[@Jblizzybaby]

Vince McMahon likes guys with lots of “beef”

[@niteporter]

Guess we won't get the Cody Rhodes is going to wwe and Brandi Rhodes is being left out video yet 😂

[@insupportofjunhado]

Roman Reigns was a stupid example. Everyone from CM Punk to Bryan Alvarez saw his potential. People were practically, sometimes literally screaming "turn him heel" for years, and what gets Roman Reigns over? Turning him heel! As for the other side, the failure side, not one example. So how about Mark Jindrak? He was a big dud in WWE, but he's been making big money since leaving. You know, Dan Severn, Sabu, Samoa Joe, Ultimo Dragon, plenty of guys McMahon has been lukewarm to have proven perfectly capable of surviving or even thriving in professional wrestling. Now sometimes guys McMahon doesn't want but do okay come back, like MVP, Eli Drake, Drew McIntyre, but I don't know where this myth of McMahon as a prescient profit head and shoulders above all other talent scouts comes from. People do realize McMahon hires talent scouts right? Most of his stars were already stars, like Hogan, Savage, Angle, even Lesnar, or started by someone else like Andre, Austin, Warrior, even Miz. He's a great promoter who saw the potential of pay per view and a ruthless businessman willing to cut the nuts off of opposition who were conditioned to give him space through a four decades standing agreement.

[@DefendYoungstown]

It's largely a subjective question, because the "knows how to pick'em" argument isn't exactly provable in every case. For example, Vince admitted publicly he "didn't see it" with John Cena and was about to shitcan him, and he ended up being talked into keeping him much to the delight of his own pocketbook. If Cena got fired back then, he would be looked back upon as a "never was" or "all show, no go" simply *because* he never got kept, let alone pushed. We wouldn't be looking as fondly back upon Undertaker if he, say, instead became Mark "The Dumpster" Calloway. Randy Orton's rise came because there was a dearth of top talent, and his push was seen as "experimental". The guys who ended up as proven commodities weren't guaranteed to be proven commodities, and you can just as easily ask how many folks did he bypass because he didn't see it, and the stink of Vince not seeing it in them tained their career because "perception is reality, pal"?

[@johnrambofauci351]

Firing Cena would have been the right choice. Millions stopped watching because of him.

[@Ticketman99]

@@johnrambofauci351 Did they stop in 2002-2004?

[@MajorMotions]

Look at stone cold. Wcw Austin vs WWE Austin

[@kfcriss]

VINCE IS WRESTLING GOD i love him i hope he never leaves

[@auldae]

Yeah, Roman Reigns, who in the world would have thought that guy would become a top wrestler, lol. Umm, guy has all the characteristics Vince would look for and Vince pushed him. Doesn’t take a genius

[@vrixmorr]

The case with reigns is that he was allowed for so long to fail. Not many get that opportunity. His family name and relatives made all the difference. Same with Nia Jax. She would have been released long ago if she wasn't related to the Rock

[@AllanAdamson]

First thing Vince looks at.. how tall is he.. what size are his guns... is he fat... is he bald... can he already wrestle.. was he an athlete.. did he play football... not all these things matter but there's a pro con... do people already like him.. what language do they speak

[@stuarthenderson7327]

Vince has sold nothing for years the guys a brilliant business guy full stop

[@ravanpee1325]

He sold shit content and Fox still pay such a lot of money for the TV deals