Eibach or Geiser Raptor Springs??

[@joshuamoore6299]

Your attention to detail through all phases ( analysis, repair, reporting) are without reproach. I think I can safely state that you are the gold standard on youtube when it comes to content. Short, sweet, relevant material packaged in a way that all who seek pertinent info will find easily digestible, THANK YOU!

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Wow! Thanks man. 🙏🙏 much appreciated

[@stevenjohnson08]

My man... Just purchased my first Raptor a few weeks ago and have been glued to your channel. Great content! Eibachs springs en route

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Steven Johnson right on man. Glad I could help.

[@Titantramp4u]

This was important because the forums were all over the place on how the two springs handled. Your review was more accurate because I know how you drive...A big thanks for all the extra time I know it takes to set up the video shoots and editing..

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Titantramp4u thanks man. All the info out there is one of the main reason I did the video. Lots of people pass themselves off as experts without any actual offroad experience. They go just off the numbers. To me the numbers don’t matter. I need to experience it.

[@gigglegasn20]

I took your advice and purchased the eibach springs to keep it soft and level the truck out and it still rides great. I take the truck off road every other weekend and these worked out perfect. My only complain is the truck sits about 1/4" taller compared to the rear. I don't like other people working on my cars so I rented the spring compressor from orileys and boy let me tell ya that was sketchy compressing the eibachs lol

[@johnevers5874]

I’ve heard that the springs eventually settle out. Have you experienced that yet or is it still sitting higher in the front?

[@sethrad8626]

After doing a heck of a lot of research on this and watching all of your videos on this, I decided to improve my 2018 Gen 2 Raptor. When new, the dealer added RPG 2.25” collars to the front. I’m doing Icon’s Option 2 to the back, and Geisers to the front. The shop doing my work actually added the Geisers on top of the RPG collars, after being told to remove the RPGs and add the stock collar clips to the struts (why listen to a customer???). They broke SIX compressors (all at different offroad shops) trying to get these installed. They called me and told me that they were having a problem. I asked what kind of problem. They sent me pics. When I saw what they did, I went nuts. I told them to fix it and if the shocks are dead, they’re buying me new ones. They broke another compressor yesterday trying to get the springs and collars off!!! A week later, my truck is still out of commission. I saw a thread in here about a guy wanting to add collars to his Geiser springs. That would be a hard NO. The truck is un-drivable and dangerous. Not quite sure how this is going to work it’s way out…but the shop is going to try another compressor on Monday. UNREAL.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

YeH Geisers are way, WAY to stiff and it’s a big no no to combine with collars. May 2.5 lift your already beyond the capabilities of the stock CV axles and will have to replace boots often. With a collar your going to blow out the shock bucket. Guys with Live valve and Geisers are regularly blowing out their buckets. Only option to compress Geisers is to use a professional wall mounted compressor. Nothing else is strong enough. Period. They need to find a local shop or just cut out the old ones and replace them for you.

[@sethrad8626]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad Got the Raptor back yesterday. Took seven different spring compressors to get the job done right. They broke six compressors getting the Geisers off the RPG collar. Spoke to Geiser and a few other shock rebuild companies. They suggested that as long as I’m not racing in the desert, the struts should be fine. Where I live, trail riding, overlanding and some open field riding is about all we can do. Had the truck out on some country roads last night. Installed 3” Geisers up front and Icons (#2) out back. The truck drives incredibly well. Smooth riding. Very controlled. Much more positive response/handling. Very impressive! Looking forward to getting off road soon! Thx for the outstanding videos and allowing all of us to learn from your successes and mistakes. No one else is doing what you’re doing and those of us who follow along appreciate the fun ride you’re on!

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Thanks man. That’s the main reason we started this channel.

[@kinosgarage]

There is a big difference between the 2017 Gen2 suspension and the 2019+. While the 19+ have the live valve, it cannot keep up with the terrain offroad. Also, the Eibach springs were softened up quite a bit because people (parking lot drivers) complained about them being too stiff. Eibach makes some of King's springs and I can tell you that 540 is too soft. You need a 600/650 spring with the 3.0 to be able to get a better ride from the front while off-roading. Another thing to point here is that the Geisers are too tall. I lost count of how many tore up their CV boots with them on. Neither setup is ideal. When you start messing with the ride height, you change the entire geometry on the truck and you need to make sure that the UCA's, LCA, CV Shafts and Tie rods are properly matched up. One last thing to consider, on non-live valve and on the live-valve shocks, once you change the spring rate, the valving is not longer ideal for the setup. Great video as always.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

KA2 Offroad thanks man. You definitely know more about spring rates than I do. And agree with everything you said. I think the Geiser springs are better suited for the Raptor stock setup. But yes, the angle is a bit much. Right at the limit or what is acceptable and after 50k miles my axle boots failed within a week of each other. But between the 2, my focus is off-roading and that’s why I would rather use the Geisers. I’m finding the Eibachs too soft. Thanks for the extra insight man. Good to know the science based on what I’m feeling with the truck.

[@edmeyer4800]

That's why it's better to just go with Fox 3.0 Factory Series Internal Bypass Recirculating Remote Reservoir Coilover Kit upper control arms and new rods

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Ed Meyer yeah, but most can’t afford $5,000 needed to do that setup.

[@edmeyer4800]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad 12 months of stashing $400.00 will get you there, if you bought a Raptor definitely shouldn't have a problem, lot of these places have payment plans too.

[@glenfetsch3294]

Anyone out there have the new Factory Race Live Valves? It would be an interesting side by side comparison, but CA is a bit far from MD for me to lend a hand :). Great video, wish there were more videos like this out there on mods. Keep up the good work man!

[@logansimpson7770]

AMAZING VIDEO!! I’d love to see your opinions on leafs for it!

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Already have a few videos on Deavers and icons. Both have their benefits but the icons are what I recommend

[@thso6716]

6:57 landing with the front first might be the reason for the bunny hops, the jump seems shorter than the Geisers at 85mph. The gen1 had all wheels on the hip, left the hip, and landed almost at the same time. I think you can try them with the same jump and speed, also the spare tires because it may affect the center of gravity. Just a little bit of thoughts. Thanks for sharing this, I was thinking about the Eibach for my gen2 live valve, but questioning the performance.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

I plan on getting the truck back to the same spots once we find some used Geisers to put on the truck. But based on how the front end has handled with the Eibachs I would not take that 85 mph jump in them. Unfortunately that 85 mph jump is no longer there. BLM fixes that section of road.

[@chriswoodard8813]

One thing to note is on the Gen 1 Raptors the Eibach raise the front a lot more than the Geisers on low perch. Also, I had to take off the Eibachs and put on the Geisers because I was going through CV Axles due to the boots tearing. I talked to others on the Raptor Forums on Facebook and they said the same thing happened to them.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Good to know.

[@RA-gk5zg]

Great video. Thanks for the real world input. It looks to me like the Live Valve shocks are not any good. Maybe they are ok for most drivers but you’ve clearly exceeded their capabilities.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

R A Live Valve shocks are great. We did a review a few months back when we first got the truck. They have much better response than the old traditional 3.0s on the Raptor and allow the truck to protects itself better. BUT, like I tell people all the time. The truck has more power than the stock suspension can handle. I drive way faster than most because I know the capabilities of my truck. I’ve spend the last 3 years really learning what she can do and improving my driving skills offroad with her. new Raptor owners will easily take 6 months to a year behind the wheels offroad every weekend to get comfortable enough to run like I do.

[@tenorsopranosax]

Great video and channel. Much more informative than a lot of the stuff I’ve seen online. Also another good part... no pissing matches!! Lol I drive my truck 99% of the time on the street at the moment and will be upgrading to the 3.0 LV when time permits me to use the truck for what it’s meant for. In the meantime, I want to add some height to the front but want to preserve the ride quality of stock. How do you feel the on-road manners of the Eibachs compare to the stock setup? I’m primarily interested in the ride quality and comfort.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Daniel Leeds it is a little harsher than stock, but not crazy harsh like the Geisers. You will feel bumps a little more, but overall the truck handles nice and smooth with them and you still improve on the offroad capabilities of the truck

[@aaronbowe596]

When adjusting the pre load of a spring you most always play with valving to compensate. The stock shocks are valued for the stock springs. I had eibach springs on my 17 but was still unhappy with the shock valving.. with fox's internal bypass design there are 5 big bleed holes in the bottom shock body that don't really control the rebound valving at all,and doesn't allow any valving changes...went with the 3.0 oem king and they made a huge difference and turned it into a different truck..with the kings ibp there's 2 pistons and 4 shim stacks to let the owner really dial in the shock valving..way better shock in my opinion..

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Thanks for the info. I felt something similar when I did the Fox 3.0s at the front on my 17. Hated the rebound i was feeling. RPG kept telling me I needed to upgrade to their full bolt kit to take advantage of the bypass shocks. Hated the rebound so bad though and most recommended tuning the shocks and I quickly found out King is the way to go. More shops can tune them and king regularly has tune days.

[@aaronbowe596]

Yeah only so much can be done to the fox style internal bypass because of the holes drilled in the inner body..im loving the king shock now..problem with the rear oem king is u can buy a 16" race shock for the same money..thats where the snowball started rolling..lol..now i got the rst 18 bed mount and looking to go with a front kit now..i read a forum from a gen 1 guy and he was saying the h and m kit pulls 18" of travel..both svc and rpg claim there's pull 16"

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Aaron Bowe upgrades always snowball. As for travel, I’m working with the HM guys to document the suspension travel of their kits. No one shows their kits being cycled to confirm they are pulling the claimed travel numbers. They all rely on CAD and in the real world things bind. Would love to see the proof and see what all these kits actually pull

[@aaronbowe596]

Me too! I agree 100%

[@NSG3635]

Great video. I have the geissers and as of last week got Deaver hd 3. My problem with the geissers is how harsh they rebound over something like a speed bump. I actually have to drive slower over speed bumps then I did with the stock set up because of this. Other driving characteristics are fine. My friend got the rpg collars and his rides much smoother

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Nick Ginsberg yeah, pavement driving sucks with the geisers period. Offroad and at speed is where they shine. I’m not a fan of the collars because all they do is add height. You can still bottom out and damage your frame with a collar. And like the Eibachs is easy to find the limits offroad.

[@NSG3635]

Keep It Dirty Off-Road true all they do is add height. I was at a well respected off road shop a few days ago and they said the stock set up requires a certain amount of droop. When you put the geissers in basically all that droop is gone, so it just rebounds almost right away. Tough call what’s actually better off-road

[@sixshooter4570]

Great video, just what I was looking for, thanks. I'll wait till I see your video on the Geiser springs with the live valve shocks. Also, with the extra lift from these springs it changes the upper A arm angle correct? How or does this affect or limit travel or cause excessive wear? I know you could install a newer upper control arm but the you would need new wheels with a different offset for a Arm to tire clearance.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

sixshooter4570 the lift with the Eibachs is not as extreme as the Geisers so I don’t expect any additional wear. With the Geisers I did see my axle boots fail at 50k miles because of the angles were right at the limit. And upgraded UCA won’t change anything. Angles will still be the same and like you said, now you need new wheels to clear the arms. As for travel, both of the springs pre-load the shock and do rob the truck of a little up travel. But with the stock shocks that is a good thing because it avoids the nose getting buried in the dirt. I bent my frame once that way with stock springs

[@sixshooter4570]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad Thanks for the reply, answered just the way I was thinking except the angle of the new upper control Arm not changing. Really appreciate your insight.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Your welcome. 🙏🙏

[@angelomiranda4361]

Great video and I purchase a set of Geisers from TSW. Great info I thank you! God Bless

[@jamesignozzitto7662]

Great channel and video content. Just picked up my first Raptor, 2020. With the Eibach springs what leaf pack would you recommend I upgrade to? Don't tow or carry more than 200-300 pounds in the rear on occasion. Offloading is mainly fire roads with a lot of ruts and washboards. Stock springs seem to have trouble handling the washboards and truck tends to wheel hop and skip out a bunch. Interested in your recommendations. Great channel and video content.

[@thumperjr100]

Another great video, thanks for the review 👍

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

W Bru thanks man 🙏🙏

[@rickl2053]

I had the Geisers on my 17 Raptor. I blew a CV axle on the passenger side within 50 miles. Ford claimed it was due to the springs and wouldn’t cover it under warranty. I had to try another dealership to get it covered. Other than that, I loved the geisers. On my 20, I think the 3.0s are the way to go. A lot of coin but worth it

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Rick L I had the Geisers on for 25k miles and lost both CV boots (1 on each side) within a week from each other. The Geisers put the axels at the very limit and the more that awd and 3wd gets used the quicker the boots will fail.

[@rickl2053]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad totallt sucks! Both my Gen 1s never had an issue. Mid perch was the best. At this point my 20 will remain stock. I dont want to deal with an issues.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

@@rickl2053 There are plenty of built up Gen2 without problem man. I think I got a bad one. I am a little hard on mine too, But was not expecting issues till later. Way too soon at 17k miles. My 2017 had far less issues.

[@rickl2053]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad I actually lemoned my 17 recently. It was in for 5 times, 60 days for the transmission. They flashed it 3 times, one set of valve springs, then a valve body. Still felt like the trans was going to fall out. It is bad quality on some parts.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

@@rickl2053 sucks to hear man. Seeing experiences all over the place. Some never see issues. Others see them all the time. Very inconsistent. My 17 was assembled in Dearborn and it was great I wonder if that’s a factor. My 20 was not, will need to look up where it was assembled and maybe make that a video topic

[@dzo_f150]

What would you say performs better offroad? Stock raptor or raptor with eibachs with Non-live valve shocks?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

In my experience and my personal opinion, live valve truck with the SDI e click is the best. Then it would be a stock raptor non live valve with a collar or upgraded top hat. The Eibachs and Geiser route is good offroad, but awful on the street. Too rough.

[@Clearbrowser]

What about the stock springs ? How do you like them compared to the eibach

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

I have a more recent video on springs for the raptor. Spoiler alert, I don’t recommend commend spring anymore on Any Raptor platform due to the issues we have seen on the trails. Check it out and let me know if you want a link to the video

[@potatospud1152]

so just a quick question, do the eibachs do worse off road than the stock 19+ springs? I dont really notice the bunny hopping with my stock raptor and i have eibachs on the way.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Potato Spud yes and no. The shocks are tuned for the stock springs so they perform better and the truck rides smoother. BUT, the front and is too low in my opinion and vulnerable to damage if you push the truck too hard. They made the front low for fuel economy. What I found is that with the Eibachs I bottomed our the suspension easier than stock springs. But bottom with Eibachs did not mean scraping the dirt with the frame and skid plate. With the stock springs bottom will also happen and when you do, the truck is cutting into the dirt and you will cause damage to the LCA mounts and skid plate. So the Eibachs do let you run a little faster and harder than stock, but they have their limits. Geisers on the other hand pre-load the suspension more and it takes a lot more speed and force to find bottom.

[@thewholesaler4162]

Keep It Dirty Off-Road so what about using an RPG collar instead?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

The Wholesaler not a fan of any collars. Because you still have the stock springs and the stock movement. The truck won’t handle right and offroad they won’t give you anything. Collars are just for show

[@rogershepherd7934]

Great video Helio!

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Thanks a lot!

[@jbbb7642]

Great video! Between the Geiser’s and Eibach’s…have you tested on wet roads, and muddy conditions?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

JB BB got plenty of testing of the Geisers in all conditions. Eibachs I’ve done wet but only a little bit of mud almost gettting stuck on a dry lake bed that was not so dry. Both functioned good. No hopping or anything like that.

[@ivansaez2119]

Only the factory spring is changed for the eibach? nothing else needs to be changed?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Yes, if you have a live valve truck, the front height has to be reset for the trucks computer. It used to be only the dealer could do it. But I think someone figured out how to do it with ForScan

[@xschm1dx]

What about for a gen 1? Idk if you made another video. I’m stock on my terrain in SoCal. Had a black 2013 with fox 3.0 dsc and HATED them for daily.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Gen1 is different because of the shorter shock bucket setup up front and adjustable perch. You don’t really need spring upgrades. You can just adjust the height with the perch and get the same results without the harness.

[@thechewyistone]

The geisers did a slap wheelie after that 84mph jump

[@xUntamed666x]

Have you had any issues with the moon roof since you are running the truck pretty hard off road? I'm debating whether to go no moon roof or moon roof. Amazing videos, keep up the great work.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

NO MOOF ROOF!!!! no moon roof. You should follow me on Instagram. On my personal account Helio Muro. Just posted a video of all the noise my moon roof is making. And I’ve had friends break the glass flexing in the trails multiple times

[@lyndalmorgan1541]

Have you put the Geisers back on? Also i want my truck to be about an inch higher on the back. I have about 300 pounds I put in the back for offroading, so what deavers shoulder I get? also HD or regular?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Lyndal Morgan not yet. If you only doing 300 lbs, you don’t need HDs. Regular deavers +3 or +4 should be fine. If you want adjustable go with the Icon springs. The Geisers raise the front a lot so make sure you account for a little bit of sag in the back.

[@bajamedic]

I am installing the Eibach’s in AM.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

BajaMedic 👍👍

[@Sanjuk0522]

For wear and tear stand point will i have problem having 3” rake? Which will wear out quicker my pinion for having a rake or installing eibach/geisers up front and wearing out the axle seals.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

You will wear out your CV axle boots with the front springs well before your gears. What are you trying to do with the truck that you have such a high rake?

[@Sanjuk0522]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad installed icon option 3 on the back with all my overland gear will be about 43.75”. Currently front is stock sits at 40”

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

If you just installed, that’s not your settled height yet. It takes a couple of cycling to get the rear leafs to settle. Took a fell small jumps and washes on mine. Do the rear is designed to move and articulate so you won’t see problems at the back. But any lift up front with springs will cause more running of the CV boots. The more the CV boots touch, the quicker they wear out. The higher the lift, the quicker they wear.

[@Sanjuk0522]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad Had them on for about 1000 miles, haven't jumped it but took it on a wash board couple times. so that rake won't cause any issues on the rear is what your saying right.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

That’s not enough to brake in the leaf pack. Offroad leafs need to articulate to properly brake in. And no, that won’t affect it at all. It’s too little. If you did like a 6in lift or more than you would need to keep and eye on it

[@fnraptr7744]

This might be a dumb question but I’m a noob. If I buy the eibach springs is that all I have to buy to get it installed? No other parts or anything I need to be able to put them on?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Yep. All the bolts on the front springs are reusable. So just the springs and if you plan on doing the work yourself, get an 18 mm ratchet wrench with a pivoting head. We have an install video on how to do it and tools you need.

[@fnraptr7744]

Awesome, I appreciate the quick reply. I subbed! It says it raises it 2.5 inches on a 17 and that will put it level?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

No. Back is 1.5 over stock on both truck. A 2.5 raise will put you height and you will need to raise the back. That’s a whole other long conversation and planning.

[@fnraptr7744]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad what would you recommend for a good level kit?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

That’s a loaded question. Check out my Deavers install video. You need to plan for the weight you will carry and any sag that may cause If unsure, the icon springs are you best bet because they are configurable to be between 1 - 3 over stock.

[@thepakofactor5018]

I love you. That’s it. You’re just the best.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

The Pako Factor ok. Weird another man telling you they love you. But ok. We will go with it.

[@brianbaker4745]

Do you need the hd cam suspension part when you install new springs ?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

So first off, we don’t recommend spring upgrades anymore after numerous reports of damage. Check out our latest video for why. 2nd, IF you take you truck offroad in any form, I highly recommend caster camber locks on the lower control arms to lock in the alignment. It’s just a slot and if you don’t have the cam locks, you will knock out your alignment on every offroad run.

[@cray_cla8317]

Nice video. Do you how know the eibach springs compare to stock in terms of off-road capability?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

They are a big improvement over stock. Stock springs allow the truck to bottom out and cause damage to the skid plate and LCA mounts. The Eibachs are linear so they do perform a little different, they don’t get stiffer as you get more into them like the stock springs. But overall I’ve been really happy with them.

[@BIG_DOGG]

Did u ever do the geiser shock review with the live valve ??

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

No. No need. Geisers with Live valve is a bad mix. Too many people have blown out and damaged their shock towers with that combination. Its too stiff of a combination. And It’s not a combo I recommend

[@BIG_DOGG]

Thanks for the quick response. Looking to get the eibach springs this weekend!

[@jbuck9821]

That video of the Geisers at 85mph is misleading. Yes, it didn't bottom out. But it did pogo. Hard enough to lift the front wheels off the ground while the rear wheels stayed planted. And before someone says it was terrain, the rears stay on the ground. If it was an additional whoop/jump, they would have lifted as well. So the pogo is still there. And still strong. But the progressive rate of the Geisers did help prevent the front suspension from bottoming out.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

I had to rewatch the video to see what your were talking about as it’s a few years old. 2 factor made the front end pogo. First is speed. 85 mph is a lot of load. way more than 55 mph that we did with the Eibachs. 2nd is live valve. Live valve shocks do a much better job of reducing rebound. The Geiser clip was with the regular stock 3.0s. And In fact we never got a chance to do the Geiser test because we started to get reports that those running Geisers with live valve were breaking their shock buckets. Live valves and Geisers are too stiff of a combination and the shock bucket would start cracking and failing. Shit even with the Eibachs, the shocks got so hot that the rubber melted around the springs. We found this out when going back to stock and the shock bucket rubber was melted on the springs and they would not come apart. Hope that helps. So our recommendation has changed since this video.

[@jbuck9821]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad Understood. Thanks for the update. Did you make a video with your updated recommendation? Would you be able to link it? Or provide the title so I can search it?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Not yet. We will be redoing our whole suspension recommendation video here in the coming weeks and cover all the common scenarios

[@johndaddabbo9383]

For mainly street performance, but with Icon Dynamics out back (400 lb setup) would the Geiser's be the way to go given the Icons and constant weight out back?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

John Daddabbo Geisers require planning. 2.5 inches don’t sounds like much. But in practice the back end needs to go up 2 over stock minimum so the back end don’t look like she’s squatting. So the middle or highest setting on the Icons would be needed. I did HD+4 deavers that is about 2-3 over stock. But then I loaded up the truck with gear and the back end was lower and eventually because I did not have bump stops, I had to get my deavers re-arched. I don’t know off the top of my head how much lift you get from the icons and how much they sag. But you need to find a nice combination of lift and weight (min 250 lbs in the back for balance) so that the truck is level stopped and the back end squats a little at speed. Don’t forget bump stops. As you upgrade the front end will send more load to the back, as it should, and you need to protect the back end with bump stops. icon bumpy stop kit is great but make sure you lock tight all those damn bolts

[@johndaddabbo9383]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad Wow, Thank you! For that is exactly the explanation I needed (despite having watched all your Vids). No doubt this explanation will help others, who like me, don't Offroad nearly as much or as hard as you and your boys. Thanks again!!!

[@raffiavedian3960]

Great video thanks. Do you have any experience using collars with geisers? My truck was level with Icon leafs in the back and Geiser in front. But I recently added a winch up front resulting in the front sagging, thinking about adding icon collar or shim up front to level out. Curious what your thoughts are on that solution? (I can't afford new full suspension)

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Raffi Avedian 😳😳 dude what? The Geiser springs are super tight. To the point that you need a commercial spring compressor to install them. I don’t think you will be able to add a collar. If you do it will be dangerous. If your front end if sagging with Geisers I would recommend a new bumper and no winch up front. Instead go with a light weight bumper with a detachable winch setup. That way the weight is only on there when you need it . Don’t add a collar man. If your front end is sagging that much you have way too much weight up front and the truck will have even bigger problems and won’t perform right.

[@raffiavedian3960]

Thanks, I appreciate your thoughts

[@roytan1245]

I’m curious where are the trails are you guys hitting? I’m looking for off road places to hit

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Roy Tan all over So Cal. Best way to find these spots is to join us on a run. Follow my personal IG account to come out on a run

[@JefeHones]

Any Geiser testing on Gen 1s? I do not want street ride getting worse. Just bought some and haven't installed them yet.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Not personally no. Sorry man. I have very limited info on the performance of the Geisers on the Gen1

[@RayBarao.]

Can I put a 6” strut spacer on the Eibach? I am installing a 6” super lift on my 16 f150 I don’t want to use my factory struts I am looking at the Eibach pro truck adjustable Coilovers. Wondering if strut spacer will fit ontop.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

The only experience I have with lift kits is they fail when you try and do what we do. These springs are designed for raptors with raptor FOX shocks. They should never be used with spacers or any kind. Specially strut spacers that will surely break so the first wash or jump.

[@littleninja5736]

Is the Geiser that really bad on road? I’m off road a lot, but really dont wanna give up the ride comfort on road either

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

They are man. Very stiff on the street. Not sure why no one talks about it, but ride is very stiff and jittery on the road. So I don’t recommend them for those than want a Cush ride.

[@littleninja5736]

And I’m going with the 3” deaver in the back. Not have any weight on the bed to be more specific. Should I go with the 2.5” or the 3” for the front spring to get the truck sit even. Thanks in advance

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

+3 Deavers is just 1in over stock. So 2.5 lift with 2 in the back is close to level. But, Deavers are stiff too many. All offroad springs are. If you want to keep the Cush ride and daily your truck I recommend the shock collars, max 1.5 lift up front with the stock springs. That will give you the smoothest ride. If you have the money, look at SDI Eclick with live valves. Best bang for you buck that keeps a Cush ride.

[@littleninja5736]

Thanks a ton 🙏

[@Travis-hl3oz]

Really great video thank you very helpful

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Travis Pelton 🙏🙏

[@NateBoyce1789]

Which shocks would pair well/better with an SDI E-click system? Stock springs(the ones I bought off a guy have RPG perch collars), Eibach, or Geisers at that point? And would I need to upgrade leaf springs with Deavers or Icons?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Currently stock without a collar or anything is the best option. Upgrading the springs or pre loading the springs with a collar make the whole solution too stiff. For that reason SDI is working with another company to develop a softer spring. Something designed to work better with live valves for the raptor. So be on the look out for that hopefully soon. For rear leafs either is great. I recommend icons if you want the option to change your mind later. They come with an add a leaf where you can change the height without buying a new set. Only drawback is installation is harder and switching in the add a leaf sucks. But saves you money in the long term

[@NateBoyce1789]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad could I use my stock perch collars from a 2018 shock on the 2019 live valve shocks? Or where can I find stock collars if not?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

No you can’t. Completely different shock bodies. How much lift is the collar on there now? If your within 1-1.5 over stock then run that and you will be fine. But anything higher and you’ve eliminated all the progressive side of the spring and it will be much stiffer

[@drtb69]

Great video! Thank you.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Thanks man.

[@gbb1419]

Eibach says their springs provide 3" lift on bottom perch, thats in 2024. I dont mind a stiff ride I want a stronger spring rate. Eibach says the spring ratea 650 lbs. If thats the case should I buy the Geisers?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

First off, gen3 raptor only has one perch. There I no bottom perch. And as you saw in my other video, I don’t recommend Geisers or Eibachs springs anymore because of the damage they can cause.

[@gbb1419]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad I was wondering for Gen 1 Raptor shocks. I'm trying to convert my F 150 to the Raptor suspension. So I bought the shocks off rock auto, but now I need to buy a top hat and a spring. Eibach lifts 3", but Geiser you say is stiffer. I don't pound my truck too bad, but we do get some deep snow here, I want a lift and a stiff spring rate is rather have. Eibach says their springs are 650 lbs. Seems kind of soft.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

What shocks did you get? For what year raptor? I’m guessing gen1 shocks. So if your doing a swap to a stock f150 with gen1 raptor shocks there no combination of top hats or springs will work unless you get the shims. Ford does not sell the shims anymore and you can only get them from take off trucks and they are VERY hard to get. Your other options is Gen2 shocks with an upgraded shock bucket. You cut off the stock shock bucket and then weld or bolt on the taller gen2 bucket. Camburg and KHC make them. Lastly. You don’t need spring upgrades IF your running gen1 shocks. If you want more height use the built in adjustable perch to get the height. No need to get a stiff ride when the shock themselves have an adjustable collar to get more height. But again. Gen1 shocks won’t work without the shims.

[@gbb1419]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad this is bad news, so the piece on top of the top hat is a shim, and I won't be able to bolt the assembly on without them? If I tried to just compress the spring and screw a stock top hat on, why won't it work? Is it because the lower arm ball joint wants to camber the shocks outwards?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

@@gbb1419 it has to do with the angle of the shock bucket in relations to the shock. Stock f150 the shock sits more vertical. With the raptor the arms are wider so the shocks sits farther out. So rather than install a different shock bucket on the f150 frame, ford decided to keep the stock shock bucket angle and use shims to get the shocks at the correct angle. If you try and install the shocks without shims, the shock will not sit right. The shock bucket Bolts closer to the middle of the truck will not be properly seated and eventually the shock will move and start to destroy the top hat and shock bucket. Now you cannot just take the top hat from a gen2 shock and put it on a gen1 shock. Shock and springs are different sizes and it does not solve for the angle. Again gen2 angles the shock bucket to match the angle of the shock being rather out. The top hat has nothing to do with the angle. So the only way to run gen1 shocks with a f150 is with the shims. Period.

[@matt_takata]

overall which one is the better option for all around purpose? I also want more height so i can fit 37’s in the future. i pretty much do everything with my truck. looking for for new springs that add 2” height and provide a better planted feel and a soft feel on and off road.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Neither. See one of my latest videos on spring upgrades

[@DustinH982]

Have you had issues with noise? I added eibach springs and am reading a ride height calibration will be needed to reset the live valves to 0. Currently, I hear a clunking noise on smaller bumps.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

YeH, you do need to recalibrate the ride height and only the dealers can do it. As for noise no, but you are in the sway bar more often so that will make some noise

[@DustinH982]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad any advice on what I should be communicating to Ford? The dealerships in my area (Atlanta) have no idea on how to do the calibration.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

@@DustinH982 just let them know you need to do a Live Valve reset. They may not know what to do, but they can ask Ford for the procedure and they should be able to handle it from there

[@DustinH982]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad Thanks!

[@CharanRaj-oq9ss]

What happens if calibration not done??

[@vamk247x7]

What is the name of the ramps?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Are you taking about my recovery boards? Those are Tred Pro boards

[@mittu042003]

Keep It Dirty Off-Road no, the ramp the truck is on in the beginning of the video.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Vamshi Krishna those are your standard crappy plastic car ramps. You can find them everywhere

[@mittu042003]

Keep It Dirty Off-Road thanks

[@Captainhairyass]

Serious question. Why not a fox 3.0 coilover?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Cost and lead time. You can get springs between $250-500 and they are readily available. Shocks are $3500 and 6-8 months out. If your on a budget, the choice is easy.

[@Captainhairyass]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad I'm on the verge of buying one over the other. I'm leaning towards the 3.0 because I don't want to sacrifice ride quality. It's safe to say the 3.0 is the better option, right? I don't really mind the price so long as ride quality stays. 🙏

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Yes, adjusted and tuned properly they are. Some shops may even have them in stock. But for me the wait times right now are both worth it

[@Jesse-Rodriguez]

Waiting for the G springs review on the live wire

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

You mean Geisers? If so, all that’s on hold until we can figure out what’s going on with the steering on the truck.

[@thor2291]

Thanks for the great info

[@sergioacevedo2874]

I have the 17 so no live valve and I honestly don’t feel the geisers are any tougher on the road than my stocks. However like you said off-road omg I can go so much harder on the trails and feel more confident and comfortable in the truck and I rarely bottom out in the front (ie hit the front skid plate) like I used to. I have the Deaver +3 HD in the back but like you have a crap ton of gear. Since you have been to deaver is it possible for me to add leaves to make my Deavers +4? Now that I have broken it in even without my gear I still sag a bit in the back.

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Planning the rear to match the Geisers is something I struggled with. You need to plan for height, weight, and how much it sags. I would say plus4 is the minimum for about 250lbs in the back and HD+4 with 400 lbs in the back to make sure you get 2in raise and only 1 in of sag. You can have old Deavers re-arched and modifies with an extra leaf to carry for weight or raise a little. But before you do, make sure you protect your investment with bump stops so the lead pack don’t go past straight and need another re-arch down the road. Contact Deavers directly and ask for Jeff. Let him know how much weight you carry and what your current Deavers are and he can give you a quote and let you know what’s possible. Just keep in mind, adjusting the leaf pack will still cost you about half the cost of a new set. And be prepared for him to tell you he can’t adjust them if your carrying more than 400 lbs in the back and you may need to switch to the HD series.

[@sergioacevedo2874]

Keep It Dirty Off-Road thanks that is great info. Dang for half the cost I may just ride these out until I need some new ones lol. I do have the rpg bump stops luckily and oh man my rear end is so stable on whoops and jumps now I love it

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

It’s half the cost, but usually it includes them taking them off, re-arch and adding additional leafs and putting them back on the truck.

[@sergioacevedo2874]

Keep It Dirty Off-Road oh if that’s the case hmmm you are tempting me hahha

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

SERGIO ACEVEDO does not hurt to give them a call and find out. The saggy ass bothered the shit out me on the last truck. Wish I would have done something sooner

[@blade2800jy]

What about off-road performance on eibach vs stock?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Check out our 37s video series. We took this these obstacles with a stock Raptor as well and there was a big difference

[@buckshotx]

So with a 2019 raptor with live valve the 3 inch Geiser springs lifts the truck 2.5inch or 3 inches?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Geisers are only set for a 2.5 in lift. I know they made a slightly different version for the 19-20s but it was still only a 2.5in lift. I also would not recommend Geisers with live valves. That combination is too stiff and in a pucker moment on the trails where the full suspension travel is needed; you could see the shock start to crack to the shock bucket. In rare instances breaking through.

[@buckshotx]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad there arent any trails where i live most of the off roading i do is in mud. Do I still need to worry?

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

Always a possibility for a bottom out moment offroad man. You should be more worried with loosing a boot. At 2.5in lift, the boot angles are high and the boots run against each other and fail quicker. When they do, you need to rebuild the CV axles or replace them. I recommend people use a shock collar or the SDI top hat replacement instead and limit the ride height at the front to 1.5 over stock to maintain a smooth ride and not have extra maintenance down the road with CV boots failing

[@buckshotx]

@@KeepItDirtyOffRoad alright thank you

[@mojaveraptor]

I’m just here for the comments... 🤣

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

🤣🤣🤣 🍿 🍿

[@fazedumb1982]

What’s your IG I’m about to add you !

[@KeepItDirtyOffRoad]

IG links in description @heliomuro is the one I’m most active on