Kweethul - The Skaven's Forgotten OTHER GOD - Warhammer Lore

Did you know a long time ago the SKAVEN had another god in their pantheon? Not only that but Kweethul was mentioned all the way until 2011! AND had his own Daemons? So who is he? A former servant of the Horned Rat turned renegade? Another god all together? Let's discuss!
Kweethul - The Skaven's Forgotten OTHER GOD - Warhammer Lore
#lore #warhammer #fantasy
Want to support the channel or find us on social media? Check out the links below:
‣ Consider supporting us on Patreon:
/ thegreatbookofgrudges
Special thanks to our Patrons:
Fabi, faithlessberserker, Gibraltar LUSC, Ryan Bertsche, Mike7676, Monkeyman, VIKRAM SRINIVASAN, TheSaltyCanadian, Valk, Rowan, Naldor, BearlyTactical
Want to support the channel while also getting stuff for your hobby needs? Check out our affliate ELEMENT GAMES!
Get 15-25% off Warhammer and other brands now!
‣ Use the code below for double gems which will eventually bag you some free stuff!
THE3476
‣ Element Games - Homepage
elementgames.co.uk/?d=10333
‣ Element Games - Warhammer products
elementgames.co.uk/warhammer?...
Check out our social media links below:
‣ Discord: / discord
‣ FB: / the-great-book-of-grud...
‣ Instagram: TheGreatBookofGrudges
‣ Instagram: nathanthegreatbook
‣ Twitter: @TGrudges
Channel art by MaxOnMars:
sites.google.com/view/maxonmars
/ max.on.mars
Music used on current videos:
Bensound's music licensed under the Creative Commons License
Bensound.com
Thanks again for stopping by!

[@TheGreatBookofGrudges]

Some really old skaven lore cos why not :)

[@indrickboreale7381]

Kweethul could work as Lord Kroak-like Legendary Hero for Skaven

[@blackadder564]

Skarbrand is so lucky that Khorne is such a forgiving, rational and laid back deity.

[@shadeblackwolf1508]

My read on the lore from the Thanquol novels seems like they refer to Kweethul as their faith's satan. Lord of their hell, too Vile for skavenkind. Perhaps he tried to step out of the Great Horned Rat's shadow and was smited for his insolence?

[@basinox]

That was the feeling I was getting based on the ways his name is used

[@thehermitman822]

So like Gork & Mork the Skaven are doomed by their own deity choices.

[@SpliffingBrit]

​@@thehermitman822 doomed by their pick of gods??? Gork and mork just want the orks to fight, thats literally the easiest thing to do in the warhammer universe

[@thehermitman822]

@@SpliffingBrit I'd say dying but I get ya.

[@doomedrpgproject4473]

I believe Kweethul was only ever intended as an example for GMs/players on how to create minor Chaos Gods rather than canon lore. Even his daemon's attributes were created by rolling on random tables. C.L. Werner loves referencing old or neglected lore in his novels. He wrote a short story featuring fimir at a time when they were almost forgotten and deemed practically verboten by GW.

[@praisethesun.praisedeussol6051]

verboten? why use a German word am just curious

[@rynemcgriffin1752]

@@praisethesun.praisedeussol6051 It’s a very interessant spracht

[@betariusprime4839]

Sprache

[@Metryk]

@@praisethesun.praisedeussol6051 Weil Denglish

[@ambustio9807]

@@Medea86730 in realms of chaos he was used as example of deamon prince and how to use them as patrons for your character (champion for your army) as a way to grant chaos gifts to them that arent in the classic chaos gifts tables

[@ryanfoster2869]

It'd be kinda funny if they rolled the lore of the two Skaven gods into one. Where Kweethul is the Horned Rat's real name but he insists on being referred to as the Great Horned Rat to appear more powerful.

[@bluemilkalienmonster522]

Would like Kweethul himself to return as some sort of verminlord

[@monthlyscoopltd]

Flying Skaven: the long lost Pigeonmen...

[@FirstoftheAbyss92]

He might have tried to backstab the horned Rat (very Skaveny) and lost the subsequent "struggle" (akin to Khorne and Skarbrand) and well nobody (especially not the skaven like a loser since it implies they might fail to reach the highest power as well) Another possibility is the Chaos link and with it the beastmen (since the whole goat-aspect of his appearance). He could have participated in one of the many chaos-invasions and (humiliated the Skaven and especially the council of thirteen and) joined forces with the Beastmen (as if he was a lesser force and not THE representative of the Great Skaven Underempire). then at some point in the campaign he backstabbed the Chaos-force and gained a massive boost in power (for example by hijacking a power-boosting ritual which turned him into a demon) but he did so whilst doing lots damage to the skaven-forces and interests. The Chaos invasion was destroyed shortly afterwards and with little good to expect from the council of 13 Kweethul decided to overthrow the council with his newly found power and his Beastmen allies. This failed possibly due to the Greyseers and even a personal intervention by the Horned Rat. He fled to the Chaos-dimension afterwards....waiting and plotting. Again his failures would make him less than admired by the other Skaven whilst his pandering to humans and beastmen would make them despise him for "subjecting him to lesser races".

[@dredgenvarg7092]

They goat like appearance was one of his very first chaos attributes from what I recall. He started as Skaven and then received the "Crossbreed" attribute, which involved rolling d100 and consulting a table, the result was beastman. So if we were to try and rationise it terms of lore, it would have been his first "gift" from Nurgle, to whom he was a champion of

[@dredgenvarg7092]

The reason why the beast and steed are a bit random is because Kweethul was an example of a randomly created daemon prince who gained his own pantheon. He was created just to show what you could create yourself so you could have you own chaos warband in service to your very own and unique chaos god. His base was a skaven champion of Nurgle who ascended to become a daemon prince of Nurgle. He was mentioned in the Lost and the Damned book long before the horned rat was a thing and was probably its inspiration. There is still is a link between Nurgle and the skaven to this day. Lost and the Damned had a whole section on running a campaign for chaos warbands to fight and evolve, at the end of this evoloution your chaos champion would either be blessed and receive the gift of daemonhood and be turned into a daemon prince, or they would be cursed and be turned into a chaos spawn. This is just an author taking artistic license and drawing on obscure lore that only the older fans will pick up on.

[@ashendant1317]

You should do a video about Skavor, the third Skaven God through from the lens of the Dwarves. There are also other "chaos" Gods I've been able to confirm to exist in the old lore, that I haven't seen you mention. They are minor mentions and they are not specifically called CAPITAL Chaos Gods: * Khakkek * Kka * Mermedus

[@jamesd5842]

I’m a little confused by some of the conclusions here. Thanquol wasn’t calling upon Kweethful in any of these passages and it seems clear that Kweethful was in fact vilified by the GHR. He’s referred to as a blasphemer and is overseeing damned Skaven souls. This doesn’t read as a second Skaven god, but more like a Be’lakor/Lucifer hybrid, who ascended, made a power play and lost, and was then cast down but still a daemon. From there “better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.”

[@Lupusam]

The first of the more modern references makes it clear Kweethul did ascend to godhood, but otherwise I agree it appears that Kweethul was villified and possibly imprisoned by the Great Horned Rat.

[@jamesd5842]

@@Lupusam strictly speaking, yes. But “godhead” doesn’t mean the same thing in Warhammer that it does in the colloquial sense. Any daemon not dependent upon a patron deity is technically a god, but that’s not the same thing as being part of a pantheon. Be’Lakor has a very strong argument of being a god in his own right, and I’d personally say he is one, and certainly has more right to the title than Kweethful (though that’s admittedly my opinion). But he’s not truly a member of the Chaos pantheon - yet. Ascending is only the first step, and possibly the smaller one. Once ascended, you need the following and devotion to elevate you to the next stage. Kweethful, like Be’lakor, doesn’t seem to have truly made that step. Or perhaps a better way to phrase it is yes, he’s a god, but he’s not a greater god like Khorne, Slaanesh, Nurgle, Tzeentch, Ursun, Ulric, or Sigmar

[@oldkingcrow777]

@@jamesd5842 to be fair he does say "another *minor* chaos god" at the very start of the vid

[@kiryukazuma8089]

Sounds like he may be the god that the Skaven view as their devil. So still their second god, but not in the beloved/worshiped sense

[@JZ0UK]

Well seemingly it starts as a Baphomet reference and then evolves to more of a Satan one as he seems to be ruling a skevan hell and is given reviled cognomens as an opposer of the horned rat presumably? Given the 40k developments with Vashtorr maybe GW are going to be more interested in adding god characters...

[@TerrorBlades]

Pointed out the weird insect like head of the Beast to my GF and she pointed out that Skaven are afraid of Insects of giant insects (in relation to your other video). The Relation seams pretty plausible to me!

[@peateargriffin9932]

It seems like Kwee is seen a satan figure for the Skaven, he’s mentioned being in their version of hell. Mayhaps the horned rat instead of destroying him, banished him to their version of hell as a form of eternal punishment

[@dragon200ism]

I hope next with all this talk of forgotten skaven lore we get a video about the horned rat Daemons like the Ratfiend and the Daemonrunt. I think they could totally be brought back, maybe even in Total war to help flush out the verminlords armies or faction more.

[@jeremycorbin2178]

I like the idea that he's more akin to something like a stronger than average Daemon Prince who acquired more power while in the warp by undermining other minor deities and chosen, and that his big rat ego makes him think of himself as a god. Dunno how accurate that could be though

[@aidancampbell5644]

I see Skaven pantheon being very much like the Drow of the Forgotten Realms: one major god who jealously guards their power while minor gods exist off to the side, often converting the power of the major god. Also an interesting idea that springs from this comparison: a Skaven god comparable to Elistree - ie a minor deity trying to reform the Skaven and break them away from the power of the evil god that abuses them.

[@slaughterlord4190]

I could be kind of nice if GW would connect Kweethul with some of the shunned skaven clans like clan Verms, could be interesting

[@zebzai3918]

Kweethul did get a small mention in Warhammer 40k: The End and the Death recently.

[@tristantheis3971]

"Ability to fly" Throat! THROAT! Rat-bats when-when?!

[@InternetMameluq]

8:10: The book actually features tzeenth, as well as the traditional Tzeentchian attributes you're describing already.

[@silverwolf3745]

Nathan it's great to see lore videos back, they're bringing back so many memories.

[@jakedustin5177]

Love Skaven lore. I never knew they had a second god. Great videos.

[@ChaosStruck]

This is pretty interesting they can rewrite this guy to be something of a Daemon prince of skaven

[@LORDOFDORKNESS42]

The idea of a betrayer and trickster so foul that even the SKAVEN will barely curse his name, is REALLY~ interesting.

[@LordOmnissiah]

My head canon is based on the appearance of some of his mounts was that Kweethul was a normal Skaven who became a Verminlord but who then gained some power from Malal, who willing gave him power in order to undermine the Horned Rat. That or Malal got shattered into lesser shards/entities like Nehoco and Zuvassin and Verminlord Kweethul found one of those fragments and absorbed it which elevated him into a lesser deity. At which point he turned on the horned rat.

[@stefvanroey8191]

Stuff like this is great! To many fantasy lore vids retread the same ground over and over again so its cool to hear about stuff that does not get talked about as much.

[@Dustman5917]

Ngl it would be awesome if,for warhammer 3, they created a demonic skaven faction and bring this guy back as a demonic skaven lord with these units for its roster

[@arriasinsanite4886]

really love when you dig up warhammer forgotten history top notch lore content

[@MrNetWraith]

It's interesting to note that the Warhammer Roleplay 2e sourcebook for the Skaven, Children of the Horned Rat, makes reference to the existence of heretical Grey Seers who practice necromancy or turn from the Horned Rat to the worship of Chaos Gods, which could be seen as an oblique reference to Kweethul.

[@OneReallyGrumpyJill]

Won't be surprised if Kweethul just stepped out of the line too far by becoming a minor god, and so Horned Rat is not attempting to erase him. Killing him might be easy, but even acknowledging him might give reason for other Skaven to worship him, so the Horned Rat instead aims to usurp him by taking his name and making sure that all worship will go to him. That seems like a behavior that is in-line with the rats. Love little guys.

[@SpartanOfLight]

Impressive, very nice nice.

[@Wargutz666]

My original copy of Realm of Chaos: The Lost and the Damned is one of my prized possessions. Love all of the short stories and lore scattered throughout the rulebook.

[@yonasshinigami4956]

IMO it seems like every skaven wich is not embraced by the Horned Rat will go to Kweethul to some kind of hell, at least judging by how Thanquol talks/thinks about him. Like the Rat Devil wich betrayed the Rat God to get himself more Power maybe

[@ricardomora9913]

Bring more lore, you know we love when you give more lore videos.

[@moonrock115]

I always thought Kweethul was an ancient Skaven warlord, not a Skaven deity. It’s surprising there would be more than 1 skaven “god” given how much reverence they hold the Great Horned Rat in, with only the Vermin Lords receiving similar worship because they are extensions of the Great Horned Rat

[@thesmilyguyguy9799]

=- D and I NEET A MOD OF HIM

[@TheVergoner]

Thank you. For giving me name idea for my Skaven Clan in AoS.

[@lordmalkus3322]

Can we get a mini series where you cover the minor and forgotten gods of Warhammer?

[@M-CH_]

Fan theory: Kweethul has defected to Malal and then ate him.

[@soccersoma]

You should make a video on the gnome faction of warhammer they seemed really neat

[@thehermitman822]

The Halflings or is there another short race?

[@SicSemperCogitarius]

@@thehermitman822 Don't believe there was ever a tabletop faction, but Gnomes do exist in the lore in the RPG, and were even made playable in a couple of supplements including a recent one for 4th ed. They're supposed to have been distantly related to Dwarfs and highly secretive, owing to some inborn affinity to the magical wind of Shadows.

[@thehermitman822]

@@SicSemperCogitarius hmm. So magically adept Dwarves that lost their hardiness.

[@nakenmil]

Hot take: giving your invented god a last name makes them sound just like another bloke. Either go with mononyms (eg. "Khorne") or titles ("The Horned Rat"). Exception: when the last name feels like it completes a name-phrase (ie. Ahura Mazda or whatever)

[@Marmamartha]

I read from the wiki that it is not even certain that Kweethul the Vile and Kweethul Gristlegut are one and the same. So I am not sure what to think of this video.

[@rickylahey657]

I can see this being changed to a beastmen choas deity and the great horned rat and council of 13 being flushed out and expanded on

[@ziomekszary647]

I love and I need more gods videos

[@jasonsantos3037]

That's lot minor chaos God we do not know about in the lord or a little know about.

[@temmy9]

I always thought kweethul was simply an independant daemon prince who happened to be a skaven when it was nortal

[@liofalba]

Kind of love how in 40k people like Lutin managed to incorporate retcons into the ambiguity of the setting, while for WF it’s like oh this was dumb so they killed it.

[@TerrorBlades]

Holy shit this is so cool!

[@DzinkyDzink]

This is getting out of hand! Now, there are two of them!

[@kharnifex]

Skaven that fly...Pigeons!

[@HomerJSimpson999]

Kweethul could fit with clan Crooktail. so if any modder is out there, you are welcome ;)

[@philmccrack698]

The Thing looks like that new Ash Wastes monster.

[@Sevansmedia]

and we know Tranquil from Shadow of the horned rat

[@SicSemperCogitarius]

Tranquil? Did Nathan mess up another pronunciation?

[@Sevansmedia]

@@SicSemperCogitarius nope, my phone autocorrected Thanquol* was referring to the PS1 game featuring Skaven lead by the grey seer

[@SamBrockmann]

The weird thing is, one would think new chaos gods would attempt to rise up every day. (And those daemons would fail to become gods every day.) But there should be dozens, hundreds, of minor chaos gods, really. And there isn't. Now, I'm not saying GW should stat out or create lore for dozens, hundreds of minor chaos gods. I'm just saying, chaos needs more chaos. The big 4 chaos gods and chaos undivided should still be the focus, but chaos needs a chaotic shakeup.

[@zogwort1522]

Kweethul isn't even a god, he's a daemon prince.

[@tobiashagstrom4168]

Can't say I'm very interested in this guy. He seems to lack any real theme or reason to exist. His name is also a bit too adorable to take seriously. I am not against the idea of more gods, but this guy needs at least an idea of what he does that makes him feel distinct and having a good place. It's a bit of a strange idea still though, given that the Horned Rat is already regarded as the deity of fucking people over, using large numbers, destroying things, magic, plague, sneaking, making machines, making your monsters uglier, etc. So if they're gonna have more gods, what is the reason why they can do something the Horned Rat can't when the Horned Rat already seems to do everything?

[@temmy9]

This guy was created in realm of chaos as an example to show how to use the random tables to create a daemon prince. He wasnt in the skaven pantheon, but rather a normal skaven who ascended.

[@tobiashagstrom4168]

@@temmy9 Sure, but what purpose does he in particular serve in furthering any kind of story or theme, rather than diluting and confusing it?

[@temmy9]

@@tobiashagstrom4168 he didnt serve any purpose. He was just an example of how the game masters could use the random tables to create their own independant daemons for the players to serve.

[@ambustio9807]

@@tobiashagstrom4168 he was created in the time when you the player made stories for Warhammer

[@robbarber7455]

To me, it sounds like the way they refer to Kweethul is similar to Satan in Christian mythology. It would be interesting to see a kind of dualism in Skaven theology, like backstab, but not THAT kind of backstab.

[@laneygo7858]

kweethul = korean word for cricket and his mount looks just like cricket so

[@thehonestaspy102]

What a truly unfortunate name for a god...

[@TheUltrahypnotoad]

Not canon? He is skaven. He is horned. He is the Great Horned Rat.

[@younan5011]

Blasphemy.there is only the one true great horned rat kneel befor the great horned one man thing

[@dd11111]

I'm VERY glad that they removed this from lore. Gods don't have surnames. This thing has a surname. Therefore it is not a god. Why would a god need a family name, they are a unique being, NOTHING is like them, because...they're a god. (actually unique, not just something they tell themselves because they have poor self esteem.)

[@TheGreatBookofGrudges]

Gods don't have surnames? Sigmar Heldenhammer?