Human civilization is facing a meaning crisis | John Vervaeke and Lex Fridman

[@jasonrench2623]

Lex this is you , you have found yourself early in life you just haven't realized it yet. You stand out from everyone else based on your conversation your calmness and willing to be in the conversation and search for everything your doing awesome man you are you the true self . Be one more with natural events.

[@jackiel1013]

Jason Rench - Couldn't agree more. I love you Lex. Wonderful inspiration, humble human being. Also agree - immerse yourself in nature as much as you can.

[@Horsediqdotmpeg]

I've been thinking a lot about the erosion of culture lately and I think it's at the heart of this conversation. There is almost no real life culture beyond work and school now. It's why people are so divided politically. The missing in person experience has created a vacuum of people trying to find it online and mental illness, misinformation and short sided logic runs rampant going unchecked because of it. Most just fall in line to one side or the other and mob mentality takes over. When you get people together all the bullshit tends to vanish or the illness becomes amplified and looks comically childish. It's so weird to think back to the 80's and 90's when absolutely every relationship with another person was completely founded on real life experience aside from maybe a landline call. But even that was more intimate than a call today.

[@ReginaJune]

It was the defunding of the arts in public schools

[@Badkhela]

Its just bad, selfish, stupid adults raising bad selfish stupid children. It all starts at the house.

[@live-soccer]

consumerism pushes the boundaries and it is a trap or loop. it always loads our cognition until we try to release. the span of attention has dropped because too many toys but same amount of human time as before. on other side of fence, for attention of humans in this competition of toys, companies go ultra/marginal. at the end we will be so separated on this wave of trends of our barely feeling tastes, we could even grow to different civilizations. or maybe we will loose the pace, the momentum, testosterone levels are dropping, maybe that is the break, similar ones are suicides, local terrorism and anytype of stab myself just to feel something. BUT humans like apocalyptic stories, while we have never been close to it, so maybe we will figure it out...

[@kaytrout3836]

@@ReginaJune it’s to complex for KZbin comments. But I believe the main ideology behind it is globalism. Chile being a perfect example of rejecting the recent changes to their constitution. They’re pushing back on this virus that’s taking any culture or individuality of people. There’s one approved narrative and anything else is a threat to the system.

[@ReginaJune]

@@kaytrout3836 you can only control 8-11 billion people if you train them to conform… that’s why drugs, weird hair/clothes, feelings, sex, art, music (culture) must be eradicated and considered demeaning to those sensible rule following sheep! ….those ho’s steal all the 80’s punk stuff because they have no imagination to conceive an original thought. Or at least that’s been my personal life experience.

[@johndoe4073]

Love Vervaeke! His series on the meaining crisis is superb!

[@dinismantas7265]

John Vervaeke is a man of exceptional erudition. Also helps that he is also an extremely generous and well meaning person.

[@johndoe4073]

15:15 - "The search for Reality is the most dangerous of all undertakings, for it destroys the world in which you live." - Nisargadatta Maharaj

[@cryptic8043]

At 6:00, Vervaeke is espousing a Heideggerian view of "Being" or God. It is no longer just thinking about Being as an essence under things, but an experience of Being.Heidegger called this type of experience as "Being-At-Hand". Then, you begin to talk about moods of being. Or as Heidegger would say, "Being-In-The-World-Towards-Death", which is supposed to trigger despair, fear, and care in order to know, obtain "wisdom", and know the proper way of "Being-In-The-World" of Dasein. Vervaeke is saying NOTHING original. This is Heidegger, and existienlism's way of getting our of the supposed Platonic/Cartesian world of Ideas or Essence view of Ultimate Reality, or Being/God.

[@OneLine122]

Yes, he is correct. His words are a bit difficult to follow because he made his own probably for technical reasons, but religion is a relationship between the self and the environment. It's a practical wisdom which can only come from other people and from training, not from thoughts or beliefs. And relationships are built through regular attendance. It also in a way creates the environment, and it's in those two ways that it can create meaning. One by shaping the environment, and then making the individual participate in it. It's the last part that is the most important, although the first also is needed obviously. He focus on the latter because it is participatory and overall it is what people miss. So they can't create a consistent self, nor can they find meaning for said self. People should listen to this guy. It's more important than they think.

[@jaslanr]

Well said

[@smokeface7111]

If the US can handle this issue humanly and stay together it would raise the bar worldwide

[@a.liam.v007]

Half the world hates the US 😂 maybe stop dropping bombs and taking resources from other countries?

[@bryanaulisio4164]

Spoiler......we can't and won't....

[@live-soccer]

unfortunately US is capitalism, and everything based on profit. US can't make education free, and have average healthcare, not only it is expensive, quality is also bad. whatever you imagine about US, it has some money "chronicles"...church - tax, hospital - sue, politicians - always promise something about budget, banker this banker that, students - loans, entertainment - kardashians, dan bilzerians, overseas politics - war.. and each side, whether right or left, has its own agenda, their own idea how to do things, rather than not doing it at all... in Europe or most of part of world you can live for weeks without even remembering about money. not in US.. bills, credit cards, subscriptions, budget.... it is like US is most religious country, and as any very religious country it talks about God daily, and it is Money for US.

[@fpep5]

There's no money in the cure

[@enzofrancescoli1260]

With 800 military bases all over the world? Of course it can with coercive force not in any other way.

[@scossar]

Finding meaning through play and movement wasn't where I was expecting this to go :)

[@ReginaJune]

I know. It happens a lot, it’s my favorite thing about Lex. Thoughts are really dynamic and to really think about a particular thing really does take you all sorts of places. I think you do have to talk about 10 things to make the one thing you’re actually focused on solvable.

[@chrisdungca6048]

It is a way to get away from presuppositions and verbal abstraction. I'd go nuts as well if all I had was all talk and no application.

[@ReginaJune]

@@chrisdungca6048 I’m there now. My best “idea” today was if society thinks I should lay in a ditch, maybe I should. I could fix the ditch weed problem like Johnny Appleseed 🤣

[@cryptic8043]

At 6:00, Vervaeke is espousing a Heideggerian view of "Being" or God. It is no longer just thinking about Being as an essence under things, but an experience of Being.Heidegger called this type of experience as "Being-At-Hand". Then, you begin to talk about moods of being. Or as Heidegger would say, "Being-In-The-World-Towards-Death", which is supposed to trigger despair, fear, and care in order to know, obtain "wisdom", and know the proper way of "Being-In-The-World" of Dasein. Vervaeke is saying NOTHING original. This is Heidegger, and existienlism's way of getting our of the supposed Platonic/Cartesian world of Ideas or Essence view of Ultimate Reality, or Being/God.

[@ReginaJune]

@@cryptic8043 is that the concept behind multiverses/dimensions?

[@ibmor7674]

Aww shit, another worthwhile substantive conversation! Lex strikes again.

[@flourishomotola5306]

Yep.

[@jackstorment1988]

True! Lex is wise beyond his years.

[@usmc72409]

Lex can you please have someone on that speaks in depth regarding the benefits of Stoicism. I love the philosophy and have benefited greatly living by it. Between that and the words from Jordan Peterson i have changed my life exponentially for the better.

[@darklich14]

I believe Dr. Vervaeke touches on this from a different perspective in the sorts of belonging and memory and many other terms he describes (loved Lex's laughing about that): meditation/prayer/whateveryouwannacallit, is something deeply profound in religions that I believe often has various stigmas attached to it from nonreligious perspectives. I wonder how this filters in to this schema.

[@arevelation882]

I am not sure if Lex was just tired for this one, but for such a compelling guest that gets to the heart of so much of what Lex seems most interested in philosophically, he didn’t engage in this conversation as I would have expected. It seemed like work for him, or perhaps like he was put off by him. I kept getting the feeling that Lex was being told things he didn’t particularly want to hear. Of course this was only a segment of the entire conversation, but I assume a key part of it. I hope he has him back on.

[@trukxelf]

vervaeke needs some pushback; he acts as if Kant and Hegel didn’t exist, that subjectivity doesn’t determine all these frameworks he posits, that no matter what he terms and perspectives he comes up with, we may be still prisoners of our rational limited perceptions- but that’s ok, as this illusion is the only representation of that which we think is “real”

[@mewimagine5920]

​@@trukxelfcheck out his awaken from the meaning crisis episodes on Kant and Hegel. He details their impact on the development on western cognition and why he goes beyond them. He rejects Kant's conclusions and goes beyond them

[@Badkhela]

I dont think wisdom comes from anywhere external like school or anyone particular. I believe it comes from you from what you see and experience.

[@ColorMatching]

so a baby is wiser than a philosopher?

[@Badkhela]

@@ColorMatching Confucius

[@ColorMatching]

@@Badkhela can you learn from other people's experiences?

[@Badkhela]

Ive already said that, yes.

[@ColorMatching]

@@Badkhela you don't make sense

[@redmoonfilms]

The secular world attempts to extract transcendent meaning, without usurping the self, which is practically impossible, if the highest standard you regard is the self. You leave no humility to be open to wisdom. This is what I believe is the difference he speaks of between those of religious and non-religious persons.

[@FalseCogs]

I too was surprised that separate versus greater self was not established. It seems the meaning was left to self-concept, which would include things like role and identity; but I noticed no mention that the self-concept can be expanded to include everything, so as to release the burden of identifying with something impermanent.

[@watercave4905]

BINGO

[@brianbrennan5600]

I'd love to see how the study he mentioned defined and quantified wisdom. What are the units? What about mutuallu exclusive concepts that two parties consider wise?

[@jamesruscheinski8602]

Christ ministry of forgiveness overcomes sin, resurrection overcomes death from human rule

[@Nathan-bp2zx]

We stopped doing everything for ourselves. Things like making pottery and hunting and there is meaning in a life that's SUPPOSED to be hard. We became comfortable in our surroundings. That's one of our problems imo

[@patrickconnor2913]

Do unto others as you would have others do unto you.

[@AndogaSpock]

"It doesn't matter!" That's all the wisdom you will ever need.

[@Travis-no3wh]

Experience alone does not create wisdom. Wisdom= Experience +reflection +time

[@freethinker79]

"Those who have not known themselves have known nothing, but those who have known themselves already have acquired knowledge about the depth of The All." --Book of Thomas the Contender (NHL, Gnostic Text)

[@hearithere.2603]

As a 24/7 mom, I can tell you that i passed on knowledge and understanding to my children from morning to night. My mother did the same with me and my grandmother with her. I can’t help but wonder. Was this merely an accumulation of knowledge or were there ways of connecting that knowledge that promotes wisdom?

[@andrewternet8370]

Yeah, it's called liturgy.

[@mchapman2424]

This is where I come for wisdom. There is an abundance of sources of wisdom on youtube like Lex, Joe, Duncan, ect... And I dont think theres anything wrong with that.

[@timetravlin4450]

All subjective

[@carlmller4769]

@@timetravlin4450 that's the point

[@timetravlin4450]

@@carlmller4769 that’s the problem there’s no grounding in right or wrong. Morality is a fiction. We pretend that just because you live in a certain location something is actually right or wrong but it’s all fake . If God doesn’t exist you have your way I have my way but the right way does not exist. Morality is not reality if God doesn’t exist. Wisdom doesn’t exist you’d have to assume there’s such thing as an objective good for wisdom to be attainable

[@hking1009]

@@timetravlin4450 if wisdom is unattainable why are you quoting Nietzsche? Typically people only quote people they believe to possess wisdom

[@timetravlin4450]

@@hking1009 if God doesn’t exist wisdom doesn’t exist either. There is no right or wrong nor good or evil if God doesn’t exist. We are trying to remove God but keep wisdom and morality but that leaves it to the subject making both of those things not objectively true. I love Nietzsche for the reality he sees if God does not exist. But I see his reasons for more reasons to support God rather than throw Him away.

[@Daneiladams555]

wisdom comes from within

[@jaslanr]

We need to gather and do shit

[@meeksthessj4]

Lex, please get David Goggins on your podcast, he’s closer to understanding life than many scholars out there.

[@nsc2443]

It's not about meaning of life. It's about understanding yourself and accepting who you are. Understanding ourselves as human beings, but we hardly even know why our thoughts happen.

[@timetravlin4450]

What are you? Know who you are? lol Tell that to a psychopath. There’s no grounding to right or wrong. You have your way I have my way but the right way does not exist.

[@ReginaJune]

How do you know who you are? Is it just a matter of being born. I used to see people driving shitmobiles that were once expensive beautiful German cars that were meant for the Audubon! I tear things down to build them back up again - better

[@tutupuff6359]

“It’s a wisdom famine”

[@carefulcarpenter]

Not a lack of wisdom, but a need to ignore meaning and experience.

[@samn8309]

Sincere embodied man is Vervaeke.

[@anab0lic]

Honestly, one of the best things you can do to really understand what matters most in life is to study the wisdom and philosophy of the ancients Greeks like Socrates, Plato and Aristotle. If you don't have time to deep dive into their writings, then at the very least visit some KZbin channels here on this platform to get a general idea of their wisdom on life. People think that because they are from thousands of years ago, they are no longer relevant, you could not be more wrong, these great minds of the past understood life on a much deeper level than most so called experts of today and their teachings are something that our modern day society as whole is in desperate need of a greater understanding of....

[@ReginaJune]

I would like to suggest an additional approach: eat well, get comfortable, probably outside like the Greeks (that was good) and just think about what the best parts of the world, yourself and the people are around you are and just amplify THAT - there won’t be much tolerance or inspiration for fuckery. Maybe I should be skanky yoda for Halloween? 💀👻🎃

[@cryptic8043]

At 6:00, Vervaeke is espousing a Heideggerian view of "Being" or God. It is no longer just thinking about Being as an essence under things, but an experience of Being.Heidegger called this type of experience as "Being-At-Hand". Then, you begin to talk about moods of being. Or as Heidegger would say, "Being-In-The-World-Towards-Death", which is supposed to trigger despair, fear, and care in order to know, obtain "wisdom", and know the proper way of "Being-In-The-World" of Dasein. Vervaeke is saying NOTHING original. This is Heidegger, and existienlism's way of getting our of the supposed Platonic/Cartesian world of Ideas or Essence view of Ultimate Reality, or Being/God.

[@MilkShake]

This guy is brillient! Thanks 👌

[@raybonin8032]

Lex is the best

[@notbob8252]

My religious (Warhammer 40K) I think he had more accurately describes the world than almost anything I've ever read

[@jeffcameron5145]

"which question? I already forgot everything." lol

[@jackstorment1988]

Exactly

[@ThePermacultureStudent]

Play the guitar with your left hand and see - it's WILD. It feels so bizarre ;) I know someone who swore by it for balancing their back and shoulders (an issue for bass players).

[@tybrownlow1689]

Lex is so phenomenally prepared for this conversation.

[@zootsoot2006]

Is he drunk in this one?

[@tobias7716]

The Miracle of being

[@DonClark]

@18:56 - rays kellys involvment in play "return to the source"? Searched the description/comments, could not find anything. I did a search for the photo but no match was found. Evolve, move, play on the shirt in the photo. Anyone know who/what they are talking about?

[@james.sirois]

I am writing a book called "Infinity Limited", in which I address the crisis of meaning with a solution. It is a book that describes three things: That existence and nothingness co-exist, that Infinity is the absolute truth and that paradoxes are the key for consciousness to understand this. I believe a framework for understanding truth is important because it can be used to foster new ways to achieve morality, purpose, and meaning; It may become a foundation for humanity to unite under a new mythos, essentially.

[@xxxs8309]

Impressive guest

[@esnaw007]

At the point where he touches on the experience of using either his right or left hand, it reminded me of Ian McGillchrist's book Master and His Emissary. I wonder if he's read it.

[@vanderlubbe7791]

Some of this is about the rise of British common law (when business, money making, and general secularism arose in the emergent complexity of the British empire, the Chinese, the egyptians, etc, who all had their own systems in emergence) and it's basis in being human and having this generally unrealized underlying structure/form. And how critical it is to functional humane systems of living in this reality. Where other systems, or overlays in some cases, like organized religion, capitalism, Marxism, communism, totalitarianism, etc... are knowingly inserted replacements/corruptions/alternates that either alter or take charge of such fundamentals and twist them for the purpose of power and control for the given system of oligarchy that is darkly congruent with said witnessed system. This is chicken and egg territory, as logic and reason tend to rise in a cross fed parallel, so which system came first is debatable, ie the rise of common reason & structure coming out of religion. (this is an off-the-cuff incomplete statement, BTW, so don't go chastising me for missing any points that I well know but could not cover without writing an entire book here...)

[@owentaylor5622]

British empiricism was a stable foundational system but a directionless one- John Seeley said the UK "conquered and peopled half the world in a fit of absence of mind" i.e there was no grand moral narrative like that of marxism, nazism or religion to her empire. This is both good and bad- it is not against but it is also not for you- so one must build their own narrative on top of it

[@cryptic8043]

At 6:00, Vervaeke is espousing a Heideggerian view of "Being" or God. It is no longer just thinking about Being as an essence under things, but an experience of Being.Heidegger called this type of experience as "Being-At-Hand". Then, you begin to talk about moods of being. Or as Heidegger would say, "Being-In-The-World-Towards-Death", which is supposed to trigger despair, fear, and care in order to know, obtain "wisdom", and know the proper way of "Being-In-The-World" of Dasein. Vervaeke is saying NOTHING original. This is Heidegger, and existienlism's way of getting our of the supposed Platonic/Cartesian world of Ideas or Essence view of Ultimate Reality, or Being/God.

[@n2the1]

@@cryptic8043 I think this is what someone else I know is saying. He has read Heidegger deeply. I've only read bits of Being and Time, so far. But my question is, even if Vervaeke is saying the same thing, if it gets through to more people isn't it a good thing? Perhapa Vervaeke is putting Heidegger's ideas into language more people can understand.

[@cryptic8043]

@@n2the1 Heidegger's ideas are not that great. Since, it reduces it self to mystical non-sense. Heidegger was on to something in terms of the deconstruction or hermeneutics of the term Being, and gave rise to the linguistic turn in philosophy of language. But, apart from that, Heidegger's philosophy is a low key return to paganism disguised under Christian concepts of philosophy.

[@codyrasco7265]

Humility.

[@reneevanelli1571]

Wisdom is not a process it:s an achievement.

[@slyspy333]

is it wise to believe You have achieved wisdom?

[@adelinaquijano1083]

I respect myself and my community

[@muumarlin1731]

Yes, finally I hear someone talking about this! We're in wisdom-starvation mode. "Wisdom isn't optional"

[@Sheepfollower]

Big fan of your content. What Joe R used to be.

[@carefulcarpenter]

_Synchronistic mathematics_ is a truth system that challenges the separation of: philosophy, science, religion. 👀🐡🌾🌿

[@Pixelarter]

I believe the modern sources of wisdom come from art, media and entertainment. Movies, songs, books, games, KZbin channels like this one, etc... condense some forms of wisdom teachings in their stories and the induced inner reflections they cause on us. We get wiser learning from the thinking other people had, through their crafted narratives, stories, speeches, and arts. In the old times religion filled that void. Now we have alternatives. In my view, what religion has that we are struggling to find in a more secular world is the sense of belonging. It's not lack of wisdom, it's lack of the sense of belonging. Joining groups and communities, like the martial arts groups, groups of mindfulness practices, etc... solves just that. People that share some point of view and intimately get together feel connected. Life in big cities lost the contact with core small communities that used to fill that void.

[@darthnihilus511]

The strength of this country has always been in direct proportion to it’s relationship with God.

[@bodyclockcoach3367]

Lex, be a learner not a judger, ask with curiosity not with aggression

[@alanconlan8337]

"What is the purpose of this life? For what are we in being? Its cause may be a wholesome one But its purpose is unseen." These are words I wrote when I was a student In the 1960s. At that time there was a knowing within me that the answer would eventually come. And it did, many many years later. Hence, my books BEING IN THE NOW and NOW IS LIFE. The search for meaning is a worldly pursuit, whereas wisdom is not.

[@jasonrench2623]

To me I think I found my wisdom within mostly in search of answers for questions that didn't have a good enough answer in my opinion so I basically took it upon myself to be aware of my surroundings and use my own judgement and curiosity to make my own opinion no matter what popular beliefs are I tend to try to find the most logical and the most impossible aspects of everything. To believe in impossible and to use a basic common since to make judgement of things.well that's how I'm going about my path to truth and it works for me . Liked what you said figured I'd respond a bit. ✌️

[@aronbijl4109]

@@jasonrench2623 Same here. I started my search for deep knowledge or truth when I was 10 and found wisdom.

[@jasonrench2623]

@@aronbijl4109 was it curiosity or a different reason or is it we all start this process at a young age I didn't find my talent until I was in my 40 s because all I did was work I never knew what I was good at till now. It's a shame it took me so long honest.

[@aronbijl4109]

@@jasonrench2623 It was pure curiosity. A deep desire. It was probably because of what the teacher said, something along the lines of: "You will know when you are an adult" ... What it exactly was about I don't know. I wanted to know, not when I was an adult, but back then. So my search begone.

[@jasonrench2623]

@@aronbijl4109 I see everything as a pattern of events that are connected to each other . Art, music, our creative nature seems to connect all of us together. I feel that language grows like we do and can be viewed like a living thing as well as thought. As if we are all 1 thought and the reason it's so hard to visualize or explain to someone who hasn't experienced this is because it's so complicated of a design of description using words to describe our experience is very difficult possible with some things but our description of what pattern we see in this form is almost is impossible to believe but once viewed is almost impossible to explain with speaking. Extremely difficult to explain with words so I use my art. A picture is worth a thousand words this helps me describe my view of what is real hard to believe And understand. This is why it takes a life time to become wise is the complexity of everything as 1 universal thought and connection to every event in time you can relate to me because technically our subconscious is 1 persons our subconscious thought is as if all of us together. Or to me it is this way as I grow in search for what is ,this is this. That is this . The reality of Realistic Realness

[@isadoradoug]

A basic functionality of religion is bringing a group of people together on a regular basis to participate in rituals that are older than they are. It is this experience that we have lost as our society has changed faster than we can keep up, as individuals move away from where they were born and how we now have invisible relationships with people all over the globe who make all of our stuff. We are surrounded by things created by people we never met from the fillings in our teeth to our clothes, the chair, the roof over our heads and the food we buy in the grocery store. These relationships are now invisible and seem to be part of the natural environment rather than the work of other people. We have a foreboding sense that this set of relationships are about to fall apart and that we will go hungry.

[@tile-maker4962]

I don't think people have a meaning crisis. I think people are starting to realize that having meaning is a burden. I think this is what the sages of old knew. Them knowing we input meaning in our lives takes away from the fundamental human experience. So I think wisdom is simply accumulated experience in time. In Daoism, the greatest path is never walked for the journey is the destination.

[@FalseCogs]

It seems that meaning and connection were treated almost as one thing. I agree that meaning is a burden. Any concept or framework held onto is an attachment, which naturally burdens us and restricts our flow. Connection is lower-level, less conceptual, more emotional. As long as we avoid becoming too attached, connection should not be too big a problem. Naturally the safest connection is the most permanent; so opening up to become one with everything can help. Without a separate self, there is less to lose and more to live.

[@tile-maker4962]

@@FalseCogs On average given the expanse of time, connection dissipates. Connection implies a temporal property of something existing. There is a mantra in Hinduism "Tat twam asi", I am that. It transforms connection into being. In Daoism they call this fundamental force "Fan" or returning. In science, it is called positive entropy. In the end, everything becomes maximally disconnected but have a max probability of temporal convergence.

[@FalseCogs]

@@tile-maker4962 The connection I had in mind was the emotional sense of belonging, or being part of something. On the physics side, if we view time as the 4th dimension of 4D spacetime, then each individual body could be viewed as a tentacle of the 4th dimension. All tentacles presumably lead back to the source. As such, there is only one being. The separation from entropy is only meaningful from the ego's perspective. The ego is basically the tentacle's way of truncating itself -- the dream of separation. Everything arises together, in many-pointed causal play. And everything may well return physically. But it was never truly separate anyway, as all serves one being, with no true autonomy.

[@tile-maker4962]

@@FalseCogs I apologies, I didn't mean to say disconnected. I meant to say deconvergence or diffusion or "spread out".

[@FalseCogs]

@@tile-maker4962 No worries. How I understand thus far, with time each separate being diffuses into existence like a river into the sea, thereby converging on the eternal timeframe. In other words, we lose our "selves" and gain our Self.

[@capone1754]

The split he’s referring to is consciousness, he just doesn’t know it yet but I’m going to prove it👁👁

[@justinbyrge8997]

I made 3 playlists that are meant to be watched like a movie trilogy. Given the nature of this episode I think you should check it out and watch them. Think of it like my answer to all the wisdom tradition and religious questions you posed. Here you go: Slavery, Emancipation, and a Big Gun Book 1 OT kzbin.info/aero/PL7bUz1yZb57014KUE3sVG3djcXhularKu Book 2 NT kzbin.info/aero/PL7bUz1yZb5730RhQJNzRSgjlTAKHLI6OC Book 3 Revelation kzbin.info/aero/PL7bUz1yZb570Ylvs5mPli2lyqv4XbRAGs

[@stevenquintanillaXYZ]

The functionality he's discussing has to do with the emotional resources provided from organized communities. Leaving the religion often times means losing the community, and it's the community itself that is providing the most value within and without.

[@lusiusgregoriusquietus1733]

You mean "emotional support" I guess? "Emotional resources" is a meaningless expression in this context, unless you mean it as a shorthand for "the potential of obtaining emotional support from the community as a resource", but that's not a good use of language, unless you've explained it or it is commonly explained as such beforehand.

[@derrybrooks7197]

Please have dr William lane Craig on

[@freethinker79]

"Heed these words, you who wish to probe the depths of Nature: If you do not find within your Self that which you seek, neither will you find it outside. If you ignore the wonders of your own House, how do you expect to find other wonders? In you is hidden the Treasure of Treasures. Know Thyself and you will know the Universe and the Gods." --Oracle of Delphi

[@scottlarock7924]

Great conversation. Isn't it also interesting that oat milk and goat milk got popular at the same time?

[@Miketar2424]

That might have something to do with Aristotle and Alexander the Great's Empire breaking up.

[@xenaluck]

oat milk and goat milk has always been popular, depends where you hangout. it's a wide world baby.

[@scottlarock7924]

@@xenaluck Thanks for the info.

[@eastudio-K]

I am sensing a Jonathan Pageau interview next

[@prithvirajgawande6150]

Lex smart. Lex asks cool question.

[@Jana-jg5ob]

9:00 syntax error 😅

[@flipflop6525]

Astrology works. That's one thing we are missing. To the doubters, pay attention to it for a while. Took me about ten years to be convinced. Too bad it's been exploited in the manner it has, but think about psychedelics and how they were exploited/marketed. Timothy Leary, back in the mid 60's said, " Use LSD now. They will lose their power once integrated into society." Something like that. The same thing happened to astrology during the Scientific Revolution of the 1700s.

[@williamstevens7934]

Bravo!

[@kenzen3564]

We need a total meaning crisis if we are to create new ones that actually mean something..

[@usmc72409]

What makes following religion more functional than following philosophies that focus on a moral code such as Stoicism or existentialism when it comes to wisdom?

[@pearlsforswine9624]

Nothing

[@OneLine122]

Those are propositional, they don't address the problem. What you call moral codes are simply laws. We have plenty of laws already. What we don't have is a way to participate in the world in a meaningful way. Like take an example. I can say: "don't kill people". That's just a proposition. It's meaningless. Now if I show you how to live without killing people and make sure it is possible, it's a totally different story. I can tell you not to be a fireman. But if it is the only job in town, you will be a fireman. If I teach you to be a fisherman, then you might do just that since it's better than be a fireman which is illegal. Or I can put a bunch of books of medicine before you, if you never saw a scalpel, you won't be able to do surgery. That's the difference. Propositional is fantasy, religion is functional. Usually you get both as a package, but he wants a religion without proposition, which might be difficult, but maybe. I just don't see it as plausible. It will just end up being another spirituality, which is decent enough for a self, not for society.

[@usmc72409]

@@OneLine122 ty for ur response. are u familiar with Stoicism? Bc i would think cosmopolitanism focuses on society as well. Stoicism is def about being your best self. However that extends out to society. Also the moral code is filtered thru the 4 virtues, wisdom, courage, temperance and justice. These are applied to morals/values such as honesty, integrity, empathy etc. In the video he even references Stoicism as a grey line 15:28. Which makes me believe its close to religion. They didn’t speak in too much detail about it unfortunately. Stoicism for me has helped me find the meaning in life. It has set me on a path i am now proud of and maybe it is a hole i was trying to fill due to lack of religion but it has filled the hole well. Or so i think. This is the reason for my question. I believe it def extends out to society.

[@pearlsforswine9624]

@@OneLine122 Stoicism is all about operating in the world in a meaningful way

[@usmc72409]

@@pearlsforswine9624 ive only heard one argument that points out a difference btwn the 2. There is no church, temple etc to congregate. I just couldn’t figure out why congregating would make such a difference as long as u are involved with ur community in some way that is meaningful to others which in turn benefits urself. Does this mean all religions fill the same purpose? If so why couldn’t Stoicism fill that purpose? If all religions cannot fill that purpose then how would one, who is not religious, know which religion is correct in their teachings of God? These are more rhetorical questions bc it appears u think about Stoicism the same way i do.

[@noahchapman253]

This shit goes crazy when you’re high

[@vanderlubbe7791]

Most importantly, Lex, it can be seen that is sort of conversation, about components of structure, are required to be known and integrated, when attempting to create functional AI systems. AI systems that are hopefully, if well based, can be good for humanity, instead of the opposite. However, the power of such things to wreak havoc in the world are then seen more clearly and maybe the pitfalls might be more avoidable.

[@ReginaJune]

Left hand vs right hand, both hands, no hands or someone or something else’s “hands” = Adaptation?

[@rdy5244]

VERVAEKE 🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌

[@vincecallagher7636]

When were we not in an identity crisis?

[@bradmodd7856]

Not since we were early apes, even then there must have been a few of us struggling with meaning...otherwise how would we have become meaning-filled beings?

[@newagain9964]

@@bradmodd7856 c’mon man. This is a western problem. Stop projecting and being hyperbolic.

[@sky.the.infinite]

500 years ago, most people were illiterate. They would have likely pointed to either priests/monks or cunning/healing people, what you might call a Medicine Man or Woman. This is a great discussion though.

[@timflelter5566]

Not all healing people are frauds. Theres been many studies on energy healing (and to a lesser extent shamanistic healing) and the evidence shows that they work.

[@sky.the.infinite]

@@pulse3554 For sure, I particularly meant ‘common/poor’ people. Which would be applicable worldwide at that time. Being Native American, and growing up in extreme poverty, I had poor and indigenous common people in mind, but I understand what you mean.

[@sky.the.infinite]

@@timflelter5566 when did anyone say “all healing people are frauds”? 🤔

[@goldenbough6563]

love this shit. Dig your roll, Lex. Best interviewer in the cosmos. If aliens ever land, you're the guy we're going to send in to talk to them.

[@esser7678]

yooo this is cool af

[@vebnew]

James 1:5

[@martindembek9833]

Let me explain Religion regardless of which religion we are dealing with gives you the answer to your problems regardless how abstract they're are we can call up god and he got all the answers he helps us to bare our problems and deal with pain and sorrow through religion we explain the world to ourself

[@1718bb]

Great clip. The danger in our abandonment of the traditional religions is that other religions will rise to replace them, and the new religions won't have the millennia of accumulated wisdom that the traditional ones have, and the new ones may very well be destructive or even "evil".

[@erichvonmolder9310]

I'm spiritual too. Meaning: the answers lie inside you, not "out there" in some item, technology, political ideology or person, right here right now. You just have to know how to access it, whether that is through psychedelics (I haven't done that), meditation, being positive and not judgmental, looking for ET's, nature, contacting your spirit guides/angels/ancestors/God and alternative history lines. Achieving higher consciousness, to rise above the bullsh** of primitive human behavior. It is a difficult thing to do, especially if you are surrounded by some people who don't care about you and view you as just another cog in the machine.

[@timetravlin4450]

What a load of nonsense. You don’t ask yourself for truth. Not everyone seeks being nonjudgmental you live in subjectivness with nothing objective to ground your subjective morality. No one can agree on everything. What makes your view correct?

[@erichvonmolder9310]

@@timetravlin4450 , I have no idea what makes my views correct or even somewhat correct, it is up to you to find your own way through primitive human life.

[@vs6536]

@@erichvonmolder9310 Thats a dangerous path. Are psychopaths wrong for killing people? If they truly believe its okay. Applying your logic that would be okay, since the answer is found inside of them.

[@erichvonmolder9310]

@@vs6536 , are they wrong to kill, sure, but from there point of view, no. Is there a spark inside them that wants to transcend killing, I don't know.

[@vs6536]

@@erichvonmolder9310 why are they wrong to kill? Truth is found inside.

[@titrecords2294]

It’s the higher self! Like how do you reach for a higher self when you blew out the stairs?? We are trying to rebuild the stairs. I totally agree religion serves a process, now we need a new kind of religion.

[@Neeon1188]

I believe the root of this "meaning" crisis is a hubris issue. Everyone knows how available religious texts are nowadays but no one wants to read it and take the time to understand it by living as if there is a God is fundamental to a meaningful life. God could be anything. It's up to you how you see God. A feeling, a person, a passion etc... The scriptures are stories of different examples of people living a meaningful life.

[@kenwahler3277]

I think its more of a problem in the west.

[@newagain9964]

BIG FAX. But the west is always projecting (and invading and rigging other nations policial economic systems).

[@marcyc7475]

i think it also has to do with the rise of witchcraft, paganism, astrology, tarot etc in the west ... and i would even say fantasy fiction /comic superheros... it is very common though to mix these to create a sense of ritual through practices which are 'nature' based. I guess you can say it is part of the wokism movement, but it might be a lot more than that - people looking for spirituality and wisdom outside a patriarchal & dogmatic system that would allow them to practice self development & reconnect with nature. one where they can mix and match, to create individualistic paths & practices. there are gurus and psychics and priestesses, but my feeling is they tend to fall into commercialization on instagram, youtube etc. You can make the case that not all of them are genuine, deep and are out to steal money and gain power over a community - but you could just as easily say that for priests & psychologists. that being said, maybe it's not exactly a wrong direction.... though i do feel people are in general starving for just people to listen to them and offer them some sincere, reflective advice, like a good friend or relative would... or even a stranger on a plane. Maybe we need to work on our relationships more in that sense? would be interested to know what anyone thinks .

[@marcusperry9481]

"Wisdom" is mentioned in 222 verses of the King James Version of The Bible. #theology

[@timetravlin4450]

There is no right or wrong without a God. Just chaos.

[@richardc861]

Would humanity have made it this far without believing in a God/religion....I doubt it. It’s only a matter of time and patience before chaos ends humanity.

[@jonhylow1239]

If so, it is self-made, just like most problems.

[@omri9982]

Not sure if all of human civilization, but definitely Western civilization

[@robwaldram532]

First! Have a great life everyone!

[@DarkPhantomSky]

Really interesting and though provoking take by him/you and the commenters here as well. I'll reiterate my two cents briefly: - We're too much focused on ourselves/in our own heads and fantasies, bubbles. - We live in a way that's fake/non-sustainable/that is full of lies/disconnected from reality. - In the process we slowly destroy ourselves and our natural foundation for life and survival. - Why? Because we never learnt how to work together in large groups and value the survival of the group higher than the individual. - It was never necessary until we got too 'powerful' and 'plentiful' a couple hundred years ago. - Now, we need a shared plan and understanding or everything will be lost. - The point is to work together, to unite. Across the globe. It's our only hope.

[@newagain9964]

“We”? Do you have multiple personalities or something?

[@mofo888]

This was excellent.

[@joesummer]

Philosophy- the love of wisdom There is no religion higher than truth All just different translations of truth for different cultures & contexts Our society is based on the Greeks work .. Platos the republic ,democracy,Medicine,science ,art ,music,dram,theatre,literature, Pythagoras,Aristotle ,aquinas, then bacon,descartes,newton,Darwin etc etc Who all came from a religious philosophical background Myth is for the masses ,the mysteries are revealed to those who study them But western civilisation is based on Greek principles & philosophy & those of the bible & its many disputed translations or the Talmud etc It all goes back to core principles that are the basis of our societies Law ,economics,politics & the philosophies & psychologys behind them Reconfigured & recontextualised reinterpreted & rehashed a million different ways

[@andrewsutherland133]

This actually sounds like a mid-20th century dystopian novel

[@adelinaquijano1083]

I keep silence.

[@astroboy3002]

Word salad

[@sulfereyes666]

What is the thing that is lost without religious text: control! Bc they don't have control on your thoughts or emotions, so now you must obviously be lost... nope, I'm just not a sheeple.

[@alejandrinahs]

05:01 Search the statue of St. Bartholomew in Milan to find the depth of application by a disciple of religion. The ‘wisdom famine’ may derive from the lack of appreciation in the investment made by past civilizations to sustain and advance the beauty we behold today. The statue of St. Bartholomew’s martyrdom is a singular depiction of the community inherited and honored daily within Catholicism. History shows the efforts of empires, corporations, and societies to overtake Christianity. The functionality of religion as a prevalent ecological practice is the conditions the wisdom of reality is acquired under: dehumanizing, or/and prosecution. The outcomes in Christian teachings repeat. Edit: LOTR as a cultural support references King, prophet, and priest.

[@bayreuth79]

Lex Fridman's STEM arrogance: philosophers are ink spillers. Really? There is philosophy involved even in science because there is no scientific fact that is not already an interpreted fact and we interpret those facts in relation to out explicit or implicit worldviews, which are philosophical through and through.

[@martindembek9833]

People dealt with their problems through the lense of religion Now they don't have that

[@TH.417]

Nietzsche predicted this

[@smartbart80]

Humans evolved thanks to the capacity to adapt to the point where we started changing the environment around us which differentiates us from lower species and animals, so to propose that a pre civilization and pre technology framework of thinking offers benefits is ridiculous. Humans persist because new generations change and adjust the culture to the needs of today. Outdated books are literature at best.

[@nikthough3110]

Rate of evolution !== Rate of technology

[@gentlemantramp7528]

On the contrary, technology _accumulates_ across generations, amplifying power and creating novel problems that shift the goalposts of reason like wind upon desert sands. However, the wisdom to manage it responsibly _starts from scratch_ each time a new baby is born. "The orthodox and the unorthodox give rise to each other like a beginningless circle. Who could exhaust them?" ~Sun Tzu

[@gentlemantramp7528]

Literature, at best? The literary canon, in which the best ideas withstand the test of time, is the continuation of a project that begins with the first cave paintings and constitutes the counsel of the ancestors, without which we are aimless wanderers in a technological labyrinth of our own making, without past or future.