Official Announcements: George R.R. Martin Shames Game of Thrones' Writers David & Dan! (HBO)

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Welcome back for another A Song of Ice and Fire and Game of Thrones season 8 update video. In this video, I will be talking about George R.R. Martin's former relationship with Game of Thrones writers, David Benioff and D.B. Weiss. What is the real reason why they stopped working together after the 4th season of Game of Thrones? Why did George R.R. Martin stop talking about Game of Thrones, while it was the biggest show on television? Why did George R.R. Martin beg an HBO executive to make 10 seasons of Game of Thrones? Why does he no longer talk about the show that changed his life so much? Why has he thrown subtle jabs at them since leaving the show? Let's explore this a little bit in this video. Let me know your thoughts down below. Thanks for watching!
Images and video clips from Game of Thrones and House of the Dragon are property of their creators, used here under fair use.
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[@TalkingThrones]

The first 100 people to use code TALKINGTHRONES at the link below will get 60% off of Incogni: incogni.com/talkingthrones

[@FirCorred]

Okay - cause it's you. This sponsor of yours, do you really trust them? I don't have a much internet presence, but I'm not blind either and I know every search is recorded somewhere, just for starters. And sometimes, in the heat of a conversation on KZbin, snips of personal info make their way into the system. I have no social media activity at all, unless you count YT, no real internet presence, don't have a homepage, channel, blog or anything like it. Would you still suggest I use Incogni and have them clean up after me? I've known you from your channel since you started, so I'm asking for your honest opinion. And I'm very sorry and upset to hear that you had identity theft issues - these are hellish and extremely hard to deal with, if you succeed permanently at all. I hope you're free of this for good now!

[@pushista9322]

In order to remove your sensitive data from the Internet sites you need to send your sensitive data to an Internet site. Sounds like a plan!

[@fairdose]

Dan and Dave got an offer to work on the Star Wars franchise and that's when D&D decided to ditch GoT and end it as quickly as possible. They basically got greedy and impatient. That's when the writing on GoT took a nosedive and the ending pissed off everyone. Oh, and because GoT ended so badly, Lucasfilm then withdrew their offer to D&D so both of them ended up with nothing.

[@JuicebyJay]

The sweetest karma. Any idea if they've worked on anything since GoT?

[@malirabbit6228]

@@JuicebyJay hopefully they’re working on their cars which are sitting on cinder blocks in their driveways!

[@zakunick1]

The thing is, they could have just stayed on as producers and left to do Star Wars while someone else ran with GoT.

[@StormtrooperYD]

Hope they never get work again

[@quetzalcahualchapman5439]

GOOD. F### Those Hacks!

[@thelasthero3677]

If we as fans hated the last season, just imagine how much George as the creator hated it

[@MarcusM334]

Who cares it’s his fault..he should have finished the books

[@spirittammyk]

@@MarcusM334 Yep, I agree.

[@kermitdfrog1511]

I liked s8 and know a lot of other book fans who loved it too. Really only the twitter mob hated it

[@taylordixon6850]

Then why he didn’t say anything when he saw them destroying his masterpiece

[@poffegy]

@@kermitdfrog1511d&d we know this is ur alt account

[@ricktheexplorer]

I am glad to hear GRRM didn't like the last season any more than I did.

[@Se7eNBlack]

*GRRM 😂

[@ricktheexplorer]

@@Se7eNBlack Haha ok thanks, I will correct it.

[@redscorpion9325]

Last Season was trash

[@krispy3790]

idk why he didn’t write it himself

[@firemaster9994]

At least they made a last season. Martin can't get there himself

[@vh8542]

HBO should have fired Dan and Dave the moment they started pushing for shorter seasons and episode counts. Hopefully they don't allow something like that to happen again. If you are arguing for that, then your heart clearly isn't in it anymore.

[@TalkingThrones]

They should have willingly handed it off to someone else if they truly loved the story and cared about it as much as they once claimed.

[@HnF128]

It's because George sold the the show rights to Dan and Dave instead of a specific studio. He thought it would be better that way. Obviously, he was wrong...

[@DivertingTales]

@@TalkingThrones If GRR Martin loved and cared for his story he would have finished it in time instead of getting distracted and impatient while at the same time wanting the show to finish his job

[@vh8542]

@@HnF128 Oh I didn't know that he sold it to them. But HBO picked it up so I'm curious as to what they could have done besides just cancelling it?

[@jeffalver2047]

I hope HOTD will have a great ending than GOT now that D&D is not involved

[@happybee7725]

George said there was plenty of material for more seasons but david and dan “wanted a life” and to do other things. Fair enough. Well and good. Then go have your life and do other things and let someone else continue with the extra seasons. Their attitude towards it seemed awfully selfish to me.

[@jaycee2070]

Not selfish, it was spiteful.

[@spirittammyk]

And maybe D&D wanted GRRM to finish the books much like JK Rowling finished hers and all leave on a happy note.

[@sierrabird3817]

⁠@@spirittammykthat makes no kind of sense. They approached GRRM when it was an unfinished series with huge time gaps between published works. It’s more on them than George for how they handled the Tv show. I get you and other “fans “are butthurt but blaming George for how the show turned out is misplaced anger. He’s always been a slow writer, expecting differently is just a set up for disappointment

[@barbaramarshall6626]

Hbo had their pick of the best writers in Hollywood to jump in and pick up the show anytime Dan and Dave wanted to step away. There is no writer in Hollywood who would not have jumped at the chance if their agent said Game of Thrones is looking for writers. What happened with the show was really unfair to George, the fans, and the cast and crew. Such a bummer.

[@happybee7725]

@@barbaramarshall6626 Very true.

[@PhotoTrekr]

Sounds like D&D started to believe they were responsible for the success of the show and thought they didn't need GRRM. And, of course, their own hubris resulted not only in their downfall but the downfall of the show as well.

[@ACinemafanatic]

They were arrogant and thought they knew how the story should go in their minds

[@whitedragoness23]

I do wonder if they became too arrogant as they did change quite a bit from the orignal story

[@BeteBlanc]

Every time I hear a promise for the last two books I kinda feel like Theon in his cell. You want to hear the words, but you know you can't trust them.

[@ContactsNfilters]

You mean Reek?

[@b_d_games]

YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER YOUR NAME

[@donna25871]

Interesting that GOT started going downhill once GRRM was out of the loop.

[@TalkingThrones]

Funny how that works

[@JoVicttor49]

It begs the question: did he leave because it started going downhill or it went dowhill because he left?

[@eddardgreybeard]

​@@JoVicttor49 The former. The writing was definitely on the wall with writing out tysha, killing Shea in self defense, and putting a crossbow bolt in tywins gut because Tyrion didn't like it when he said "whore."

[@GJBedrin]

​@@eddardgreybeardwriting tysha out was a good call on the show . No piint ro her charcter. Its redundant with shaes and moreover the audience never met her so you might as well give her role to someone they connect with instead😊

[@eddardgreybeard]

@@GJBedrin That's foolish thinking. It completely shaped the entirety of his relationship with tywin, Jaime, Shae, and every woman he's ever been with. And what it means to be a Lannister. You could say it was the Pinnacle character defining moment for him. They wrote that out, and they completely wrote out Tyrion. And you obviously haven't read the dang books because they didn't even need to cast her. All the audience needed to know is how that moment affected Tyrion and how it shapes his relationship with basically everyone. This would be like making Jon Snow a legit Stark, or having Bran never thrown from the window by Jaime, or perhaps never having Ned executed in the first season.

[@Lyner_bersett]

If only we can pursue HBO to get new writers and re shoot the story after season 5. I'd watch it, 10 times over

[@bjarzubeer4527]

​@@kandiekane.After season 4 it didn't make any sense

[@danielsander3576]

The actors have aged already and I have never heard about anything remotely similar in the history of cinema. Probably because you would never reach the same audience levels close to the first time streaming and there would always be a confusion with two different endings. Its beyond repairable. The worse it is. They spoiled potentially the best series ever because of their greed? Impatience? The audience could tell, the critics could tell, the actors and the author of the books were in horror real time. No one could do anything...... Unbelievable professional failure from both of them.

[@enman009]

@@kandiekane. I agree with you. Season 6 was overall very good but flawed

[@AlbinoMutant]

Why? We still don't even know the ending. HBO would have to write a new ending and why would it be good when writing fantasy novels isn't their expertise in the first place? They don't even know how to hire a writer to write a fantasy novel, never mind two. No, the ending is the ending forever. The moment is gone. No one will ever go back to that series. It's possible far into the future when George is dead and AI has completed his novels that someone will again put out a series based on the main story. But don't hold your breath. It will be decades.

[@echoesofmalachor3700]

@@danielsander3576Deadwood is the closest thing I can think of and that was so good nobody ever talks about it.

[@sesshowmarumonoke]

Not to defend D&D, but GRRM wanted HBO to halt the show until he finished the books. He wanted HBO to sit atop the actors contracts for years - while paying them and the "kids" got older and the hype diminished year after year after year. He's an impractical man. It's impossible to make a show this expensive to last for 13 seasons. D&D did a bad job, yes. But GRRM also let us down.

[@goldenhourg]

Absolutely. GRRM has some nerve to be angry when he didn’t finish the books, despite undertaking a filming project with HBO, actors, and many dedicated staffers dependent on his progress. Say what you want but at least JK Rowling FINISHED the series that made her famous. She has a legacy. GRRM has nothing but my disappointment and low key contempt until the books are released

[@geniepyt3123]

I agree with you 100%

[@edstringer1138]

And we still dont have that book

[@joseortega3257]

@@edstringer1138 it really feels like he wrote himself into a corner.

[@edstringer1138]

@@joseortega3257 Agreed , and now he is pouting

[@GenericTallGuy]

It’s his universe, these are his characters and this is his story. GRRM deserved a say in everything. EVERYTHING. He’s literally THE CREATOR. D&D destroyed what could been the greatest and the biggest show ever made with the last two seasons for whatever the reasons might have been. To a point where it has been erased from pop culture and no one talks about it anymore. It’s kinda sad coz I was a huuuuge GoT fan.

[@spirittammyk]

His fault. He should have signed a contract similar to how J.K Rowlings signed on with WB where she had to have approval over every script and casting choice.

[@kathrinkweseleit7074]

This is all true. He sold the rights anyway… 😐

[@shahidabdoullakhanzorovr1564]

👃👃👃...Whaddyou expect?

[@johnsmith9205]

It doesn't matter what he deserved, but what he signed. That's all, really. Let's just all move on and forget a decade of our lives in entertainment. It's like we spent that time in TV prison.

[@drexplordinaire]

no he doesnt.

[@ShadyRonin]

The crime that D&D committed is that they didn’t want to do the show anymore but refused to resign and let someone else who cared finish it.

[@ninap9216]

I was thinking about George RRM tell once that The Red Wedding chapter was really hard for him to write and in fact he wrote the rest of the book first and came back to finish this chapter last. Just because it was emotionally the most difficult- killing off characters he loved and was attached to. Maybe this is similar with Winds. My understanding is that this book is likely meant to be the darkest of the series, with devastation, loss, despair throughout the seven kingdoms. It's probably not fun to write chapter after chapter of such bleak landscape, your beloved characters suffering and dying

[@Rev_Goose]

Yeah, but he also brought Catelyn back to life at the end of the book too. Another reason why the show went downhill after season 4, they omitted some of the coolest parts of the later books.

[@eddiOrtiz]

D&d rushed it alright, coz they wanted to work with kateleen Kennedy 🤢 and Disney on a star wars project...what happend that now,??were is that project?? Lol

[@mamsy1169]

@@Rev_Goose They explained why Catelyn wasn't brought back. They wanted to keep the surprise of Jon coming back to life & if they had brought Catelyn back, it may have ruined it. They didn't want what was dead to never actually die, essentially. If too many characters "die" then come back, it can end up just seeming like a novelty. And something that's just used for shock value.

[@amuddymoose]

Nope. It’s been 12 years. He’s given up. Period.

[@pepsipwns666]

Two completely different usages of being ressurrected. One being, beric dondarion pouring his life into catlyn after her being dead for a while@@mamsy1169 her coming back as a half zombie, absolutely vengeful and looking to punish anyone who wronged her and the starks (a great story development). Meanwhile john was killed off completely randomly with his story being imcomplete, clearly obviously going to get res'd as mellisandre just happens to be nearby. It was all very obvious.

[@Xearrik]

I think the Hound relieving himself in the river that Lady Stoneheart was supposed to be pulled out of was a hard and public middle finger to George. I see that as a for sure cutoff point for him working with them at all.

[@myaalexander354]

I’m glad someone else caught that. I remember thinking pretty much the exact same thing when that aired.

[@theweedusama]

Yes!

[@kriiistofel]

My first thought when I saw that

[@jaycee2070]

No, that was D and D pissing on the book fans.

[@myaalexander354]

@@jaycee2070 def that too

[@chelisue]

George doesnt need to be angry about it. There’s plenty of anger out here in the fandom. All he needs to do is WRITE❣️

[@DarthJacobi]

He will never finish and has no reason too. He can just continue to say he’s working on it and that his ending is way better. At this point whatever the ending is will be disappointing, it’s been too long and the expectations continue to grow.

[@sannyassi73]

Yup, I don't care at all how he feels about anything at all at this point. I actually enjoy the offense that he may feel- meet karma Mr. Martin.

[@madveteran7945]

HBO GOT ended so out of character of how the show was heading. I honestly would have accepted Cersei winning at the end over the train wreck the writers threw at us.

[@xxlCortez]

I would have accepted the Night King winning.

[@madveteran7945]

@@xxlCortez I could accept that as well. Anything but the train wreck they gave us.

[@deanfirnatine7814]

Hollywood almost always does this with great novels, these directors/show runners think they know better than the award winning authors of these IP's, their egos are unreal. When will executives learn to rein these producers/show runners in and make them stick to the IP they spent a fortune to buy, look what the show runner did to the Witcher, she refused to stick to the books and destroyed the show. Thankfully Dan and Dave have hardly worked since the season 8 disaster.

[@EB-bl6cc]

It really is crazy. How many times can you watch someone make the same mistakes before you learn from it? Apparently the answer is.. quite a lot

[@OGQuatumStorm]

Exactly. Like it’s really a standard for them. Buy popular IP. Gain traction from fans. Once views gained, destroy IP. Go off on our own version. Impose our own will on IP’s characters to tell our own story. It’s pure evil honestly.

[@cantabrian1009]

A couple of points. 1 - I doubt anyone will be arguing in any seriousness as to what the real ending will be as long as the written story is completed. 2 - the remark about actors perhaps wanting to go on to other projects - as much as that is true and bigger scale doesn't always mean better things, I can't think of a single actor who has been in anything remotely as popular by comparison to their roles in GoT, since the end of the show. Do we know if any of the actors actually felt 'done with' their roles and were happy it didn't go on longer? We know that Emilia and Kit both felt gutted personally and that might be an understatement.

[@Elwaves2925]

I'm sure you realise this, and it's probably just the wording, but it isn't necessarily going on to bigger and better projects. It's about moving on to different projects. Very few actors want to be stuck in the same role (or same type of role) for their careers. To answer your question that came after that, the two that immediately spring to mind are Jason Momoa, who I'd argue found greater success with Aquaman (even though DC+WB are screwing that up), followed by Pedro Pascal who has had two massively successful hit shows after GOT, plus other stuff. Of course it helps that their GOT runs were limited and they weren't part of the main characters but it still fits the criteria. 🙂

[@sannyassi73]

Hind-site 20:20

[@Opnn8d1]

Dan and Dave had One Job: To adapt the NOVELS in "A Song of Ice and Fire" into an HBO series. There's just one problem. Dan and Dave ran out of finished novels, and likely only had a cliff's notes equivalent of material for The Winds of Winter, and at the most, bullet points of events that had to happen in A Dream of Spring. Because Martin FAILED to deliver the remaining two books in his novel series. And now, even after all these years, he STILL hasn't finished ONE of the two books. Also, I distinctly remember watching a video where Martin clearly stated that the way the show ended was pretty much the way the books would end, though he said that there would be more character perspectives in the books. So tell me how it's really Dan and Dave's fault? Their biggest mistake was undertaking the project when the source material wasn't anywhere near complete. I think they assumed that Martin would care enough about his career as a writer to actually get Winds of Winter and Dream of Spring done while the show was being produced.. I did the figures and determined that had he written something like 402 words a day, five days a week, he could have delivered Winds of Winter in the form of a novel the same length as A Game of Thrones by the midpoint of Season 4, and A Dream of Spring at the same length by end of Season 7. The gap between 7 and 8 would have allowed the final books full adaptation. But no. Martin didn't really even get started good with writing Winds of Winter until after the show ended. So Dan and Dave had no choice but to use the limited resources they had to write the ending of the story FOR martin. That wasn't their job. I lay the failure of Season 7, and to a greater degree, Season 8 at Martin's feet. And if Martin was so unsatisfied with Dan and Dave's handling of the as-yet unwritten novels' material, then why didn't he, as an executive producer, step in and put them in their place and make sure they got it on track. Remember, like I said, Martin said that the books would end like the show ended. So, he must not have been all that disappointed. When you are adapting something, you shouldn't have to feel like you're having to lay down tracks in front of a moving train.

[@Essydyk]

George should have maybe wrote the remaining 2 books and gave them the content everybody wanted instead of them having to make it up on the fly. He will literally do anything other than finish these books.

[@Kjai537]

They didn't have to make up everything "on the fly"! Aegons prophecy laid out the way it should have ended. Now with the way GOT ended the prophecy was just thrown out the window.

[@Essydyk]

@@Kjai537Of course they were making it up on the fly. Where do you think the material for the last 2 seasons was coming from?

[@Garybell09]

⁠​⁠@@Kjai537It mostly ended how it was suppose to, they just didn’t put all the build up to it. It’s GRRM fault anyway.

[@amuddymoose]

@@Garybell09yup…that’s was George’s ending more or less

[@cmike123]

This man has like a 30 book "side project". He's never going to finish this series. He doesnt care about it anymore.

[@xoler2167]

Maybe my grandson will have the honor to read TWOW

[@yugrise1286]

if they didnt cut characters we get season 9-11. Young griff is a game changer and dorn is an addition plot.

[@retributionpics]

Hopefully we will live long enough to see a GOT remake. I actually think I have a better chance of seeing a remake in my lifetime then ever reading the final book. I am now sad while typing this, because I realize that it is the truth.

[@izi5150]

It pisses me off that they already had the ending repeated constantly in Aegon Targaryen’s prophetic dream and it didn’t happen. It’s the most irritating thing ever. It makes the whole prophecy irrelevant.

[@umwha]

???

[@Jeeper1378]

@@umwhajohn snow being a true Targaryen and a male should of took the throne.

[@finstor3386]

Obviously, the show went down hill rapidly once George was no longer involved. That being said if he no longer wanted to be directly invovled, it makes sense that the people involved with the show are going to work effeciently and not include George. What did he expect that would ask his approval on every script? You either are working oni it or you are not. I think this is just George's way of letting us know that after season 4 it is no his story. And we as fans can not expect some TV writers to be anywhere near the quality of writer that George is.

[@YagamisMouth]

Rapidly? 5 6 7 were great seasons

[@NakulKrishna]

@@YagamisMouththe dialogue was written by teenage brains. The show reached a climactic point so it felt big but they really had no clue how to make it feel as big. Just think about s1 to s4 with GRRM part of it and the way they built up the intensity, and then go back to s5-s8 and really listen to the quality of dialogue. They’re idiots that rode the hype that have no clue how to write and had a great budget to spend on amazing cgi(not s8).

[@YagamisMouth]

@@NakulKrishna disagree season 5 and 6 were outstanding

[@eddardgreybeard]

​@@YagamisMouth They were nonsensical. The dorne storyline itself was a dumpster fire.

[@mrsemilybartrum]

Book One told us there are dragons elsewhere. Remember, Bran saw them warging.. the books are so great. I hope he does finish.

[@johnwright6706]

D&D still gave the only ending for GoT we'll ever get. Prove me wrong George, prove me wrong.

[@MrInvinciblewarrior]

I am quite sure, that he has the ending already in detail available, with most of the major events in between. Its just a total mess and he wants tl make it perfect. As soon he is 6feet under, the pubisher will send in an executor to sort all the notes and write a final with as much grrm as possible. Look at lord of the rings, where we just got another book a few years ago, which is claimed cowritten by jrr tolkien

[@bidossessi]

This right here!!

[@Jeneric81]

@@MrInvinciblewarriorProblem is that GRRM stated he doesn’t have all this exhaustive notes and documentation that Robert Jordan had. Most of it is in his head

[@travisbaugh8560]

GRRM should have finished writing his books like he promised to do. The show changed when they went from source material to an outline of what could happen.

[@ryankwon8785]

They had plenty book materials for Season 5-6: Varys and Young Griffs’ Blackfyre Conspiracy, Ariane Martell, the Dormish and Sand Snakes conspiracy, Lovecraftian Euron Greyjoy, Jaqen H’gar in Old Town, etc.

[@jfgibson73]

Unfortunately, when a writer makes the deal to have their work adapted, they take the chance on how it will turn out. George is still pretty lucky that the series had some great episodes and that it led to him getting many more opportunities.

[@JuicebyJay]

I don't think he's ungrateful, more or less I think he is just being truthful about the ending not being the direction (if he would ever finish them 🥴🥴🥴) the books are going to go in.

[@Swearengen1980]

And that's why he'll never finish the story himself. The show destroyed his fucks to give. I wish he'd just tell us his ending in a one paragraph statement before he has a heart attack.

[@firemaster9994]

​@@Swearengen1980If anything the success of the show made him procrastinate more. If he cared enough he would try to correct the mistake the TV show made

[@Swearengen1980]

@@firemaster9994 It appears you missed my point.

[@jfgibson73]

@@firemaster9994 Yeah, instead of criticizing the series that took his career to new heights, use that energy to finally show us what direction things could have taken. Stop whining and prove you had something that was so much better.

[@narem1092]

Curious, why doesn't GRRM "retcon" the unwanted seasons or events in the upcoming Snow series? I bet most of the characters are willing to come back.

[@ragnar97]

Why doesn't he retcon it in the books he has yet to release to finish the series?

[@JuicebyJay]

I mean, I think if they were going to do that, they should've done it just a couple years after the series ended. Or maybe even just did a 'movie' to fix the finale to fit Georgie's vision. It's been 4 years. Some of the actors would probably come back but most of them have probably moved on and revisiting it would only exacerbate their PTSD that D&D caused. I mean so much of the cast was displeased. Not to mention, the cast has aged. Of course us die hard fans wouldn't focus on that. We live for the story. But I think majority of the viewers weren't book readers so therefore they would be more focused on how different everyone looked. I mean look at all the bullshit Emilia Clarke gets for aging naturally. A lot of factors why... also, maybe it's been mentioned, and HBO doesn't want to take that gamble.

[@ragnar97]

@@JuicebyJay "Georgie's vison" That's assuming he has one, still 2 books to go years after the show ended so.... Not sure what vision you're talking about

[@monicaalexandru9638]

you can’t fix four seasons of development(proper or unproper) in a movie. and frankly, nor can a network recind its own show and do another one presenting it as “the good continuation”. @@JuicebyJay

[@caseyhart4999]

@@ragnar97100% he should retcon them in the books. The tv stuff is only ensuring we might never have anymore book material and it’s for that reason I blame George about as much as D&D for the predicament we are currently in.

[@kristijan8518]

I don't trust a word George says. He's had over a decade to finish the book but he didn't.

[@Abhijeet-47]

And even if wow came we will never able to read ados

[@YourGrace_06]

I love GRRM. I don’t care whether he gives another book or not. The ones he gave us are pretty damn special

[@raydrexler5868]

I’m reminded of the way Clive Cussler’s works have been treated on film. He wrote books that were excellent movie scripts and the studios just wiped their butts with them.

[@Red1Green2Blue3]

YAWN. When he finishes the books (or at least publishes the next one that has now been 10+ years since the last book) I'll be interested in his complaints.

[@DerBomster]

Frankly, my compassion for the complaints of a guy who happily sold half a story for 15 million dollars/season is pretty limited. Not to mention - his comments plainly throw shade not only at the show, but (intentionally or not) at himself, too: praising The Last Kingdom, whose author managed to write 7 novels in the time since GoT started, and Endgame which demonstrated how to actually *finish* a long-running story.

[@Bloodlit]

I mean… The whole damn series”The Last Kingdom”!was freaking awesome. So he’s not wrong.

[@DaviesMartinezBeats]

I thought I would never say it, but I DO NOT CARE about WoW any longer... It's been too long coming and I've moved on with my life and other things due to the extended wait...

[@DEANOpics]

I think the show ended the way the books will, but... the show is like your friend telling you the plot of movie he just saw. He's leaving out lot of detail and some things don't make sense, but the broad strokes are there.

[@michaelcortez6596]

GRR Martin, begged too late... he could’ve finished the books and gave the conclusion we all deserved but HBO got tired of waiting for him. Now he cries when he had all these years to finish it..

[@Marta1Buck]

people noticed the downfall in season 5, I felt it in season 7 where everyone can just teleport. It's so strange, in early season it takes them a few episodes to get to the next kingdom, showing us how big the world is.

[@ragnar97]

He could just write a different ending for the books. Oh wait! Forgot he can't be bothered.

[@lrlavalais2068]

Probably already wrote both Novels and toying around with us.

[@ragnar97]

@@lrlavalais2068 More like playing around with his toys while forgetting about the novels lol I literally imagine him in his pool playing with d&d minis instead of writing lol

[@lrlavalais2068]

@@ragnar97 😂😂😂😂😂 I'm dead.

[@FreakyLynx]

Didn’t he promise a book to be released during the show’s run? We’re years past the show being over and still no book. D&D made mistakes but they didn’t exist in a bubble - other people had opportunities to jump in. And GRRM wanting the show to continue past eight seasons… well then give them more material.

[@juleyse2431]

Mister Martin talking about his book and saying: " 'Winter' is coming I told you long ago, and so it is" is such a genius and clever line

[@valenciawalker6498]

Thanks for the review.

[@Some_Guy_87]

On the other hand they simply had nothing new to work with since the first season aired. I doubt anyone would have predicted that they would have no new material available until the end of the show, and that they suddenly would need to become writers of the story who can consult with the author, rather than adaptors. It's really unfortunate how this all went down, starting with one of the best if not the best series in television and then degrading like that. It feels like this story is just not meant to be finished properly in any shape or form.

[@craigmills6275]

Since he got out of the writers room after season 4, he could focus on winds of winter???? That was wishful thinking huh?

[@AkahigeNoAmo]

after listening to this, I am really hopeful that Oda (author and artist of One Piece) keeps his creative control of the adaptation. While the showrunners of the OPLA seem much more into it than DD ever seemed to me, distater of deviation can always strike

[@july9566]

Wow almost 4 years later and we're all still pissed off hahah . Damn I think this is a first for television, where a massive fan base feels absolutely betrayed , where the show has been completely forgotten

[@DistantLights]

If he really wanted to save the show, he would've finished the booms so the writers could just adapt the books like they used to

[@MrCommentmaster]

If he was “out of the loop” after season 4, why hasn’t he finished writing the books?

[@amcd85]

because writing an entire book series complete with your own wordbuilding is .... hard. imagine that. imagine creating something actually being real work.

[@JLPayne_78]

I'm sorry but I don't believe the fans of the books will ever see the written end of this great series of novels. I sadly don't see it happening.

[@TheMikepatota]

The last kingdom was amazing though too. I didn’t know GRRM gave them a nod or that it happened during the final season 😅

[@Animaxx010]

Ok I get it. But honestly George kind of have no one to blame but himself. The show literally caught up to his books and he still was not done. But I do agreed, D and D grew super big and thought they can do no wrong. But boy was that not the case.

[@garvador]

It's easier to point fingers.. but the reality is HBO could have got a new director and re involved George to continue more seasons but they cleaned their hands and this is the conclusion. Yes, the directors wanted to give the conclusion for the show, but they also have a lot of bosses and producers above them.. so I can't really blame all to the directors

[@Hermes157]

could there be a tv show adaptation in the future of a song of ice and fire, one which stays 100% on point with the books ? what would be the chances of that

[@TheElizondo88]

Depending on how big the IP continues to be and whether or not whole streaming fiasco hasn’t swallowed the studios whole, I could see HBO/WB (or maybe a new owner of the IP) giving it a go to keep the IP going.

[@deborahgoslin5858]

Really good video ! Thank you.

[@justhereforthetragedy]

Yeah, dear George, no grace from me. You created this mess.

[@adamhatch9698]

This is a perfect example of content creators milking time. This video goes on and on but never really goes anywhere.

[@berniemargolis4288]

The video is full of lies and omissions. GRRM is a long-time fan of Marvel and Bernard Cornwell. Of course he's going to shout out their stuff when it releases. Given that GoT was releasing a show every week, these shout outs were bound to coincide with one episode or another. The stuff he was saying about creative differences was in reference to Beauty and the Beast. Even the screenshot of the article posted in the video explicitly said that it was not in reference to GoT. All I saw was a bunch of out of context tweets that were presented in a way that insinuated that GRRM was crapping on his own show when he never did any such thing.

[@SmilieLyon]

Well done, great summary

[@debbralehrman5957]

Thanks it is good to have an idea of how George feels. Not that it is a big surprise. Again thanks for the information👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼🌹

[@mikepalmer2219]

I think this is one reason he has not finished the books. I think he is afraid of how it will be received. I think he is at a loss on how to end it.

[@mackenzieyoung5306]

It really is crazy looking back how D&D put out that travesty of a last season

[@MHDebidour]

The last seasons of GOT destroy all my feeling about the show and GRR Martin's books, I even didn't watch the new show. Martin was not a newbie in screenwriting and relationship with producers. He can shame D&D as he want but he also let all that mess happen.

[@DewitticusBrett]

Even though he's put Winds off for 50 years, I'm still as excited today as I was when he released his first chapter on the blog. Please George.. please knock this out of the park. We're itching.

[@tyhamell5425]

well all he has to do is finish the f’in story and we can get a finale

[@addictstatic]

His writing style isn't an architect but a Gardner.....translating to even he has no idea what could or even what will or in the case of Winds what has happened to the various characters, which is on the one hand hopeful, yet if you are trying to not only to craft an overall storyline but write a TV show under deadlines due to contracts that held the financial futures of the cast and crew in jeopardy. It might take lifetimes for him to discover what could happen and how he wants to tell it because he is floundering for closure. I didn't initially enjoy the final product but the story as well as the books are left up to interpretation until he finalizes his gardening process and harvests results. HBO and the cast and crew are reality, expectations were real. George is still trying to muster confidence on pulling everything together and writing a plot down the long ways. Much patience and passion to you and your channel I love your possible take on season 8 and 9 they took more time and energy than George has for this era of the series.

[@kirschsteinchen]

I still don:t get how the author of the books AND HBO wanted a longer show, but D&D had the final say about it?

[@GamingStew]

nothing could have given me the desire to watch The Last Kingdom more than that tweet from George

[@Ranzoir]

I have a couple theories on why wow is taking so long. I think the tv show used some of his endings and he’s trying to rewrite to not have the same outcome. Or he has just wrote himself into a corner and can’t work it out. My last idea is he is writing both winds of winter and dream of spring at the same time, this is why it is taking so long… but who knows really these are just my thoughts. Winter is coming…

[@lrlavalais2068]

I've a feeling both Novels are already written. He is playing with us. Sick of it really.

[@moondra3481]

I also think this is the deal.. he will release them both say that's it there ya go these are MY characters I can kill whomever I choose it's my story it is done finito... leave me alone😂. Plus he is going to be super busy once the spin offs resume as well as hotd. ❤

[@caseyhart4999]

@@moondra3481 he has not written the books lol but I think you are 100% correct the spin offs are keeping him distracted which is why we will likely never get the books. The day George greenlit GoT as a show is the day any hopes of him finishing the story died. That’s my theory anyway. He did always want it to be a show to begin with but it just couldn’t be done back in the 90s. Then one day when he is most of the way through the series the opportunity finally presents itself and he took it. He was banking on the show successfully completing the story so he wouldn’t have to only it didn’t work out the way he hoped.

[@brianargenas1924]

You can only hope. Stephen King finished The Dark Tower saga pretty quick with the last two books. I was very surprised. Maybe George is on the same plateau. Not holding my breath. Two different writers, king puts out a book almost every 2 or 3 years, which have been pretty great. Maybe George is frustrated with his great saga. Give Stephen a call for help.

[@lrlavalais2068]

@@brianargenas1924 I agree! (Hands down to Stephen King one of my favorite horror writers next to Dean Koontz and Anne Rice)

[@kenji5055]

just finished re-watching GoT after the the first season of HotD ended , and I feel robbed that we didn't get the ending we deserved, re-watching made me realise the amount of writing mistakes that happened in the show , ser Barristan's death , Arya's marvel plot armor doing parkour with an open belly and so much more. House of the dragon on the other hand , Loved everything about it , especially Viserys's last walk to the throne

[@mismismism]

I'm of 2 minds with this because on the one hand, D&D made something so shockingly bad. Like there's a noticeable difference between trying and not sticking the landing and someone very clearly not caring anymore. That said, this man still has released the next book, and there's meant to be another after in like twice the length of the entire TV show so I don't really understand what he expected to happen. Even if they adapted every minor character in the books, they would have run out of material to pull from unless they spun their wheels forever to not pay anything off and if that was the case, do we really think the show would last this long, let alone how long it would take for him to drop both books? I think people let him off the hook for the show too much because frankly, it was never gonna end well since he very clearly doesn't know where to go himself. How can we honestly expect anyone else to make a satisfying ending when he can't even figure out what to write himself in over a decade? Especially when they were only supposed to adapt the source material, they were never meant to make up the ending or make up large parts of the story. I am not defending D&D but at this point, George had the power to prove he was in the right but he's still here just talking, making excuses, saying it's almost done year after year so it seems kind of ridiculous to expect he wasn't pissing people off with this wishy washy nature behind the scenes of the show when I guarantee you, they all went into the show expecting the books to come out, or at least one of the books to come out, long before they got to the point they did because TV shows are never guaranteed to continue, most shows never get as many seasons as GOT did so it seems wild for George to throw shade about the show not lasting longer when he still hasn't delivered himself. Both sides are as to blame for this as the other IMO.

[@melindacochran5193]

I watched an interview with Dan and Dave and said If the fans were upset with the writing it was because George wasnt giving them sorce material for the show any longer, so maybe thats why they shut him out of the writers room. They had already signed a deal before the show ended so they were just ready to go! The last two seasons were hard to watch, but I absolutely loved GOT!❤

[@robbcd]

This makes me so sad. We deserved faithful adaptions of the books.

[@blooper6543]

If George told Dave and Dan that the ending is that it was all one long fever dream of Ned's and that he never left Winterfell, you have to respect it. It's his story. I don't understand these "creative differences." It's not yours to do whatever you want with.

[@npats550]

Thanks for these little nuggets of information.

[@unclefish]

If HBO wanted more seasons, why didn't they hire new writers?

[@luismunoz5866]

Well it wouldnt of been like this if he had finished his novel. At the end it falls back on him. Hope he does finish his book soon and a Dream of Spring

[@lunny2230]

To be fair, maybe if GRRM had of put as much effort into finishing his books as he did in soaking up the fame from how well the show was doing, then it might not have ended as such a clusterfuck.....

[@taolinnegar9961]

Your Amazing videos are truly inspirational making learning fun again !!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@caseyhart4999]

As much as I hate to say it the ending of the show is the canon ending to the story until George finishes the series himself. With the continued efforts to pump out spin off shows I’m convinced it will never happen which is why I blame George as much if not more than D&D for the predicament we are all in.

[@edwinbrown7179]

That makes zero sense. Show Canon is completely different. The hacks cut kings out of the timeline and changed peoples personalities and names.

[@caseyhart4999]

My point was George is not going to finish the series so unless someone else writes it then it’s the only ending we are ever going to get. You can call it not canon but I bet everybody who was happy with the shows ending (as hard as that is to believe) will see it as the canon ending and without another ending to point to I can’t really see how they would be wrong in thinking that.

[@greenman8]

Act like seasons 6, 7, and 8 did not exist, and re do them, completing at season 10. I want to see the Wheel Break, I want the Night King to be resolved in the 10th season. I want to follow Varys, after Littlefinger. I want to find out that Varys is a Wizard, and his hatred was misdirected, and Varys learns of the Warlock. Lady Stoneheart-season 7&8? How about the Mysterious lady of Quaith. Maybe season 10 should end with some things resolved, and other things not.

[@rasalpaul4574]

Season 6 was amazing. For a lot of people it was the Best season of GOT

[@chamirus1]

Don't forget season 5. That Dorne plot still haunts me

[@greenman8]

@@rasalpaul4574 personally I was 'OK' with season 6. Not what I would have done like this, or have wanted, but if that season was setting the low bar of expectations, I could take it, as a viewer. Seven and eight were unacceptable, aside from the SFX, Actors, and Crew.

[@greenman8]

@@chamirus1 I liked the idea of the Dorne people and Nation, but yeah, if they had 5 more seasons to work with in season 5, the Dorne, and other people, like the Gold Cloaks, would have been fleshed out and treated with reverence.

[@chamirus1]

I mean, I love Dorne and its people, but in the books. The Dorne plot was só good in aFfC and in aDwD and in the show they butchered it

[@delvinairish4920]

Question: Do you know When the books📚 will be for purchase ready?

[@promi4259]

He didn't even finish the book, no point arguing what he wants at the ending. The producers cannot wait that long....

[@sarahevans-politte4756]

Throw as much shade at D&D

[@TheRealRedAce]

George RR Martin apparently doesn't want to write any more Game of Thrones books either! I think the problems with the TV series resulted mainly from this and are as much his fault as the show's writers who were left with no books to adapt the last seasons from.

[@sunnydaze2712]

NEVER LEAVE OUT THE CREATOR!!! George should have kept creative control. HOTD is good because George is involved. Oda Sensei with One Piece is doing it right because he is giving his blessing on all the changes and the changes actually make sense to the characters.

[@AbdullahSediqi23]

"George no longer wanted to write" is a good summary of the last decade

[@maritasue5067]

I’m so glad D&D decided not to do Star Wars after all. They couldn’t have been trusted with such a beloved franchise.

[@moondra3481]

I believe Disney dropped that Star Wars deal and after the enormous backlash from GOT fans... they went with Netflix instead.

[@stevem2323]

​@@moondra3481And they destroyed in equal measure.

[@stevem2323]

Disney did the same tho.

[@moondra3481]

@@stevem2323 dude, don't get me started on Star Wars and Disney 🙄

[@stevem2323]

@@moondra3481 start i wanna hear it 😉

[@doble_20]

This guy is 75 years old. The novel is 12 years late. He will never finish it. There is only one end of GOT, the one in the TV series.

[@pmac1096]

Maybe HBO should shame him into finishing the books. Screw GRRM.

[@blueseqperl]

Maybe he should put out the next book. It has been 12 years. The entire Expanse series was written and released in that time period.

[@ericvulgate]

I tel people that still haven't seen the series but say they're going to 'when a church burns down stop watching. Cersie wins the game of thrones the end.'

[@JuicebyJay]

😂😂😂

[@Anbu_Sampath]

D & D should have given next few seasons to other directors and left. GRRM speed up the book sooner.

[@kerravon4159]

Makes you wonder how D and D'er managed to get away with nosediving the franchise into the ground.

[@DarthJacobi]

D&D were hired to adapt the source material into a show and they made one of the best shows in the history of television. They however are not authors capable of continuing a story they were never supposed to have to write. You don’t like how the show ended blame George.

[@saleheenrizwan5294]

Just a reminder GRRM is 74! 🙂

[@Deedee37986]

Actually 75! His bday was yesterday 🎉

[@lrlavalais2068]

Is he waiting to die before he gives us the damn books?

[@michaelguest4247]

GRRM has nobody to blame but himself. He got left out of the loop because he never finished the Ice and Fire series of books and may never finish them. What possible role could George RR Martin have played in a series where he has openly admitted that part of the problem with Winds of Winter is that he keeps changing his mind about how the plot should go. The producers were under a deadline to finish the show. In the end they had to finish it without George.

[@guayaquilindependiente8763]

I can still remember the anticipation I had to watch the last season and how I got progressively angrier and more disappointed at how bad it was… it really could have been one of the best shows ever, all to be ruined my mediocre writing in the very end.

[@helgar791]

The nerve of GRRM shaming the producers of the show. This guy hasn't bothered to publish a page of the series for 12 years. Yeah, the last few seasons were a mess. But what were the producers supposed to do? They had zero source material. "The Lord Of The Rings" and "The Witcher" managed to royally screw their shows up with all the source material they needed. "The Lord Of The Rings" even had a movie to source. At least Benioff and Weiss, unlike Hissrich and Kemeny, didn't try to turn their show into feminist propaganda forcing the lead of the series to quit. Jordan's "Wheel Of Time" show, although slow to build, is actually doing a good job, but they too have a complete source to work from. Benioff and Weiss managed to keep it fairly interesting, if a bit hackneyed, to the end.