My Thoughts on Mythic+ in Season 1 of The War Within So Far...

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[@omega1231]

I've personally given up on m+, i pug because i have a super wonky schedule and i just want to play, but pugging as a healer .. the best way i can say it is, the heart palpitations are not worth the reward. It feels soooooo bad, literally shaking from the adrenaline and stress then getting gold for my trouble.. Soloing delves are much more my pace and i actually feel rewarded for my effort, i also don't have to constantly correct the mistakes of others. I agree that punishing mistakes harshly forces people to learn, but it also forces people to quit. I've learned my lesson, i deal with the affix, i kick, i stun, i dispell, i dps, i heal and still the dps is randomly dying for god knows what reason. It's miserable and as a healer, it is so difficult not to take it as your fault when people are dying, and people are dying alot to everything. It's just miserable.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

If you are having heart palpitations from playing a game you need to get outside and get some exercise. This is unhealthy both physically and mentally.

[@wiskeeamazingdancer4964]

​@@heythereguysitsMetrois basically the norm for pug healers

[@ireallysuckatthisgame2194]

Your second paragraph is telling me that you’re doing everything in your power to succeed. If that’s truly the case, then the people around you aren’t putting the same effort in as you are, and you shouldn’t take offense to that. You shouldn’t take the blame of a key failing on yourself. I understand failing a key can be frustrating, I do it all the time. My keys have been hovering between 3s-6s this whole week as a tank and honestly I could give a fuck less, and I’m in the same “work fucks up my gaming schedule” boat. You’re doing the best you can. Don’t stress yourself over it. It’s obviously not physically doing you any favors. Just have some patience and wait for everyone else to catch up.

[@antons7210]

The healing state sucks right now, but if it's stressing you out that much, I'd probably stay away from healing in general lol

[@corb352]

I chose healer for those heart palpidations! Lets me know im ALIVE!

[@beebeemw]

There’s something really weird going on with keys, because above a 5 there’s pretty much only siege, mists and necrotic wake listed, just cannot find anything else.

[@MostlyFish21]

Dude I'm having the same issue. I've never seen anything like this happen. I keep on thinking LFG is bugged somehow

[@gxxkc8074]

@@MostlyFish21 it is bugged just search specific dungeon or tinker with the filters

[@SuacoRV]

Yes, my whole list is like 90% mists and necrotic and a few siege here and there. I asked this a few times in groups but nobody really replied so i thought it was a me problem.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Ya I have heard a lot of reports of this. Try searching for individual keys. I have had no issues with that so far.

[@gxxkc8074]

@heythereguysitsMetro yea it's cuz u r searching in a higher bracket that doesn't cap the limit of keys of pre-made so the bug cannot exist.

[@zoedawn7125]

Also have to take into fact the 'accordian' effect, where the beginning of the season all players are more or less nearby eachother, on both sides of the accordian. As it slowly stretches out when the season gets longer the better players and worse players become slowly more far away from eachother. I do believe that at the start of an expansion the good players are present in 5-9 keys farming gear.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

This was just a discussion more about the dungeons than the playerbase. Other than that one guy I would not say we had any outliers in keys.

[@littlenuggets6426]

its funny that you mention city of threads and stone vault, because ive only manage to time one 7 city and stone vault with the cube boss is very frustrating.

[@kittysgomeoww]

ive been playing blood dk and i cant do even 6s with pugs, they just always die and dont know mechanics and someone either leaves or we dont time it. im not having any luck.

[@Kelastov]

Great video mate, really enjoyed the storytelling about your key experiences. I'm playing disc priest this season, first time since cata and I'm having a load of fun. Keeping a spreadsheet of all the pugs aswell!

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@Kelastov nice well let's get together at the end of the season and compare the stats! I'm eager to see the difference.

[@hbups]

This week, for me, has been absolutely cursed. I play WoW kinda sporadically so I don't have a guild/friends to play with so I pug absolutely everything and my god the gap in skill level is insane. Tanks are frankly a rarity and every tank that's invited there's a 50/50 chance they're either very good or have never done M+ before. People absolutely do NOT care about mechanics, they don't care to learn and so wipe after wipe they continue to not care. The difficulty spike of particular dungeons is immense; Grim Batol, Stonevault and Siege are almost unplayable in pugs above a +5 because of what I talked about earlier. There are soso many mechanics that will just one shot people on anything above a +2 and still there's just a complete lack of effort and care from what feels like 75% of m+ players right now, and from a healer POV it feels even worse. The amount of times I've been on the last boss in Ara Kara on track to 2 or even 3 chest it and then DPS just dropping left and right because they don't know how the mechanics work is depressing to say the least. Not to mention the reduction in tank defensives/healing making things even more stressful. Another issue is there are what seems to be barely any keys going right now. Almost every key above a +5 seems to be only NW/Siege/Mists. Finding a +6 Stonevaults is practically impossible. The past few days have gone like this: do 1-2 keys and time, do another and have someone be toxic or leave early or not know what they're doing, be completely mentally drained because of the depletion. This expansion has been SO good so far in every aspect EXCEPT M+, but I can't even blame the devs for most of the problems. It's genuinely just a player-to-skill gap. Until something changes, people move on or whatever my very little time to play will sadly be spent elsewhere.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Ya unfortunately the community is the worst part about the game at times. Please consider recording the runs you feel like are wild and submitting them for review though!

[@Hadesxo027]

I understand that your experience may differ from others, but the only reason "your disbanded" keys is so low, because its the first week. Everyone wants loot, because an untimed 10 is still going to get you the highest possible gear in your vault. Just as an untimed 8 can still give you the BiS trinket. In 1-3 weeks this number will tremendously increase since many people won't need those items anymore. This is what happened in DF and SL too. I'm a high end M+ player, been 3.5-3.7k whole DF, 3.3-3.4 in SL and I don't feel this season so far. 1. People go to 8-10s without understanding mechanics: The number of clueless people I see in my keys is just insane. Look, I understand that everyone wants the highest loot, but especially with this dungeon tuning and dungeon pool it ain't work. In DF almost every boss (except 1-2) was doable with 2 dps "just slower". Most bosses are currently undoable if you lose one person (and cannot resurrect them). Personally I do not appreciate meeting people who don't understand mechanics in 9-10 keys which which usually result in a huge timewaste after all. Yes, I'm looking at Necrotic Wake 3rd boss. 9/10 groups on 9-10 just cannot do it. Putting aside how much DPS you need to pump, the bugs (hooking totem, pets, etc) they just straight mess up both hooks. 2.5k players which is considered "good" now. 2. 4 tier pieces + AOTC + full enchant (rank 3) + 620 ilvl: Obviously you want the highest ilvl in your group, but when I see "note piece + enchants" in a +8 I get really angry. I have friends who waste WoW tokens like there is no day tomorrow, so that they can put 30-40k enchants on a gear they will change likely in a week, but we shouldn't enable this madness. I hate doing my own keys, but without it, having multiple 3.5k++ seasons people are still treating me like a nobody. Have +11 timed to get into an 8. Be meta class because obviously as a non meta (even though I beat "meta dps" all the time) I cannot do a 9-10 or higher key. The best is when I get whispers like "sorry, 615 ilvl minimum and 8/8 HC". I know.. I could do my own keys, but what if I don't want to 1. risk having people who are putting half their effort into my key? 2. I want a key which I still didn't get since the beginning of the M+ season? I want to get into a 9 GB but I just cannot. I have 8 timed which I did with our premade (who are out for a week). Should I redo content so maybe after 10 keys I will actually get an GB? 3. Affixes (so far one): If you CC 10, you get 20% haste, because each gives a 2% haste bonus. If you miss 10, your enemy/ies will get 100% haste. Yeah, I guess that's a huge "kiss-curse" effect, when the penalty is 5x higher. Did we actually tackle the situation when the affix can spawn in a distant location effectively buffing the boss / enemies? Or the other affix which is literally "moving towards" the boss? How on earth this is a thing? Imagine last boss in Grim Batol where you must move and you have limited space. I cannot wait for that great affix, so we can wipe because nobody will be able to do affix. Don't get me wrong, I do affix as a dmg dealer and people tend to do affix too, but it is rather an inconvenience, than a cool stuff. You need to decide whether you CC mobs or do affix. I'm well aware sometimes they do overlap so your "mob" CC actually affects the Affix too, but that's not 100% of the case. We have already enough to deal with yet we have an affix which makes you choose one option over another. Bonus is the thing you were talking about. Dungeons are already punishing (running back, etc), but now 10 deaths can actually mean a deplete. 4. Blizzard Listens / dungeon imbalance: Honestly I hate Blizzard and Blizzard devs. I can already hear "just send me your gold before you leave", but I do hate when Blizzard re-realizes the obvious every single time. We have PTR where people like you and me spend our time, we give feedback then at season start you see this happening over and over again. Overtuned bosses, mechanics, bugs everywhere. I am well aware that the more ilvl we get the easier it gets, but I do not expect things to become significantly easier in 15 ilvl. Dungeons are currently completely off the chart, we had 14 minutes for the last boss in 10 Ara kara where 2 dps (who obviously didnt have any idea what to do) and healer + tank + me finished the key still +2-ing it. Same goes for Dawnbreaker. The amount of enemy forces needed is laughable, bosses with minimal "common sense" can be done and you can easily time it or +2 a 9-10. Then you go to CoT and most bosses will wipe your group, including last boss fight, which is a huge check for everyone. Stonevault 2nd and 4th boss are also brutal. The difference between Mists 10 and CoT 10 is way bigger than it was in S1 DF (Court of Stars vs Azure Vault). Again this boils down to PTR feedback which I know many players did. I have no clue what for since Blizzard again seemingly didn't bother at all.

[@leon03k]

I’m in the +7 bracket and it’s super frustrating pugging keys as a healer and than finding out people don’t know mechanics. The worst is having people under 600ilvl running this keys. At least make an effort and running lower keys, learn and practice mechanics and increase your gear score before joining such key

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@Hadesxo027 uhh yes I'm aware of it being the first week and that people are staying in keys for gear. Please do not insult me with that nonsense as if it's my first season pugging.

[@Hadesxo027]

@@heythereguysitsMetro Yeah, great response to my comment which addresses many real issues which players are facing now. With all seriousness I wish you didn't reply just to say this. There are so many things which could be addressed, but you chose to pinpoint that "duh I know it bruh".

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@Hadesxo027 my initial response is actually removing your comment. You just posted you complaining. I'm not reading or engaging with that. Best of luck. The forums are a good place for that.

[@valrath84]

I give you props cause tanking m+ in pugs this week has been nothing but misery

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Oh ya? Maybe it's just blood but it's been very fun so far. Could be the lack of fortified too haha

[@DaikoLP]

thank you for the video 🎉 i don’t even find stonevault keys 😂

[@MostlyFish21]

Dude same here, the only keys that show up for me are Seige, Necrotic Wake, and Mists 😅

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

You can always search individually too don't forget!

[@scottegly89]

I am healing and some dungeons are ROUGH, but I am absolutely loving this season.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Glad to hear you are enjoying it

[@kozstreamstv]

The thing that bothers me the most is that we're punished 3 times overall when doing a M+ which end up in depletion. For any key over 7 anyway, first, 15 second death penalties, 2nd, they key depletes, meaning now you have to run a 6 to go fail another 7, this needs to be changed so keys no longer deplete, and 3, you get less crests for failed keys. Its never been this punishing to fail a M+ key. I honestly think with the changes most people will get KSM week 2 and stop playing, or login once a week to do their key. I've already experienced a bunch of sub 7 keys where there was 1 wipe and people insta left. The only light at the end of the tunnel is that as we go up in gear 7-10's should start feeling easier, but our gear will increase but player skill level will remain the same.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@kozstreamstv you don't get punished additionally for failing a key because of an affix that makes it harder to upgrade a key. The affix is what caused the failure, not the punishment. But ya at the end of the day I agree that changes need to come. But it's been this way for a long while and people do keep coming back so I wouldn't worry. The big thing to think about is the lack of affixes changing weekly so people will quit more over repetitive gameplay rather than anything else, in my eyes.

[@andymars650]

Glad to hear you're enjoying it! I'm also mostly a pug/solo player, and I think they kinda messed up by making delves too easy for the rewards. I play more casually than you and I usually enjoy the lower (2-7ish) M+ just because it's less competitive and people are nicer. Now it feels like they're obsolete from a gearing perspective. 10s also have way too many people who paid for a boost and don't know what they're doing. Hopefully that sorts itself out in a few weeks. I'm planning to tank on an alt, so I'll be watching your stuff to see what's up from a tanking perspective. Keep up the good work, Metro!

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Ya the gearing situation is certainly weird. But that's a good thing if you aren't interested in pushing, you can just stick to delves!

[@CatDad312]

Grim Batol’s linear layout, small trash packs and straight forward tank mechanics translated into a perfect M+ dungeon. The last boss is the only real challenge but it’s quite fun and if you wipe, it’s very obvious what you did wrong. This dungeon really helped me improve as a tank. Sadly I can’t say the same for some other dungeons that are a bit convoluted with poor layouts. I will also say that Delves have been a huge factor for early gearing where in the past you didn’t have alternative solo content for gear to get you into M+

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Grim batol is the best dungeon of the season and that is absurd to say out loud.

[@wiskeeamazingdancer4964]

​@@heythereguysitsMetroExept the last boss where everything is purple and you can't see the tentacles under boss.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@wiskeeamazingdancer4964 I don't have this issue myself so might be something with your monitor. I would say my issue is it gets too dark though. I have to adjust my blinds in the late afternoon when I'm on that fight because the contrast from the bright room with the dark does make it hard to decipher edges.

[@skrabio]

Dawnbreaker for me has always been either a breeze or a complete downward spiral. It also kills me that you cannot mount on a repair mount because of the flying buff.

[@steiige]

Jeeves (engi), Reaves (engi), Auto hammer (auction house) and there’s some others. There’s also an anvil you can repair at towards the back of the ship.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@skrabio oh wow didn't realize that. There is a repair NPC on the boat though at least.

[@Aethermie]

The difference of dungeons' difficulty is absolutely weird How could they create 2nd boss of Dawnbreaker and twin-boss in stonevault in the same xpac. Like one has basically 2-3 mechanics for each role and the other is hard to evenexplain?! Difficulty spikes with affixes are also brutal. Going into +10 after +9 is just another level. Suddenly mists feel like it's difficult after the very first mobs kill players in 2 jumps. Finishin 9th key on +2 is arguably easier than timing +10 at all. Except for that its the most enjoyable season for me in some time. As a healer there are many hps-checks that are hard to beat but if you do it feels amazing and even pugs are praising you for it. Also it is the first xpac for me where I managed to finish highest vault reward in first week. Not sure if its about season being easier or me becoming a better player.

[@nodrog051]

Now Golf will drive you MAD

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Had the best day of the year out there, funny sport.

[@lizzaroo]

My main issue is how long it takes to actually get into a group. Even with 595 ilvl it takes me ages to get into groups for M0 and 2+ to actually get started. I'm not sure if it's because so many DSP classes are pretty good right now so the sheer number of people applying makes it very easy to skim off the top and pick out the very top of ilvl applicants or if people have a distorted view of the ilvl you need in these lower keys. Every key I've managed to get into has been a fine, in both doing DPS and not falling over from a single hit. Letting us apply to more than 5 groups at a time could help with this issue.

[@AzureLaaz]

Agreed - this is still an issue at 602 ilvl on a Rogue with ~1400 score. It may be because I played Shaman in the past seasons and I just got invited for lust but it has been way tougher to get invited this season.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Right ya that's why you just do your own key. Especially for low difficulty content, no reason not to.

[@antons7210]

Yeah, just do your own key tbh. Not worth signing up for others as DPS at least

[@Kabo0meh]

me and the boys never grind gear early so we never overgear the m0s, at 560-570 they were about appropriate tbh. Do it wrong and you die, do it right the boss dies.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@Kabo0meh 560 is like REALLY not grinding gear though lol...

[@danoizedafunk753]

Yeah I did Grim for the first time today. It was very hard, we didn’t time it, but it was the most fun I have had in a dungeon so far. I think they did a great job at it. I think group comps in there will be interesting too. I was praying our mage would de-curse at some point lol spoiler, he didn’t 😂

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@danoizedafunk753 ya decursing is HUGE in there too. Great dungeon though all around.

[@zachemorgan]

the gearing thing is not an issue its been great imo. i didnt do one delve so i had none of that gear i couldnt do heroic with my guild and its hard to get an invite. i think gearing is great atm because i was able to keep up somewhat on ilvl with people exploting and pushing it to the max. The fights are hard if u don't know whats happening which is why the lower u go they almost get harder in a weird way. +2's on my monk are feeling like +8's on my shaman simply because of the players. I'm finding the 3rd boss in grim batol as a wall boss, people don't switch to adds people are still getting launched into the abyss in a +7 mind u seeing alot of tanks not knowing to run from mace.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

If you are running into wild runs of grim batol record them and send them in! Gonna be a treasure trove of great moments this season.

[@ZACKandATTACK]

I don't necessarily like the new affix system, but I do prefer it to the old one. The extra death timer sucks and feels really bad, but at least it isn't making my actual gameplay feel miserable. The best affixes in the old system were the ones that were irrelevant to where you basically ignored them. However, even those affixes felt awful when you were not in a good coordinated group. Sanguine got nerfed how many times, but it was still really annoying with certain mobs that loved to stand in it forever or when your tank isn't moving perfectly when a mob dies. Afflicted was one of the easiest affixes in the game if you had 2 people dispelling. However, I still had to solo dispel and heal the other one constantly or else I would lose all my haste and we would wipe. It's only the first week, but the Xalatath affix feels a lot better in shaking up gameplay week to week without making the game less fun. Every class has an AoE stop that they can use when the orbs spawn to then get a pretty good reward. The mobs do get buffed if you fail, but the incentive structure makes it so that others want to be dealing with the affix instead of ignoring it completely and letting it be the healer's problem.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@ZACKandATTACK ya I can totally understand that perspective. For me the thing that "feels" the worst though, is doing a full key and not succeeding. This new affix situation seems like it's going to make that happen a lot more so that's less favorable for me.

[@evildarkeevildark5943]

well here comes the early 1-3 day of delve where we rushed like 20-30 idk alot.. in 5-6 min down xD and we all got 603 or.. 610 ilvl gear like free so ye :) m0 are for start gearing anyway

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

?

[@MethielVerd]

I agree dwanbreaker is an easy dungeon, with one condition. the amount of bugs in there that will cause random deaths is absurd and it never should have gone live with all of them. pallies being able to BOP off the "debuff" allowing you to fly during the first boss. (this may have been fixed since i watched it happen) unable to mage blink, or warlock circle (NOT GATE) the beams on first boss without getting hit. first boss exploding and deleteing people clearly not inside the bubble. ground effects not showing up during the first and last boss while on the boat (could be lumped in with general ground effects not showing up anywhere but so far ive only encountered this while on the boat) falling through / off the flying boats before the first boss. after last boss, will wipe the group if the "debuff" (the light) falls of while on the little RP boat to the chest most of these are controllable by players and just add extreme frustration to the dungeon in general and will make it commonplace when you get to the "death affix" level of keys people will just drop as soon as more than one person has a problem. very pessimistic view, but i just ran one and tank couldnt land on the side boats at all followed by group disband

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@MethielVerd oh ya been talking about all this for a long time now. It's the worst idea for a mythic plus ever. But at least it's easy.

[@amandarinorange91]

I like the kiss curse affixes a lot more than sanguine. Yes, they're more challenging, but that's not a bad thing. The death timer affix is bad design, though. I just find some of the dungeons/bosses to be too much. The SL dungeons may be a bit too easy, grim batol right on the money, several others need to be brought down to grim's level.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Ya it's a pretty bad season in terms of balance so far.

[@BenJonesart]

Well let me tell you, my experience has been the exact opposite. As an average to above average player/tank, anything i run over +4 has been a deplete with random pugs and really doesn't matter which key and it usually comes down to at least one boss per dungeon...Mist/second boss, NW/ 3rd boss, SV/2nd Boss, ect ect. Much like you 99% of my keys are pug based since i only have about 3-4 days at most to play and one of those nights is dedicated to raid. I have friends in dedicated groups and been doing well, most of which are KSM while i sit now in the 500s or so because i just cant time anything over a 4, nor upgrade my gear because i need the shards from +4...Ive had to solo last bosses in prolly 50% of my completes (anecdotal). AND, i would say most issues arise from mechanics because things are now more lethal when compared to M0, which i agree with you M0 should have been MUCH harder and more representative of what we would be seeing in M+ now for the average everyday joe and new player base. DK doesn't feel as fun because even now when you do things the "correct way" it feels like im on the edge of death most times and initial snap agro can be a problem with warriors right now on pull. Now i say this as near 50 year old player so maybe the youngins are having a better overall time but feels like im just barely holding on when compared to expacs/seasons since BFA.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Well all I can say is if you are running into trouble in low keys please record them and send them in for review! We can laugh and we can also learn together!

[@_deepcalm_]

i feel the dungeon tuning is okay. they need to adjust a few bosses i think but overall it's just a learning curve. it feels like people were spoiled by how relatively easy the season 3 and 4 dungeons were in DF compared to this season, and are carrying that energy still. the nerfs to VDH were a big thing as well, i think the overall dps population got used to just letting the tank handle so many of the ints and stops (in addition to how they changed mob casting). also, tanks in general are just squishier. in addition, people are still learning these dungeons and are standing in mechanics, pulling extra mobs with their long range aoes, and not using personals when they should. i have been having fun but i really wish people would stop leaving at the first sign of the key being possibly bricked. ppl need to stick around and learn the dungeon, even if it's not timed.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Leaving early is unacceptable. Best advice I can give is to not let people think it's okay to do it. Message them and challenge them on it. Let them know you are not happy with their behavior. It won't help in that key, but if every time they behaved selfishly people pushed back against them, they would eventually start considering the rest of the group before they make decisions.

[@_deepcalm_]

yea i really don't understand leaving unless you're wiping over and over again on the beginning trash or first boss. but i really do wish people would stick around to learn the fights. you're right about letting people know that leaving is bad behavior - i probably will start msging leavers to push back.

[@s0515033]

Was in siege and the first boss had people actively kiting the boss around bombs. So many silly deaths. I can understand mistakes, but stuff like that makes low keys impossible 😂

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Ya we have seen some bad ones. Did the two hour ten siege where the mage was just walking away from the boss and getting meleed instead of blinking and being in position earlier.

[@Nightstalker314]

Siege of Boralus and Grim Batol need some adjustments. Overall the dungeons with the lowest success rates according to raiderIO. Made a post about it on competitive WoW (same account name as here).

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Hmm maybe at the absolute top end? No shot those are the hardest atm at the level I'm at. Siege is actually one of the easiest I'd say.

[@Nightstalker314]

@@heythereguysitsMetro Might be for experienced people. It performed the worst in all of BFA according to RIO. It was also progress/reputation locked within the first few weeks of BFA. People in general have very little experience with it.

[@kamuimac]

regarding the new affix - its obvious what blizzard plan is - they bring m+ close to raiding . +4 is basicly jump from normal to hc raiding - thus 10 % + 25 % differenceo n bosses makes liek 35 % gate - very close to the jump from normal to hc raiding. its horrible for bad players but for good players its amazing because it keeps "baddies " in the bracket below 4/5 while goo players push 8-10 :)

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

I would not say this is happening at all so I would be careful calling this obvious.

[@kamuimac]

@@heythereguysitsMetro your perception is twisted by the fact you are pushing +10s as tank do easy mode unlike dps have. I spend literaly 3 evening with pugs complelty incapable of clearing +4 or +5 in time. Its complete total failure .

[@zizthesin]

i've ran about 20 keys so far. i've depleted 5 keys and only had 2 disbands, one due to gear check and one due to lack of mechanical knowledge. I've only been toxiced out of m0s, lower and raid pugs. I'm loving m+ now. I love that the lower keys are harder and that we don't have to split rating between weeks. Dungeon Mechanics seem more important because of the nerf to casting and CC interacting in keys and how quickly things scale up. I feel extremely motivated.

[@tylerstewart3181]

Lower keys are harder? What?

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Glad to hear you feel motivated.

[@dr3armer]

I think they overdid it a bit making gear rewards higher up the key ladder. I think DF was a good mix between not too easy not too hard. This season alot of casuals are gonna quit early on and make it harder for us to queue up. Its the first season and im already sitting in queues twice as long. Maybe im wrong though well have to see how the season plays out

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@dr3armer not sure what you mean here or how this relates to gear. But you can always do your own key. Highly recommend if you are just looking to climb.

[@dr3armer]

@@heythereguysitsMetro i try that but literally no one wants to do a 5 or 6 everyone wants either a 7 or a 9/10. Basically 2-6 is irrelevant now and you sit in queue for an hour finding a competent group. Or you finally push to a 7 and its city of threads or nw

[@raymondandsweetheart7150]

My experience in m+ is the dawn breaker I'm dancing having the time of my life. Then I get 7 necrotic wake and I want to kill my self. then need to balance the difficulty of some of this dungeons.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Necrotic wake is so easy though. What would you want to see balanced?

[@raymondandsweetheart7150]

@@heythereguysitsMetro Maybe it was the pug I was in. I'm traumatized by my experience there.

[@Regis_Philbin]

Had 75 deaths in my last CoT group :,)

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@Regis_Philbin ya sadly that's probably not even uncommon.

[@Aegea291]

It’s odd. I’ve had groups on any dungeon where it’s been a complete clown fiesta and then you get the odd one or two in a row and it just feels like normal M+. For me DF season 4 felt much rougher at the start. And yeah, stonevault just seems un upgradable and they will need to nerf it. And for me, mists is easy, necrotic is easy (except if your group can’t do stichflesh), city of threads is kinda easy except maybe last boss, a kara is pretty hard, grim batol is hard but quite fun, dawnbreaker is medium and a bit annoying. Siege is pretty easy, and stonevault OP. The variance in difficulty is wild.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Make sure you are recording and submitting those ones you'd consider a "clown fiesta!"

[@bojnebojnebojne]

Yeah my group did a +9 and we used 3 javelins on Surgeon Stitchflesh and then we have an Arcane mage doing a casual 4mill dps on it.. while my own Havoc DH did around 2mill with an Aug ofc.... Nerf magicks plox!

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Arcane is all about burst though, always had been. That's more of a misunderstanding than an imbalance.

[@bojnebojnebojne]

​@@heythereguysitsMetro Yeah that's why they have gotten nerf after nerf. I don't misunderstand anything. I fully understand that a burst spec like Arcane will exponentially scale with all dmg amplification multipliers like the Bloody Javelin. It's one of the reasons why we stack any dmg amps like battle pots and on-use trinkets with PI and Hero / BL with offensive cooldowns on all classes. It's the same concept but the difference is that a spec like Arcane simply scale more exponentially compared to pretty much every other spec with that, especially on a fight like Surgeon Stitchflesh with a stacking Bloody Javelin dmg amp.

[@captainpandabear1422]

Your thesis that this season is just super easy? Strongly disagree. Actually getting to 10s feels like an impossible goal for me right now at 610, and I got KSM all seasons in DF and KSH once, so not a total noob. These dungeons feel hard, maybe because people don't know them, but these are not easy by any means. This is just a you thing.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Huh? Give the video another watch lol

[@sdfds1973]

want to rip my hair off.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

Why

[@celery4564]

I really don't like any of the dungeons and the new affixes this season so probably for the first time in a while just not going to bother with them much, might get a couple of slots a week in the vault but not eevn going to go for mythic track.

[@heythereguysitsMetro]

@@celery4564 ya it's not a good dungeon pool but it's still a load of fun. You'll give it a try, don't lie!