Ozempic: Miracle Weight Loss Drug Or A Secret Killer? - Johann Hari

Johann Hari is a journalist, a writer and an author.
From fad diets and fasting to vibrating plates, the quest for easier weight loss has been endless. The recent emergence of Ozempic and similar drugs promises a no-strings-attached solution to achieving the body you've always wanted, but is this actually a new miracle drug or a bundle of hidden side effects?
Expect to learn the biggest impact Ozempic is having on people’s lives, why these drugs work so well, what it's like taking Ozempic, the potential long term side effects, whether Ozempic is different to weight loss drugs of years past, how these drugs interact with our modern diets, the potential problems for people with eating disorders and much more...
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00:00 Johann’s Weight Loss
05:11 Is This Any Different to Previous Pills?
11:29 How Common Are Weight Loss Drugs?
15:10 Why Society Has Become More Obese
21:29 Taking Away the Pleasure of Good Food
30:19 Why Not Just Diet & Exercise?
38:05 Most People Are in an Unfair Fight
43:10 How the Drugs Impact Other Behaviours
47:17 Main Risks of Taking These Drugs
52:38 How Weight Loss Drugs Impact Muscle Mass
55:04 Our Appearance-Obsessed World
1:03:53 Johann’s Thoughts After Writing the Book
1:10:52 Where to Find Johann
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Get in touch in the comments below or head to...
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[@ChrisWillx]

Hello you savages. Get my free Reading List of 100 life-changing books here - chriswillx.com/books/ Here's the timestamps: 00:00 Johann’s Weight Loss 05:11 Is This Any Different to Previous Pills? 11:29 How Common Are Weight Loss Drugs? 15:10 Why Society Has Become More Obese 21:29 Taking Away the Pleasure of Good Food 30:19 Why Not Just Diet & Exercise? 38:05 Most People Are in an Unfair Fight 43:10 How the Drugs Impact Other Behaviours 47:17 Main Risks of Taking These Drugs 52:38 How Weight Loss Drugs Impact Muscle Mass 55:04 Our Appearance-Obsessed World 1:03:53 Johann’s Thoughts After Writing the Book 1:10:52 Where to Find Johann

[@Tommysimonsen]

We make Ozempic here in Denmark it`s for diabetics not weight lose, American doctors are crazy. Apparently the UK once as well.

[@SaarLeestMee]

Thank you Chris for all the available for everyone information through your channel and podcast ❤ much love and gratitude from Belgium

[@CarnifaxMachine]

It's so unbelievably wild to me that we go through this two-step process of 1) eating hyper-processed, dogshit modern food and becoming obese, then 2) using a highly-advanced modern pharmaceutical product to cure the problems from step 1. Instead, you can just take 0 steps, and eat what a normal evolutionary human would have eaten 50,000 years ago. Meat, fruits, veggies. Maybe throw in some whole grains. Our further divergence from our evolutionary past is a huge problem.

[@chmicharka]

It is literally *amazing*, the lengths people will go just to avoid these simplest facts. Surely not everyone on the planet who isn't overweight and eats PROPER FOOD is a god of willpower, we just kinda use common sense. Also the vast majority of people trying to lose weight are not really trying, they keep seeing the process as a terrible period they need to endure before they can get back to eating (and living) like pigs. I've seen it over and over, it is moronic. Not to mention the cost of medical care for obese people with a plethora of health issues, which in my country is state-provided, meaning that few doctors who remained need to literally waste their time and tax payers' money on people who have no self-control whatsoever. "But the poisonous food" - yeah I don't care, it is the same exact food available to me in the same exact supermarkets I go to, I just somehow decide against it.

[@andrewdominowski4631]

Agreed, but sayin all that won’t get you elected

[@LaserLips2]

@@chmicharka Seems like you missed the points that Johann and Chris made here. Highly processed, highly satiating foods have created an unfair imbalance in our dietary lifestyles; the odds are unfairly stacked against people who are trying to lose weight. These foods hijack the natural order of our base satiation mechanisms. We already know, based on unanimous statistics and studies that diets and exercise almost always result in failure. So unless you agree that there should be an almost totalitarian level crackdown on these highly processed foods, then perhaps it is best that we do look at other solutions, i.e. these sorts of medications. Medicating our way around avoiding death is not exactly new.

[@chmicharka]

@@LaserLips2 Again the same foods me and everyone else are exposed to. I see all the points very clearly and have myself had an issue with weight in the past so I know a bit about this, those are not unfairly stacked odds, it👏is👏a👏choice👏 And making a good choice requires having relevant information and some willpower. Period. *Unfair* is not a word you want to be using in describing the odds of people who want to drop excess body fat that did not accumulate overnight but through repeatedly horrible food and lifestyle choices over a period of time. There is no excuse, please do not @me ever again, thank you.

[@LaserLips2]

​@@chmicharka It's a comment section, I'll @ whoever I want. Look. Props to you on tackling weight loss through pure willpower -- but we don't live in a world where everyone is educated enough or mentally resilient enough to do what you have. You are the exception, not the rule. No matter how loud you scream "JUST EAT BETTER AND DO EXERCISE, IT JUST TAKES WILLPOWER!", it won't change the raw data or reality that people are fat, and nothing seems to be working on a meaningful level to change that data. FYI, if it sounds like I'm making excuses, just letting you know, I'm not fat and never have been, on the contrary I am quite fit.

[@MalachiCorliss]

We actually do know why people seem to gain the weight back after dieting… It’s because they can’t stick to the lifestyle necessary, and will power isn’t a good way to stick to something. Instead, what you need to do is pick a lifestyle you ENJOY and is SUSTAINABLE.

[@alexmeier1]

There is no way in hell Ozempic, and drugs like it, don't have horrific long-term side effects. Especially for people who take it for long periods of time.

[@davidnoonan7893]

Yep, I couldn’t agree more… and my sis in law said she’s on it for life , she took it to lose 15 lbs, and plans to never stop🤦🏻‍♂️

[@sherridevries9144]

​@davidnoonan7893 😮😢

[@ShayMaxx]

I hope not 🥲 then again, I can’t think of any drug that doesn’t. I even worry about my piers that pop ibroprofen and paracetamol daily for headaches and migraines

[@TheRexTera]

Biggest is simply that it doesn’t cure “bum-brain”. Only suffering and willpower can cure that.

[@WadmanP]

"... people who take it for long periods of time," And in large doses! When they throw out all these percentages like 15% or 21%, that's not 15% of fat. It's total weight loss which includes muscles. Another word for that type of weight loss is starvation.

[@ThriftingSquirrel]

Ozempic hides health issues that poor diet might initially display as weight gain, it does’t stop people being malnourished, even if they do lose weight, and the vast, vast, vast number of people who exercise a bit more and eat a bit healthier, do lose weight. Never mind that this is seriously harming those needing the drug for its actual purpose of helping those with diabetes.

[@richiekirby8751]

How does it hide health issues? Genuinely curious.

[@mvabdyke52]

research study?

[@chrisschene8301]

I am almost 72 and never thought I would live this long. I prefer fighting it with diet and exercise.

[@jenanne31]

Thank you! So did I. It's not easy -- but it's pretty simple.

[@chrisschene8301]

@@jenanne31 Also, since I am just slightly obese, my insurance won't pay for it. I have always had a tendency to be pudgy but I controlled with exercise by studying martial arts all my adult life. I estimate I burned 1200 calories each martial arts workout and I did it regularly until age 57. I just could not take punishment any longer and my GP doctor advised me to find some lower impact form of exercise

[@jenanne31]

@@chrisschene8301 I walk and do Pilates and Qigong online. So far, it's working.

[@tswierczek]

This isn't going to end well.

[@lordjaraxxus663]

Might be because you dont want to. Why?

[@bellakenny-ph8dd]

Thats what I said. Lol

[@w00t3r]

What if the amount the food you eat reflects the nutrients the body needs to fill the reserves and operate? Satiety postpones because you don't get enough from the processed foods...so if you take a drug that mimics satiety and keep eating crap, cutting the quantity, it will surely end well

[@TheCrazykid0416]

yes this is what i think is happening; it's the reason red meat has such high levels of satiety; people are eating terrible fake food then wondering why they aren't full, then overeating because of it, then going on a medication just so they can eat a little less of the same bad food? doesn't seem like the best plan

[@user-dy9oo6vd1b]

In the book the author lists 'possible malnutrition' as a side effect for this very reason. The same thing can happen after gastric surgery.

[@jennysiepka9900]

Yes!!!!!​@@TheCrazykid0416

[@alexanderbruce8014]

Great point

[@StrongopinionsRus]

Exactly-if you are stuffed after three bites, even if those are three very nutrient dense bites-it’s going to be impossible to get the nutrients you need from food, which we know is the best source of nutrients.

[@TrajanTC]

Im really struggling with this episode & weight loss drugs in general. I have been out of shape many times in my life, but I learned discipline and willpower in this domain of life to overcome this. I didn't always have strong dicipline/willpower, its something that I intentionally trained. I really dont think im special at all. I just learned about healthy habits and, over the course of several years, worked on my discipline and slowly implemented healthy habits into my life. I have so much empathy for people struggling with their weight, and I do think drugs like Ozempic could be a great intervention in some situations, but I really struggle to believe that I and others who maintain a healthy lifestyle are somehow special or have some other worldly will power that obese people dont have. I know many obese people who are very hard working and disciplined in other domains of life. I believe that the vast majority of people have the capacity to live a healthy life if proper education about food, and the reasons why one may be overeating/living a sedentary lifestyle is addressed on a personal level, as well as conciously worked on by the individual over the course of several years. I used to eat terriblely, play video games until 4 am, get 2 hours of sleep, miss all my classes, and hardly exercise. I did that for a long time and just worked slowly to build my discipline and change my habits one at a time. Im willing to believe that there are genetic compenants that make this significantly more difficult for some individuals. I for example have terrible Insomnia, and always have and likely always will. Most of my life slept 2-4 hours a night, but now I sleep 6-9 hours a night. It is such a problem that I have to structure my entire day around optimizing for sleep, or it wont happen. It woukd be very easy to take a pill, but that would likely degrade my health, so Instead I do all of the sleep protocols from Dr. Mathew Walker and i can sleep reasonably well now. IDK MAN.

[@ncamisilengcongca]

Wow!! Well done on improving your life so well 👊🏾👊🏾

[@TheSwauzz]

I'd suggest thinking about all the people this is truly helpful for and isn't a crutch. Like those who struggle with losing weight despite doing everything they should be doing outside of starving themselves. Like those who developed bad eating habits due to depression from other chronic illnesses that keep them from utilizing other healthier coping mechanisms such as exercise. There is no reason anyone should feel negatively about these types of drugs existing. Everyone needs to focus on themselves and stop caring about what others are doing.

[@saturnreturnmagik]

How old were you when you made that change?

[@TrajanTC]

@@TheSwauzz absolutely. I personally have people in my life who I think could benefit from the use of Ozempic as tool along their journey to better health. I just don't like how patronizing the discussion is to suggest that majority of people are incapable of change through discipline, education, and slow implementation of of healthy habits into their lives over the course of several years. This type of mindset will lead to over prescriptions and life long dependency on pharmaceuticals, if not coupled with actual lifestyle changes. If I simply believed that there was nothing I could do to change my health outside of a pill, then I would be taking Ambien every night and my health would be much worse for it. The human spirit is more powerful than any drug. Some people just need more help getting the first few steps going.

[@TrajanTC]

@@saturnreturnmagik Started addressing my health when I was 22. I didn't get to a great place until I was about 26. I am 28 now, still an ongoing iterative process.

[@vanessafields6156]

I took it, it’s both good and horrible, I was 110-120 and even 90 lbs , but recently weighed 150lbs, and I’m short, so I was considered fat. I was rushed to the hospital after three months of taking it. It cause gall stones. I’m a person who walk and run, but eating too much. I noticed my skin all over lost muscle tone and didn’t look right. I stopped and gained 10 lbs within 2 weeks. I have managed to lose it on my own, so this is interesting.

[@Mary-Mar]

I've been following Johann Hari since his Lost Connections book. I clicked on this video because I didn't believe this was the same guy based on the thumbnail image...lol I was like , "Wait, is there another Johann Hari??"...lol I appreciate his honestly, curiosity and vulnerability. If you come from a family like his, like I do (also raised by my mom and grandma), you get it. I can see people on here who are skeptical, but when you've struggled with your weight your entire life, these GLP-1 drugs are a life saver, both figuratively and literally.

[@cecagna]

I've always liked Johann and have bought all his books since his first appearance on the podcast years ago. He's the only one who can make lifetime dependency on a pharmaceutical sound like a plausible solution to our present alimentary hellscape.

[@jozigalm8159]

Lol and he's so good at it. Sounded like a dream until he said deformed children 🙃

[@acmhfmggru]

i agree with your sentiment, but not with your judgment: i think this topic is really interesting and if like to know more, but i can't stand this guest's way of talking.

[@MrSolLeks]

Damn its a lifetime dependancy? No ty, i already smoke lmao.

[@brianmeen2158]

@@jozigalm8159yeah but only 40% chance of having deformed children 😂

[@brianmeen2158]

@@MrSolLeksyeah that’s the problem with chemicals - you have to keep taking them and tolerance is always an issue as are side effects

[@robinp2039]

If i could afford it, i would take it in a heartbeat. I don’t care what the down side is… that is how i have suffered with my weight my ENTIRE life. Now in menopause, I’m trying to lose an additional 30 pounds, and I eat very clean and am very active. It is a living hell to be ruled by food.

[@iss8504]

Are you on hrt? That's the gamechanger here. Do the lifestyle, take the hrt and your life will come back.

[@reacting_to_stuff_]

It felt like I was watching infomercial for Ozempic

[@lelandmassaro4086]

Glp-1s will be used as the tool to fix obesity. Probably one of the greatest medications pharma could make.

[@victimoperated9795]

They said the same thing about Fen-Phen

[@Thrive910]

For real..

[@lelandmassaro4086]

@@victimoperated9795 two completely different things with different mechanisms and different research on side affects. Ozempic has been around for a long time with diabetics.

[@deedeewhipple4668]

Seen the same on Diary with CEO - must be pumping money. Stuff is toxic. Just stop eating food that's poison.

[@KevinJDildonik]

Ozempic taker: I discovered thanks to genetics and Southern parents, I had never felt satiation from eating before. I could eat until my stomach was distended, and I just couldn't shove more in. Or I could get sick. But I never actually felt full. While on Ozempic, I would eat a few bites and my brain just said stop putting food in. Trying to finish the last bite of a burrito could be absolutely gross, when I used to have a psychological need to finish it thanks to my family history. I never felt that before, even after losing a lot of weight through diet and exercise. If you're in this boat, then one vial (as in vial with a pack of syringes not expensive pre-loaded single shots) of ozempic might be smart for you. You don't need any more than that either. People who are lucky enough to have the natural hormones around satiation really do have a gigantic advantage in maintaining or losing weight. And bro communities need to understand this. To put it another way: I lost 100lbs through diet and exercise. It was years of hard work and lifestyle changes and I'm better for it. But if I had the money for ozempic back then, I'd have just shown up 100lbs lighter and thought nothing of it. A lot of "skinny fat" people walk around like that. People who have no muscle but were born thin. The best target for Ozempic is someone who can do both. Take ozempic, and you basically learn how a skinny brain behaves. You can apply that to your daily life. That's the real value - for people who have problems feeling satiation from food. Anyone else. Anyone who feels normal satiation. Does not need ozempic. Unless you're at massive risk of diabetes or whatever. But even then, it seems like fasting can do the same thing. Or batiatric surgery. Or... Ozempic really is a cheat code for weight loss. But like using cheat codes. It doesn't make you good at the game. That will be the big downfall here. Just like people who get bariatric surgery can commit suicide or gain the weight again. Lifestyle changes are mandatory. Drugs are optional. And if you're not going to fix your lifestyle. Don't take these drugs, and don't get the surgery. It won't work. You MUST change your life.

[@BorisBidjanSaberi11]

Why not the surgery where they lap band your stomach or whateber its called? My roommate lost 120 lbs no ozempic and everyone told him it was genetic. Lies

[@kofikyeremateng4249]

Well said! Lifestyle beats drugs and even genetic anomalies to an extent. We can change our weight to whatever we want with the lifestyle we decide to embark on

[@junk_rig_sailor1698]

Put down the Burrito, and start just eating meat. Your body's natural satiation receptors wll kick in, and you will be way healthier. It is not genetics, it is the rubbish food you have been eating that caused the weight gain.

[@TheCrazykid0416]

you might just not be eating the right foods to make you satiated. different foods have different levels of satiety, your body is probably just craving certain foods, not a drug to fix the issue

[@brianmeen2158]

@@TheCrazykid0416 one should not be eating with the purpose of feeling satiated though! We should be looking at food as supplying the nutrients that we need to function Properly. That’s it. Now I can understand occasionally splurging at a restaurant but not every meal

[@ThriftingSquirrel]

An average person relying on Ozempic to lose weight rather than improving his or her lifestyle, and doing the work to be healthier, is really off-putting to me as a personality trait. I’m finally starting to lose weight after years of various attempts, just be cooking more of my meals, increasing my veg and protein intake, and walking a little more. The formula is simple for most people.

[@adamhixon]

Best case scenario a generation or two of people taking these drugs will put the junk food companys out of business and maybe people will have healthy food available to them. I don't mind that path.

[@ClintDowd]

I've lost 60 pounds over the last 2-3 years.... But I've been following the themes of health and wellness that are consistent across the most reliable platforms (including this one). I've also kept it at a sustainable level. Any major changes I've made have been done slowly and I do not exhaust myself in the gym. This followed getting clean and sober 3 1/2 years ago. Maybe getting sober gave me the faculties to make large changes in my life. 🤷 For perspective, at 41 years old I was 5'11" and 260 pounds... I just dropped below 200. I guess my point is that 2 lb lighter seems outrageous on a 2-year diet.

[@philippegauthier5054]

lets go, thats hype asf dude

[@TheRexTera]

Absolutely fantastic guest. Hope he is invited again soon talking about his take on the War on Drugs and his take on antidepressants.

[@teenafrench7236]

God. Thank you Chris. I'm 45 with morbid obesity for 40 years. I have a BMI of 63 weighing in at 183kg. I have PTSD from years of yoyo-dieting, bullying, body dysmorphia, binging, purging, starving myself in attempts to lose weight. I don't want bariatric surgery for obvious reasons. I will be using Ozempic soon with a doctor's prescription. I've been following you for nearly a year even though I don't fill out the typical physical demographics of your followers. One day I would like to have a healthy relationship with my "bio/psycho/social" situation; my body and my life. Even after 40 years I have not given up hope. My undying appreciation go to people like you for turning up to make these awesome podcasts. Thank you for continuing to believe in me❤😊

[@sentineluk5059]

Good luck! I hope it works even better for you than it has done for the rest of us. It sounds like you deserve some respite from life's difficulties. Honestly, I hope you find it the awesome team player many of us have in reaching your goals.

[@teenafrench7236]

Your kindness means everything...thank you🌻🐝🍯

[@junk_rig_sailor1698]

Look into just eating the natural food of man - meat. We are not meant to eat carbs. Start with Keto if you need to, then move onto Carnivore. It's not a diet - its the natural food of man and is why our brains started growing so big compared to our ape cousins. It will naturally induce the satiation cycle as well. Go look up videos on youtube of the Carnivore Diet - there are now plenty of them. You don't need surgery or some stupid pills that could kill you anyway. Thank me later once you have done at least 6 months of keto then carnivore, and seen the weight just drop off.

[@TheCrazykid0416]

i would strongly recommend looking into the serious side effects of the drug before you start. my mom is on it and she has daily nausea in the morning, almost every single morning. it literally paralyzes your stomach, some people have it permanently paralyzes where even after the drug is gone they still have issues. no shame in any of this, sorry to hear you went through all of that; i just hope you are aware of the potential side effects before attempting a novel medication like this. if you havent tried the diet of carnivore/meat/high-protein, i would maybe suggest considering that before the medication, it helped me lose 50+ pounds without meds. it's all about metabolism and understanding how seed oils and other bad additives and hormone-disrupters affect our metabolism, and as such our ability to gain/lose fat. best of luck.

[@MutantMessiah]

As someone with BED, I am envious of those that used these drugs to address the disorder. At this point I'm dealing with sunken cost after "getting in shape" the "hard" way and would only take it if I regained the 60 lbs I lost.

[@iss8504]

The thing is, ozempic shows that there is an addiction aspect to obesity. It's the food. Most of us live on processed food. Change the food, change your life. I am on a meat based diet, low carbs, zero processed food. Zero craving for sugar. Once you switch over, if you eat the processed food you actually feel sick afterwards. I cannot eat potato chips for instance, nor any of those carby snacks because the seed oil makes me really ill. The biggest problem is eating out. They're usingall kinds of junk in the food. If you can eat at home, make food that is whole and unprocessed, ozempic is not needed because you won't have the addiction to the bad foods. Note that fasting also ups glp1 and that's totally natural.

[@Blerwerler]

So, in summary, GLP-01 will be a key component in the composition of ‘Soma’. Horrifying.

[@666atyler666]

Exactly. Don't control yourself. Medicate and continue your gluttony. Don't be one of those people. Act accordingly.

[@Notsram77]

Oh, is this a GLP-01 Receptor Agonist? I didn't realize that from the small talk about Ozempic. I edit medical lectures... and wow. There's a lot of concerning material about this family of drugs.

[@skunknetwork]

WHOA. i was just thinking this. nicely said.

[@loganbristol7148]

Although I enjoyed listening to a perspective that usually wouldn’t show up in my feed, I do wish this guest was a bit less biased. It was pretty clear that this conversation wasn’t in the middle.

[@jorgetinoco3574]

Honest question, but what exactly was his biased about? Like towards the drug? Of course, he said he is taking it. At the end, he gave a fair shot of who should take it

[@loganbristol7148]

@@jorgetinoco3574 I just personally felt that the whole conversation was tilted towards the pro ozempic in all aspects. When I actually wrote that comment was during the part in the video when he was asked about risks and turned it into the positions and pros about the drugs once again. Nothing wrong with him saying all of that, just that I personally wish the conversation was slightly more centered. Still an interesting conversation as all of Chris’ podcasts are

[@jesperburns]

@@jorgetinoco3574 So your question in the beginning is "what was his bias", and then you immediately answer that...?

[@Rambleon444]

Yep. Until Chris asked about the "risk" deep into the interview (47:30) I felt I was listening to a snake oil sales pitch. Johann said there are 12 big risks and then only explained a few, and they were pretty big.

[@rockyf4981]

no way, i'd much rather hear from someone who has an informed opinion after doing sufficient research

[@nloualden-cetrulo8927]

Great guest! I always appreciate the host who doesn't take over the conversation and let's the guest speak.

[@johnnyb4869]

I have type 2 diabetes and all the people taking it for weight loss now it’s very hard to get my medicine 😊

[@Engrave.Danger]

Most people can reverse/manage T2D without medications.

[@davidnoonan7893]

You can thank my sis in law, not the smartest cookie… she got on it to lose 15 lbs🤦🏻‍♂️🙄

[@evamirikantor]

I think mounjaro and ozempic are great, definitely much better then getting surgery!

[@iamhim83]

Amazing watch, thank you

[@allysagilbreath]

The food we eat has very little nutritional value. Even the produce and meat are depleted because the soil is not balanced and the animals are fed junk. Our bodies are craving what they need, which used to mean food. Now where can we get nutrition?

[@BUSeixas11]

In 2011, Hari was suspended from The Independent and later resigned, after admitting to plagiarism and fabrications dating back to 2001 and making malicious edits to the Wikipedia pages of journalists who had criticised his conduct.[1][2] He has since written books on the topics of depression, the war on drugs, the effect of technology on attention span, and anti-obesity medication which have attracted criticism for inaccuracies and misrepresentation.

[@nutritionbyelsa]

SUCH INTERESTING DISCUSSION - I love hearing his opionoin as a NON doctor and actual user, this gave such good insight and jut literaally literally made this epsiode SOOooooOOOOOOOoooo goooodddddddd

[@HoustonNiner1]

Great job Chris & Johann. Learned a lot.

[@yaadhassan4261]

Really enjoyed the conversation, though have a lot to think and say about it, its was indeed a brilliant talk. Noted the amount of swearing by Johann, and I love him for being so true to his talking nature! Well done Chris for such unique and intriguing questions.

[@BABS644]

Chris & Johann this is amazing ! Thank You both !!🙏

[@braddub8145]

So, I'm dubious about Johann Hari, due to his previous issues with plagiarism. I'm listening to the podcast regardless with an open mind, but I will point out that Jay Rayner has completely refuted that he has ever taken Ozempic, so I would definitely say to take all of this with a grain of salt

[@RiverFallsPlantation]

I have not read all the comments so this may have been stated already. The answer is to clean up the highly processed junk we call food and get back to whole real food.

[@anthonyambrose8783]

I enjoyed this interview and I feel like there were many interesting and challenging parts to it but the one bit that really, really stuck out to me was, "this is an artificial solution to an artificial problem." Yeah, no kidding. He said it himself, the state of food today is unrecognizable to what people two generations back would even call food and it is getting worse. This wasn't some natural phenomenon due to changing climates or shortages of food or anything like that. Corporations saw money to be made by - as he said - "manufacturing" food, regardless of the harm their products ended up causing. This is a greed problem. This is a society problem. This is not a biology problem. I know very well what being obese can do to a person and how it not only can shorten their life expectancy but rob them of so much more. In a situation like that, someone telling an obese person with type 1 or type 2 diabetes to "just go on a diet" or "use some self-control" is like telling a house fire it needs to turn off the stove. They are kind of past that point and something needs to be done and done quickly. For them, I see this as an emergency measure that even with any negatives - and there always, ALWAYS negatives with drugs like this - the pros likely do outweigh the cons. But so many of these conversations just stop there and that isn't really solving anything. It is always about the symptoms and never about the real disease. And why is that? We all know the answer. I don't even have to say it. For people who need this kind of treatment to drastically and quickly improve their health or face terrible medical consequences, I am all in favor of it. But for those who want it for nothing more than vanity... I do not believe in outcomes without cost, actions without consequences. The entirety of life and existence is nothing but a system that has said in every possible way - action and reaction, behavior and consequence. Modern society has utterly rejected that basic principle - this is literally a pill you can take in order to try and subvert that truth. There is always a cost to pay. Whatever it is they'll always try to make a pill for that, too.

[@ekjcastle]

As a nurse, ive taken care of too many people whos GI systems become paralyzed from this drug. Im still shocked that people choose to take it.

[@lordjaraxxus663]

seems like a problem of misusage not a problem of the drug itself, manage dosage and timing and that doesnt happen. Misuse it and that happens

[@xaveri28]

Of course, you work at a hospital. You don’t come across the millions that choose to take it and have no major GI issues.

[@Sacarat]

Like all good interviewers, Chris stays out of the way for most of this and lets the guest speak; much appreciated.

[@annam.4184]

Thank you, great info, great insight. I can't say I agree with everything that has been said, though.

[@angiewiggins4118]

You’re right Joel, I never thought of the weight loss, I was just thinking about the addiction aspect. I did not realize that it had such a strong effect on addiction and compulsive behaviors.

[@chrisi6963]

Thanks for the information. Stumble upon your channel during your interview with Dr. Peterson. Appreciate your insight in many issues. Hope this will push the discussion on food industry for better food for us.😊

[@lordjaraxxus663]

Food industry doesnt "push" food bozo, it just makes what consumer wants. Change your consumer behaviour and industry changes.

[@user-iy4qn4kp6w]

Awesome and insightful, both men are incredible

[@mahan.javaheri]

A routine like Carnivore + 10K steps per day should be able to help most people see great results with regards to losing weight right? I've been fit since I was 14 (14%-12% bodyfat) so I dont fully understand the struggle of losing weight. But taking a drug that has such a huge impact on your body and behavior just on a basic principles perspective cannot be a good idea for the long run, right?

[@rovert245]

This is the comment I was looking for. The guest mentions Japan in the first few minutes. Having just moved to Tokyo it really hits home just how sedentary I really was, even though I was working out multiple times a week. Standing for 8 hours, walking all over the place (like our ancestors used to do) will totally rewire your body and, in my experience, suppresses your appetite on its own. Do this for a few months and you'll see why everyone here eats bread all the time but never gains weight. It's also totally normal in Japan to run every morning, then walk/stand all day after, even up into very elderly ages. Walking is the key difference everyone is missing in the diet talks imo.

[@desdts2769]

If that would work for everybody I dont think there would be so many obese people. Most of them have tried various different diets und exercise programms and havent succeeded or gained all the weight back again. It cant be that theyre all simply undisciplined?

[@desdts2769]

2/2 A lot of them are successful in their work lives and have proven to be very disciplined. So why should they not be able to stick to a diet and exercise. Something just doesnt make sense.

[@mark91345]

This was a riveting episode. I've been fat as far back as I can remember, so I can not only relate, but empathize. Over the past few years, the "health issues" are popping up. So, I am going to ask my doctor about these drugs. Somehow, it feels like a letdown because I've always believed that I should be able to overcome this problem. I never have.

[@TheCrazykid0416]

before you ask your doctor and get convinced otherwise, please consider learning about metabolic health and high-protein diets. look into casey means and calley means' work, these drugs have very serious side effects that your doctor will probably not tell you about. learn about exercise post-meal and how that affects your metabolism. dont eat so much before bed, try to get good quality meats in your diet, cut out seed oils, dont have too many carbs, count your macros, there is so much that simply has to do with understanding how your body works before going on a drug. the drug wont teach you any of these things, it'll just patch up the issues your current diet/lifestyle seems to cause, while still causing the issue itself

[@AncientYouth64]

@@TheCrazykid0416 he wont, dont waste your time

[@kiely4561]

@@TheCrazykid0416if he had any dedication and will power to do any of that he wouldn’t need Ozempic lol

[@AncientYouth64]

@@justadude4826 don't know about the rice and beans, but yes to meat and veggies

[@diokdin]

Awesome interview. Very informative.

[@MrZola1234]

Great guest. One push back. Obese women are not being shammed everyday. In the West, we have made it a social crime to say anything even remotely negative about women in any way.

[@solomondavid9811]

Chris is exceptionally sharp and lucid in this episode. Not sure why but whatever he’s doing created an even sharper episode on the whole. Even though I’m a huge fan this episode seems markedly more excellent.

[@Davidipac]

Very eloquent and credible knowledge.

[@NHRebelsthoughts]

It has been a game changer for me

[@avaceleste]

Wait until you hear about the tens of thousands of people taking or who took ozempic and have irreversible effects, such as gastroparesis with no known cure, which makes life nearly unbearable and doesn’t go away when people quit taking ozempic.

[@AKracecars]

I cuss a lot. Watching this podcast episode convinced me to try to stop.

[@dannycobb5052]

Boooo. Fuck that.

[@afailable]

95%+ people who say they can't lose weight, can but won't. Like he said, he could lose the weight but he always put it back on. I hate putting people who actually can't lose weight, and people who choose not to, in the same category. Either way if you want to take the risks of a new drug like this so that you can avoid eating properly and exercising an adequate amount as a perpetual habit, all the more power to you.

[@TheSwauzz]

In order to be on these weight loss medications, you must also change your diet and exercise. Any weight loss clinic/GP/nutritionist that has been properly trained requires this... Please educate yourself before speaking.

[@badaap69]

Great episode and great guest!

[@DianneWestbrook]

Wow that was such an informative interview! I learned so much listening to this. The thing that I think was failed to mention was how much the drugs cost. I believe it's about $1,000 per month in the USA! I don't want the drug but I know people who spend that money to lose the weight and after stopping, because they couldn't afford it anymore, have gained all the weight back again. It's definitely a wealthy person's game

[@Anna-wr2fi]

I thought I was crazy until I started reading the comments section…so glad the majority of people have enough common sense to see what B.S. this is…

[@CarnifaxMachine]

Care to elaborate? In what specific ways is this "B.S."?

[@chmicharka]

​@@CarnifaxMachineHe is not lying BUT is using facts out of context, that is, putting them in a context which only supports his narrative, claiming that it is ok if you have no willpower - "here, take this super expensive drug with questionable side effects, you still won't need willpower" (and common sense, while we're at it) Um, no - if you have no willpower you just die and that's ok. People 👏 are 👏biologically👏built👏to👏struggle👏 If you don't use your brain or your muscles they die off and it makes perfect sense. Looking for shortcuts while not fully understanding the process is indicative of a low cognitive ability.

[@melrose331]

Great interview.

[@donnakona1347]

great podcast. He is such a great speaker and does his homework. I do worry about people that take this drug don't change their way of eating just not eating as much junk food. Dr should give the patient a nutritional guide or a healthy diet. For example eating Keto or Carnivore helps with satiety.

[@mohammadrana2745]

great timing, I just finished Magic Pill.

[@ryanutterback]

Me too. Really enjoyed it.

[@dims1607]

Very good journalism. Well done 👏 👏

[@warpaintjj]

Brilliant episode, Ian paints much like myself, arms length tabletop standard 👌

[@geekspeak1066]

I get the considers but this is an easy choice for those who medically need it. Changing the food system isn’t going to happen overnight. Unfortunately u have to fend for yourself.

[@beddythecorgi4269]

You're buying this crap hool line and sinker by what you just said. Those who need it? No one needs this. The drug literally just causes you not to eat. Ie starvation by another name. Not a single person on this drug wouldn't have benefited MORE from eating vegetables and drinking water and that carries no risk of gut paralysis or thyroid cancer. Stop believing pharma lies that anyone needs this. They may need to lose weight desperately but don't confuse that with needing THIS.

[@TheCrazykid0416]

those who medically need it should go on a high-protein diet, cut out seed oils, eat good quality meats, take walks/exercise after meals to reduce blood sugar, not eat before bed, the list goes on and on. the problem is that those who medically need it are the last ones that should be on the drug itself, these people are literally the exact population that NEEDS to change their lifestyle

[@megalosing5900]

Mounjaro can radically change your diet. I’m eating Whole Foods lots of organic vegetables this week I added purple sweet potatoes and that was a treat. Mounjaro can completely change you I’m in the pool doing water aerobics or swimming 9 hrs this week, I was stationary before. I burned 7400 calories this week on top of my normal crunching tdee weight loss goals. My appetite hasn’t changed. I’m still hungry I just refrain during fasting hours.

[@Jo11ee]

I NEED THE FAT SHAMING FROM THE DALAI LAMA STORY! At any rate, when I was growing up in the 70's, it was extremely rare to see a heavy person, you just never saw it. Today, many of us are struggling with our weight and obese people are sadly becoming the norm.

[@joshmaag2457]

Meanwhile I have a box of ozempic and monjoro sitting in my fridge because I didn’t want to take them anymore because I got my diabetes under control and didn’t need them anymore. Yeah

[@joshmaag2457]

I thought this a medication for diabetes. Because I am not overweight and never was…

[@jackc3727]

@@joshmaag2457 The FDA has approved Semaglutide in a higher dose for weight loss

[@TheSwauzz]

Some of the weight loss injections also serve as a treatment for high blood sugar and were created with that in mind first.

[@lordjaraxxus663]

So you had to use it before finally getting your diabetes under control, makes it useful then.

[@joshmaag2457]

@@lordjaraxxus663 no I didn’t have to use it, just made me feel sick. Only thing I needed was metformin exercise and diet

[@me9061]

Excellent

[@user-dy9oo6vd1b]

Chris is gonna hate most of these useless negative comments. This was a really balanced take on the pros & cons, if it felt like a sales pitch to you you weren't listening to the parts where he outlines the negatives.

[@10.6.12.]

This guy is actually a spokesperson for O . Just listen to him..

[@brianmeen2158]

Yep and it’s a bit disturbing.. instead of teaching people self control and how to exercise let’s just give them a pill so they don’t sit there and end up eating 6 pizzas.

[@devcjg]

@@brianmeen2158 Why does that bother you?

[@jamesnguyen7385]

⁠​⁠​⁠​⁠@@devcjghe gave the reason in his comment, being dependent on a pill instead of exercise/self control is insane.

[@devcjg]

@@jamesnguyen7385 No, that's a reason he shouldn't take it. That doesn't explain why what other people are doing bothers him.

[@rockpete1237]

@@devcjg it could/will encourage laziness in others with equally weak wills. But you’d say again, why does it bother him? Well, that encouragement might affect someone they care about if this is widely accepted in the global zeitgeist. Perhaps a pessimistic and exaggerated prognostication, but it’s worth considering. Just me 2 cents.

[@sc0ldingh0tc0ffee]

Really missed it with the gunshot analogy. Gunshot wounds almost never require amputation.

[@albertoiordanov5972]

When they talked about that side effect of not feeling much pleasure from eating... That's basically how i've always been.I love it though.I can regulate my weight to whatever i want easily and eat super healthy,because why not ? The taste doesn't really matter to me anyway.

[@brek5]

Weird you say that. I do like the taste of food and enjoy it immensely, but when he said, "3 or 4 mouthfuls, and I was done eating." I feel like that pretty much every meal. I'd like to eat more, but I really just can't. If I do, I don't feel bad, just bloated, but that goes away relatively quickly. But I'm basically just like a moderate plate of food and then done. Obviously, I don't have excess weight problems, but I wouldn't mind putting on a bit, actually, haha. Going to have to look into this as he talked about gut biome and such. Maybe I'm already eating something that curbs my appetite?

[@ConnorTrading]

This episode is hilarious. that KFC story killed me🤣

[@heidiescobedo2870]

I feel like the people who are commenting on here seem like fat shamers. Diet & exercise do work for some people. I have battled my weight my whole life. Dieted & lost 15 lbs at a time only to gain it back. I don’t say I never eat bad but I’m not a glutton. I gain really easy. There are some people who can eat whatever & not gain. My husband is a type 2 diabetic. Most type two diabetics are diagnosed bc of lifestyle. He was offered Ozempic by his dr years ago but he decided not to use it. He knows his type 2 is bc of his personal choices so people wanting to lose weight & keep it off using a drug like ozempic aren’t taking a drug away from a type 2 diabetic. It isn’t an absolutely necessary drug for them either. At least people are trying to do something about their health before it be becomes a larger problem with health implications. I’m looking at trying to get on a drug like this. I don’t want to wait until I’m type 2 before I get some help.

[@jozigalm8159]

I feel you. I feel like Hari was fair but this response is to be expected considering Chris' usual bro-ey self discipline/self improvement guest type and audience.

[@TheCrazykid0416]

yeah i think for me the main issue is the side effects of these medications not being talked about responsibly, being written off as if they just dont exist; then on top of that, at the same time, we are ignoring the fact that our diet nowadays has so much processed materials and bad seed oils, etc. people dont eat enough protein and good meats, they eat too much bread, etc etc etc. it really IS, to an extent, all about lifestyle and diet i lost 50+ pounds just cutting out terrible foods from my diet and eating more protein; this stuff CAN be simple, it's about knowledge and understanding, and the problem is no one in this country knows anything about metabolic health

[@heidiescobedo2870]

I hear you @thecrazykid0416. I try my best to stay away from carbs. Eating mostly protein & veggies. Due intermediate fasting majority of the time. Exercise & I still have my struggles. Even doing things in moderation I have a hard time not gaining weight. I was never a skinny kid growing up either. I definitely wasn’t overweight but weight was an issue early on. I played sports & worked for a farming family so I was very physically active.

[@user-dy9oo6vd1b]

@@TheCrazykid0416 It doesn't help that we see wave after wave of flawed 'studies' with conflicting results, based more on whoever funded them.

[@calvinkutemeier393]

This would have been a great 10 minute video

[@devinmims6593]

Your brain is fried

[@shanefeather-lopez5935]

I think we need to consign BMI to the history books... mine is 37.9 (so considered very much obese) but my A1c measure is 5.3, despite my GP assuming and almost starting to treat me as a type two diabetic. People can be large without being unhealthy. The state of the NHS in the UK is abysmal. Instead of taking a few extra simple measurements we should look at someone and assume by that visual inspection what they need.

[@cristinarossi7367]

Chris is great at breathlessly listening to his guest. No interruptions.

[@VWJR86]

Love this interview, its truly going to be interesting to see the ramifications of this in the coming decades. I understand that while diabetics have used it for rougly 2 decades, it hasnt been at the massive quantity of users compared to now. As a person who has been obese over 2/3rds of my life I was always thinking surgery, some other procedure or even these GLP-1 drugs would be the answer. Instead I made a dietary change that has now become a lifestyle. Since Jan 1st I've deopped 77lbs, went from a 42 sized pants to 36/38, and my shirts went from a 4x/5x to 2x/3x. I have yet to even step foot into a gym, and even at my all time highest of 350lbs I would try and walk for at least 30-40 minutes daily, which i still do now, but i can walkuch further in that time period. Shear will power and dietary changes that I can personally sustain for a long term period.

[@lostincredulity5369]

I just 30 lbs in 3 months! Although I did this unaided. I didn’t use a drug I used willpower. It’s horrifying that so many people need to inject a medication as they lack the willpower to make appropriate lifestyle choices. If you don’t want to be obese stop eating so much. Fasting helps develop will power in a natural way.

[@chrisschene8301]

I maintained pretty normal weight up until the age of 58, but I did it by being extremely active in martial arts. I estimate I burned 1200 cal per day working out bike riding and martial arts. At 57, I had to give up martial arts as my joints and bones could no longer take the punishment. I was extremely strong and I switched to other exercises but have the same issue: at my age of 71, I get overuse injuries if I push too hard ar the exercises.

[@shpalman7]

Oh dear. Hari has been called out for plagiarism, was wrong about depression, and is basically wrong about this too, or at least trying to drum up a scare while admitting the drug was good for him and for a vast majority of people currently suffering with obesity. Jay Rayner, for example, has already gone on record that he never took Ozempic, he just once wrote a column explaining why it didn't interest him. This particular "inaccuracy" is repeated at about 23:50 in this interview.

[@brianmeen2158]

He was wrong about depression? In what way? Yeah he’s basically advertising Ozempic as just another “miracle pill” that works for many different things. I’ve heard this about a few other drugs over the years

[@shpalman7]

​@@brianmeen2158 look up Dean Burnett (garwboy) for a reply regarding antidepressants.

[@shpalman7]

He has apparently realized he was wrong about Jay Rayner but said he had the article confused with one by Leila Latif who has never taken semiglutide (or anything similar) either. So that gives you an idea of the level of fact checking we are dealing with.

[@happydog6537]

Call me crazy but the rat test isn’t that just taste. We wouldn’t eat broccoli enough to make ourselves fat if that’s all there was if you eat food for fuel, then you stop if you eat food for emotion you don’t stop if you get joy from food you don’t stop if you eat when you’re sad you don’t stop we eat for every single reason to celebrate if we’re angry if we’re happy but it’s about taste it’s about emotion. If you eat for fuel, you will stop when your tank is full, but we eat emotionally and toasty. I don’t think it’s the brain. It’s the tongue.

[@emmadray9813]

I used to be overweight and now im not. However, I am skinny fat. But I'm trying to fix that with building muscle and eating lots of protein. My main problem is staying full when eating (I am currently in a moderate calorie deficit) but even when I went up to my maintenance calories I still had problems staying full. I can get full if I eat a lot of food but then I gain weight. I think my saitity signals are messed up from years of overeating or its my body trying to get back up to my original weight again. Your body doesn't actually want to be lean because of evolution it panics thinking if a famine happens then you are going to starve and die. I'm not going to go ozempic because that's a road I don't want to go down. Even though it would probably help me be less hungry on my calorie deficit. I'm sure there's another way for me to do it without restoring to a drug. Once I put on more muscle I'll be able to eat more without gaining too much fat anyway.

[@ericdraven3654]

Isnt it funny that we developed a drug to fight the processed food that we also developed? What's next? Will we develope another generetion of food to fight this drugs and start all over again?

[@MrWeebable]

7:40 wow that explains a lot. J wake up hungry perhaps once a month? Used to be more often, seems related to drinking beer, eating bread etc.

[@lisaalexander1824]

Im starting it soon..for diabetes..ive already gone off food...just the thought of unhealthy food kicks my brain into better choices..and hardly any food at all...like im bored with it...talk about mind over matter..i think it was just the knowing that THIS IS IT.. now ..at 67 yo..or never...😮

[@Rakealia]

Very interesting interview here. My MIL is on this drug for weight loss so I was very curious. Personally I have thyroid issues, so I wouldn't dare take it. The processed foods thing is pretty spot on, with a few other things on top of it under the surface from my understanding. Funny enough, for both my second and now my third pregnancy, I get a very similar experience with food to what is being described here with Ozempic. I do find a few select foods I can eat more of though, but the vast majority I only eat a few bites and I feel full, sometimes I have to remind myself to eat or push it even. Weirdest thing and it lasts from about 6 weeks until birth. :/

[@shaunawhitledge8102]

This was very informative but one problem I see for the future is the food companies that make millions on selling ultra processed foods. Many the insurance companies too.

[@ShayMaxx]

Triple G has helped me get to a weight where my CPAP therapy somewhat works for my complicated sleep apnea Miracle drug

[@GeVisacri]

I’ve never been a fan of Johann Hari but I’ve been seeing him in so many podcasts lately that I was definitely curious. It seems this drug has only good miracle things about and it sounds like Johann is being paid to say it.

[@ClintDowd]

Waiting for David Goggins to comment.... 👀

[@lcbrisk1837]

There's a huge amount we don't know.🤨 Go do some sprints, I guarantee you'll be fit. While being aware of your diet, and making healthy choices. I believe diet will be a challenge as well and will most likely account for a balanced weight more so in the long run.

[@TheSwauzz]

My double chondral defect knees would die if I did sprints...

[@viazards]

What happened to good olde whole minimally processed food, protein, vegetables, fruits and moderation? 😅 crazy how far the world has changed

[@AB-im7ek]

Now I know why it's called the Food & Drug Administration. They profit from both ends

[@gratiaDei777]

Weird. Recently: Saw Johann on DOAC, then now here. Saw Nuclear Annie on here, then over on DOAC.

[@yaredyoseph2909]

Yeah. I also observed that. Seems lile things are saturating

[@dylanking1895]

Yeah, it’s generally due to doing media tours after writing a book or something similar, they’ll go on Rogan, Triggernomitry, Lex Fridman, Tom Bilyeu ect.

[@winnieroze]

And Jordan Peterson. Won't be surprised to see Jimmy Carr come on here too

[@brianmeen2158]

Nuclear Annie? I’m intrigued

[@roxsoo_523]

Chris was so locked in for this convo

[@collin9085]

The issue I see is that it stops working if you stop taking it. So basically, you need to spend $1,000 a month for the rest of your life? If you are actually going to make lifestyle changes to loose weight, then you don't need this drug in the first place.

[@Gothicssss]

Yes that's exactly my issue with the drug as well. My parents have both been using these drugs and while my mother has been using it as a "supplement" to her dieting, she doesn't need it all actually. My father is actually obese and uses it to aid him in losing weight, but the moment he stops taking it (which he has done multiple times), he just goes back to his old habits. Dieting as much about eating right as it is about making different life choices and learning about how to cope with the feeling of hunger.

[@thomabow8949]

The latter part of your argument is not entirely correct; it is medically beneficial for you to receive a tool that will help or accelerate weight loss to improve different aspects of your health simultaneously. Such as sleep apnea, hypertension, etc. One can adapt their lifestyle habits simultaneously to taking it; if the party fails to adhere to their lifestyle habits, then they still are at a healthier weight to further combat such habits while not dealing with the myriad of problems obesity entails.

[@StripedCheeseBread]

The drug is not the answer. My goodness people…cook for CRYING OUT LOUD. Get a grain mill. Make all bread products from freshly milled wheat. Your body is cravings minerals and vitamins and not getting them. The electric grain mill should be the staple appliance on the countertop. Leave reviews on your favorite restaurants saying you won’t return until bread products that are 100% fresh milled grains are available. $ speaks. The problem with diets is they don’t handle cravings. The grain mill will. A cookie made with real butter from freshly millled wheat becomes a nutritional powerhouse and the sugar can be cut since fresh milled wheat has a natural sweetness. Same with muffins etc. Food freedom!

[@stevecooper7883]

I love using my grain mill. Very hearty bread!

[@DavidLowe1974]

"...who were working-class Scottish women whose way of showing love was to give you unhealthy food..." Here's the rub, parents or guardians spoiling their kids with unhealthy food choices, along with pester power from the latter. What could possibly go wrong?

[@happydog6537]

It’s like an anti-depressant for your appetite. No highs or no lows. And that’s gonna make a lot of people, especially the people that really like the highs and lows of eating and looking forward to eating and thinking about what they’re gonna eat if you take that away they don’t have anything else much the same way schizophrenics don’t like medication because they like the ride. If you keep taking things from people fasting works too, but it’s really hard and it’s boring. We have made food entertainment. It’s something to do. That’s why everyone is so fat.

[@brianmeen2158]

“We have made food entertainment” What could go wrong when one of the top 2 things you enjoy most in life is eating junk food?

[@levanceland]

I heard cinnamon pills does the same thing of curbing your appetite. Why dont people do that instead?

[@lengting]

When you look away from the screen the video sounds like an audio book