Picard Showing Mind Meld - Exchange Of Truth | Star Trek Picard S02E08

#guinannewability
#stuckinthepast
#relativity
#ducane
#Q
#butterfly
#elaurian
#imfrom25thcentury

[@AlbertoGarcia-wd7sc]

It is impossible to resist the voice of Patrick Stewart when he enters in his "wise guy" mode

[@slamdunkdmc]

I'd like to think this is Commander Ducane's ancestor. Knowing that humans from the future came to his ancestor he decided to join Starfleet as a Temporal officer on the USS Relativity.

[@LinkTardis]

Dude I wish it was ducane

[@rlopezosorio1975]

Dude, same actor@@LinkTardis

[@TacticalWeedwacker]

"He wasn't a monster, he was a Vulcan." 🖖🏻

[@zazaranger5]

Boy, Temporal Investigations are going to have a another field day with this one

[@BrentHarmon]

Only that Q was involved in it. If you watch beginning of Season 2 of Picard.

[@TechnoMageB5]

Assuming their existence comes to pass in the first place, after all this...

[@augustcanyon3438]

"Emotional Shrapnel" is a wonderful term.

[@jamiefoyers2800]

I liked this scene. Especially the "humans are stuck in the past" tag line. Aren't we all really...it's our flaw. Just seeing this whole scene unfold was one of those "A-ha moments!". Speaks to you on so many levels....

[@thomask4978]

All the different situations we encounter, what we learn, emotions we feel, moments we need to endure. May it be good or bad. It all shapes and defines us. It depends on how every single person uses this information to move forward through life. At the end the ending will be good or bad, but there will be an end. I like to think sometimes you're being pushed towards a certain direction to fullfil your destiny.

[@calliarcale]

There's a line from Doctor Who about being the sum of our memories, and there's some truth to that. We're built up by our experiences.

[@gawainethefirst]

“You exist here.”

[@alexb6234]

It is a wonderful way they tied the season together with this theme.

[@edwardcohen1184]

I love how soothing and gentle Picard and Patrick Stewart’s old man voice is. Pay attention to the lighting as well. It’s framed like a halo at the end when he is talking

[@B1izzardHawk]

"Who do you think I am?" "Don't tell me...you're from outer space!" "No, I'm from Iowa, I only work in outer space."

[@Dowlphin]

Rios actually did a reference like that at some point. He said, no, he is from Chile, he just works in space.

[@artembentsionov]

And then in an alternate timeline, Kirk *was* born in space… on the USS Iowa

[@jeffreyjeziorski1480]

There be whales here!!!

[@B1izzardHawk]

@@artembentsionov you talking about the new movies? Cuz that was the Kelvin. Besides, he didn't say he was born in Iowa, just that he was from Iowa.

[@artembentsionov]

@@B1izzardHawk no, there was an episode of SNW set in an alternate timeline where the Federation never formed and Earth is uninhabitable. That Kirk was born on the USS Iowa

[@LGranthamsHeir]

The mind-meld failed because the Vulcan was beamed away before he managed to say "my mind to your mind, your thoughts to my thoughts" 😆😉

[@andouille1]

Mind melds with other races were not attempted at the time. First time it was documented was Suran with Archer with gigabit transfer rate with Archer hosting his Katra

[@trekgirl65]

Wrong, he did not have to speak, as he was trying to erase the boy's memory of the encounter, watch again. DUH!

[@Devinj2000]

@@andouille1 they weren’t attempted OFFICIALLY. That one Vulcan might have made the decision on his own to try it.

[@andouille1]

@@Devinj2000 other non official attempts: t’pau/archer, t’pol/hoshi, t’pol/tolaris, etc

[@bundesautobahn7]

@@trekgirl65You don‘t need to say ”My mind to your mind“ to initiate a meld. It‘s optional, see how Spock did it.

[@worlukk]

this scene is one of the best in how it relates to the pull one first feels when they begin to understand the larger story

[@pinkfloyd7572]

Agreed. Been watching Star Trek religiously since the 70s. I thought this was a fantastic scene.

[@WeekdayWeekend]

Isn't that the same guy from the Timeship Relativity from Voyager? If so that's an amazing casting choice

[@jonbaker1697]

He sure looks like him

[@ZodDamn1t]

It is in fact Jay Karnes who played Lt. Ducane in the Voyager episode Relativity.

[@josiahbahuaud2294]

That’s why he looks familiar! Thank you. 😊

[@josephgriffin2388]

"Who am I to question the captain of the Enterprise?" -- JT KIRK

[@jeffreyjeziorski1480]

It was.......fun.

[@bundesautobahn7]

I thought Picard was even able to do the mindmeld thanks to Sarek at first. But his experience with Sarek makes him in a way more empathetic as he explained to the guy the mindmeld.

[@WardNightstone]

it's possible he could that Golem was built by one of Data's descendants who had studied vulcan philosophy who could herself mind meld

[@tasha3762]

Quelle émotion dans cette scène, quelqu’un qui à peur, qui a raté sa vie et qui pourtant, va aider Picard à retrouver la ligne temporelle . Du Star Trek comme on l’aime tant

[@thesum3312]

Best star trek season of all time!

[@edwardcohen1184]

3:40-4:55 Mysterious but nice music, with the Star Trek theme at the end 🙂

[@TobiasSchulz1]

I get that Vulkans normally would not have used mind melds so commonly back then. But I don't really see that as an inconsistency, since the Vulkan failed at it. If it was a regular thing to do, he probably would have done it properly, Vulkans are not sloppy. Also he was beamed away right in the middle of it.

[@LGranthamsHeir]

1:24 - 1:39 Agent Wells is channeling his FBI colleague Fox Mulder here, except he did not say "I Want to Believe."

[@slammsonite1]

This story need a follow up. What happened to the guy afterwards.

[@WardNightstone]

He meets a young man named Zephram and protects him through the war

[@joedellinger9437]

1:43 Familiar forest sound for East Texas, grey tree frogs singing! It must have rained recently!

[@LGranthamsHeir]

0:09 - 0:35 This scene seems like from a "Twin Peaks" or "X-Files" episode. Guinan seems to channel The Man from the Other Place from the red room by stating this quote 😆

[@Dowlphin]

This is all the storytelling approach of creating an in-fiction canon for mysterious, paranormal phenomena of our society. Guinan was basically totally doing 'some voodoo shit', and she also looked the part.

[@Cannonbolt42jr]

Picard is look like he becomes professor x

[@debbie4503]

For someone who's never seen Picard, this is as confusing af. 😂

[@erisveseli]

Actually during that time the mind meld was forbidden. It was that vulcans that were able to do it were ostracised. Now that vulcan had a good friend who kept his secret or that person could do it too.

[@user-ol7xe6hq8k]

i get alot of people weren't big fans of the first two seasons of Picard ((talk poop on season 3 at your own peril! we got the send off we wanted from TNG!!! ok at least i got what i wanted, guess you can have your opinions too grumble grumble)) but bits like this made me like all of it, sure it had some weaker moments, but then what show doesn't? but this was glorious only issue i take is enterprise not canon anymore? cause like mind melds were kinda a nono in enterprises time which is like what a century later? beyond that though an amazing scene as someone raised on tos reruns and got to see my parents excitement for TNG, like it was a big deal in our house, my parents actually made plans for the pilot were together to see it, TNG holds a special place to me as does Picard

[@BleedingUranium]

Pretty sure this is just a case of one vulcan improvising, in an "off the books" sort of way. And I swear that in one of the scenes with kid-Picard there was a model/toy NX-01 sitting on a table.

[@deksroning125]

This seemingly clashes with ST: Enterprise, does it not? In Enterprise, the Vulcans didn't seem to have transporter technology... but other species such as the Klingons (and later the Andorians in S4 of Ent). The fact Andorians had it, suggests the Vulcans did too, still. Also, there's the little problem of mind melding kinda being taboo in this era (and it remained as such until the 22nd century). Unless this was one of the very rare Vulcans who did practice mind melding.

[@HN-sn9xx]

Goddamnit, Dutch! What other errands do you have us running for the DA?

[@spikeep6141]

Signals Officer : Shall I *Transmit,* sir? Lincoln : …You Think We *Choose to Be Born?* Signals Officer : I don't suppose so… Lincoln : Are We *fitted* to The Times We're born *into?* Signals Officer : Well, I don't know about *myself* - *You* may be, sir. *Fitted.* Lincoln : What Do *You* Reckon? The Fitter : Well, *I'm An Engineer.* I reckon, *There's Machinery,* but; no-one's done *The Fitting.*

[@murrynathan]

They’ve always gotta save the galaxy. Wonder how it’s gonna turn out this time?

[@thewokefindergeneral7631]

victory for poc or something

[@davfree9732]

I'll give em this, these two connecting was an interesting scene to watch. Sadly it comes with the baggage of Secret Hideout execution. But Picard explaining to a man who has lived in fear and then finding his answers... I just wish they could have built more around scenes like this. I think the scene in the room, when it was just FBI guy and Picard was helped by the fact that the camera had to revert to good old Trek standard back and forth shots. Both stand up as their truths clash, but when Picard gives FGI guy his answers he falls into the chair and Picard looms over him, the truth both freeing and ensnaring FBI guy... It's very nearly the standard camera work we got with Trek, except with more shakey cam, because ofc SH can't help but add something dynamic in what was otherwise a scene showing the two establishing a rapport.

[@Dowlphin]

Picard's words were so cheesily grandiose and clichée, it was also kinda cheesy that the cop totally bought them. (Although it was convincing at this point. Just to the observer is is a bit cringy.)

[@overanDownUnder]

It’s not the ending that drives us to watch, it’s the journey.

[@tbd-1]

I take it the odds are against us and the situation is grim?

[@Wizardof]

This season gave me such a headache I needed to visit the EMH for treatment. Between the different sub stories and Jurati's clothes....

[@rebeccadolashewich7094]

✨🖖✨

[@josiahbahuaud2294]

Season 2 was really cheesy, but this scene got me for some reason. I like it.

[@varidian694]

Imagine how much raw power the borg got when they assimilated them. Fucking hell

[@bjornjoseph]

When did vulcans have transporter technology?

[@MJG206]

obviously in our 1950s. Probably centuries before, theyd been in space for a long time.

[@LonewolfProd_]

​@@MJG206In Enterprise, they were still using shuttles because they were deathly terrified of what the transporters would do to organic matter.

[@firerescueratchet559]

*of what the starfleet transporters would do, no?

[@Dowlphin]

As beautiful as this scene is, it came much too late. This was one of those very frustrating story elements: Much earlier Guinan gave him such a damn obvious clue, that it is personal for the cop. And he already knew they were at the gala, so their involvement cannot be denied, ET or not. This was screaming for making an ally out of him, since they had a common enemy and it was personal for both of them. Instead they kept being stubborn, as if that was of any help. Plus, what were those vulcans doing there so carelessly? If they were studying humankind, surely they could have had one person stand guard (if they don't have, oh, I dunno, a lifeform scanner or such), instead of being jumped by a kid stomping towards them and waving a flashlight. When they then stolled over the hill and the boy hauled ass, after he fell and looked up, I would have expected them to just not be there anymore, thereby making the boy think he just imagined them in the scary darkness of the night, or people would assume he saw some wacky cultists or LARPers or such. No, instead they somehow lightning-quickly and/or totally silently walked up to him to allow him to get a good look and then attempted a mind meld, which of course the boy could totally have foiled by getting up and running again. And someone then must have gotten the secret hand sign to beam them up, or not and that might actually have been what foiled the memory erase. And then they didn't take care of the boy afterwards, as if the UFO abduction trope didn't exist. - *WAAAAH! I hate lazy writing like this! Especially in a show with an excellent basic story arc.*

[@count23all]

what sucks is they should have had that cop turn out to be an older version of the time cop from Voyager. It's the same actor that arrested Captain Braxton, he should have been leading hte arrest as a way of trying to prevent picard from alterating the timeline only to find out that the timeline had already been altered by Q. this whole alien conspiracy thing was just another pointless plot element that was used and discarded just as fast.

[@cypheron3030]

Isn't those 2 Vulcans the ones T'pol described in Star Trek Enterprise - 'Carbon Creek' episode?

[@cleekmaker00]

Nope. Different Vulcans, different mission. Seems to me that the Vulcans would have sent many 'missions' to Earth, in order to study an emerging Species on the precipice of nuclear annihilation, before deciding that Humanity was too 'primitive', and ceased to allocate further resources to study them.

[@ensignmjs7058]

Probably not.

[@warthog733]

needs captions to be watchable...

[@safiremorningstar]

Let me see what a little honesty can do... Talk softly and quietly and calmly to the scared human, explain to them a truth they did not understand, and they'll soon be eating out of the palm of your hand...lol

[@cleekmaker00]

Folks, just flow with it. Yes, 'Picard' has some flaws. Lots of TV shows have them. Every incarnation of Trek has had its share of growing pangs, from TOS to now. But, there are some nice touches from time to time in this Series, like this scene.

[@cowsagainstcapitalism347]

I like to remind people how god awful early TNG was.

[@thewokefindergeneral7631]

Still better than this

[@Bysior88]

Freaky hand

[@lima6638]

Continuity error. Mind Melds were taboo to Vulcans in this era.

[@chrisc6857]

Eh kinda sorta. Remember there was an episode of Enterprise where TPol had bad consequences from a Vulcan cultist forcing a poorly done mind meld on her. Considering this is just two centuries earlier and Vulcans didn't develop as fast as humans for most of that time it's not at all a stretch to theorize that maybe that cult already existed in this era and those Vulcans were members.

[@bjornjoseph]

​@Chris C right... that was an offshoot of vulcans. Not the high command running tests on earth. Any high command vulcan wouldn't do mind melds... nor did they have transporter tech

[@artembentsionov]

Yeah, but he still took a chance. It was only logical

[@MJG206]

@@bjornjoseph Trek canon has never once said they didn't have transporters at any time.

[@MJG206]

Taboo. Not unheard of, and this was a 'situation'.

[@barrioorientetalca9582]

Is that woman volcan t´pol´s grandmother?

[@MJG206]

No, but that would have been the best callback in the entire series, had they gotten those actors back.

[@claudiamanta1943]

Come to think of it, nobody lives in the present. The present is only the infinitesimally small moment at the beginning of something (albeit a thought)- imagine it as the smallest conceivable unit of time. Everything else is (in) the past, so humans always live in the past trying to catch- up with everything they largely misremember. The present is imperceptible to human mind which requires a loooooooooooooong time to register, process, and conceptualise something (anything, really). There is no such a thing as a congealed future- everything changes in a constant but not uniform flux. Until a person is in that infinitesimal present moment that once will have been ‘future’, it doesn’t exist, and when it does it is present. So, the future is also the present and mostly, the past. Imagine you being on a high speed train and seeing some electricity pilons outside; by the time you perceive one, you no longer look at it. If there are many many pilons you will perceive them like a continuous wall (similar to film celluloid frames). Misremembering, dragging all the misremembered past into that ‘present’ point, and the slowness and biases that hamper assimilating the ‘present’ points explain many things. But it cannot be otherwise because without thinking in big chunks, the mind becomes overwhelmed and unstable. Too much awareness leads to madness. Literally. Also, think about you looking at the night sky and seeing stars that haven’t been there for a loooooooooong time. The speed of light is not the fastest per se; the speed of light is the fastest speed of something that human mind can think of/ conceptualise. Time and space are essential for human mind to orientate itself in its own created structure, but they don’t exist outside the human world. PS- Sorry it’s a clunky bunch of ideas, but, unfortunately, cybernetic terms are fashionable. And I definitely don’t know what I’m talking about 😄

[@shanenolan8252]

Im not sure the Vulcans had transporters in the 20th century.

[@Nighthawke70]

I don't think there was either. He merely put the boy into a temporary trance, but was sloppy in erasing the memories that were deeply embedded by the trauma. The poor fellow, but I'm glad he connected with Jean-Luc, so this may happen, and another gear drops into the great machine that is Picard.

[@shanenolan8252]

@@Nighthawke70 yes it definitely traumatised him sloppy indeed. Thats another thing mind melds were taboo and illegal i think , or stigmatized. Vulcan high command definitely did not approve. , you would think logically they would make sure the memory was properly wiped medically it was possible, and the sloppy handling breaks the prime directive. Which the Vulcans practiced before the federation and Starfleet. ? ( obviously it a writhing issue )

[@Nighthawke70]

@@shanenolan8252 By either design or by incident, there has been other interactions between Vulcan and Earth, but no other records of mind melds. Up to until First Contact, that is. (Pulling all this from the ENTERPRISE series.)

[@shanenolan8252]

@@Nighthawke70 yes i believe your correct. Enterprise,

[@mutopis]

Maybe time traveling vulcans?

[@mosherbyact]

They didn't have beaming tech then. So ....... How? How is their no eugenics wars either? I mean what the heck kinda show ignored it's own continuity.

[@artembentsionov]

Do we know when Vulcans got transporters? Also, SNW addresses the Eugenics War part. Because of all the temporal shenanigans, it got pushed back by decades. It still happens but later. In fact, it must happen for humanity to unify. We see a timeline where it doesn’t, and it’s not pretty (no Federation, Earth is uninhabitable, Vulcans on the verge of being defeated by Romulans)

[@mosherbyact]

@@artembentsionov the transporters are just starting to be phased in in enterprise, so in Picard, they are at least 150 years early

[@artembentsionov]

@@mosherbyact right, on human ships. We have no idea how long Vulcans had them

[@MJG206]

@@mosherbyact HUMAN built transporters. Vulcans obviously had them.

[@mosherbyact]

@@MJG206 for that to be true, "Enterprise" would have to not be canon.

[@user-xn8qp7tl6u]

It is supernatural

[@thewokefindergeneral7631]

Mordaunt, elegant locust

[@Jay16Mar]

This, ladies and gentlemen, is what we call "filler."

[@raenfox]

The mind melding thing is actually an inconsistency in the writing. It's unlikely a Vulcan would have done it at that time, as it would have branded him an outcast. Up to the 22nd century, it was thought that only a minority possessed this ability. It was considered a very intimate act, which is why Vulcans believed to be a deviant practice which defied the ancestral teachings of their society. Thus other Vulcans considered individuals capable of mind melding as outcasts. This view changed during the 23rd century when mind melding became more commonplace.

[@thiagodeandrade7081]

Vulcansmcould have covered their ears, them he would look like cultists or some religious minority instead of aliens.

[@thegrimmretails3777]

Neither of which would have gone over any better.

[@thiagodeandrade7081]

​@@thegrimmretails3777At least, it would not be the monster in the dark.

[@bjornjoseph]

Also wasn't mind melding a taboo during this time period. Something a high command vulcan wouldn't do

[@MJG206]

under normal circumstances. But this was hardly normal.