Porsche 944 - Mass-Air-Flow (MAF) Conversion Kit Preview & Benefits Over Air-Flow Meter (AFM)

[@michaelsliwinski8044]

Anxious to see how installation goes and what performance improvements are realized. Thanks for making these videos!

[@geoffstandee]

I have been excitedly waiting for this.

[@retroclassicfleet]

Thanks for the review didn’t even know replacing the MAF was an option , don’t think these kits are available in the UK. I will be really interested to know your thoughts on performance improvements when fitted.

[@NC944er]

No doubt! I’m sure Lindsey would ship to the U.K., but I also know your MOT is a little different and there isn’t a lot of data on how emissions are impacted. I’ve heard of folks swapping back and forth between a MAF and factory setup just to pass MOT and then reinstalling the mod. 😂

[@LJC944]

@@NC944erI’m thinking about buying an 82 needs some work but it’s gonna be my first project. Doesn’t need an MOT as it’s past 40 years old 😁

[@NC944er]

@@LJC944 Nice! Sounds like fun. Where I’m at in North Carolina, we don’t require inspections on these older classics either, so that’s one less hurdle to overcome. 👍🏼

[@devildog_iii3492]

Installing mine right now.

[@NC944er]

Nice! Let me know your thoughts and if you come away with any tips or lessons learned. 👍🏼

[@devildog_iii3492]

@@NC944er I don’t like the angle it goes into the J boot or how it’s still a tiny bit loose in boot. May get their silicone intake boot and see. Gonna use an eye connector for red 12v to coil. Still in the middle of doing turbo brake, manual rack, and stripping emissions. ‘86 NA

[@NC944er]

@@devildog_iii3492 Sounds like some nice upgrades in the works! It doesn’t appear the coil circuit is fuse protected, so I picked up an inline fuse kit on Amazon for like $10… maybe pop in a 5amp blade to protect the MAF sensor. That’s odd they can’t get the J-tube mounting size correct, I’ll need to look at that.

[@devildog_iii3492]

@@NC944er not a bad idea w fuse. Kinda pissed at Lindsey for scraping off all the part#s

[@vincentarcuri4089]

Are you having a throttle hesitation with this kit as well? Chasing my tail on it. Basically does it fall on its face when you twist the throttle? Ive had my kit since late January its one of the test kits.

[@jaminwalton4223]

Great video , I have heard you can clock the stock afm to change fuel air mixture. I’m curious to see how the maf will preform for you.

[@NC944er]

Thanks! Yeah, I’ve seen some folks make adjustments to the AFM with some success, but looks like it requires a bit of trial and error. If mine were malfunctioning, I’d probably be more inclined just to replace it with a new one. The cleaning of the contact strips and realignment of the sweeper arm seems to make sense though if there are deep grooves developing.

[@TheRealFrankWizza]

I finally got all this stuff and a newer DME for my 84. I have a cam on the way as well. Once I get the maf going, I'll get into the cam, and do some porting.

[@NC944er]

Very cool! Sounds like some sweet upgrades. 👍🏼

[@TheRealFrankWizza]

@@NC944er This ended up working out great for me. My AFM must have been wonky, because the car runs a lot better.

[@NC944er]

@@TheRealFrankWizza Glad to hear it! Mine has been pretty stable as well after getting it dialed in.

[@TheRealFrankWizza]

@@NC944er I got lucky, when I got my DME from ebay, and opened it, there was no doubt that it was in flood water. However I cleaned it with 99% isopropanol, and saw no signs of corrosion. It fired right up.

[@NC944er]

@@TheRealFrankWizza Score! Hope you got a good deal on it, they can be costly. I’ve thought about having F9T do the sport DME upgrade on mine, but it’s not yet too bad off.

[@kaleknikker123]

Buddy I just came across your channel and I love it! Keep the vids comming!

[@NC944er]

Where have I been all your life!? 😂 Glad you’re enjoying the content and I hope it’s helping keep more 944s on the road. Cheers!

[@BennysBenz]

This looks like a awesome upgrade

[@gerrygoulet1675]

Thanks to this video, I purchased this kit for my '86 NA. I would appreciate it if you could suggest a safe routing of the red power wire to the ignition coil for me. Thanks again for all your excellent videos.

[@NC944er]

Hey Gerry! Yeah, the instructions don’t provide a recommended routing path for the power wire and it’s not terribly long to begin with. I think the answer depends on how clean you want the final look to be, but the primary conditions are that it should be clear of any high heat sources and it has to be connected to a circuit that supplies 12v when the ignition is switched to the “on” position. Here are a few options I’m considering… 1. There’s a switched power source available if you run it back to the diagnostic port on the driver’s side behind the emissions vapor control valves (black cover that can be flipped open to reveal 5 connections) This is what I would love to do, but I need to test it again as the 1988 models eliminated two pins and moved some connections where it’s a slightly different setup from the earlier models. This method would be short, easy, and allow everything to be kept on one side of the engine bay. 2. The easiest path to the ignition coil would be to follow the wiring for the oil pressure sender that runs under the J-boot, over the water pump, and down the passenger side of the engine. The only thing I’m not crazy about is jumping the gap between the engine and the right frame rail where the ignition coil is mounted as the wire would just be floating there. Maybe route down to the sender and then back up the power steering fluid line? 3. A cleaner option would be to follow the existing wiring for the ignition coil, which could be picked up on the left frame rail under the air box. It then passes under the headlight bucket and to the right along the front cross member behind the aluminum bumper, and down the right frame rail under the headlight motor. This would be very clean and heat free, but would require front bumper removal and splicing in some additional wire to extend the length. 4. I also like the idea of connecting it to the circuit for the HVAC blower motor, since it’s powered in the on position. That way the wire could go straight back on the left side following existing wiring and pass though a bulkhead to the fuse box. I was thinking if a no-start condition arose at some point, it would be nice to have the MAF separate from the ignition circuit and you would know it’s receiving power because you could hear the blower running, then move on the the next suspect. 🤔 Anyway, let me know how it goes for you!

[@gerrygoulet1675]

@@NC944er Thanks for the quick response and supplying so many options. As usual, you're thorough and go beyond the expected. Keep up the good work and I will let you know what I finally decide to do.

[@NC944er]

@@gerrygoulet1675 Yeah man! I’ve seen some info on the forums that indicate the ignition coil connection can present some noise and is not fused, so adding an in-line fuse to the power wire seems to be a sound recommendation. My diagnostic port is testing at 11.75v, which may not provide the smoothest operation for the MAF sensor, which requires 12v+. Not sure if that has to do with the lighter gage wire there or oxidation somewhere, but I may be exploring the fuse panel a bit.

[@j.b.e.5149]

I can't find a version that attaches to the airbox for the turbo models. What would happen if I used this product on my 951?

[@NC944er]

Hey man! Yeah, the Turbo uses a different kit, but still available. Here’s a link - www.lindseyracing.com/LR/Porsche/LRA-M-TUNE.html

[@j.b.e.5149]

@@NC944er I saw this and many others. I don't like the look of filter. Was hoping for an alternative that bolts to the factory airbox.

[@NC944er]

@@j.b.e.5149 Ahhh, gotcha… yeah, I haven’t seen any for the 951 that bolt to the factory air box, they generally use the cone-style filters.

[@FueledBy.Passion]

And the final HP gain if any, is? or is this more of a long term reliability gain? Thx!

[@NC944er]

A little bit of both I think. I’ll include a link to the original developer charts below, but it averages out to an ~8% increase in HP, so roughly 12 HP with a stock exhaust setup, etc. On the reliability side, certainly sensors can fail, but the moving parts are eliminated so there’s no longer any physical wear. And for a lot of us with miles on these cars, we’ll eventually be looking at replacing the AFM at some point to keep them on the road. www.roguetuning.com/944_maf_kit_na-tune©

[@guyfaux5010]

@@NC944er Apparently, Rogue gained even more HP/ torque with a freer flowing cat back exhaust system. I know the stock NA works best with the stock exhaust system. It provides a lot of back pressure. Ever open up a stock muffler? You'll be surprised! I wonder if the torque gains with a freer flowing exhaust translate into actual low end gains? The K&N air cleaner was a wash and provided no HP gain. I prefer the stock air filter anyway.

[@FueledBy.Passion]

@@guyfaux5010 I'm not 100% sure but I believe the special edition 924S called The Spirit in Spain came without a cat, and putting out an additional 10hp to 170hp. No cat but with stock muffler may have enough back pressure to not lose hp

[@connorwetmore5404]

Hey love you video! But was looking to purchase a maf for a Porsche 944 but I am on a budget. Is there a cheaper kit that you know?

[@NC944er]

Hey Connor, the cheapest one I’m aware of was that kit by Miller Performance out of Canada, but my understanding is that it’s no longer in production and didn’t really perform well anyway. I think Vitesse is still making kits, but that will be on par or more expensive that the Lindsey option. These cars are quickly becoming antiques with fewer quality examples on the road, and my guess is a lot of the modification options we see today will be dropping off the market sooner than later.

[@dwjr75]

Excellent overview! Unfortunately, it just depresses me as LR seems to turn a blind eye to the 16V cars. My only real option to get rid of the MAF at the moment is to spend $1,500 on a VEMS.

[@NC944er]

😂 Definitely didn’t mean to rub salt in the wound, but you’re right. I know Joshua of Rogue Tuning was working on an S2 kit back in 2012, but seems like it took a back seat to family and a career change, with the 944 stuff being just a side project for him. He essentially hand delivered the NA and Turbo products to Lindsey and they picked up the sales and packaging piece. Joshua continued to supply them just the chips for awhile, but finally quit that about a year ago. I’m not sure if it came down to time or money, but with the lower production numbers on the 16v cars, maybe there were demand concerns.

[@dwjr75]

@@NC944er In all fairness to LR, I did purchase a header and chip and they do offer 16V cylinder head upgrades. Of course, the 16V DME is different than the 8V to the point where opening it up doesn't match all of the vids out there. I have a few local resources, here in Raleigh, through the local PCA group that may give me a hand with that.

[@HarrisonBernath]

Cant find the kit on the website, can you edit the description with a direct link?

[@NC944er]

www.lindseyracing.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=LRA-944-MAF-TUNE

[@acantor]

What about the early cars. Is the chip compatible with them with the pin conversion?

[@NC944er]

The DME units for model years 1983-1985 had the ADC chips hard-soldered to the boards, so there’s no easy/plug-and-play method to swap the chips. What’s recommended is to first upgrade the DME in those cases to one from 1985.5 or later, which will have the chip socket already built in. 1985.5-1987 DMEs are setup for 24-pin, so those will need to be converted by adding in 4 additional chip pin sockets to accommodate the 28-pin chip. DMEs from 1988-89 are already setup to accept the 28-pin chips.

[@acantor]

@@NC944er ok gotcha, I figured there was something weird with the early cars

[@geoffstandee]

How has it held up so far?

[@NC944er]

Hey Ron! The kit is installed and doing well so far. No idle adjustment was needed as I think the ICV on the later cars solves for this automatically. It pulls noticeably stronger in the higher revs, but was hesitating a bit off idle with initial throttle tip-in. I adjusted the FQS switch on the DME to add +9% to the fuel mix and that eliminated it for the most part. I’m scheduled for another Dyno test next week to hopefully confirm it’s dialed in well and see the results. 👍🏼

[@geoffstandee]

@@NC944er Thanks! Can't wait to see more. I wish you all the best. Thanks again for making such amazing content

[@vincentarcuri4089]

Are you having a throttle hesitation with this kit as well? Chasing my tail on it. Basically does it fall on its face when you twist the throttle? Ive had my kit since late January its one of the test kits.

[@NC944er]

I haven’t installed mine yet as I’m still rebuilding the front end, but it sounds like I’ll having something to look forward to. 😂 Did you have issues of any kind prior to installation? Also, do you have the power lead wired to the positive ignition coil terminal or another power source?

[@vincentarcuri4089]

@@NC944er i fixed my problem i put bigger injectors out of the 2.5 and a 3.8 bar regulator. For some reason the 2.5 injectors flow more then the 2.7 injectors do at 3 bar as the 2.7 factory uses a 3bar regular and the 2.5 uses a 2.5 bar regulator kind odd but I fixed the problem after long research and trying multiple parts.

[@NC944er]

@@vincentarcuri4089 Very cool, thanks for the follow up!

[@NC944er]

@@vincentarcuri4089 How badly was yours hesitating? I’ve got my kit installed now and the RPM does dip slightly on initial throttle tip in, hesitating a bit. Only noticeable from idle. I may install a 3.0 bar regulator to see if that helps, currently running a 2.5 bar with the the 2.5 injectors.

[@vincentarcuri4089]

@@NC944er it was pretty well to my liking at least. Like if it had to jump out from a stop it was not there then it would kick in. I put a 3.8bar in and switched my injectors to the 2.5 motor injectors since apparently the 2.7 flow less at 3 bar the the 2.5. And it fix the problem. I do notice at wot in certain RPMs its either not getting enough fuel or too much i need to put it on my dyno and hook the wide band up to figure it out.

[@Kptgibson]

Looking forward to the results of this

[@NC944er]

You and me both! 😂

[@Stikeri1]

Looks really good, i live in Germany and im quite concerned about his legality. It’s under the TÜV German standarts?

[@NC944er]

The manufacturer doesn’t publish any emissions data on the product, but it does have a built-in intake air temperature sensor, which is used with MAF for the purposes of fuel economy and emissions control. In the US, each state and county has individual requirements and different standards. I live in a rural area that doesn’t require exhaust testing at all, but states like California are very strict to the point of implementing a visual modification inspection on top of emissions and this would likely raise concern there. I can’t speak to the TÜV standards specifically, but I will say that I’ve seen people swap out the MAF for the factory AFM to pass the test and then reinstall the MAF when they get home.

[@tims_4x4_garage]

Sweeeet! Guess it is time to convert my 24 pin to 28 pin.

[@NC944er]

🤣 The increase in throttle response alone should be interesting to see. The flapper is perpetually choking the engine just to ask the question, “How well are you breathing?”

[@tims_4x4_garage]

@@NC944er can’t wait for the results.

[@tims_4x4_garage]

@@NC944er you already have a 28 pin dme, correct? I have a 24. I have a lot of skills but soldering small pieces of ancient circuitry is not one of those skills. Maybe I can sweet talk you into helping me pin mine if this turns out to be worth that. I like the GA - NC mountain roads anyway.

[@NC944er]

@@tims_4x4_garage Yeah, mine is setup for 28, I pulled the boards and inspected them maybe a year ago. There was evidence of someone else having opened it up in the past, not sure why. I would put most of my soldering work in the “functional” category, not factory pretty. 😂 It’s tempting since Lindsey sells the parts for just an extra $3. If you’re feeling particularly bold, the 944 Sport DME by F9T looks freaking amazing, with all new boards and electronics, just swaps over the 4 main factory chips and the new board is setup for 28-pin. Pretty cool if you have $475 laying around.

[@tims_4x4_garage]

@@NC944er that would be a sweet setup for sure. I’ll wait to hear your thoughts and results before i start to try and justify spending a bunch of money on a car that already runs.

[@guyfaux5010]

Nice start. But, you should DYNO your engine BEFORE and AFTER the MAF install. All the other vids on YT concerning this conversion SUCK. You should put to rest once and for all whether this is an upgrade or just snake oil

[@NC944er]

Dyno testing results would be interesting to see, I agree. There are a couple shops in my area and I could probably get the before and after tests done for about $150. Haven’t yet decided if I want to invest it since it’s just a street car and I have no other big tuning plans for the car. We’ll see…

[@guyfaux5010]

@@NC944er Inquiring minds want to know. Seat of pants results are subjective at best. However, you can't argue with the numbers. Make a deal with the dyno shop. You'll plug them on your vid if they give you a rate on BEFORE and AFTER runs on their machine.

[@NC944er]

@@guyfaux5010 I just scheduled a baseline test for May 3rd. Regarding the negotiation, you may be dramatically overestimating the influence of my channel, but it’s worth a shot! 🤣

[@guyfaux5010]

@@NC944er Alright man. Don't underestimate your channel. The value of these cars are going UP and your channel is one of the most comprehensive channels on this subject by far. I've owned my current 1988 Celebration Edition 944 since 1994 so I've seen all the forums, channels, groups, etc. Keep up the good work.