Legion Class Previews - Rogue

[@Preachgaming]

The rogue, I actually have stronger feelings and doubts than I expressed here however, given that talents 'could' solve them I kept it relatively neutral instead of being overly pessimistic. Although I find it unlikely that something like Combat Insight which was the depth of the combat/outlaw spec exists as a talent, I just can't bes ure and whine while it's a possibility.

[@darkside1485]

Yar - har, fiddle - dee - dee, being a pirate is all right to be! Do what you want 'cause a pirate is free, you are a pirate! (Rogue)

[@Sigurdar]

+Preach Gaming I agree with most of your comments. I think the new Shadow Dance however has potential, because the current sub rogue rotation during downtime is pretty boring. This could bring some flavor to it. I just hope that there's still a big ass cooldown during which we can go nuts, though...

[@evanbunnell]

+Preach Gaming Thank god a voice of reason. So many people are creaming themselves over the pirate hype, but nothing that we've been shown is super compelling. Still hopeful that the talents will do something great, but the hype over what's basically one spell is pretty ridiculous. #internetculture

[@TheFromaster24]

+Arthur Ibragimov (Ironcaster) Already got my pirate xmog set up and active, now just waiting on the artifact cutlasses

[@darcraven01]

+Preach Gaming would be awesome if the outlaw weapons weren't 2 swords, but a sword and a pistol... and they coulda added in a few other gun shot abilities too just to make it worth while. lol

[@Detinator247]

Subelty be like : “Ah you think darkness is your ally? You merely adopted the dark. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn't see the light until I was already a man, by then it was nothing to me but blinding!”

[@Perid0tStar]

+Smiles Your avatar matches this comment Really well lol

[@newjerseyjustin]

+Smiles until you realize you cant stealth with shadowdance passive in pvp

[@Detinator247]

newjerseyjustin that's what vanish is for right? and also along with the talents, artifact talents, and pvp talents I'm sure they'll work something out to keep us as the masters of shadows ( ex: waay shorter vanish cooldown, but modified)

[@Aatrixx]

Rogue is by far the best preview so far

[@nearbylegends]

So far

[@set2500]

+nearbylegends there are no more, rogue was the last.

[@Cruciatum]

+Aatrixx ... Apart from Dance, almost nothing changed for rogues lol. Combat got a proc, assassination got a new dot, sub changed dance.

[@Aatrixx]

Cruciatum when you say it like that it does sound boring but try and sound optimistic. these changes will change rogue for the most part as for a dynamic rotation if you think about it ?

[@nearbylegends]

Ryan Adams im thinking that they might release a demon hunter one later on

[@Mangs1337]

Oh Blizzard with their Bane references xD

[@m1nayondaime]

+Mangs Guess I wasn't the only one who thought of it. :P

[@stormtrooper13371]

+Mangs it was bound to enter wow eventually.

[@torragg8635]

+Mangs Wait where?

[@torragg8635]

+Torragg On second thought i noticed it except it was Raz Alghul's Daughter not Bane, Bane was her protector.

[@jordanallen3078]

+Torragg Wasn't Bane Ivy's protector? 🤔

[@slothape]

If you are a Combat rogue... YOU ARE A PIRATE

[@JackassJimbo]

+slothape yo ho yo ho, an outlaws life for me!

[@CorvusxRex]

+slothape YAR HAR, FIDDLE DI DEE. BEING A PIRATE IS ALRIGHT WITH ME YO HO, AHOY AND AVAST BEING A PIRATE IS REALLY BADASS HANG THE BLACK FLAG AT THE END OF THE MAST YOU~♩ ARE~♩ A PIRATE~♪ ♫

[@Scrumshiz]

+MalevolentJester FUCK YEAH!

[@matt5842]

+slothape pls no

[@ABonafideSkeleton]

+slothape Pirate transmog: check Hyacinth Macaw: check Bloodsail Admiral title: check You guys have no idea how many years I have waited for this opportunity.....

[@NovaTheReaper]

"Rogues don't use shadow magic, they're just so good that it makes it look like they're performing magic." "This ability literally does shadow-element damage." What???

[@Lichdemonz]

+GoneSupernova ImmortalHD: Don't worry about it.

[@Kittsuera]

+GoneSupernova fake it till ya make it! guess their tricks are just that effective.

[@evilcam]

So to dance, you're supposed to use a finisher which at 5 combo points should give you a 3 second stealth, and spam shadowstrike as much as you can in that 3 seconds. So use energy to go into a short stealth and spam something else that uses a bunch of energy. With the right kind of energy regen that could be crazy OPed, if you could get off at least 2 shadowstrikes per dance, 2 more points through backstab and eviscerate for another stealth into shadow strike....but I really doubt we're gonna have the energy for that sort of thing. No doubt it will simply be get off a shadowstrike, stand around waiting for energy to backstab, shadowrupture, wait for energy to backstab, get 5 points, wait for energy to fill completely to eviscerate, get off one shadowstrike, wait for energy for backstab. Being able to choose explicitly when to go into dance, without it using energy so you can actually get some ambushes off sounds so much better. Perhaps the energy issues will be negated with talents, but if it's not, this spec might be as slow as arms warriors.

[@mojoswampweed]

+evilcam with current talents Master of Shadows + Relentless strikes give you 100 energy every time you enter stealth :)

[@GrimReapa1]

+evilcam there is also a pvp talent that reduces the energy required of shadowstrike by 50% making it only cost 20 energy

[@zHaKy7]

+evilcam Shadow Dance only lets you use one ability before it expires. It says you can autoattack but not that you can use your abilities for 3 seconds. That means you will be able to use one Shadowstrike or Cheapshot every 5-6 seconds but not spam them

[@GrimReapa1]

where does it say you only can attack once shadowstrike has no cooldown and shadowdance paired with subterfuge would allow you to do x2 shadowstrike get 5 combo points and stun target for 2 secs per shadowstrike (if you talent into it) then you use a finisher and your back in stealth and repeat

[@zHaKy7]

+GrimReapa1 you can read the tooltip on wowhead, it clearly says Shadow Dance stealth effect does not brake by autoattack damage, but says nothing about abilities. So it is safe to assume that using an ability will remove the effect, meaning you can only use one shadowstrike. About subterfuge, we are not sure if it applies after shadow dance ends, and I doubt it does because otherwise you could be using a full stealth rotation 100% of the time.

[@blyjd91]

CB? Combo Boint?

[@WBlake01]

This.

[@Felixxfb]

+GunvorPlays CJ, Combo Joint :)

[@Pr0xRESOLUTE]

it's better than saying CP KappaRoss

[@weladravideos]

GOMBO BOINT BRETTY GUD XDDDDDDDDD

[@im_cold_blooded]

Cold Blood. Old School.

[@Reconsideringg]

Remember with PvP... there won't be any issues. There will be PvP specific talents and other features to alter the class to PvP for balance like they mentioned at Gamescon.

[@omegavorosh9801]

Preach Thank you for doing all the classes for us. You Rock Man!

[@richardjones8846]

0:58 ow.. well.. i'll just take my leave then. ASS-ASS-ination - i like the changes here. it's a lot more like sub in wod honestly, and the energy regen is going to be so crazily good i can't wait. the mastery despite it's short CD, and being only there AFTER you use a finisher imo is a great facade to how powerful the rogue can be in the cleave/bleeds. you can use mutilate twice in a row and another finisher in the time it takes that buff to run out, and if you've got an assload of bleeds going on you're getting TONS of energy back on top of buffing the holy balls out of them. there is also the option of using a finisher on a lower combo point to get that buff for whatever reason or scenario that may happen it IS there. Outlaw - YARR HARR FIDDLE DEE DEE DO WHAT YOU WANT BECAUSE A PIRATE IS FREE YOU ARE A PIRATE! i don't get why everyone is so hype about the gun... there is hunters if you're hype about guns /facepalm. outside the standard combat i really like the bone rapier artifact skin. insight not being there really seems to make it feel very plain. i'd like to see them go a lot more in depth with the pirate theme and have a 10 minute cooldown that shoots cannons from your ship or something (artillery strike as a cooldown basically). i am interested to see the rest of the spec that is for sure. Subtlety - this one really upset me with the whole pvp thing. you won't actually stealth in pvp.... so what's the fucking point of making you stealth in pve then? reset the mob you're attacking... i mean ffs bliz cmon. that's the point of sub! going stealth and fucking around with people... making a clone and being able to teleport with it and confuse people. i really like the new shadow dance and availability to basically shadowstep all the time when ur target swapping/cleaving. i can see shadow reflection being a talent with them, but i'd like to see it baseline and able to use it after a newer 'find weakness' comes up which the clone does 100% of the dmg you do, and ignores armor because it's a shadow.

[@Saaunn]

i got all hyped, logged in and realized im still in wod sad

[@errric1176]

i actually didnt like find weakness, or shadow dance to maintain the debuff, it felt more like a minigame of micro managing all buffs, dots, debuffs, instead of fighting a boss. i really like the new idea of a teleport-stab ability though, they hit the nail on the head with how i think the feel of sub should be with constantly going in and out of stealth to execute your target.

[@TheRealCeeJai]

I can see Elaborate Planning being used in conjunction with Anticipation combo points, assuming that talent is sticking around. It would require some set-up, but I think that ties in very well with the name. I think it's a good idea for a talent that would make you think more in terms of setting up combos, an aspect rogues should have.

[@E1YK001]

Needs to be a flintlock pistol. *bang* cloud smoke fades... Also, thanks Preach for pumping these out so quick with nice quality.

[@shh532]

So... slice and dice just gone then on everything but the Outlaw? I'm cool with that...

[@Photonkannon]

+Hagen Smiles nah it's still there. he didn't cover every detail. look up the class preview and read it.

[@shh532]

I'm only seeing it listed on the Outlaw

[@Photonkannon]

Hagen Smiles slice n dice is baked into assasination. Sub should still have SnD as well. i doubt theyremoved it.

[@Slyth1]

+StDiablo1 Actually it makes more sense that they would remove it unless it is gonna be baked in for both assassination and sub.

[@DarkPoisoneer]

isn't shadow dance effect still the same? I mean in the description it is said that in pve it leaves a decoy and makes you go into stealth for 4 seconds allowing stealth abilities and in pvp you can use stealth abilities but does not make you enter stealth. The difference here instead of being 1 min CD and 6 sec duration it is 20% chance from attacks and 4 sec duration.

[@armaldo0000]

+Dark Poisoneer I think you are talking about Vanish, not Shadow Dance, am i right?

[@DarkPoisoneer]

well talents are said to be spec modifications instead of adding a shared ability or passive shared across all the specs and they gave a talent as an example

[@DarkPoisoneer]

armaldo0000 new shadow dance has vanish effect and current one makes u use stealth abilities for a short amount of time and you can check the website for the full description of the new shadow dance which makes you vanish leaving a decoy and entering stealth for 4 sec and in pvp it makes u use stealth abilities for the duration without stealth

[@armaldo0000]

Dark Poisoneer Ohh, so they just fusion both skills... debatable move right there i think

[@DarkPoisoneer]

armaldo0000 here is the full description and but they only mentioned 1 spell used in stealth right now others are not mentioned cuz they stay the same aside from garrote that is assassin only or come from the talents and artifact weapon Shadow Dance -Passive -Your finishing moves have a 20% chance per combo point to activate Stealth. For 3 sec, this Stealth will not break when you autoattack or take damage. When this effect occurs, a Shadow Decoy will appear nearby, confusing your enemies. -Developer Comment: This will function differently in PvP, granting the use of abilities that require Stealth, but not actually providing Stealth.

[@icewolf1333]

The concept and story of outlaw tickles me the right way i have always wanted a swordsman/fencer class in WoW

[@Zcreager]

Just wanted to say thank you for these videos!!!!

[@Plusimurfriend]

quick question... how can you solo level a sub rogue? i have 20% per combopoint to vanish for 3 seconds. it will break combat and the mobs will run away.

[@TheKroganMaster]

+Plusy Leaves a decoy, so you have room to re-set and attack the target attacking your decoy.

[@MultiReptilian]

Confirmed on tweeter that backstab "behind" bonus will take effect from the sides aswellnot only the back

[@dessa721]

I will say for people like us who play a rogue and who spent most of this expac as subt, seeing it change is sad, BUT for new people just picking it up or trying to get into raiding as a rogue or as subt it will make it easier for them, having less to micromanage can be a good thing, unlike all the min maxing required before

[@grip7777]

I capped my rogue a while ago and decided to try sub. Tbh I really liked the micro manage stuff with all the buffs and bleeds and the like and even getting shadow dance+shadow reflection to line up nicely and making sure i had a rupture going and so fourth. To be honest though it didn't work out for me at all trying to do some dungeons and keeping everying up while doing even simple mechanics. I am probably just not used to the playstyle of sub yet and I am aware that skillcaps can be a lot of fun to have and I did manage to do more damage as I progressed with my character, but I really think it's just a bit too much for a new rogueplayer. This I don't think the issue is for many people however, there are 2 other speccs so wtf? The issue with sub in 6.2 was how amazingly powerful it was along with like soul capacitor, playstyle can vary and yes, if the expected dps from a raider is 50k and sub pulls 53 and assassination pulls 50 I would be ok with that and allow higher end players to have their neiche speccs that do more damage while keeping up with a lot more stuff with a chance of fucking up and have lower end players pulling off less complicated stuff while still being able to be on the raidteam.

[@drewj557]

So I know you didn't want to do any more guides but seeing as some of these specs are getting completely "reworked" do you anticipate doing them?

[@engerlandt]

Don't get the hate with the new shadow dance. It's basically going to be: 1) get to 5CP and pool 50 energy 2) use a finisher 3) shadow strike x2 4) pool 50 energy. Repeat from step 2. You'll never have to backstab at all, it'll be like Shadow Dance right now but permanent.

[@ThomasBachler01]

+engerlandt you can only shadow strike once

[@engerlandt]

My bad, understood the new shadow dance incorrectly. But even if you can only in 1 shadowstrike per finisher, you'll still get more shadowstrikes per min than ambush per minute with the current shadow dance right?

[@ThomasBachler01]

the reason why some hate it is because shadowdance as it is now is a perfect way for good players to differentiate themselfs, because there are so many things to consider, procs cooldowns energy, for a perfect shadowdance. with the legion system a mistake is going to have a much lower impact, some peaple like that, some people dont...thats how it always goes =)

[@petrinafilip96]

gotta admit,since bc i was skeptical about rogues,started playing one in wod and fell in love with the class

[@DrPluton]

So, you can either be a ninja (subtlety), a pirate/brigand (outlaw), or an assassin (assassination). That definitely makes the specs seem different in theme. How it will play out is what I am looking forward to seeing.

[@L1ghTx]

If they fuck up Subtlety im really sad. For me this always has been a spec which a lot of decision making and good timed shadow dance/shadow reflection mechanics. If that's gone now, I'll play afk outlaw rogue I guess.

[@cas6382]

4:35 "OOOO WE GET A GUN" my reaction exactly lol

[@DomSza]

When I first read the changes to Shadow Dance I was like, "Holy damn that's pretty cool actually" - leaving a shadowy figure behind while you sneak back in to stealth. Thinking about it again, realistically it's just going to be that my action bar flicks over to the stealth one for a brief moment while I use Shadowstrike maybe twice. EXCITING.

[@Traditional_American]

The changes to the rogue seems wonderful, can't wait to try out the Outlaw Spec

[@Ozten-gg]

Have to be honest and this may make me sound like an idiot but when i saw that hunter was getting a melee spec and that the combat rogue was being changed to outlaw with the Fate and Fortune artifacts i was hoping so badly that rogue was getting a ranged spec with dual pistols. that would have been fucking amazing IMO

[@mattscolamiero9640]

+Preach Gaming as assassination I could keep that 20% up basically an entire boss fight... Of course fights with crazy movement will differ, even if I have to envenom on 4cb from time to time the trade off would be worth it keeping that up

[@jonahhusak1037]

SUBTELTY OUTLAW HYPE actually just hype period, i like that theyre trying to give each spec its on unique identity

[@TheShinyDunsparce]

was preach thinking about shadow reflection? shadow dance is just a 'spam ambush' cd.

[@rumbleshakes]

Subtlety is going to be OP in PvP! That with the Unholy DK would make the perfect arena team. Mix that with a good healer would make it into a perfect 3v3. The Artifact talents give Shadow Blades (combo-generating abilities generate an additional point for 5 seconds) wan increase duration of 15 seconds (making it 20 seconds). Shadow Techniques can also get a 100% increased chance (if the chance was 5% it would become a 10% chance). Gain a free Vanish if you are not hit while Sprinting for 3 seconds.

[@Dunkingsonn]

Sub be like... "Hello darkness my old friend"

[@Spartucus101]

As a long time Ass-rogue. Elaborate Planning is crazy bananas good preach. You have to imagine that 4 seconds includes 20% on, Garrote, Rupture, Poisons, and Mutilate X2. If you're Ass-ing properly. Considering that about every 3-5 seconds you should be Envenoming. The up time on that de-buff will be consistent if not constant. anymore than 4 seconds would actually be broken. Slightly so, in pvp. Defiantly op in pve.

[@squidelz5710]

Pistols. PISTOLS.

[@Focusedfelix]

As far as Assassination; if Anticipation sticks around, that Elaborate Planning Talent would be great. You'd be able to get at least one more finisher, if not two during that period.

[@binlo9959]

I'm sure they'll do something to make sure this doesn't happen, but if you 5cp finisher as sub while you're out questing or killing stuff, and you enter stealth with the new shadow dance, won't the mob evade out and reset?

[@upxd3710]

when your out in the world doing quests and you get popped back into stealth do you loose your target or is there like a 3 second grease period.

[@ThunderUp65]

+Aaron Kellner Shadow Dance is supposed to leave a decoy behind, I imagine that this will keep you in combat and stop mobs from running away

[@TheRunesmythe]

My initial impressions are that Rogues are being neutered. Now granted, as you said not all spells/skills/attacks (whichever term you prefer) aren't heavily discussed and until release things are subject to change, which is why I'm tempering my reaction and not jumping the shark here. Unfortunately most, if not all, I've heard is thus far disappointig; that loss of poisons for all specs save Assassination really hits where it's most painful. Yes, I understand they're trying to give things that will make up for that loss but it's going to be an uphill battle to make up for something that didn't need changing/fixing in the first place. My main is a Rogue and I've really enjoyed leveling the class, but I'm not sure that enjoyment is going to continue into Legion at this point, which is a shame. As I said, I'm tempering my initial reaction (which is that I may not have a Rogue for much longer) with the understanding that things are still being worked out and the hope that change/get better.

[@Gannicia]

Will dance break combat when going into stealth? that would suck in solo content

[@Beanjuice]

Definitely gonna be giving outlaw an alt slot in legion. I love the new pistol shot. Reminds me of the Scoundrel spec for the smuggler in SWTOR.

[@KillerenergyWIP]

one concern for Shadow Dance in open world though. Is there a mechanic in place to avoid mob reset? Otherwise RIP solo player dance....

[@Kylos117]

Sub = "You merely adopted the darkness, I was born in it, molded by it. I din't see the light 'till I already a man, by then it was nothing more than blinding". Bane - The Dark Knight Rises

[@johnniejackson2375]

I have always felt that Sub rogues should be able to stealth more often. I figured they could have done a cool down reduction on vanish via finishers, much like combat

[@sloanguitar4862]

I mained a rogue for early WoD until I returned to my prot pally roots. Outlaw looks like the badass swashbuckler that combat was supposed to be. I wanna try it really bad. Can't wait to see how Demon Hunters 'll play.

[@sloanguitar4862]

+Tauren Oracle Hopefully the gun is as kickass as it should be. I'd love to see my character point a pistol at a huge infernal and blow him to bits. That would be hilarious. And Sub is going to be awesome, I love sub, and these changes seem to make us total monsters. PvP sub will annihilate enemies.

[@Jiiimmie]

Wonder if rogues will be good in pvp now, used to main rogue in arena (2v2) in bc, wotlk and then cata but from wotlk to cata i went more and more on my priest due to it felt like rogues just got hammerd as soon as you went out of stealth.. :( havent tried much pvp on my rogue lately, did some random 2v2 arena but it was just meh when i tried it the first time as fresh lvl 100.

[@ethanavrigean6734]

Rogues are some of the tankiest classes in Wod, a shit ton of defensives and an on demand/no cd 30% damage reduction buff that only costs 20 energy. Combat has great sustained dps, and Subs burst is excellent.

[@Jiiimmie]

Yeah i've noticed, just started pvp with my fresh 100 rogue and even tho i lack pvp gear i still kick some ass, i just die to fast atm tho xD

[@ethanavrigean6734]

+Jiiimmie what spec are you playing as?

[@Jiiimmie]

Atm, combat, I've always had combat close to my heart for some reason, even when it was bad I managed to keep up with sub / ass rogues

[@ethanavrigean6734]

+Jiiimmie as Combat you have a shit ton of sustained dps, so my advice pvp wise is to play pretty carefully, watch for offensives from enemies, pop defensives when appropriate, until you have red buff then KS. But it's worth mentioning that you should pop shadow reflec and adrenaline rush in your opener.

[@SageDarkHunter]

so where do we get the pistol from? is it going to be off hand or an extra slot in the weapons?

[@ThomasBachler01]

+Joshua Pagan no weapon at all, rogues just have one concealed all the time and it is not an item

[@telivan776]

No it's just also concealed from us.

[@Levinceful]

Which class are you guys gonna main after all the changes announced?

[@IamS0Cool]

Rogue. As in every other expansion ever :)

[@sebkure]

+Levinceful That's hard to say without all the changes announced.

[@WBlake01]

I can finally go back to Balance. I hated that eclipse bar

[@sloanguitar4862]

+Levinceful Most likely a demon hunter(not gonna abandon at level 100 and pick up a random alt) or, as always, a paladin. This expac I'm exploring new servers, so I might end up transferring my main if my guild doesn't change their time zone to East from west. Which could be disastrous and near impossible.

[@CPhrost]

+Levinceful cant decide between DK and Paladin.

[@daltonlakin8312]

Do you have a video showing talents Etc?

[@Kittsuera]

No poison on Subtlety? from an opponent stand point that sounds really good. but targeting them is going to be a serious pain if they pull off stealth every few seconds.

[@DarkRogue107]

Rogue has been my main since Vanilla never changed and I must say I am glad that Sub is getting the light it deserves... or shadows Cheapshot is being removed... that's a substantial offensive AND defensive disturbance for all rogues, PvP more so. Assassination is the only spec with poisons? I see because Outlaw has 'guns and lungs' and Subtlety has a 30yrd teleportation ability, Shadowstrike, but poisons can only be applied to those in *melee range*. Assuming BoS/Sprint are still universal talents, Assassination just got neutered PvP wise, looks better in PvE because maor dots = maor energy = maor dps. Outlaw looks like a fun new playstyle from the conventional rogue "stabby-stab". BlizzDevs on twitter said Outlaw will have a *pistol-based stun*, pretty much a ranged version of KidneyShot. Looks as though Outlaw will be a favored spec among most rogues and probably will be the easiest spec to play just like Combat was. I like everything they did with Sub so far but I must see how Spectral Sight will influence the gameplay, or how drastic it may be.

[@ThomasBachler01]

+DarkRogue107 ass gets a ranged dagger throw ability that applies poison

[@CrystalblueMage]

How does proccing stealth work with open World content? Evade?

[@fredriksk21]

I like sub the most. Assa seems like the same stuff unless they give us some interesting talents. Hope they give us some nice talented interactive poison that stacks poison on the target and are consumed by envenom to give us a big burst or something. Would be cool.

[@khaltora863]

I like the lore change of (Outlaw) but I already didn't mind the play style. But.. The sub changes.. Let's hope their talent trees, and artefacts are awesome

[@FalsiestProphet]

Is the UI preach uses available for download?

[@Gandlersfake]

"Oh, big boy voice". Lol Love you, Preach.

[@Rhodair]

I wonder how sub will be leveling solo. Won't mobs be evade resetting all the time? And if they don't, is it really even true stealth then?

[@TheKroganMaster]

+Rhodair Aurelien shadow dance leaves a decoy, so you have a buffer time to get back into things.

[@zxc9884761]

So Preach, tell us what are you going to be rerolling? Not another Demon Hunter I hope?

[@ThomasBachler01]

+Sam T why would he reroll anything and why "another" demon hunter, he doesnt have any

[@MrCooljeppe]

+Thomas Bachler he tends to reroll for every xpac, and there is gonna be a fk ton of demon hunters, just like there was with death knights

[@ThomasBachler01]

I understand rerolling as creating a new character that is why i asked, since he already has every avaiable class on max level i didnt see any need for him to level again...thats where i was coming from

[@Chraisyer]

+MrCooljeppe I mean, of course there is going to be a fuckton of demon hunters, it's a new class which people have been waiting years for.

[@roarkecheetham762]

Bane from Dark Knight Rises is confirmed as a subtlety rogue. " You merely adopted the shadows. I was born in it."

[@sequel4]

just in case for people who didnt read the actual notes and are worried about the constant stealthing of sub rogues in pvp "Developer Comment: This will function differently in PvP, granting the use of abilities that require Stealth, but not actually providing Stealth."

[@larsveras4210]

Subtlety rogues to outlaws and assasins: you merely adapted the darkness. I was born in it, molded by it... Blizz went with batman/bane inspiration. If they have a artifact quest where they go back in time to find Baine bloodhoof and shouts "Where's Baine!?".... I'll go sub rogue in legion for that reason only.

[@David-bu4cl]

Ok, for Outlaw all we need now is a orange to eat for a root removal

[@Hyzen0_0]

So a subtlety rogue is Bane? Born in the shadows :-)

[@Trivity_]

+Fedarik Frost dks are born of frost so. 2 Bane classes :)

[@swordoflorn]

This is what I was waiting for, baby. Rogue is my main - best class! IMO :) Oh OMG Sub though. Sounds GREAT for me. I didn't play it in the past because of Shadow Dance, but this makes me want to play it. Outlaw sounds like a blast, too. But there's one problem: as soon as your dance procs and you vanish in the open world as Sub, the mob will reset :/ Totally unusable spec for leveling.

[@Repz_VN]

as a hardcore pvp er playing sub rogue i think my priority wont be to cc anymore and stun lock. with shadow dance i could cheap shot how many times i wanted and garrote sap u know rogue things with this new chages i feel like im going to be forced to use a finishing move to do all this

[@davidlewis6728]

that talent for ass would be great with subterfuge. combat run through is like a charge or a blink, this can either be used to keep yourself from taking to much damage or make you go faster for a few seconds/blink. sub dance has been beaten so hard over the time it was first shown, such a sad thing, tbh.

[@iIVIarky]

Feel exactly the same about sub could be so boring with the dance change but we will have to wait and see

[@billymx2]

With the sub change I'm hoping they go all in and push a full on ninja aspect, why not if they are adding pirates with the new outlaw.

[@TheKroganMaster]

+William Decou They are kind of a mix of ninja with new moves like Shuriken storm, and more infusing shadows into there abilities like Nightblade, Gloomblade, and shadow blades.

[@MarcielMcMullyMon]

so the outlaw spec is like a pirate now? Looks like the Delfias Cutlass is back for transmog boys

[@zesusvsbfow]

When is bullet time coming? :D

[@cyseroism]

Does outlaw keep insight/red buff?

[@ubermoc]

have been playing subtleties since vanilla and I like the new changes but there is no snare

[@xkankesx]

As someone who really likes playing rogues but feels like the rogue's position in WoD was a dull one, I really like the sounds of these changes. Subtlety may be a bit iffy though but it's intriguing.

[@Uninteruptable]

I dont really know how much you played assassination rogue , but 4 sek 20% dmg is a fine , you envonom like crazy when you have your dots up , also very well combined with your already envenom buff 30% more poison and 30% more dmg with multi and dispatch for up to 6 sek , so i think its great combination with already interesting buffs you get from your general finisher .

[@kl0ness]

Rogue is all about poisons imo. Outlaw or Subdlty don't appeal to me.

[@rasmusaulik12]

Thx for the series, good stuff.

[@dardi16]

8:00 Sub sounds way cooler and like more fun to me now ..

[@godlyobject6509]

As someone who played as 70% PvP and 30% Raiding, I kinda like the changes....I think; it's hard to tell with so little information, but the basics look to really mix up the rogue a lot for both PvE and PvP. That said, no poisons in 2 specs? WUUUT!? Also, as someone who PvP'd a lot, I found Shadow Dance clunky; it could be fantastic, and I have some good memories from it, but it ultimately was a keybind nightmare for PvP.

[@shawnfancy1476]

Will they still have Killing spree in combat... i mean outlaw?

[@shawnfancy1476]

nvm should of waited you just said it will be a tallent... booooo

[@joshlynn6195]

+Shawn Fancy WAIT WHAT that was my main dps attack :(

[@kentoran3312]

gota love that crispy shadow dance m8

[@SharXxXxX]

Can't wait to play combat 2.0 sounds amazing, even have a pirate transmog haha, and thanks to blizz it won't look weird with shoulders because you can hide them now :) I wish we could hide belts, kills the robe transmogs ...

[@tiffles3890]

Given that Demon Hunters will be hitting the battlegrounds and arenas soon with their spectral sight, might as well give the sub rogue (the preferred pvp rogue spec) the shadowstrike. That way atleast they will have a fair fighting chance.

[@ewanlister9262]

Finding it pretty interesting... Hoping it plays well

[@MrPeterDiamant]

So you can't quest as sub cause you drop mob aggro whenever you do a finisher

[@shikatsu]

+Egge Planten that is the shadow decoy part so it that may keep it tapped when you stealth for shadow dance.

[@RowanWeir]

+Egge Planten it drops a clone that the mob attacks when you go into stealth

[@Alex-gw9wq]

I can't wait for all the pirate T-mogs for outlaw rogues

[@TheSilverwing999]

Wow you do not sound so happy preach :) Does it matter that outlaw is pretty much combat? That some abilities are basically the same? Now the spec at least has some flavor, which it very much needed. The same with the other specs. It's an improvement in my eyes. At least for now. Let's see how the talents are going to look, but right now this is looking awesome.

[@Xarick]

Combat rogues looking like Cervantes de Leon now! Blade in one hand concealed pistol blade in the other!!

[@zadrik1337]

I knew going in that you would be happy about the gun. Granted you wanted it on survival hunter, but wtf, a gun!

[@arcticwarrior100]

so rogues now can use pistols?

[@KnotSavage]

how do u shoot a gun if ur hands are full

[@NickMK]

Other specs merely adopted shadow, sub was born in it

[@isnotaddicted]

Shadowstep tied into a regular damage ability is going to be even worse than KS. Any fight with sensive positioning for melee will be unplayble as sub.

[@milenasoloduhina1726]

Don't take a dagger to a gun fight?

[@RodneyDennis89]

Sub rogue=batman themed. The born in the shadows quip was from batman.

[@jasoncoetzee979]

I was born in a it, moulded by it, i didn't see the procs until I had no combo points and by then I found it nothing more than a DPS loss.

[@Meuduso1]

The WoW xpacs: Vanilla: The first BC: The first xpac (BLOODELFS AND PALADINS FOR HORDE OMG!!!!) WotLK: Mindblower and the first time Blizz used real textures Cata: THE DESTRUCTION!!! MoP: The world-visual update WoD: The "Pls wait for a good xpax" and the whole visual update Legion: HYPE! HYPE! DEMON HUNTERS!!!! HYPE! HYPE! ARTIFACTS!!! HYPE! HYPE! CLASS REWORKS!!!! But wait.....Almost all the remaining villains are going to be defeated (yeah maybe not but there is Aszara, maybe Old Gods, maybe Sargerras......Hmmm DONT KILLSTEAL AGAIN GREEN JESUS!!!!!! ^^