Pure Sine Inverter vs. Modified Sine - Microwave Oven Test

[@christiannationalistcrusad4557]

I'm a cross country truck driver and use the microwave daily. I was buying a new microwave every 3 to 6 months using a modified inverter and it didn't matter what brand microwave it was either. Once I got a pure shine wave inverter, my microwave was quite and heated my food, drinks a whole lot quicker! That was over 2 years ago and still using same microwave! The extra money to purchase a pure sine wave inverter pays you back quickly!

[@knurlgnar24]

Thanks for the comment! This is an excellent piece of data that I think others will find useful.

[@leelemon3373]

Real world advice is what most people are looking for. Thanks

[@sotokgilbert1490]

Thanks for the info!

[@jessstuart7495]

The buzzing sound you hear using the modified-sine-wave inverter is coming from the microwave's power supply transformer due to odd harmonic voltages (3rd=180Hz, 5th=300Hz...) on the modified sine wave output. This will cause harmonic currents, which will cause heating in the microwave's power supply transformer. It would be interesting to measure the value of the harmonic voltages and currents and estimate the total harmonic power going into heating the power supply transformer. If this is over about 50Watts, I would say you probably should spring for a True Sinewave inverter.

[@yaroc07]

+1

[@frugalprepper]

When I ordered my power jack inverter I got ripped off. The Hot Chinese chick in the picture wasn't even in the box!

[@FloryJohann]

Did you ever get a refund because of it or did they send the hot chick afterwards?

[@h7oslo]

Disappointment. rc

[@prmikey]

lmao

[@aamiddel8646]

Just to mention that the measuring devices you used are based on sinusoidal wave forms. Measuring square waves is quite different (True rms).

[@knurlgnar24]

I used RMS meters so all measurements were accurate regardless of waveform.

[@JoeZyzyx]

modified sine wave is 1100w for 2 minutes. 1110w/60 seconds =18.33w supplied per minute for 2 minutes to heat water to 40C, using total of 36.66w power. Pure sine wave is 1500w for 2 minutes. 1500w/60 seconds=25w supplied per minute for 2 minutes to heat water to 50C, using total of 50w power. Modified sine wave in same time heated the water to an 80% temperature value compared to the 100% for pure sine wave. This is 1w for each 1 degree Celcius for the pure sine wave, and 0.92w for each 1 degree on the modified sine wave. The unexpected discrepancy making the sine wave seem more efficient may be due to the extra power required to use a 5kw inverter than a 2kw inverter, due to differing heat loss from the inverters, also efficiency of conversion should be included. A more accurate picture would be if the time requirement was ignored and instead both were heated to 50C and then the total wattage used by both to bring the water to the same degree Celcius was used. My calculations says it would take 2 minutes and 24 seconds (2.4 minutes) for the modified sine wave inverter to also reach 50C temp in the water, and the use of 44w power compared to the 50w of power the pure sine wave inverter used. Another way to test better would be if both inverters have the same Kw rating, thereby reducing efficiency differences due to different transformer sizes used in each inverter.

[@JoeZyzyx]

Also would like to mention a 1000w microwave output will pull 1500w of power input. The reason the buzzing sound happens with the 2000w invertor is because it really can't supply more than the 1100w power to the microwave, so the microwave was running under powered, therefore the buzzing sound.

[@JoeZyzyx]

I use a crockpot with a clamp lid instead when traveling. It's 100w on low setting. I use a cheap 300w inverter to run it. Load it with beef stew, potatoes, carrots and peas and secure in my van with bungee cord around it to van. Leave on trip at 7-8am and by 1pm I have an excellent lunch already cooked, and more later for supper. When lazy, I drop a couple cans Dinty More Beef Stew or other canned food into it instead and let it warm up for a meal.

[@jimanddiana4103]

I've been watching your videos for hours now and you've helped me greatly. Thanks!

[@knurlgnar24]

I'm glad my videos helped you. Thanks for the comment!

[@Aceman307]

Your videos are very informative . Thanks for posting

[@mitsuoo1012]

Only 1,000 watt Modyfied Sine wave inverter compared to 5,000 watt Pure Sine wave inverter? How can 1,000 modyfied put out as much as 5,000 Pure Sine ave inverter?? Wouldnt that matter???

[@TheStevenhull]

This might be a dumb question, but if your power company is running 120v (like mine) and the pure sine wave inverter is 110v would it change the water temp any over the 2 minute cycle?

[@knurlgnar24]

Steven Hull Yes, a higher voltage will cause the microwave to consume more power and heat the contents faster.

[@johnsquire8178]

I had a modified-sine-wave inverter powering my microwave in my RV and by about the 20th time fried my microwave which was brand new ...

[@JSuparman]

Auuuw ....so horrible this !

[@Skylightatdusk]

Great video. Thanks! Would you definitely want a pure sine wave for a refrigerator or would you use the same approach regarding the value of the refrigerator to decide?

[@marklangridge2734]

I've been trying to find out whether to pay double for a pure sin-wave converter for using power tools with a caravan battery. I think you have convinced me its worth spending the money. I do wonder what a less expensive pure-sin inverter would be like (1000-2000W range rather than "5000W"). would it make much difference?

[@knurlgnar24]

For power tools I would generally recommend a modified sine inverter as universal motors will run just fine on MSW. If you want to run an air compressor, for example, you will need at least a 3kw inverter. That starts to get fairly pricey and is why a MSW may be an economical choice. Pure Sine Wave is going to be better for all applications though if you are willing to spend the $$.

[@jrplus416]

I recently bought a couple of deep cycle batteries and a couple of inverters. One is a 1000 watt pure sign wave inverter and the other is a 3000 watt modified sign wave inverter. My 600 watt microwave is an 20 year old unit. Both inverters showed that the microwave oven was drawing about 1000 watts. The puresine inverter couldn't handle the load and I switched to the modified sine wave. I know that microwave ovens are inductive loads, but a 40% increase in power usage was a surprise. What is the manufacturer stated wattage of the mictowave oven you used in the video and how old is it? Would newer 600 watt ovens have power correction to reduce the apparent load?

[@FloryJohann]

There is something I noticed in modified sine-wave inverters. I used to have an 2000 watt modified inverter to power a fan motor and that 100 watt motor would hum very bad. But powering the same fan motor with an 4,000 watt modified inverter, the motor would not hum at all and it was like the motor was running of the power grid. Could you try the same experiment with an 4,000 watt modified inverter to see if this would make any difference? I am just wondering.

[@knurlgnar24]

The difference likely lies in the inverter waveforms. Some MSW inverters have better waveforms than others. (lower THD) There isn't any specific reason why a high wattage MSW inverter will run motors better than a low wattage MSW inverter - it depends more on the design and quality of the inverter. Some do a better job of approximating the sinewave than others.

[@FloryJohann]

***** Thank you for explaining this. I actually thought that the higher wattage inverter just will hold the wave form better.

[@SB-bt8um]

Most helpful explanation of critical technical puzzle.

[@Bassguitarist1985]

Great to see a new video ***** all the best!

[@Tmanstomp100]

im surprised nobody has drawn the similarities between inverters and amplifiers yet... But I think the microwave doesn't like the modified wave for the same reason speakers dont like a clipped signal because a transformer is just basically a coil wound in a different shape. and when you clip an amplifier the sound wave starts to turn square like a modified sine wave

[@elvinhaak]

Thanks for sharing, gives another look at the subject. Some things I experienced: - with my pure sine wave inverters from Victron Energy, I get a nicer looking sinewave most of the time then on the normal 'street connection' that is running here, especially when not using full-loads. When I use only 1000Watts on a 1500 WA inverter for example it stays in a nice sine-wave. - with some cheaper 'pure sine wave' inverter from Conrad (rebranded I think from Voltcraft), it is kind of a modified sine-wave under low load (like a 50 Watt tungsten lightbulb), actually looking a bit like a sine-wave. But still isn't as is getting very clear under the scope. Actually this inverter killed my energy-meter pretty fast...electronic components... - modified Chinese kind of 'sinewave'... it is more of a block-wave with spikes. Even worse then on a couple of UPS-es I have (they are also modified sinewave ofcourse). Not really a 'modified sinewave' but just spikes and longer taking spikes to make blocks when under higher load. With a large inductor/coils you are getting more of a sinewave. Power-meting on the output of a inverter is not showing you something real though because they are made for and calculate for the results of a sinewave, so the values are incorrect. You will probably get a better result when measuring on the 12 volt inputs Because of the high pulses, a microwave can be the worst kind of load for an inverter, the spikes are getting through. I think I noticed your inverter flashing like 'overload' in your video because of this.

[@audiophilephile]

Given all the nonlinear loads your home and your neighbor's homes put on the grid, and the grid source being anything but a constant impedance (versus frequency) it's not surprising that a decent sine inverter has a smoother sine output than the grid.

[@sarahmorrill]

Thanks again for a very helpful video! It inspired me to buy an open-box Insignia microwave from Best Buy for $40. I connected it to a MSW inverter and it didn't make any noise at all and the clock/timer worked without issue. The only difference is that it appears to function with reduced power. It took a little more than twice as long to boil a cup of water. So, I could install it in my van, but a JetBoil or a $25 Japanese butane stove would boil water a lot quicker and would take up less room. The only inconvenience with using a JetBoil or a butane stove is that you need to have a door open. Oh, and you also have to be careful that you don't set everything on fire.

[@reddragon27284]

I expect an inverter based microwave would be more efficient than a traditional transformer based microwave on modified sine wave as it doesn't use a big transformer but a switching power supply like a computer or TV which rectifies the incoming AC to DC straight away.

[@knurlgnar24]

I would expect an inverter microwave to be less efficient than a traditional transformer based one. When run on MSW, however, the efficiencies are probably more similar as the inverter microwave won't suffer nearly as badly from the harmonics.

[@jacquesjosephj128]

RedDragonUKTech i

[@kokekusanov3859]

by the way how did you remove the tatoo from your face

[@realvanman1]

It should be noted that a MW oven is sensitive to, and it's output varies with, the peak voltage of the supply. This should not vary much with a sine wave inverter ("pure" is a redundancy- marketing hype. It's either a sine wave or it's not). But peak voltage absolutely varies with load and battery voltage with a modulated square wave inverter (there's nothing even close to a sine wave coming out these- "modified sine wave" is a joke, more marketing hype). If you raise the DC voltage going to the MSW inverter, you will also raise the output power of the MW it's supplying.

[@PaulPetrea]

LOL. "This is a thing..." Great video, as always.

[@kokekusanov3859]

stu make good videos specialy in the hangover part 1 2 and 3

[@olusolaeri-oluwa]

Hello, I have an Auto AC Inverter Traveller's Power 5000W, Model No. 2012 which I want to use in the house, unfortunately in Nigeria we use 220V. Also do I need a separate charger for the battery or charger inbuilt in the inverter?

[@BRUNNENG1]

I'm wondering what the results of power consumption would have been, if you had taken power factor into the calculation, and measure in volt amps. Just a thought, but another great video.

[@ryantoomey611]

The voltage reading of the modified sine inverter will only be accurate with a true RMS meter!

[@knurlgnar24]

Good tip. The meter shown in the video was an RMS meter.

[@friendofvinnie]

@@knurlgnar24 lol

[@PhilNelson_internet_fossil]

I would not have guessed that,@@knurlgnar24, and I have one of those things. But, if I can believe the manual I just looked up, it is "measured with true RMS methods". I guess a person could test the accuracy of that claim with an experiment very similar to this one, only using an electric kettle instead of a microwave. www.p3international.com/manuals/p4460_manual.pdf

[@EdmondCharrette]

Thanks for the video. I was wondering why the microwave drew 500 less watts from the modified sine wave inverter?

[@JoeZyzyx]

Because that's all the modified sine wave invertor could actually supply constantly. That 2000w rating is probably a surge rating.

[@user-ut9ln4vd5m]

Could be the power meter doesn't measure accurately on a modified sine wave...

[@budhihart8161]

I wonder the type of ur microwave..is it a inverter microwave or a transformer microwave..i need the answe...cause i want to buy inverter for microwave

[@jameswilsin5348]

I drove a truck for a long time i used a 3000 watt power drive inverter and i ran a 12 cup coffe pot and i ran a 500 watt microwave worked just fine .his microwave is one those 1000 watt or higher .700watt or less microwave 2500 to 3000 i run my hole trailer of a 4000 right now and have a 12000peak 6000 out put inverter on the way

[@dgoins6]

Thanks for the video. You answered my questions. This was a huge concern for me until I realized that I barely use my microwave. Now I'm not even sure why I have a microwave oven. Problem solved!

[@knurlgnar24]

That's one solution! For many people it may be the best solution.

[@ybaggi]

thanks for all your videos. Why is it so hard to put out a pure sinewave? even if one starts with a square wave, it's not hard to filter that low power signal with a high Q bandpass filter using a couple op-amps. isn't it? then amplify the signal to get the derired output power. Why are there still modified sine wave inverters? is it that much cheaper not to do it?

[@knurlgnar24]

Pure sine cannot be made by simple filtering on a MSW waveform, however I agree that pure sine isn't difficult to make. The direct answer is that because MSW is slightly cheaper to make, and because people don't know the difference, MSW sells better and therefore is what is sold. MSW inverters really shouldn't even exist from a technical and practical standpoint.

[@ronb6182]

People don't know so they buy cheap inverters, they also just look at watts output. And what sells is what the stores carry. I myself would like a lower voltage output. Bulbs including leds last longer when using 110 volts instead of 125 volts. I found that out a few Christmases ago. I was changing led lights about 7 or 8 a month. Now when I lowered the ac voltage to 110 instead of 125 volts I haven't changed 1 led bulb in the past 3 years. So I know it helps using 110 instead of 125 volts.

[@gchenley]

I always enjoy your scientific analysis, and have incorporated some of your ideas and cautions into my transfer switch. Thanks for your informative videos.

[@rd170]

This review is not exactly '' scientific '' analysis. First, why compare the outputs from a 1000W MSW to a 5000W PSW? Second, the 5000w inverter is a cheapo Alibaba type, while the Xantrex is...well, a Xantrex!

[@49richard]

does that mean that a toaster or a coffee maker will work also on a modified converter?

[@paulmryglod4802]

Richard Belanger yes. Resistance appliances like toasters and space heaters work fine on modified sine wave. I own a 3k watt HF mod inverter. In my opinion, don't bother with mod sine wave. Pay more and get good power from pure sine wave inverters.

[@49richard]

Thanks or your advice!

[@tylermack954]

Thanks for this! What's the make and model of the modified sine wave inverter? My microwave on regular ac power draws 1540 watts so I think it's the same as yours and would work with that inverter too.

[@hustlaz2k]

u should do an equal power inverter.

[@herrbrahms]

Just curious -- you mentioned that the microwave is a 1000W model. You were dissipating 1490W off the pure sine inverter. Do you know what the power draw spec is on your Whirlpool? It would be interesting to see how closely your KillAWatt reading matches the back panel.

[@fratermus5502]

Microwaves are rated on cooking power, not the power they draw to run.

[@MichaelAChang]

That appears to only be the microwave oven's power transformer lamination buzzing from the quasi-sine' s high harmonic distortion. It keeps time because there's a separate low voltage DC power supply powering the low level stuff, all of it integrated into a chip.

[@jsl5570]

I have a 2500 watt Xantrex Freedom 458 modified sine inverter/charger that came in my 2005 Fleetwood Bounder RV. Today we were using a fan with the inverter and it stopped working after a short time. Not sure how long because I was asleep. I plugged an identical fan into the outlet and it ran for less than a minute before stopping. Now neither fan works when plugged in at home. Is it possible that this modified sine wave inverter burned out the fans? They worked fine while at home and when using shore power or generator power. They are brand named Sunter and came from Costco a few months ago as a package deal of a floor standing fan and a tabletop fan.

[@jimmcandrew4933]

Microwave ovens seem to run ok on MSW, but my induction cooktop does not heat. I've tried two different cooktops (but both NuWave PIC) on two different MSW inverters, one a 2500W and the other a 2000W. The cooktop readout LEDs light, but it will not heat anything when connected to a MSW inverter. I suspect it needs some out-of-phase magnetizing VARs not available from an MSW inverter. Any confirmation or other explanation?

[@srobidoux]

I was reading about some inverters that have strapping options for 110 vs 115 vs 120v. Maybe that 5000w sine unit has such an option?

[@ekksiele286]

Kindly do a review on reliable power inverter

[@pietdepad4103]

Hi Knurlgnar, did you measure your voltages and power in RMS values. In other words does your meters measure the voltages and the powers independent of the wave form. Your a clever guy so i assume it does. If that's the case the the power difference between the two power measurements are not and indication of inefficiencies. Just a note form my side. It seems that you have calculated it through because you come out at a difference of 10% and that's not what the power measurements indicate. I come to more of less the same numbers. By the way nice experiment

[@NorthernKitty]

I calculated a 10% difference in watts per 1 degree change. I'm thinking that's what he based the calculation on: 1490W / 35° = 42.6W per 1° change for the Pure Sine Wave 1090W / 23° = 47.4W per 1° change for the Modified Sine Wave 42.6/47.4 = 89.9% The Pure Sine Wave inverter required only 90% of the power demanded by the Modified Sine Wave inverter to heat each 1°C.

[@lezbriddon]

Wow, I'm really shocked at the result of like a 10' difference. I was wondering what the transformer temp difference would have been but now dont really care as its got to be higher on the modified... I must admit I only run appliances that are usually swichmode powered, like PC's and laptops, so the wave shape doesnt bother them at all, i had an inverter go wonky and it was putting out dc not ac and i didnt notice for months till i plugged in something with a transformer supply and it would not work...

[@JSuparman]

Excellent testing report. Thanks.

[@kevin9c1]

You need to be comparing VA between the two microwaves, not watts. On another note, I have a cheap 1500W modified sine inverter from Harbor Freight that outputs such poor quality power that my kill-a-watt didn't read properly.

[@knurlgnar24]

VA isn't a useful measurement of microwave input or output power. Watts is what matters since it is the real power. VA is only apparent power. VA would be useful in determining the necessary inverter power output rating to run a particular microwave oven but since they aren't specified in volt-amps it isn't all that helpful. I haven't had a problem with my kill-a-watt with any inverter I've tried so far. Maybe they've had a few design changes through the years? It compares with a professional power analyzer pretty closely in my tests.

[@REVIEW_JUJUR]

Hello there... Will a modified sine wave inverter runs a AirConditioner??? My aircon constant draws 2A in 220v plug in the wall, how much watt MSW inverter i need to buy???

[@barnyard27]

Seems like you would need a 600 watt inverter.

[@rpdigital17]

So the modified sine inverter uses PWM duty cycle and True RMS AC voltage is lower?

[@Hammerjockeyrepair]

my microwave sounds like its going to explode on my mod sine inverter!!! could i get a cheap microwave thatll work on it instead?

[@lionlocVanDwellington]

Answered all my questions

[@oilspeculatorhater]

Thank you very much for this video which has answered a very important question for me.

[@tylermack954]

I tried a modified sine wave inverter on my 1000 watt microwave. It only put out 660 wats . On house power was 1540 watts. Also inverter beeping due to microwave overheating and was very hot. Would using better cable fix this? Was only 11 gage. Toaster and vacuum perform perfect with very close watts as house power.

[@knurlgnar24]

I don't understand the 'inverter beeping due to microwave overheating and was very hot" statement, but it sounds like something about your inverter/microwave setup is disagreeable to one or both of them. Toasters and vacuums don't care about waveform but microwave ovens do. 11 gauge is very thin is you are referring to your battery connections. Something like 2AWG would be more appropriate. You might get by with 4AWG if you run at lower duty cycles and monitor cable temperature.

[@tylermack4530]

@@knurlgnar24 Thanks! Was just a quick test. I will be using 2 gage wires and a pure sine wave 2000 watt inverter now i know better. Planning on using 2 batteries in parallel and a 3rd battery to 2nd inverter to charge the other two if that makes sense. The charger only uses 70 watts max i figure will last a good while that way. I like your battery bsnk but dont have the room.

[@RussellHank-t3t]

Not that I'd ever choose a modified sine wave inverter as a full-time A/C power source but I was still hoping that you would have addressed the efficiency question a little more mathematically. Considering there was a difference in the final water temperatures and the resulting wattage of the inversion, I would think that you'd use a ratio of the DC mAh used by each to the temperature gain from each, factoring in any relevant laws of thermodynamics to determine the true efficiency of each of your specific inverters with your specific microwave. Either way, I would never recommend a modified sine wave inverter be used with any level of consistency. In my opinion, it is a useful emergency backup device but, if you can afford it, generating your own power from current technologies and inverting it with pure sine wave inverters is better for your devices than the utility company's 5% THD by 2 to 3 percent in most cases.

[@KneelB4Bacon]

Could you detect a "dirty" power inverter with a power monitor that shows the line frequency? (Like a Kill-a-Watt monitor connected to the inverter?) Would you still get a nice, steady 60khz display or would there be enough "jitter" in the reading to see? (for those of us who don't have an oscilloscope or who want to blow up our microwaves. :) )

[@knurlgnar24]

You would need an oscilloscope or a harmonic power analyzer. A decent 'free' way to check is to use an AM/FM radio and look for interference as well as hooking up to a transformer based appliance (like a microwave) and seeing how much 'buzzing' it makes at various loads. Even purse sine inverters sometimes have unbalanced output causing transformer/motor saturation/heating.

[@surgingcircuits6955]

I would have liked to see the Kil A Watt P.F. Power Factor and VA volt amps measurements for each as well.

[@Skylightatdusk]

When looking up types of inverters, I got the following 2 classifications: 1) pure sine wave VS modified sine wave and 2) microinverters VS power optimizers VS string inverters Do these classifications interlap. For instance, can I have microinverters that are also pure sine wave inverters?

[@380stroker]

For recording MUSIC, good power source is a MUST! Fuck the pure sine wave shit. Get the audio recording hardware that runs off battery........aka: Direct Current. The result? HELLO "SOUND DEVICES". Great company with great products.

[@380stroker]

Very expensive hardware.

[@johnconrad5487]

Thanks for sharing. have an identical looking multimeter. how did you use it to measure temp on the 200 Volt scale?how did you measure 122V? was it from a different output? the modified sine wave inverter did not put out 122 Volts and your measurement was incorrect. rms is rms. you called ur meter reading rms. soooo... it was not the inverter. it was your reading. and your inferences about efficiency also are incorrect.

[@michaeljackson7361]

Was the clock affected by the modified? Was a full 2 minutes or was it not?

[@knurlgnar24]

The clock was not affected by the modified sine wave on my particular microwave. I cannot say this applies to all appliances.

[@errolcain4071]

Hi my friend, What doyou think about the whisler xp2000i iverter,,,,,,,thanks in advance

[@12vLife]

On the fence about spending an extra $100 ($80 vs $180) on my simple setup for pure sine vs modified sine wav . Also finding Inverters just don't last very long for me.. wish they were generally more robust. My battery Is my starter 70AH 120RC. I run power tools and appliances 500w to 1000w, but need to run a freezer for 8 hours while a 200w solar panel feeds my battery through a MPPT controller. Just had my 1200w modified sine inverter go bad after an accidental short.. they are so sensitive. Somebody wrote a review on my inverter saying the inverter was eating 200W to power a 100W in devices...

[@TheBlackadder-Edmund]

Hello, wasn't sure if to ask this here or on the ups conversion videos. It seems modified sine wave is more trouble than it is worth Vs pure sine wave, but pure is a fair more expensive. Could a modified sine UPS be converted to be a pure sine inverter? Without touching wattage capacity, just make it pure sine. Reason to ask: I can get backup ups's (modified) for a tenner and the smart ups for 100-150 (both working second hand). Thank you.

[@TheBlackadder-Edmund]

+knurlgnar24

[@GM-ul1el]

I bought a 1000w Bestek modified inverter before I learned about the pure sine models. Which brands do you personally like in a 2 or 3000w pure sine inverter for 2017?

[@toddlaplanteVT85]

Greg Miller I Belive he has a 3k watt Samlex inverter that is very good. Outback inverters are some of the best if not the best if you have the coin

[@jameswilsin5348]

Im wondering why the small inverter witch is way to low watt to run that big microwave didnt shut down naturaly a 5000 watt of any kind will outdo a 1500 i got a 1100 watt ouput inverter krieger that will run mine i even ran my hole trailer of it .

[@TheJustin574]

Interesting video, thanks for the upload.

[@Mangler316]

Impressive information. Thanks.

[@yeliab814]

Would be interesting to see this test using one of today’s inverter microwaves. The humming problem should be gone and the performance gap may be negligible. But I’m curious about the effect of moving from one type of difficult load (highly inductive) over to another type of difficult load (highly capacitive)..

[@knurlgnar24]

I have wondered some of the same things, but Inverter microwave ovens were largely a thing a couple decades ago no? At least here in the USA I haven't seen one marketed in a long time aside from some extremely expensive luxury models that no one actually buys.

[@yeliab814]

@@knurlgnar24 they’re back, and bound to eventually take over entirely sure as the SMPS did. Much lighter to ship and prob already cheaper to make. .Toshiba (Midea), Panasonic, LG, Galanz all sell them; I purchased one recently and it’s great. Reminds me of HVAC - I think it was Trane that introduced a full VRF AC in the 80’s. Then they vanished for decades but look at it now!

[@BarryPomeroy]

Thanks for the videos; I bought my modified sine wave inverter on your recommendation and it has paid off. I've been wondering about the ability of the modified sine wave inverters to run electronics. I am particularly interested in running a bread maker. Do you think they have any electronics beyond the clock that modified sine wave might run improperly or ruin?

[@martehoudesheldt2708]

be REALLY careful i tried a mod sign wave on my house and burnt up the coffee maker, ele mattress pad +. it will be what you are going to risk? the coffee maker was a black and decker and mr coffee units

[@DougDiLaura]

Great video, very informative. Thank you

[@kf7tkj]

Great video! I like the actual application to answer a question, thanks for making this video. On a side note, any idea why I can't find an OSP tiger claw inverter anywhere?

[@knurlgnar24]

kf7tkj They don't seem to be available all the time - a batch comes and goes and then you can't find them for a while again. Not sure why, and I'm unsure if the quality is consistent either. Definitely the best low cost pure sine inverter I've seen so far though.

[@Bassguitarist1985]

***** sigler music imports them from china. Their cycle is about a new shipment every 45-60 days. Not exactly sure but I bought two tiger claws and both performed equally well.

[@knurlgnar24]

***** Thanks for the update! I am glad that they didn't reduce the cost of their design and relegate themselves to another 'me too' inverter.

[@Bassguitarist1985]

***** yessir. In fact they are back in stock as of writing this comment.

[@FloryJohann]

I just saw them a few days ago on ebay.

[@fishermans1friend]

If I charge my ebike with a modified sine inverter, can this do any harm to my ebike battery or just to the charger as it would heat it up unnecessarily? Thanks for the great video!

[@knurlgnar24]

That will work fine. Wile a pure sine inverter isn't necessary for your eBike charger it will likely charge slightly more efficiently with one. This is a good application for a modified sine inverter.

[@ericcloudbolduc8840]

Appreciate the video... But, not sure 1500w is enough to run a microwave to its full potential... I have seen advice to use an inverter that is double the microwave rating... Not sure if this had an effect. The microwave did work without blowing a fuse or safety shutdown, which i find surprising.

[@knurlgnar24]

The only reason people recommend using an inverter rated for double the microwave rating is because most inverters cannot output what they claim to output. The situation on inverter ratings has gotten pretty bad, so buyer beware.

[@Asuperchipmunk]

Hi, im planning to power two led smds 30w each floodlights with a 300w modified sine wave inverter. Will i encounter any problems?

[@imtheadamus1979]

No

[@fotomedia1]

good test

[@rockyboon5025]

Hello, i think we should also consider the fact that the invertor are not of the same wattage.

[@SquirrelFromGradLife]

Speaking of PSW inverters.... have you tried looking at the wave form from a modified sine wave inverter at the output point from a transformer like from a laptop? My Mascot 600watt pure sine inverter runs just fine but I had a guy ask me if plugging in a transformer for a laptop didn't smooth out the wave form from a modified sine wave and I couldn't really give him a definitive answer other than modified sine wave inverters and computers are a bad thing.

[@knurlgnar24]

laptop power supplies are switching power supplies which first boost the voltage to around 400V DC, then send it through a high frequency transformer to convert to lower voltage AC, then rectify that transformer output to make dirty DC. It is then filtered to produce a clean DC. The waveform will be a nice clean DC waveform whether operating on MSW or PSW. Modified sine may allow some radio frequencies past the filtering and may make some of the input filtering run hotter but otherwise will power laptops without issue.

[@SquirrelFromGradLife]

***** All that in that little brick?...Thanks for your answer... so it doesn't affect clock frequencies that much then... is it the same for smartphones, tablets etc?

[@knurlgnar24]

SquirrelFromGradLife Yes, same for phones and tablets except that those devices can be more sensitive to some of the higher frequency noise that MSW inverters tend to produce. e.g. There have been reports that the touchscreens may not behave as expected or the like on certain especially noisy power sources.

[@thefaeryman]

seems that I hear that the microwave can't get enough power to run off a small off grid setup, this would explain why since many will, like myself, will but first the modified because of price, later I only buy the pure sine waves that I use now.

[@cheapwoodworking_plan-to-build]

Can a PC be damaged by using a modified wave inverter to power it?

[@knurlgnar24]

Yes, but it is very unlikely to be damaged. I would not hesitate to run my computers off of MSW. The input filtering stage of the power supply will be more stressed and run hotter but the rest of it will operate just fine.

[@FloryJohann]

We have power failures on a regular basis and when it happen a 4-12 hr failure is normal. So far I ran my Pc and a tv on a Modified inverter and there was no damage to it.

[@jameswilsin5348]

How many watts is the microwave?

[@PaymentIsDue]

very informative thanks

[@joepah51]

great video.. It would have been helpful to measure the DC current and voltage in to each microwave, becuase the would be the truest measure of energy required to operate the microwave. The reduce output of the MSW might be a limitation of the setup.

[@knurlgnar24]

Thanks for the comment and you have good recommendations. Others have also commented that they would have liked to see more data.

[@vincentrobinette1507]

It would be interesting to measure the Peak to Peak voltage of both inverters. My experience is, a modified sine wave peaks about 145 volts, a true sine, about 165 volts. If the microwave uses a capacitor and diode, it might be running on the peak voltage, which may be the main reason why the oven doesn't draw its rated power on the modified sine wave inverter.

[@JSuparman]

I do agree, Sir.

[@voltare2amstereo]

if the microwave was an 'inverter' type, it wouldn't matter.

[@tad95683usa]

Agree! Like the ones by Panasonic.

[@kg4boj]

Love those 24-dc1 batts. Best bang for your buck. I use them in my locksmith geddup with a battery isolator.

[@knurlgnar24]

They used to be a better deal than they are today but are still a good battery regardless. Be sure to use the online coupons to get a hefty discount!

[@kg4boj]

***** I wish optima batteries were what they used to be. I used to exclusively use the blue tops. Ever since they moved to Mexico and bumped the price up 100$ I haven't had one single batt last more than a year. In fact I had 2 in a row right off the shelf measure less than 8 v

[@kg4boj]

***** better still, I use my commercial account discount :-)

[@AnthonyDiSano]

Peter Carlson If you are looking for an alternative to Optima take a look at your local Batteries and Bulbs retailer. Their AGM house brand is actually manufactured by Northstar however is quite a bit cheaper and carries a much longer (two & three years longer) replacement warranty than one purchased directly from Northstar. Northstar batteries are some of the best in the world and the only battery the US military will use so it's a pretty good find.

[@smallenginedude71]

Peter Carlson dont complain in aus they cost about 250 dollars.

[@babelcomm4236]

Thank you! You explain very well your discoveries, etc., in your videos! You do not waste time! And that is great!

[@dondiego124]

Great video thanks

[@ericgfx01]

Holy TLDR. Works yes but Modified Sine Wave is less efficient, cause an odd buzzing noise ( @6:50 ) and may damage the microwave.

[@ryantoomey611]

Can you run an air conditioner off a modified sine wave inverter without burning it up?

[@paulmryglod4802]

Ryan Toomey my window unit runs noticably worse on my HF 3k watt inverter. Buy pure sine wave inverters!

[@gelumiro1160]

thanks for the video

[@noneuno53]

can i have a game pc run of a battery back up pure sine wave. that is plugged in to the wall, of an off grid modified sine wave home?

[@cloroxbleach1200]

It runs on a power supply, so yes.

[@nate8088]

Excellent video! Showed what has been exactly my experience. (Plus the weirdness in MSW while charging/powering computers and other electronics.... especially those with touch-screens.) Which is why I'm going to PSW.

[@Bergwacht]

Hello, I just feed my electricity into the floor of this house with a 1500W pure sine. However, that is not even enough for an 800 watt microwave. Can I simply use a 3000 Watt Mod sinus instead? Everything depends on it, computer, kitchen, etc. When I see the video, mod sinus is even better because it consumes less watts^^

[@knurlgnar24]

Many inverters do not perform anywhere near their 'rated' power. 1st, make sure you have a good inverter that can actually provide the power it is rated for. 2nd, I don't know your battery situation but you will need about 100ah of battery per 1000W of power when the batteries are fully charged, and 200ah per kw when partially charged. 3rd, modified sine is less efficient than pure sine due to most appliances being about 30% less efficient when operating on modified sine so it is good to take that into consideration when talking watt consumption.

[@Bergwacht]

@@knurlgnar24 Thanks for answering in such detail! The situation is as follows... To put it bluntly: I wanted to know if I could possibly get more out of a 5000 watt mod sine wave than out of a 2000 watt pure sine wave. I have 4x140 Ah and 4x100 Ah truck batteries on a 3.2 kilowatt solar system (24V). I cut the house fuse to the public power grid and feed it from my 1500 watt inverter directly into the house socket in the wall. (230V) When I have the microwave on and my mother turns on the coffee maker, the lights in the house go out. I don't even know what dimension of inverter I need, I only know that 5000 watts mod sinus costs the same as 2000 watts pure sine. It is said that Mod Sinus inverters would destroy my devices, and here everything is operated with an inverter, does that mean that in a year all computers and smartphones in the house will be broken if I use a Mod Sinus? i need more power but i can't spend 700€ for a pure sine inverter😨 and sorry for the spam^^

[@kokekusanov3859]

Thank you stu

[@Dr.Fingertips]

Thanks man!

[@oprahwinfrey878]

Bro lol you’d need to do a comparison of two equal output wattage inverters with different sign-waves from the same company. This was a terrible comparison.

[@pmaxgen]

Hi, Any one know the practical difference between High frequency and Low frequency power inverters? Specially related to loading of inducive and other loads.

[@UrgenthelpwithSubscriptionsHel]

High frequency are dangerous for human body. Electromagnetic radiation can cause severe headache and other problems

[@UrgenthelpwithSubscriptionsHel]

Search on google

[@audiophilephile]

Somehow I don't think the Kill A Watt was designed for "modified" wave forms. This makes all results on the modified sine converter suspect.

[@knurlgnar24]

I've tested them against a quality lab style watt meter and they were within 2% of eachother. The Kill A Watt meters are made and work well, though I agree that using home equipment can be suspect.

[@SigKappel]

good video. Ok I'm getting a pure sine wave inverter. You're like a wise 50yo in 16yo body in a XXXL Shirt

[@Totogita]

If you hot glue a couple of egg cardboard holders together and place them at the corners of the room, you Will reduce the reverberation in your audio. Bath toowells framed also does a good job. Very instructive video otherwise, Thanks!

[@ady7d77]

hey buddy, you have to use to microwaves, cuz, when u first use it , i till not warm as strongs as the last use,

[@DUTCHBOYH]

Great video.

[@cloroxbleach1200]

3:44 Well done with that notice! I'm sure those metric-heads are now turning red with embarrassment