Putting Others First - Selfishness v. Selflessness Redux | Sanders Sides

*WARNING: This video contains instances of computerized voices, eyestrain, loud noises, & digitalized music & sound effects. There is also flashing at 10:46 & 30:20-30:25*
At long last, the day is here. Thomas was torn between going to a callback and potentially fulfilling his dream of being a part of a huge cinematic project, or going to two of his best friends’ wedding to be there for them and support them. And, even though, he’s sure he made the right choice, something feels off. After all is said and done, is there something to be said for putting others before yourself?
I wanna give a HUGE thank you to the director of this episode, Joan, who takes so much of their time to help get these performances outta me and I could not be more grateful!
Joan’s Links:
thejoanglebook.tumblr.com
/ thejoanglebook
I also have to thank Joan for heading up the writing of this episode, as well as Davi and Quil, who assisted!
Davi’s Links:
/ hello_davii
/ hello_davi
vm.tiktok.com/ZMJAwTT8X/
Quil’s Links:
/ quildarling
/ quildarling
vm.tiktok.com/ZMJPjMe4W/
And a GIGANTIC thank you to the animator who brought every video game scene to life: John Stratman!! He has an amazing channel and you’re gonna wanna check it out, TRUST ME!
John’s Links:
/ motionfictiontv
/ stratmasterj
/ stratmasterj
Also, I have to give a HUMONGOUS thank you to Erin AKA RainyDayWindow, for helping create all the Ace Attorney art for the Rhythm Redux song!
Erin’s Links:
/ supercoffeehigh
Gotta give a GINORMOUS thank you to Joseph and Joan who helped create the music for the Rhythm Redux song!!
And I’d like to give a GARGANTUAN bit of gratitude to Connor, who helped compose special background music for this video!!
Connor’s Links:
/ khonjin
And, a TITANIC thank you to Talyn, who is the hands behind the Deceit makeup!
Talyn’s Links:
/ tallykat3
And a GIANT thank you to Joan and Cam, who helped me edit this video!!
Cam’s Links:
/ camdenfoote
/ camdenfoote
Of course, a SUPER-SIZED thank you to Diana, Aleksandr, and Dalton for voicing and playing characters in this video!
Diana’s (Mary Lee) Links:
/ t_diana
Aleksandr’s (Lee) Links:
/ awilde.photo
/ aswilde1
Dalton’s (Wedding Photographer) Links:
/ daltoncotter
www.daltoncotter.com
I would also like to give a very heartfelt thank you to our special guest, Leslie Odom, Jr.!!
And, last, but not least, an EPIC thank you to Danilo for creating our thumbnail!
Danilo's Links:
/ cometbrace
_______________________
My Social Links:
www.vine.co/ThomasSanders
/ thomassanders
/ thomassanders
/ thomassandersofficial
Tik Tok - thomassanders
Tumblr - / thatsthat24
________________________
Merchandise:
North America/WorldWide: shop.thomassanders.com/
________________________
Works Cited:
The History of the Trolley Problem - www.google.com/amp/s/amp.thea...
Deontological Ethics - www.britannica.com/topic/deon...
Deontology - www.minerva.mic.ul.ie/Vol19/De...
Are You Engaging In Enough Leisure Activity - www.psychologytoday.com/us/bl...
Why Put Your Oxygen Mask On First is Not the Best Metaphor for Self-Care -
www.everydaytherapist.com/blo...
Why You're Instructed To Put Oxygen Masks On Yourself First - www.google.com/amp/s/www.huff...
U.S. Could End Homelessness With Money Used To Buy Christmas Decorations [INFOGRAPHIC] - www.huffpost.com/entry/homele...
Six Facts About Wealth in the United States - www.brookings.edu/blog/up-fro...
The Cost to End Homelessness - www.nytimes.com/2012/12/10/us...
Hypoxia and Hypoxemia - www.medicinenet.com/hypoxia_a...
Odyssey by Kevin MacLeod
Link: incompetech.filmmusic.io/song...
License: creativecommons.org/licenses/b...
Peter Singer - Effective Altruism
• Peter Singer: The why ...

[@brookedevonshire9688]

“This is Sanders Sides, not Odom Sides. Ahem, I’m not threatened at all.” Thomas, you outdid yourself

[@plusiegaming8962]

I wanna like but its at 666 likes

[@SimWings]

Yes

[@Modernwoman-cy6dc]

Yavier Xman quadrupled now

[@itsiona20]

@@plusiegaming8962 what does that mean ;w;

[@AJ-The-Bumblebee]

I know people dont trust Janus, but remember in his introduction: His only motivation is self preservation. And sometimes that comes in the form of taking care of yourself before others.

[@Rex_o_roar]

Also the fact he's a part of Thomas so he would want Thomas to take care of himself too.

[@koalabeertje2466]

my exact thought

[@scapegoatcomics6168]

Janus represents a human self defence mechanism, lying is essential because without it you cannot conceal your true intentions. The problem is the act of lying has been demonised and the idea that it's wrong is reinforced from such an early point that when we have to learn that lying can be okay and in some cases necessary then we have to unlearn the notion that lying is wrong. And that's what we have here, Janus represents ironically an uncomfortable truth: he is part of Thomas. Roman and Patton have held a sense of moral absolutism and whilst Patton has realised this is not the way and is starting to grow Roman cannot accept this because it challenges his whole identity. In his moral reasoning he is the hero and Janus is the villain...but his reasoning is flawed because it neglects the reality that morality isn't an absolute it's a spectrum. Janus is not evil, he's not even inherently bad but if that's true then what does that mean for Roman? And there is the uncomfortable truth that not all sides of Thomas can reconcile with in this episode. The thing about Janus is he is in service of the self, his priority is and always will be Thomas' wellbeing even if it comes at the expense of others but this doesn't make him any less of a valid side than Virgil, Patton, Logan or yes even Roman. And I cannot wait to see how this continues on, we are seeing the sides evolve with Thomas and just as Patton is learning morality isn't simple so must Roman learn things aren't black and white.

[@xjessyplaysssxx7486]

Who is janus?

[@xjessyplaysssxx7486]

Nvm I know now

[@EliasMorals]

God, Janus is written so well in this episode He plays the devil's advocate for all the arguments but never actively steers thomas wrong. He has good arguments without needing to quote, and he's kind of like a compliment to Logan.

[@Unidentified952]

Yeah!

[@bee_the_fox_]

Actually, the "compliment" is extremely accurate due to the fact that blue and yellow are invertered colors, which compliment each other! You invert blue, you get yellow and vice-versa! You are one smart cookie!

[@lukeroberson2115]

Janus is the compliment to Patton, the same way Remus is a compliment to Roman. My personal belief is the upcoming orange side will be Logan's foil.

[@threelayerbeefybeanburrito872]

Did anyone notice how the two sides that were missing (Remus and Virgil) were the two sides that actually played a really large role in this episode? The anxiety over having to pick between yourself and others, as well as guilt, and the dark creativity needed to imagine those train car scenarios

[@galaxyweirdo1018]

This comment sounds so smart

[@Sarah-vv6in]

My theory is that whenever the other sides aren’t “physically there”, Thomas actually embodies their personality and role. It’s not full proof because of the anxiety 2 parter but in the moving on 2 parter Logan said that he wasn’t an emotion and couldn’t really duck 🦆 out. And of course Thomas actually said “falsehood”. So Thomas feeling anxious and imagining that dark situation makes complete sense to me cause they are part of him after all. Does that make sense? lol

[@fallenpaint4494]

i can just see the two watching the show, and when janus came into scene virgil said 'Now i think its time to dial down, i feel like making the snake cry would be to far' and remus just makes roman go off

[@ithinkamberiscool]

LITERALLY THOUGHT THAT

[@IguessImhere223]

@@Sarah-vv6in Quack

[@applej]

Janus is only cloaked as a “bad guy” because Thomas associated putting yourself first (selfish) as a “bad thing”. Janus said “youve been taught to feel guilty for taking care of yourself”

[@wafflesgacha9900]

Ya, once he got rid of the “selfishness is bad” mentality Janus doesn’t seem so evil anymore

[@greedo2009]

hes not evil just kind of a prick

[@viravos]

yeah. but he is a sassy snake. :)

[@applej]

the shagg but doesnt it make you wonder how the “self-care” Sander Side would present for someone who didnt learn “selfish” as a bad thing? like would they be more of a maternal figure or a friend? thats different compared to Thomas who would see the Sander Side that is concerned about taking care of himself as “bad” because he formed the opinion that self-sacrificing is a virtue

[@summanus4437]

@@greedo2009 That's more to due with the mentality Thomas developed towards concepts like Deceit. Personally, outside of being a little snarky, he never really came across as a bad or unreasonable person to me. Frankly he just came across as someone upset he wasn't being appreciated.

[@joshuahuvenaars9021]

Decades from now, people are going to analyze the great philosopher Thomas Sanders and be so amazed and confused why he is the same persons talking to himself in a bunch of different outfits. Truly the Plato of our time.

[@julien4305]

Philosophers are always exotic beings Thomas fits in very well

[@PurpleMoth459]

True 😂😂

[@MisterDeplume]

He's like the modern Mr. Rogers, just for more mature audiences

[@shelby5736]

The absolute flex of having Leslie Odom Jr in your video but only giving him a few seconds of screen time

[@MasterMagikarp]

Chad move right there.

[@sadie6094]

"just your typical tuesday." -Thomas Sanders

[@boomgirlbucko]

I mean Thomas is definitely more popular than him soooo

[@greenbean6547]

Virgil: has a redemption ark Janus: is honestly trying to help Thomas Remus: eating deodorant in the background

[@vendedordecanela]

Honestly i prefer the dark sides

[@foxle_]

Now let’s see what happens when orange is revealed

[@TheMinecrafty3cl1pse]

I want to like, but I don't want to ruin the 666- so take this as a like-

[@Lunarwolf57272]

31:48 deceit vs lillypatton FIGHT!

[@Zipper_cookie]

Wait, who is Janus again?

[@anythingbyalex9660]

okay but like i think janus’s reaction to roman laughing at his name is fair. imagine if you introduced yourself to someone at school and their reaction was to laugh and say “that is such a stupid name” and obviously you’d want to insult them back

[@nomatophobia]

41:37 (just putting a time stamp so we all see what you're talking about)

[@LyxiLynnn]

I think it's fair. But you can tell that Janus was only really annoyed and not hurt. While Janus went for what Roman is most insecure about. Janus naturally said it and you can tell he regrets it or at least was like " Uh oh to low" In his next shot (41:56)

[@desireerodriguez389]

I think is like a call out, he did the same with Virgil and he laughing at others is getting normalized, Janus name is an importante thing, just like it was with Virgil, and when Janus said something that will hurt too he couldn't take it and expect everyone to take his side (I like Roman, and I identify a lot to him, so it's something that i've experienced in the past, at least that's my way to seeing it from experience haha)

[@mayab8053]

I think it was kinda like a knee-jerk reaction. Especially after being considered evil for so long. Janus opened up about something personal to him and he was laughed at and made fun of by Roman. So, he naturally put on a mask and insulted Roman back. I can relate to that. Anyway, it’s obvious that they both went too far and have some apologizing for do. After all, you can’t take back what you said but you can make up for it and move on.

[@etherealsoliloquy]

I personally like to think this confirms that Janus stands more for Self-Preservation, of course he would have a reaction like that to protect himself, just like how he would protect Thomas

[@lenaschubert5533]

„You need to unlearn that selfish is a dirty word“ LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK

[@cmd0317]

PREACH

[@blaze5126]

I mean really, If people weren't selfish than they wouldn't be human, it's one of the things that makes people, people. They gotta get that info in their brains

[@Cinnaschticks]

👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾

[@aetheryourfriend4001]

i need to unlearn that

[@smolamericanbean9120]

LOUDER FOR ME CAUSE IM DEAF AF AND IGNORANT AF

[@moothecow8029]

Did you know snakes are colorblind? So the line where janus says if remus didnt have a mustache he wouldn't be able to tell whos the evil twin might be true for him.

[@claireaquos6532]

Oh 🤔

[@purposehearts190]

It also explains the red/blue shirt thing from a few episodes back cause the shirt was gray.

[@moothecow8029]

@@purposehearts190 oh yeah!

[@percyjackson4709]

@@purposehearts190 i mean, it had red and blue on it sooo

[@markyboi9354]

Noooooooooooooooooo (Is it a Pokémon reference or a just a pun you thought of and thought wuz funny)

[@dragonkingscotty]

Roman: Well, when is it enough??!? Janus: T r e e s?????

[@cauliflowercay5555]

I was SEARCHING for this comment

[@drkfiredrgn]

I bet Janus has a green thumb

[@steven.q]

No selfishness

[@Mothpuff]

Funniest moment in the entire series

[@freddygamer911]

when is it enough trees

[@samhague4213]

When Roman makes fun of Janus' name, you can just see how hurt he was by it, and unlike Virgil, he didn't have anyone stick up for him, Janus has to stick up for himself

[@funkysquig]

Oh no, Janus!! I’ll accept you!

[@CPete711]

I legit started crying at that part😭😭

[@barbiecentral]

it made me so sad seeing him visibly hurt, and when no one said anything about it, like PATTON DIDN'T EVEN MAKE A DISAPPROVING FACE COME ON

[@phoenixablaze649]

Our poor snake boi 😭

[@jellyremusthethrashman2534]

Le Rat Man we all accept him and by all I mean all us dark sides.... *****! I’ve said too much

[@starcat4814]

The sides just look at each other and think: each of you is an idiot, but I'm a horrible person, so what are we gonna do?

[@nerdywolverine8640]

O u c h

[@caffeinemilk]

I mean, you’re not wrong

[@abrielleelysee7991]

That's pretty much it.

[@maddy7101]

I feel like at the end though, they all just felt really bad and they just wanted to like each other again.

[@viravos]

accurate af :,)

[@skelefoowey]

Janus doesn't feel like 'Deceit' anymore. I feel like lying and maneuvering around the truth is less of a malicious aspect of his personality and more of a way to protect Thomas's. He isn't a one-dimensional embodiment of lies and trickery, he's simply the most adamant in looking out for Thomas' needs and desires. He protects his ability to think for himself and to do the things that he wants to do. Lying is only one aspect of what Janus is and what he stands for. As a whole, he's something like Thomas' guardian. I feel like Thomas started out by seeing things as they are on the surface. He saw Patton as morality and saw him as a constant force of good despite the fact that he also primarily represents emotion and Thomas's moral compass (doing good for others). as we've seen in this episode, it's clear that morality, though initially perceived as good, can be problematic and harmful to Thomas's mental health if not practiced in moderation. Roman is seen as Thomas' creativity, but he's later shown to also be his ambition, expression, and passion (which needs to be kept in check for obvious reasons). Thomas's view on morality had driven him to primarily focus on one aspect of 'creativity', which lead to the birth of the Duke, who was neglected because of what he represents. Then, there's Virgil, who carries all of Thomas's fear and doubt, who also serves as a guardian. Logan is someone who's already perceived as entirely logical and incapable of seeing things from an emotional point of view. His character was already in the gray zone rather than considered either good or bad by Thomas and/or the audience. Point is, I really appreciate this series, because you see genuine growth in the way Thomas perceives things and works through his dilemmas. Things are no longer black and white. Anxiety isn't just bad, Morality and Creativity aren't just good. If you don't approach things from every side's perspective, you'll never fully understand how you feel toward a specific dilemma you're having, especially if one side of yourself can have you believe something that could be harmful to the state of your mental health. This series is beginning to morph into the idea that nothing is one-dimensional, especially the characters living in your mind palace. I feel like future installments of this series are gonna involve fully accepting the darker aspects of your personality (like Janus, who's no longer just Deceit. He's grown into a fully three-dimensional character as soon as he was given a name not pertaining to everyone's already established preconceptions of him and his character). All in all, I adore this series with all of my heart. It feels like a therapy session and, as someone who has a good number of my own issues, I sincerely appreciate Thomas' takes on morality and selfishness. 'Kay, sorry for the essay. I'm done now lmao (2022: I didn't expect there to be so many people who'd appreciate how I see things and/or how I put it into words. I thought people would just scroll past my comment 'cause it was too long. Thanks for all the love. It definitely gave me a healthy amount of confidence when I really needed it

[@mooney5564]

that was beautiful thank you

[@beaclauie]

id give you a perfect score omg

[@ZK-ib2wp]

A+, good job

[@derpyblu1651]

A++++ amazing job!

[@watermelonwiki3540]

(Everyone liked that)

[@gwenpines3526]

that little pose Janus makes when he says "You're just stuck with a snake boi" is KILLING me

[@ZK-ib2wp]

So cute lol

[@scocopat457]

I have a screeshot of it

[@Fynchfire]

me to

[@magicrainbowkitties1023]

It is important to remember that they are all, at the end of the day, all parts of the same supremely silly individual.

[@brynncess2228]

Time stamp?

[@wolftango6084]

May i gently remind- "It's not like I'm trying to look out for Thomas or anything"-Deciet/Janus

[@josieburks9049]

I was thinking of "I don't want Thomas to be punished in a world where you can die for breaking the rules." LIKE HE'S A SNEK BOI NOT AN EVIL SNEK BOI

[@g.g.7730]

Lmao he's a tsundere confirmed

[@logansanders9307]

@@g.g.7730 XD

[@bluownbutterfly]

LEGIT THOOOOO

[@miareynolds1863]

Roman is insecure about the dark selfish parts of him. When he showed them he was criticized. So to see someone who has openly shown these parts of them get openly accepted hurts.

[@C0co_577]

Mia Reynolds yessss exactly! Also I think he’s insecure because he feels like there’s still an attachment to Remus, and maybe he feels like he only deserves to be a dark side and hated by the others like Remus, so when another dark side is excepted so easily (not counting Virgil cause that took a while) he was really insecure.

[@izzylacroix4131]

OOOHH that makes sense!!

[@solessisters4848]

Holy heck ur right

[@your_local_fander3702]

Wow. That is.. a good point. Imma go rethink my life

[@toby4514]

Mamma mia that's a good point!

[@KK-bb5ln]

I noticed this watch that when Logan pops up again, Janus has a little "oh sh*t" moment-but after that, as Logan speaks, he sort of leans in, looking genuinely interested. Whether he's playing it up to make Logan feel better or if he's just actually interested, I think it's sweet how intently he's listening to Logan's info, especially given how insecure Logan's acting about it lately.

[@elizakitty6579]

Aww that is sweet. Thanks for pointing that out!! I hadn't noticed that before Also I think it's interesting that the "light" sides listen more to Logan when the "dark" sides are involved. Especially with the color wheel theory and the foreboding orange eyes that Logan has in the latest Asides episode, hinting at "the orange side" and that, in theory, orange would be considered a "dark" side

[@alexinwonderland5782]

yeah i also feel like he was getting frustrated that no one was listening to “logan” of all people. when deceit was disguised as logan you could tell he was getting annoyed. i feel like logan lowkey might be his favorite

[@naan000]

as much as deceit seems to enjoy toying with the sides and slightly pissing them off, he does seem to have an appreciation for logan and his logical ways

[@kaelin_cherise]

@@naan000 I saw another comment that pointed this out: Deceit is not just lying. To deceive, you must know the truth to veer someone away from it. Deceit even as himself talks a lot like Logan because he needs the logic and information to make his arguments or to twist the facts in his favor.

[@Thatonenerd88]

He hides his face and then is just like “Heyyyyyyyyy man how ya doin?” It’s Dutch an awkward and subtle gesture and it has me in tears😂

[@Vi_Vi_1]

I adore how Janus starts out feeling like a villain but is revealed to actually have Thomas' best interests at heart, because it's so real. Lying feels inherently evil (and can be very toxic, certainly), but usually it just stems from the desire to protect oneself. It's one of the biggest reasons victims of abuse learn to lie: they NEED to in order to keep themselves safe, and once they've escaped, realizing you don't have to lie to protect yourself anymore is so alien it can be hard to grasp.

[@rowan9910]

No one's pointing out Logan's whole "I'm ok, not that any of you care."

[@MrLegendofLP]

Yeah Patton has been super dismissive of all the other sides and this episode I think he finally realized that. A little too late and I'm certain future episodes are going to be about the consequences of that but both Logan AND Roman have been pushed aside. Virgil not so much just because of how heightened Thomas' anxiety always is, but Patton has been pretty stubborn.

[@bearhugsleafbugs]

It need to be pointed out though ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. I liked how Pat tried to interject but Logan just kept going.

[@pigakitty]

poor logan. and also the fact that he felt the need to make his input optional. like he doesnt think anybody cares about him or what he thinks... :(

[@maem7462]

@@MrLegendofLP True and Patton was trying to dial back in this episode

[@maem7462]

I know poor Logan

[@firstnamelastname6194]

The Dark Sides don’t make you evil or a bad person, they make you human.

[@kojirospaghetti1649]

Facts

[@forgemakesstuff2734]

ProGay Shipper truth I mean, Remus is gross, but we love that about him

[@ShinyKyogre789YT]

Remus may be a stink rat man, but he has some STYLE in that dumpster he crawled out of

[@jewelferret2320]

EXACTLY. It shows that us humans ain't fucking perfect. It frustrates me that people say Remus and Janus are evil and that's all they'll ever be. They don't seem to realize that they're apart of Thomas and they see him as this innocent,kind,pure, selflessness person. Don't get me wrong he is, but he's human. He has flaws just like us. GOD I'M TOO DEEP INTO THIS OMG💀💀😭😭

[@mirandaparker5330]

@@jewelferret2320 Me tooooo

[@liamatlas]

i feel like romans worst nightmare is being like his brother, and then cut him really deep. also he took janus’ little nod as a “hes lying” instead of a “hes telling the truth” and thats why he freaked out. he also fears abandonment/people not liking him and therefore through a tantrum. god i love lore

[@KrisRN23935]

I mean I would fear that too if my Twin was exiled.

[@whilenya4714]

37:07 to 37:09. Just… Janus' _face,_ realizing Logan isn't here to shut him down and kick him out like nearing the end of SvS, but is actually in a roundabout way _validating what Janus himself said._ This is precious and hindsight is 20/20.

[@prettydragonbaby112]

YES

[@Fynchfire]

yeah

[@mousestar369]

Just went back to take a second look at that. There is excitement in that expression. He smiles. He's been validated for what could be the first time in a very long time (possibly most of Thomas's life)

[@jocelynnmoquin2535]

When Thomas did his first vine dressing as a dad I wonder if he ever thought that character would become a animated frog final boss having a moral crisis

[@imadoor2205]

Lol would you 🤣

[@cobalt_bold]

He knew it all along!~

[@ZuMii_Idled]

It's 1:14 AM and I'm holding myself back.

[@opie1kenop134]

😂😂

[@userr_paradoxx]

Isabella Madore I totally would think about it if I did XD

[@mirandadalgetty6441]

Janus is the embodiment of the “we should overthrow the government, just kidding. Unless?”

[@danielleisaacs6237]

A mood.

[@calimorales9880]

XD

[@MK-jw9xk]

Richy Gaming I don’t agree, I don’t believe in the Good sides Bad sides because that is a concept that Roman came up with. Understanding what Roman and Remus came through it makes sense that Roman would have a strong sense of right and wrong. Roman has ALOT of problems that NO sanders sides episode has touched, this is happening for a reason. I think that the next season will be unraveling Roman and Remus getting accepted by Roman. This will be EPIC

[@taylorhives9588]

Michal Korn 👀👀👀👀

[@H0RR0R_CR0W]

That would be amazing!!!

[@mushroomhat6030]

Roman: "Well when is it enough??" *Dramatic music plays* Janus: ". . . . . Trees . . ?" *more dramatic music plays*

[@prettydragonbaby112]

🤣🤣🤣

[@coyotix]

it's giving that one scene in working through intrusive thoughts with the hot dog

[@irene-wv6uj]

thinking about how everyone shamed roman for trusting janus last time then turn around and shame him for not trusting him now. he deserves so much

[@Dandelionsinthesky]

^^^This

[@Kaylee-Bear]

Yeah Roman deserved better. I might love Janus, but Roman deserves the world. Patton seems to unintentionally be causing a lot of issues he needs to be held accountable for...

[@tonyal8839]

both times roman was acting extremely selfish for his own views

[@notbubblystarters05]

It's always situational, but yeah. Definitely could be better on both sides.

[@happyflowerdemon8565]

@@notbubblystarters05 Yeah. Though it was wrong of Janus to insult Roman like that. I mean I doubt that he doesn't know what hurts the sides. Roman does have things to work on. Just like Thomas, the sides are all learning that it's okay to have your mind work the way it does. It's okay to have anxiety, it's okay to lie sometimes, it's okay to be sad, and it's okay to have intrusive thoughts. I feel like for the longest time, Thomas has despised his lies, anxiety, and intrusive thoughts, thus despising their embodiments; Janus, Virgil, and Remus, which is probably why they are considered the darksides. Roman is a prince, Thomas' hero. Thus Roman feels like part of his job is protecting Thomas from anyone who could hurt him. He probably feels like he needs to protect the other sides too. For the longest time, Janus, Remus, and Virgil were the villains that he and the light sides, had to protect Thomas from. I think it's gonna take time for Roman to except Janus. Also Roman mentions, in another video, that he shows his love through making fun of the person or thing he loves. Mabie he was trying to show support in the end by making fun of Janus' name, but it failed. Though he might have just been being rude. I do feel like if the first one is the case, that Roman needs to learn when and when its not, okay to show love by making fun of something. Because I can see why Janus and the others we're seeing him as being rude. I mean Roman did just call him a villain and also there is the most likely case that Roman was just being immature. But honestly I think everyone just needs time.

[@ronski8animates245]

"Like a groom feels when their bride ran away" "But your gay." Pfft... That was good

[@thiscouldbebetter]

I'm so gunna use this

[@hsimone]

Literally if the episode wasn't so angsty this would be the entire comments section

[@mrvoid4282]

I thought he was bi

[@elizabethliddell2181]

What about my gay? 🤣🤣sorry for the grammar nazi couldnt pass it up

[@sophiaoshea399]

So is no one gonna talk about how Patton and Roman are both the opposite of how they normally act. Patton was really anxious and overwhelmed. Roman's confidence has been falling the last few episodes and now it's completely gone.

[@courtneykeegan2286]

Ok I'm glad I'm not the only one that noticed because bro for the first half of the video my first watch I was convinced that Patton was deceit and Roman was Remus and they had some plan to mess with Thomas. Also can we talk about how they are acting like they did when they were in Virgil's room

[@MK-jw9xk]

It amazing to me how many of us don’t realize how not okay Roman is. I think that the next season will focus on unraveling Roman, he is a mess- this will be interesting, sad and devastating

[@peacepadvalley9840]

Maybe that's what Virgil was doing the entire time

[@e.mcintyre9489]

I think the dark sides generally unsettle Patton and all the recent videos have included them. And I think Roman has realised that Patton's been telling him he's amazing this whole time but now he doesn't believe him because he is accepting Janus.

[@yukiandkanamekuran]

Okay yeah, something was off the whole time!!!

[@darkcadk]

I really like how when Janus wanted them to trust him, he gave them his name, just like when Virgil started trusting them he gave his name. I'm starting to feel like names are a big thing to the Dark Sides (Except Remus, but he's a special muffin)

[@darkcadk]

But if he isn't on his redemption arc yet, it may be simply for them to feel sympathy, because that's what Virgil did, so he's playing into their senses

[@yeseniasanchez2739]

To add on to this I think it's because they are treat the bad guy. Much like real life people hide and lack trust towards other if all their life they are made to believe to be a bad person. The on thing people can do in order to protect themselves is their identity and involvement.

[@fightingknight2360]

Actually, I interpreted that as Remus already having some form of trust in them. He said he had no reason to lie to Thomas. But you aren’t wrong about him being a special muffin lol

[@darkestlight660]

@@darkcadk well, I don't personally think deceit is ever really a necessarily bad thing. I think *most* people would agree lying to the serial killer to help your friend isn't a moral evil. In my opinion it comes down to a mix of why and the potential outcome. Lying is a tool, you can use to harm others, or to try to help others That tool can easily corrupt however whenever we try to justify helping ourselves with the illusion of helping others, aka, a lot of times "I just want to spare their feelings" is, "I don't want to take responsibility". On the other hand, lying for yourself isn't necessarily bad- if people want to hurt you or others, that's an obvious example. But feeling uncomfortable and telling a small lie say, about not wanting to hang out with someone but you don't want to explain why so you say you feel sick- I wouldn't say that's evil either. It's nuanced and complicated, as most moral questions are

[@helloitsme472]

​@@darkcadksorry I know your comment is a year old but, respectfully, did you actually watch the video? like really watch it? Janus isn't really the embodiment of deceitfulness that we've been lead to think he is by this point in the narrative. it's more accurate to say that he the embodiment of selfishness, where Patton is the embodiment of selflessness i.e. this name of this episode AND the one that lead into this one; as we've learnt from this episode, selfishness is not inherently evil or wicked, it is NECESSARY for your own survival. I know the two are shipped together a lot, but Janus is, objectively, much lass harmful than Remus, and I think them being shipped together so much has given people the wrong idea about Janus as a character. This entire episode exists to justify why EVERYONE has the capacity to lie and be selfish. tl;dr Janus is not playing into everyone's sensitivities (when he speaks he is almost always being truthful) and is only trying to help Thomas in the way that he knows how: by placing Thomas first (Patton tries to keep him morally righteous, Logan gets him to be scheduled and think logically etc.)

[@lightningqueen1145]

Ok I JUST noticed the nod from deceit at 42:04 trying to tell Roman that Thomas is telling the truth, but because Roman doesn't trust him, he interprets it as a sign of Thomas lying.

[@cisnt9244]

We all care that Logan's okay, we all stopped to read his facts..poor buddy.

[@flwrsofbffnry]

I did indeed pause to read his facts. Poor Logan :c

[@RavenRoses88]

Eriotl Ampora omg I thought I was the only one who stopped to read it

[@holly3330]

Same, I paused just cause I wanted to know what it was.

[@Callordin]

I mean Logan brought the T and I was thirsty. If you know what I mean. Why is Remus wiggling his eyebrows like that?

[@WatermelonLord_]

Im another person who stopped to read his facts! And this video was sooooo emotional.

[@Moongirl12121]

“You’re not stuck with an evil snake boy,” *dramatic pose* “You’re just stuck with a snake boy.”

[@nmquestionmarkm1781]

wholesome snek boiii 🤘

[@chaoticmushroomchildren6936]

That just made me love him even more!!

[@nmquestionmarkm1781]

@@chaoticmushroomchildren6936 yeee 🤘😄🤣

[@thelittleprince7072]

and that precious smile

[@nmquestionmarkm1781]

@@thelittleprince7072 shhHHHHH- IM GONNA START FANGIRLING AGAIN- 🤣🤣🤣

[@felix-dp7xg]

Okay but can we appreciate that in his inventory he has everything needed for pattoncake

[@nerd_liv]

OMG YES

[@Unidentified952]

Omg

[@JustMe-mf5ms]

Wdym?

[@Unidentified952]

@@JustMe-mf5ms in one of the previous videos, when Patton reveals his name, it’s a pun as one should only expect. Instead of pattycake, it’s pattoncake. there’s a variety of items needed for the game, and all of those are in his characters inventory in this video! Hope that helps, and sorry I can’t remember the exact video 😅

[@apjtv2540]

I read a quote the other day that reminded me of this video: "Selfishness is not evil by nature. How could it be evil to love yourself?" Edit: And another thing, as I've just noticed. Roman was described by Logan as "welcome" creativity. In other words, he's creativity inspired by things like Disney, the family friendly stuff. So it's his very nature to see Janus as evil. His focus on Disney isn't an accident by Thomas. In most Disney films, the villains are pure evil and they don't redeem themselves. Janus started as a villain, so Roman will see him as such.

[@princessthyemis]

oooooo wow! i LOVE that quote. Very Janus-y!

[@toots5130]

Virgil coming back after having an hour nap just to see Roman having a mental breakdown, Deceit/Janus and Patton having a normal conversation, Logan getting frustrated at the chaos and Remus playing just dance in the corner: Well what'd I miss?

[@sketchingstudio5552]

Haha nice

[@catchynickname3516]

Yes

[@_calpurina2767]

And then he just avoids them so he doesn't scream at them

[@PotatoPerson_]

Pretty much

[@nekovannox]

I'd go for another nap 😂

[@taez177]

Also I could tell when Roman said “He’s just trying to build up false confidence in you so he can plummet it down into its depths” Roman was talking about himself, when Janus used to flatter and manipulate him.

[@josieburks9049]

I think that Janus was trying to beneficially manipulate him. But Roman can't see that now, he's just coming to terms with the fact that he was being manipulated

[@Rose-ix7ox]

Wonder if Janus has a another name that matches the God he's named after... Because there are quite a few gods that have a feminine names and goddesses who have masculine names. Wonder if Thomas thought of that??

[@mrsbasia122]

I wonder if he used to do that to Virgil as well. Which is why Virgil is super wary around him and calls him a liar. I bet it was another one of Janus' 'beneficial lies.' Trying to get Virgil to calm down the only way he knew how to, by lying, but which epically backfired on him with Virgil seeing the half-truth and being paranoid of anything Deceit now does.

[@killershark597]

mrsbasia122 that makes sense. I mean the way Janus acts it just sounds like how Remus can’t think of positive metaphors. Janus almost always speaks in lies because it’s the only thing he’s ever known. And Remus doesn’t know positive metaphors because those thoughts weren’t separated to him. I thought Janus looked a little more composed and relaxed in this episode (video? Idk) and was able to be honest because that is what benefits Thomas in that moment. It sounds to me like Janus will do anything to benefit Thomas even if it means lying and manipulating.

[@j.jaylee.h]

Lmao Janus

[@bumbabees]

as someone with depression, I really appreciate Janus saying "mental health should be regarded with the same life or death attitude as physical health." my struggles weren't taken seriously until I was put in the hospital because of it and that's, quite frankly, unacceptable. that's why I refer to my condition as an illness. because like a physical illness, if I don't manage it, it could kill me. it's really important that more people understand that.

[@zacharynguyen7286]

Hope you’re doing good and staying safe. If you need to talk to someone or need help, there are people who care. Sending support and hearts. ❤️❤️❤️

[@_primrse_1252]

Janus: - reveals his name - Everyone: ..... Roman: - starts laughing - Janus:- completely ruins his self esteem -

[@flower_productions7213]

Janus: Woke up Had some wine (he probably drinks it) And chose: *Self-Esteem destruction*

[@Fili9521]

To be fair it is pretty shitty to make fun of other people's name (no hate on roman it was just mean)

[@Teahillmusic]

Oh rewatching this I actually realised something the ones connected to the dark sides all have Roman names Janus- two faced god of lies and gateways(pretty sure) Remus- one of Romes founders with his brother Romulus(Roman) And Vergil a poet who criticised those in power in his works

[@rosesareredvioletsblue5438]

Janus: **raises hand to show that he's telling the truth** Me, an idiot: wait is his name written on his hand

[@ayleth891]

Same

[@cottonhead7166]

Omg I thought the same thing to XD

[@shadowdragon2122]

Same xD

[@clytieapollo]

😁 part of the squad too 🙋

[@impiish5414]

Hand reveal squad

[@analauratintori8508]

Conclusion: Leslie Odom Jr. Is the other dark side

[@aine6544]

hOLY CRAP HE'S THE ORANGE SIDE 😆

[@valdoxtheunmerciful]

And now he has to be a regular, it's in his contract.

[@colouredbranches]

I KNEW IT

[@br.mitzzz]

emphasis on the dark side part SHSJSJSJS *just a joke, don’t kill me*

[@that1tallkid_498]

Hi I’d like to report a racism

[@GoodNeutralEvilChaos]

I like how the Dark Sides care about Thomas as the normal Sides

[@rosette4268]

I mean they are still a part of him

[@GoodNeutralEvilChaos]

@@rosette4268 what I mean is they don't try to corrupt him. They care about him and look after him to the best of their abilities, despite being the worst Sides of him. I hope this comes up later as a plot twist or something.

[@rosette4268]

@@GoodNeutralEvilChaos hm

[@TheNinthGenerarion]

@@GoodNeutralEvilChaos well, maybe not Remus, he’s just out to get Thomas to indulge in every possible fantasy

[@GoodNeutralEvilChaos]

@@TheNinthGenerarion yea, found *that* out in his latest episode.

[@ArchMageFox]

That fight between Patton and Janus... It shows very clearly that Janus is more than just Thomas' deception. He's also his self-preservation and self care. Even in the court room scenario he wasn't saying "be selfish because why tf not", he was more so saying 'It's fine to be selfish every once in awhile, it's *needed*". Janus is easily my favourite character, and his theme is just amazing~ I also find it really sad how, Roman isn't even trying to look past Janus being "Deceit". Lies is all he ever see's in him, and it's sad. Very well written story don't get me wrong! Just... Yeah :/

[@lpsshortcake3790]

I agree, to be fair though, for the first two videos with Janus Roman was on his side, defending him and the conclusion was Janus was evil, siding with him was criticised, now he's the only one in the video not siding with him. Plus, Janus lied to him to butter him up and used him to better his deception, so he's less likely to trust him. Still not cool laughing at his name though and Janus does obviously have Thomas's best interests at heart, I can just kind of see where Roman is coming from is all

[@ArchMageFox]

@@lpsshortcake3790 You make a good point. I can see wheres he coming from too.

[@Hannah4765]

It also sticks with Roman's character; he was the last "Light" side to accept Virgil as well. He very much embodies the "we're Light and good, you're Dark and bad" argument as a hero would to those he sees as villains. And he seems to see Remus as HIS dark side, rather than one of Thomas' "it's like looking in a fun house mirror". I'm glad that this has been consistent with Roman as a character and it's a great arc for him.

[@anonymouslymj1064]

@@lpsshortcake3790 yeah the fact that Janus manipulated Roman in the last video (which is actually pretty much stated by Roman here) and most people just gloss over it doesn’t sit right with me. If somebody had toyed with me if I had a fragile mental state and ultimately harmed me for their own purposes, no matter how virtuous, I’d be pretty pissed at them too.

[@sadboyhours9286]

Is no one gonna talk about how close deceit sounded to crying when he said "My name.." the first time

[@paperclippy]

@@clover951 sAME bro

[@oliverh.8432]

Can I get the time stamp for this?

[@anadabanana5570]

SadBoy Hours yES

[@jdguymon6023]

@@oliverh.8432 the scene starts at about 41:11

[@jalenstoryarts9865]

RIGHT?!

[@nat2987]

Virgil missed ONE EPISODE and now they’re trusting the snake boi he’s gonna be sO PISSED

[@dapperdabber13]

Virgil: *_I CAN'T LEAVE Y'ALL ALONE FOR ONE MINUTE-!_*

[@brendagutierrez8733]

Vigil is probably like Virgil: I leave for one side video and yall are a mess!

[@Destroyer-mm9rl]

half the time i was pausing the video saying "Where is my anxious baby?!" 😂 but yeah i dont think Virgil will be happy about them trusting Janus

[@grisbel7836]

Accurate

[@dmay6637]

@@phoebebeirne3373 true

[@DizzleDoodles]

"But when is it enough?!" "...trees???" This is why we love Janus

[@EnderTheIdiot]

Yes

[@Unidentified952]

Yes 😂

[@thespeedyyoshi]

40:07 HAHAHA I love this part 😂😂

[@alexjewett7455]

I like Janus's character development. He goes from a sinister scooby doo villain to a slightly sketchy ally.

[@dinosaurk]

Roman (really upset): "When is it enough!?" Deceit: "......... trees?" That made me laugh SO HARD

[@cosmodusty]

Danny Keenan TIME STAMP PLEASE

[@reynbow9841]

Candy Corn the Unicorn around 40:09

[@oliverh.8432]

Sameee

[@fandomrandom2741]

The idea that Janus probably genurly thought Roman was talking about trees make me laugh harder than it chould

[@peach_vera5417]

I had to rewind the video, rewatch it, and then pause the video so I could laugh

[@trixiehong205]

deceit/janus went from "evil trash snake boy" to "sassy self-care snek boi" through this entire episode and frankly i am ALL for it

[@yoursleepparalysisdemon1519]

Trixie Hong anxiety would secretly approve while strangling Janus to death

[@sorceressoftheoceanandstar2526]

Virgil and Janus would be the two dorks in the corner talking about death casually. Ha!

[@cass3026]

sAME

[@kodywise8152]

His snake boi scene is my favorite out of the video I think😂

[@isabellafortune1705]

I think he was always like that. He just was playing into the roles of dark and light.

[@sammadden9931]

It has taken until *now* for me to notice that the hooked cane used to pull Logan away is the same as the one that Janus is holding when he reveals himself. HOW DID I MISS THIS?

[@Bgdf007]

I've been scrolling in the comments trying to find someone who noticed like me. I'm watching this instead of skipping to find all of Logan's lowdowns to actually let him be listened to and I noticed it right away, lol.

[@seandonahoe3495]

​@@Bgdf007I was also looking to see if anyone else noticed this

[@whilenya4714]

Janus posing as Logan: " …Having heard a piece of information before _does not give you license to ignore it in the future._ Especially when the consequences of forgetting are so perilous. " Wait. Is J here (27:37 - 27:46) low-key passive aggressively calling them out for ignoring Logan (Logic, y'know, _Common Sense™)_ so hard all the time when he's talking about maintaining a healthy lifestyle that Deceit _(Self-preservation)_ of all people had to step up in his stead? Because if so, I am all for it. Go off, snek boi, go off!

[@sienasalittlelost8056]

roman: WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO HELP THOMAS? janus: *BECAUSE IM ONE OF THE IDIOTS WHO LIVES IN HIM*

[@whitejadin7157]

Lmao gotg meme

[@hosuh_artz4007]

Funny

[@Themtaters618]

K

[@quigly5058]

Lmaooooo thats something he would say tho

[@LovelyGhostz]

Yo like-

[@grassj6002]

Thomas and Patton: **says the word "ineffable"** Good Omens fans: **choking and unholy screeching**

[@gaygoddess139]

Omg MOOD

[@k.7962]

I LITERALLY CHOKED WHEN HE SAID THAT

[@rome0417]

AND ITS THE 30TH ANNIVERSARY!!!!

[@kaileys6237]

ITS A SIGN OMG I LTTERALLY JUST GOT INTO GOOD OMENS THIS WEEK

[@weird_animation_stuff189]

Me who hasnt watched it: huh?

[@frog137]

“I always thought that sort of language was .... ineffable.” Flashbacks to Good Omens

[@lasanya_galang13]

I was looking for this

[@naan000]

glad to see i'm not the only one

[@lakotathetimelord]

Brooooo! How did I only just notice how smooth the transition from Logan's voice to Janus' voice was??!!?!! THAT WAS BRILLIANT!!!!!!!!

[@rioisnotokay-ipromise-6115]

For y’all wondering where Virgil was, he was obviously social distancing

[@rioisnotokay-ipromise-6115]

april aw my pleasure!

[@dayy_dreemurr]

Virgil and Logan are the only sides with brain cells (Logan was social distancing with the text box)

[@doodlethreadsofficial3323]

I love this but also Thomas said in a live stream this is a alternate timeline so this is set before everything happened

[@g1wstk]

Pretty sure he's playing Just Dance in his room.

[@leafeonlover2970]

Mary Dewitch I’m so scared for where Virgil is and what he’s going through because, normally, Anxiety would be a huge factor in what Thomas was experiencing in the episode, yet he wasn’t present!! WHAT HAPPENED TO THE PRECIOUS ANGSTY BOI!!!

[@Soupslutt]

The broken and sad look on Janus/Deceit's face when Roman was insulting him after he reveled his name is heartbreaking

[@crowlowin4330]

And then he lashed out with something he knew would hurt Roman! It's interesting, he usually seems so put together but when he was hurt he lashed out. I love these characters so much!!!

[@gloryasme]

Roman insulted Virgil's name too and when he's finally awake again in Intrusive Thoughts he refers to Remus as Dukey, I think Roman has a thing against the Others that plays into his insecurities, especially after how he reacts to what Janus hits him right after

[@Jeiissleepy]

Ngl that was a very teary moment

[@gingerweasel]

It also looked like he kind of regretted bringing up Remus. Like the kind of thing where you're so mad you yell at someone and it's a low blow. And as the words are coming out of your mouth, you're partially regretful but then you think, "Well, they deserved it. They were being even worse."

[@connor4391]

Can I get a time stamp

[@MorbidMacabre]

I'm rewatching all of these again and realizing Janus actually looked kinda hurt when Roman said they couldn't trust him near the end 😭

[@whilenya4714]

Janus posing as Logan at 27:55, looking downward from his spot in the info-box portrait like he's questioning his life choices after Patton all but told him his advice wasn't worth anything to the current conversation and Roman cut him off just as he was about to say something. This is Janus having realized he is not being HIMSELF at the moment yet they're STILL dismissing him without a second thought even if not quite as outright, and that the methods used to shut him down being subtler might feel worse. Currently identifying _way too much_ with Logan's continued struggle to make himself heard and internalizing just how hard poor Logan actually has it when trying to be listened to too. I think this is the moment when he started to regret taking Logan's place during this video, if he didn't already. (And, by the way he acts so done with their sh*t after this moment as well as the passive aggression towards people's important contributions being ignored _rolling off_ of the way he framed his advice just before this together with his response of "Nothing at all _and I resent the question"_ to "What did you do to Logan?!" as coupled with his initial concerned/guilty "Oh sh*t" reaction at seeing Logan more or less in person later, I think there might've been an important if awkward off-screen conversation there that we missed spanning from when they swapped at 23:20 to J showing up in disguise at 26:45. One involving Logan being so done he might've greenlighted this post hostile takeover. Which, that still probably involved Logan lashing out first or simply thinking it wouldn't make a difference, since it's already a given they won't listen to Dee either if he's posing as _Logan._ Then lo and behold they actually _do._ And it feels nice of course, but also Janus has mixed feeling about it now whoops. Apologies are in definitely order after this, if they weren't a given already.)

[@spadehenri8300]

Literally everyone is gonna ignore the fact that Leslie Odom Jr. himself literally made an appearance in the video and they only made one hamilton reference

[@hummingbirdspark3998]

Spade Strange wait when

[@earltaboada]

Yes when

[@Callordin]

You couldn't give starving, down in his luck actor Leslie Odom Jr. A hotdog's worth of lines and screen time? How very dare! I'm playing, bless y'all for this

[@spadehenri8300]

@@earltaboada Roman referred to him as Aaron Burr 32:34

[@juliannaagoncillo6090]

....technically 2. Check The Mind Vs. the Heart and My Negative Thinking

[@mauveforest8839]

Roman asks Thomas if he still is his hero, Thomas said “Yes, of course you are”. Yet still Roman DOESN’T BELIEVE HIM, he looks at Janus and he nods, BUT ROMAN SEES HIM AS THE LORD OF LIES, SO OF COURSE HE SNAPS, AND JANUS’ SMILE WHEN HE NODDED FADES WHEN IT CLICKS TO HIM THAT ROMAN THOUGHT THAT THE NOD WAS A LIE. GOD, THOMAS, JOAN, ALL THE TEAM DESERVE SO MUCH LOVE AND ADMIRATION FOR THIS WORK OF ART!

[@Speckaboo]

MFVM I did not see it as that at first but yeah that clarifies a lot about Roman’s reaction

[@rabies2800]

IM LOVING THIS EVEN MORE BY THE SECOND

[@ayvee1759]

That makes a lot of sense. Janus has also manipulated Roman into doing what he wants twice, so Roman doesn't feel like he can trust anything Janus says. Additionally, during the song at the beginning of the video, one of Roman's lines is "If our goals aligned with his, what would that say?" I think that because Roman has such a negative attitude towards Janus (which isn't entirely unreasonable), he thinks that he can't have anything in common with him or he won't be able to be Thomas's hero anymore. He already feels guilty about being tricked into siding with Janus twice before, and he feels like he needs to prove that he'll never let it happen again, so he lashes out at Janus in any way he can (hence why, when Janus revealed his name, Roman laughed at him). Roman has no reason to believe that Janus is even capable of telling the truth, and Janus realized that after he nodded. I don't expect Roman to come around to Janus being more or less accepted for a while. I don't really agree with Roman's behavior because I'm biased (Janus is tied with Virgil for my favorite side and Roman is my least favorite), but I do understand it. Also, I think when Virgil finds out that Janus has been more or less accepted, he is not going to be happy about it. I believe that at least part of the reason Virgil doesn't like Janus is because a) he knows Janus from when he (Virgil) was a dark side and they possibly had some kind of falling out, and b) Janus reminds Virgil of who he used to be when he was a dark side. In the first episode Janus appeared in, "Can Lying Be Good?" Patton described him as "an inner coach that acts with the one intention of self-preservation." Virgil used to be something similar before the others accepted him. He's toned it down quite a bit since then, but I think Janus reminds Virgil of his past self, who he is not proud of. However, I think Virgil will come around sooner than Roman, because Virgil is more likely to believe that Janus actually has Thomas' best interests at heart.

[@PheonixGirl-hg7cf]

Something i dont think Roman is seeing, is that the world isn't so simple as "Good and Evil". Good and Evil is a matter of perspective, to a cannary, a cat is evil, but to say, an earthworm, the cannary is evil, but to US as humans, all three are good. The real world is messy, nothing is as simple as, for lack is better words, "Black and White". The world is more Grey in that case. This is something that Roman is going to need to understand, and that Janus is a prime example of this. Trust wont come easy, but hopefully it will come eventually...

[@catrina2943]

Roman has massive issues because he seems to be getting less attention and recognition each episode and in DWIT he at the end says he got stuck with a realisation. Most likely that his input isn’t as important as he thought it was. In the beginning he had pride in himself but slowly he seems to be fading as if he values other people impression of himself way to highly. It’s as if he has no real value of himself so he seeks for others to praise him.

[@Ghostie-Tempura]

I realized something here. Thomas, Roman, and Patton have all been kahoots this whole discussion. That was until Janus showed up and showed himself when things finally went back together. Now remember during Virgil's arc of him disappearing? They were all in kahoots with Thomas lacking anxiety. He was a disaster to say the least. So that means they literally can't have a full discussion without having a dark side nearby to stabilize the conversation, as Logan said, Virgil has a bigger part into Thomas' life than just being his anxiety. And seeing as Janus was the one to calm Thomas down by saying that it's okay for him to be selfish, it's rather interesting. This theory is really out there but Ehhhhhh.

[@prettydragonbaby112]

The 1st ep was alright But ye the lights are definitely a lot more chaotic and all over the place when they haven't got the common sense around (janus) or just want to get rid of something (ree)

[@simoncarter8190]

If you want to expand on that... this series as a whole is effectively presenting case after case of Thomas not being able to solve his problems without hearing from as many people as he can. Obviously, he doesn't get to hear from *everyone*, *all the time*, but the later episodes especially are fantastic cases of this. If we ignore: "Way Too Adult" "Taking on Anxiety (with Lilly Singh)" "The Dark Side of Disney" "The Mind vs. The Heart" and "My Negative Thinking", then every episode has most of the sides that we know of. Remus doesn't show up a whole lot to begin with because we only know him for his dirty mouth, dirty mind, and dirty thoughts that he imposes on Thomas from time to time, which is obviously a very specific problem. And Janus didn't show up a whole lot before his redemption arc, either, so you could argue Remus's absence from most episodes after his first appearance isn't that important. POINT BEING, Logan said that Virgil plays a bigger role in Thomas's life than just being his anxiety, and in this episode, we learn that that's also true for Janus. I don't think we can say the same for Remus (at least not yet, idk what Thomas has up his sleeve), but it's certainly true that both Virgil and Janus represent facets of humanity that are generally perceived by society as hindrances, when in reality, it's helpful and even necessary to give one or both of them a seat at the Socratic Table, so to speak. Even if it's something small, like auditioning for a role... anxiety may tell you that you won't get it no matter how hard you try, or it may tell you that getting it involves a lot of work and only it knows how much work it'll take. Deceit (or whatever Janus actually represents) would tell you to put in that work, no matter how much it may be, for the sake of protecting your reputation, your self-confidence, and possibly your future if your career depends on it. This series really is about Thomas figuring himself out... all of the sides have gotten a whole lot more complex and at the same time more specific since the start of the series. In earlier episodes, you could argue that Anxiety and Deceit were the same person; Deceit only became a separate side because Thomas questioned whether it was worth lying to people to preserve himself, which also happens to be Virgil's goal (as this series interprets anxiety). Patton also got a WHOLE lot of development in this episode; his realization that he doesn't have all the right and wrong answers of the world is Thomas's realizing that morality is a whole lot more complex than "Don't kill, don't steal". 10 out of 10 episode right here.

[@hildcit]

@@simoncarter8190this and the og comment had some great commentary and food for thought and I just wanna let you both know that

[@MartialFitness656]

Janice is like early Virgil, seen as the bad guy but cares more than others and doesn’t let it show it and is a protector like Virgil is.

[@shaolin.r]

“You’re not stuck with an evil snake boi...” _You’re stuck with a snake boi_

[@ShinyKyogre789YT]

GachaFox YT I am a NEUTRAL snake boi thank-you-very-much!

[@quintirissk]

*_Janus is just so wholesome now-_*

[@evie7065]

That was the best part, I love him so much he's so sassy

[@toost4382]

that face that he made when he said that was the best thing

[@maddish__]

*snek shimmy*

[@sunnyDee_]

I don’t care if this isn’t a movie, it needs ALL of the oscars

[@abrielleelysee7991]

Ikr

[@jadatar]

DAMN RIGHT IT DOES THE THOUGHT THAT WENT INTO THIS IS DAZZLING!!!

[@abrielleelysee7991]

I again agree with this statement

[@isabellajgz]

Yeah all the sides should get Oscars- oh wait they're all one person

[@emmysparks7307]

it basically is a movie

[@bwaindead5539]

My sides when I’m trying to get the covid vaccine: Logic: You have to get it. Creativity: You have to get it. Morality: You have to get it. Anxiety: *sobbing uncontrollably*

[@szaboluca5536]

I know it's an older comment, but oof mood. I was so anxious about having an allergic reaction to the vaccine that after getting it, while I was in the waiting room w the other freshly vaccinated folks, I almost had a panic attack and the attending lady asked if I was okay, and took my blood pressure, and gave me a glass of water💀💀

[@glitchie_the_monstrosity475]

So I just got 2 shots and apparently it looked like I was about to have a whole panic attack- so that's g r e a t. My anxiety was seriously kicking in- the entire time before, I was trying so hard to reassure myself that I was fine but in my head I was freaking out-

[@scarlettarana]

My Anxiety would be ominously looming over my shoulder while Deceit and Logic are talking me through it

[@wren4now904]

C a n r e l a t e

[@markyboi9354]

Deceit: Nooooooooo Bwaimdead don’t get it it won’t save any lives AT ALLLLLLL…

[@gabbyp1934]

Ok. I just had a small epiphany. When “Logan” said “you’ll need a sharp side to cut throughout all this bull … 🐸” I think there’s a double meaning. He’s talking about how he’s actually Janus and talking about dissecting Patton’s reasoning. Just like how sometimes students and teachers dissect frogs in science class. 🤯

[@gabbyp1934]

@@alisond929 well yes there’s that. But also I feel like in a sense that “Logan” was trying to point out the obvious and kind of make a “pun”, since Patton actually is a bull frog. That was just my opinion and my thought process, and I just thought that that detail added an extra layer of cleverness to the scene.

[@cryptiddmashups0011]

WHY IS NOBODY TALKING ABOUT HOW THE A C T U A L L Y MANAGED TO GET LESLIE ODOM JR. IN THE VIDEO????

[@currentlyhere1505]

Catnip Cryptid I KNOW RIGHT???? LIKE FREAKING LESLIE, THE ORIGINAL AARON BURR, CASTED AND VOICE ACTED FOR A BUNCH OF SHOWS AND MOVIES AND NO ONE SAYS ANYTHING??

[@StarLight-hg5xt]

IKR!!!!!!!

[@soulrecords857]

THANK YOU SOMEONE BROUGHT THIS UP!!!!!!!

[@echomoon4693]

OH MY GOD I KNOW RIGHT??? LIKE HOLY WOW

[@kntkat8594]

The fandom is strong with this one

[@Thecrowsnesttrinkets]

Patton: “Janus?” Janus: “I’ll take care of him” Me: *cries*

[@Mars-io9wl]

That scene honestly confuses me because I can’t tell who he is going to go to. Like Patton said he was going to go and help Roman (I think-) so he isn’t going down to say anything to Roman. So who exactly is he going to..?

[@cmd0317]

Isabellla LaRocca I think Thomas.

[@robertpongrac8837]

WHERES PATTON GOING

[@Mars-io9wl]

SlimySnekBoi ÙWÚ OOH! OKAY! Thank you! It makes so much more sense thank you so much!

[@Intrusivemov]

Robert Pongrac I’m p sure he’s gonna go Check on roman

[@conalexander-smith4926]

The opposites: Roman - "Good" imagination Remus - "Bad" imagination Logan - Fact Janus - Fiction Patton - Constructive criticism Virgil - Criticism

[@WinterPains]

I think Patton and Janus are actually the two sides of the same coin. Both being morality. Patton being Altruism, and Janus being Selfishness.

[@Subterranean_sebastian]

@@WinterPains as well as anxiety often being illogical yet still effects us!

[@pattonbunny3331]

Patton the dad for light sides Janus the dad for dark sides

[@Lia-dd9pz]

@@pattonbunny3331 in the words of Virgil "other" sides

[@Chestnut-xm2pv]

@Con Alexander-Smith Thank you so much for not using the contemporary "opposite-labelling". It goes to show that categorising any of the sides as strict opposites of one-another is all-around stupid.

[@IDKAnymoreOfficial]

I love the fact that it changes from Deceit and Payton fighting each other, to just Thomas’s mental health. And also, looking back, I realize that everything is about all the other sides and barely about Roman. It’s Virgil this, Patton that, Logan this, Remus that, Janus this and etc. Everyone views Roman as some annoying characteristic of a stereotypical hero, so that is what he is. No one is giving him any sort of ear to listen to how he feels unloved and left out, no matter how hard he tried to voice that and I realize that now, Roman has feelings himself. It’s like being the funny friend, and yet you yourself make yourself the “funny friend” to ignore what’s hurting you. They see him as the funny friend and as the annoying side, but he’s more than that, but as long as everyone sees him as annoying and “funny” he will remain that way.

[@anniplenge1200]

Virgil after he finds out that Thomas and Patton accepted Janus: What the gosh darn diddly dang f*ck happened while I was playing Just Dance?

[@arbsallaku6478]

Im imagining virgil in michel jackson clothes doing the moonwalk and seing patton janus and thomas talking and being like:IM NOT BRAVE ENOUGH FOR DIS and sturts runinig

[@percy2940]

BEST COMMENT BY FAR

[@dabuff1319]

I think logan was busy keeping him from self destructing from all the anxiety.

[@tristana1660]

Took them a whole episode to accept Virgil and not even ten minutes for Janus

[@mickycoetzee1385]

Why Just Dance though xD

[@bigoof8646]

Thomas probably: oh, no one will notice all the Greek and Roman references. The comment section: OUR TOP STORY TONIGHT

[@jaysonbickel671]

a ROMAN reference, eh?

[@bigoof8646]

@@jaysonbickel671 I d I d n ot r e a l I ze

[@panek6443]

Big Oof As in ROMAN, the SIDE

[@littleskeckes1416]

What a coincidence that Janus is the name of the Greek god of deception and Virgil is the name of ROMAN pote AND Remus is the name of one of the first greek people and hap a twin but his twin's name wasn't Roman but his fathers was! Totally a coincidence and Joan TOTALLY didn't do his research!! And I TOTALLY didn't spend all of last night researching this! Ha help me.

[@constella1891]

@@littleskeckes1416 is there a sanders sides gc that we can geek out all day about this? defo wanna join in. Enjoying reading the comments rn.

[@sailorenthusiast]

Just making a personal note that Janus’ logo was labeled Denial at 20:22.

[@coyotix]

Roman's was Passion

[@embodimentofawkwardness7734]

And Logan's wasn't gone over at all...does it mean he's not necessarily logic and they're hiding it?

[@theboogeyman2590]

@@embodimentofawkwardness7734they did go over his, his said logic except they very quickly moved away from his icon

[@veeranummila9113]

45:34 "-And it's (Deceit being a part of Thomas) not that I'm an evil liar, or even a fractionally fiendish fibber. Everyone has a capacity for deceit, including me. And all that means is... I'm not perfect." Love how at the end they straight out call Janus's whole existence an imperfection TO HIS FACE! And then he just hides it because he is literally Deceit and can probably hide his feelings pretty easily. Damn. Time to go think about this for the rest of the night.

[@kierstenchaney4197]

THANK YOU! I was thinking the exact same thing, I literally said to myself, "Did he just call Deceit a mistake??". I'm hoping that, much like Virgil called out the time Logan implied he was a 'defeatist' (I forget which episode), Janus will make a callback (no pun intended) to this line.

[@happyflowerdemon8565]

Eh I don't think Janus would be too affected by this line. He knows that humans are not perfect and are not supposed to be. He's just finally making Thomas realize that.

[@lunastarseeker5288]

"you're not stuck with an evil snake boi." **smug grin** "You're stuck with *a* snake boi" - Janice, 2020

[@ThatGuy-zh7jl]

Allyson Moore Janus

[@bucket8906]

After the greek god of lies

[@kornflakez1405]

@@bucket8906 Huh?

[@cckarissa14]

Lol

[@Jayup]

AdoniZylle 1261 yeah the way all the names tie together is amazing

[@Lemonboyartss]

"We love you kiddo" "Right.." WHY IS NO ONE TALKING ABOUT THIS

[@Lemonboyartss]

Timestamp: 42:23

[@lovelyaristotle4983]

I’ll thank about it! *It made me sad*

[@weirdcatcoaster1237]

Looks like someone’s slowly having a mental breakdown

[@divineichor7079]

@@weirdcatcoaster1237 Yes. We need that juicy Roman angst.

[@Lemonboyartss]

@@divineichor7079 YES THAT ROMAN ANGST IS WHAT WE NEED

[@bunnyhasreligioustrauma5874]

Janus has evolved into Thomases more self centered nature and desires rather than deceit. But Thomas has internalized this as deceitful and evil in some way when it’s really the most honest part of himself

[@happyflowerdemon8565]

Honestly that does add onto their story. Tbh, I don't think that the dark sides were always dark sides. However they became this way as Thomas grew to despise them. While the hate towards Remus and they way he acts can't fully be helped. I think that the way that Virgil and Janus were viewed by Thomas and the others, caused them to become dark sides.

[@gamergamer4369]

Patton: Oh, logan I- Logan: PETER SINGER...

[@remytherat6158]

“Karma is a very fair person” is like Brendon Urie saying “the poor grooms bride is a beautiful woman”

[@ayleth891]

When Roman started swearing in this video, he disproved Logan's explanation of him as Netflix kids and family in DWIT

[@bookworm_of_heaven]

Isabella Phalen 41:38

[@somedumbgayplantboi3012]

yeah,

[@somedumbgayplantboi3012]

@@ayleth891 also the bitchmas thing

[@CrowsNest05]

I chime in, haven’t you people ever heard of- letting my babeys be happy? No, much better to face these kinds of things with a sense of angst and feels

[@bi_beans9011]

IT MAKES SO MUCH SENSE HIS NAME IS JANUS JANUS IS THE GOD OF CHOICES AND IS LITERALLY TWOFACED

[@dualitysDownfall]

the galaxy-brain naming in this series....

[@pikaphin3335]

Ohmygosh that is brilliant, thank you for telling us!!

[@greg4lifers145]

oh my g o d .

[@esora2476]

AND HIS LOGO HAS TWO HEADS ITS SUCH A GOOD NAME IM SCREAMING

[@starsnatcher4659]

I FORGOOTT THATS SO SMART

[@sardsvib]

I've just realized a couple of things. Janus is also Thomas's morality, he's similar to how Remus and Roman are - the "bad" side of morality, the side that's self-serving. Not only that, but Janus's outfit is almost the exact opposite of Patton's. Yellow is the opposite of blue, and black is the opposite of white (the sweater is light).

[@markyboi9354]

Well yellow isn’t an exact opposite but it’s really close oh and also yellow just symbolizes lying and Deceit

[@kaelin_cherise]

Actually in color theory, Orange and blue are complimentary colors, but this is still a good point

[@HaShomeret]

I think your right.

[@bradholstein2343]

After a while I finally decided to rewatch this, and I think Roman's reaction at 42:09 ish to Thomas saying "Wh- You ARE!" As a response to Roman saying "I thought I was your hero" was just a simple misinterpretation on his part. He looked specifically at Janus, and the camera cut to him, as if asking "Is he lying?" But Janus may have taken it at "is he telling the truth?" Therefore nodded, because Thomas wasn't lying, Roman IS his hero, but since the question at hand was "Is he lying", a nod was interpreted at "Yes, he is. You're not his hero" hence Roman covering his mouth in disbelief and snapping back with "I can't believe this, did you forget that he's EVIL"

[@theboogeyman2590]

Janus going back to the mind palace be like: Janus: Virgil, I get why you didn’t want to share your name now. Virgil: so he laughed at yours too? Janus: **makes ‘duh’ face**

[@charsiupau20]

Poor boys

[@malixnant]

Shadow Monster In Your Closet it rly be like that doe

[@Destroyer-mm9rl]

omg yes 😂😂

[@emi2664]

aw :,)(

[@grisbel7836]

Cute

[@tylajoanne2453]

After Roman leaves- I’m just imagining him and Virgil hiding out like under the bed watching The Nightmare Before Christmas and avoiding everyone.

[@pauliner9444]

That's actually so cute omg-

[@thatuzikinnie6077]

*why is that so cute.* I don't even support the ship alot but that sounds adorable :0

[@RoseIsAnnoyedAtTheHandle]

Princexeity everybody! (I hope I spelled it right) And I thought more like he went and hidden in his room "locking" it and hides under something sothat IF somebody came he is hidden or "gone"

[@marquis911]

6 feet apart because they're cautious.

[@reese8659]

Omg that’s adorable

[@nothingtoseehere5678]

Everyone talks about the "color theory" but I have a Role Theory. I think the Role they are introduced as is the aspect of the side that Thomas has the most trouble with. Self Care, Survival Instincts, Spontaneity are all obviously more palatable than Deceit, Anxiety, or Intrusive Thoughts. It works for the Lights too. Patton is called Morality instead of Emotion. Logan is Logic instead of Reasoning. Even Roman is Creativity (something any artist grapples with) instead of Inspiration. I am sure the orange side is going to be something like Wrath but will be accepted as they realize he is also something like Self Respect.

[@pointbreak8474]

Janus: I’ll take care of him Three seconds later Let’s push sum peepl down sum sters

[@lollipop-nt8lx]

When Patton is grabbing Lee and Mary Lee from his inventory you can see that he also has 2 cookies. Guess he was feeling dangerous that day.

[@echo_va]

Did you notice that inventory is from Stardew Valley? No? Just me then ;-;

[@kj_ocho]

5. . . Second. . . Cookies

[@quigly5058]

Hes a danger boi

[@LovelyGhostz]

OMG YAS

[@khushik3899]

there are also a bunch of references to patton-cake

[@julialabusch9403]

Janus is a Roman god of beginnings, who is often depicted as having two faces. Genius.

[@larryconnors6161]

Julia Labusch it’s kinda like that saying that we’re two sides of the same coin

[@samanthalarned5230]

yessss!!! I also though it sounded a lot like Genesis, which is the book in the Bible where the snake tempted Eve, which is even depicted in the duke's song when he talks about Janis!

[@heylove6822]

He is also the God of choices in Greece. His is in your path and gives you two doors one as good and one as bad. (I always thought it was pronounced Jay-nus?)

[@ancient4263]

Ikr I love his name

[@meh3861]

Is his name spelled Janice or Janus because went I put caps it's spelled Janice... •-•

[@thatch_4245]

I just want to point out Patton’s inventory at 19:55 , it looks like he has his cat onesie, 278 cans of tuna (?!?) two tennis rackets, a candle, eye protection, some piece of paper (i’m not 100% sure, but it might be the card Virgil made for him), his Christmas sweater, two cookies, two things that i can’t make out, a potato (maybe), a painting/picture of some sort, the scooby doo tag, LUNGS(?!?), and lee and mary lee. i love how every single one references another video.

[@yufaelia]

Quick correction, the lungs are actually the dog ears from the Halloween episode :)

[@thatch_4245]

@@yufaelia oh that makes so much more sense jsnshwkms

[@thatch_4245]

@@thatastastan oh, i just meant it was a lot

[@Jackie-McCann]

Who came here to rewatch this after “Working THROUGH Intrusive Thoughts”… _And who else noticed that Frog!Patton’s eyes are ORANGE?_

[@parycartoons6840]

"Yes everything's just... fine"

[@constantine3555]

I just realized that

[@mangle6850]

Holy shiiiiiiiii-

[@izaacreatherishere]

L O R E

[@who.is_updog_]

WAIT-

[@sammieinc.3398]

Meanwhile, Virgil (in his room blasting MCR): *REMUS GET YOUR HANDS OFF MY DEODORANT-*

[@Boltofmercury]

70th like #underratedcomment I love ur comment

[@your_local_fander3702]

153rd like, this is underrated!

[@mina_ashido8286]

Remus:NEEEEEEEVRR

[@singsong7874]

So me everyday?

[@your_local_fander3702]

Sing Song do you deal with a rat man everyday?

[@ejonesactor]

HOW IS NOBODY TALKING ABOUT THE FACT THAT LESLIE WAS JUST CHILLING LIKE WHAT

[@gracefizzle4827]

Im just Bumbee I WAS JUST ABOUT TO COMMENT THIS

[@Jayup]

Aaron burr... ...sir...

[@reganmatthews1193]

Alvin Is bored oh sure sir

[@farewellneverland]

Regan Matthews im alexander hamilton at your service sir.

[@invisibleghost3820]

Pink Lasagna I’ve been looking for you

[@timothydunaway7568]

37:08 Look at deceit's face he looks so happy to have someone help defend his point

[@slitherysnakeysnake5206]

I also love how Janus actually LISTENS to Logan

[@lotuspocus1113]

Janus is apart of Thomas. He asks himself, "how can we trust you?" For me that feels like, "How can I trust myself?"

[@panek6443]

Derpy Dragan THANK YOU? THAT’S WHAT I THOUGH!

[@arkanhelle2525]

Oof

[@klabiaga3684]

Oooh darn

[@nurailidepaepe2783]

they're.. all a part of thomas..

[@alterego24122]

Oh.. Ouch

[@starry1013]

Are we not going to talk about how abused Logan is? Janus literally put the skip there because he knew that Patton and Roman would take the opportunity to not listen to Logan.

[@pluto_plays4062]

Oh no. Ohhh no. Dear lord, no. My poor boy needs a hug! What if Logan saw that happen, and that's why he was so angry and annoyed when he popped in? What if thats why he was talking about how the others didn't want him? What if thats why he cut off Patton when he tried to comfort Logan? Because Patton was the one who hit the skip button! Ohmygoodness im not okay (i promise)

[@MrLegendofLP]

I think a big focus going forward is going to be each side getting heard and problems not being ignored and negative feelings not being repressed. We've obviously had these discussions in the past (Problems being ignored=Puppet episode, negative feelings being repressed=moving on) but character growth doesn't happen all at once.

[@chaoticmushroomchildren6936]

Patton hit the skip button...what does that say about him?!

[@starry1013]

@@chaoticmushroomchildren6936 It says that Patton will need to work to regain Logan's trust. At least in my opinion.

[@starry1013]

@@pluto_plays4062 Did you notice that he stuck to his word and didn't come back after the fact was done? He doesn't want to "overstay his welcome"

[@lolli_popples]

So, Remus has totally filled Roman's room with cats, right?

[@claireaquos6532]

I think that's canon

[@p0larbEars]

Patton: *gets hits in the face* Logan:oh shiz my bad Thomas: MY BLIND'S!! Timestamp: 21:55