All radios were bound to their receivers in 2 way telemetry mode. Sanwa FH4T in SHR mode, FlySky AFHDS3 in 2 way mode, and Traxxas TQi Link. While my math doesn't match with documented latency, I did calculate latency the same way for all 3 so we can see the difference in response delay. Sanwa wins, FlySky very close 2nd, and for Traxxas.. we show why a fast low-latency RF protocol matters for racing. Product links in the video description. Thanks for Watching.
@lightningcount1233 жыл бұрын
Thanks man! just starting to get back into racing, glad i saw this video and picked up an mt44
@ChaosRC6663 жыл бұрын
What about the 1-way option on the nb4? I don't need Telemetry on a race car... I don't know about you guys but when I'm in a race, my eyes are on the car, not the radio...
@samintrepid5 ай бұрын
I have buy the MT-4 in 2014 for my tekno ET48 and that was my first high grade transmitter and I feel the difference. After that I resale the transmitter and the truggy to my best friend Steve Séguin teknoman and he have a great result for long time with this set up when he racing with you :)
@dutchducrider94363 жыл бұрын
Great video but, i think your figures have error. You mention response times of 0.09, 0.11 and 0.19 milliseconds. This can not be correct as they are way to fast. If you recorded at 960fps then indeed, one frame is 1/960 th of a second and if your frame counts of resp. 90, 106 and 186 shot @960fps are correct it adds up to total times of resp 94 milliseconds, 110 milliseconds and 194 milliseconds. Which are way to high. Did you count your frames when playing back the video @30fps? in that case, you have to correct for the slowmotion factor of 960/30=32. Then your times become 2.9 , 3,3 and 6.1 milliseconds which sound realistic. You also lose time in the transition from servo movement to wheel movement because of play in the steering links. You see your servo arm move ' way ' earlier than the wheel. Check out this guy's video on the same subject: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rXnIl3Vnl7GHmJI He shot at 240 fps . he removed the steering linkage errors by taking a 'naked' servo but i think, he counted his frames during play back at 30fps and also made the mistake not correcting for the slow motion factor of in his case 8. His result for the Noble should be 24.95/8 = 3.1milliseconds. This comes close to your 3.3 value which probably has some link-transfer error in it. Perhaps you can redo the test in a similar way the other guy did and compare your results with his? I have a Noble 4 as well and am very happy with it. It's versatile, lots of features, great range and not very expensive for what you get. I also use it for VRC World :-) Keep on making great RC movies and let's get as many people as possible interested in this great hobby! Regards, Gert
@simonanderson39612 жыл бұрын
Yeah I didn't get it. The TQ says 3 second latency at the top, then .19ms at the bottom... So insanely slow or insanely fast....
@Tunned135i3 жыл бұрын
The NB4 has a "sport" mode. By default the radio uses 2 way communication. To set the radio in "sport mode", you need to set the RF to AFHDS3 1way, under Model/Radio Frequency Setup.
@buss1205 Жыл бұрын
what does that do
@ccurrivan Жыл бұрын
@@buss1205 Removes bidirectional communication so you lose telemetry (signal lost warning) but improve latency.
@MX-CO3 ай бұрын
After watching this my take away is to never just let go of your wheel after a corner when trying to go back to going straight, that wobble is crazy
@alanrixson49493 жыл бұрын
Thats just made my mind up the flysky radio is worth every penny. Nicely done very informative thank you
@kgoward3 жыл бұрын
I just ordered one...I’m excited to give it a shot. Thanks for the videos!
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
After testing this, I feel confident saying the Noble is best value for a modern new high performance RC racing radio. The newest Sanwa and Futaba are lower latency, but it's such a small difference you likely would never notice it.
@fgarcia22773 жыл бұрын
Great to see this on video, understood the theory but seeing it is better.
@joeyfesta20422 жыл бұрын
The Noble 4 is a must for me.I’m left handed.
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
FYI Spektrum DSMR was not tested in this video but those have a documented 11ms response rate with Smart telemetry on. If you have a Spektrum PRO radio and PRO receiver, you can bind DSMR at 5.5ms but that is 1 way only (no smart telemetry). Regarding Futaba, I have no Futaba radios to test with but documentation says they are at or under 4ms in the newer protocols.
@joevasquez17763 жыл бұрын
Great video, my track has four of us running nobles now. Two of the guys are towards the top 4 "over forty" rCerz
@Muchomorek23 жыл бұрын
I ordered flysky with 2 receivers for 196$. Futaba or Sanwa is starting from 320$. In my opinion so little difference is not worth paying so much more
@mattster197 Жыл бұрын
I use the Hitec Lynx 4s and the Axion 2 receiver has a 4ms latency and thats fast too. It was the best until recently.
@TerraRyzin78 Жыл бұрын
Latency in the distance would be interesting
@stevemoon21363 жыл бұрын
Super interesting & well presented. 😊
@MX-CO3 ай бұрын
Ive been trying to find a lap time comparison with a traxxas TQI vs a higher quality radio. I cannot find this comparison anywhere on KZbin, im certain it would get a lot of views
@islandrc-duke19723 жыл бұрын
cool test and information
@woogienitro3 жыл бұрын
Awesome vid man
@machinedred Жыл бұрын
Latency increases with distance I've noticed please re test at track distance
@MrMaximuskodrata3 жыл бұрын
Nice review
@gordonshaw32453 жыл бұрын
Great stuff John, I tried the one way protocol on vrc and it felt quicker (could be a placebo though 😁). I couldn’t get my v1 FGr4S receiver to bind on the 1 way protocol, maybe the v2 you have might? Interesting if it improves the latency further. Overall I’m rapt with my NB4 and a small latency penalty isn’t an issue for me given all the other positives (I guess the top 5% of racers would not want the latency penalty, but for the rest of us it’s not an issue). Would be great if you could do some back to back running at the track too (🤞 you can get back there soon). Thanks again!!
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
Phend uses Spektrum which is at best 5.5ms bind protocol, and for most DSMR radios it’s 11ms. So technically the Noble is lower latency than the best Spektrum that a world class A driver uses. Once you get this fast I don’t think it matters much but still interesting to see the input delay differences.
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
Oh I remember reading you won’t get a confirmation of 1 way bind because the radio doesn’t get a confirmation signal. Power off and on after a 1 way bind attempt and it should be linked.
@lexsteel123 жыл бұрын
Great testing. I feel you should have included the Dumbo RC and RadioLink radios. Those two are two of the best cheap radios out there on the market. They both have excellent protocols and latency. not to mention the best range of most radios out there, including Futaba's and Sanwa's. Maybe you can test those next time?
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
Yes that will happen. I don’t have a dumbo but I do have a radio link to review
@OldfartRC13 жыл бұрын
great video...would like to see someone do the same test on the radiolink rc4gs v2 or rc6gs v2. great budget radio and super fast response and super long range.
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
I have a new in box RC6GS v2 and will test it. The on paper response rate is RTR spec (+13ms), but range is far.
@roberttruesdell61513 жыл бұрын
Radio link is ok if your on a tight budget or banging around the house. But if your getting into racing you really want a quality system. Noble is the best for the price I love mine. But my Futaba 7PX is still the king of all transmitters. But it comes at a price.
@aaronperelmuter8433 Жыл бұрын
@@roberttruesdell6151 What does that even mean, a “radio link”? 🧐 Every radio on sale uses a radio link, they always have. 😱 How else is the rx supposed to receive the transmitter commands if not by a radio link, you’d prefer a long cable instead? 🤔 Because that’s the only other option, wired or wireless. Maybe you think your Futaba uses some magic connection to your internal telepathic powers but mine sure doesn’t! 🤪 It uses a radio link, just like every other rc control system ever invented which is wireless.😱
@roberttruesdell6151 Жыл бұрын
@@aaronperelmuter8433 what the heck are you talking about? RadioLink is the brand. Learn before you spew off uselessness and then try and insult and be funny.
@roberttruesdell6151 Жыл бұрын
@@aaronperelmuter8433 dude Radiolink is the Brand of the transmitter and receiver the poster is using. Where is your confusion?
@polishedturdspeedshop2 жыл бұрын
You should be focusing on the servo horn, any slop in the system will show as latency. No different than the old steering box systems in real cars
@GyuHobbyRC3 жыл бұрын
Wow !!!! It's a great video. Thank you for sharing great information and great videos. Always be healthy and happy. 👍😉😉😉👍
@marquezpradoluisjavier77542 жыл бұрын
Good video 😸✌🏻
@user-rx8qq8sk9ydv1ce5ib Жыл бұрын
Excellent comparison . Do you still recommend the noble nb4 till now or there is something new you can recommend. Thanks anyway
@netcruzer Жыл бұрын
Still recommend the Noble NB4 in 2023. There is a Pro model too, but most (including me) don’t need the features it adds for the big price jump.
@adrianchiloeches726210 ай бұрын
After watching videos, investigating and comparing, I even had purchased the pro, and returned and got the NB4 m. You can get the regular Noble for half of the price and they are the same. The pro just has some fancy extras. They are some crazy good extras but, after thinking about very well, NB4 is moreeee than enough
@user-rx8qq8sk9ydv1ce5ib10 ай бұрын
@@netcruzer Thanks a lot. Got it. And I love it. Hate the sanwa too)))
@user-rx8qq8sk9ydv1ce5ib10 ай бұрын
@@adrianchiloeches7262 Thanks alot. 👌
@KurtsRCs3 жыл бұрын
Great video I was thinking of getting into racing a little and wondering what radio would be good hope you are going to do some more test
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
I don’t see much of a downside for the Noble. It’s much better value than Futaba or Sanwa for similar performance and features.
@Ghost-un4fu2 жыл бұрын
Do a comparison with the futaba 7pxr and the Sanwa m17, that’s how can tell which one is the best no disrespect bro
@GREENFROGRC3 жыл бұрын
John, cool video full watch big 👍. Enjoyed seeing a scientific comparison on KZbin. To many 🍎 VS. 🍊 videos, in my opinion.
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
Thanks, it’s doing well and people are interested. I’ll look into doing more like this with other radios to compare. Hope all is well. 👍
@aaronperelmuter8433 Жыл бұрын
Seriously, you’re calling THIS a scientific comparison??? You obviously have ZERO understanding of the scientific process is all I can conclude as this video is about as far from scientific as you could get, short of just guessing the results! Where do I start? First off, his numbers are COMPLTELY WRONG!! All of them, not just some. Ok, so to make things super confusing, there are 2 latency numbers we’re told, for the NB4, 0.11ms and 1.23 SECONDS, ye, SECONDS. WTF?? How is it possible that ANYTHING could have a latency that stupendously long? It isn’t and I’ve no clue where that comes from. I think he shows something like 3s for the Traxxas, which is also absolutely incorrect. Worse still, he somehow managed to also obtain a latency of 0.11ms!! Again, WTF?? No rx on the planet has a latency that minuscule! If they did, it’d still be used to control military drones or similar, would be classified and not on sale to the public. Why would the manufacturer say it’s about 3ms if it could actually perform just under THIRTY times as fast? And this is what you’re calling a scientific comparison, you’re either delusional or as I initially stated, you simply do not understand the scientific process. I’m not even going to bother pointing out the rest of the serious flaws in this setup and very bad failure at attempting to compare rx latencies. This is really an appalling ‘comparison’, if it could even be called a comparison. Hopeless (shaking head)!
@ShenRC3 жыл бұрын
Nice test..the traxxas was bad compared to the others... Wonder how the latest Ko propo radio would be they are supposed to be the fastest yet I believe.
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
They recently stated they have a very fast new radio, but I don’t remember seeing a number. Sanwa M17 in newest FH5T mode is 1ms, so It likely matches that.
@davidnieuwland3 жыл бұрын
I would love to see a range test. I find my GT3C has way less range than my GT3B so I would really like to know how the Noble performs.
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
I expect it will be dependent on what receiver you use. The little Rx will have the worst range but I expect it will be adequate for most race venues. I’ll consider some range testing but I’m not sure best way to achieve that.. and it’s stupid cold out now. 🥶
@ericthestone Жыл бұрын
A DX5C vs Traxxas TQi. Is it a worthy upgrade for small track carpet racing?
@sgtcrusher662 жыл бұрын
ANYONE KNOW WHAT THELATENCY IS ON THE RADIO LINK RC6GS V2 IS ?
@Sphyxx Жыл бұрын
You can get a used MT4 for pretty close the same price as a brand new Noble
@CarlosDelaoGunEngraver Жыл бұрын
what tires and wheels are you using?
@MX-CO3 ай бұрын
Is it possible to be competitive in racing with a tqi if it was in a team associated car for example?
@netcruzer3 ай бұрын
Yes, but eventually a radio upgrade will help you improve with its added features and lower latency.
@MX-CO3 ай бұрын
@netcruzer Thanks, do you you think the Flysky fs-g7p is an upgrade from a tqi?
@ExelArts3 жыл бұрын
is throttle and steering trim switches or twistable knobs?
@andreasjonsson8075 Жыл бұрын
The 2 turn knobbs on the pistolgrip, do you think they will interfere when holding it righthanded?
@netcruzer Жыл бұрын
No, they are above where your hand rests, either way.
@johnsorensen57583 жыл бұрын
Nice test I have a futaba t3pv do you have any idea how fast it is compared to the ones you tested I'm getting into racing should I upgrade or is it fine for racing?
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
Documented latency for that 3PV radio in normal S-FHSS mode is 14ms, and in high speed S-FHSS mode is 7ms and if you pair with a faster receiver and fast digital servo you can get latency even lower.
@johnsorensen57583 жыл бұрын
@@netcruzer thanks for your response👍
@jasperpareyn5503 жыл бұрын
So if i got this right, the noble nb4 is faster?
@cue033 жыл бұрын
Do you have a Spektrum Dx5C or pro or similiar to compare the speed to the NB4? I would be interested to see if the Spektrum is in the same league as the NB4 or at least faster than the Traxxas.
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
I do have a DX5C smart. Those are 11ms advertised latency. It’s slightly quicker than traxxas 13ms. But nowhere close to Sanwa, Futaba, and the Noble. Those are all 4ms or less racing radios. Spektrum at its very fastest is 5.5ms but you need a PRO radio and a PRO rx and get no telemetry at 5.5ms DSMR.
@rcjunkie2603 жыл бұрын
Informative video!!!! If my 14 year old sees this vid.I'll never hear the end of it until I replace radio and servo in his baja rey. Lol!!! I can just hear the excuses. Sadly he's right (ur video) lol! By chance do you know the latency #'s for a Sanwa mx3x 12 years old. In great shape! Thank you for the visual comparison!!!
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
That older MX-3X is still good! It uses FHSS-3 (FH3) non telemetry 3 channel signal. I expect you are at ~4ms documented latency with that. A M11X with top spec FH3 receiver was 2.5ms. Sanwa does an interesting thing where the higher end Transmitters have lower latency even when binding to the same Rx as a lower end radio in that generation. AKA, your old Sanwa is still 2x as fast as a normal RTR radio for latency. The MT4 I have was what came after MX-3X and the big deal was adding 2 way telemetry on FH4T protocol without a latency penalty (~4ms). Then dropped to 2ms on MT4-S and beyond.
@rcjunkie2603 жыл бұрын
Thank you, wow that is nice to hear. 12 or so years old. Sanwa don't make this mx3x anymore do they? It is very responsive.
@bat33.123 жыл бұрын
Interesting test and very likely not noticeable difference on an off road track. How about range, do you plan on doing a range test? Wasn't this one of the issues with Spectrum when they first started in the race radio market that signal strength was a bit weak and range could suffer?
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
Spektrum DSM had a problem with how it chooses frequencies, causing interference. DSMR is better but still I think the competition protocols are better. Range I’m not too conferenced about as I’ll just be using this at race tracks not long distance speed runs, but a few have mentioned it so I’ll consider how to test range. I’ve seen a Noble used at the big Bego 1/8 track and it had no range issues.
@ivanvrane72133 жыл бұрын
Nice video.. but, I think that those differences are not visible to normal every day user.. i use different radios, from cheap dumborc, over spektrum and traxxas till futaba.. and they all do they Job Great.. same thing as on my fpv drones.. few years back latency was big thing until dji digital fpv came out with waaaaaay worse latency than any average analog system.. and suddenly, latency is not a big deal 😄😄
@nealecarbis3637 Жыл бұрын
Hi there, Great videos, what was the outcome of the tests with the Nobel, I am looking to buy one for crawler and buggy racing. Switching to wheel from sticks and using the sanwa ZZ. Cheers Neale I am in the UK
@netcruzer Жыл бұрын
I race with the noble NB4 past 2 years. Like it a lot.
@147diavolo3 жыл бұрын
For the same price, should I get a brand new Noble NB4 or a used Sanwa M12?
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
That is a really difficult choice. M12 is technically a faster protocol, but I think that radio is too big and weighty. Noble NB4 is a more unique and futuristic build. Personally I’m keeping a Sanwa for onroad and Noble for off-road Racing use.
@rclunatic2 жыл бұрын
@@netcruzer what’s a good radio for on road and off road do you suggest
@wisnumaulana58253 жыл бұрын
request latency ko propo ex10 eurus
@cue033 жыл бұрын
Is the telemetry data you mentioned on the NB4 only from the receiver or is it getting info from the motor and esc as well? Does it also have car battery info? Just trying to understand the whole smart telemetry stuff.
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
Only from the receiver, showing it’s voltage and signal strength in 2 way mode. Additional telemetry would require sensors which I’m unsure if flysky supports. “Smart” telemetry IMO means it works without buying extra sensors and cables. Traxxas TQi and Spektrum Smart paired with their own brand ESC are the only smart systems I’m aware of.
@rcasey3 жыл бұрын
@@netcruzer FlySky does have sensors which can be added, like temperature, voltage, etc.
@earlyculyer41033 жыл бұрын
Do they all come with extra grips I didn't see one in my box
@aaronperelmuter8433 Жыл бұрын
No, they sell a special edition for idiots, the “doesn’t come with everything, we decided to rip off special people” edition. Seriously, why would you even ask that? Have you EVER IN YOUR LIFE heard of something so ridiculous, perhaps next you’ll buy a tv but it’ll be the version without a screen or a car but your version doesn’t come with wheels and tires.
@stephenpizer56663 жыл бұрын
Are there any other left hand radios that are better but not over $250 if so please let me know. Thanks 😊
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
I don’t know of any. The Noble is well worth the price for this design and performance.
@flederdanielminguinidaniel15572 жыл бұрын
Rádio Hk 310 sua opinião
@timesweeper97783 жыл бұрын
I have a Futaba 4pls. Any idea what the latency on that is?
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
Completely depends on what protocol you are binding with. According to RC TECH forum, here is Futaba latency. Note that high speed usually requires a digital servo and higher spec receiver. normal speed s-fhss 15ms high speed s-fhss 6ms high speed t-fhss 3.3ms normal speed t-fhss 16ms
@timesweeper97783 жыл бұрын
@@netcruzer Thanks for letting me know
@paulpadilla52883 жыл бұрын
Great video.....how much of that depends on the servo......you might get something different with faster servo.....
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
I used one of the fastest brushless servos I own to test this. I’m watching for the delay from when my hand moves the wheel to when the servo moves. The speed of the servo itself is a rating of the 60 degree sweep transit time. We are not as concerned about that. But a fast servo is what makes the traxxas radio also look fast when watching it in real time.
@diycaravanning65072 жыл бұрын
I know this is a fairly old video, but it’s very difficult to calculate with real accuracy. Was there delay at dead centre programmed in. The quality of receiver. Speed of hand could vary. All could make a difference. But unless your a world class driver it don’t matter. Y standard a one second delay wouldn’t make much difference 😂
@rcinhand9671 Жыл бұрын
After a year later, do you still use your NB4?
@netcruzer Жыл бұрын
Yes, it's the radio I use for my Offroad racing and VRC
@joeyfesta20422 жыл бұрын
Have you tried testing it at 400 feet away ??? See how your response time is then.
@pncampbell2 жыл бұрын
Radio signal travels 180 miles in 1 ms so control distance isnt a factor.
@aaronperelmuter8433 Жыл бұрын
Exactly HOW would you go about doing that, genius? How can one test something if they CANNOT SEE IT? How is anyone going to know what’s happening 400 feet away from themself? Honestly, that’s such an awesome idea, why not test it at 5000 feet? Seriously, WTF you on bro, I want some!
@ctbully2 жыл бұрын
Based on the latency, I would say that is not an upgrade at all :-(
@dreyn77802 жыл бұрын
In the car world, every benefit has a down side. If you 'improove' something then you also loose something. So now you 'improoved' when stuff happens, your car will do something badly. It will be too fast at doing stuff. You'll smash into the guide rope. You tune in the steering to get track position.
@nitro7783 жыл бұрын
How did we ever race on 75mhz
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
LOL, I wonder if the old FM radios are fast. Not as much computer processing and there was no frequency hopping. Remember having to choose your crystals and marking the radio boards? I do. 👴🏻
@zacharygoettl80173 ай бұрын
@@netcruzer I sitll use my old crystal radio. I know im making some crystal girly out there happy
@johnalenwork533 жыл бұрын
I honestly thought that the Traxxas TQI was better than Both....?
@mikegebhard903 жыл бұрын
Put it against a real samwa with fh5...
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
I want to! Maybe next top spec radio. I don’t like the M17 design
@TheAntoine1913 жыл бұрын
Man your latency number in red are in s not ms. It's 0.11s not 0.11ms. Does not help following the vid.
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
The math is wrong but I did all the same way so the comparison is accurate.
@TheAntoine1913 жыл бұрын
@@netcruzer Sure you did a fine job ! But maybe a disclaimer in the description would help.
@jongonegone12623 жыл бұрын
no futaba. no real test.
@aaronperelmuter8433 Жыл бұрын
No, of course it isn’t a real test. Because obviously, it was all make believe, complete fiction. Just like your brain, it’s complete fiction that you even have one. Matches your name though, must be your brain and your thought was Jon gone gone, no brain brain now.😱😢
@turtletrading42073 жыл бұрын
Hi, please don't include any traxxas products in the future. They are an insult to the hobby industry.
@netcruzer3 жыл бұрын
It’s to compare RTR spec radio latency. The Traxxas actually has plenty of features such as over the air updates and telemetry than other brands don’t have. I’ll check Spektrum and other brands later. I’ll show and review almosf any hobby grade brand products.
@zacharygoettl80173 ай бұрын
I would argue that without traxxas the industry over all would be worse off. it brought in an entire generation at an affordable price point. Without that the RC industry would be much smaller, parts would be more expensive and you'd have less places to run your vehicles.