Remington R51: Slow Death?

[@professorpewpuew]

It would be brave of them to rerelease that gun. I did review the RM380 recently and I definitely like it and the consensus seems to be the same. So there is hope.

[@RyeOnHam]

+mark3smle Hope for the company, perhaps, but not so much for the R51. I do not intend to get an RM380 or ANY other Freedom Group product in the near future. They left me hanging on the R51.

[@markl.3074]

whiteonturkey here, As I commented earlier in the week on one of your videos, the R51 was not listed in the 2016 product catalog. Now, today, Remington has it also removed from their handgun section of their webpage also. Before you know it Remington wont even acknowledge they even produced such a model.

[@RyeOnHam]

+Mark Lionberger That just changed today. I checked earlier today. Looks like they revamped their entire web site. If you watch the video, I was surfing their old web site. There is still a glimmer of hope some different news will come out of SHOT. I have heard that people are still being told that the Gen2 is coming. I am withholding judgement at this point. Thanks for the heads-up.

[@markl.3074]

+RyeOnHam I hope a Gen2 makes its way into the market with flawless performance. I don't think anyone in the gun world wants to see an American company fail in this business with a product (especially in todays society). To have a second rollout fail would be demoralizing for Remington along other things. They cant afford much more negative press, attention, etc. So if its coming, and they are crossing their t's and dotting their i's, testing and re-testing to make sure its 110%, then the waits worth it obviously and we can all move on from this debacle

[@jasonhw00]

Guys and Gals, 10:22AM on 06/10/2016 - The R51 production team has a BIG announcement coming up about the release date for the Gen 2. Keep your eyes open for a barrage of electronic information to the loyal R51 owners and an eblast to announce the re-launch to the rest of the gun world in the next few weeks. The approvals have all been made, the suppliers are all on board, the plant is fabricating (has already built 100's, tested and proved reliable) and distribution is preparing to package them to send out the first ones to those that have stuck it out and have been loyal (although exasperated) to Remington. From what I have been told over the past few months about how it has been thoroughly tested and painstakingly inspected, this next version is going to be GREAT! The redesign and the durability of the Gen 2 will extend its longevity to make it an heirloom for generations to come...like its predecessor the Model 51. If you sent your original R51 back for the voluntary recall repairs and have been waiting like I have for almost 2 years...the wait is almost over. It will be so nice to be able to talk about the performance of the new Remington R51 - Generation 2 Pistol and put behind us all of the other conspiracy stuff that has been posted on this forum. It is rather apropos that this re-release will happen in their 200th year anniversary. I will be honest that I have also been skeptical, but have hoped what I was being told was correct (even though the time line kept getting pushed back until they could make sure it met their QC requirements...this time). Congratulations to Mr. Marcotuli for having the tenacity to verify the quality of every single one the details, and to the Remington engineers, designers, and mechanics that have worked to get it right before the marketers are allowed to hype it up. I hope this has been a lesson learned for all gun makers, albeit there could have been some improvements on the communication side. And to the person that has kept me up to date (so I could keep you guys informed of the real facts) I am very appreciative. Mine is being shipped! Soon to be an R51 Gen 2 Beta tester, T3 -latest from the r51 forum.

[@RyeOnHam]

... I just checked my porch. There's a 20-year-old Manfrotto tripod that needs some repair in my studio now that wasn't there when I woke up, but no R51. I'll believe it when I see it.

[@jconradh]

Bummer. I'm rooting for you! I really wanted mine to work- all metal, 9mm pocket pistol. I still have my magazines and owners manual, LOL.

[@RyeOnHam]

+jconradh I'm in the same boat. I'm keeping them whether or not I get a pistol back. The final nail isn't in the coffin yet. We'll see what SHOT 2016 brings.

[@MrBulletpoints]

Remington and .380 do not seem to play well together. The few that are out there will probably be worth money as a collectible.

[@GunCollector007]

it's a shame, I really wanted that gun when it first came out.

[@MrBrown-br7sh]

I've given up hope on getting my R51 back at this point. When I get around to it I'll probably call and ask for an R1 which I'll immediately sell.

[@RyeOnHam]

+Wax Pragmatic That's my fallback plan. for a company to express such indifference to their customers let alone a fanboy and FORMER devotee like myself says a great deal about the depths to which this once-great company has sunk. I'd sooner buy a Hi-Point. At least they seem to care about their customers.

[@MrBrown-br7sh]

RyeOnHam Have you seen TheFireArmGuy's Hi-Point torture test and subsequent customer service videos? He tied one to his bumper, drove down a gravel road, stopped, test fired, and repeated until it died. He then called Hi-Point, told them what he did, and they fixed/replaced anyway. I was impressed by the whole exercise.

[@RyeOnHam]

Wax Pragmatic No, have not seen those. I'll have to check it out. I had two Hi-Point customer service experiences. I buy broke guns, so it stands to reason I spend a good deal of time with customer service departments. They didn't argue and fixed the problems. MUCH better than Taurus or Freedom Group of course.

[@DriftTaxi]

I've heard such negative things about the R51 that I would be very surprised if they release it.

[@RyeOnHam]

+David “Derpy Drift” Adams That probably plays a part in whatever decision they've made. I will say, though, that the design was good, it was just hobbled together with zero quality control. Some have argued that it was sabotaged by employees who were being rushed while at the same time were being told that they were closing down the factory it was made in. The design, though, is sound. I can't stress that enough. Were Khar, S&W, Ruger, SIG, Beretta, or any number of US gunmakers were producing it, we would not have seen the problems we see now.

[@markl.3074]

Come to think about it, I now wish I kept mine. If they do indeed stop production and dont return those defective guns (and they wont) the R51 will be one "rare" (is that the word i'm looking for?) gun to own. It would be interesting to know how many are in the hands of owners to date.

[@RyeOnHam]

+Mark Lionberger In that case, I would litigate for specific performance. Either I get my gun back or I get the current market value vs. the price I paid for it two years ago.

[@markl.3074]

If they seize production of the R51 for good, I would want my R51 back. Sure, it would still be defective but I have plenty of other guns to shoot and just to have one might mean something someday. As it stands today, they appear hard to come by in the gun market-I've been watching. As you mentioned, we should (hopefully) know more after SHOT. The company reps know the questions will be coming when ask in person, by a lot of people at SHOT. I bet they are home right now memorizing their answers given to them from Remingtons legal dept. Or....maybe they will just go with the "deer in the headlights" look of any mention of the R51 and throw the RM380 in your face to change the subject. Wish I had a plane ticket Vegas now.

[@irgski]

Looks like you've got a very rare "collector" on your hands!!

[@gerryk3114]

Why did I see the R51 shown in your video ?? I'm Confused !! The RM380 looks a lot like the R51 ??

[@RyeOnHam]

+Gerry K As I stated in the video, the R51 is still showing on the web site, but it is missing from the 2016 catalog. The RM380 has a similar finish and many similar styling cues.

[@gerryk3114]

+RyeOnHam In Your Video, I thought you were showing the catalog. My Misunderstanding !! Obviously I've been watching your channel and waiting to see How Remington Resolves Your R51 !!! Because of the R51 FIASCO, I'm Leary to Buy Anything Remington !!!!! I'm Not in the Market to buy a 380, but if I were, I Certainly wouldn't buy Remington until they REPLACE YOUR R51 !!! At Least !!!

[@shaneobrien9658]

Everyone knows the Rem R51 1st gen was a disaster. When the Gen 2 came out, it had problems too. It was only that the front lip of the mag was bent to far in. Easy fix, but owners had to do it themselves or send it to the factory. Once tweaked, it works fine. If Remington does end production, they will become instant collectors pistols.

[@RyeOnHam]

Please provide a source for the magazine lip assertion.

[@recoilrob324]

Yep....don't hold your breath to get an R51 back...ever. The Pederson design is just not up to snuff. I know...YOU say it's a great design, but if it can't be made to function...then I qualify that as a defective one. As I said before, yes you CAN make it work...with careful assembly and compatible ammo, but if it won't tolerate a wide spectrum of bullet weights and cannot be assembled with normal CNC tolerances then it doesn't make the grade as a properly engineered device. This is reminiscent of Pederson's 'toggle-lock' gun he competed against the Garand with. Totally horrible to machine and even when everything was perfect it required waxed ammo to extract. For some reason...he just seemed hell-bent on making delayed blowback guns work. Once all the lawsuits are settled it will make an interesting read if someone will step forward with the whole story about this gun. Have read that the guy/s that designed it said it wasn't good enough to produce, but the people they worked for got all excited and sold the design against their objections. Then they were hired to try to make it work...and obviously this has failed. Kind of reminds you of the Shuttle booster O-ring problem...doesn't it? (it does me) The guy responsible for the suggestion pulled it after thinking about it but higher-ups ran with it and until the Challenger blew up they wouldn't listen to the guy. Sad. At least nobody has died with the R51.:)

[@RyeOnHam]

+Recoil Rob I respectfully disagree. The R51 was sabotaged. The design is sound. The Pedersen lock held up just fine against the 1911 during Military Trials in .45 ACP. I know more of the story about this gun which is why I have faith that IF it can be produced in Alabama to specs, it can be successful. Feel free to research the ACTUAL history of the Garand by reading Hatcher's Notebook and Book of the Garand and I believe your current opinion might be changed. Thanks for watching. Either way, I will report on if Remington can get it right.

[@fordxbgtfalcon]

Remington told me it is cancelled indefinitely.

[@RyeOnHam]

+gunz-n-gadgets That's disturbing considering they aren't telling anybody. Why are they leaving us hanging?

[@AlwaysDoingSomething]

Sad ....

[@firefighterLTP]

It's coming back, I guarantee it, inside information.

[@RyeOnHam]

+firefighterLTP YAY! I've got an update coming suggesting just that. Feel Free to message me if you feel the need to elaborate.

[@Philly1958]

It's almost back

[@RyeOnHam]

+gstea1 I wouldn't hold my breath. I'll have another update to post on the 10th or so.

[@littlemichael7876]

+RyeOnHam On the 10th? You've got me holding my breath again.

[@RyeOnHam]

Little Michael My newest update is live. More positive news, I think.

[@calvinledford9606]

Some REALLY juicy grist for the rumor mill located about halfway down the page here: www.remingtonowners.com/topic2395-10.html

[@RyeOnHam]

+Calvin Ledford I am on a bit of a gag order from my contact(s) and have chosen to wait to post what I was told. This is somewhat different, but still interesting. The one thing he is seeing that I am also seeing is hope. They have a ton of capital invested in this product and many at the company believe in the product. Time will tell. Still toying with the idea of another update based on this and the "50-pistol" party line I keep hearing. I only think of the plot from "The Princess Bride" where Humperdinck tells Buttercup that he has dispatched his four fastest ships to search for Wesley; this is a lie of course. Just wondering how much inappropriately inserted smoke I can take at this point.