Smash's Worst Moves

How bad do "Smash's Worst Moves" get? Here's how they changed, for better or for worse.
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gnar
Jose Rosario
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Laserman2
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SuperSonicBros
Kyle
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Ari Freireich
Dash
J Sizzle
Toma_Strims

[@limerplaz8208]

Luigis smash 64 dash attack actually doesn’t have a final hit. Its coded in but not actually present. Which leads people to believe that the devs of melee just assumed that there was not meant to be a finisher.

[@fernafro8798]

It's funny, because it's the same case for Samus's Uair, but they fix it in Melee.

[@fr0stdr4ke95]

​@@fernafro8798 Yeah. Cuz Luigi is more of a wimpy character.

[@elijahfriedline9381]

0:07 WE SUMMONING THE SALT WITH THIS ONE 🗣️🗣️🗣️🗣️🗣️🗣️🗣️🗣️🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯

[@airothic0516]

Summoning Salt Type Beat

[@abcluigi21]

Glad I wasn’t the only one who noticed

[@ItsMeChair1]

I’m sorry, why are you summoning a salt can? Why do you need salt that badly? And what does it have to do with the beat?

[@slicklyndon1756]

​@YoKids1 There's this youtuber named "Summoning Salt". He covers speedruns and their history, goes into immensive detail, etc. The way this video started was akin to Summoning Salt's intro, where the same song plays whilst giving an overview of whatever the video may be about.

[@SaltInYourEye_ICs]

He’s the goat, no questions asked

[@The76532]

@@slicklyndon1756it was a joke i think

[@fax8891]

"Donkey Kong does some sort of leg-kick?" Guys just wait until I tell him about the arm punch...

[@MariaYuri-qo8jy]

No! An arm punch can kill you dead and then you'll be a dead corpse!

[@finalmix4375]

14:31 Banjo's Up-Tilt is actually a pretty solid kill move, it's as strong as Snake's Up-Tilt, it can be used to catch predictable landings and it can be comboed into Breegul Blaster

[@ZachHonest]

It's definitely not the worst move in the video, that's why I mentioned it very briefly. Banjos up air is for sure worst imo.

[@finalmix4375]

@@ZachHonest Banjo's Up Air is worse than Up-Tilt but it's still pretty decent since it combos into itself, can create frametraps and can combo into other aerials when landing.

[@GreatestThanks]

​@@ZachHonest What song did you use on 10:20

[@gridenboat]

​@@GreatestThanks Hsien-Ko theme from Darkstalkers/Vampire Savior

[@GreatestThanks]

@@gridenboat I will personally like to thank you You Saint 😇

[@StanleySophana]

Here's one thing I like about Kirby's Stone. In Brawl, there's a glitch called the Earthquake Glitch where if you use Stone at the right side of a slope, Kirby will hit the ground repeatedly and can rack up damage. Pictochat is the more common stage to perform the glitch

[@TheDemonChara]

Luigi's dash attack was missing the final hit in Smash 64 too

[@epitome8639]

That was my thought too when I heard him say it was in 64. It was notably missing there too. The clip of 64 only makes it look like it’s there because of the massive hitstun that game has

[@fr0stdr4ke95]

It did exist tho. Just... Not programmed to come out.

[@justarandompurplefox3243]

A significant portion of Wii Fit Trainer’s kit simply did nothing if you weren’t directly on top of the opponent in Smash 4. The non-projectile attacks that did have a little reach, the smash attacks, were extremely laggy for their average power.

[@demolitiongod64]

Dk's original dash attacks seems like a brain fart from the devs that lingered longer than the stench from your toilet after you feed it taco bell.

[@djdrizzy9139]

Kirby's stone is actually usable in Smash 4 and Ultimate. It's niche, but is good as a landing mix up or edge guard. The Smash 4 version is arguably the best since it could break shields, unlike Ultimate. Though stone did get cool buffs like super armour on frame 19. If you could combine 64's stone frame data (frame 23), Smash 4's shield break, and Ultimate's damage and super armour, it'd be a really good move.

[@amberknight7301]

Kirby stone can checkmate certain recoveries.

[@djdrizzy9139]

@@amberknight7301 Yep. Disjointed vertical recoveries lose to stone.

[@lasercraft32]

I feel like the reason they don't make Zelda's side special stronger is because its EXTREMELY spammable, especially in casual play.

[@heartnet40]

They buffed the move in Project M and it was incredibly broken. Right now it's a very good move, but it's balanced by the fact that it's on Zelda. If it was on another character, it would be broken again. Din's Fire is a very tricky move to balance and it's honestly the one I hope they change it in future titles.

[@justice8718]

@@heartnet40 Nah. Side-b still sucks for Zelda and Zelda in general needs a rework like Palutena did in Smash 4.

[@PizzaTimeTheater690]

The worst move of all is when ur go down b as Sheik and become a low tier lolz amazing video Honest!

[@JDLupus]

Another thing about Egg Roll that's horrendous, particularly in Sm4sh and Ultimate, is how easy it is to accidentally use it when intending to throw an egg. If on-stage, you have to somehow escape it without being punished, and when off-stage it makes you lose a TON of height and distance before you can get out of it. Yoshi's side-B would literally be a better move if it did nothing at all.

[@LinktheCommunistWaifu]

Link's ultimate dash attack is also really bad too. It's so easily punishable and takes forever to come out. It's more like a forward smash than a dash attack. His dash attack should've been a shield surf animation, or a roll animation.

[@lasercraft32]

Link's dash attack is NOT bad. If you throw it out willy nilly, of course you'll get punished for it... Its usefulness comes from reading your opponent well and punishing them for it (its quite similar to Dedede's dash attack, in terms of how you're supposed to use it).

[@melee9183]

No it's pretty good. It beats 2/3 tech options near the ledge and even if they tech in you won't really get punished.

[@LinktheCommunistWaifu]

Well, It's not as bad as I'm saying, but it doesn't really do what a dash attack is supposed to do. It's only used for reading your opponent, it is laggy and his frames data's too bad to capitalize. King Dedede's dash attack is better at that job due to being able to break your shield. I feel like Jump Slash shouldn't even be Link's dash attack, due to it never being able to be used while dashing in the Zelda games. It should have been a forward smash.

[@pancpop1603]

Banjo's up tilt sucks to throw out in neutral, but it most definitely does have KO potential. It's a great kill confirm after down throw between 97%-120. This confirm is pretty much it's only viable use, but hey, it kills lol

[@fr0stdr4ke95]

Breegull Blaster allows for some heinous set ups.

[@toonatic220]

Still sad that banjo was cut from the thumbnail

[@mandalorianhunter1]

Yeah DK's roll was there since 64 and yet we had that kick for three games like WHY? Luigi's dash attack is bad but so in character for him. Sheik's chain is for whipping people and giving people a great time

[@kylespevak6781]

DKs roll was there since Country, even earlier

[@mandalorianhunter1]

@@kylespevak6781 That's what I'm saying why Sakurai

[@SludgeBob_]

As a Banjo main, I think his up air is good at putting certain characters in a bad position. Similar to Pikachu's up air in Melee

[@TriforceZard]

To this day I still don’t know what purpose Jigglypuff’s Spinphony custom up special is supposed to do.

[@varietychan]

Summoning Salt theme

[@gayandweird]

home - we're finally landing

[@GreatestThanks]

What about the other songs?

[@williamnighswonger8438]

Roys dash attach is amazing if you can hit it properly

[@one-wingedoreo]

One thing about reflect barrier in S4 that no one talks about, is the hitbox on Palu's shield is actually unblockable. You can kinda troll people shielding on platforms with it lol

[@BigLadStudios]

I wont lie, I thought the chain was only in Melee. I had no idea it was in Brawl.

[@Bosanac97]

Your videos are awesome, subscribed. Love the green screen stand and talk

[@hmmmmmmmmmm_]

Sheiks chain could've been a grapple hook like jokers if they stuck with it, maybe had some combo routes as well. but hey the nade ain't bad either

[@botwleon187]

I watched enough toriguri to know that up tilt is good

[@banananoodles]

I love just dropping the kirby stone from like 2 inches above their chracter to annoy them

[@cassmoney3160]

There is a hidden egg roll technique where u can break shields w it in ultimate but it’s hard to land and should only really be used in ledge trap situations in the event u catch someone shielding

[@jacobmorris6357]

DK's kick attack actually originates from DK64, which was the newest DK game as of smash 64

[@TheMe9595]

Luigi's downward angled ftilt did have a use in brawl, it was the only move (iirc) that could jab lock for him.

[@Olblimy]

There is actually one move that you missed and its brawlers counter which is easily the worst counter in ultimate with its small detection window can be easily punished out of it you can’t edgeguard with due to the fact it can launch you in the opposite direction of the blastzone

[@fr0stdr4ke95]

Shout out FirethePyro.

[@Sly88Frye]

Sometimes it just takes changing one move or improving it and boom that fighter goes from garbage to pretty solid

[@SonicTheCutehog]

Luigi's Dash Attack was missing its final hitbox in Smash 64 also. It was supposed to have one, but due to a bug, it never appears.

[@JAMllostthegame]

The worst move in all of Smash is deciding to play Ganon in Brawl.

[@thunderd7904]

Moves you missed: Simon/Richter’s whip dangle Piranha plant’s footstool attack Melee Yoshi’s grab Smash 4 PAC Man’s grab Smash 4 Zelda phantom Melee Sheik down b 64 Samus up air Brawl Ivysaur. Just brawl Ivysaur Edit: also Smash 4 Roy double edge dance

[@kylespevak6781]

I forgot Palunata didn't have custom moves, just nore specials. Such an odd idea

[@The_Jho]

Bowsers neutral b should’ve been the classic fire balls from him that go straight forward

[@Tolinar]

In support of fire breath: it's very hard to prevent this move. Your opponent can - and must - retaliate, but the trade is virtually forced, as long as you don't telegraph and get completely avoided.

[@cashwilliams3988]

banjo uptilt combos out of downthrow to kill at ~100% and from neutral b to kill at a similar percent. upair combos out of neutral b too for good setups

[@gerardoramirezcazares1009]

Woow, the music he uses really got me

[@pilarius3973]

I mained Zelda in melee for a while and her side b actually combos cross screen into fair or up air for a kill confirm at highish percents.

[@jvgonzalez90]

Bro is not Finally Landing with that intro 😭 Anyways great video man love your editing style

[@McDoubleFunny]

yes I did completely forget sheik had a whip lol. That might be the most forgettable special move in all of smash

[@kylespevak6781]

Hilarious it took them until Smash 4 to give DK his most notable move

[@MAJ0Magi3MACHT]

The song from 4:06 locked me into the rest of the vid, and I'm glad cause this vid's great! But if someone knows what that song is, lemme know.

[@azurewarrior2000]

Smash correction on Ness: He got the hitbox for his Down Special in 4, not Ultimate.

[@EpicOdysseus]

Roy's dash attack in Melee is actually a brand-new animation too from Marth. Most people don't see this but they're different swings, with Marth swinging across his body and ending his sword pointing toward the screen, while Roy swing upward and over his head. Of course, they just copied Marth's frame data onto Roy with a completely different animation, and that's where the misalignment comes from.

[@Alonzone]

I don’t know if they made Egg Roll better or worse as time went on. A character that excels in the air has a move you should ever only be using on the ground. And even then it’s subpar at best. But if it’s used in the air, it can immediately turn neutral into disadvantage. It basically leaves you wide open for attacks with no hitbox until you land. As a Yoshi main, I feel like this is what holding him back.

[@supersmashbrosbrawl-rc7uq]

Great list. Definitely agree with marios flood in brawl. Its the most useless move in any smash game.

[@teddie5661]

ultimate pac man's up tilt. it is literally as bad as banjo's up tilt, except weaker and smaller.

[@thepooroldsoul8179]

Fun Fact: Luigi's dash attack in Brawl was given it's final hitbox. HOWEVER, they somehow made his dash attack Even WORSE in Brawl even with the last hitbox.

[@hiddencorner]

Could pk thunder be used twice after bonking into a wall in melee&brawl?

[@icykuikinu6757]

Kirby main over here👀 Id honestly argue that kirby's forward throw in both ultimate and 4 were significant buffs. You can very easily combo someone from 0-60/80 with one throw, and that's already a good percent fit you to start using down throw to rack up percent. Forward throw into up b is also a pretty good option as well in ultimate. The main drawback of his forward throw is that platforms *can* ruin its combo potential in ultimate, but on a good amount of characters you can use up air after forward throw to do a neat little extension. Imo i think it's one of the better f throws in ultimate, defo evolved from melee's awful iteration haha

[@MedK001]

you should do Sheik's Down-B in Melee

[@JonnyJayKhan]

Banjo up tilt is good it’s like a diet version of snake up tilt. Pacman up tilt or Jigglypuff up tilt are worse

[@brro1404]

love the p3 ost

[@TramiNguyen-oi3kp]

That’s my boy, Kirby!

[@Hugelag]

Pac-Man's grab in Smash 4 was awful. It had no hitbox when receding. Plus, there's also a ton of bad custom moves.

[@ln8496]

Roys dash attack is used for a regrab on the chain grab on full di away. Not useless!

[@goGothitaLOL]

You forgot Ridley’s Down-Air and Skewer His d-air is so bad, even by stall-n-fall standards. That and it got in over his iconic and glaringly missing Pogo Tail And they actually nerfed Skewer so that you can’t combo out of down-throw with it, all because of an patched broken infinite doubles combo that involved Ridley’s Skewer and K. Rool’s down-throw ironically enough. And why use Skewer on midair opponents when you can do literally anything else? -except said down air-

[@Persianpudding]

Banjo's up tilt is not at all in the same level as many of these other ones you mentioned. Yes you can't hit people next to you, but many other up tilts in the game, like Mario's, are purely for anti-air. Banjo runs fast, so you can do up tilts out of dash to catch landings. At low - mid percents, you can even combo off of the up tilt. Not to mention the down throw or Breegull Blaster into up-tilt for KOs. Banjo's up-air makes sense to be mentioned for its low damage output and low hitstun. However it still has good range + disjoint, so you can keep characters airborne with it. A landing up air can also combo into other attacks at certain percents. But yeah, it's not very good lol.

[@notanerd6838]

@@MrGameguyC It's solid in his kit because the multi jumps and low launch distance allow him to shark with it under platforms as well as juggle more than once.

[@666blaziken]

One move I think you forgot about is peach's side b. In melee, it went through shields, but it didn't hit the opponent, and said she went through and landed. This move is almost as slow as falcon Punch and it has so much more end lag as well. The reward for all this? A move that can't even kill at 200% combo cases against spacies, which are other moves are already so much beter at

[@Juelz_GnW]

I use boxx when I play melee sheik and chain is actually a good move in certain situations

[@aidenstrauss1829]

Ultimate Gordo is certainly decent but it get knocked back with like 2 damage moves and is very easy to avoid and knock back

[@CrowFGC]

Ayo third strike music

[@Yoshixandir]

Yoshi side b is awful. I hate how easy it is to accidentally use that move. It would be better if Yoshi had no side b or if they change the side b into something else like maybe have Yoshi do that custom move is smash 4 where Yoshi stick it tongue out but won’t swallow the opponent( it’s the alternative b move where instead of Yoshi swallowing the opponent he just stick his tongue out). It be just a damaging move but hey it’s better then egg roll

[@Roman_the_black_cat]

Prediction, shieks transformation into Zelda is not a good move

[@jalilfrancois7700]

What about Multi Hits? I heard they suck in 64,Melee and Brawl but idk why.

[@Monhamd1000]

It's funny that those moves do better in mods.

[@plabcentral630]

I’m a fan of this channel

[@NightGhost-qs6yw]

Roy’s dash attack is fine. It’s easy to poke fun at it because of its unfinished nature but as an actual move it is far from what I would consider the worst of the worst. It’s got very solid combo options and even though it’s a glorified shoulder bash it’s definitely better than falcons shoulder bash. Now that’s a bad move. Or at least a move that finds no place in the kit it’s in.

[@IcyianCanehdian]

Does anyone know the song at 4:07?

[@Double_AA17]

How is Bowser Jr. Smash 4 Clown Cannon not on this video lmao?

[@shadowxtulhybridtheoryep2780]

16:26 how did the platform move?

[@Lambs4lyf]

banjo down throw up tilt kills at 100% what are u talking about 😭

[@sbsb7352]

ehhh it's hitboxes are too small especially compared to most Up-Tilts. Up Air is still his worst move.

[@notanerd6838]

@@sbsb7352 Nah its solid, disjointed can be used to shark and juggle, combos out of breegull blaster and low launch distance means it can hit multiple times against characters who don't have options to hit/land as well. Down air is easily wayyyy worse and side b with no wings is the worst by a mile.

[@fr0stdr4ke95]

​@@sbsb7352Torigiri would love to have a word with you.

[@Triobros1098]

Good move version when?

[@someaccount5200]

ganondorf's Side Special?

[@poopsmithjones1]

in 64 Luigi actually doesn't have the dash attack ending hitbox at all, the code for it exists in the game but it's not enabled or something, perhaps not even intentionally, same with the ending hitbox of Samus uair

[@user-uk1xq1cf6z]

Another terrible ness move is PK flash, in melee it was incredibly slow (64 frames of startup, a full second) and his decent power dosen't balance his huge startup, and it was the same in brawl, even in smash 4 where ness got buffed significantly pk flash was still terrible (49 frames for no charge and a wopping 2 seconds for the fully charged version) in smash ultimate, the uncharged version now actully starts combos, and the fully charged version also combos at 0%, still ness's worst move, but not a bad move on ultimate

[@epoc3338]

9:02 what is this freeze frame bruh

[@GreatestThanks]

10:20 What song even is that???

[@eltipidemalaguero]

Palutena's Smash 4 Reflect is better than Explosive Flame

[@Tails_The_Fox92]

If any of Ganon's moves are on this list, we RIOT

[@notanerd6838]

Uptilt and warlock punch are contenders for some of the worst.

[@RaheemRollair]

18:53 Don’t mean to be picky, but that’s a Weird edit. This is still a very nice video.

[@saxeladude]

yo no link!? 13:00

[@randomzergling]

Palu in the thumbnail 💀

[@the_bookworm8281]

Some of my favorite awful moves are hidden away with the vanilla version of SSB4. Vanilla SSB4 Shulk is one of the most hilariously defective characters in Smash history, and his up air back then exemplifies that. The move has never had a good history of being functional, but move straight up not work when SSB4 first came out. There is also vanilla SSB4 Greninja's forward tilt. SSB4 Greninja had an unique journey, where he was heavily nerfed early on but heavily buffed later down the line, resulting in the vanilla and final versions of the character being similar in power, but very different in how they approached the game. Vanilla SSB4 Greninja's toolkit was far more polarized, with some pretty overtuned moves (up smash, up air, forward air) and some pretty awful moves (down smash, grabs, neutral B). My favorite of these awful moves was forward tilt, which used to be one of the worst moves in the game. The move used to have 9 more frames of endlag, which is really bad for a move designed to poke and whiff punish. The move also dealt less damage back then, resulting in the foot hitbox (aka where you want to hit the move) being notably weaker. One thing to note is that the body and leg hitbox had more knockback scaling back then. However, this is completely invalidated by the lower base knockback and higher endlag of the move, resulted in the body and leg hitboxes being punishable on hit at lower percents back then. This move was... really bad.

[@BlueBlur_91]

You can cancel yoshi side b by pressing special

[@Alonzone]

Is that even important?

[@kylekinganimations7008]

Leave the green screen back in 2010s KZbin bro

[@elibonham4388]

Whats up with the summoning salt ahhh intro

[@jasonfuentes3852]

If you’re not summoning salt you shouldn’t be using this song.

[@user-nf8ph1gd4d]

Music 8:11?

[@minecraftman6376]

14:53 lol someone just killed MKleo with this

[@CarbonMalite]

Omg, Zelda's nair in Ultimate. You'd think it'd be huge like Ness' but actually people fall out of it at least 1/3 of the time and it's so slow that people can actually punish you for hitting it.

[@Penguno45]

Chat whats the song that starts at 7:40 ?

[@MAJ0Magi3MACHT]

It's Killing Moon (Arranged) from Third Strike I think

[@Penguno45]

@@MAJ0Magi3MACHT ty goat

[@GameMasterWLC]

Melee Ness PK Fire and Flash were just as bad lol. Tragic character.

[@jalilfrancois7700]

You should talk about Mediocre moves

[@Rabbit_Work]

Persona 3 Type beat

[@WiiMoteGodYT]

BABYBABYBABYBABY

[@Chrisuan]

DAFT mention 📈📈📈📈📈