WE COULDN'T BREATHE! | Game of Thrones 7x6 REACTION and REVIEW | 'Beyond The Wall'

[@SpartanandPudgey]

Want to watch EARLY or access the UNCUT reaction? Join us on Patreon for Early access to episodes 7x7 & 8x1 & 8x2, 8x3 & 8x4 (EDITED & UNCUT) + 8x5 & 8x6 (UNCUT) + Histories & Lore S7 www.patreon.com/spartanandpudgey

[@darrenglover1851]

I personally really liked season 7 and 8 although the pace was increased but means there more action. Cant be cheap annimating those dragons

[@hoon_sol]

The title should say "breathe", by the way.

[@hoon_sol]

@@jayblack8132: In some cases where people are complaining, the scenes are simply asynchronous, though; that's nothing new, and can be frequently observed throughout the entire series. Didn't check to see if that's the case here or not, though.

[@hoon_sol]

@@jayblack8132: Like I said, I haven't personally checked whether it's inconsistent myself, but "hand-waving" skips of time where people travel is very common (happens throughout the entire series), and I'm not sure that isn't the case here.

[@efrensoto3273]

I have undertood you finished watching the entire series on their Patreon channel. So I can write spoiler here. The entire expedition to capture a white walker to show it Cersei and gain her support in the fight against the Night King was absurd. That was totally illogical for the following reasons: -So far there was no risk of the Night King and the white walkers crossing the wall. The wall has been around for millennia and the white walkers and the Night King have also been around for millennia and have not made it across. What has made Jon Snow and the other characters in Westeros believe that now the Night King and the white walkers will be able to cross the wall, to the point that Daenerys, Snow and the others need Cersei as an ally? No, there was simply no way the Night King and the other walkers could get past the Wall. Therefore, it was not necessary to prepare alliances with Cersei against the Night King. Everyone in Westeros could very well have carried on as they are now, ignoring the white walkers, and the Night King and the white walkers would have continued on the other side of the Wall forever. That whole idea of the expedition was nothing but a bad idea by the writers to lengthen the series so that Daenerys would not face Cersei right away, because if so, Cersei's character would have ended in this season. The writers of the series could have come up with another idea to lengthen the serie. -The only way that the Night King and the other walkers managed to cross the wall was by destroying it, thanks to the fact that they captured the Dragon Viserion. And how did the Night King capture the Dragon? The Night King captured the Dragon thanks to Jon Snow's proposed expedition to capture the white walker, to prove to Cersei that walkers exist, and thus Jon Snow gain Cersei's support to protect Westeros from a threat that does not exist. ; because there is no such threat because it was impossible for the Night King to cross the wall before capturing the Dragon. -In summary: If it had not been for the expedition to capture the white walker, the Night King would not have captured the Dragon and he would never have been able to use the Dragon to destroy the wall and cross the wall. That was all the fault of useless Jon Snow. -And yes, I understand that for the purposes of the plot it was necessary for the Night King and the other walkers to cross the wall, and the only more direct and dramatic way was to capture one of the dragons; but the scriptwriters could have thought of a more logical and reasonable reason for the expedition; for example, that Bran was still on the other side of the wall and Jon wanted to go rescue him. That would have made more sense and logic.

[@Teabagsforlife]

When Spartan kept getting bigger when he was talking about Jon Snow not being little had me in bits 🤣

[@BhBc8f8]

lol

[@wiscoqueen]

Me too! 😂😂😂😂

[@Wraiven22]

Is Spartan short? I would still think he was 😮‍💨 even if he was 5’ but now I’m curious

[@jhzwwe123]

​@@Wraiven22bro I saw their Twitter and he looked tall af, he's a true spartan lol, unless pudgey is really short which is okay, but spartan looked over 6 foot 3 tbh lol cuz in 5'8"

[@ScottyDoesntKnow69]

That line he’s too little is such sh;t modern Hollywood writing, oh Jon has to be the 6,7,8 rule for me, lol what a joke

[@brettbartlett-k3u]

I never comment on videos.. But "The ice was cracking because my mans mammoth balls were fuckin droppin on the ice" had me DYING

[@sylverwebsurfer788]

Perfect

[@Heather61776]

The white outfit Dany is wearing is one of my favorites of the series

[@yeskev]

For sure! Costume and production designers did their jobs well through the end of the series.

[@Nova03463]

It looks horrendous

[@Heather61776]

@@Nova03463 opinions

[@Nova03463]

@@Heather61776 it looks like a Pyjama and does not fit into the World of Westeros at all

[@Heather61776]

@@Nova03463 again, opinion

[@ollegnaget]

"That must be the quickest raven ever". Everyone apperently learned to teleport in season 7 so its all according to the plot!

[@jaybird8192]

LOL! They figured a Raven is too slow, so they sent a Peregrine Falcon with the message instead!

[@neospock5034]

Birdy has gone supersonic! LOL

[@716olli716]

Time goes by, we just don't see it on screen. Why would we waste episodes on travel in season 7

[@neospock5034]

@@716olli716 that's one of the weaknesses of storytelling in seasons 7 and 8... In the early seasons we mostly saw everything happen in real time. No flashbacks, no big time jumps, at least not within the same episode. If someone left a location in episode two, then we'd see them traveling in episode three, that kind of thing. It helped keep everything in the moment.

[@janhommer]

​@@neospock5034yeah, right, that's why we see Cersei and Jaime in KL in literally the first episode and then in Winterfell, like 10 minutes later, eh? 🤣

[@maloneaqua]

Imagine being Dany and losing one of your kids to save Jon just so he can run off and STILL not get on board Drogon

[@nielgregory108]

Yeah, that is something that could drive you crazy, eh?

[@annjenkins2677]

Lol I still dont understand why he just kept fighting. I'm mean once everyone was on Drogon he had every opportunity to climb on but he just kept fight and making his way further away. Almost like he wanted to just die there. Lol

[@hopemikaelson9223]

​​@@annjenkins2677It is really stupid and I'm shocked we only got a calm "Jon get on the Dragon now" from Pudgey. The first time I watched it I screamed at the TV "JON WHAT THE F*CK ARE YOU DOING?!" And the worst part is that with a bit of editing it could've been fine, we did not need that dramatic stare down between Jon and the Night King.

[@annjenkins2677]

@@hopemikaelson9223 yeah I can't believe neither one of them were like get the fuck on the dragon. Because that's exactly what I was yelling but I added " you dumb fuck where the fuck are going " Lol

[@orlog3343]

Jon knew he had to come home hurt and almost dead or else babygirl would be mad at him lol

[@toddcole1805]

All that rowing really built up Gendrys cardio

[@jbail2547]

Plus he's really excited to be in snow the first time in his life

[@C-Money1221]

Fun fact: he ran most of it on his hands using his upper body strength from YEARS of ROWING when his legs got tired.

[@beclou9832]

Shout out to Ramin Djawadi for the amazing music start to finish, the theme when the dragons arrive is so beautiful and triumphant

[@LadySophiaVelaryon]

Absolutely! The night this episode aired, that scene when Dany rode Drogon with Ramin's phenomenal music playing gave me chills.

[@nightfrost1891]

his favorite character is dany so you can tell he really puts effort into her themes

[@jmstauff601]

Everything he does is amazing. I also love his music in Iron Man and Pacific Rim. It’s so different from Game of Thrones but equally amazing!

[@stephanielomeli6950]

I got see Ramin in concert and he played the Targaryen theme on electric guitar and it was amazing!!

[@GiselaMisa]

When I saw his joy at seeing Danny leave with the 3 dragons I thought.... "Ooooh poor poor children, this will be painful!"

[@ArcRogerr]

"Bran can do something, can't he?" Yeah you'd think

[@annjenkins2677]

Um yup he does. That's how Sansa and Arya have all the info on Littlefinger.

[@orlog3343]

@@annjenkins2677bad writing excuse considering Sansa and Arya already know how much of an untrustworthy slimeball littlefinger is. No reason for them to fake fight each other when they have a million reasons to execute him as soon as they retook winterfell

[@annjenkins2677]

@@orlog3343 ok

[@gunnar4915]

@@orlog3343 True but it’s fun watching them troll him

[@viziontrex]

​@@orlog3343without mentioning Littlefinger's IQ reduction by at least 40 points following season 6. Just a terribly managed character

[@filipklanjcic867]

when Pudgey said "NOR NOR NOR NOR NOR NOR NOR NOR NOR NOR NOR NOR" i felt that

[@bigjavo36]

I love that Jon's answer to everything amounts to "1v1 me right now! Bitch you won't!"

[@BhBc8f8]

I mean it's not a bad plan when you're great with a sword.

[@SnailHatan]

@@BhBc8f8it’s a bad plan when you can’t take on thousands of undead with a sword. He acts like the NK is just as dumb as him

[@withxoutxlife]

The best part of this show in these later seasons is definitely the dragons. Watching the cinematography of the dragons in action is always something to behold. Glad you two are still enjoying yourselves, it makes the reaction enjoyable.

[@riolkin]

Yes, in spite of this shows flaws it still has the best "live action" dragons I've ever seen.

[@CASantos]

Also the wardrobe, cgi & cinematography etc. Some absolutely gorgeous shots in S8 especially. Basically everything but the plot 😅

[@clownafra6088]

That's what D&D were counting on. Screw the writing, let's make an action flick. After 6 seasons they knew the fans loved those dragons, so they used them to get fan reactions and bring in fans who didn't care about the show or books. They just like action and shit blowing up. It turned into WWE. I agree with Puggy on it was time. It's just how we got there. We lost people throughout this series but 10 stupid things didn't have to happen first. Thoros was one of my favorites and Benjin was a fake Cold Hands for fan reaction, but they were B and C characters. If the show got more popular after killing Drogo and Ned, the could have killed Jorah or Tormund.

[@jesses5463]

@@clownafra6088 I only got 30 minutes into the D&D movie. Don't recall any dragons, but perhaps they come later.

[@_justinblizzle]

​@@clownafra6088people screeched for so long how this show was only about "tits & dragons" and then when they give you just tits and dragons everyone complains lol i feel so bad for D&D and what a daunting task it must've been to finish this series only to have all these people shit on their work. Those guys were tireddd you could tell 😆

[@Mic-Mak]

1:09 *Dany was absolutely raised as a Targaryen.* Just because she grew up in exile doesn't negate that. Her brother drilled it into her, and she heard about her family from other people. That's like saying Theon wasn't raised as Greyjoy because he grew up in Winterfell, and Ned & Robert weren't raised as Stark & Baratheon because they grew up in the Eyrie. When you are from a prominent House, growing up away from home doesn't erase your family heritage and upbringing. You are reminded of it constantly.

[@niccologregorutti]

You're right, however Theon and Ned are not exactly what a Greyjoy and a Stark should be according to their family's history

[@Mic-Mak]

@@niccologregorutti Care to elaborate? Especially on Ned. Being part of a family doesn't mean you all have the exact same personality and value everything equally. Ned still subscribed to the Stark values, and Theon was proud of being a Greyjoy, even if there are Ironborn values that he seem to not embrace. Family values and country values don't necessarily overlap. Also you could say the same thing about Yara/Asha, even though she grew up in her home with her family. In the books, she wants to rule the Iron Islands, but her vision is to surrender and make peace with the North, so they can unite and beat the Lannister. She understands that taking over Westeros and taking over the North is folly! Would her father have done the same? No. Does that mean she's not a true Greyjoy or a true Ironborn? Also, no.

[@lalamagnoliagyrl]

Absolutely the BEST explanation of anyone! People will ALWAYS be who they are. It is their choice. And you can have all the best council or help along the way, but in the end, you are who you are.

[@niccologregorutti]

@@Mic-Mak Aeron,Balon and Asha follow the Ironborn tradition,they pray the drowned god,their way of life is pillaging and ravaging. Theon on the other hand doesn't seem to care about the tradition of the Iron Islands,his pride comes from being part of a noble family and the son of a Great Lord,the fact that his family is the Greyjoy of the Iron Islands doesn't seem to be that important to him until he comes back home. Ned was raised in the Vale,and he is completely different from Rickard,Lyanna,Brandon, and the old Lords of Winterfell,much more ambitious,wild and cruel. On the other hand it's clear the influence that Jon Arryn had on him,Ned is very honourable,honest and chivalrous,even though his real family was much more hotblooded, and wild. Ned resembles more the Arryn than the Starks of the past,except for him praying the old gods and passing the sentence himself

[@noneofyourbeeswax01]

Indeed: Dany was absolutely NOT "raised as a slave"

[@RonanXI]

Pudgy saying no in her Australian accent is the only reason I’m subscribed

[@Vampagan]

"NOERRR!!!"

[@sequoia1171]

I thought they were from New Zealand

[@plasticfoodz6991]

it's like "NAURR!"

[@yousmelllikeabaka584]

and Spartan's "YUCK"

[@mgp1203]

I'm Aussie. They're definitely from Australia. Spartan has the greek/serb influenced Aussie dialect. @@sequoia1171

[@LegenDaeria]

Dany spent the first 5 years of her life in the house of a nobleman in Bravos, or so she believed, because it is vague in the books and it creates a big deal about Danny's identity(but that's another story.) She remembers it as "the house with the red door and the lemontree outside her window". When her protector died and Robert 's reign was established in Westeros, she and Vicerys were kicked out of the house with the red door and they traveled along all the Free Cities, to find allies or hospitality. That's why Vicerys was called "The beggar King". They lived in the streets for 8 years as beggars, hunted by Robert's assassins, or that's what Vicerys believed. He was telling Dany stories about Westeros, Dragons, Kings and knights, but he was abusing her every time he got mad. They were so hungry, that he had to sell his mother's crown, to get money and food and after that he totally snapped. After these 8 years they found hospitality for six months in the house of Illyrio Mopatis and we know the rest. In the books it is not the Iron Throne Daenerys wants. All she wants is to go back to "the house with the Red door and the lemontree outside her window", witch symbolizes the warm, happy, safe childhood she had never Known. She literally searched for it checking the doors in Meereen. Her heart longs for the family and love she never had, the belonging, the companionship and that is the ideal she's been working towards her ASOIAF arc. I strongly recommend KZbin theory videos about the House with the Red Door-In Deep Geek makes an excellent job. (I am not him, I am a fan of him)

[@xxfutureisnowxx]

"They're gonna revive the dragon!" "Noooooorrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!"

[@penguin8711]

It would have made sense if Dany was at the wall prepared to come pick them up as part of the plan.

[@rsenalsucks]

There ya go.. but that’s just you putting more logical thought into it than the writers did.

[@hopemikaelson9223]

That would've solved like 80% of the issues in this episode. Specially because they planned this stupid plan at Dragonsone and it was Tyrion's brilliant idea. I guess you could say he didn't really care about sending Jon to his death and didn't expect Danny to go running after him 😂 Ah what the hell, it sucks no matter how you look at it.

[@penguin8711]

@hopemikaelson9223 ehh I kinda liked it even with the obvious flaws.. but like the original plan of Tyrions is so idiotic. Every plan he has failed.. like just fire him at this point. And tyrions first bad idea was leaving Daario in essos. At least he gave Dany good advice.

[@queenxx1690]

it made no sense in first place

[@Knightowl1980]

Or at the very least they could have taken a raven with them and then gendry wouldn’t have had to run back

[@jussieeeeyunnv]

emilia clarke as dany is the single best casting all time. what an incredible woman emilia is. icon

[@seancarroll5803]

one of the worst characters in the show and this is the whole show im talking about, not just the last few seasons

[@junemichaels885]

emilia single handily made dany most popular character on earth. incredible really

[@fionasawtye543]

@@seancarroll5803 you fuming bro dany is most beloved in the world. a staggering gap to second place in this franchise.

[@JonnyQuest64]

Ignorant take

[@gemmagutana3998]

@@JonnyQuest64 Even if not number 1 on your list. she is up there for millions of us. i would also have her as best ever. and every day that goes by makes this more obvious. resonated with the entire world. and to say emilia is an icon is an understatement!

[@Mic-Mak]

22:20 Although I don't like anything about this mission and its execution, Spartan's childlike excitement is always a delight!

[@ARD-lk5pr]

Same. I actually enjoy their reactions to the show at this point more than I enjoyed the show itself.

[@THEHOLYGAMERR]

@@TheReDeeMeR1988huh?

[@joes1755]

@@TheReDeeMeR1988huh

[@nordboya1656]

@@TheReDeeMeR1988 huh?

[@monkeyman1350]

@@TheReDeeMeR1988 huh

[@winesquivel8245]

Ah, Beyond the Wall, the episode where they invented teleportation, where they taught the wights to swim and where it was revealed that there's a hardware store beyond the wall.

[@noneofyourbeeswax01]

Isn't Eastwatch a port? Exactly where one would expect to find heavy chains? And wights don't swim, but there's nothing stopping them just trudging along the lake bed - it's not as though they are going to drown.

[@seancarroll5803]

"Can they swim" "No" "Good" I guess D&D Kinda forgot

[@mike90317]

Beyond the Wall Depot. Open 24/7

[@jbail2547]

Teleporting existed before you just had to be rich to use it like varys and littlefinger . By season 7 they developed the technology to teleport people a lot cheaper so everyone could do it. Also really developed the plot armour this season, Thank god as our heroes have got a lot more stupid and that would have got them killed in earlier seasons.

[@lanepotts1046]

You don’t swim on ice you walk on it

[@natb9919]

Dany may seem like she's being difficult with Jon but if you notice she's given him everything he's asked for even though he hasn't once offered her anything in return. He refused to bend the knee and she still allowed him to mine the dragonglass and offered her own men and resources to help him. He refused to bend the knee again in the cave and she still valued his opinion, trusted him when he asked her to and agreed to the wight hunt meaning she was open to helping him fight his war if he brought one back. Then she brought all 3 of her dragons to save his life when she could've just as easily left him to die. If you think about it politically, she really had no logical reason to save him. Tyrion was technically right. From her perspective as a Queen, Jon's claiming himself as King of one of her kingdoms, refusing to bend the knee or help her win her war so just leaving him to die would be the smart political choice to win her war as quick and easy as possible and gain control of the North. Jon knows this too, but she didn't. Then he got her dragon killed and she didn't blame him for it, instead she tried to stop him feeling guilty about it then gave him her word that she would help fight his war with the Night King. All up until this point Jon has offered her absolutely nothing in return for anything she's given him and she gave up asking him to bend the knee in exchange for her help an episode ago (she never even mentioned it when agreeing to the wight hunt) so I think she has been more than reasonable tbh, even if she comes across as cold because she's trying to protect herself and Jon knows this. He knows she's been the only one to make any sacrifices. That's why he bends the knee even after she gave him everything he asked for. All of this is just happening in the subtext of the story and not the actual dialogue which is annoying because it's really not obvious unless you pick each scene apart. It's one of the many reasons people just couldn't understand this storyline when it aired, myself included.

[@awadoma2702]

How was it Jon's fault that her dragon died? It was Tyrion's plan for them to go get proof of the white walkers and Dany approved the plan. Jon was covering the others all getting on the Dragon and nothing Jon did caused the Dragon's death The group were still in the process of climbing up when the Dragon was brought down. None of them were expecting that the Dragons were in any immediate danger while flying around at the time. Then when they realized the danger Jon told Dany to leave him and go before she lost another dragon Everyone involved made choices that at the time they were making said choices felt it was worth the risk The Dragon was a casualty of war

[@hokagedlo6133]

@@williamshelton4318 the blood relation thing? 🤣🤣 marrying another targaryen is the best prospect she could possibly wish for.

[@johnivory3245]

Agreed

[@baronhomer1]

Um shes trying to recruit him as a ally.why would he give her anything?

[@johnivory3245]

@@baronhomer1 nope. He needs her.

[@itss_nattyj]

Spartan is adorable with how giddy he got. 😂I’ve never seen him so happy.

[@toomuchsauce5599]

Forreals its so infectious, to think of all the times I used to troll him at the very beginning, I take it all back

[@tylerbrown9339]

The change of emotion from Dani showing up to the night king grabbing the ice spear…. 😂

[@rd30000]

35:18😂😂😂😂 I was cracking up when Spartan kept getting big.

[@rustygear447]

LOL Gendry ran to the wall, sent a raven to Dragon Stone, Danny fly her dragons all the way back to North of the wall, all that in less than 1 night. They must have some super sonic ravens and dragons.

[@Springheel01]

Add to that the fact that Dany has never been to the wall, so how did she even know where to go? How long would it take her, flying around randomly, to spot a group of wights from the air (given that they just look like a dark mass even from camera height). And why the heck hasn't she made some kind of apparatus to hold on to? How many hours in a row is she supposed to be able to grip these six inch spines while wearing gloves?

[@rustygear447]

@@Springheel01 I'm willing to let that point go because the Hound did highlight the mountain that look like arrow head.

[@ms_scribbles]

@@Springheel01 It's a giant flippin' wall that runs completely across the north of the continent. It's rather hard to miss. You guys are starting to grasp at straws finding more reasons to hate the show.

[@baronnuuke7821]

@@ms_scribbles Yeah but once you get to the wall, how big is beyond the wall ? it seems huge with lakes, mountains, caves and plains...There is no way someone not familiar can locate anything with that weather and without any cold protection or ways to properly grab on the dragon

[@cavrence]

And the fact that dragons can’t go over the wall because of the magic, but you know D&D just kinda forgot

[@mascan7905]

After 7 seasons, I was used to seeing almost anything on this show. Flaming zombie bear still caught me a bit off guard.

[@AndyMatts44]

Apparently "@matthewanderson2162" is the Hound's KZbin handle.

[@_justinblizzle]

😆😆 ... that was a "big fxcker"

[@abeldnite]

an 11 feet tall 1700 lbs real life monstrosity but also undead and burning is peak horror

[@rahilrameez8635]

" Jon and him are always having stare offs , it's beautiful " Good Time's lol .

[@BlackDeathThrash]

you 2 are funny AF, you were both catching flies quite a few times this episode. Spartan almost lost his boyfriend.

[@kiana685]

Spartan’s reaction to Dany arriving is my favorite part of this video.

[@Pelagion98]

I remember when this came out, everyone was laughing at how silly and cliche this episode was. Especially how it basically shrunk Westeros to the size of New York. Not to mention how Jon fell into a frozen lake and lived.

[@ARD-lk5pr]

Aye, especially when you think back to those conversations with Thorne in S1 about how deadly the cold was in winter north of the Wall. "You don't know cold" LOL!

[@mattybob12310]

nothing to see here just Gendry running 30 miles in half a day in heavy snow, and Dany and the Raven covering a 3,000 mile round trip in a day :'D Edit: Also, this is where the show takes a random turn to a 'Men are Stupid' vibe, even though Tyrion, Little Finger and Varys are 3 of the smartest people on the planet at this point in time.

[@MFBloosh]

Littlefinger's not stupid. He just didn't know that the Starks had a Bran. Bran is kind of a cheat code. If there was no Bran, then who would be there to call out Littlefinger on his bullshit? No one.

[@Leo_ofRedKeep]

Gendry Maratheon was the best joke of Season 7.

[@CrazyWork25]

Tyrion becomes a dick joke specialist

[@dvo1245]

Don't forget the Night Kings magical swimming zombies who happened to have 3 massive chains to raise the dragon out of the lake 😂

[@janhommer]

​@@williamshelton4318LF is blinded by his desire for her when it comes to Sansa. All these characters are only human after all and being smart under certain circumstances and with regard to certain things doesn't make 'em immune to being complete idiots when it comes to others (and it should probably make me way more mad than it already does that in times of movies / TV being full of super heroes and Mary Sues and people complaining (!) about that all the time, the same people still can't appreciate GoT, not noticing how different it is from those other things!), just one of many, many examples for "fans" not getting the point at all 🙄

[@aquarius489]

Sad to see your GoT journey is nearing the end but it's been so fun rewatching with you both. The discussions before and after make experience even richer and you guys are a top-tier reaction channel. Would love to see you guys tackle Chernobyl, The Glory, or whatever series you'd have good banter about, like this one.

[@Saphthings]

Spartan is so angry about the height comment, and pudgey is laughing about it XD

[@Natalia-ll4pz]

31:04 I understand that you want to see Jon on the dragon, but Rhaegal would never come back for him, he has no connection with Jon. Remember that dragons don't form a bond with a human simply because they have Targaryen blood. Drogon didn't immediately allow Daenerys to ride him. D&D kinda forgot about it in the next seasons 🫠

[@timmcgrath8030]

It's not about loving cruelty, it's that this episode was so full of plot holes and the whole mission was so incredibly stupid that it felt like it betrayed everything that made the show great. P.S. Arya was so incredibly out of line and basically downright cruel to Sansa this episode

[@boki1693]

As I said before, so why don't you complain about the plot holes BEFORE the show passed the books?

[@reddeaddave4675]

@@boki1693 i'm curious , what plot holes?

[@efrensoto3273]

@@reddeaddave4675 The entire expedition to capture a white walker to show it Cersei and gain her support in the fight against the Night King was absurd. That was totally illogical for the following reasons: -So far there was no risk of the Night King and the white walkers crossing the wall. The wall has been around for millennia and the white walkers and the Night King have also been around for millennia and have not made it across. What has made Jon Snow and the other characters in Westeros believe that now the Night King and the white walkers will be able to cross the wall, to the point that Daenerys, Snow and the others need Cersei as an ally? No, there was simply no way the Night King and the other walkers could get past the Wall. Therefore, it was not necessary to prepare alliances with Cersei against the Night King. Everyone in Westeros could very well have carried on as they are now, ignoring the white walkers, and the Night King and the white walkers would have continued on the other side of the Wall forever. That whole idea of the expedition was nothing but a bad idea by the writers to lengthen the series so that Daenerys would not face Cersei right away, because if so, Cersei's character would have ended in this season. The writers of the series could have come up with another idea to lengthen the serie. -The only way that the Night King and the other walkers managed to cross the wall was by destroying it, thanks to the fact that they captured the Dragon Viserion. And how did the Night King capture the Dragon? The Night King captured the Dragon thanks to Jon Snow's proposed expedition to capture the white walker, to prove to Cersei that walkers exist, and thus Jon Snow gain Cersei's support to protect Westeros from a threat that does not exist. ; because there is no such threat because it was impossible for the Night King to cross the wall before capturing the Dragon. -In summary: If it had not been for the expedition to capture the white walker, the Night King would not have captured the Dragon and he would never have been able to use the Dragon to destroy the wall and cross the wall. That was all the fault of useless Jon Snow. -And yes, I understand that for the purposes of the plot it was necessary for the Night King and the other walkers to cross the wall, and the only more direct and dramatic way was to capture one of the dragons; but the scriptwriters could have thought of a more logical and reasonable reason for the expedition; for example, that Bran was still on the other side of the wall and Jon wanted to go rescue him. That would have made more sense and logic.

[@efrensoto3273]

Yes, The entire expedition to capture a white walker to show it Cersei and gain her support in the fight against the Night King was absurd. That was totally illogical for the following reasons: -So far there was no risk of the Night King and the white walkers crossing the wall. The wall has been around for millennia and the white walkers and the Night King have also been around for millennia and have not made it across. What has made Jon Snow and the other characters in Westeros believe that now the Night King and the white walkers will be able to cross the wall, to the point that Daenerys, Snow and the others need Cersei as an ally? No, there was simply no way the Night King and the other walkers could get past the Wall. Therefore, it was not necessary to prepare alliances with Cersei against the Night King. Everyone in Westeros could very well have carried on as they are now, ignoring the white walkers, and the Night King and the white walkers would have continued on the other side of the Wall forever. That whole idea of the expedition was nothing but a bad idea by the writers to lengthen the series so that Daenerys would not face Cersei right away, because if so, Cersei's character would have ended in this season. The writers of the series could have come up with another idea to lengthen the serie. -The only way that the Night King and the other walkers managed to cross the wall was by destroying it, thanks to the fact that they captured the Dragon Viserion. And how did the Night King capture the Dragon? The Night King captured the Dragon thanks to Jon Snow's proposed expedition to capture the white walker, to prove to Cersei that walkers exist, and thus Jon Snow gain Cersei's support to protect Westeros from a threat that does not exist. ; because there is no such threat because it was impossible for the Night King to cross the wall before capturing the Dragon. -In summary: If it had not been for the expedition to capture the white walker, the Night King would not have captured the Dragon and he would never have been able to use the Dragon to destroy the wall and cross the wall. That was all the fault of useless Jon Snow. -And yes, I understand that for the purposes of the plot it was necessary for the Night King and the other walkers to cross the wall, and the only more direct and dramatic way was to capture one of the dragons; but the scriptwriters could have thought of a more logical and reasonable reason for the expedition; for example, that Bran was still on the other side of the wall and Jon wanted to go rescue him. That would have made more sense and logic.

[@MariotheJedi]

It’s all subjective at the end of the day

[@bambamsboys7394]

“The ice was breaking cause my mans balls were dropping on it” just caught this during my second time watching this video haha… You guys crack me up! Love your channel. Good luck and be well ♥️✌🏻♥️

[@Mic-Mak]

37:54 The fact that you were emotionally unaffected by Rickon's death, or the Sandsnakes's death is, to me, a testament to the show's poor writing. Those deaths did not land the way they were supposed to land for most of the audience. They didn't even land for the characters because we never see the Starks mourn Rickon, or even Dany mourn Viserion in S8. It's very unrealistic, not just to the show but to real life.

[@RPCentral7]

I love how at 23:50 Spartan goes from saying "I love the Hound!" to "oh, you're an idiot dude" 30 seconds later 😂😂

[@Andre_APM]

Dany, Jon and Tyrion have enough XP that they put it all into plot armor and fast travel abilities but at an intense intelligence debuff

[@farouk8578]

Arya forgetting she served tywin and missed the opportunity to kill him is one symptom of the fall of got imo

[@bujin1977]

The passage of time in season 7 was absurd, and it was so evident in this episode. Gendry had to run back to Eastwatch - not sure how far that was, but certainly at least few hours of running. Then they had to compose a message and send the raven. The raven had to fly around 2000 miles to Dragonstone, then Dany had to fly that 2000 miles + however far north of the wall they are (and somehow find Jon and the others having never been there before), and all of that happened in the space of a few hours overnight...

[@delg1211]

...and the payoff was still worth the absurdity 😜

[@kalecrystal4054]

That "You're the fastest!" line to Gendry makes me Laugh aloud EVERY time!!!! Like, what???? You guys can now re- watch HOTD with greater appreciation for the Targaryen Family lineage that is noted at the start of House of the Dragon episode 1. It is pretty cool to see all of the people who led to Dany and Jon. I really hope they eventually cover the Blackfyre rebellion too!

[@alzer6467]

ha, he only met the guy 20 minutes earlier.

[@ARD-lk5pr]

@@alzer6467 They must have cut out the scene where they had a foot race to determine who was fastest LOL!

[@arobin6695]

and Gendry's probably never run through (or even seen?) snow in his entire life

[@AndyMatts44]

@@alzer6467 - I love how everyone makes fun of the time compression, as if we need to watch them on the boats, sitting around for days while at sea, and then getting ready at the Wall, or the dead waiting for possibly days before realizing the ice was thick enough, in order for the time to have passed. He knew him for longer than "20 minutes," he saw him in the battle when they grabbed the wight. Did he show some good burst running out to ambush the dead? Jon's a seasoned battle commander. He can make a rough assessment of his speed. What would be his basis for thinking anyone else is faster? Except for Tormund, he didn't know any of them longer than Gendry. Just based on Gendry being the only one besides Jon who isn't an older f--k, you can probably make that guess and be right.

[@jaybird8192]

Dumb and Dumber edited out the part where Gendry informed Jon, he won Gold in the 40 yard dash, when he was in highschool. That's why Jon knew: He was the fastest!

[@jefferybarnett6056]

After you've had time to digest this episode....ask yourself three questions. 1) where did the walkers get the chains from ? 2) did the whites plan all along to get a dragon and this was just part of the plan? and last but not least, 3) if the walkers can't swim...who swam down with these crazy heavy chains and attached them to the dragon? That will eat at your brain of a couple days.. LOL

[@rancchan]

I love it, I've never seen Spartan that emotional 💗

[@Jerome-y3o]

Your reactions are awesome. Love you guys. All the way from South Africa. Big shout out to both of you😊

[@keanancupido]

Ahh hey fellow South African! I'm from CPT!

[@lu-cardowashinggreen1278]

My fellow South African, I'm from cpt

[@ig_.122]

Hy fellow citizens I'm from JHB

[@2jz-boi]

This is where the show just goes completely off the rails

[@VoloMalVor]

It started from season 5

[@bobdonda]

I think fully off the rails is next season, but it's a train wreck in progress the whole time

[@Al-ji4gd]

It started veering off the rails during season 5. Even the faults in the railway line started to appear in season 2.

[@2jz-boi]

@@Al-ji4gd i think it was pretty solid seasons 1-4, 5-6 was a real dip in quality, then 7-8 is just digital cancer

[@noneofyourbeeswax01]

How long - if ever - do you think it will take S&P to notice? Given that they describe this episode as "a masterpiece", I'm guessing never.

[@fragilejem123]

THANK YOU FOR yet another awesome reaction! When Spartan said "I wish I could cry" I felt that 😂 I also really enjoyed the zoom in edits, it felt hilarious for some reason.

[@traviscue2099]

This episode is such a weird peice of TV. Every aspect of this episode is amazing.. outside of the clear "Why!?". It's shot amazingly/the cgi is stunning/the acting is amazing/the music is perfect.. But none of this makes any logical sense, from Gendry who's never been in a cold climate all his life able to run that distance back in that time.. Danny getting the raven, then flying in record speed, and also having cold resistance that high up in the air.. To the clear there's 0 point in doing this.. I think the show needed a big action set piece for the season to close so they were pushed into doing something stupid to apease the network. And to be fair aside from episode 9 of season 1, they have done the epic battle for almost every season. The biggest reason I want to see the books finished is to see what GRRM does in this section of the story.. I assume the ending will be very similar, but this part is so fucking random and out of place.

[@Fauss]

I promise you that this "mission" will never be in the books :)

[@mvprime8]

To appease the network? Mate, the network and everyone else would've loved to have more seasons and more episodes, it was completely Benioff & Weiss who were done with the show and wanted to move on to other things (well good luck, who wants them now?). They wanted to get to the end so everything happens in 2x speed and any pesky logic that would slow things down or make things impossible is thrown away.

[@traviscue2099]

@@mvprime8 It's far more complicated than that. Likely started during season 4, and we saw it in season 5. Season 7/8 were just an extention of the issues starting way back. A network wanting more episodes/seasons isn't always a good thing. D&D are at fault for part of this, but they also brought us seasons 1-4. Which are incredible seasons. The books were still in play during season 5, so the books running out isn't the issue.

[@traviscue2099]

@@Fauss I think we'll have another reason for them to either be at the wall, or go over it. Since Danny losing one of her Dragons and becoming an ice dragon seems like something GRRM would write

[@usgreth]

@@traviscue2099 I mostly defend the show from the haters but this episode does seem to have been written to answer someones question of "How do we give the Night King a dragon?". If the books eventually have a dragon turn this way, I hope it is made a little less obvious.

[@winesquivel8245]

Cersei is petty because she doesn't believe ice zombies are coming to destroy them? Would you believe it? An episode ago, Dany doesn't believe it either. Give Cersei a break.

[@Shaesi.]

Also as a reminder, Ned didn't believe it either. He killed the deserted who saw White Walkers and thought he was a mad man.

[@hepunk]

Take a shot everytime "this ripped me", "what a legend", and "what a weapon" is said. hahaha

[@Mic-Mak]

37:08 Although I'm sure it's not the only reason, I think _part_ of why you feel this way is because you're bingeing the show, and you're so into the spectacle that you have a blind spot for what's not working. When one watches the show week to week and takes the time to think it over and engage with the discourse around each episode, you're far more likely to see the gaping problems. Not long ago, I binge-watched *_The Good Wife_* for the first time. After a couple of seasons, I started reading reviews after every 1 or 2 episodes on the AV Club. They made me realize something that I had yet to pick up, which is that 2 main characters who interacted all the time in the past, had stopped interacting after 10+ episodes, because allegedly, the actors couldn't stand each other anymore. Once I noticed it, I couldn't unsee it, and indeed it caused a lot of narrative issues. I had felt that the quality had gone down past S5, but I missed a lot of the signs, in part because I was bingeing, but probably also because I was watching it for the first time, and wasn't engaging in deep critical thought after every episode.

[@natb9919]

This is very true, I notice people who binge watched the show don't have much of a problem with the final 2 seasons and I think one of the main reasons is the amount of time we waited between seasons. Especially the 2 years between S7&8, most people were already disappointed with S7 so to get those final 6 episodes we got in S8 just felt like a major insult. The community aspect around a show is a big factor too, like you point out, and GOT's community aspect online was huge at the time. Engaging in the discussion of the show or even just reading it after the fact can definitely change your watching experience of a show. For me I've found it's best to stay out of fandom discussion places because more often than not it ruins my watching experience of the show. Especially when there are fan wars or "teams" that everyone fights over. It's so exhausting when you just wanna discuss something you enjoy.

[@janhommer]

If someone's already going in with a negative attitude and has nothing better to do you mean. I watched the show an episode a week and a season a year back then and I didn't notice most of the flaws people pointed out (as far as that's even actually what they are, I mean). The point of a show is to be enjoyed and if it manages to do that, logic flaws / plotholes or not, it can't actually be that bad or (!) badly written, can it? (Especially (!) if people binging it as one, minus the ridiculously high anticiparion and expectations it couldn't possibly live up to, are obviously enjoying it MORE!)

[@Golladan]

@@janhommer Something can be bad and still be enjoyable (see Sharknado). That doesn't make it not bad.

[@janhommer]

@@Golladan Actually, it "kinda" does, yes (I mean, people are even discussing whether one should keep calling "The Room" a bad movie when so many people enjoy it so much and that's pretty much the most extreme example of "so bad it's good" one could think of; the fact that it's unintentionally (!) one of the most hilarious comedies doesn't mean that's not what it is; had Monty Python done something like that, people would have unironically praised it as hilarious). I mean how the f do you define "bad" in a movie / TV show if not as a lack of enjoyabilty, doesn't really make sense. Don't tell me it's 'cause it's got plot holes, as if you don't find those in pretty much every show / movie (if you don't have anything better to do than actively look for them). And all that's not even taking into account that they're by no means enjoying it in a "so bad it's good" kind of way, as unintenitonally funny or something, but are genuinely intrigued by the plot, the twists etc., so...

[@Golladan]

@@janhommer I mean, "so bad it's good" is still bad. It's right there in the name. I guess it's all subjective. So what makes something good or bad?

[@sylverwebsurfer788]

I couldn’t handle it when Viserion was as taken down. I screamed like Ellaria Sand did when Oberyn died

[@Lue_eye77]

realistic doesn't equal cruel. Loses are meaningless if they weren't realistic. I wouldn't like it even if all of them were killed illogically. But I hate it when they do somethings extremely unrealistic.

[@baron7755]

Imagine how long they were on that rock in the middle the lake: they marched for days, so lets say it took Gendry 1 day to run with his superhuman stamina, then the raven from the wall to Dragonstone lets pretened it only took 2 weeks, then Dany on the Dragan which is stronger and faster than a crow but still has several hundred miles to fly....

[@determinedsprinter]

When Dany said "he's too little for me" she was being defensive because Tyrion saw thru her, knowing that not only was John interested in her but that she was interested in John. Hence the reason she was stressing abt John risking his life going beyond the wall. lol and even tho she said he's to little for me defensively Tyrion knew she liked him lol. Her actions proved how she really felt about him as opposed to her words lol

[@efrensoto3273]

The entire expedition to capture a white walker to show it Cersei and gain her support in the fight against the Night King was absurd. That was totally illogical for the following reasons: -So far there was no risk of the Night King and the white walkers crossing the wall. The wall has been around for millennia and the white walkers and the Night King have also been around for millennia and have not made it across. What has made Jon Snow and the other characters in Westeros believe that now the Night King and the white walkers will be able to cross the wall, to the point that Daenerys, Snow and the others need Cersei as an ally? No, there was simply no way the Night King and the other walkers could get past the Wall. Therefore, it was not necessary to prepare alliances with Cersei against the Night King. Everyone in Westeros could very well have carried on as they are now, ignoring the white walkers, and the Night King and the white walkers would have continued on the other side of the Wall forever. That whole idea of ​​the expedition was nothing but a bad idea by the writers to lengthen the series so that Daenerys would not face Cersei right away, because if so, Cersei's character would have ended in this season. The writers of the series could have come up with another idea to lengthen the serie. -The only way that the Night King and the other walkers managed to cross the wall was by destroying it, thanks to the fact that they captured the Dragon Viserion. And how did the Night King capture the Dragon? The Night King captured the Dragon thanks to Jon Snow's proposed expedition to capture the white walker, to prove to Cersei that walkers exist, and thus Jon Snow gain Cersei's support to protect Westeros from a threat that does not exist. ; because there is no such threat because it was impossible for the Night King to cross the wall before capturing the Dragon. -In summary: If it had not been for the expedition to capture the white walker, the Night King would not have captured the Dragon and he would never have been able to use the Dragon to destroy the wall and cross the wall. That was all the fault of useless Jon Snow. -And yes, I understand that for the purposes of the plot it was necessary for the Night King and the other walkers to cross the wall, and the only more direct and dramatic way was to capture one of the dragons; but the scriptwriters could have thought of a more logical and reasonable reason for the expedition; for example, that Bran was still on the other side of the wall and Jon wanted to go rescue him. That would have made more sense and logic.

[@walterrutherford8321]

The one thing that always bothered me about this episode is that if the White Walkers can’t swim then how did they get four heavy chains on the dragon under the ice?

[@MegaJSK123]

The Night King just scored himself a rare Blue Eyes Wight Dragon. 😅

[@williamerazo3921]

10000 pts for you 😊

[@waylonmercy1533]

I like the part where the night king decided to spear the smaller dragon 500 feet in the air. Instead of the bigger dragon laying down right in front of him with people riding the dragon

[@Jon.A.Scholt]

Gendry: Westeros Marathon Champion

[@GranFelicia]

I found you two not long ago and I have to say watching GoT through your eyes is an absolute joy and a lot of laughs (and tears Pudgey!!). I haven't reached this point yet; just started S5, but I wanted to hopefully have you two see this comment and know that you're doing a fab job, love you two, can't wait to catch up to where you are now in the postings.

[@SpartanandPudgey]

thank you! we are glad you're enjoying along with us 🙏🏼

[@Mic-Mak]

9:23 _Indisputable evidence that Sansa was in on all of the Ned-murdering fun times. [...] Sansa here acts like Arya having this letter is somehow worrying. It’s not. It’s really not. Robb and Catelyn got that letter and they were just like “well…looks like Cersei has Sansa and is making her write stuff.” The drama there was that Sansa was a hostage, not that Sansa betrayed her family. It’s bloody obvious._ _Yes, Arya. Yes, they did force Sansa to do it. It’s not any less duress because they didn’t get the knife out right then and put it to her throat. They had your father in their dungeons. I don’t get this plot. I really don’t. Is anyone supposed to sympathise with Arya? Is anyone supposed to think she has a point? Her arguments fall to pieces on the show’s own canon. Yet Sansa is acting as though this is supposed to be damning. Best I can come up with is that the writers wanted these two at odds and couldn’t think of any other way to get there. So they subjected us all to this crap._ *-TURTLE PACED*

[@Xenomorphasized]

Doesn't matter anyway since this argument is never brought up again after Littlefinger dies, leading us to assume that they were fake arguing? Since when Littlefinger gets called out they both act like they knew what he was up to the whole time. This really makes no sense.

[@psychedelicpegasus7587]

I agree. It's not the best writing. If I was generous and looked at it from a character motivated perspective, while as an adult Sansa might understand she wasn't at fault, she might still carry guilt from that time. Imagine the years of thinking, "What could I have done differently to save father?". It's natural to internalise these feelings when grieving. Arya is saying everything that Sansa may have thought about herself many times over. It doesn't mean Arya IS right, but I'm sure hearing someone else say those things would hurt. Arya could also be interrogating Sansa to see her reactions and get to the truth. Anger is also a part of the grieving process, so it makes sense that Arya would feel angry and maybe also guilty for similar reasons to Sansa. Both have been in survival mode for years and I'd argue they haven't really had time to grieve for Ned, Robb or Catelyn, or to reflect on the traumatic events that brought them back together. Littlefinger is relying on confusion, hurt feelings and misunderstandings to push them apart and keep him in control.

[@annjenkins2677]

​@@Xenomorphasizedthey do know what Littlefinger is up to because of Bran. He tells both Sansa and Arya about what happened during both their journeys.

[@annjenkins2677]

Sorry I missed the part when you said we were to assume they were both fake fighting. Sorry about that.

[@Mic-Mak]

@@psychedelicpegasus7587 Robb & Catelyn didn't have that reaction at all when they read the letter, though. I could potentially understand S1 Arya being bad at Sansa for that letter, but not grown up Arya.

[@keanancupido]

32:59 welp, you're right there Spartan. It is literally not possible to kill a dragon like this. The writers just thought it would be cool for the night king to have a dragon. Also, in the books the dragons aren't able to go over the wall💀💀

[@Noone91875]

Yes! Silverwing disobeyed alysanne whenever she tries to go beyond the wall!

[@th3mightyeagle417]

There also isnt a night king in the books iirc. The white walkers exist but in a very different way

[@keanancupido]

@Joseph-- Please read the novels and Fire and Blood and you'll see what I mean 💀💀

[@keanancupido]

@@Noone91875 yes exactly😭

[@drrohanjacob]

I never understood how the whole zombie dragon worked. How did they get the dragon out of the pool. How did they ever turn the dragon? Didn't viserion catch fire as he went down. U can't raise the dead if they were burnt.

[@elliebelliewatermellie155]

I remember yelling at the hound after he threw the second rock lmao I was like noooooooo

[@stacywhisenant6242]

Arya and the viewers forget that Sansa was imprisoned in the Red Keep. She played courtesies to try and bargain for her father's life . She had no protectors at all.

[@justdan9264]

Rewatching this episode gives me a migraine and PTSD

[@Hero_Of_Old]

Its the worst episode of the show for me.

[@ms_scribbles]

Then....don't watch it?

[@justdan9264]

@@ms_scribbles I don't want to, but eh intrusive thoughts ig

[@JustAway9]

Makes you think why didn’t the king just go for Drogon on the ground lol

[@JustAway9]

Dany really sacrificed everything to save Jon. Let’s put respect on her name

[@thatswhatithought6519]

Uhm no

[@JustAway9]

@@thatswhatithought6519then you’re just hating for no reason at all lol

[@junemichaels885]

@@thatswhatithought6519 she is the most respected fictional character on the planet

[@RPCentral7]

@@junemichaels885 are you dumb? Isnt even the most respected in this show

[@LadySophiaVelaryon]

Thank you Spartan and Pudgey for an excellent reaction to my favorite TV series. I ❤ that regardless of what others say about not enjoying the later seasons, you don't allow it to influence your opinion.

[@yomamma.ismydaddy216]

They’ve already finished the show lol ain’t nobody influencing anything at this point. I mostly enjoyed this season, I am interested to see they’re reaction to next season however lol

[@andrewmatos8300]

@@yomamma.ismydaddy216 People have been bitching about the show for a long time already in these comment sections lol. It's kind of obnoxious

[@mindshiftershub.]

I love this from Spartan and Pudgey! Because honestly It is so annoying at this point. Like, we get it, a lot of people hate everything after season 4. Then why are you looking through reactions on KZbin of what traumatised you so much years after? Just leave and let the rest of us enjoy

[@yomamma.ismydaddy216]

@@andrewmatos8300 I feel ya, I don’t think the bitching should have really started until about this point in the series lmao

[@hokagedlo6133]

​@@mindshiftershub.or maybe you could just leave the comment section since you can't enjoy what the people who support this content think about the show

[@Jazz-Singher]

It really is fun to watch but somehow makes even less sense on ensuing rewatches. Like why tf are Dany and Tyrion so desperate for the Lannisters help against the White Walkers? You had the Reach, Iron Islands and Dorne, you should’ve sacked the city then turned your attention towards the Night King.

[@ARD-lk5pr]

I think the most stupid part of this plan was believing that Cersei could be trusted, even if they did manage to convince her about the white walkers.

[@ed2968]

From here all the errors the writers made in earlier seasons come together to just make the plot absolutely broken - even basic stuff like they didn’t know dragons can’t go north of the wall

[@MiguelM159]

Yes, thank you so much Daenerys for trying to save Jon, we lost Vizerion and thanks to Tyrion's master plan.

[@efrensoto3273]

The entire expedition to capture a white walker to show it Cersei and gain her support in the fight against the Night King was absurd. That was totally illogical for the following reasons: -So far there was no risk of the Night King and the white walkers crossing the wall. The wall has been around for millennia and the white walkers and the Night King have also been around for millennia and have not made it across. What has made Jon Snow and the other characters in Westeros believe that now the Night King and the white walkers will be able to cross the wall, to the point that Daenerys, Snow and the others need Cersei as an ally? No, there was simply no way the Night King and the other walkers could get past the Wall. Therefore, it was not necessary to prepare alliances with Cersei against the Night King. Everyone in Westeros could very well have carried on as they are now, ignoring the white walkers, and the Night King and the white walkers would have continued on the other side of the Wall forever. That whole idea of ​​the expedition was nothing but a bad idea by the writers to lengthen the series so that Daenerys would not face Cersei right away, because if so, Cersei's character would have ended in this season. The writers of the series could have come up with another idea to lengthen the serie.

[@frnknstndrgqn]

proof that tyrion's plan was so fucking stupid. the night king and his army couldn't cross the wall... they didn't need to prove to cersei anything. Go to the red keep melt cersei while she's in there and move on. get the realm stabilized then worry about the night king. Tyrion wanting to spare his family is part of the problem.

[@williamerazo3921]

👏👏👏👏👏

[@romevo100]

There was a book before GOT called the Ice dragon. By GEORGE R MARTIN. Once Danny went with her dragons to save them, I knew what was coming. Heart breaking

[@carlogiurizzato2441]

in the books the dragons cannot pass north beyond the wall

[@Mic-Mak]

37:20 It's not just about the show not being faithful to the books. There are critics who have never read the books, and immediately saw the dip in quality after S4, and consistently pointed out the problems after. A great example is Lili Loufbourow. Her writing about the show is nothing short of fantastic! You also gotta remember that the vast majority of disappointed fans have not read the books.

[@johnnyskinwalker4095]

Lili who?

[@VandalJace]

Honestly I felt a shift in season 4. The showrunners got more focused on epic moments and power-duos over everything else. Things really didn't start falling apart though until the end of season 5.

[@johnalden5821]

You really have to feel for Daenerys at this point. If she exercises caution and strategy, she suffers losses. But if she goes right at it with her dragons, she again suffers losses. She is in a pressure cooker, and right now Jon is the only way out. He is the only one who understands her situation and can help her find a way to victory over all of the enemies north and south.

[@Noone91875]

Ooooyayyy! The portals appeared.

[@Leolottie]

The plot armor was shining strong in this one! 🤺

[@Mic-Mak]

28:47 It makes no sense that the NK would aim at Viserion who is much further away and in flight, rather than at Drogon who is stationary and right in front of him.

[@giaezrae]

it actually does, viserion was burning his army as he killed him. it makes all the sense lol.

[@seancarroll5803]

@@giaezrae he doesnt give a fuck about his army, hes got like a million after that, its just bad writing

[@giaezrae]

@@seancarroll5803 it makes sense, drogon is quicker and smarter than viserion. viserion was an easy target all while he was burning the nk army.

[@giaezrae]

@@williamshelton4318 his main priority was to get a fkn dragon which is what he did lmao

[@seancarroll5803]

@@giaezrae drogon was on the ground with no one ordering him to fly, at the speed of his throw drogon would have died and had no time to move

[@tiago_s_]

I love how the nightking found giants chains out of nowhere

[@isabellemaria5235]

And way down we go 😅😅😅 Everytime I see the dragon die it brings tears to my eyes

[@Immundissime1]

Whites must be some great blaksmiths to make such a nice massive chain during those times...

[@SaidBKD95]

Stop pointing out these things,the directors did an eccellent job

[@malreynolds7309]

I'm glad you two enjoyed the episode but I still feel like it is one of the show's weakest when it comes to writing believable and earned sequences. Almost every scene feels contrived out of a need to rush. And every big moment feels cartoonish in many ways. It doesn't feel like the Game of Thrones we were watching where everyone can die at any moment. We lose one named person in this insane fight that should have killed main characters. And that one named character was removed just to say to the audience "So, no one can bring Jon back." And then a dragon is killed in a silly sequence just so the Night King can have a dragon. Even after rewatching this episode several times, I'm still irritated by every decision in it.

[@alzer6467]

They threw logic and writing out of the window at this stage of the show, well it had actually had happened well before this but this was the episode when everyone saw it. Traditional blockbuster Hollywood writing had taken over.

[@usgreth]

*checks patreon progress* This episode does have some pretty sketchy writing and I'm not even one of those it sHouLd haVe bEeN joN people.

[@jaybird8192]

Yup! Plot armor running amok!!! Any one could die with one mistake at one time! Now they survive with the smallest odds!

[@reddeaddave4675]

that truly is one of the worst written episode of the show... so many plot holes it uncountable. everyone has plot armor ,gendry has super speed the,the raven has teleportation, tyrion has another awful plan, the night king choosing to throw the spear on viserion and not on drogon, danny somehow seems more afraid of losing jon than her own dragons. and somehow the walkers found huge chains and learnt how to dive in the water.

[@rudy_4ier]

they like mindless action above all else. i think 8x3 (The Long Night) is going to get a fuckton of praise from them because it's just pure mindless action. edit: they both agreed this was a 10/10 masterpiece. LOL

[@darthbricksempire3606]

13:55 all you need to understand here, is that the Directors (David and Dan) were a bit jealous of Kit Harrington (Jon's actor), and so they decided to knock him down a bit, by having characters constantly refer to how short he is. It's annoying as fuck

[@mscheese000]

Dan and Dave are such petty shits aren't they? There's a thing they said about killing off a certain character (they didn't mention who but pretty sure it was Barristan Selmy) where they basically said "the actor got the script for his death, told us it was not canon in the books and really disrespectful to the character's arc to kill him off this way, which made us want to do it even more"

[@nightfrost1891]

yup, they basically said it was a knock to kit no wonder emilia says she prefers working for marvel she's really close to kit and rose and apparently d&d did a lot of this petty stuff as if we didn't need more reasons to hate them

[@laza0202]

Remember this, Dany agreed to help jon without him bendig the knee Jon decided to bend the knee Remember this... They are going to shape this as if Dany forced jon to bend the knee so she would help him That she cares about the throne more , meanwhile she abandoned that quest & went north to fight the others, tried to take it peacefully & didn't rush it But d&d try so hard to twist it Especially in how Sam talks abt it w' jon

[@isabellemaria5235]

Right, all the things they did to make Danny look so bad ruined the show writing, even others characteres had their story changed to something that doesn't make sense

[@hopemikaelson9223]

Nah, they won't. Apparently they think it makes sense that she snapped because "that is the Targaryen way" and "Rhaenyra had that same look in her eye after they killed her son" 😂😂😂 At least that's what they said in the livestream. I bet Spartan will be PISSED because Jon wasn't named King, but that's about the extent of it.

[@hokagedlo6133]

172 years before Daenerys targaryen. Don't forget GRRM loves this character she is the prince and the books will do her justice

[@Blinkptx]

​@hokagedlo6133 Her story in the show will be the same in the books. Hopefully, it's done better, but that was Martin's ending. All the main things that happened in the end came from him. Unless he's rewriting it based on people's response, which I doubt, she will go mad queen in the book.

[@Hollygli]

I hear you. Yes, she did. And because she saw the wights herself, she sees the bigger threat. But once that's accomplished she 100% pivots back to her blind ambition. I think Dany snapping at the end and burning all of KL (these are not spoilers since they've watched the whole series) and then saying to her armies that they're going to do the same to Winterfell & all of Westeros makes no sense. BUT let's not pretend that she wasn't totally focused on sitting on the iron throne. Her feeling threatened but Jon was absolutely believable.

[@Manotevebaba]

Funny, how you guys don't mind that everyone has just unlocked fast travel! 🤣

[@Mic-Mak]

27:54 _Going by sunrise and sunset, just over twenty-four hours have passed. At most. In that time:_ _-Gendry ran to Eastwatch from an unspecified point beyond the Wall._ _-A raven flew from Eastwatch to Dragonstone._ _-Dany flew from Dragonstone to the Wall._ _-Dany flew further north and found the conflict at this unspecified, unknown-to-Gendry location._ _We have a map in every opening credits sequence. The very first shot of the episode emphasised the distance between Dragonstone and Eastwatch. This is not a single minor slip in time and space, but three separate journeys that had to be broken over geography’s knee for the plot to work. The director called this sequence of events a plausible impossibility. I call it lazy, suspension-of-disbelief breaking writing._ *-TURTLE PACED*

[@mrc-rrn]

i hate this episode so much and hearing people calling it a masterpiece makes me sad. this episode is another fuck you to the books and everything that was established in the world (books and show), it makes no sense at all and on top of it all it's also very bad tv writing in general

[@orphanedhanyou]

This isn't 24. Not every second is on screen. Just because they didn't show every sunrise or how far their group is from the wall, doesn't mean it's not fully plausible (especially in a fictional world) for a show that's waited 10 years for content that Martin to this day hasn't given us, to drag out several episodes of waiting on screen. That would be ridiculous. They wrapped up the show. Stop acting like we needed a gazillion more episodes to get the story across.

[@orphanedhanyou]

​@@mrc-rrnMartin created this problem by taking over a DECADE to release the next book and he STILL hasn't

[@Mic-Mak]

@@orphanedhanyou Quick question. Have you read the books? D&D barely covered Feast & Dance, the last two novels. If they had been faithful, it would have taken them at least 2 more seasons before they caught up to Martin. So that argument doesn't fly.

[@chrisgarrett9939]

Spartan be like "OH MY GOD! I LOVE DANY!!!" Pudgey be like "Mmm hmmm"

[@kitlow2970]

these two are going to defend the final season, i just know it

[@seancarroll5803]

they finished the show and in one of their livestreams they said they didnt love the ending but also didnt hate it

[@kitlow2970]

@@seancarroll5803 that's even weirder. the ending is marmite, you either love it or hate it. that feels like a filtered take to not piss people off on either side.

[@changingmind2522]

And that’s fine if they do.

[@kurtrivero368]

@@kitlow2970”You either love it or hate it.” Wrong.

[@MichaelPower212]

The books left off when Dany was backing to Meeren after her first ride on a dragon.

[@orrinscott-stewart3641]

I take your point about Cersei but I don't feel bad for Ellaria and her daughters. Ellaria killed an innocent child who did nothing to her because her boyfriend got himself killed. Also in GOT there are two unwritten laws and everyone who breaks them comes to a bad end. KInslaying and guest right. Freys broke guest right died horribly. Robb killed his kinsman, died horribly. The Sandsnakes killed their little cousin died horribly. Check it out. everybody who nreas those two rules gets fucked in the end. Oh yeah Stannis killed his daughter...

[@noneofyourbeeswax01]

Pudgey: Danaerys was raised "pretty much as a slave" - even within the context of the show, just wow!

[@orlog3343]

Being bought and sold like cattle isn’t exactly freedom. She was a prisoner essentially

[@Blank_e2v]

I don't think people realise not everything terian says is gold he was actually a bad hand under DANNY, he was way better at it before, most of his advice under danny regarding Kings landing was clouded by the fact that it's still his sister and brother, he kept thinking of ways to take kings landing that wouldn't result in his brother and sister death when in reality they could've taken kings landing as soon as Danny crossed the sea but terian prevented that thinking there's another way but trying to solve things peacefully by getting cersei to surrender rather than taking it by force the first opportunity they had.... it resulted in the Whole of kings landing being burnt down I'm sure the damage would have been way less if they didn't wait so long because by that point too many things had happened to danny that most people in her position would have done the same

[@raianthony8492]

💯

[@isabellemaria5235]

100% agree with you, and it gets worse next season, trusting Cersei ???? Any way, Tyrion was a terrible hand to Danny even in Essos when she was gone

[@Pink.andahalf]

He became stupid when unimaginative people started writing for him. He was fine til they ran out of books to adapt.

[@giaezrae]

why would you spoil the show u dimwit, delete ur comment.

[@AndyMatts44]

He's a competent administrator and helping to rule kingdoms. He's not, to quote Sonny Corleone, a "wartime consigliere." He doesn't have a passion for blood, slaughter and conquest. Even his military successes have mostly been about self-preservation. So he's got a lot of wisdom to offer, but there are some aspects of getting her to the Throne that are definitely not in his wheelhouse. Good observation on your part.

[@walterrutherford8321]

When Dani and her dragons came in and saved Jon and his army when they were surrounded by white walkers, even The Hound loved seeing that fire!

[@Mic-Mak]

35:08 _Dany taking Jon’s hand is also a nice moment that would have worked really well had their mutual attraction been depicted with anything like consistency. You can see the concept here. On Dany’s part, of all her suitors, Jon’s the only one who has any idea what the dragons mean to her, so he’s the only one who can comfort her in her grief; on Jon’s part, he finally sees that Dany really would put everything aside to save the realm, and with this all the barriers between them are down. The patchy leadup robs this moment of the support it needed._ *-TURTLE PACED*

[@efrensoto3273]

The entire expedition to capture a white walker to show it Cersei and gain her support in the fight against the Night King was absurd. That was totally illogical for the following reasons: -So far there was no risk of the Night King and the white walkers crossing the wall. The wall has been around for millennia and the white walkers and the Night King have also been around for millennia and have not made it across. What has made Jon Snow and the other characters in Westeros believe that now the Night King and the white walkers will be able to cross the wall, to the point that Daenerys, Snow and the others need Cersei as an ally? No, there was simply no way the Night King and the other walkers could get past the Wall. Therefore, it was not necessary to prepare alliances with Cersei against the Night King. Everyone in Westeros could very well have carried on as they are now, ignoring the white walkers, and the Night King and the white walkers would have continued on the other side of the Wall forever. That whole idea of ​​the expedition was nothing but a bad idea by the writers to lengthen the series so that Daenerys would not face Cersei right away, because if so, Cersei's character would have ended in this season. The writers of the series could have come up with another idea to lengthen the serie. -The only way that the Night King and the other walkers managed to cross the wall was by destroying it, thanks to the fact that they captured the Dragon Viserion. And how did the Night King capture the Dragon? The Night King captured the Dragon thanks to Jon Snow's proposed expedition to capture the white walker, to prove to Cersei that walkers exist, and thus Jon Snow gain Cersei's support to protect Westeros from a threat that does not exist. ; because there is no such threat because it was impossible for the Night King to cross the wall before capturing the Dragon. -In summary: If it had not been for the expedition to capture the white walker, the Night King would not have captured the Dragon and he would never have been able to use the Dragon to destroy the wall and cross the wall. That was all the fault of useless Jon Snow. -And yes, I understand that for the purposes of the plot it was necessary for the Night King and the other walkers to cross the wall, and the only more direct and dramatic way was to capture one of the dragons; but the scriptwriters could have thought of a more logical and reasonable reason for the expedition; for example, that Bran was still on the other side of the wall and Jon wanted to go rescue him. That would have made more sense and logic.

[@chillen8413]

Sorry Spartan but Jon did loose the battle hahaha it’s okay to admit that

[@aboutthat1440]

I can't lie. I am loving all the complaints coming about the nonsense that was the last two seasons in particular. Dan and Dave really rushed this like idiots.

[@OswinPond]

This has been debunked actually. The production wasn't rushed. What you're trying to say is that the pacing of the plot was too fast but it has nothing to do with rushed production.

[@ARD-lk5pr]

@@OswinPond If the production wasn't rushed then the writing certainly was.

[@OswinPond]

@@ARD-lk5pr The writing is part of the production. The pacing is too fast is the word you're looking for

[@ARD-lk5pr]

@@OswinPond No it isn't. Yes the pacing was also too fast but this was symptomatic of the writing being rushed in the first place. Obviously there had to be a reason why the pacing was too fast! Most likely because the writing was rushed...What other reason is there?

[@OswinPond]

@@ARD-lk5pr bad writting lol

[@raianthony8492]

A lot of Tyrion stans have a hard time admitting he sucked in season 7. Also, more than one thing can be true at the same time; you can love the wins for these characters we love & root for, the cinematography in these episodes & the scores are amazing, the emotions these episodes evoke are great, but there is a lot of nonsense, plot holes, illogical decisions being made, smart characters being dumb & all sense of time just going out the window, & impractical things taking place. What’s missing is the layers & complexity from the earlier seasons, and that doesn’t equate to ppl “missing cruelty”. And no, I’m not a book reader & don’t care if the show diverted from the book. Dumb & dumber just got lazy and stopped caring about the quality of the story.

[@ARD-lk5pr]

Spot on. A film/show can be entertaining and still crap.

[@cee_jay_mcc7914]

If we’re being completely honest he lost his brain starting with season 5. season 7 is being generous.

[@CASantos]

Good point about the book. S7/8 weren't bad because they diverted from (the foundations laid by) the books. They were bad because the writing was just bad...

[@johnnyskinwalker4095]

I don't think there's anybody that didn't think Tyrion was not dumb in later seasons.

[@clownafra6088]

It's like when they make comic book movies for people who aren't fans of comics. You get Batman . Bane with no venom is like Batman without his utility belt. Real fans don't like those changes but people who just like explosions don't know there were changes and don't care. It's like changng a characters race or sexuality when it doesn't help the story. Who is if for. People who don't care about the material but are being pandered to and never become real fans. Bringing in casual watchers for ratings ruined two things. The greatest show in TV history and D&D's legacy.

[@Alex-mn1fb]

"That must be the quickest raven evah! " legit made me laugh 😅 Yup, Spartan, it was an equivalent of an Email. Oh, and it gets even better then that, just you wait! 😁😁

[@orphanedhanyou]

This isn't 24. Not every second is on screen.

[@Alex-mn1fb]

@@orphanedhanyou Its generaly agreed that the last few season become incredibly badly written, contrived and nonsensical. And even if that raven flew for several days off screen, it makes even less sense, as it would mean the crew up there behind the Wall stood on that frozen lake and fought zombies for weaks, or a full month or so untill the Dragons got up there. No food, no warmth, no sleap. Its so riddiculous I can hardly believe it even now 😅