Stanford Psychologist Reveals One Change That Will Dramatically Improve Your Life | Kelly McGonigal

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An acknowledged leader in the “science-help” movement, Kelly McGonigal has dedicated her career to using neuroscience and psychology to develop methods of improving mental well-being. And she is now at the forefront of researchers and advocates who continue to explore the connection between mind and body. On this episode of Impact Theory with Tom Bilyeu, Dr. Kelly McGonigal explains how to change your emotional states through physical movement, and also explains why movement has such a strong effect on the brain. She also describes ways to become more compassionate, shares the story of her own struggles with chronic pain, and gives surprising insights into why it’s not always good to try to control your inner experiences.
SHOW NOTES:
“This is the book I was born to write.” [3:30]
Movement and exercise are essential to mental well-being [4:15]
Kelly explains the hypothesis that we have large brains for physical movement [5:50]
Tom and Kelly discuss runner’s high and why he doesn’t get it [7:12]
Working out your core reduces anxiety [11:03]
Kelly explains how your brain receives information from your muscles and tendons [11:51]
Kelly and Tom discuss how physical improvement changes your self-image [13:15]
Kelly talks about why it’s not always good to try to control your inner experiences [17:53]
Kelly describes her experience with chronic pain [21:05]
Kelly has a strong gut instinct for whether or not things are consistent with her values [24:00]
How do you teach someone to be compassionate and self-compassionate? [27:56]
How to be a better listener [31:41]
Kelly explains how she teaches self-compassion [34:52]
Tom’s crucial insight that even the average human is the ultimate adaptation machine [38:05]
Tom and Kelly discuss competition and cooperation [40:48]
Kelly describes overcoming the need to be better than others [42:33]
Kelly shares the impact she wants to have on the world [44:29]
QUOTES:
“Your literal moment to moment sense of self is always being informed by what your body is doing.” [11:36]
“You can choose your values over trying to control your inner experiences.” [23:49]
“So you’re lifting something heavy. Your brain is going to get feedback from muscle contraction and tension from the tendons on your joints. Your brain does not get that information and think, ‘my bicep is strong.’ Or, ‘my lats are strong.’ The brain thinks, ‘I am strong.’” [12:02]
FOLLOW:
WEBSITE: kellymcgonigal.com
INSTAGRAM: bit.ly/2NuymKX
FACEBOOK: bit.ly/3aeLYE1
TWITTER: bit.ly/2swZkKX
BOOKS MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:
“The Willpower Instinct” amzn.to/38fkb4B [2:07]
“The Upside of Stress” amzn.to/372LRJH [2:07]
“The Joy of Movement” amzn.to/2TvIXsU [2:53]
IMPACT THEORY MERCHANDISE: Check out Impact Theory's Merch Shop: bit.ly/ImpactTheoryShop

[@Ang.143]

I exercise twice a day because I’m a sensitive and emotional person. Movement and meditation changed everything. Hardly any anxiety or depression these days.

[@user-he4lj5wl7w]

This is awesome....will try it out for myself..thanks for sharing.

[@oslatron]

I will try this. thanks

[@RhiWildeupgrade]

YES! Meditation and movement have done the same for me! I'm super sensitive and I used to have an emotional default of mild depression. I almost never experience depression, anxiety, sadness or even anger. I'm almost always feeling good

[@90MysteriumFascinans]

That’s inspirational. I imagine those would heal most of my physical or psychological wounds, with consistent daily practice of both activities. But I have suspected as much for years, and have yet to achieve that habit pattern to be able to relieve my own suffering (of which I think I have too much). I hope to grow enough or find enough resolve to be able to do what you have, and to experience a better life, so that my life can be more meaningful and fulfilling for me, and so that I can give more to the world around me, and be my best self for others.

[@q-q-qiah]

I’m the same. If I’m moving I’m moving and if I’m not I’m not

[@EllieUltra]

I’ve noticed that other kind of exercise high. I’m overweight and I’ve started working out regularly. I’m normally very quiet and introverted and I’ve noticed my voice is projecting louder, clearer, and people seem to understand me easier. The social anxiety has gone way down.It’s a side effect I wasn’t expecting but it’s really awesome.

[@TylerValendza]

She seems to have an amazing balance of brilliance and humility. This was great!

[@Brooklynbaby47]

Amén! 👏🏻👏🏻❤️😑🙏🏻

[@sunnybaek7047]

Nile Whent pp

[@sunnybaek7047]

Nile Whent p

[@ericsierra-franco7802]

She's very cute too!

[@Ty-zd7jg]

Tom I am afraid, in a good way, of who you are going to become and what you are going to do 5-10 years from now. Every discussion/interview you have, you are always leaning in & learning. A couple of weeks ago I just started making it a habit to watch and take notes on one Impact Theory video a day. It has drastically improved my life my friend. I admire your hunger to continue to grow. Thank you for inviting me on this growth journey with you brother!

[@lordnelsonmc.billionberg9166]

Watch his interview with rich roll

[@GM-yb5yg]

And I'm afraid of what you are going to do, and who are you going to be when you've watched all these videos?

[@kreativepulp8760]

I'm just afraid! Bwaahahahaha. Okay, sorry. Kidding! :P

[@Mr196710]

Wait till you discover Joe Rogan and DR. Jordan Peterson.

[@stevenrempel]

The flip side of "achievement" consciousness: He is likely never satisfied, and although has a smile pasted on his face, liekly rarely feels like he's "got there" and as such is always in a state of feeling inadequate. It's still preferable to its opposite, but remember the grass is always greener, until you move past the concept that it was ever about the grass, it was always just you.

[@penelopefp]

This was the impact I needed. 20 years ago I was super healthy, taught fitness classes and worked out hard, but I hated myself and my self talk was loathing. Met my spouse, moved across the country, new job, got busy, totally quit working out, had kids, body changed. And along the way found a wonderful new self loving me. I know I need exercise for my mind and body. But I have such a negative association with how I used to exercise and how I perceived my self. This spoke to me in just the right words, to find the exercise I love, that speaks to my emotional and physical needs, and reinforces the joy I now embrace. I will be watching this on replay for a couple days!! GREAT conversation to both of you. THANK YOU BOTH SO MUCH!!

[@scottjohnson9846]

Absolutely agree here. I was 104 kg depressed And miserable had been for years. I started Martial arts and weightlifting on a daily basis six days a week. Wow the difference is amazing. It took time but slowly i’m feeling better and better now days I’m 81 kg building up muscle and toning up. I’ve stopped antidepressants since also. the feeling of strength, courage, self-worth, self-love and power within myself is just fucking amazing. I’m strong I can do anything.

[@muum4048]

Fabulous!

[@chinita7754]

I have been with meds for one year and I feel same depressed I don't even have motivation for take a walk I only work come home do some shores and go bed .help

[@user-df3gf6wh1x]

What martial art do you play, Scott?

[@sabrinavoth959]

Exercise has been so much more effective than any therapy or medication for depression and anxiety. It is a game changer. I’m 1 year into my journey and I’m never going back

[@micahwilson4244]

Sabrina Wenzel maybe you just haven’t tried the right medicine yet! Prozac works great have you tried Prozac? Ask for the generic brand it’s cheaper! Running is bad for your knees! Stop running!

[@mandywright7545]

Well done, Sabrina. If you can manage your depression and anxiety via exercise your whole body will benefit. Don't listen to naysayers who tell you not to exercise or run because it damages your body. I'm fifty eight and have run my whole life and I've got the strongest bones and muscles of a much younger person. Many people who have tried to dissuade me from running over they years have developed other medical conditions associated with lack of exercise e.g mental health issues, heart disease, diabetes, cancer. It definitely helps my mental state...trust your own instincts and if in doubt get medical advice.

[@sabrinavoth959]

Micah Wilson I have tried it. Doctors who will prescribe you medication before asking about your diet, activity level, and over all situation are just glorified drug dealers. Being mindful of my diet, exercise and self care has made more difference than anything. Running can be bad for your knees, but I don’t run. I do yoga, jiu jitsu, and weightlifting.

[@sabrinavoth959]

Mandy Wright thank you :)

[@chinita7754]

Sabrina voth ,what type of exercises do you do ?

[@HealthWealthRelationships700]

I just watched her ted talk. I am now on a ventilator, because she is breathtaking.

[@quinnrivers527]

Absolutely brilliant! I am continuously pleased with the quality of guests on this show. This woman is so intelligent and courageous. She in my new hero. Seriously! It’s like she has a super power but she is teaching other people to have it too. These are the kinds of people who are helping humans evolve as a species. Wise wisdom. Thank you! 🙏🏻

[@geoattoronto]

She has definitely got my respect.

[@gma904]

She briefly mentioned enthusiasm; I’ve noticed that since I’ve made inner changes and have become an overall happier, more positive person that a side “effect” has been increased enthusiasm. And I like it. :)

[@humanyoda]

Doesn't enthusiasm go hand in hand with being happy?

[@M3nta91]

"Do you mean to be enthusiastic?" "YEEES" . Loved it

[@exeniaesquivel1049]

Her brilliance is outstanding! That vocab and eloquence is beyond measure. She is definitely one of the finest minds Tom has ever interviewed. She is literally glowing with fervent passion for life. I want to be like her.

[@koroglurustem1722]

Kudos to her to be able to accept the chronic pain and live her life fully despite that. Strong woman! God bless you with alleviating your pains.

[@sleepsmartsmashstress740]

Migraines a sign of bright people. Many neurologists have it Even I do

[@Snow_Pulse]

Best hour I spend today who else?

[@kreativepulp8760]

Very true. Kelly's voice... My god! Like honey being poured into the ears. I listened to this talk with my eyes closed and I was so sad when it got over. Of course, I agree with the whole thing about exercise and movement, but one thing stuck out like a sore thumb, you know. The part where she said that she gets headaches when she indulges herself in her favourite activities. I mean, isn't exercise a way of eliminating those pitfalls and insulating yourself from such problems? I could be wrong, but may be she has resigned to the fact that the headaches will come.

[@tomakram872]

True

[@sierraschaffer613]

I am on the Euphoric end, so much so, that it can bring me to tears at times of peak movement. It's this "rush" that i get, that keep me active and moving. I thrive through movement, I feel as if I come to life the moment my foot touches the ground and my heart rate increases in the slightest... TOTAL WORKOUT EUPHORIA JUNKIE right here! The Euphoria I get also boosts my mood and mental health natural, and my overall sense of joy and peace within myself and around me! I love walking, hiking, aerobics, and biking ... all freedom based movements! I am free and alive!

[@bobbyd0656]

I definitely have gotten to the point of having tears in my eyes, singing, shouting and jumping for joy on several occasions. I It usually hits me hard at about miles 4-6 on a 8-12 mile run on a riverside trail. Even on shorter runs, I get an amazing endorphin rush.

[@amandalynn8591]

Wooooow, I have to say I really wish I had this. I hate exercise, it makes me panic and I hate sweating, it makes me itch. 😭

[@alchemyofeden]

I love his interview skills. He actually allows his guests to speak.

[@ToanTheNomad]

Runner’s high hits when you stop viewing movement as exercise. When you do it just for fun, or as an award-that’s when you feel good for doing it.

[@karenbolton9526]

I'm 58 don't drive walked everywhere my whole life. Also do positive affirmations haven't been a doctor apart from smears for 28 yrs heal myself

[@GoldKingsMan]

Nice one.One my family friends passed away from cervical cancer recently,she did not check regularly her smears sadly.Was too late for her,she went to India to try something but didn't work out.

[@staceyanderson8916]

@@GoldKingsMan sorry to hear..

[@MM-qz2yd]

I really love her TED speech "How to make stress your friend" saved one of my favorite speeches forever since a few years ago. 👍

[@MenaVee]

I needed this video!! I'm going through depression and I've been trying to think my way out of it since it's been said that all happiness comes from within. I figured that meant I could just change my thoughts and mood by just sitting here. It hasn't been working and now I have something else to try and get me out of the state I'm in. Thank you for this interview Tom!!

[@Lauraisgreen]

Me too! I've started running and it's changed my mental state almost immediately

[@andrewshaw3926]

Mena you are not alone. Keep trying things. That's a huge step away from depression. Every time we try we are improving. Much love coming your way. X

[@YogaBlissDance]

Mena, it will help alot, keep at it, try different types of movement you will find the one that you love.

[@debbiemohekey1509]

My mother has always said how important exercise and fresh air is and when you feel wound up mentally do something physical and if physically tired sit down and read or do something mentally. She still goes for a walk every day. She's 98. Also vegetarian. Her Dr is quite interested in her secret to longevity and good health.

[@zoezzzarko1117]

I like her mindset 💖

[@debbiesmith2908]

Wow... I could listen to her for hours. Very enjoyable and informative interview. It really helped deepen my appreciation for the positive impact of movement on over-all well being. Kelly McGonigal is truly a lovely human being.

[@angkalikasan2388]

I like the what she said that she dont compete with others but reflect on what is the contribution to the world she had every single day is really empowering.

[@lamoustiquere]

KELLY MCGONIGAL IS THE REALEST!!!!! SHE IS EVERYTHING... WOW. My heart.

[@sleepsmartsmashstress740]

She is hot enough to inflict a heart attack on some men

[@spiritedamanda23]

This is one of the best episodes for me, truly she verbalized some major points that I knew instinctively but could never explain, thank you IT & Kelly McGonagall 🥰

[@prernagandhi7326]

Tom, Kelly McGonigali's book- The Willpower Instinct deserves to be on the book list. It is a life changer!

[@RobJenkinsDubTechno]

Put your attention on what you can control. We can not control other people, but we do have control over ourselves. I was generally discouraged by the people around me when I talked about starting my own meditation KZbin channel, but I believe in the idea, so I went ahead anyway. Subscriber growth was extremely low in the 1st few weeks, but it's growing now. Don't let others discourage you. Believe in yourself.

[@bradleylatham8184]

Ahoy there!!! An awesome compliment to the believers. I have had a few Divine Interventions happen within a 12 hour period many times after meditating to plants or the higher power. There is something ELECTRICAL.... It works with the right people....environment has to be conducive to the energy field....PEACE.

[@Tes73792]

I subbed.

[@robertmcguckin2713]

Chillout Meditation Music NEVER ask another what they think and expect support? Most people around us at any one point in time are SHEEP! They are lazy, negative, angry, pessimistic beings that will bring you down in a heartbeat.

[@RobJenkinsDubTechno]

@@Tes73792 thank you Tess

[@nathanafnan4680]

And you just got a sub from me! ;P

[@cel8683]

Ok.. wow.. a few seconds ago... I stood in the bathroom in front of the mirror, while the video was playing in the background.. and I said to myself I dont want to be here anymore.... And in this moment her words at minute 45:00 hit me.... I don't know what to say rn... Thank you.

[@SandroMarino]

I agree 1000%! If it weren't for my passion for the outdoorsand in particular skiing at the time of my traumatic brain injury, there's no way I would have recovered so quickly and so well! I was hit by a truck while riding my mountain bike at the age of 20 and came to from a coma not being able to walk, speak, eat any food or drink any fluids. But within six months of my injury I was back to skiing Mammoth for the season 😁⛷️

[@arunsawdekar820]

That's a miracle brother

[@MichaelDennis1234]

Most inspiring and informative show on KZbin🔥

[@ErikaK]

Being active really helps us to reduce depression and makes us definitely happier :)

[@ahmedlahlou8123]

Wherever there is wellbeing and positivity Erika is there :)

[@ErikaK]

@@ahmedlahlou8123 ♡♡♡ hi :) much love !!

[@sleepsmartsmashstress740]

depress the depression sure

[@beldonhuang]

Brilliantly said. Just one session covers so much that we should know about how to live our lives to the fullest and learn to enjoy it

[@Belle1]

She is amazing. The way she talks about compassion, virtue, movement. Just amazing. Thank you Tom for this interview.

[@Wendathena]

Love hearing Kelly McGonigal! I have listened to many of her books and actually took a couple classes from her at Stanford. Thanks for having this conversation and glad I could find it 3 years afterwards. Her sister is pretty amazing too!

[@kevinprajwal2912]

Tom, Dude You and Ur channel are definitely having an Impact man! SOOO much have I changed learning from your channel. TQ Keep rockin

[@CryptoBellwether]

I'm a lot like Tom..I don't get a runner's high and only work out everyday to fight old age because I understand it intellectually. I 100% agree with her on everything she said. Just look around and compare your active friends compared to inactive ones.

[@kacperkozicki2182]

Speaking of Dr Jordan Peterson... When are you going to invite him to your show, Tom? That would be an amazing episode!

[@leonjhendrix2]

Thanks, Tom & the team for continuously providing great content ❤️

[@ShantayGood2Go]

I have literally watched this 4 times 🤦🏽‍♀️. 📿🧘🏽‍♀️👂🏽😌

[@TechUnboxingVideos]

Thanks Tom for always interviewing guest that we can learn from

[@shaunjeter]

Self compassion is something that I needed for the longest time and I am so happy that I love myself! I loved this episode

[@lanawebster2078]

Tom, once again you have gifted us with a unique guest...love Kelly and her offering....

[@saraennis1402]

this is actually so empowering. Feels like something I'll have to listen to every couple weeks when I start talking myself out of a workout

[@alicelovescats888]

I love this lady!!!!! Brilliant, grounded, sensitive, wise, and so so interesting!

[@aligned4good]

I loved every bit of this incredible talk. I Learned so much! Especially about how to really listen with your heart. So powerful! I have a lot of work to do on myself when it comes to truly listening. Thank you for this.

[@sailormoon408]

Thank you Kelly and Tom 🙏🙏 This was such an amazing episode👌 definitely I will watch it again. Sending love from Libya ❤️

[@GT-xp6bx]

It's great to see how much Tom enjoyed doing this interview. Thank you for the great content. I exercise to your impact quotes everyday :)

[@lanawebster2078]

Kelly, I needed to hear this...I interrupt others....so your technique so helpful...

[@michaelglynn5856]

Kelly is the best as was her willpower instinct. She is only out done by her gorgeous face! She is beyond great!

[@collad1000]

Brilliant lady! I will be getting all her books and watching her Ted talk. Thank you, Tom for another wonderful guest! 😘

[@akshayostwal1614]

This is so powerful! Truth & wisdom by you both. Thank you so much. ❤️🙌☺️

[@sophiasophista6609]

I love your research and your talks Kelly! I am a big fan (: always high quality interesting stuff! Thank you both!!

[@mariaale1464]

what an amazing insightful interview. Thanks to you both! Kelly changed my life today!

[@keziahdaniel3740]

I love her insight into herself and what gives her meaning. Inspiring authenticity. I love how she embraces the reality of the pain and the love in life. Wow wow wow.

[@PowerfulU]

Loved how she talked about compassion blindness at 30:33 I think that many people have experienced that before

[@bluejay5531]

Thank you both for this powerful talk. Kelly is an amazing woman, she deeply inspired me and this talk finds me in a difficult moment and is of help, thank you wholeheartedly

[@attifarkas]

This video is a gift to the World. Thank you for translating how to be awesome by being awesome!

[@functionalfitnessworkouts]

Kelly has uncovered the single most profound KEY to WELLNESS!! Keep up this mission that you have embarked on, Kelly.

[@josephchristopherlewis6020]

She seems like a person who is very much in touch & in tuned to her body, conscious, soul, spirit, & surroundings. She got hidden antlers, lol. Keep doing what doing, you are touching lives; great job. God bless.

[@kreativepulp8760]

Thanks a lot, Tom. This was one of the best talks that I've come across in recent times. Not that the others weren't just as amazing or more, but that, this one came at a right time for me.

[@Ala-bb5gd]

Amazing interview - really enjoyed every part of it. My favourite was when was she talked about “how to be a good listener”. I also enjoyed how she added value to exercise - the msg I got is that it’s all about doing something we enjoy and appreciating the positive neuro-feedback it gives to the brain.

[@daydreamer7067]

Thank you for sharing with us, these awesome conversations you have with these extraordinary people.

[@emersonsandman1699]

When truly loving yourself within, along with meditation, reading, and running brings alive your enter creator of feeling absolutely wonderful.

[@jrborgify]

the self respect cycle that is generated from treating yourself well is all the medicine I need sometimes

[@melissarose6901]

Yes

[@pattymcdonald6057]

Yes yes When we first went into lockdown My daily morning routine reading for an hour praying going for a run and cooking a good meal most days of a week

[@HG51_]

One of my favourite episodes! Very insightful on exercise and motivation etc. I’ve read both her books

[@beachknc218]

Kelly is BRILLIANT. Loved her Ted Talk about how we perceive stress makes all the difference. Thanks for inviting her to your channel.

[@JM-zi4in]

All the ones I have watched have been great, and have gotten something powerful out of all of them, but this one is one of my favorites. Everything made complete and absolute sense.

[@SheriLightAndLove]

Most amazing book! Completely transformed my view of exercise. I read it 3-4 days ago and I've exercised more in 4 days than I have in 6 months. Get the book! Really awesome!

[@sapnaoberai2921]

Tom- thanks for introducing her to us. Love your work. Keep on helping us

[@daughterofelroi4369]

I love this so much! My movement is praise dance through worship flagging. I love how science supports the joy I receive during worship. 💜

[@mayankpj]

Thank you Tom for this wonderful and untiring work you are doing ...... !! it just keeps pushing me towards my best.... Your book list is sooooooo great... thanks !!

[@liammorningstar4970]

Thank u for having Kelly ....amazing episode as always

[@carecree888]

Ok I’m her new biggest fan lol I wish this interview were 3 times longer.

[@nicamaben]

Kelly is awesome and so humble. A new fan here. :)

[@mohammadhuzaifa7]

Watch her interview with rich roll ?

[@danpenia219]

I have a crush on her

[@carecree888]

Whoa I’m not even halfway through and I feel like this message has already changed my life.

[@jtrad3z]

Thanks Tom! Thanks Kelly! Thanks everyone at impact!

[@orangenblue6981]

I’ve seen a lot of Impact Theories. This is definitely one of the best.

[@sleepsmartsmashstress740]

Kelly is THE BEST

[@paulpuiwolee8868]

This gave me so much inspiration to make my life meaningful by helping people. Thank you both!!

[@javichavez5114]

Kelly's The Willpower Instinct is a book that helped so much in changing my mind by knowing how to the Brian works. Love the book. I think she is right on point with the movement subject. All people should stay active. Thank you Tom for bringing her in.

[@empowered123]

Tom, you are so sweet and natural. Thanks for being you!!

[@janetterodriguez868]

This was gold on so many levels for me ❤️🙏🏻

[@rachelgarcia7865]

If you run but have never experienced a "runner's high," try this: Go for your run, and then SIT for even 5 minutes after you finish. Usually we're onto the next thing so quickly, but the times I have had the strongest runners is when I had a car ride after my run and was forced to just be still for a moment. Try it and see if that works.

[@leonjhendrix2]

Great timing as most people who signed up for the gym as their New Year's Resolutions are starting to sign off again at the end of January 😂

[@RvFlip19]

Why look down on people’s attempt to change?

[@blueskies3845]

Spot on! Everything she said resonated with me. I love this lady ❤️ and pray her wellbeing and for more of us to have these values of compassion, contribution and enthusiasm ❤️

[@Devibaba]

Another amazing conversation. Thank both of you for sharing.

[@pacibaco]

This is Pure listening Gold ! It’s a lot to try to absorb. But every bit of it is extraordinarily great ! Thank you Tom !

[@sandravicente2550]

Your awesome Tom, thank you for your time.

[@vin_lulz]

Thanks for putting out these videos. You're really motivating and a role model, not just some rich actor who does a podcast now. Really inspiring for me thanks for helping me turn my life around

[@elizabethwilk9615]

Never thought of enthusiasm as a value. She’s a very inspiring person

[@lanawebster2078]

Kelly, I identify with you....I also value enthusiasm....enjoyed your words and helping me put words to feelings...

[@bodybybazile]

Exercise keeps me pushing through each day!

[@carolgeorge6409]

Love her calmness

[@sunshiner9204]

That's how I feel when I'm snowboarding . Alive and powerful at 51😊

[@crisbrackett2067]

So amazing.to hear this woman and values that make our core vibrate in alignment and what it can mean and our physical challenges overcome helps every cell in our body build resilience. Amazing talk

[@carolgeorge6409]

Thank you for having this awesome human being on❤️🙏🏻

[@SitamirJewlery]

You great 👍!!!! Thank you 🙏. God bless you. I can see the desire you have to help humanity. You always provide us with great contents. 🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏

[@MrGhirbo]

we developed big brain in order to be able do more complex movement! Working out for brain chemistry is more important than working out for physical benefits. The runners high... is when u work out so much that u feel muscle exhaustion & that makes u feel good because u know u did something for urself... u know u took action ... u know u are important... u matter!

[@user-dp4bu8jy4b]

What a great talk and wonderful woman! I'm definitely going back to working out now!

[@katerinmartins7803]

I absolutely loved this!! Thank you 🙏

[@vead4152]

she is a beautiful soul I LOVE HER

[@elbiaperez1983]

Mr. B ,thank you ! Your work is the best! Íve learned sooo much from you!

[@serenesongs]

As always Tom great interview.